You're listening to the back home network, presented by home
field apparel. Hey hey, welcome back, who's
your nation. It is the 13th of May of twenty
twenty-three. This is Crimson cast, we're back
after a bit of a Hiatus, Scott Gail.
Ellen, joining you again here and we're happy to be talking to
you Scott yesterday. Very, very, very good day to be
a Hoosier before we get started with the bulk things.
Congratulations to IU softball. They make it to the Big Ten
title game, that's gonna be played a little later on today,
on Saturday. And I, you baseball, just
pulverize has Purdue in the first game of the series down
here at the BART. 22 10:34. I think was the final run total
which I mean there. And I you football games where
they didn't score 26 points. So big hats off to both of those
but of course, the big news yesterday and the one I think
that was kind of a seismic shock, not just through the IU
fan base, but perhaps around college, basketball as well.
Five-star recruit Mackenzie mcvaugh KO who had been
committed to Duke and then you know, if you listen to the
internet was already committed to Kansas like was already like
boating with Bill self in the Summertime instead releases an
Instagram and announces that he's coming to Indiana
University to play for Mike Woodson and the Hoosiers Scott.
We're going to dive into that. First of all, great to see you.
How you doing? I'm doing great.
All right, you ready for this? Yeah, Mackenzie ombak to know
that was. No, that's not right.
No, we're off to a terrible start here.
Easy boy. Mackenzie I think maybe you just
go with that. Lets just think that's an easier
thing to go along with Mac, double double Mac.
No, this is, yeah, yeah, it's good to see M squared, perhaps,
for you and spared like that, but I think for everybody's for
everybody's safety, I think that might be best.
But yeah. So is everybody else gets like,
you know, the full magazine I just get highlights, right?
I just get the Highlights. Yeah.
You, you get the cover of the
magazine. You don't actually open it up.
But anyway, but no Scott. This is exciting times.
And before we dive into the the bulk of the show just reminder
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about your neighborhood and we got a little bit nervous and
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It's a good follow. Scott IU is suddenly a national
player in recruiting. I don't quite know how to get my
head wrapped around this. It's you know, it's one.
I feel like to some degree, a lot of the reaction of IU fans
to this recruitment. Announcement has been it's like,
wow, this is amazing and then I don't know what to do with my
hands, you know, it's like this is Just different kind of
strata. I feel like for IU in terms of
where they've been recently and it's not like Indiana hasn't
pulled in 5-star recruits. But a to get a guy that was
committed to Duke, who's a clear?
Five star who had Kansas on his list and and then to actually be
able to pull that guy, it just feels like all of a sudden,
Indiana broke through a glass ceiling of sorts in terms of
where the program had been. Because, you know, I mean, yes,
they've Cody Zeller. I think was actually, he wasn't
Maybe Technically a five-star. He was a borderline, you know,
but he was also from right down the road Romeo Langford was
deciding between Indiana and Kansas was a five-star.
You know, he's also looking at I think maybe North Carolina, but
he was literally, there's maybe Duke, but he was literally right
down the road. This is a guy from New Jersey.
I think maybe I think, I think our friend IU artifacts told me
this is only the second New Jersey recruit Indiana's ever
had. And I think the first one was
Jordan Geronimo. Like, yes, you got Jalen atrophy
know last year and that felt like Cool occurrence but it's
like that felt like an anachronism.
Like that's not something that Indiana normally does.
Mike Woodson now has managed to pull multiple five-star recruits
really like modern athletic basketball players into the fold
here in Indiana. You throw in calel where who's a
transfer, but he fits that same kind of mold and you know we'll
talk about the individual player here but I think overall program
wise Scott this just feels like a different playground than
we've been invited to. In the past, a hundred percent.
So I'm going to text thread with two friends, shout out to Robert
and been Robert is who I've mentioned.
Many times the Michigan State fan neighbor, but we have a kind
of a fun, basketball, text thread and as mckinsey's got
down to the last two, I kind of sent out a screen shot of him
like you Kansas Indiana and he comes back very valid.
Like I thought you didn't care about recruiting him, like, like
had all these, like, screenshots of things.
I've talked about, like, when he's talking about all the
Michigan State five stars they got and I'm like, yeah.
But now, we're getting five stars, but it's like, now I
care. Now, again, I still not into
like, the Deep recruiting. But yeah, once once five stars
get down to two schools and Indiana is one of them I'm 100%
in. No, I agree that it does feel
like we've broken through something.
You know what, I will reference something I did list.
I was not able to make the assembly call, emergency pot
either, but I listened to it and they reference something, which
I think is interesting that, you know, Woodson has kind of The
Narrative is he kind of sees himself as a closer and you
know, maybe that doesn't work as well in the longer, you know,
three-year recruiting cycle. But it definitely seems to be
working in these shorter windows.
And, you know, it's like and you know the thought may go to some
IU fans like well man, why can't you do?
The it's like we haven't had a coach do one thing well, in
recruiting in a while. So like having him be really
good at, this is great. And you know, exactly what you
mentioned. This is a guy who decommitted
from duke who was Looking at Kansas and we won that battle.
Like we haven't been in those you know we've been kind of
peripherally in those battles where it's a guy names like 13
schools and Indiana's, one of them, and then they narrow it
down and we're not there. Like we were not going
head-to-head with Duke, but we're going head-to-head with
Kansas and Rick Pitino at st. John's right?
Yes, st. John's yes.
Who also is like he's well like, so.
There is something going on here.
I think also it needs to be mentioned that, you know, this
is I think the third year in a row that we've had a five star D
commit at another school in commit here with Tamar Bates and
then Malik renew and now Mackenzie, and, you know,
that's, that's really good. You know, this is where you
start stacking 5 stars on 5 Stars, good things happen.
You know, we'll talk about you know again I'm not saying his
last name. I'll get there by, you know,
probably November December but you know, Of 25 and 26 and we'll
see on. See how see how good he is.
He's got a score, if he wants pronunciation, respect, you know
it, you know five stars. Don't automatically mean, you're
going to win a National Title like Romeo Langford, I think
it's still the highest rate of recruit we ever got that didn't
pan out how people wanted. But part of the problem was
there wasn't a lot of other five star Talent on that team.
You know, this is how you build a program is you start stacking
these, these things up, some five stars will be fantastic.
Some will be Okay. But, you know, you get enough
and you're going to be doing well in this is, you know,
probably the best stretch of, you know, I've not I'm thinking
of this as I'm saying this, I probably should have done a
little bit of research but you know, when you count all of the,
you know, five stars and high-level recruits and
transfers that we're getting in this last three year.
Period, I'm not sure when we've had such a nice little run in
recruiting. I mean cream built that team.
But it's like you know like you said Zeller was like right on
that border like oh The depot was a not.
He was a three-star who grew into something.
I think you know, Watford, Maurice Creek is probably the
highest rate of recruit whatever is pretty rated.
Highly like Jordan holes was not like that those were all really
good players but not a lot of great recruits.
And again the last thing I'll say is you don't you know you
don't have to have all five stars to win the title.
Like look at this year's tournament Kansas state.
Did it with a couple you Lowell or Newell guys would get our
transfers that you know from from smaller schools at Penn
State is a great example of a great season.
All of that said, Often than not having a lot of like Kansas has
done really well over time. Duke and North Carolina done
really well because they just load up with tons of talent.
So there's multiple ways to win. But this is a very, very high
likelihood way to get a lot of wins.
Yeah, I mean so there's a couple elements there.
One of them is this idea that IU is tapping into Talent channels
that it just hasn't had up to this point?
Point. And you know so much of what you
saw /, really? I mean you could really go all
the way back to the late 80s. Well you know where Indiana kind
of stopped being a primary destination for the highest
level of athletic Talent the guys who were likely to go to
the NBA very quickly after or maybe even skip, you know and
just go straight to the NBA when that was still the rule.
I think about what kind of win like Will started getting out of
their Geographic territory. Well, that means was well good
in that area. It was targeting everyone.
The Midwest, it was partially that but it was also, you know,
I you kind of got left behind as college basketball changed, its
approach to playing the game and and you really saw l.a. l.a.
gears on a good shooter who wants to have well a lot.
And so and I honestly kind of came a little bit later because
it wasn't just talent. And one of the things that I
think is important about this, it's not just that high level
Talent from a ratings for spect is being criticized.
You point out, I use gotten some highly rated guys before that
haven't really equated to anything, but there's a
development aspect to it as well.
And this is where Mike Woodson in a very short period of time
has managed to create a reputation for himself and his
program that hey, not only will I get you to the draft, if you
come here as a highly regarded recruit, but, even if you
weren't at highly-regarded, I can get you closer than when you
when I first got my hands on you, trace Jackson, Davis being
a good example. I mean, You know, that's a guy
who I don't know, if he's going to get drafted, you know, he
probably will seem like his draft stock had gone up to the
point. Maybe he's a, you know, a high
second-round pick, but for a guy with a relatively limited
offensive skill set, you know, more than 8 feet away from the
basket. Mike, Woodson did a tremendous
amount with him to develop his game.
Jalen Hurd, Shaheen. Oh yes, he didn't have a perfect
freshman year but he did more than enough and Woodson put in
enough situations to succeed, that he is going to be a border.
Online Lottery top 20 Prospect in the NBA draft and that
matters to people. And that's what Indiana really
hasn't had. I mean, you know, yes, Romeo
Langford got drafted, but you could argue, he went backwards
in terms of his draft stock between the time.
He got to IU in the time that he got drafted and Woodson's NBA
connections. I mean you know Carmelo
Anthony's getting involved in the recruitment.
As we saw from one of the stories you know from this from
this particular commitment, you're starting to see.
Comments from people about Woodson, being the type of
person that they want to go play for and the kind of guy who
will, you know, be a real human being, but will also push you.
And that's kind of what Trace Jackson.
Davis has animated in a bunch of his postseason press conferences
as well. That environment is to a large
degree, something that Indiana's missed.
Yes, they've had guys that are developed and have gotten
drafted, but it's always felt like an accident or a nice.
Bonus as opposed to the way the program does business.
And I feel like in a very short period of time.
Now, Mike Woodson's managed to put his own stamp on the
program. And it's it's weird because I
think this you know, it's hard to give like a huge amount of
credit for not for like okay, Scott Dolson couldn't have seen
all of this coming per se because who could have
predicted, that college basketball would have been at a
point where you've got the transfer portal where you've got
all this player movement. But you have to give Golson some
credit because Woodson as a coach with what he brings to the
table and what he's been able to do already has kind of defied.
What a lot of the initial expectations were in that.
It's not just a paycheck, caching situation for an xn.
Be a guy like we'll see you in a lot of situations but instead
someone who's molding a Blueblood College basketball
program back into what it could be in an era where a different
type of cogent, a different type of approaches.
Needed from kind of what Indiana has been able to have over the
last 20 to 25 years. What I also really like about
this is and we don't know how these things were going and you
know when guys announced versus when they make their decisions
and all those things but you know just from what we know, you
know I don't think Mackenzie had even decommitted when we were
talking to Chris Ludlum. Like again to the point of how
how fluid these things are. But you know, we go after Chris
LED l'm, he signs with Tennessee.
And you know, I do have to give Woodson the entire program
credit of not being like Oh should we gotta just sign three
more guys? It was like getting to know just
getting like who the next week guys?
Before we'll get him get him, get him get him which feels like
what you know like cream might have done it did seem like there
was kind of a measured response now getting, maybe they were
already talking to McKinsey. They knew that was, you know, we
don't know. But it did have a very kind of
cool calm approach, like, hey, man, we're good, like we're, you
know, we will, there will be somebody good and better, not
just. All right, we struck out on two
of our dues. We now need just get Ever we can
before this portal closes and I really like that patients.
And again, looking at it from kind of a high-level view of
we're not just going to grab any piece that's available.
Like we're going to wait for the right piece, even if that means
getting really close to the end of the shot clock so to speak.
Yeah. And I mean the the last kind of
overarching thing I'll say on this is we tried to talk about
this last time when we were discussing what was going on
with the portal. And, you know, we at that I
don't think with the last time we podcasted the Adlam news had
come down or the the the news on the other player whose name,
I've already forgotten had come down right.
But but there was an immediate, it's like ex-girlfriends the
right with you. There was a real Panic among the
fan base again, and there are certain corners of the eye, you
online experience that seemed to really just relish the thought
that Mike Woodson doesn't know what he's doing or that the
program and they athletic department is going in the wrong
direction. And they're not doing what they
should be doing and every perceived failure is Amplified
to a ridiculous extreme and you know my perspective on it has
been okay maybe they maybe they did fail we don't know.
There's so much going on behind the scenes in the portal and
with recruiting that we just don't know about as fanzi.
And and look a lot of journalists or people that
report on teams will claim that they know things.
And a lot of that is what coaches are.
Telling them, or assistant. Coaches are telling them or
people connected to programs because they're trying to put
particular types of information out or not.
As the case may be, you really is a fan have to accept to some
degree that despite what you might think, you don't really
know what's going on behind the scenes with a lot of these
recruitments. And as you said, like this was a
relatively late pop, it took some happenstance, Kyle Philip
house key doesn't come announce that he's coming back and you
know you're probably not seeing this.
Our be available for Indiana in the first place but that's where
it's a lot more flexible and a lot more of a malleable
situation than just oh we lost that player.
Therefore we're screwed, which is how a lot of people seem to
be evaluating this and the message I put out on Twitter
yesterday. It's like if you're an IU fan
why don't we just say, you know what?
I think Mike Woodson and his staff know what they're doing.
I mean this is a as much as there was criticism all last
year. It's a team that finished with a
top four. Feed.
You know, finished within spitting distance of you know,
the top of the Big Ten and beat Purdue twice and did a bunch of
things that people have been asking for, and it felt like for
a lot of people that still wasn't enough.
It's like, well, I have to criticize this or criticize that
and the recruiting piece and the piecing the roster together
piece is another part of that, where it's like, well, you
didn't get this player, why don't I have any guards and out
of that and it's like well, hey guess what?
Have a 68, you know, small forward power forward with
three-point range. Is already projected to be a
first round pick in the NBA draft.
These things. I understand where people are
are snake bitten by the past but I really think if you're going
to be a good Steward of your eye, you fandom, you got to look
at what this coaching staffs done in a relatively short
period of time and say, these guys seem to be Pros, they seem
to be know what they're doing, knowing what they're doing.
Let's give them room to operate. And I think this is a good
example, as to why, well, if you take that out again, like, you
look at our Are you know, I don't want to start playing the
starting five game but I'll just I think I can figure four of the
starting five. It's like how many years would I
have wanted to go into any neiu fan wanted to go into a season
just knowing this, you know, you're starting five at point
guard, you're going to have a, you know, an ultimate senior,
who is, you know, it all big, 10, caliber player.
I think it's if you know, first or second team all-big, ten
caliber player and then in three of the other spots are all going
to be five star guys. And I'm not talking like, you
know, five star guys that were Goodbye other Blueblood
five-star programs like how many years already?
Like I love, we just had a five star.
It's like now you know you three of your starters could very well
be all five-star recruits and you and you have an all big ten
point guard. Yeah.
Like that. Like how many years like I would
have loved to have had like, we have that right?
I do get some of the angst at the end of last year because
like it felt like it was a we're losing a lot of guys which we
did. We were losing, you know, a
generational player and Trace Jackson Davis and was kind of
like, wow, there's what's going to be there but But you know, in
part of it may just be from fans, you know, having years
where we didn't, we weren't able to reload, but this is a new
Administration and this is a new coaching staff and they seem to
be able to reload it. And again, I go back to the idea
of, you know. Yeah, maybe and again, give
Woodson some time on some of these 34-year recruits like, you
know, people are kind of hammering him and I don't want
to turn this into like, you know, a kiss-ass rodeo but it's
like, oh, you know. But yeah, everyone's hammering
on the 2023 class, like dude, he's only been there for eight.
Months, like he missed the beginning part of those
recruiting cycles and like he's showing that when the time is
short, he's able to kind of focus and get it done.
And in 2024 2025, we may see better recruits coming in
because he's had that time to build that relationship.
Like, obviously, he can build those relationships and the
players respond to it. Well, no, I think it's all
really good and now, you know, you think about it.
Now, you've got a five-star in McDowell coming in and you've
got four stars and Gabe cups and Jukai Newton coming in and then
you've already got on the roster Khalil where ours, who's a
five-star you've got renew, who was a borderline, you've got
Caleb Banks, who was a promising for Star.
You've got CJ gun, who was a for?
I believe a four-star. And then you've got this depth
among your seniors. As you mentioned, either 60 or
starting point guard, which is a tremendous luxury to have in
anywhere. You've got, you brought in this
kind of utility knife and Anthony Walker from Miami.
You've got another utility knife in the post in pain. and Sparks
you've got tray Galloway who could just end up being your
starting to because now I mean, you think about this if Baco can
actually Shoot and score. And that, you know, that's kind
of the best part of his game is, he's shooting ability.
He averaged, I think something like 16 and a half points, a
game and 7.6 rebounds per game, he was on the Nike ybl circuit,
you know, he he had 22 points and eight rebounds, in the Nike
hoop Summit, he's not a perfect Prospect, that's why he's not
like a top-five guy. Because, I mean, he's a little
from what you've read. I mean, Jack Ankeny from the SI
Indiana imprints talking about. He's a little bit stiff
athletically, that's something that can be, Be worked out.
He could use some time in the weight room but now you don't
need necessarily tray Galloway to be anything other than like
your number five offensive option.
If you're starting, we're at the five renu-it, the 4mc Baco at
the three and Johnson at the one.
It's like, well, gosh, if you had a fifth offensive option,
who could shoot 46 percent, or 45 percent and three
occasionally and play good defense and you've got some
backup. You still need, I think another
guard. It'd be nice to pick up one more
guard. But if CJ gun Develops over the
offseason suddenly your roster looks really, really nice and
really complete. That's this is where I think
going back to something that you said, a lot of the criticism, I
understand where it comes from, but God's college, basketball
has changed so much in the last two years.
I mean, this is a guy who Indiana, I don't think was on
the radar for at all, maybe a little bit in the initial
recruitment, but guy goes to Duke.
That's not the strata Indiana isn't pulling in, but the fact
that you're going to get Get D commits, you're going to get
guys, transferring that you're not expecting.
There are three or four guys that hopped in the portal.
Including I think a kid from Marshall that Indiana is looking
at who's a guard. You have to be able to Pivot
very quickly and say, alright, I realized we have to fill this
hole and suddenly these guys are available and then we even saw
like when Ludlum committed to Tennessee.
Now, there's a guy in the portal from Tennessee who if Indiana
hadn't gotten big Bako, might have been able to go after that
guy. And it would have been a really
good fit, so, I think ultimately as we've talked about many times
on this show, you almost have to unplug what you think college
basketball works like, from where things are right now
because it's a very different world.
And weirdly this staff with Woodson leading, it feels really
well equipped to handle the constant fluctuation.
And I'd like to note like yes, you lose Jordan Geronimo and
it's a shame Geronimo, didn't work out as a player.
But, you know, outside of people leaving because Our eligibility
was exhausted, Indiana didn't lose any key pieces that they
were really worried about. You know, it's clear that Mike
Woodson's built something where the good players that were here
wanted to stay and the players that are coming in are like,
this is a project that I want to be a part of and that should be
really exciting for you as an Indiana fan.
I would think. So I'm just I'm kind of laughing
is you're saying that I know this is not what you mean but
I'll use it as a proxy argument. The, you know, when you were
talking about, you know, the the reasons why McKinsey is not a
top five. Kurt, you're seeing some of that
chatter of like, you know, he's you know, there's there's parts
to his game that aren't great and it's like, alright well like
but see you scarecrow arguments, those Indiana fans.
It's like you can't just go from like zero to 100 in one season
like there is a great like like yes we're not getting the top
two recruits every year but like we're not getting anything five
years ago so you can't just go from like kind of being out of
recruiting to Suddenly It's like wow he's only the top using the
for recruiting the country. So it's like that makes me laugh
but the Other piece too is like two people who would say that
again. Not saying it's you but it's
like there's also the peace that you know, we're talking the
values of Woodson, how he's doing in this recruiting, in
this new age which is showing to be very well.
It's also like, let's not forget that.
Yeah. MacKenzie's going to come in
with some holes in his game but Woodson has also shown the
ability to make players better. Like look at Tres Jackson Davis
in the first two years under Archie.
He was good, he kind of What he was.
And then once Woodson really got his hands on Trace I think, you
know, obviously Trace put some work into but it's like Trace
transformed his game, totally differently.
So you know and you look at guys like he was a savior Johnson
who's become you know much more focused and what he's able to
do, you know so it's like there's a world tour.
Like Woodson can take these guy, you renew struggled a lot with
fouls and he still did near the end but you could definitely
see. He was getting so much better
and he was doing starting to do the Right?
Things by the end of the season. So, you know, there's a world to
were like, you know, this is a guy would sort of guy who can
also develop players. Not like, we're just getting
recruits and then rolling the ball out and say, well, that's a
part of his game is never going to get better.
So, I know it's all, it's all really good.
And again, that the piece that I really like is something that
you had hammered home. You know, near the end of the
crean era cannot pick going back to pick on cream but it's like
when you looked at the recruits we were getting for a while
there. Your point was always look at
the other schools were competing against at that point.
It was like Well, and Western Kentucky and like you know,
maybe they had an offer from Cincinnati at the time.
It's like who like big win? I mean, you know, these are
these are really big recruits like where had you know guys.
You know five-star he had deal top level program offers last
year went to Oregon you know. But then he was wanted by a
bunch of different schools when he when he dropped out you know
it Mackenzie went to Duke, I'm not sure where else he was offer
but I'm sure it was all the schools you'd imagine and then
we went head-to-head to Kansas like this.
Is if nothing else too. This is something that we just
really haven't done too because going back to some of those
other targets that we've gotten, It's Like Romeo, you know,
probably would have gone to Louisville, had it not been for
the hilde to Scandal, but it's also an Indiana kids.
So we have an inside track like right?
Ike, I would be hard-pressed to think of another high-level
recruit that really didn't have like a real Indiana tie that we
were also going up against a Kansas, North Carolina Duke.
And we won that like these are again, this doesn't mean we're
going to win the national title with me.
The guy is going to be the As pirate Indian history but it's
like those are things that we haven't traditionally done it.
If we want to be the program, we want to be, we've got to be
doing these kinds of things on a in you know, every season basis.
And the fact that we're starting to see a lot of traction very
quickly is really positive, I agree.
And look like you said, it doesn't mean I'm going to win a
National Title necessarily but you've got a lot better shot at
getting there with those types of players.
Do for right right? Yeah that was the last thing I
would say because I know Scott's got to get to it.
They party but before not mine. Not Scott's birthday party,
though. But the other thing I'll note
and I this was in one of the articles but Indiana's ni L
operation was was specifically named as one of the factors for
Bach, bro, to come to Bloomington.
And I I'm going to keep saying this and for those of you who
are still skeptical of Ni L, this is the biggest innate
advantage that Indiana has right now in college basketball.
And I for one am thrilled that Woodson and the athletic
department are leveraging it, as well as they are and doing it in
a way. That is both careful.
But also thoughtful, there's so much money tied up with IU
basketball. Fandom that has never really
been tapped officially or at least not to the degree.
It hasn't been leveraged to a degree the way that Kentucky or
Kansas or Duke has leveraged their money people because it
was quote-unquote, you know, against the rules and we didn't
do that with Indiana basketball. but it's all legal now and it's
clear that Indiana has figured out a formula and has a group of
people who are like Oh you mean if we give this to this person
we're going to have an advantage in recruiting and there's very
few schools I think when you fully unlock the financial
resources among alumni and among donors that can match, what
Indiana can do, you know, I mean I'm not saying Indiana can
exceed a Kentucky or a Kansas or North Carolina, but they also
don't necessarily have to be particularly far behind I think
they're in that argument and if you put everything else equal
out there and you have a coach that people believe in and want
to go play for, that's a dynamite combination like that.
Is that is what elevates your program back up to, where it
needs to be. And look, I don't think that
money is the sole reason why Indiana struggled in basketball
for the last 30 years, but it certainly hasn't helped that
Indiana has gone into a lot of these battles with both hands
tied behind their backs, compared to what some of their
competitors. Have done.
So that is exciting, Scott and go ahead.
And I want to, I want to expand on that.
I think it's a great point. And, you know, because I thought
here this all the time, I think we have this like Indiana's.
A second largest alumni base in the country, like, not just in
the Big 10 but I think out of all schools, like it's Ohio,
State and Indiana. So, there's a huge alumni base
to give money, but I agree with you a million percent.
I also think that it's really good that we're getting those.
Those stories are getting out there that, you know, hey, this
is a fan base and they program has a real positive and good ni
L program. Because what's interesting is
other schools in the Big Ten, you're seeing the opposite
happening. Like I think it was Minnesota,
you know, the university came out and said like, you know, we
had, you know, four hundred thousand dollars to all of our
basketball players this year at ni L.
It's like okay well if you're saying that is probably lower
because everyone flakes everything.
And like that's not something to gloat about like that semi.
It sounds like a lot of money but it's like but the other
thing is that you look at hundred Dickinson who's like
basically, basically Aang, I left Michigan because they
weren't paying me enough money. And I can make a lot more money.
It can was. And so you get more of these
stories stacking up where it's like, hey these other schools,
the Big Ten kind of don't have their s together at ni L and
look, I you kind of does I think that's going to just change the
perception because, you know, you and I are on this page I'm
fine with this but this is like all these things matter but in
the end like this, you know, that famous quote, the answer to
all your questions is money, you know, in the end like if you're
like, hey Andy, Yeah, and it has money and they're willing to pay
players that's going to change a lot of opinions.
Even more than all the other things were mentioning Penn
State is actually the school that has the largest alumni
base, but all Penn State alums care about is football in the
Indiana. Second, they've 650,000 living
alumni want to read the rest of the list real quick Michigan's
3rd, which is kind of ironic. But again, Michigan fans care
about football. They don't really care about.
They say, they care about basketball.
They honestly don't fourth Michigan, State, Michigan State,
I think has It's that both before and during the ni El era,
but you need to be fair, all their alumni are buying NBA
teams, right? We'll take their money.
Their money is going to the NBA, it's like Point actually over
atmosphere. Well, no, well, then no Magic
Johnson, just was part part of the bid that bought the
Commander's. So when I got the Dodgers.
Yeah. And you know it well but to be
fair, they also tied up, what three hundred million dollars on
Tucker's? Yeah, fifth is UCLA.
Which again this is my point is it's not a 14-1.
It's not like we have a huge alumni base.
Therefore it's going to result in a lot of recruits because you
know who's what is it a fun? The list is Rutgers intent on
the list is Purdue, but produce problem is like two-thirds of
their alums live overseas, you know, the oven.
So, that's this is where Indiana's just in this really
fascinating spot where there's, this is what people in Indiana
care about. They care about basketball, you
know, as much as we've talked about football as much as you
and I have podcast about football, realistically, the
straw that stirs? The drink?
The drink itself is basketball. Here it is.
Anna. It's not football and so that's
where I'm really our podcast. Numbers agree with that.
They really do. Let's take you behind the
analytics here at Crimson cat. No, no we really don't want to
do that, but the point is ultimately a fully activated IU,
n IL infrastructure combined with a coach like Mike Woodson,
who is, you know, I think Tyra and you can feel free to come
back, fans listening. Feel free to come back and Ten
years if I'm wrong and say Galen, you were wrong.
But I think 10 years from now we're going to look back at the
results of the 20 22 23 season and say, how the hell did Mike
Woodson. Squeeze a four seed out of a
group of players that were that one-dimensional, in terms of the
things that they brought to the table?
That's not a criticism. But it's like, Trace Jackson
Davis did one thing incredibly well, Miller cop did like one
thing. Incredibly, well, they lose a
starting point guard. They had a freshman point guard
who, you know, was still learning the ropes.
Hopes and they somehow got them. Do a four-seat.
I think we're going to look back on that and say that was a
really incredible job of putting a team together and getting the
most out of what you had. I think we're going to look at
things moving forward with as Woodson starts to get more
athletic, more modern, you know, athletic players into the mix
and starts to work with them. I think you're going to see,
even greater gains in terms of what Indiana's able to do on the
floor. What we're seeing here is is
Woodson, kind of doing the best with what he what hand he was
dealt and What limited things, he was able to get in the
portal. Now we're starting to see, okay,
this is the caliber of player that frankly Woodson's used to
coaching at the NBA level, like long athletic guys, that can
shoot from anywhere and, you know, put him in his
developmental team on those guys for a year.
Two years, whatever. I'm really excited to see what
happens with all of that. Last last last thing.
Last last let you in, you have all of this, which is good.
The other thing that he is this is where, like, I'm just very
happy with where things are going.
It was just announced a couple days ago.
This is not the biggest one but it goes to my point.
You know, we're playing Florida Gulf Coast to open the season,
but that's another area where Woodson is helping and these all
these things are all connected where our schedule in the
non-conference is getting just so much better.
You know, last year you saw us play Kansas and Arizona.
You know this year we're playing the Empire classic which is
looks like a really good field including the defending national
champion, you know. Again the Florida Gulf Coast
isn't a like a high-level team but it's still like it's a team
that's made some noise in the Animal.
That's better than some of these, you know, Louisiana Cajun
state or whatever and then you know, we have Harvard which is a
name school but then you have a law bird and Lana we're playing
Kansas in a home-and-home. We get 100 Dickinson back, you
know? And there might be one more.
Like that's another piece of all these things like these
high-level players want to play in shockingly, high level games
against other high-level players on National Television.
They don't want to play, you know, five teams in Assembly
Hall, that are just, you know, 30-point blowout.
So I'm also really encourage. By that seeing us continue to as
you would say, like we're continuing to act like a
big-time program, like this is what high level programs do.
They go after high level recruits?
They go after high-level transfers, they schedule like
high level teams and like we're starting to do all of the things
that a high-level program does. Yeah.
And and they do things with those players.
I think is the other piece of the puzzle.
That's, and at that is obviously had to be seen but I don't know
how you look at the first two years of what.
Woodson was able to squeeze out of the rosters but there's years
and say, well gosh, there's no way you can do anything with
these guys. I think to me, it's quite the
opposite. So anyway, we'll be back with
more. We've got some schedule stuff to
talk about on our next podcast. We might have another recruit
because the portal hasn't completely closed.
Yet there's still some time to do some stuff, but we will come
back and talk more about that on a future show.
Will also have a special show coming up this week that I'm not
going to spoil for you, but it'll be interesting to a
certain segment of our audience. Scott have fun today.
Are you going to the race? So I am going to the Grand Prix.
That's great. I hope you have a great time.
I'm going to watch it on television.
They haven't black that out yet, but it was available on TV.
Well, maybe he's still got a couple hours to Black it up.
Anyway for Scott, I'm Galen have a great weekend.
Hoosier Nation will catch you folks on the flip side, bring
back the Bison. So long everybody.