1 00:00:02,720 --> 00:00:05,800 Hey there, it's Jess. If you're new here, I'm a 2 00:00:05,800 --> 00:00:08,600 certified professional canine nutritionist, raw nutrition 3 00:00:08,600 --> 00:00:11,720 certified for dogs and cats, a holistic pet health coach, the 4 00:00:11,720 --> 00:00:15,040 founder of Wild Wellness Pet, and the host of the Pet 5 00:00:15,040 --> 00:00:17,680 Parenting Reset podcast that you're listening to right now, 6 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:22,000 where every pet deserves the absolute best and every pet 7 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:25,480 parent is welcome. Learn from the best holistic and 8 00:00:25,480 --> 00:00:27,880 integrative experts in veterinary medicine and 9 00:00:27,880 --> 00:00:31,160 nutrition every Tuesday right here on this podcast. 10 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:34,960 Or get individualized help with your pet through one-on-one 11 00:00:34,960 --> 00:00:38,840 consultations and take a deep dive into the root cause with 12 00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:41,840 the Wild Wellness Bioenergetics at Home testing kit. 13 00:00:42,240 --> 00:00:45,880 It's time to rethink how we raise our pets. 14 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:49,560 A reset to naturally healthy dogs and cats. 15 00:00:50,040 --> 00:00:52,720 If you've been feeling like there has to be something more, 16 00:00:52,720 --> 00:00:58,280 something better, a better way to raise healthier pets, welcome 17 00:00:58,520 --> 00:01:02,800 to the pet Parenting Reset. Welcome back, pet parent. 18 00:01:02,800 --> 00:01:08,120 I'm really, really, really excited to bring back Doctor 19 00:01:08,120 --> 00:01:10,120 Odette Souter for you guys today. 20 00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:13,160 If you remember, it's been a little while since she's been on 21 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:17,880 the podcast, but if you are an OG, you remember when she was on 22 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:21,280 and you Remember Me saying that one of the very first books I 23 00:01:21,280 --> 00:01:25,360 ever read when I first started going down this journey of 24 00:01:25,520 --> 00:01:30,640 integrative holistic modalities, bringing them into my pets 25 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:33,680 lives. It was her best selling book, 26 00:01:33,680 --> 00:01:37,360 What your vet never told you. And so first of all, let me 27 00:01:37,360 --> 00:01:40,320 welcome Doctor Odetsir back to the podcast. 28 00:01:40,320 --> 00:01:42,440 How are you doing? I'm good, I'm good. 29 00:01:42,440 --> 00:01:45,200 It's so nice to be here and chatting with you, Jessica. 30 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:47,920 I never knew that about you. Know that that was your first 31 00:01:47,920 --> 00:01:51,760 enjoying troll. Yeah, You know, I think that 32 00:01:51,760 --> 00:01:54,440 because it's been so long. I mean, it feels like it's been 33 00:01:54,440 --> 00:01:57,400 so long now because I've kind of immersed myself in it. 34 00:01:57,400 --> 00:02:01,200 But I remember the very first thing I ever found was a 35 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:04,560 Facebook page that was it was not Rodney or Karen, even though 36 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:06,600 they have some of the biggest Facebook pages. 37 00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:10,199 I found another Facebook page that led me to them. 38 00:02:10,199 --> 00:02:13,360 And when I first started, like just doing a deep dive. 39 00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:15,560 I love to read. I love books. 40 00:02:15,560 --> 00:02:17,880 I love to read. Give me me all the books I'm 41 00:02:17,880 --> 00:02:19,920 going to. I have, I have a stack this big 42 00:02:19,920 --> 00:02:23,960 of my to be read pile, but not to mention my audible wish list. 43 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:28,720 But yeah, it's, it was one of the very first books that I 44 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:32,080 actually read and I, and it's very approachable. 45 00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:35,280 So that was one of the things when I got started, I was like, 46 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:39,360 OK, you know, there are books that are this thick, you know, 4 47 00:02:39,360 --> 00:02:41,520 inches thick. And, and I'm like, OK, I can do 48 00:02:41,520 --> 00:02:44,160 that, but it's going to take me some time. 49 00:02:44,160 --> 00:02:48,040 So finding your book, I was like, oh, I, I got through that 50 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:51,560 on a plane ride, like, but it was impactful. 51 00:02:52,400 --> 00:02:54,600 So thank you for this. Yeah. 52 00:02:54,640 --> 00:02:55,160 You're. Welcome. 53 00:02:56,440 --> 00:02:59,320 Yeah, that's how people tell me they read it in an afternoon and 54 00:02:59,320 --> 00:03:03,920 and it really kind of gives them the, you know, the lowdown 55 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:08,240 because in the end, you know, you can get into all the details 56 00:03:08,240 --> 00:03:11,040 and sort of lose the forest for its trees. 57 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:13,160 I think that's how we say. It right, I always say. 58 00:03:13,920 --> 00:03:17,800 But in any case, and I'm also somebody who doesn't really beat 59 00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:21,520 around the Bush, I'm a very bad storyteller as a result of it 60 00:03:21,520 --> 00:03:25,440 because like, OK, it started here and then here's the end. 2 61 00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:27,360 minutes later, I'm telling you the story. 62 00:03:27,360 --> 00:03:30,240 So that's my book. You know, in a way as well, you 63 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:34,320 know, just kind of what really what really matters rather than 64 00:03:34,320 --> 00:03:37,360 going on too many tangents and making it more complicated 65 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:40,680 because I think we have enough of that going on in this world 66 00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:43,000 right now. I call it the Internet vomit 67 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:45,600 because there's so much information out there. 68 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:48,360 People get confused. They are overwhelmed with that 69 00:03:48,400 --> 00:03:50,680 information. They don't know what to do with 70 00:03:50,680 --> 00:03:52,480 it. Either they go and buy a bunch 71 00:03:52,480 --> 00:03:55,560 of stuff that's not really helping, or they end up just 72 00:03:55,560 --> 00:04:00,480 completely paralyzed, not knowing where to go from having 73 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:06,200 bringing it down to basics to kind of clear things and and 74 00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:10,320 make it more understandable in the sense of what is really what 75 00:04:10,680 --> 00:04:13,760 really matters is very helpful for people, obviously. 76 00:04:13,880 --> 00:04:18,000 And I just realized I forgot to put on my poop hat Rabbit real 77 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:21,560 quick. Anyways, yeah, yeah, we're going 78 00:04:21,560 --> 00:04:23,680 to be talking about the gut and everything, you know? 79 00:04:23,840 --> 00:04:26,520 Yes, yes. Higher here. 80 00:04:26,800 --> 00:04:30,520 Well, yes, we are going to talk about the gut and but before we 81 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:34,320 do that, I just want to kind of continue that conversation you 82 00:04:34,320 --> 00:04:39,320 just started around this like vomiting of information, not all 83 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:42,600 of which is true. There's so many opinions and not 84 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:45,600 to say that opinions are bad or wrong, but it's, it's 85 00:04:45,600 --> 00:04:50,080 overwhelming for a lot of pet parents and even people like me 86 00:04:50,080 --> 00:04:55,560 who, you know, I try to stay up on what's going on and what 87 00:04:55,560 --> 00:04:57,680 works and what doesn't. And, you know, all the 88 00:04:57,680 --> 00:05:01,000 different, some of the different harvesting modalities. 89 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:06,040 And there was a time this past summer in 2025, I was at a 90 00:05:06,040 --> 00:05:08,080 conference and there were multiple speakers. 91 00:05:08,200 --> 00:05:13,200 And one of the conversations that I started at the end of the 92 00:05:13,200 --> 00:05:18,480 conference was that this is This is why pet parents are so 93 00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:22,000 confused. Because even among all of these 94 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:26,840 amazing veterinarians and pet food formulators and all of the 95 00:05:26,840 --> 00:05:31,160 wonderful people that we love to listen to, in one conference, we 96 00:05:31,160 --> 00:05:35,320 had conflicting viewpoints from two different speakers. 97 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:39,920 And it's like both of them seem right, right. 98 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:42,440 You listen to 1:00 and you're like, you make so much sense and 99 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:44,840 you listen to the other and you go, you make so much sense, but 100 00:05:44,840 --> 00:05:46,760 you're saying exactly the opposite things. 101 00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:51,160 So what do we do? And and that's just confusing, 102 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:57,320 but also to me kind of points us right back around to the reason 103 00:05:57,320 --> 00:06:00,800 why so many people are finding functional medicine again, 104 00:06:01,040 --> 00:06:04,800 because everything is it needs an individualized approach. 105 00:06:04,800 --> 00:06:07,120 And what works for one dog may not work for another dog. 106 00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:09,600 Yeah, yeah. And I think, you know, the 107 00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:14,280 different things that each of us learn and bring to the table is 108 00:06:14,280 --> 00:06:18,520 based on our experience, our lives, our lenses, our views of 109 00:06:18,520 --> 00:06:21,280 things and what we were diving in. 110 00:06:21,280 --> 00:06:24,680 And so then if you get conflicting information, doesn't 111 00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:28,640 mean that one is wrong or the other one is is right. 112 00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:32,360 It's, it's more that it may just fit different, different 113 00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:35,760 situations basically, but we certainly also have so much 114 00:06:35,760 --> 00:06:38,960 information and so much more knowledge that's coming out. 115 00:06:39,000 --> 00:06:42,520 For example, microbiome research has exploded. 116 00:06:42,520 --> 00:06:46,960 When I was doing my lectures at the AHVMA conference, I just for 117 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:50,760 fun sakes, I googled, you know, how many new papers were coming 118 00:06:50,760 --> 00:06:56,040 out every day And within like a five day period back in, I think 119 00:06:56,040 --> 00:07:03,000 it was in 23 or 22, there were like 700 new papers in five days 120 00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:05,600 that came out. So that's like, you know, a bit 121 00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:07,480 more than 100 new papers every day. 122 00:07:07,720 --> 00:07:10,040 There's no way anyone can keep up with that. 123 00:07:10,080 --> 00:07:11,480 You know, there's, there's no way. 124 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:16,000 And so it's not just microbiome research, it's mitochondrial 125 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:18,440 research, it's research and cancer. 126 00:07:18,440 --> 00:07:23,080 It's research and inflammation, Well, danger response is one of 127 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:25,560 the things that I've been kind of looking into a little bit, 128 00:07:25,560 --> 00:07:28,600 you know, chronic diseases, there's exploding and 129 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:33,200 information that is coming to light now and that that makes it 130 00:07:33,200 --> 00:07:35,520 really confusing. I mean, it's for me as well. 131 00:07:35,520 --> 00:07:39,120 I feel like I know this much, you know, in the grand scheme of 132 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:42,880 things. And so I tend to focus back on, 133 00:07:42,880 --> 00:07:45,840 we have a little visitor there. So I tend to focus back on 134 00:07:46,200 --> 00:07:50,680 what's simple, you know, what makes sense, what's common 135 00:07:50,680 --> 00:07:55,840 sense, what what is nature doing and kind of going back to that 136 00:07:55,840 --> 00:07:59,360 as my anchor because otherwise I would also get lost in the weeds 137 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:02,080 because for example, in the mitochondrial cell danger 138 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:05,000 response, I can talk a little bit more about what that is, But 139 00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:07,320 you know, there's and then decided, you know, coming up 140 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:09,240 with some kind of a drug to manipulate it. 141 00:08:09,240 --> 00:08:13,600 And I'm like, OK, probably not, not the best idea. 142 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:17,040 So, you know, it gets really confusing and you can kind of 143 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:19,320 get lost in the weeds and losing nature. 144 00:08:19,320 --> 00:08:21,440 And that's a little bit what happened with the whole pet food 145 00:08:21,440 --> 00:08:23,960 industry. I mean, frankly, I mean, if you 146 00:08:23,960 --> 00:08:27,960 were to, you know, bring a bag of kibble and write down, you 147 00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:31,560 know, with all the list of ingredients that are on there 148 00:08:31,600 --> 00:08:34,760 and you give that to a person from like 200 years ago, they're 149 00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:37,799 like, what? You know, it doesn't make, it 150 00:08:37,799 --> 00:08:40,559 makes no sense. You know, there's no rationale 151 00:08:40,600 --> 00:08:44,320 to feeding this junk that we're providing the animals. 152 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:48,000 And so we have to kind of let go of, of some of whatever other 153 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:51,160 people are saying and such and kind of get back to common 154 00:08:51,160 --> 00:08:52,920 sense. You know, what do we know, 155 00:08:53,160 --> 00:08:56,000 right? We know we need oxygen, we know 156 00:08:56,000 --> 00:08:58,480 we need water. We know that we feel better when 157 00:08:58,480 --> 00:09:02,280 we're out in nature, You know, these things and and we the body 158 00:09:02,280 --> 00:09:06,480 knows what it needs to you know what, what feels good and the 159 00:09:06,480 --> 00:09:09,160 animals will tell you as well. You know, for example, my 160 00:09:09,160 --> 00:09:12,520 neighborhood dog, my neighbor's dog, if Ioffer him a piece of 161 00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:16,600 celery, he is like you crazy. I don't want that stuff I eat 162 00:09:16,600 --> 00:09:19,800 that, you know, so we have to kind of listen and and go back 163 00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:21,240 to that. And I think that's a little bit, 164 00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:26,120 you know, what's what we're being asked to do nowadays is to 165 00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:31,120 find the power inside of us, the knowledge inside of us. 166 00:09:31,160 --> 00:09:34,520 And sure, it's great to have additional knowledge from, you 167 00:09:34,520 --> 00:09:37,840 know, because it can make sense and put some pieces together and 168 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:39,800 all of that. But in the end, we just have to 169 00:09:39,800 --> 00:09:45,680 focus on on re empowering ourselves, taking our power back 170 00:09:45,760 --> 00:09:48,600 rather than giving it away to someone else and thinking that 171 00:09:48,600 --> 00:09:51,840 all they know better. In the end, as a pet parent, 172 00:09:51,880 --> 00:09:53,480 you're the expert of your animal. 173 00:09:53,480 --> 00:09:55,280 You know what works for your animal. 174 00:09:55,480 --> 00:09:57,080 You know what makes sense for them. 175 00:09:57,080 --> 00:10:01,040 Listening to be your guts, pun intended, is important. 176 00:10:01,680 --> 00:10:05,040 Well, yeah, that it's hard to get back to that where you 177 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:07,880 actually kind of know what your gut is telling you. 178 00:10:08,280 --> 00:10:11,360 I feel like it's it's become difficult to get back to that. 179 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:16,640 But so you have done tons of research into the gut microbiome 180 00:10:16,760 --> 00:10:19,720 and so much so that I'm like intimidated. 181 00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:22,280 I don't really even know what to ask you because I have no idea 182 00:10:22,280 --> 00:10:26,160 what you know. I think at the end of the day, 183 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:28,920 we can probably bring it back to a very simple statement like you 184 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:30,640 just made about getting back to nature. 185 00:10:30,640 --> 00:10:36,400 What are some of, if you don't mind divulging some of like if I 186 00:10:36,400 --> 00:10:40,360 were to just ask you what's like the most interesting or coolest 187 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:44,000 thing you've learned in your research, What comes to mind? 188 00:10:44,000 --> 00:10:47,440 Well, I think the, the coolest thing is really that most every 189 00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:52,800 microbe, parasite, yeast, whatever fungal, you know, 190 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:56,440 Organism or whatever is out there, they're not our enemies. 191 00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:02,280 You know, because we were trained and not for not that 192 00:11:02,280 --> 00:11:06,480 long, we were, we have now been trained to look at everything as 193 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:09,600 our enemy. And that's not the case because 194 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:13,400 most of these, you know, bugs, they, they've been living on 195 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:16,920 this planet for like 3 plus billion years. 196 00:11:17,280 --> 00:11:21,560 And they've not really, I mean, they've kind of evolved and 197 00:11:21,560 --> 00:11:27,600 they've also discovered and, you know, perfected strategies of 198 00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:31,880 survival that are absolutely necessary on this planet. 199 00:11:31,880 --> 00:11:36,480 And we are at a place in, in the world right now with all the 200 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:40,040 pollution and the destruction and the diseases and everything 201 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:43,720 that we've created. We are in a place where either 202 00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:47,320 we are going to find some survival strategy that is going 203 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:51,080 to let us survive and keep going, or we're going to perish 204 00:11:51,240 --> 00:11:54,360 and all, you know, die and it's not going to be the parasites 205 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:56,840 and the bacteria and so on. They are probably going to do 206 00:11:56,840 --> 00:12:01,000 just fine because bacteria, for example, they can evolve in like 207 00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:04,560 a short 2 hour period. They can completely change and 208 00:12:04,560 --> 00:12:09,120 adapt to the environment as humans, you know, animals, we 209 00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:11,200 have so many cells and so much going on. 210 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:14,000 There's no way that we can adapt so quickly. 211 00:12:14,400 --> 00:12:20,640 But you know, we can't forget that we're only 10% cells and 10 212 00:12:20,920 --> 00:12:24,920 and 90% microbe. So we have all of these amazing 213 00:12:24,920 --> 00:12:29,840 survival specialists and experts to help us adapt. 214 00:12:29,840 --> 00:12:35,800 And so if we can keep them alive in US and have that diversity of 215 00:12:35,800 --> 00:12:40,520 of microbial of the microbial community, then then we stand a 216 00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:43,040 much better chance. And there's a lot of research 217 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:45,720 going on these days with microplastics. 218 00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:48,280 You know, how can we destroy my microplastics? 219 00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:50,800 And there are some probiotics, I think it was from the 220 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:53,320 Lactobacillus family. I can't remember for sure now. 221 00:12:53,320 --> 00:12:57,560 But if you have some of those in your gut and take some of those, 222 00:12:57,560 --> 00:13:00,920 then it will limit the amount of microplastics that go into the 223 00:13:00,920 --> 00:13:03,160 system. So microbes are big going to be 224 00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:07,960 saving us because they can do so many things that we can't do. 225 00:13:08,600 --> 00:13:12,600 They can process something that would take years or even decades 226 00:13:12,600 --> 00:13:16,560 for us humans to do that in a in a lab at temperatures much 227 00:13:16,560 --> 00:13:20,240 higher and also creating a lot more pollution in the process. 228 00:13:20,280 --> 00:13:23,760 So they have like they, they have incredible abilities to to 229 00:13:23,760 --> 00:13:26,720 do things. And so making friends, I think 230 00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:31,520 is the is the is a kind of at the forefront for me is, you 231 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:32,960 know, we have to be friends with them. 232 00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:35,720 And that's why I post photos of me in the bathroom. 233 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:37,960 And I know you kind of picked up on it too. 234 00:13:38,000 --> 00:13:42,280 I mean, I haven't done it. Of a airport, fully dressed. 235 00:13:42,280 --> 00:13:45,160 I want to yeah, clarify. Fully dressed. 236 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:47,960 I know I haven't done it lately, even though I was traveling 237 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:51,280 recently, but I every time I stop in a bathroom in an 238 00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:52,840 airport, I always think about it. 239 00:13:53,760 --> 00:13:57,080 I like even one time I went to go do it, but there were just 240 00:13:57,080 --> 00:13:58,880 too many people in there. And I'm like, I'm going to be 241 00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:01,560 the weirdo taking a picture in a bathroom with everybody looking 242 00:14:01,560 --> 00:14:03,080 at me. Like, I know you're not trying 243 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:07,200 to take a picture with me, but it is, it is very funny. 244 00:14:07,200 --> 00:14:10,680 And I said I actually said something to someone recently 245 00:14:10,680 --> 00:14:14,480 when I was traveling because he was talking about how like 246 00:14:14,480 --> 00:14:20,800 health conscious his wife is. And and somehow we got on the 247 00:14:20,800 --> 00:14:24,960 topic of porta potties. And I'm like, well, I mean, you 248 00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:28,000 know, public restrooms, They're they're they're great natural 249 00:14:28,000 --> 00:14:29,160 FMT, right? I don't know. 250 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:35,800 Yeah, yeah. Well, yeah, And I don't want to 251 00:14:35,800 --> 00:14:38,040 say that everything happens for a reason. 252 00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:42,880 I truly believe that. And there's a trajectory and 253 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:48,440 there are learning curves. But germ theory did a lot of 254 00:14:48,440 --> 00:14:51,920 damage. And the way our doctors are 255 00:14:53,000 --> 00:14:57,560 taught now where it's just like kill it or cut it out, basically 256 00:14:57,560 --> 00:15:04,080 like the, everything they, they, they try to do doesn't when you, 257 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:11,040 when I hear you say, well, we're only like 10% of us really like 258 00:15:11,160 --> 00:15:15,600 then it really like really puts it into perspective as to why 259 00:15:15,600 --> 00:15:19,640 that's not ever going to work. And it could work in some 260 00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:22,040 certain situations, like it might be necessary. 261 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:25,440 I don't ever want to say that. I mean, thank goodness for 262 00:15:25,440 --> 00:15:29,600 emergency medicine, right? Goodness, we have that, but it 263 00:15:29,600 --> 00:15:34,520 really puts it into perspective as to how detrimental it is for 264 00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:36,360 us to always reach for that first. 265 00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:41,040 Yeah. So when we think about, I truly 266 00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:46,040 believe we're like as humans, we're in a health crisis. 267 00:15:46,040 --> 00:15:49,080 We have been in a health crisis. I think people are waking up to 268 00:15:49,200 --> 00:15:50,480 to the fact that we're in a health. 269 00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:53,560 Not everybody, but I think people are waking up to the fact 270 00:15:53,560 --> 00:15:55,760 that we're in a health crisis and that our food and 271 00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:59,640 environment are huge factors in that. 272 00:15:59,640 --> 00:16:01,720 And the same is true for our pets. 273 00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:05,720 You've already talked a little bit about pet food and certainly 274 00:16:05,720 --> 00:16:08,320 I talk about pet food all the time. 275 00:16:08,320 --> 00:16:13,400 It's it is my thing that I will always talk about and hydration. 276 00:16:13,400 --> 00:16:15,720 And like all the things. I actually, the reason I 277 00:16:15,840 --> 00:16:18,560 hydration came to mind is because the, the, the day we're 278 00:16:18,560 --> 00:16:21,520 recording this episode that's going live tomorrow is with a 279 00:16:21,520 --> 00:16:24,880 water expert. And I actually like put this off 280 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:29,880 for so long because for whatever reason it feels so overwhelming 281 00:16:29,880 --> 00:16:37,360 to me to tackle how terrible our water supply is and not really 282 00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:43,240 knowing the best answers for it. And also knowing that this is 283 00:16:43,240 --> 00:16:47,520 just a tangent I'm going on. The EPA guidelines are 284 00:16:47,800 --> 00:16:52,880 detrimental to women because they're based on 170 LB man. 285 00:16:53,560 --> 00:16:56,600 But then to think about how detrimental they are to our pets 286 00:16:56,600 --> 00:17:01,440 just because all of the EPA guidelines are based on 170 LB 287 00:17:01,440 --> 00:17:03,800 man. Like we don't even think about 288 00:17:03,800 --> 00:17:06,160 this. And my mind is being blown. 289 00:17:06,160 --> 00:17:09,119 I just edited the episode and I'm just like, this is so over. 290 00:17:09,119 --> 00:17:10,240 I don't even know if I want to put this up. 291 00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:11,440 I'm going to put the episode out. 292 00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:14,640 But to me I'm like, I'm still so overwhelmed. 293 00:17:16,319 --> 00:17:20,560 And so overall, just the idea of keeping ourselves and our pets 294 00:17:20,560 --> 00:17:25,920 healthy can just feel so overwhelming to pet parents, to 295 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:31,480 even pet professionals. I feel like even somebody like 296 00:17:31,480 --> 00:17:34,240 you who you know, you're professionally trained as a 297 00:17:34,240 --> 00:17:38,240 veterinarian, like, do you have moments of overwhelm still, 298 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:40,880 especially when you dig into, like, as much research as you've 299 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:44,000 been digging into, do you still have those moments of overwhelm? 300 00:17:45,120 --> 00:17:47,800 Yeah, yeah. Because it feels like there's so 301 00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:51,160 much more that I want to learn, and it just kind of flattens me 302 00:17:51,160 --> 00:17:54,000 out when I just think about it. Except it makes me tired, you 303 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:56,760 know, to think about it. But certainly, and, and, you 304 00:17:56,760 --> 00:17:59,960 know, in the end, you know, I'm not the youngest chick on the 305 00:17:59,960 --> 00:18:02,840 planet anymore, you know, So I've had time to sort of go 306 00:18:02,840 --> 00:18:06,360 through the process of coming out of that school thinking I 307 00:18:06,360 --> 00:18:11,000 have to know everything, behaving as if I need to be God 308 00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:14,920 because there is no God that's going to save all the animals. 309 00:18:15,120 --> 00:18:17,960 And if I don't do it and you know, there's, it's not going to 310 00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:20,320 happen type of thing, which, you know, it's more of a 311 00:18:20,320 --> 00:18:22,560 subconscious thing. It's not like, you know, I'm 312 00:18:22,560 --> 00:18:25,200 going in there. I don't have to save this 313 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:26,480 animal. I mean, certainly there's, 314 00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:29,640 there's some of that, but I've kind of come around, you know, 315 00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:33,600 in a circle where I'm, I'm more at peace with not knowing 316 00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:37,800 because I've realized that when I'm, when I'm in that space of 317 00:18:37,800 --> 00:18:40,560 not knowing, then usually I get some answers. 318 00:18:40,560 --> 00:18:43,680 Something will come up. And sometimes something comes up 319 00:18:43,680 --> 00:18:47,560 with an animal and I just sit with it for like a few days and 320 00:18:47,560 --> 00:18:50,040 then all of a sudden I'm like, yeah, that's what we need to do. 321 00:18:50,080 --> 00:18:54,880 So it's changed that way, but it's, it was, it was not easy 322 00:18:54,880 --> 00:18:56,840 to, to get here. You know, I had to do a lot of 323 00:18:56,840 --> 00:19:01,760 work on it because it requires a lot of trust and a lot of well 324 00:19:01,760 --> 00:19:05,240 and, and experience that things will turn out OK. 325 00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:08,080 Because if I look back, you know, even though things weren't 326 00:19:08,080 --> 00:19:12,640 always all nice and peachy and and rosy, in the end, everything 327 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:16,760 is seemed to always get better. You know, like it was kind of 328 00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:18,800 like a upward spiral. Basically. 329 00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:21,640 You revisit some of the same things, but it's it's always 330 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:25,280 getting a little bit better. And so that, you know, looking 331 00:19:25,280 --> 00:19:31,720 back kind of creates more trust that things are OK and we're 332 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:34,800 going to be OK. And, and certainly learning from 333 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:38,480 all the experiences and realizing that life is giving me 334 00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:41,120 things. It's not doing something to me. 335 00:19:41,160 --> 00:19:43,920 You know, it's not about punishment, you know, whatever 336 00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:47,800 the lessons are. It's about helping me to grow 337 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:51,120 more and have developed more wisdom, more trust, more faith, 338 00:19:51,120 --> 00:19:54,640 more, whatever it may be. So I hope that answered your 339 00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:56,440 question. Yeah, yeah. 340 00:19:56,760 --> 00:20:03,760 Well, and I think the undertone to all of that is this like grip 341 00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:07,760 that we have on trying to control everything that we have 342 00:20:07,760 --> 00:20:11,360 to be able to let that go. And like you said, trust that it 343 00:20:11,440 --> 00:20:14,760 it's all going to work out. That can be really, really hard. 344 00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:17,920 That's not easy because we're in the survival. 345 00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:19,840 I mean, we're survival beings, you know. 346 00:20:19,840 --> 00:20:22,440 I mean, the physical body is about surviving. 347 00:20:22,880 --> 00:20:25,720 I mean, that's the main function of the body, survival and 348 00:20:25,720 --> 00:20:28,960 procreation. And so, yeah, you kind of hit it 349 00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:31,920 on the head about the control, you know, and the more we try to 350 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:36,720 control things, the worse it gets, generally so. 351 00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:41,720 I know you have a program that pet parents can join and we can 352 00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:43,640 talk a little bit more about that later. 353 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:49,480 And I'm sure there's a pretty heavy focus on the gut and what 354 00:20:49,480 --> 00:20:54,440 you can do to support the gut in its natural processes of 355 00:20:54,440 --> 00:20:57,480 repairing and just overall health. 356 00:20:57,480 --> 00:21:00,680 What I actually want. Like, I would love for you to 357 00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:02,240 answer this question in two different ways. 358 00:21:02,240 --> 00:21:05,400 I would, I would love to hear what like if you could only tell 359 00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:10,640 pet parents one thing to know about keeping their pets gut 360 00:21:10,640 --> 00:21:15,120 health in in line, But then also what would you tell 361 00:21:15,120 --> 00:21:17,760 veterinarians? Like the tradition average 362 00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:21,560 veterinarian in America who is probably very overwhelmed 363 00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:25,320 working for a corporate corporation, like doing all the 364 00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:28,200 things that most I think veterinarians in this country 365 00:21:28,200 --> 00:21:30,800 now are doing. I can imagine they're probably 366 00:21:30,800 --> 00:21:33,080 two different things. I'm curious, what would you tell 367 00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:34,120 if have parents? What would you tell 368 00:21:34,120 --> 00:21:36,680 veterinarians? Actually, it would be the same, 369 00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:40,200 yeah. I would say, you know, what is 370 00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:45,920 nature, you know, what did nature give the animals to be 371 00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:49,280 able to survive? I'm sure with a veterinarian, I 372 00:21:49,280 --> 00:21:53,480 would probably go a little bit more into Physiology and ask 373 00:21:53,480 --> 00:21:55,640 them, you know, do you really think the Physiology of an 374 00:21:55,640 --> 00:22:00,360 animal has changed in the last 100 years when it took 3 billion 375 00:22:00,360 --> 00:22:04,920 years to get where we are now? I doubt it, you know, I mean, 376 00:22:04,920 --> 00:22:08,320 you'd have to show me that certainly the pathologies have 377 00:22:08,320 --> 00:22:10,600 changed because we've made a mess of things. 378 00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:14,440 But if you look at it, you know, I think an animal will still 379 00:22:14,440 --> 00:22:17,680 thrive much more on, on what nature provided if they're 380 00:22:17,680 --> 00:22:19,800 decently and if they're in decent shape. 381 00:22:19,800 --> 00:22:23,880 I mean, if you take a dog or a cat who has major inflammatory 382 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:27,680 bowel issues going on or whatever it may be. 383 00:22:27,680 --> 00:22:30,360 I mean, I see so many animals that are hypersensitive to 384 00:22:30,360 --> 00:22:32,200 everything. You know, you change, you give 385 00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:34,640 them one treat and they have diarrhea from that. 386 00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:37,200 And you know, I'm talking about, you know, this much. 387 00:22:37,200 --> 00:22:40,240 So I'm, I'm not talking about those animals, obviously. 388 00:22:40,840 --> 00:22:42,840 Yeah. Sometimes with those you can't 389 00:22:42,840 --> 00:22:46,160 just switch things around, but or just say we're gonna do what 390 00:22:46,160 --> 00:22:49,080 nature provided because they can't handle it anymore because 391 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:51,320 they're so sick. So we have to get them back to 392 00:22:51,320 --> 00:22:53,200 the place where they can handle nature. 393 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:57,520 So that's how far away we've gotten from from nature that we 394 00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:00,680 can't even handle nature anymore, you know, the way it 395 00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:04,840 was meant to be because we've gotten so, you know, so sick. 396 00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:07,920 Basically, I go with veterinarians. 397 00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:10,640 I would probably talk a little bit more, you know, in that 398 00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:15,200 direction and yeah, have them look at Physiology and, and 399 00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:18,720 maybe see if I could kind of wake up a little bit of the 400 00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:21,080 common sense. Because I have to be honest, I 401 00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:26,120 don't really understand how they how any a person can think that 402 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:31,040 some food out of a bag that's been highly processed can be 403 00:23:31,720 --> 00:23:35,880 something that would be healthy. Because I mean, if you were to 404 00:23:35,880 --> 00:23:40,160 tell somebody, a human, you should only eat like cereal out 405 00:23:40,160 --> 00:23:42,960 of a box for the rest of your life and never change. 406 00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:45,760 Always the same one, always from the same brand. 407 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:48,000 I'd say they would probably say I'm insane. 408 00:23:48,400 --> 00:23:49,880 I mean, I hope they would say that. 409 00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:52,320 Yeah, I would hope so too, because it. 410 00:23:52,560 --> 00:23:56,040 Is crazy there's a big question mark I don't know what's going 411 00:23:56,040 --> 00:24:00,280 on you know why why there's you know how they got bought like 412 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:04,360 that somehow, but. Yeah. 413 00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:07,160 And I may be wrong as well, you know. 414 00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:10,320 Who knows? Yeah. 415 00:24:10,320 --> 00:24:14,280 I just don't think I truly, I, I will say this as many times as I 416 00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:19,080 am afforded the opportunity to say this, I feel like even 417 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:24,120 though it feeds still the majority of animals and we have 418 00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:28,480 shelters and rescues and it's that it's in itself is 419 00:24:28,480 --> 00:24:30,000 overwhelming and sad to think about. 420 00:24:30,640 --> 00:24:33,280 I still at the end of the day feel like kibble is just a 421 00:24:33,280 --> 00:24:35,280 failed experiment. And like at some point we're 422 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:38,800 going to have to all collectively come to that 423 00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:43,600 realization that this kibble is the experiment and we are seeing 424 00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:45,840 that it has failed. Like just look at if we look at 425 00:24:45,840 --> 00:24:49,280 nothing else but cancer rates, it's it's failed. 426 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:53,920 Yeah, it's failed. We're humans, we love to 427 00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:56,120 experiment. I mean, that's how we learn, 428 00:24:56,120 --> 00:24:57,840 basically. I mean, you look at a kid, 429 00:24:57,920 --> 00:25:00,520 right? Or a dog, a puppy, they're gonna 430 00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:03,320 take everything into their mouth to kind of figure out what it 431 00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:07,000 is, and then they'll go, well, that's not good or whatever it 432 00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:09,840 may be. So we all learn through 433 00:25:09,840 --> 00:25:14,800 experimentation, and we as humans have experimented in a 434 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:17,880 lot of different directions with a lot of different things. 435 00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:21,560 And unfortunately, you know, there have been some good things 436 00:25:21,560 --> 00:25:23,400 that have happened. Obviously, you know, we have 437 00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:26,200 electricity, we have all kinds of things that we didn't have. 438 00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:29,480 We have running water, we have wheels, you know, we have, you 439 00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:33,520 know, tools and stuff like that. But with everything good that 440 00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:36,680 has come out of the experimentation, it's also 441 00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:39,040 brought in something not so good. 442 00:25:39,120 --> 00:25:41,480 You know, for example, electricity creates a lot of 443 00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:45,080 electromagnetic, magnetic radiation that affects the body 444 00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:50,560 with running water if it goes through pipes that have mercury 445 00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:52,680 or whatever. No lead, lead pipes. 446 00:25:52,680 --> 00:25:54,640 That didn't really work out very well. 447 00:25:55,120 --> 00:25:59,400 So a lot of the progress comes with some negative to it. 448 00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:01,680 You know, airplanes, we can fly airplanes, right? 449 00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:03,320 Which are still kind of surprised. 450 00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:06,720 I still don't know how that's possible because I tried to flap 451 00:26:06,720 --> 00:26:10,000 my wings and nothing happens. But then at the same time, they 452 00:26:10,000 --> 00:26:13,160 create a lot of pollution. So on this planet, 453 00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:16,040 unfortunately, everything positive always comes with a 454 00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:19,080 negative because we live in a world of duality. 455 00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:22,320 And so, you know, with all these experiments that we've done, you 456 00:26:22,320 --> 00:26:25,680 know, a lot of them have kind of gone in the direction that have 457 00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:28,040 created a little too much negativity. 458 00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:33,440 And then the compounding of all of those has then gotten us to 459 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:35,520 where we are now, because it's not just the food. 460 00:26:35,800 --> 00:26:38,920 Because way back when animals, you know, dogs were probably 461 00:26:39,040 --> 00:26:41,880 able to live on cable their whole life and nothing ever 462 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:45,360 happened and they were fine and they died at what, 1516 or 463 00:26:45,360 --> 00:26:48,800 something like that because they didn't have all the other 464 00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:51,520 compounded things on on top of everything. 465 00:26:51,520 --> 00:26:53,920 But now we've compounded everything so much. 466 00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:56,000 And again, I'm not saying we should feed kibble. 467 00:26:56,280 --> 00:26:59,240 I'm not saying that at all. But it's like when you're only 468 00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:03,160 dealing with one thing that's really impacting the body, then 469 00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:07,120 you're more likely to survive it than if if you have a compound 470 00:27:07,120 --> 00:27:10,800 of multiple things that are affecting it, including also the 471 00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:14,680 genetic and epigenetic changes that have happened from one 472 00:27:14,680 --> 00:27:17,520 generation to another. You know, thinking about the 473 00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:20,240 Pottinger cats, I don't know if you've ever talked about those 474 00:27:20,240 --> 00:27:26,120 in the in your podcast. No, I haven't, but it you know 475 00:27:26,120 --> 00:27:30,920 it, I have so many things that are that I want to ask you the 476 00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:37,120 well first before I go down my crazy thought process, tell me 477 00:27:37,120 --> 00:27:40,120 about the Pottinger cats. Yeah. 478 00:27:40,120 --> 00:27:45,560 So Pottinger was a Doctor Who lived kind of in the 1940s, and 479 00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:49,240 he had a sanatorium that he was where he was basically treating 480 00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:53,360 people with tuberculosis. And at the time, he was using 481 00:27:53,360 --> 00:27:59,080 adrenal extract from cats. And when people around the area 482 00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:01,960 heard about it, they started dumping cats at his doorstep. 483 00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:07,160 So he ended up with about 900 cats and obviously having 900 484 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:09,160 cats and needing to feed them, that was a little bit of a 485 00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:12,120 challenge. So some of these cats, you know, 486 00:28:12,120 --> 00:28:14,760 he had two groups. So some of these one group of 487 00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:18,800 cats, they were getting raw, raw foods, so leftovers from the 488 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,840 butcher, that sort of thing. And then and raw milk. 489 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,760 And then the other half, the other group, they got cooked 490 00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:28,480 things, cooked foods, cooked milk, etcetera. 491 00:28:28,480 --> 00:28:31,960 And obviously, you can see there's not a huge difference. 492 00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:35,400 You know, it's just from raw to cook now we are going from raw 493 00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:39,480 to like highly processed kibble. That is really totally 494 00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:42,600 inappropriate physiologically. Plus, he also lived in the 495 00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:44,920 1940s. So pollution was not really a 496 00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:48,040 thing back then because, you know, there were what, like very 497 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:51,040 few cars around. Well, maybe the coal industry, I 498 00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:53,320 don't know. But in any case, pollution 499 00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:56,280 probably was not not what it is. And quality of food was still 500 00:28:56,280 --> 00:28:59,600 better than what it is now. But in any case, with each 501 00:28:59,680 --> 00:29:02,800 generation, these cats that were on a cooked food diet, they were 502 00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:05,920 getting worse and worse. So they were eventually losing 503 00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:10,720 the Bony structure so that their skeletal structure of the face 504 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:13,480 became different. So if you have a cat that has a 505 00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:17,320 very narrow type of face, they probably don't have a ton of 506 00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:21,080 bone structure, not the same way as like a real tomcat with like 507 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,840 the round face, right? They were getting allergies. 508 00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:26,720 They were getting other kinds of chronic issues. 509 00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:31,440 And then by the 3rd generation, the third generation wasn't even 510 00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:34,320 able to reproduce anymore on the diet that they were on. 511 00:29:35,400 --> 00:29:38,960 Whereas the cats that were fed raw diet, they stayed healthy 512 00:29:38,960 --> 00:29:42,840 throughout the four generations. And then he tried to also see 513 00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:46,120 how long would it take to take these diseased cats? 514 00:29:46,800 --> 00:29:49,840 How many generations would it take to get them back to health? 515 00:29:50,160 --> 00:29:54,800 So he took the first generation raw, cooked food, cooked, fed 516 00:29:54,800 --> 00:29:58,360 animals and turned them back. We got them back on the raw food 517 00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:01,240 diet and it took about four generations just to get them 518 00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:05,800 back to, you know, closer to where they they were. 519 00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:07,600 They never were completely healthy. 520 00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:11,760 If you imagine with humans or animals now, you know, both. 521 00:30:11,760 --> 00:30:15,160 Obviously we start out with a generation that was really 522 00:30:15,160 --> 00:30:17,400 healthy. The next generation got more 523 00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:19,640 pollution, more things compounded. 524 00:30:19,640 --> 00:30:23,360 So they aren't as healthy. The next generation gets 525 00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,680 whatever this generation is passing along, plus whatever 526 00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:30,400 their generation is getting, which is more pollution, more 527 00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:33,560 deficiency, more of everything and so on. 528 00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:38,560 So that's why now you see more animals be sick, being sick from 529 00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:42,680 very, you know, basically as soon as they're born because 530 00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:46,520 they're getting whatever mom is passing along, you know, 531 00:30:46,520 --> 00:30:50,320 generation to generation because from a pollution standpoint, 532 00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:52,560 toxins are passed along for generations. 533 00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:56,000 Epigenetic changes are also passed on at least 4 534 00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:59,000 generations. But because each generation gets 535 00:30:59,000 --> 00:31:03,360 their own junk and, you know, exposure, it's like it's so 536 00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:06,800 compounded that it just grows exponentially. 537 00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:12,440 The the effect of the, you know, the yeah, the effect on the body 538 00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:14,920 basically is is gross, exponentially so. 539 00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:22,200 Yeah, we so BC Henshin and I talked about that without really 540 00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:25,200 knowing what we were talking about, but we when we it was 541 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:30,680 about two years ago now that a very popular pet food brand and 542 00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:33,200 a few ancillary brands started popping up as well. 543 00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:38,360 Seemed to be causing a lot of animals illness and 544 00:31:39,120 --> 00:31:42,880 unfortunately quite a few animals died like with new bags 545 00:31:42,880 --> 00:31:45,920 of food being opened and there was never any resolution to 546 00:31:45,920 --> 00:31:48,320 that. But that is what I had BC 547 00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:50,840 henshin on who has been in the pet industry, pet food industry 548 00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:53,640 for decades. And we were talking about like 549 00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:57,480 what, what could this in here? We were just talking about like 550 00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:02,120 his perspective and seeing how like there are cities and 551 00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:05,840 counties that there is no way they're going to let anything 552 00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:10,480 happen to a manufacturing plant, a pet food manufacturing plant 553 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:13,760 because it literally provides all of the tax revenue and you 554 00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:15,880 know, all the things. So it was all of the like behind 555 00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:18,840 the scenes type things. But that was ultimately what we 556 00:32:18,840 --> 00:32:23,240 got to was that, you know, if we're testing for the same 557 00:32:23,240 --> 00:32:28,200 things we've always been testing for in a pet food bag, that 558 00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:31,640 maybe it's not hitting any maximums, Maybe it's not hitting 559 00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:33,960 any like, Oh my gosh, this is horrible. 560 00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:37,040 This is going to kill an animal. But the fact that so many 561 00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:40,120 generations of animals have been sick and they're getting sicker 562 00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:47,360 every generation, that what was a maximum before, like maybe 563 00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:50,320 that maybe it's different now for these animals because they 564 00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:54,560 can't handle as much as four or five generations ago could 565 00:32:54,560 --> 00:32:58,080 handle. So I'm glad you actually have 566 00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:00,960 like the scientific information to put behind that. 567 00:33:00,960 --> 00:33:03,240 Theory. Yeah, I know, and that's true. 568 00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:06,560 And that kind of would sort of bring me back to that cell 569 00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:09,040 danger response that I mentioned earlier, right? 570 00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:12,200 Yeah. Because anytime the cells the 571 00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:17,200 body gets exposed to something that could potentially kill it, 572 00:33:17,520 --> 00:33:19,920 there's a response from the mitochondria. 573 00:33:20,400 --> 00:33:24,280 They switch to, you know, from energy producing to basically 574 00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:28,840 sending out signals of danger. And what's happening nowadays is 575 00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:32,440 that we are exposed to so many things that are basically 576 00:33:32,440 --> 00:33:35,960 triggering this danger response that then we sort of get stuck 577 00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:39,080 in it. Because, for example, when when 578 00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:42,560 you cut yourself, right, initially you have some 579 00:33:42,560 --> 00:33:45,520 inflammation, you have more immune cells that are coming to 580 00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:48,560 make sure it's cleaned up. And then you have some chemicals 581 00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:53,080 that are being released to help to breakdown and eliminate some 582 00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:56,080 of these damaged cells that are then gobbled up by the cleanup 583 00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:59,800 crew of the immune system. And then eventually it starts to 584 00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:02,920 regenerate new cells. And then eventually the cut is 585 00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:06,000 healed, right. So that's, that's how a normal 586 00:34:06,000 --> 00:34:07,880 healing response is supposed to go. 587 00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:11,400 But when we have all these chronic diseases, it's basically 588 00:34:12,159 --> 00:34:16,040 we have the initial whatever it is that caused it, so that 589 00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:19,800 started it, and then it just kind of stays in that loop. 590 00:34:19,800 --> 00:34:22,480 It never comes out of that loop. It never heals. 591 00:34:22,800 --> 00:34:25,199 So it gets stuck in the process of healing. 592 00:34:25,199 --> 00:34:28,600 And so with chronic diseases, we have this constant cell danger 593 00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:32,120 response that's that's present and healing doesn't go anywhere. 594 00:34:32,199 --> 00:34:36,080 It just kind of stays there. So if you then add more danger, 595 00:34:36,719 --> 00:34:40,120 you know, if you add 1 little added danger to it, it can just 596 00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:42,480 throw everything off. And that little danger could 597 00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:46,080 also be, for example, a supplement that should actually 598 00:34:46,080 --> 00:34:50,639 help, you know, And that's how then some animals will react to 599 00:34:50,639 --> 00:34:53,239 a little bit of enzymes in their food. 600 00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:56,840 I mean, that should not cause a reaction, right? 601 00:34:56,840 --> 00:35:01,840 Or switching food from rabbit from the same brand to Turkey 602 00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:04,640 should also not cause a reaction, right? 603 00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:07,880 But because there are, you know, all the cells are already in so 604 00:35:07,880 --> 00:35:12,840 much cell danger response and and, you know, kind of stuck in 605 00:35:12,840 --> 00:35:16,520 the cycle of of not healing, you know, things just end up getting 606 00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:18,680 worse. So when you're saying that, you 607 00:35:18,680 --> 00:35:21,200 know, it could be a multitude of things that could have happened 608 00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:24,680 with these bags. Yes, because you know, those 609 00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:27,240 animals who were probably in better shape, they probably had 610 00:35:27,240 --> 00:35:30,440 less of a reaction to it, whereas those that were already 611 00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:34,040 sick, they probably would have had more problems with it. 612 00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:38,280 Yeah. So I kind of want to switch 613 00:35:38,280 --> 00:35:42,240 gears a little bit, but kind of also back up because you brought 614 00:35:42,240 --> 00:35:46,400 up cats and eating raw food even versus cooked foods. 615 00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:50,360 One of the things that especially in the raw feeding 616 00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:55,440 community is still talked about a lot is feeding vegetation. 617 00:35:56,040 --> 00:36:01,320 And I know in well, I don't want to say I know, I believe a lot 618 00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:06,760 of the research that has been presented to us show that, you 619 00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:10,520 know, more diversity in the microbiome overall, generally 620 00:36:10,520 --> 00:36:13,440 speaking, is better is going to lead to a healthier microbiome. 621 00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:18,640 And there are some people that say that vegetation and feeding 622 00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:21,360 lots of different types of vegetation is the way to get 623 00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:23,800 there. There are some people that 624 00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:29,160 believe that it, you know, still minimal vegetation and more like 625 00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:33,000 fur and feathers and all of like there's, there's so many 626 00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:36,720 different like ideas of how we actually get the fiber into the 627 00:36:36,720 --> 00:36:39,760 diet of how we diversify the gut. 628 00:36:39,760 --> 00:36:43,760 And then I'm curious as to your thoughts on both cats and dogs, 629 00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:48,120 because cats being obligate carnivores, are we still 630 00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:52,320 concerned with diversity in the gut microbiome in the same way 631 00:36:52,320 --> 00:36:55,360 we are with dogs? Are we supposed to get there in 632 00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:57,360 the same way? How do you view that? 633 00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:01,880 Yeah. So every species on this planet 634 00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:06,800 thrives on diversity. Diversity is key for survival. 635 00:37:07,480 --> 00:37:10,440 So that goes for cats as well. Now they will have a little bit 636 00:37:10,440 --> 00:37:13,920 of a different microbiome than a dog, for example, or a human 637 00:37:13,920 --> 00:37:18,840 just because of what they eat. But they too need fiber in their 638 00:37:18,840 --> 00:37:22,560 in their diets because certain microbes need fiber in order to 639 00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,160 make the short chain fatty acids, for example, like 640 00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:29,760 butyrate, which help with the energy production of the cells 641 00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:32,200 and gut healing. It has all kinds of other 642 00:37:32,200 --> 00:37:34,560 functions as well. But we do need to feed the 643 00:37:34,560 --> 00:37:38,600 microbes and some microbes do get fed well with fiber. 644 00:37:38,600 --> 00:37:42,680 They need a little bit of fiber. So we all need a little bit of, 645 00:37:42,760 --> 00:37:47,160 of that, But a cat may need less than a dog, for example, because 646 00:37:47,320 --> 00:37:50,080 of how their GI tract is and such. 647 00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:52,880 But in the wild, they, they would chew on little things. 648 00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:54,680 They eat a little bit of grass, right? 649 00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:58,000 They, they will eat a full mouse because usually what they leave 650 00:37:58,000 --> 00:37:59,520 of a mouse is usually the kidney. 651 00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:02,920 So there's some something, but the guts usually get eaten. 652 00:38:02,920 --> 00:38:05,640 And what did the mouse eat? It ate fiber, right? 653 00:38:06,320 --> 00:38:10,440 And mice have a much bigger GI tract compared to body size 654 00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:13,960 compared to cats, for example, and dogs because they have a 655 00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:17,080 much shorter GI tract or a horse, you know, huge, 656 00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:19,960 obviously, or a cow. But because we'll all, all 657 00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:23,720 herbivores have a bigger GI tracts than carnivores. 658 00:38:23,760 --> 00:38:28,600 And so a mouse will have a bit of a bigger, you know, GI tract 659 00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:30,200 as well. And so there will be more 660 00:38:30,200 --> 00:38:33,880 material in it. There will be more bacteria in 661 00:38:33,880 --> 00:38:37,920 the gut of a mouse, for example. So they they would get that too 662 00:38:37,920 --> 00:38:39,680 in nature. So again, we need to go back to 663 00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:42,520 nature. So can we try to feed them as 664 00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:45,480 close as possible to what nature would provide? 665 00:38:45,520 --> 00:38:48,160 And I know there are some companies that sell ground up 666 00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:51,800 mice, although I did try to give that to my sister's cat once. 667 00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:53,320 And he's like, I'm not eating that. 668 00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:55,280 I mean, I have to. I had to agree. 669 00:38:55,280 --> 00:38:58,400 It looked a little disgusting. Maybe you crossed it too long or 670 00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:01,320 something, Who knows. But in any case, yeah, again, 671 00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:02,640 mimicking nature. Yeah. 672 00:39:03,960 --> 00:39:08,320 Yeah, I will. And that brings up another topic 673 00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:13,960 of probiotics, which are all the rage and everybody talks about 674 00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:16,560 them and everybody thinks that everybody and every dog and 675 00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:19,200 every cat and everybody should always be on probiotics. 676 00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:22,440 And I'm not saying that there isn't some truth in there, but I 677 00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:24,960 definitely have talked to different people again that have 678 00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:30,600 different opinions on the best way to get probiotics in an 679 00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:32,600 animal. I certainly talked to some 680 00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:37,240 people, people who believe that it should come as much as 681 00:39:37,240 --> 00:39:40,760 possible from food sources. And then of course there are 682 00:39:40,760 --> 00:39:42,920 people who love their supplements. 683 00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:47,560 And the only real negative I've heard, and I'm just curious your 684 00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:52,440 opinion on this about like supplementing probiotics that 685 00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:59,840 are not necessarily food based probiotics is that to have the 686 00:39:59,840 --> 00:40:03,200 shelf stability, you're not getting the really like fragile 687 00:40:04,720 --> 00:40:08,600 probiotic strains and and those are often what are actually 688 00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:11,520 missing and need to be supplemented. 689 00:40:11,680 --> 00:40:16,720 So they would be better found in whole food sources. 690 00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:21,480 Of course, there's also the. The idea that, you know, we need 691 00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:24,640 to be rotating, no matter what kind of probiotics we're giving, 692 00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:27,880 we need to rotate them because that's again, the whole point is 693 00:40:27,880 --> 00:40:30,080 diversity. So what are your thoughts on 694 00:40:30,080 --> 00:40:35,040 like food and getting probiotics from food sources versus 695 00:40:35,040 --> 00:40:37,720 supplementation? Yeah. 696 00:40:37,720 --> 00:40:43,080 So when we look at probiotics in the probiotic industry, that's a 697 00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:47,480 multi billion dollar industry. And when, when I looked, you 698 00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:50,640 know, when I did my Biome research, I looked at what, what 699 00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:55,240 are the trends, you know, and so the trend of probiotic sales is 700 00:40:55,240 --> 00:40:59,400 going up, but what's the trend of GI issues? 701 00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:04,280 It's also going up. So if the probiotics were to 702 00:41:04,280 --> 00:41:10,040 actually work and be this like magic bullet thing, then the GI 703 00:41:10,040 --> 00:41:11,720 diseases should have gone down, right? 704 00:41:11,720 --> 00:41:15,280 Or both of them should have gone down, but that's not the case, 705 00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:17,440 right? So I don't think that probiotics 706 00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:20,240 are, are the full answer. You know, they can help and in 707 00:41:20,240 --> 00:41:24,040 certain cases certainly. But you mentioned the viability 708 00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:27,720 of, of microbes. The thing is that the GI tract 709 00:41:27,720 --> 00:41:30,840 itself in the stomach, it still has a little bit of oxygen, 710 00:41:31,080 --> 00:41:34,600 still a bit of an oxygen in the small intestine, but less. 711 00:41:34,960 --> 00:41:38,920 And as it goes further back towards the anus, there's less 712 00:41:38,920 --> 00:41:41,120 and less oxygen in the in the gut. 713 00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:46,320 And so we also have bacteria that thrive in oxygen. 714 00:41:46,400 --> 00:41:50,200 They need oxygen to survive. And then we have bacteria who 715 00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:53,440 would die in oxygen rich environment. 716 00:41:53,440 --> 00:41:56,600 So they're the anaerobes, right? And then we have some that are 717 00:41:56,600 --> 00:42:00,280 in between that can survive in both oxygen rich and oxygen poor 718 00:42:00,280 --> 00:42:03,200 environment. So when we're trying to 719 00:42:03,200 --> 00:42:07,680 replenish the microbes in the oxygen poor areas in the GI 720 00:42:07,680 --> 00:42:11,600 tract, we need oxygen. You know, we don't need the 721 00:42:11,600 --> 00:42:13,880 oxygen loving at once. We need the other ones. 722 00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:17,120 And they're much harder to culture because you'll have to 723 00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:20,000 also culture them in an oxygen poor environment. 724 00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:24,280 And that is much more difficult than just the, the regular 725 00:42:24,280 --> 00:42:27,960 probiotics that you can find on the market that are, you know, 726 00:42:27,960 --> 00:42:31,160 easy to culture. So that's, that's a little bit 727 00:42:31,160 --> 00:42:35,080 of the problems. They there are now processes on 728 00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:39,360 projects going on to make some of the culture, some of these 729 00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:43,960 probiotics that would be found more in the large intestine, 730 00:42:43,960 --> 00:42:45,880 because that's where most of the microbes are. 731 00:42:45,880 --> 00:42:48,320 You know, we have a lot more microbes in the large intestine 732 00:42:48,320 --> 00:42:50,880 than we do in the small intestine or in the stomach. 733 00:42:51,160 --> 00:42:54,320 So stomach has the least amount, small intestine has a little bit 734 00:42:54,320 --> 00:42:56,840 more and then we have a lot in the large intestine. 735 00:42:56,840 --> 00:43:01,240 So there are definitely some project on the way to culture 736 00:43:01,240 --> 00:43:03,600 some of those, but they're not easy to, to culture. 737 00:43:03,600 --> 00:43:07,160 And so that's where the shelf stability, shelf life and all 738 00:43:07,160 --> 00:43:10,160 that would obviously then then play a role for sure. 739 00:43:10,200 --> 00:43:13,400 But you know, the, the problem with probiotics is that if 740 00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:16,080 you're lucky, there's maybe 20 different species in it. 741 00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:18,720 If you're lucky, most of the times it's maybe four or five, 742 00:43:18,720 --> 00:43:21,240 if that. And the gut microbiome has 743 00:43:21,240 --> 00:43:26,120 between 300 and 1000 different species, at least of microbes. 744 00:43:26,120 --> 00:43:30,120 So you're never going to be able to replenish that with like a 745 00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:33,760 small little bottle of, you know, 5 different strains of or 746 00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:36,240 species of microbes to put into the gut. 747 00:43:36,240 --> 00:43:39,280 It's not possible. Plus I obviously am a big fan of 748 00:43:39,280 --> 00:43:42,640 doing fecal transplants because with fecal transplants you get 749 00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:47,320 the micro, the bacteria, you get fungi, you get protozoa, you get 750 00:43:47,760 --> 00:43:51,000 the viruses because there are a lot of viruses in the gut as 751 00:43:51,000 --> 00:43:53,800 well that actually keep the bacteria in check. 752 00:43:53,800 --> 00:43:57,880 So there are viruses that are specific to to individual 753 00:43:57,880 --> 00:44:01,200 microbes. So for example, E coli has its 754 00:44:01,200 --> 00:44:04,840 own viruses that keep the E coli level in check. 755 00:44:04,920 --> 00:44:07,120 And these viruses in the gut that we call them 756 00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:10,480 bacteriophages. And so these bacteriophages are 757 00:44:10,480 --> 00:44:14,240 also in a fecal transplant. So they will also help to kind 758 00:44:14,240 --> 00:44:17,840 of balance out things. And then you also have all all 759 00:44:17,840 --> 00:44:20,720 of the good nutrients that these microbes just made. 760 00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:24,120 You also have that in the poop. So when you're doing a fecal 761 00:44:24,120 --> 00:44:27,280 transplant, not only are you putting all the microbes in it, 762 00:44:27,280 --> 00:44:29,720 you're also putting in all the bacteriophages. 763 00:44:29,720 --> 00:44:32,680 And then you're also putting in all of the good nutrients. 764 00:44:32,680 --> 00:44:35,640 You know, the post biotics, I call them the poop and the 765 00:44:35,640 --> 00:44:39,280 bacterial poop, you're putting that back in and that will then 766 00:44:39,600 --> 00:44:43,960 basically potentiate everything. So that's why I like fecal 767 00:44:43,960 --> 00:44:48,240 transplants much better because I'm not really big into wasting 768 00:44:48,560 --> 00:44:51,520 money on some something that may not work as well. 769 00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:54,880 I much have rather have a sledgehammer to get the nail in 770 00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:59,480 than little, I don't know, a spoon because it doesn't work. 771 00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:02,400 Yeah. Yeah, interesting. 772 00:45:02,400 --> 00:45:06,520 Well, and gosh, I feel like I could probably just ask you 773 00:45:06,520 --> 00:45:10,200 questions forever, but we are we're getting close to that hour 774 00:45:10,200 --> 00:45:15,080 mark and I want to give you the opportunity to talk about your 775 00:45:15,080 --> 00:45:18,480 program. And I think probably for me, the 776 00:45:18,480 --> 00:45:22,160 best way to learn about that is obviously every animal, in my 777 00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:24,840 opinion, every animal is going to require some sort of 778 00:45:24,840 --> 00:45:29,880 individualized approach because they're just so many factors 779 00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:32,720 that are different from animal to animal, even living in the 780 00:45:32,720 --> 00:45:37,680 same household. But do you have like a standard 781 00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:41,480 like protocol that you go through to start with to see 782 00:45:41,480 --> 00:45:46,000 where, where everybody's at? Like, OK, let's fix these, I 783 00:45:46,000 --> 00:45:49,280 don't know, 5 environmental things and then let's see where 784 00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:52,000 we're at. And like, how do you start out 785 00:45:52,320 --> 00:45:55,280 with a new client, you know, talking to a pet parent? 786 00:45:55,280 --> 00:45:57,920 Like how? What is that framework that you 787 00:45:57,920 --> 00:46:00,120 provide? Yeah. 788 00:46:00,120 --> 00:46:04,320 So I always start out with an assessment call, so people will 789 00:46:04,320 --> 00:46:07,960 fill out a lengthy questionnaire so that I have a bit of an 790 00:46:07,960 --> 00:46:10,240 understanding of what the challenges are and what they're 791 00:46:10,240 --> 00:46:13,520 facing and what's, you know, how is affecting them too, you know, 792 00:46:13,520 --> 00:46:19,240 though the owner themselves. And then based on that, you 793 00:46:19,240 --> 00:46:23,800 know, if they decide to sign up, I will have them send me all of 794 00:46:23,800 --> 00:46:26,480 the medical records and I will go through them. 795 00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:29,880 And then based on those medical records, I will then design a 796 00:46:29,880 --> 00:46:33,280 plan to get started. And usually that starts out with 797 00:46:33,320 --> 00:46:35,520 like very simple things. Let's add a little bit of 798 00:46:35,520 --> 00:46:37,480 enzymes. Let's talk a little bit about 799 00:46:37,480 --> 00:46:39,120 diet. You know, how can we start to 800 00:46:39,120 --> 00:46:42,200 make some small changes, you know, add a bit of apple cider 801 00:46:42,200 --> 00:46:45,880 vinegar to help digest things. And then I will give them the 802 00:46:45,880 --> 00:46:49,680 list of tests that I want them to do depending on whether they, 803 00:46:49,960 --> 00:46:53,120 you know, just had a what panel with their vet or whatever it 804 00:46:53,120 --> 00:46:55,600 may, you know, they may have already have done some of the 805 00:46:55,600 --> 00:46:58,320 things. So I will just add to it just to 806 00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:01,240 so that I can get the information that I need in order 807 00:47:01,240 --> 00:47:05,320 to really move forward with them and really create a real plan. 808 00:47:05,320 --> 00:47:08,960 So that's kind of the strategy appointment that we we have. 809 00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:11,280 And then they do the blood work or the lab work. 810 00:47:11,280 --> 00:47:14,280 It's not just blood, it's hair analysis, you know, to see what 811 00:47:14,280 --> 00:47:18,200 toxins are they exposed to, what nutrients are deficient and what 812 00:47:18,200 --> 00:47:22,160 is their overall tissue level health, You know, for example, 813 00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:25,000 if they're really deficient, then I know I have to go slowly 814 00:47:25,000 --> 00:47:28,160 with that animal and I can't already going to detox. 815 00:47:28,440 --> 00:47:31,120 So it will give me a bit of an idea of how quickly can I move 816 00:47:31,120 --> 00:47:33,120 forward. What are the next steps that we 817 00:47:33,120 --> 00:47:35,520 need to do for that, you know, take for that particular 818 00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:38,520 individual. And then in the meantime, people 819 00:47:38,520 --> 00:47:41,760 will go through the process of watching the modules that I 820 00:47:41,760 --> 00:47:44,520 have. So I go into like the foundation 821 00:47:44,520 --> 00:47:47,680 of knowledge because you know, as we mentioned earlier, there 822 00:47:47,680 --> 00:47:50,560 is a lot of information, people are overwhelmed with it. 823 00:47:50,560 --> 00:47:53,520 So I give them that foundation of knowledge that they really 824 00:47:53,520 --> 00:47:56,000 need to have. So bringing all of the pieces 825 00:47:56,000 --> 00:47:59,760 together so that it makes sense, because I find that most pet 826 00:47:59,760 --> 00:48:03,400 parents have a very disorganized knowledge base because they're 827 00:48:03,400 --> 00:48:05,200 just picking up pieces here and there. 828 00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:09,480 And so it's not organized and when it's disorganized, then the 829 00:48:09,600 --> 00:48:12,040 process of healing is disorganized too, because then 830 00:48:12,040 --> 00:48:15,600 they jump from one supplement to another trying and trying to see 831 00:48:15,600 --> 00:48:17,840 if that will help. But I help them with the 832 00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:19,480 modules. They get that organized 833 00:48:19,480 --> 00:48:22,320 foundation of knowledge that they can then build on. 834 00:48:22,360 --> 00:48:26,320 And that will get empower them in knowing how to you know what 835 00:48:26,360 --> 00:48:28,200 to how to look at things as well. 836 00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:31,400 Because it's healing also requires rethinking, you know, 837 00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:34,080 looking at things differently. And that's what my book is is 838 00:48:34,080 --> 00:48:37,920 about as well is like, you know, we need to move away from, OK, I 839 00:48:37,920 --> 00:48:39,920 have a symptom. What pill can I use? 840 00:48:39,920 --> 00:48:43,200 That was kind of the old module, but then it switched into this 841 00:48:43,480 --> 00:48:47,760 what I call fullistic medicine, where instead of the pill, we 842 00:48:47,760 --> 00:48:50,120 are now looking at herbs and supplements and things like 843 00:48:50,120 --> 00:48:51,960 that. You know, so I have a symptom. 844 00:48:51,960 --> 00:48:54,760 What supplement can I use? You know, for example, my dog 845 00:48:54,760 --> 00:48:58,920 can't jump on the couch. What's what fish oil can I give? 846 00:48:59,360 --> 00:49:03,200 I'm like, well, yesterday was your dog still able to jump on 847 00:49:03,200 --> 00:49:04,960 the couch? Yes. 848 00:49:05,000 --> 00:49:07,680 OK, so it's not a deficiency of fish oil, right? 849 00:49:07,680 --> 00:49:10,720 So let's just do some Cairo and look and see what's going on. 850 00:49:10,720 --> 00:49:12,080 You know, if there's some pain somewhere. 851 00:49:12,160 --> 00:49:15,040 So in any case, I I teach, you know, the whole process is 852 00:49:15,040 --> 00:49:19,280 really to also teach people to think differently and, and ask 853 00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:21,800 critical questions that we ask with everything else. 854 00:49:21,800 --> 00:49:24,280 Because, you know, if the car engine light goes on, right, we 855 00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:25,920 don't just put a piece of duct tape on it. 856 00:49:25,960 --> 00:49:29,960 We ask, OK, what is it, you know, have it diagnosed by, by 857 00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:31,960 some mechanic. And so we need to kind of think 858 00:49:31,960 --> 00:49:35,120 that way again with the animals and, and their health as well. 859 00:49:35,680 --> 00:49:38,560 So anyway, so they get that foundation of knowledge, they 860 00:49:38,560 --> 00:49:42,440 get like some rethinking done. And then at the same time, then 861 00:49:42,440 --> 00:49:45,840 I will also guide them through the process because I will lay 862 00:49:45,840 --> 00:49:49,400 out a plan for each animal on how to move forward. 863 00:49:49,680 --> 00:49:52,360 And then we move forward on that plan during the six months. 864 00:49:52,360 --> 00:49:55,760 So every week we have live sessions where they give me 865 00:49:55,760 --> 00:49:58,440 updates, you know, they let me know what's happening, they ask 866 00:49:58,440 --> 00:50:01,880 questions, whatever's on their mind, and I will give them the 867 00:50:01,880 --> 00:50:04,440 next steps to move forward. So that way they are really 868 00:50:04,440 --> 00:50:08,600 being coached week after week after week through this protocol 869 00:50:08,880 --> 00:50:11,800 that I set up. And as a result, you know, not 870 00:50:11,800 --> 00:50:15,120 only will the animals improve, but they will also have much 871 00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:20,520 more knowledge because they see how I think about things, how I 872 00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:24,280 go about things. And that will then help to kind 873 00:50:24,280 --> 00:50:27,280 of move along and then also help them with any other animals they 874 00:50:27,280 --> 00:50:29,080 may have and, or for their own bodies. 875 00:50:29,240 --> 00:50:32,240 A lot of people tell me I'm doing the same thing for me now. 876 00:50:34,920 --> 00:50:38,920 Yes, my gosh, yes, we need it just as much. 877 00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:43,760 And everything that I learned is from my own journey. 878 00:50:43,760 --> 00:50:48,240 I mean, I had a lot of chronic health issues from a relatively 879 00:50:48,240 --> 00:50:52,760 early age and it was a real pain to get through it. 880 00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:56,200 And because I had no strategy, I was just kind of winging it. 881 00:50:56,200 --> 00:50:58,560 You know, I tried a little bit of this, a little bit of that. 882 00:50:58,640 --> 00:51:01,040 I mean, I give gave everything a really good try. 883 00:51:01,040 --> 00:51:04,800 So it's not that I gave up like 2-2 days in or something like 884 00:51:04,800 --> 00:51:06,600 that. But nothing really worked until 885 00:51:06,600 --> 00:51:09,080 I figured out what it really takes, you know, what the 886 00:51:09,080 --> 00:51:12,040 strategy needs to be and that you have to really put all the 887 00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:15,880 pieces together to to get there. And for each animal, these 888 00:51:15,880 --> 00:51:19,160 pieces look, I mean, they're the same, but they will look a 889 00:51:19,160 --> 00:51:22,120 little bit different in the sense of when are we using what, 890 00:51:22,160 --> 00:51:25,720 you know, for example, for a really old dog that's, that's 891 00:51:25,720 --> 00:51:28,920 already sick, I'm not going to do a bunch of detox, you know, 892 00:51:28,920 --> 00:51:32,960 I'm going to build the body up, you know, decrease a little bit 893 00:51:32,960 --> 00:51:34,920 of the inflammation and build the body up. 894 00:51:34,920 --> 00:51:38,480 And then if we ever get to detox, sure, that'd be great. 895 00:51:38,520 --> 00:51:41,400 I mean, I mean, as the body gets healthier, it will start to 896 00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:44,640 detox a little bit on its own, but I will not be pushing it so. 897 00:51:46,280 --> 00:51:50,680 Yeah, Well, I love all of that. That sounds absolutely amazing. 898 00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:55,080 And I definitely think that it's a, it's a great, it sounds like 899 00:51:55,080 --> 00:51:59,280 a really incredible program for pet parents to go through to be 900 00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:03,720 able to, I mean, even even if you're just starting out, I 901 00:52:03,720 --> 00:52:06,080 can't tell you how many people reach out to me. 902 00:52:06,440 --> 00:52:10,280 I talk to them, I give them like, you know, I have a good 903 00:52:10,280 --> 00:52:13,480 conversation with them and learn a lot about their animal. 904 00:52:13,480 --> 00:52:17,240 And you know, say, you know, I think you would really benefit 905 00:52:17,240 --> 00:52:20,560 from this type of testing and blah, blah, blah, going through 906 00:52:20,560 --> 00:52:25,840 all of the things, usually some sort of HTMA like, and, and six 907 00:52:25,840 --> 00:52:28,520 months and, or a year later, I'll hear back from them and 908 00:52:28,520 --> 00:52:31,280 they're like, OK, I actually need to do something now because 909 00:52:31,280 --> 00:52:34,480 I just left the emergency vet. And I'm like, you know, it just, 910 00:52:34,520 --> 00:52:38,680 it gets, it gets worse when you don't, don't act on it. 911 00:52:38,720 --> 00:52:42,480 And like, I don't know, maybe, maybe people are getting there 912 00:52:42,480 --> 00:52:43,280 quick. I hopeful. 913 00:52:43,280 --> 00:52:45,560 I'm hopeful that people are getting there quicker. 914 00:52:45,640 --> 00:52:48,640 Yeah, well, because I mean, we don't like to see anybody in 915 00:52:48,640 --> 00:52:51,920 pain because it's not just that's in pain and suffering, 916 00:52:51,920 --> 00:52:55,160 it's the people too. I mean, I talked to one person. 917 00:52:55,160 --> 00:52:59,000 They, their dog was so itchy that the husband who was older 918 00:52:59,160 --> 00:53:02,280 already, like in his 70s or something like that, he had to 919 00:53:02,280 --> 00:53:06,440 actually sleep on his recliner with the dog on his lap to keep 920 00:53:06,440 --> 00:53:11,120 the dog from scratching herself bloody, you know, that deciding 921 00:53:11,120 --> 00:53:14,600 it was not worth their money. And so I'm like, OK, well, 922 00:53:14,600 --> 00:53:18,560 there's nothing I can do about that then, you know, So I think 923 00:53:18,560 --> 00:53:21,640 in the end, working with animals, being in the service 924 00:53:21,640 --> 00:53:25,520 business, we have to also learn to just take people where 925 00:53:25,520 --> 00:53:29,720 they're at and, and know that whatever they're experiencing is 926 00:53:29,720 --> 00:53:32,920 exactly what they need right then and there, whatever they 927 00:53:32,920 --> 00:53:35,800 decide. And that certainly is, is a 928 00:53:35,800 --> 00:53:38,440 challenging one too, because we want to change the world, right? 929 00:53:38,440 --> 00:53:41,040 But we can, it's kind of like with addicts, right? 930 00:53:41,040 --> 00:53:44,440 You can't make them change unless, until they kind of hit 931 00:53:44,480 --> 00:53:46,480 rock bottom. And I think, you know, for us 932 00:53:46,480 --> 00:53:49,840 humans, it may be that way in other ways or in some ways as 933 00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:53,200 well, because we tend to learn more from pain than we learn 934 00:53:53,200 --> 00:53:59,520 from from joy and love. Yeah, sadly, but that goes back 935 00:53:59,520 --> 00:54:02,640 to being creatures of survival, right? 936 00:54:02,920 --> 00:54:05,600 Like that's how we're programmed for a reason. 937 00:54:05,600 --> 00:54:09,040 But I think I could continue to ask you all the questions, but I 938 00:54:09,040 --> 00:54:13,920 think that's a good place to end with that thought and where I 939 00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:15,280 would just love for you to tell people. 940 00:54:15,280 --> 00:54:18,160 It'll be in the show notes so you can just click the link and 941 00:54:18,160 --> 00:54:21,440 go, but where can people find you and find the program? 942 00:54:22,200 --> 00:54:26,960 Yeah, they can just go to my website, itsodetsutordvm.com. 943 00:54:27,040 --> 00:54:30,640 They can just go there and find it there. 944 00:54:30,640 --> 00:54:33,480 I have my master class there or a link to it. 945 00:54:33,480 --> 00:54:35,600 So if you go there, then you can from there. 946 00:54:36,160 --> 00:54:38,960 You can then schedule the assessment call and then we can 947 00:54:39,440 --> 00:54:40,520 kind of discuss. Awesome. 948 00:54:41,160 --> 00:54:44,160 Well, thank you so much for being here and sharing all of 949 00:54:44,160 --> 00:54:46,560 your knowledge. I know, I don't know, I can't 950 00:54:46,560 --> 00:54:50,520 even fathom the amount of time you have put into researching 951 00:54:50,520 --> 00:54:55,200 the microbiome, but I know we all appreciate it because you 952 00:54:55,200 --> 00:54:57,840 are the kind of person that is going to hand this knowledge out 953 00:54:57,840 --> 00:55:00,040 into the world so that we can all benefit from it. 954 00:55:00,040 --> 00:55:03,400 So thank you for that. And guys, thank you for 955 00:55:03,400 --> 00:55:08,440 listening to today's episode. Please make sure to whatever app 956 00:55:08,440 --> 00:55:12,040 you're on listening to this, rate the show and share it with 957 00:55:12,040 --> 00:55:14,680 others. That is the best way to help us 958 00:55:14,680 --> 00:55:17,440 continue to put the show out for you. 959 00:55:17,440 --> 00:55:20,640 And with that, please give your pets some extra left for me and 960 00:55:20,640 --> 00:55:23,840 from Doctor Souter this week and I will talk to you next week. 961 00:55:24,600 --> 00:55:25,720 Yeah. Thanks everyone. 962 00:55:25,720 --> 00:55:27,120 And thanks for having me, Jessica. 963 00:55:27,120 --> 00:55:29,480 It was fun. Thank you, Doctor Sader.