1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:04,120 Welcome back, pet parent. I have a guest today that has 2 00:00:04,120 --> 00:00:07,440 been on my list to bring to you for so very long. 3 00:00:07,720 --> 00:00:11,440 And I finally got to meet her in person and asked her to come on 4 00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:14,120 the podcast. And I am so excited that she 5 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:17,440 said yes because she does so many different things. 6 00:00:17,440 --> 00:00:20,160 And I'm going to do my best to touch on everything so that you 7 00:00:20,160 --> 00:00:23,560 get as much information as possible from her. 8 00:00:23,560 --> 00:00:26,880 But I, I'm just so excited. So I can't wait anymore. 9 00:00:26,880 --> 00:00:28,880 Chelsea, Kent, thank you so much for being here. 10 00:00:29,760 --> 00:00:34,240 Yeah, thanks for having me. So you do so many things. 11 00:00:34,960 --> 00:00:38,560 You have a store, you have solutions, pet products, you 12 00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:41,400 have Parsley pet. What I know you have like your 13 00:00:41,400 --> 00:00:43,720 own apothecary, what you do so much what? 14 00:00:43,720 --> 00:00:47,720 Tell me a little bit about what you do and how you got involved 15 00:00:47,720 --> 00:00:53,040 in the pet industry. The way that I got involved in 16 00:00:53,040 --> 00:00:56,360 the pet industry was kind of a combination of things. 17 00:00:56,360 --> 00:01:02,360 I was actually doing acting and modeling of all things, and then 18 00:01:02,360 --> 00:01:05,280 moved back to my home state of Colorado. 19 00:01:05,319 --> 00:01:09,080 And my sister was moving out of the state when I was moving into 20 00:01:09,080 --> 00:01:13,160 the state and I just took over the job that she had, which was 21 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:16,840 in a pet supply store. And it happened to coincide with 22 00:01:16,840 --> 00:01:20,920 me dealing with some of my own health problems that I was not 23 00:01:20,920 --> 00:01:23,880 getting any support really from the doctors. 24 00:01:24,160 --> 00:01:28,000 Like their answers to everything were things that I was like, you 25 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:30,280 get paid to give people these answers. 26 00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:33,880 This is ridiculous. So I just realized that I had to 27 00:01:33,880 --> 00:01:37,080 be my own advocate. And working in a pet supply 28 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:41,760 store at the same time as that occurring made it so that every 29 00:01:41,760 --> 00:01:45,600 person that was coming in was asking questions where I was 30 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:47,720 like, I don't know, let me go research it. 31 00:01:48,000 --> 00:01:51,120 And I was already on this research mission to help myself. 32 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:56,640 So I just ended up spending all of my time doing research for 33 00:01:56,640 --> 00:02:00,120 myself as well As for all of the different people that were 34 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:03,760 asking questions. And just collectively over the 35 00:02:03,760 --> 00:02:07,400 years, you managed to gain a lot of knowledge. 36 00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:14,480 I decided, you know, a few years in, like you can have a job, but 37 00:02:14,480 --> 00:02:18,320 it's not the same as a career. So it was like, either I need to 38 00:02:18,640 --> 00:02:22,360 find something else to do or make this into a career. 39 00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:28,080 And Long story short, my mom and I partnered to create Heroes 40 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:31,040 Pets, which obviously then became a career. 41 00:02:31,440 --> 00:02:37,040 But then a number of years into that, I started feeling a little 42 00:02:37,040 --> 00:02:41,560 burned out and just like I was spending all of my time doing 43 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:44,040 the same thing over and over and over again. 44 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:49,040 So the only way for me to really stay in the industry was to 45 00:02:49,040 --> 00:02:52,240 start doing things out-of-the-box of retail. 46 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:55,640 So I started going to regulatory events. 47 00:02:55,640 --> 00:02:59,440 So we'll go into the AFCO meetings and getting involved in 48 00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:03,880 advocacy. In doing that, I managed to 49 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:07,720 partner up with some other pretty well known people in the 50 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:11,000 industry to do a variety of different projects. 51 00:03:11,840 --> 00:03:16,920 That was really educational and taught me a lot about laboratory 52 00:03:16,920 --> 00:03:21,720 analysis and the importance of data and data analysis. 53 00:03:22,120 --> 00:03:27,280 So I had helped the people that started Parsley Pet to kind of 54 00:03:27,280 --> 00:03:30,760 get started. And there was a point at which 55 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:34,640 the person that was running the company was busy doing some 56 00:03:34,640 --> 00:03:39,000 other things and wasn't putting too much effort into the 57 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:41,400 company. And I just was like, hey, if you 58 00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:44,960 ever want to sell, I would be interested, especially if you 59 00:03:44,960 --> 00:03:50,040 still have all of your data from like all of the previous tests. 60 00:03:50,360 --> 00:03:55,200 So Angela Robertson and I purchased Parsley Pet and then 61 00:03:55,680 --> 00:04:01,360 kind of got, I got checkmated into starting solutions about a 62 00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:03,680 month later. So that wasn't really 63 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:08,120 intentional, but it because of my role in advocacy, it was 64 00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:12,800 really important to me to not allow the people that were about 65 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:15,360 to get pushed out of the industry to really leave the 66 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:17,880 industry. And there wasn't a whole lot of 67 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:19,800 other option to keep them around. 68 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:23,120 So it was like, well, I guess this is the thing I'm doing now 69 00:04:23,120 --> 00:04:25,840 too. So it does seem like a lot of 70 00:04:25,840 --> 00:04:30,120 different things, but to me it's all one thing. 71 00:04:30,400 --> 00:04:32,800 It's just different avenues of the same thing. 72 00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:36,920 I can totally see that. And I got to meet you at the 73 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:40,320 last AFCO meeting, which happened to have been the first 74 00:04:40,400 --> 00:04:44,320 AFCO meeting I ever attended. And who the heck knows, might be 75 00:04:44,320 --> 00:04:47,960 the last one ever. We don't know, but we'll see. 76 00:04:48,160 --> 00:04:53,640 We'll see what happens there. But advocacy is something that I 77 00:04:53,640 --> 00:04:58,520 have recently, like I don't want to say discovered I've been an 78 00:04:58,520 --> 00:05:01,280 animal advocate. I've worked in rescue for many, 79 00:05:01,280 --> 00:05:03,400 many, many. Or I should say I did because at 80 00:05:03,400 --> 00:05:05,120 the moment I don't have the bandwidth. 81 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:09,600 But it's a different level of advocacy that I have found. 82 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:14,680 Like it really pulls at me and it's not easy at all. 83 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:18,880 And you can talk to that so much better than I can. 84 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:21,600 But I do want to talk about solutions and I do want to talk 85 00:05:21,600 --> 00:05:26,040 about parsley pet. But since since since we brought 86 00:05:26,040 --> 00:05:31,800 it up, can you just so people I, I have told people like my 87 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:35,520 experience at AFCO, but would you mind just summarizing your 88 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:40,280 experience at AFCO? You know, what I usually say 89 00:05:40,280 --> 00:05:44,240 about it is that it's like a really, really, really, really 90 00:05:44,240 --> 00:05:49,040 boring horror movie where it's like you're, you're about to 91 00:05:49,040 --> 00:05:51,360 fall asleep because it's so boring. 92 00:05:51,600 --> 00:05:54,960 And then something happens that you're just like, Oh my gosh, my 93 00:05:54,960 --> 00:05:57,760 brain just exploded. Are you kidding me that that 94 00:05:57,760 --> 00:06:00,960 just happened? So you have these moments of 95 00:06:00,960 --> 00:06:05,320 horror, which it seems like that's almost always what it is, 96 00:06:05,320 --> 00:06:08,880 is stuff that's going on in the industry behind the scenes, 97 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:15,160 perspectives on the way that certain things that like how 98 00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:19,760 they should be handled. And those things really don't 99 00:06:19,760 --> 00:06:24,600 align with consumer interest and they don't align with your 100 00:06:24,920 --> 00:06:29,280 experience of owning a pet. If you want your pet in your 101 00:06:29,280 --> 00:06:33,640 home, like if it's a backyard pet, maybe possibly you might be 102 00:06:33,640 --> 00:06:40,400 like, OK, but if you have a pet that is a companion, then pretty 103 00:06:40,400 --> 00:06:44,640 much everything that goes on in regulation opposes what 104 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:48,160 decisions you would make for yourself, for your pet. 105 00:06:48,240 --> 00:06:51,760 And so those are the kinds of horrors that you see is just 106 00:06:51,760 --> 00:06:56,600 these people acting like it's totally normal to make these 107 00:06:56,600 --> 00:07:00,960 decisions about things that are just absolutely mortifying. 108 00:07:00,960 --> 00:07:05,880 Like how do we use not food waste but industry waste like 109 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:11,720 chemical trash to feed animals? And how do we make it so that 110 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:16,280 it's nearly impossible to do alternative things like stuff 111 00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:18,840 like that? So you're like, bored, bored, 112 00:07:18,840 --> 00:07:21,440 bored, bored. Why would you do that? 113 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:23,120 Bored, bored, bored, bored, bored. 114 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:28,960 You know that that's such an interesting perspective that I 115 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:32,200 absolutely don't disagree with. But it was that was one of the 116 00:07:32,200 --> 00:07:38,080 takeaways I had was like, just how casually all of these people 117 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:43,560 were just like, and this is what we're going to do and let's go 118 00:07:43,560 --> 00:07:45,840 ahead and vote on it. And yeah, yeah, yeah. 119 00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:50,960 And I'm like, wait, what? How are we so, like gung ho and 120 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:56,120 casual and like, no big deal about what on, you know, in 121 00:07:56,120 --> 00:08:00,640 black and white in the, like, paperwork that they give you? 122 00:08:00,640 --> 00:08:03,080 It's like, did you read the same thing I read? 123 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:05,280 Because I would not be OK with that. 124 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:09,440 Yeah, Yeah. The one that you attended, there 125 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:13,080 was discussion about spent grains and they were pretty 126 00:08:13,080 --> 00:08:15,760 proud about their use of spent grains. 127 00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:20,520 And that's something where like after a bunch of chemicals and 128 00:08:20,520 --> 00:08:24,840 toxins have accumulated into this by product, then that goes 129 00:08:24,840 --> 00:08:28,640 to animal feed. And yeah, why, why are they 130 00:08:28,640 --> 00:08:32,360 like, yeah, we're going to use these woohoo like this? 131 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:36,000 That's not something that I would even dig out of my trash 132 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:39,799 can to give to my animal. Why are we excited about that? 133 00:08:39,799 --> 00:08:43,679 I mean, it really comes down to, you know, the their thinking is 134 00:08:43,679 --> 00:08:48,800 more or are we going to pay money to go and do something 135 00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:51,800 with this, like to figure out a way to get rid of it or are we 136 00:08:51,800 --> 00:08:55,560 going to receive money by selling it for this cause? 137 00:08:56,000 --> 00:08:59,640 And that, in my opinion, is just not a good reason to be making 138 00:08:59,640 --> 00:09:01,720 those choices. Yeah. 139 00:09:02,520 --> 00:09:10,000 So that I'll use that as a segue into doing things the right way 140 00:09:10,600 --> 00:09:17,480 with solutions, pet products. So I, there's probably some 141 00:09:17,480 --> 00:09:21,320 things that can and can't be talked about as far as like the 142 00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:27,440 trajectory of what, what got you there, But there are definitely 143 00:09:28,360 --> 00:09:31,760 products on the market. And this was actually something 144 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:34,760 Susan Thixton said to me one day. 145 00:09:34,760 --> 00:09:37,840 And I, I was like, like, I kind of knew that in the back of my 146 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:40,120 mind, but the way she said it, I was like, Oh my gosh, yes, 147 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:44,440 you're right. She said that even not, not all 148 00:09:44,440 --> 00:09:47,960 raw foods even are, are great for your pet. 149 00:09:47,960 --> 00:09:50,160 Like there are some raw food companies out there that are 150 00:09:50,160 --> 00:09:53,560 playing the AFCO game too. And I was like, I guess I knew 151 00:09:53,560 --> 00:09:55,560 that, but it, it never really hit me. 152 00:09:55,560 --> 00:09:58,360 So like one of the things that I know that you're doing with 153 00:09:58,360 --> 00:10:02,360 solutions is doing everything the way that you would want to 154 00:10:02,360 --> 00:10:06,720 feed your dog or cat. And that is vastly different 155 00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:10,520 from regulatory from industry. Can you tell me a little bit 156 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:13,440 about that and how you're creating the products at 157 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:15,400 solutions? Yeah. 158 00:10:15,480 --> 00:10:19,040 I mean, it's definitely a lot easier to do things the wrong 159 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:23,200 way. So by saying doing things the 160 00:10:23,200 --> 00:10:26,720 right way, it equates to saying doing things the hard way. 161 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:32,320 And it just requires a lot of creativity, a lot of networking 162 00:10:32,320 --> 00:10:36,360 with people that honestly are not really in the pet industry 163 00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:39,040 very much. So working directly with the 164 00:10:39,040 --> 00:10:43,400 farmers and getting to know them rather than just having brokers 165 00:10:43,400 --> 00:10:46,400 for things where you don't necessarily even know where it's 166 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:50,080 coming from or care. In a lot of cases, the companies 167 00:10:50,080 --> 00:10:53,200 are like, I just need this ingredient. 168 00:10:53,480 --> 00:10:55,040 I don't care where it comes from. 169 00:10:55,880 --> 00:11:02,400 I always joke that one way that I visualize kibble companies or 170 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:07,240 canned food companies actually creating an ingredient panel is 171 00:11:07,240 --> 00:11:12,000 there's like dice and that there's a set of say maybe 20 172 00:11:12,000 --> 00:11:16,280 dice and each one of them on the different sides, it has the 173 00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:22,080 ingredients that are available. So what junk is available from 174 00:11:22,080 --> 00:11:27,240 the bio biodiesel industry, in the alcohol production industry, 175 00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:31,240 in the food waste industry, and you know, on and on and on. 176 00:11:31,560 --> 00:11:35,800 And you just take the dice and you throw them on the table in 177 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:39,480 whatever order they land in. That's your ingredient panel. 178 00:11:39,480 --> 00:11:42,760 So they're all pretty much identical products, they're just 179 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:47,520 in a different order. So for a company like solutions, 180 00:11:47,560 --> 00:11:49,720 you know, we we don't use the dice. 181 00:11:49,960 --> 00:11:54,600 So we don't have a preset list of things that are available. 182 00:11:54,600 --> 00:11:58,200 We're not saying what are the easiest brokers to buy from. 183 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:02,480 We're saying, OK, we want this ingredient, we have to go find 184 00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:04,200 it. And then when we find it, we 185 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:07,360 have to audit those companies to determine whether or not we want 186 00:12:07,360 --> 00:12:09,760 to work with them. And if there's something that we 187 00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:13,920 don't like about their, they're processing or whatever thing 188 00:12:13,920 --> 00:12:17,480 they're doing, you know, the way they're raising the animals or 1 189 00:12:17,480 --> 00:12:20,360 little chemical that we just don't want in there. 190 00:12:20,360 --> 00:12:23,480 Then we have to go through the whole process of either 191 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:27,480 negotiating that they do things differently or determining that 192 00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:31,280 we have to start all over again and we have to go find somebody 193 00:12:31,280 --> 00:12:34,000 else that's more in alignment with what we're doing. 194 00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:36,800 And we have to do that with every single ingredient and not 195 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:40,720 just one time. Mean you have to understand, of 196 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:44,640 course, as we all know, but sometimes we don't want to admit 197 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:49,600 to ourselves that things change. So sometimes you have something 198 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:53,560 that's going really well and something changes and you have 199 00:12:53,560 --> 00:12:58,680 to either accept the change or modify what you're doing to stay 200 00:12:58,680 --> 00:13:02,440 in alignment with your values. So that does make it a lot 201 00:13:02,440 --> 00:13:05,840 harder, but that's what we choose to continue to do. 202 00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:07,840 One of the things that I've learned in the past couple of 203 00:13:07,840 --> 00:13:11,280 years that was surprising to me, though, I think a lot of things 204 00:13:11,280 --> 00:13:14,320 are like, I don't, I don't think anything surprises most of us 205 00:13:14,320 --> 00:13:15,760 anymore. We're just like, oh, yeah, 206 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:20,920 right. But one of the things like when 207 00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:26,120 I first realized that it isn't as simple as like taking an 208 00:13:27,040 --> 00:13:30,640 ingredient that you and I know that, you know, we can go to the 209 00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:33,200 grocery store and buy like a particular mushroom. 210 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:39,480 If it's not listed as an ingredient in the database for 211 00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:44,440 at at the time AFCO, you know, then you can't put it in your 212 00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:47,080 pet food. Like it's food, it's real food. 213 00:13:47,120 --> 00:13:51,560 It's not like, you know, you're making something in a lab and 214 00:13:51,560 --> 00:13:54,400 you have to apply for a patent for, you know, it's not it's 215 00:13:54,400 --> 00:13:58,480 like it's just a piece of food. But they're like, no, no, that 216 00:13:58,600 --> 00:13:59,880 can't. You can't put that in pet food 217 00:13:59,880 --> 00:14:02,160 because we don't know what it. Is that was crazy. 218 00:14:03,240 --> 00:14:07,800 There's no studies on its safety even though it's used in 59,000 219 00:14:07,800 --> 00:14:11,280 different supplements for pets and has been for the last 40 220 00:14:11,280 --> 00:14:13,480 years. So yeah you're right. 221 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:18,680 Like in the AFCO book you can legally use feces, litter, 222 00:14:18,680 --> 00:14:22,920 hydrolyzed hair, hydrolyzed feathers, sludge. 223 00:14:23,720 --> 00:14:27,760 Fish oil can be from oil extracted from fish, or it can 224 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:30,680 be from cannery waste. And there's no definition for 225 00:14:30,680 --> 00:14:34,480 cannery waste. Like, is it even a fish cannery? 226 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:37,920 Like it doesn't say. So you can use all of those 227 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:42,520 things, but you can't use catnip, You can't use milk 228 00:14:42,520 --> 00:14:45,400 Thistle. You can use spirulina only in 229 00:14:45,400 --> 00:14:47,920 small amounts and only for coloring. 230 00:14:48,040 --> 00:14:51,160 You are not allowed to use it for a nutritional value. 231 00:14:51,520 --> 00:14:54,320 So things like that. Yeah, it's, it's really 232 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:58,120 complicated. And in a lot of cases it's it's 233 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:02,520 disheartening and frustrating because you see these companies 234 00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:06,440 that are using things that are legally registered by the EPA as 235 00:15:06,440 --> 00:15:09,720 chemicals, and that's a primary ingredient often. 236 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:12,440 And even things like prescription foods, like it's 237 00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:16,720 not just food, they're giving it to the sickest pets. 238 00:15:16,760 --> 00:15:20,960 And that's totally acceptable. And then you have to jump 239 00:15:20,960 --> 00:15:24,800 through hoops for six months to be able to save fermented okra 240 00:15:25,160 --> 00:15:27,320 like we had not to write white papers. 241 00:15:27,320 --> 00:15:33,200 It's ridiculous. So that the idea of using 242 00:15:33,200 --> 00:15:35,640 fermented okra is is very different. 243 00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:40,400 And that kind of brings me to my next question about how you feel 244 00:15:40,400 --> 00:15:45,240 solutions pet products is is different not just in the pet 245 00:15:45,240 --> 00:15:48,840 food space, but even in that what I call the healthy pet food 246 00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:52,680 space. Well, there's a lot to say 247 00:15:52,680 --> 00:15:56,680 there. One of the basic fun facts about 248 00:15:56,680 --> 00:15:59,800 solutions is actually the way that the company started. 249 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:06,120 You know, it started with our entire base team going through a 250 00:16:06,280 --> 00:16:11,800 ridiculous legal situation and being prohibited from doing the 251 00:16:11,800 --> 00:16:15,280 things that they had created in the pet food industry. 252 00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:20,160 And so before Solutions was actually even an idea, I looked 253 00:16:20,160 --> 00:16:23,240 at the things that they were prohibited from doing. 254 00:16:23,560 --> 00:16:26,840 And I thought, if you guys aren't allowed to do these 255 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:31,400 things, then what could you do? And I created a list of things 256 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:35,520 that literally don't exist in the market based off of that 257 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:37,880 list. It was like, OK, nobody has 258 00:16:38,280 --> 00:16:41,520 eggnog. We could easily make eggnog. 259 00:16:41,560 --> 00:16:48,560 Nobody has a Nepalese recipe of butter tea, so we could do that. 260 00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:52,920 So I created a list of about 30 different things, and I gave it 261 00:16:52,920 --> 00:16:55,600 to that group of people and I said, OK, here are all the 262 00:16:55,600 --> 00:16:58,960 things you guys could make based on the restrictions that you 263 00:16:58,960 --> 00:17:01,760 have. And in response, they were like, 264 00:17:01,880 --> 00:17:03,960 no, we're lightning bolts. You do it. 265 00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:07,640 And I was like, I don't want to do it. 266 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:13,920 So realistically, the foundation of the company revolved around 267 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:17,720 creating things that didn't really exist in the industry. 268 00:17:18,119 --> 00:17:23,160 So then taking it a step beyond that, you know, there's, there 269 00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:28,280 are a lot of things that we, we assumed to be true, we believe 270 00:17:28,280 --> 00:17:31,840 to be true about health in humans and in pets. 271 00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:35,640 There are things that seem logical that they would be true, 272 00:17:35,920 --> 00:17:38,480 but we don't have evidence of those things. 273 00:17:38,480 --> 00:17:42,200 And that's, you know, side note, that's actually why I wanted 274 00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:48,240 parsley pet was because I wanted to see the direct impact of food 275 00:17:48,320 --> 00:17:52,320 and the influence of different types of food on the body 276 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:55,480 itself. So testing a body tissue is the 277 00:17:55,480 --> 00:17:58,360 only way to do that. So that kind of information is 278 00:17:58,360 --> 00:18:01,440 not readily available. It's really difficult to find. 279 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:03,200 It can be difficult to interpret. 280 00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:05,200 It takes a massive amount of research. 281 00:18:05,480 --> 00:18:10,880 But being able to have that kind of data and the science that we 282 00:18:11,320 --> 00:18:14,640 spend a lot of time procuring and reading through and 283 00:18:14,640 --> 00:18:18,120 assessing, you know, those kinds of things are really how we 284 00:18:18,120 --> 00:18:21,400 determine the recommendations that we make. 285 00:18:21,400 --> 00:18:24,520 You know, we're looking deep down at like what's the 286 00:18:24,520 --> 00:18:28,680 metabolic data that's available? What what is actually true 287 00:18:29,080 --> 00:18:34,120 versus what is marketed is true that maybe isn't. 288 00:18:34,120 --> 00:18:38,480 And that is our focus is what's the reality, not the assumption. 289 00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:40,480 Do you want to talk more about Parsley Pet? 290 00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:44,240 But really quickly, before we do, I had one more question 291 00:18:44,240 --> 00:18:50,320 about solutions. This is always a hot topic on 292 00:18:51,080 --> 00:18:52,640 this podcast. I am. 293 00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:58,480 I mean, I kind of understand why because for me, I can see both 294 00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:03,360 sides. But I know that you, you 295 00:19:03,360 --> 00:19:12,280 advocate for a very minimally processed food and that you do 296 00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:17,360 fermentation and recently came out with an article that, you 297 00:19:17,360 --> 00:19:21,080 know, This is why we don't do HPP and why we'll never do HPP. 298 00:19:21,360 --> 00:19:24,520 And I, I know you've done a ton more research on it than I do. 299 00:19:24,520 --> 00:19:27,120 I saw it through the presentation at AFCO a couple of 300 00:19:27,120 --> 00:19:30,640 months ago. And there were a lot like just 301 00:19:30,640 --> 00:19:33,800 for me, just for somebody who I don't make a pet food. 302 00:19:34,160 --> 00:19:36,280 I feed pet food, but I don't make a pet food. 303 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:40,520 I do try to educate myself as much as I can and then try to 304 00:19:40,520 --> 00:19:43,880 educate others. I can see where like I can see 305 00:19:43,880 --> 00:19:47,480 both sides and my, my brain was like going crazy at all the 306 00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:51,480 things that this, you know, the the presenter was telling us. 307 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:54,200 And I'm like, I didn't know that. 308 00:19:54,320 --> 00:19:55,920 I didn't know that. Oh my gosh. 309 00:19:57,880 --> 00:20:03,480 But I can also see where using a process like HPP, though we 310 00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:05,760 might not want to use it for you, you might not want to use 311 00:20:05,760 --> 00:20:10,200 it for solutions where another pet food it can it, it can be 312 00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:13,600 kind of leveraged to bring people into the market away from 313 00:20:13,600 --> 00:20:16,080 other foods. But I want you to talk about it. 314 00:20:16,120 --> 00:20:18,960 I've talked about it enough, but people love to hear about it. 315 00:20:19,800 --> 00:20:22,080 Sure. Well, I'll start by saying 316 00:20:22,080 --> 00:20:26,080 something that I say very often, which is the only sweeping 317 00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:30,600 statement that is always true is that no sweeping statement is 318 00:20:30,600 --> 00:20:34,920 ever always true. So of course what that means is 319 00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:38,840 there are there are times, there are incidents where something 320 00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:42,520 like HPP could potentially be valuable and then there are 321 00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:46,080 times that it isn't. So what are those times, right. 322 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,080 Let's kind of try to find what's the dividing line there. 323 00:20:49,440 --> 00:20:52,880 And a lot of this is actually what was presented at that 324 00:20:52,880 --> 00:20:56,760 specific meeting as well as a one that followed up shortly 325 00:20:56,760 --> 00:21:01,280 after that, the IAFP meeting in these points and more are 326 00:21:01,280 --> 00:21:04,520 referenced in that document on the Solutions blog page. 327 00:21:04,880 --> 00:21:08,880 So HPP does not work on high fat foods. 328 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:12,760 So that's one reason why even if Solutions was like, yeah, let's 329 00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:16,480 do HPP, it would not be valuable for us to do it. 330 00:21:16,760 --> 00:21:20,560 If you're feeding any brand of food that's high fat, it's 331 00:21:20,560 --> 00:21:23,320 ineffective. The fat actually protects the 332 00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:28,800 microbes and prevents them from being killed or neutralized in 333 00:21:28,800 --> 00:21:31,440 the process of doing high pressure pasteurization. 334 00:21:32,400 --> 00:21:35,480 It also doesn't work on low moisture foods. 335 00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:40,160 So if you have a freeze dried, dehydrated, air dried, any of 336 00:21:40,160 --> 00:21:43,160 those things, it wouldn't work as the last step. 337 00:21:43,520 --> 00:21:47,400 They could do HPP on it while it's still wet, but this brings 338 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:49,680 it to another time in which it doesn't work. 339 00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:53,560 It's not very effective if there's a long transit time, 340 00:21:53,560 --> 00:22:00,080 more than basically like a day before HPP or after HPP, because 341 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:05,240 even though you have done, you've damaged the pathogens, 342 00:22:05,560 --> 00:22:10,560 they actually can recover. So if you have a longer transit 343 00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:14,600 time before or afterwards, then even if it was effective 344 00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:17,520 immediately after, that's not when you're feeding it. 345 00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:21,000 You're not like, I just pulled this out of the machine and now 346 00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:23,800 I'm giving it to my pet. Those pathogens could have 347 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:28,920 recovered and especially like even if those pathogens didn't 348 00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:34,840 recover, if you didn't HPP in the end package, the final one 349 00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:38,720 that goes to the consumer, you can re contaminate the product 350 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:44,240 after you open it. So to do HPP, most companies 351 00:22:44,240 --> 00:22:49,600 will do big logs of their meat product and then after the HPP, 352 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:53,640 they open that package up, which again can open it up to 353 00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:57,440 contamination and then they mix it and then they form it into 354 00:22:57,440 --> 00:22:59,720 whatever shape they're going to be selling it in. 355 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:03,800 And then if you're drying it, that's a whole nother set of 356 00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:07,680 time and potential contamination for that product. 357 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:12,160 So it's really not valuable to do it even if it were a higher 358 00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:16,360 moisture product at the time that the HPP was done and even 359 00:23:16,360 --> 00:23:19,320 if it were a lower fat product where it would be effective. 360 00:23:19,760 --> 00:23:25,440 So when would HPP be valuable? If you have a product that is 361 00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:29,000 already contaminated, it's not a really high quality sourcing, 362 00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:33,080 then it is going to reduce the pathogen load in there. 363 00:23:33,360 --> 00:23:37,840 But as they said in that meeting, it is absolutely not a 364 00:23:37,840 --> 00:23:41,520 sterilization method. It is pasteurization, not 365 00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:44,880 sterilization. So it's not 100% effective. 366 00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:52,120 My biggest beef with HPP is actually not even necessarily 367 00:23:52,120 --> 00:23:55,520 all of that, because I don't think that pathogens are even 368 00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:58,960 always bad. Our bodies, bodies in general, 369 00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:04,640 have worked symbiotically with good bacteria and bad bacteria 370 00:24:05,120 --> 00:24:08,200 through all of the time that life has existed. 371 00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:12,800 So there's actually more and more research proving benefit to 372 00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:16,360 having certain pathogens in the body, so we don't have to be 373 00:24:16,360 --> 00:24:20,680 scared of them all the time. Even FDA referenced scientific 374 00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:25,080 studies show that you can intentionally feed dogs 375 00:24:25,120 --> 00:24:28,840 salmonella, pathogenic salmonella, and it's almost 376 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:32,640 guaranteed that they will not get sick if you meant to give it 377 00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:36,520 to them in higher doses. So I'm not really against the 378 00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:39,680 pathogen so much. What I worry about is the 379 00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:44,000 plastic. It's not possible to do HPP in 380 00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:47,040 really any kind of container besides plastic. 381 00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:51,400 It has to be high flex plastic, which means it has higher levels 382 00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:58,000 of in stable for simplifying terms, plastic particles. 383 00:24:58,120 --> 00:25:01,560 So it's very easy to destroy them. 384 00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:05,520 So it's, it's kind of the equivalent of if you leave your 385 00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:10,880 water bottle, your plastic water bottle in your car and it's 120° 386 00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:13,800 out and it's sitting in your car, who knows how hot it's 387 00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:16,080 getting. Everybody knows you're not 388 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:18,040 supposed to drink out of that water bottle. 389 00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:23,000 But it's even more than that. Like the pressure that no life 390 00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:29,080 can live above IS300 MPA and they do it at 600 MPA. 391 00:25:29,440 --> 00:25:32,640 So it's a massive amount of pressure that's placed on this 392 00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:36,520 highly unstable plastic and that does get pushed into the food 393 00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:39,560 matrix. So because we know there's 394 00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:44,760 massive amounts of data that really show the damage on the 395 00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:48,200 endocrine system and the hormone balance and we see it regularly 396 00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:52,960 with Parsley PET that I think regular use of something that we 397 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:56,040 know is contaminated with plastic particles is really the 398 00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:58,360 most concerning thing about it in my opinion. 399 00:25:58,400 --> 00:26:00,680 That is more and more concerning. 400 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:04,480 I know this is a little off topic, but we, I have been 401 00:26:04,720 --> 00:26:09,400 inundated with videos on Instagram and TikTok of all the 402 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:14,760 people who were recently at the congressional hearing on, you 403 00:26:14,760 --> 00:26:17,200 know, food safety in our country. 404 00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:22,520 And this is about, you know, human food and pet food in 405 00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:29,000 general is so much worse. But I mean, what our government 406 00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:38,280 allows, even in human food is just so it's almost like it's 407 00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:41,120 intentional. And I don't want to, I don't 408 00:26:41,120 --> 00:26:43,640 want to be the one saying that it's intentional, but I feel 409 00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:48,720 like it may be intentional. And then even with that 410 00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:54,000 intention that I believe is there, I the byproduct of that 411 00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:56,760 is what our pets get, which is even worse. 412 00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:01,920 So parsley pet, you, you brought that up again. 413 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:10,400 I am such a big fan and I'm not afraid to say that like there 414 00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:15,400 are so many different tests on the market for different things 415 00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:17,880 that we can do with our Pets at Home. 416 00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:23,080 Testing has become like a really like it's, it's, it's booming 417 00:27:23,080 --> 00:27:24,560 right now. There are more and more that are 418 00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:29,960 coming out and I like a handful of them for various reasons, but 419 00:27:29,960 --> 00:27:34,440 I recently started incorporating parsley pet test with my 420 00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:39,560 one-on-one clients and the ones that decide to do it because I, 421 00:27:39,720 --> 00:27:42,200 I try to work with people where they're at, you know, with what 422 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:47,960 they can afford to do. And you know, sometimes if they 423 00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:50,480 can't afford the testing, then we can, you know, I want to I 424 00:27:50,480 --> 00:27:53,080 want to put the money where it's going to benefit the pet most 425 00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:56,880 when they're a little strapped, especially in this economy, But 426 00:27:56,880 --> 00:27:59,880 still with the information you're getting, I feel like it's 427 00:27:59,880 --> 00:28:03,080 still a an incredible value. This is something you you're not 428 00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:04,440 going to get from your veterinarian. 429 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:08,280 Even they can run a ton of different tests at different 430 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:11,560 labs and different universities and you're still not going to 431 00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:14,080 get the information that you're going to get from Parsley Pet, 432 00:28:14,080 --> 00:28:17,880 especially with the kind of personal touches that you guys 433 00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:19,760 have on it. Can you tell me a little bit 434 00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:21,800 about it's a hair tissue mineral analysis? 435 00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:23,880 Can you tell me a little bit about that, how it works and the 436 00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:25,560 and the information that you're getting from it? 437 00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:30,280 So it's a hair test that's done at home. 438 00:28:30,280 --> 00:28:32,600 You don't have to receive a kit or anything. 439 00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:37,680 Once you pay for it, then you get instructions on how to cut 440 00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:42,000 the sample, how much you need, where to mail it, and then you 441 00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:46,480 get a link to an intake form. The intake form provides enough 442 00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:49,760 information to make it easier to personalize the results. 443 00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:53,880 So say for example, we get results back and it says that 444 00:28:53,880 --> 00:28:57,840 your pet is really high in zinc. Now that could be a number of 445 00:28:57,840 --> 00:29:00,640 different things, but if you put in your intake form that you're 446 00:29:00,640 --> 00:29:03,160 giving zinc, easy fix. Stop doing that. 447 00:29:03,520 --> 00:29:07,920 Right, So it's really just designed to try to cater more 448 00:29:08,200 --> 00:29:11,400 directly to what things you're doing and what you should 449 00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:14,080 consider or even what you should discuss with your vet. 450 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:17,840 So everything is really done digitally after you mailed the 451 00:29:17,840 --> 00:29:20,440 sample in. The information that you're 452 00:29:20,440 --> 00:29:26,520 getting is uptake of minerals, heavy metals and hormones over 453 00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:28,840 the course of time that it took to grow the sample. 454 00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:32,800 So that depends on the length of the sample that you send in. 455 00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:36,800 If it's, you know, an inch, inch and a half, then it's a few 456 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:39,680 months. If you were to send in like my 457 00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:42,600 hair, you can get several years worth. 458 00:29:42,800 --> 00:29:46,280 That's not really valuable because you are diluting the 459 00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:49,480 information. You would get an average of all 460 00:29:49,480 --> 00:29:54,240 of those years of information. So if you wanted and you had a 461 00:29:54,240 --> 00:29:57,520 long enough hair sample, and I've done this before, you could 462 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:00,640 send in the tip and then you could send in the side at the 463 00:30:00,640 --> 00:30:03,600 root separately so that you're able to compare. 464 00:30:03,800 --> 00:30:06,880 This was my health then and this is my health now. 465 00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:10,320 On that note, I'll clarify. We do humans, horses and 466 00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:15,640 canines. The one thing just going back to 467 00:30:15,640 --> 00:30:18,600 what you were saying about the value of it, one thing that I 468 00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:22,640 really appreciate about this type of testing is that if you 469 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:26,760 don't have a large budget, it can actually help you to save 470 00:30:26,760 --> 00:30:30,280 money. So it's it's $250 for dogs. 471 00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:35,720 Normally there's coupon codes somewhere out in the ether, but 472 00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:39,520 let's say that you have a pet where you're like OK I could 473 00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:48,520 potentially need to do a thyroid test for T4 reverse T3T3, TSH. 474 00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:52,920 I also need ACTH and cortisol for the adrenals. 475 00:30:52,920 --> 00:30:56,160 I need parathyroid hormone. I need vitamin D testing. 476 00:30:56,160 --> 00:31:00,160 I need B vitamin testing. I need a CBC, a CMP. 477 00:31:00,160 --> 00:31:05,360 Like the list can be so long of the information that you want to 478 00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:08,240 gather for your pet that it is not affordable. 479 00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:13,360 So when you take a test like parsley pet, it helps to refine 480 00:31:13,400 --> 00:31:17,680 and like direct what you need. So we can say there's no 481 00:31:17,680 --> 00:31:21,680 indications in this report that would say that you need to do a 482 00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:26,120 vitamin D test or there are indications in this report that 483 00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:29,360 show that you probably should be looking more closely at the 484 00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:35,760 thyroid or the adrenals or inflammation or cancer or like 485 00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:39,640 here's reasons why we believe that allergies are occurring in 486 00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:42,040 your pet. So it just really helps to like 487 00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:45,240 refine what other things that you should do. 488 00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:50,240 And in most cases, we will make recommendations about specific 489 00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:54,640 things that are beneficial in tandem, because usually HTMA is 490 00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:57,600 most valuable in tandem with other tests. 491 00:31:57,600 --> 00:32:02,480 So what you gain from that is you actually get to see where 492 00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:08,960 the error in metabolism lies. So for example, we find that not 493 00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:13,560 all but the majority of pets with blood anemia actually have 494 00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:18,560 very, very, very high tissue iron, not low. 495 00:32:19,200 --> 00:32:24,560 So it's not true anemia in the sense of a full iron deficiency. 496 00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:27,480 What's happening is that the body is using the iron 497 00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:30,240 incorrectly. It's not converting it from non 498 00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:34,160 hemi iron to hemi iron. So what you need to focus on is 499 00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:37,400 not necessarily iron supplementation because in the 500 00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:40,600 tissues it's too high. You need to focus on iron 501 00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:45,440 conversion, which is going to require methylation, B vitamins 502 00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:49,120 and vitamin C instead. So the way that you're addressed 503 00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:52,720 an issue can be different based off of those results as well and 504 00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:54,520 especially when you're seeing them in TAN. 505 00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:57,720 So, well, you've mentioned a couple of things already, but 506 00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:03,480 what are some of the cooler things are the more interesting 507 00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:06,680 things that you've noticed with all of the data that you now 508 00:33:06,680 --> 00:33:11,600 have through Parsley? Pet there's so many things I can 509 00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:15,720 stay on here for hours. So I would say calcium is 510 00:33:15,720 --> 00:33:17,680 probably one of the most interesting. 511 00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:25,760 Calcium is not that valuable to see in blood tests because it's 512 00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:30,080 very tightly regulated by the body and the body stores 1.6 513 00:33:30,080 --> 00:33:33,320 million times more calcium and tissue than blood. 514 00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:36,760 So you won't actually see imbalances in blood calcium 515 00:33:36,760 --> 00:33:38,840 until the body's in severe crisis. 516 00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:43,200 But calcium imbalances can actually be the cause of 517 00:33:43,920 --> 00:33:48,120 everything from like fatty lipomas to sebaceous cysts, 518 00:33:48,120 --> 00:33:54,800 tremors, seizures, allergies, you know, retention of other 519 00:33:54,800 --> 00:33:57,800 minerals. It can be indicative of heavy 520 00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:00,760 metal toxicity, vitamin D deficiency. 521 00:34:00,760 --> 00:34:04,480 All the hormones are dependent on proper calcium levels and 522 00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:08,280 vice versa. So I think being able to 523 00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:12,480 identify what's going on with calcium, if you got literally no 524 00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:17,280 other information off of those tests besides tissue calcium, it 525 00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:21,880 would still be worth $250 because of the degree of 526 00:34:21,880 --> 00:34:24,320 influence that calcium has on the body. 527 00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:30,679 I was really surprised to find out that low sodium can cause 528 00:34:30,840 --> 00:34:33,800 muscle wasting. You have to have enough salt for 529 00:34:33,800 --> 00:34:36,560 the body to properly utilize protein. 530 00:34:36,880 --> 00:34:40,840 So even with adequate protein intake, you still will have 531 00:34:40,840 --> 00:34:44,199 relative protein deficiency if sodium is deficient. 532 00:34:45,239 --> 00:34:49,800 The influence of the hormones I think is so understated. 533 00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:56,040 So even if let's say that you have adequate thyroid function 534 00:34:56,040 --> 00:35:00,360 and adequate adrenal function, so from a veterinary perspective 535 00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:03,200 and blood test, you're like they're in range, everything is 536 00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:05,680 good to go. That's not a contributing 537 00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:07,960 variable. We have found that that's 538 00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:11,720 absolutely inaccurate. And the reason is because the 539 00:35:11,720 --> 00:35:16,320 imbalance in the ratio between the two can still make the body 540 00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:20,320 respond as if there's a deficiency or toxicity of one of 541 00:35:20,320 --> 00:35:24,360 those hormones. So you can still, for example, 542 00:35:24,360 --> 00:35:28,600 manifest the symptoms of Addison's disease even if 543 00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:32,960 Addison's isn't present, but adrenal hormone uptake is very 544 00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:35,640 low and thyroid hormone uptake is high. 545 00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:40,160 So you can still resolve health problems associated with those 546 00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:43,880 things just by helping to support the hormone balance. 547 00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:48,640 And then I think the other thing that's most interesting to me is 548 00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:52,840 lithium. Lithium is really something that 549 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:58,120 we need to do more research on. So lithium is it impairs thyroid 550 00:35:58,120 --> 00:35:59,960 function in multiple different ways. 551 00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:02,760 We don't want high lithium in the body. 552 00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:07,560 And the sweeping statement has always been just avoid high 553 00:36:07,560 --> 00:36:09,800 lithium or supplement with thyroid. 554 00:36:10,120 --> 00:36:14,720 But what we've actually found is that pets that are not fixed 555 00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:17,960 naturally have higher lithium in their tissues. 556 00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:22,720 So why would that be when they actually have a better 557 00:36:22,720 --> 00:36:25,320 metabolism than the ones that are fixed? 558 00:36:25,600 --> 00:36:29,960 And what I think is true is that the sex hormones help to store 559 00:36:29,960 --> 00:36:33,800 lithium in the tissues as a protective mechanism for the 560 00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:36,960 thyroid. So I think that castration might 561 00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:41,160 actually be releasing lithium into the blood and impairing 562 00:36:41,160 --> 00:36:44,720 thyroid function. And I think that the way that 563 00:36:44,720 --> 00:36:49,600 the body stores lithium might have an enormous influence on 564 00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:52,880 metabolism in general. So I'm hoping somebody hears 565 00:36:52,880 --> 00:36:56,200 that someday and is like, I want to do a research study and then 566 00:36:56,200 --> 00:37:02,520 they come and get all my data. Yeah, well, I mean coming from 567 00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:08,920 the rescue world, 2020 years ago I started working in rescue IT. 568 00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:13,640 That was one of the harder things for me to I don't want to 569 00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:18,840 say it was hard for me to accept the information, but like, I 570 00:37:18,840 --> 00:37:24,400 didn't want to hear it to begin with because, you know, humans 571 00:37:24,680 --> 00:37:27,760 are humans and there are so many of us who are very 572 00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:33,080 irresponsible. And I, I actually today no 573 00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:37,080 longer believe that we have quote UN quote too many dogs and 574 00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:41,240 cats. I think it's just more of a 575 00:37:41,240 --> 00:37:45,320 distribution issue and you know that some people are not as 576 00:37:45,560 --> 00:37:49,840 responsible as others, but learning especially in the past 577 00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:54,720 couple of years, how detrimental it is to their health, 578 00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:59,040 especially when we are spaying and neutering them so young. 579 00:38:00,560 --> 00:38:04,160 They don't even have the opportunity to, you know, fully 580 00:38:04,160 --> 00:38:08,040 mature. But more often than not before 581 00:38:08,040 --> 00:38:13,320 they're spayed or neutered. And so many veterinarians, we're 582 00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:19,520 not trained in alternative span neuter procedures doing, you 583 00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:23,680 know, the ovary sparring phase and the like. 584 00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:27,040 There's, there's so much out there that we can do. 585 00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:31,600 And yes, we want to be responsible so that we're not 586 00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:35,560 putting animals into the world that are going to suffer, but 587 00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:40,120 also we need to be responsible for the health of the animals 588 00:38:40,120 --> 00:38:44,160 that we are caring for. And so it's like this, like 589 00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:46,240 teeter totter. Yeah. 590 00:38:46,400 --> 00:38:50,640 What do we do? Well, we should look to Europe a 591 00:38:50,640 --> 00:38:53,760 little bit more because they don't really do a whole lot of 592 00:38:53,760 --> 00:38:57,040 castration there. And if you ever go over there, 593 00:38:57,040 --> 00:39:00,640 like they will walk around with their dogs, they're not on leash 594 00:39:00,640 --> 00:39:04,400 and you can see visibly that they are not fixed and they're 595 00:39:04,400 --> 00:39:06,720 well behaved. They're not running off. 596 00:39:06,720 --> 00:39:10,440 They're not picking fights like they they do a pretty good job 597 00:39:10,440 --> 00:39:15,040 of having good quality pets in a responsible environment and they 598 00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:18,840 don't have the overpopulation problems, they don't have the 599 00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:21,200 health problems. Again, it is very different and 600 00:39:21,200 --> 00:39:24,560 we do have multiple places really in the world that we can 601 00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:27,760 actually look to provide us evidence of that. 602 00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:30,960 Yeah, it is interesting to see. You know, I think so many 603 00:39:30,960 --> 00:39:34,800 Americans are not well traveled, and I can't claim to be either. 604 00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:37,160 I've only been out of the country a handful of times. 605 00:39:37,160 --> 00:39:41,240 But I mean, even, I think that's one of the one of the benefits 606 00:39:41,320 --> 00:39:44,760 of the Internet and social media specifically is that we can get 607 00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:47,600 a glimpse at what's happening around the world and not just 608 00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:50,240 here. And, and I get it. 609 00:39:50,240 --> 00:39:56,320 Like, you know, being an American, we have 50 states that 610 00:39:56,360 --> 00:39:58,920 we can travel to and they're all very different and have very 611 00:39:58,920 --> 00:40:02,120 different cultural, you know, and food experiences and all 612 00:40:02,120 --> 00:40:02,880 that. So it's like. 613 00:40:03,720 --> 00:40:06,120 For so many Americans, it's like, why would we leave? 614 00:40:06,120 --> 00:40:10,200 But to see how the rest of the world does things, It's like, 615 00:40:10,200 --> 00:40:16,960 oh, we're we're really not doing things right here for sure. 616 00:40:18,800 --> 00:40:23,640 But I, I want to kind of circle back around a little bit to 617 00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:28,320 solutions because you're not just doing a food, which I think 618 00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:33,200 is one of the main things we like to talk about is the food 619 00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:35,720 because it is the foundation of health. 620 00:40:35,720 --> 00:40:38,960 Like what we put into the body is fueling ourselves. 621 00:40:38,960 --> 00:40:44,240 And it's literally, you know, constructing our bodies with, 622 00:40:44,280 --> 00:40:47,960 you know, how quickly our cells divide and die off and all the 623 00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:50,800 things. But you do other things with 624 00:40:50,800 --> 00:40:54,680 solutions as well. You mentioned all the different 625 00:40:55,120 --> 00:40:58,800 like milk products that you have, but you also have a lot of 626 00:40:59,160 --> 00:41:02,920 herbal products. Can you talk a little bit about, 627 00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:06,120 you know, why and how you're doing those? 628 00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:11,320 Yeah, yeah. So with the herbs, I think right 629 00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:15,960 now we have 15 herbal powder blends and then we have 3 630 00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:18,400 tinctures. So the tinctures are a new 631 00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:21,920 addition. One of those is a duplicate of 632 00:41:21,920 --> 00:41:25,760 the powder, the parasite free just because anything for 633 00:41:25,760 --> 00:41:29,040 parasites is very bitter. So there's two ways that you can 634 00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:32,920 give that now, but everything else is fully different 635 00:41:33,360 --> 00:41:36,720 ingredient panels. So the history behind those is 636 00:41:36,720 --> 00:41:41,280 actually my my apothecary here that I'm in. 637 00:41:41,640 --> 00:41:43,680 It's very big, lots and lots of herbs. 638 00:41:44,280 --> 00:41:48,280 I've been actually making the herbal blends for I guess about 639 00:41:48,480 --> 00:41:53,920 13 years just in my basement and just for my retail store. 640 00:41:53,920 --> 00:41:57,560 And I transferred a portion, actually a kind of a small 641 00:41:57,560 --> 00:42:01,720 portion of the things that I've been making over to solutions 642 00:42:01,720 --> 00:42:05,040 just to make sure that all of the farmers had something that 643 00:42:05,040 --> 00:42:08,800 they could get paid to do. So we've been really impressed 644 00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:11,760 with how well they've sold. We weren't fully expecting that, 645 00:42:11,760 --> 00:42:16,240 but it's awesome. The history of the reason that I 646 00:42:16,240 --> 00:42:20,000 got into that in the 1st place, It's not actually something that 647 00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:22,240 I was like, oh, I just want to start making herbs. 648 00:42:22,920 --> 00:42:28,160 It was really out of necessity. So my supplement section in my 649 00:42:28,160 --> 00:42:36,280 retail store is maybe to 25 to 30 feet long and as high as you 650 00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:39,680 can comfortably reach. So we have a lot of supplements. 651 00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:45,040 I am very meticulous about not having things that duplicate 652 00:42:45,040 --> 00:42:47,440 each other. Like I, I don't want to have 653 00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:49,040 things that are really redundant. 654 00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:53,200 So we'll usually if there's something new that's amazing, it 655 00:42:53,200 --> 00:42:56,920 has to be better than whatever we have that's similar for us to 656 00:42:56,920 --> 00:43:00,040 bring it in. So that size of supplement shelf 657 00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:05,200 without redundancy. And I still was finding that 658 00:43:05,200 --> 00:43:07,840 being that we, we don't really advertise. 659 00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:11,480 We primarily have people that come in by referral. 660 00:43:11,560 --> 00:43:15,560 And so they had very complicated issues and that's still how it 661 00:43:15,560 --> 00:43:17,280 is. But I was finding that they 662 00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:19,400 would come in and they would say, OK, I have this health 663 00:43:19,400 --> 00:43:21,640 problem. And I was like, OK, you need 664 00:43:21,640 --> 00:43:25,560 these 10 supplements to manage the situation that you're 665 00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:29,000 dealing with. And either they wouldn't buy 666 00:43:29,000 --> 00:43:32,080 them all, they would take one, in which case they wouldn't have 667 00:43:32,080 --> 00:43:34,520 a good outcome, but that's what they can afford. 668 00:43:35,440 --> 00:43:38,760 Or if they did buy them all, they wouldn't use them all 669 00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:41,160 because it was too much. It was too complicated. 670 00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:45,080 So poor compliance still resulted in bad outcomes. 671 00:43:45,400 --> 00:43:50,120 So it, for me, it really was like, OK, how can I make it so 672 00:43:50,120 --> 00:43:54,120 that there's fewer things that they have to use with less 673 00:43:54,120 --> 00:43:58,640 filler that they don't need? That makes it more easy to use 674 00:43:58,640 --> 00:44:02,160 and more affordable for them to be able to purchase it. 675 00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:08,120 Like at most I want them to buy 3 supplements, preferably 2, 676 00:44:08,120 --> 00:44:11,320 preferably 1 if that's an option at all. 677 00:44:11,400 --> 00:44:16,960 So really the only reason that I made them was to fill holes in 678 00:44:16,960 --> 00:44:19,960 those shelves where there just wasn't something that was 679 00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:24,000 available, where we had all of those needs met, where it was 680 00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:28,240 just consolidated, easy to use, super effective. 681 00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:32,960 You know, the for the most part, the things that we have where 682 00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:37,160 you would have to get one more supplement is like if your pet 683 00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:41,080 has a heart problem, then we have the I heart you. 684 00:44:41,080 --> 00:44:45,000 But you should also use the jiggles because they're two very 685 00:44:45,000 --> 00:44:47,200 different things. Like 1 is helping the heart to 686 00:44:47,200 --> 00:44:51,400 do its job of moving blood and the other one, the jiggles, is 687 00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:53,280 for helping the heart structurally. 688 00:44:53,680 --> 00:44:57,080 And then maybe you might add in like a Coq 10 or ubiquinol, 689 00:44:57,080 --> 00:44:59,720 which we're not going to add into a powder because that is a 690 00:44:59,720 --> 00:45:03,440 liquid. So like there's very few areas 691 00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:07,040 where we have recommendations for additional supplements added 692 00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:08,880 in and that's why. That's amazing. 693 00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:14,120 And I think herbs are underutilized and underrated. 694 00:45:14,120 --> 00:45:18,280 And it's, it's actually one of my next, next things that I, I 695 00:45:18,280 --> 00:45:24,200 want to learn about is, is herbalism because I think 696 00:45:24,200 --> 00:45:26,680 there's so much benefit there. And I am one of those people 697 00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:29,440 that's like, I want to make an apothecary. 698 00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:34,280 Like that's what I want that to do it. 699 00:45:34,280 --> 00:45:37,880 It is a goal of mine. But I, you know, we've covered a 700 00:45:37,880 --> 00:45:40,840 lot and I'm sure there's, there's always so much more to 701 00:45:40,840 --> 00:45:43,720 talk about, but I always like to like first time I have somebody 702 00:45:43,720 --> 00:45:48,520 on, I want to kind of introduce them and their products and, and 703 00:45:48,520 --> 00:45:53,960 services. But before I let you go, I do 704 00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:58,240 want to just kind of ask. We've touched on so many things 705 00:45:58,240 --> 00:46:02,200 already from AFCO to feeding pets, you know, the food we're 706 00:46:02,200 --> 00:46:08,520 feeding to HPP and HTMA test. But if and you having a story, 707 00:46:08,760 --> 00:46:11,600 you, you, you may already have your like pitch down. 708 00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:14,000 I don't know. But if there is one piece of 709 00:46:14,000 --> 00:46:17,520 advice that you could give pet parents who are maybe just 710 00:46:17,520 --> 00:46:20,640 starting out, like they've been kibble feeders forever and 711 00:46:20,640 --> 00:46:25,000 they're like just starting to to learn that like, oh, this 712 00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:28,440 actually isn't good for my dog. And they're faced with like 713 00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:32,520 overwhelm of all of this information and a lot of bad 714 00:46:32,520 --> 00:46:36,080 information out there too. By the way, what would you, what 715 00:46:36,080 --> 00:46:39,160 would you say to somebody who's like just starting out? 716 00:46:41,800 --> 00:46:46,080 I would say that the two things that are probably the most 717 00:46:46,080 --> 00:46:53,080 important one, always try to stick with things that nature 718 00:46:53,080 --> 00:46:57,640 provides. So even if humans take a product 719 00:46:57,880 --> 00:47:01,200 like they, they create a product that has 15 different 720 00:47:01,200 --> 00:47:04,840 ingredients that are made by nature, it's still not anything 721 00:47:04,840 --> 00:47:07,560 man made. We more and more and more and 722 00:47:07,560 --> 00:47:11,320 more are finding that man made things can be problematic. 723 00:47:11,320 --> 00:47:14,760 There's so much that we don't know and there's so much that we 724 00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:18,320 might never know and nature knows. 725 00:47:18,320 --> 00:47:23,120 Nature does not do a good job of making mistakes. 726 00:47:23,240 --> 00:47:27,800 Nature doesn't 'cause the same kinds of contaminations and you 727 00:47:27,800 --> 00:47:33,240 know, issues that humans do and where that has been wrong in the 728 00:47:33,240 --> 00:47:37,840 past, we've been making mass produced things long enough that 729 00:47:37,840 --> 00:47:40,960 we do have a good idea of how to avoid those things. 730 00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:45,200 Like the ancient Romans used to flavor their wine with lead. 731 00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:47,560 We know we shouldn't do that anymore, right? 732 00:47:47,560 --> 00:47:49,480 Like lead is natural. Let's not do that. 733 00:47:49,480 --> 00:47:53,560 So outside of that, like whole food things are always going to 734 00:47:53,560 --> 00:47:57,800 be better. If you can read on the label 735 00:47:57,800 --> 00:48:05,080 that it says like for example, you know, zinc sulfate or copper 736 00:48:05,080 --> 00:48:08,120 protonate or something where you're actually reading a 737 00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:12,440 vitamin or a mineral or an amino acid man made that it's an 738 00:48:12,440 --> 00:48:14,560 isolate. Try to avoid those things. 739 00:48:15,280 --> 00:48:20,440 The other thing that I would say is, in my opinion, you're going 740 00:48:20,480 --> 00:48:24,560 to do a lot better for yourself if you were looking at how much 741 00:48:24,560 --> 00:48:28,680 it costs to use a product and not how much it costs to buy a 742 00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:32,720 product. Because across the board, the 743 00:48:32,920 --> 00:48:36,560 things are going to be less expensive for you to use it if 744 00:48:36,560 --> 00:48:41,640 it's a healthier thing with fewer fillers and like junk in 745 00:48:41,640 --> 00:48:44,880 there. So better concentration, which 746 00:48:44,880 --> 00:48:48,920 might be for food a higher concentration of calories. 747 00:48:50,800 --> 00:48:56,160 So for example, solutions we recommend using our food based 748 00:48:56,160 --> 00:49:00,120 on 88 calories an ounce. The average raw food is 40 749 00:49:00,120 --> 00:49:03,680 calories an ounce with some of them I've seen as low as 27. 750 00:49:03,960 --> 00:49:07,240 So our sticker price can be higher and it can still be less 751 00:49:07,240 --> 00:49:10,000 expensive to use. That also applies to 752 00:49:10,000 --> 00:49:13,040 supplements. You can have a very inexpensive 753 00:49:13,040 --> 00:49:18,280 supplement available to you, but it's I've seen them as high as 754 00:49:18,280 --> 00:49:22,880 like 94% filler and 6% active ingredient. 755 00:49:22,880 --> 00:49:27,120 You have to give so much more of that cheap product that it's 756 00:49:27,120 --> 00:49:31,120 costing you a significant amount more money and you're not 757 00:49:31,120 --> 00:49:32,760 getting the same benefits out of it. 758 00:49:32,760 --> 00:49:35,200 So ultimately you kind of wasted your money anyway. 759 00:49:35,520 --> 00:49:40,400 So look at how much are you going to have to use and how 760 00:49:40,400 --> 00:49:44,120 does that apply to the price, rather than just saying, OK, I'm 761 00:49:44,240 --> 00:49:47,040 just going to go with whatever sticker price seems the most 762 00:49:47,040 --> 00:49:51,040 comfortable because you might be doing yourself a disservice by 763 00:49:51,040 --> 00:49:53,840 using a sticker price. Wow. 764 00:49:54,640 --> 00:49:58,160 I think I don't know that anybody has ever answered that 765 00:49:58,160 --> 00:50:01,320 way before. And that's so wonderful. 766 00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:06,960 No, really, because especially working with, you know, pet 767 00:50:06,960 --> 00:50:11,480 parents one-on-one pricing is like, especially today, pricing 768 00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:12,880 is an issue. And I get it. 769 00:50:12,880 --> 00:50:14,680 Like I'm right there with everybody else. 770 00:50:15,120 --> 00:50:19,920 Pricing is certainly an issue, but also the quality of the 771 00:50:19,920 --> 00:50:22,960 product makes such a huge difference. 772 00:50:22,960 --> 00:50:26,680 I have so many people that are giving so many supplements and 773 00:50:26,680 --> 00:50:31,080 I'm like, we've got to stop. We have got to stop, you know, 774 00:50:31,080 --> 00:50:33,920 and, and some people have a hard time with us and people are 775 00:50:33,920 --> 00:50:35,960 like, but no, but no. And I'm like, no, we're going 776 00:50:36,040 --> 00:50:37,960 to, we're just, we're going to pull all of this back. 777 00:50:37,960 --> 00:50:42,040 We're going to, you know, find a handful of things that are going 778 00:50:42,040 --> 00:50:45,280 to make the biggest impact for your pet. 779 00:50:45,320 --> 00:50:50,200 And like, I know that's really, really hard, especially when you 780 00:50:50,200 --> 00:50:53,560 know, you've been using something for so long and you, 781 00:50:53,720 --> 00:50:56,920 you, I don't know, it's just it drives me. 782 00:50:56,920 --> 00:51:01,680 It drives me crazy sometimes how attached people are to brands 783 00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:04,440 and products that don't even know who they are. 784 00:51:06,320 --> 00:51:09,200 And this is where something like Parsley Pet can bring a lot of 785 00:51:09,200 --> 00:51:11,320 value. If you're afraid to stop certain 786 00:51:11,320 --> 00:51:16,120 supplements, then take a look at the data from your pet's actual 787 00:51:16,120 --> 00:51:20,880 body or your body and say, what is my body saying that I do and 788 00:51:20,880 --> 00:51:23,560 don't need? And then you can strip away the 789 00:51:23,560 --> 00:51:29,080 things that you can see from the body's tissue are not helping. 790 00:51:29,080 --> 00:51:32,600 And you can add in things that you can see that the body is 791 00:51:32,600 --> 00:51:35,600 saying that it needs. It's a much easier way to filter 792 00:51:35,600 --> 00:51:38,960 through without it having that emotional aspect to it. 793 00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:44,200 Yes, that's one of the reasons why I like testing so much is 794 00:51:44,200 --> 00:51:46,480 because it's like right there in black and white. 795 00:51:46,520 --> 00:51:48,080 This is working. This isn't working. 796 00:51:49,080 --> 00:51:51,880 And I do hope people, well, I'd hope people go check out 797 00:51:51,880 --> 00:51:55,640 solutions. I, I have included it in my 798 00:51:55,640 --> 00:52:00,160 rotation and I really hope people check out parsley pet 799 00:52:00,160 --> 00:52:05,800 too, because getting this information on our pets really 800 00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:07,840 is like you've said it so many times already. 801 00:52:07,840 --> 00:52:14,800 It is so valuable to us to be able to better take care of 802 00:52:15,640 --> 00:52:19,120 these tiny little beings that are our responsibility. 803 00:52:19,200 --> 00:52:24,760 So I thank you so much for all of your knowledge and sharing it 804 00:52:24,760 --> 00:52:28,080 with our listeners. And where can people find all of 805 00:52:28,080 --> 00:52:29,400 these Wonderful. Products. 806 00:52:30,360 --> 00:52:35,640 There's a long list to abbreviate it. heroespets.com is 807 00:52:35,640 --> 00:52:39,200 my retail store. We're in the process of redoing 808 00:52:39,200 --> 00:52:41,440 the website. So you can always reach out with 809 00:52:41,440 --> 00:52:45,680 questions and we can direct you to things that we have available 810 00:52:45,680 --> 00:52:49,280 or suggest in your area if that's what comes up. 811 00:52:50,040 --> 00:52:53,560 solutionspetproducts.com. We don't sell direct. 812 00:52:53,560 --> 00:52:57,720 We sell through retailers and then we have a couple of people 813 00:52:57,720 --> 00:53:00,600 that do direct to consumer, but you can reach out if you have 814 00:53:00,600 --> 00:53:04,040 questions. And then Parsley pet.com sounds 815 00:53:04,040 --> 00:53:05,240 pretty easy to use. Awesome. 816 00:53:08,240 --> 00:53:11,520 I'll make sure all of that are in the show notes as well. 817 00:53:11,520 --> 00:53:15,520 And again, Chelsea, thank you so much for being here guys. 818 00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:18,640 Have a fabulous rest of your week and please give your pets 819 00:53:18,640 --> 00:53:21,400 some extra love from both me and Chelsea this week.