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It seems like what possesses us 22 00:01:22,440 --> 00:01:25,960 to break out these mics, stop what we're doing and yap about 23 00:01:25,960 --> 00:01:31,720 track is either a world record or World Athletics. 24 00:01:31,720 --> 00:01:36,640 Unveiling the qualification system for Beijing 2027 pre just 25 00:01:36,640 --> 00:01:39,120 as we thought we were gonna be done talking about world 26 00:01:39,120 --> 00:01:44,480 rankings, here we go. We've got a whole show dedicated 27 00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:47,520 to just explaining to folks these changes that World 28 00:01:47,520 --> 00:01:52,480 Athletics has made for 2027. Yeah, no, it's a, it's not in 29 00:01:52,480 --> 00:01:54,480 the fun starts. This is our, this is our 30 00:01:54,480 --> 00:01:58,120 favorite topic, isn't it, Chris? So yeah, let's let's dive in. 31 00:01:58,120 --> 00:02:00,240 I mean, I'm it was quite exciting. 32 00:02:00,240 --> 00:02:02,640 It was a sudden drop this afternoon. 33 00:02:02,640 --> 00:02:06,360 And yeah, lots to talk about. Actually more than you might 34 00:02:06,360 --> 00:02:08,680 have thought initially just looking at the the entry 35 00:02:08,680 --> 00:02:10,520 standards by themselves. Yeah. 36 00:02:10,520 --> 00:02:15,400 So let's begin with the fact that and remind folks that World 37 00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:18,800 Athletics is going to continue its hybrid model that combines 38 00:02:19,120 --> 00:02:25,360 people qualifying off of hitting a particular time or mark those 39 00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:30,200 entry standards with also people qualifying via world rankings. 40 00:02:30,200 --> 00:02:33,280 Obviously World Athletics created the world rankings and 41 00:02:33,280 --> 00:02:37,120 so they want to push as many people into their championships 42 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:40,480 with it. And in the past it was the goal 43 00:02:40,480 --> 00:02:43,640 was 5050. And so the biggest change this 44 00:02:43,640 --> 00:02:48,520 time is that the system is now designed so that roughly 40% of 45 00:02:48,520 --> 00:02:52,520 athletes qualify for the World Championships via the entry 46 00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:58,000 standard and 60% will come through the world rankings. 47 00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:04,280 And part of that is so that World Athletics is trying to 48 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:08,840 reshape the sport in a way so that this rewards the athletes 49 00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:14,680 who are competing and performing consistently over the course of 50 00:03:14,680 --> 00:03:19,560 a season rather than just one single, you know, peak result. 51 00:03:19,600 --> 00:03:25,440 And then people go on and take a long break to train for the 52 00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:27,920 World Championships and only show up for the World 53 00:03:27,920 --> 00:03:30,160 Championships. Now, if you are one of the best 54 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:35,080 in the world that you could, you still probably have that ace in 55 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:40,600 your pocket to be able to run the standard one time and then 56 00:03:40,600 --> 00:03:44,280 chill out for the rest of the season before the championships. 57 00:03:44,280 --> 00:03:48,720 But this definitely is going to affect a greater population of 58 00:03:48,720 --> 00:03:51,560 athletes. And so there's a variety of 59 00:03:51,560 --> 00:03:55,000 other changes that were presented with this 2027 60 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:59,840 qualifying system. So there are four different ways 61 00:03:59,960 --> 00:04:02,680 to qualify for the world championship. 62 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:06,960 So the first is you hit the standard at some point during 63 00:04:06,960 --> 00:04:11,440 the qualification window. Second way you qualify is you 64 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:16,839 finish in a certain place at certain competitions. 65 00:04:16,959 --> 00:04:20,360 And so that is I think mostly aimed towards the marathon where 66 00:04:20,360 --> 00:04:22,240 they have like the Platinum label. 67 00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:25,520 Third way you receive a wild card. 68 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:31,360 Fourth way is you qualify via world rankings at the end of the 69 00:04:31,360 --> 00:04:33,960 world ranking period. So that is something that you 70 00:04:33,960 --> 00:04:36,480 can monitor all throughout the qualifying window. 71 00:04:37,320 --> 00:04:39,680 The qualifying windows are as follows. 72 00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:44,360 In the marathon, it opened up last November, November 3rd and 73 00:04:44,360 --> 00:04:48,080 it will run through May 2nd of 2027. 74 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:51,760 So that means any performance from essentially the New York 75 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:58,120 City Marathon last year through next early first weekend of May 76 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:03,720 next year will count towards Tokyo qualifying, the 10K, the 77 00:05:03,720 --> 00:05:06,400 race walk, the multi events and the relays. 78 00:05:06,760 --> 00:05:10,920 That window opened up back in February, February 23rd and runs 79 00:05:10,920 --> 00:05:14,880 through August 2020. Second 2027. 80 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:20,760 The important thing to note there is that 10K that the 10 81 00:05:21,000 --> 00:05:26,640 that was hosted back in March counts towards the 2027 World 82 00:05:26,640 --> 00:05:28,960 Championship qualifying window. But I don't believe anyone got 83 00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:34,080 the standard so. But people did run fast enough 84 00:05:34,440 --> 00:05:38,440 to earn rankings points there that will go towards an athlete 85 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:40,760 score. So someone like Shelby Houlihan 86 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:45,240 who ran the 10K at the 10 already has one on the board 87 00:05:45,240 --> 00:05:50,560 that counts towards 2027. Every other event the window 88 00:05:50,560 --> 00:05:56,360 will open up August 23rd, 2026 and then run through August 89 00:05:56,440 --> 00:06:01,200 22nd, 2027. So that means after the Diamond 90 00:06:01,200 --> 00:06:05,280 League final and. So it'll be the the first meet 91 00:06:05,280 --> 00:06:08,400 is the Celestia Diamond League, Celestia Diamond League, Zurich 92 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:12,520 Diamond League and then Diamond League final, etcetera. 93 00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:13,840 Well. Those are in the window. 94 00:06:14,280 --> 00:06:18,360 Then you got World Ultimate Champs and you got Athos. 95 00:06:18,360 --> 00:06:21,760 That is sort of like the first part of the qualifying window 96 00:06:22,000 --> 00:06:23,520 where you'll see times that count. 97 00:06:23,520 --> 00:06:26,920 So honestly, like if if athletes aren't tired enough and they 98 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:30,120 just want to knock this thing out, sure, maybe you see some 99 00:06:30,200 --> 00:06:33,960 faster races at Athos, but as we've seen over the last couple 100 00:06:33,960 --> 00:06:38,840 of years, that's definitely more of an exhibition party for the 101 00:06:38,840 --> 00:06:40,160 athletes at the end of the season. 102 00:06:40,480 --> 00:06:42,920 And of course, the relay spots, which we've talked about before, 103 00:06:43,440 --> 00:06:46,000 those qualified through the world relays that just took 104 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:49,160 place in Gabarone. And then the last four remaining 105 00:06:49,160 --> 00:06:52,280 spots are going to be determined by world rankings at the end of 106 00:06:52,280 --> 00:06:55,240 the qualification period. So as of right now, Preet, 107 00:06:56,080 --> 00:06:59,360 everything seems pretty straightforward, right? 108 00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:02,360 We don't need to expand upon any of those points. 109 00:07:02,680 --> 00:07:07,640 All right, moving on the wildcards, who do those go to? 110 00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:13,360 The wildcards will go to the defending 2025 world champions. 111 00:07:13,560 --> 00:07:17,760 So if you won gold in Tokyo, you've locked down a spot for 112 00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:22,080 Beijing. The winners of the 2026 World 113 00:07:22,160 --> 00:07:28,120 Ultimate Championships also can lock down a wild card to the 114 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:31,760 2027 World Championships. This is where it's going to get 115 00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:35,240 pretty interesting because like typically we know we, we have 116 00:07:35,240 --> 00:07:38,920 never had just sort of an ultimate champion wild card. 117 00:07:38,920 --> 00:07:42,320 We've had no, actually you don't even get an Olympic champion 118 00:07:42,320 --> 00:07:47,080 wild card to any championship. So this is going to be 119 00:07:47,560 --> 00:07:51,920 interesting in certain events, like for example, if Rye 120 00:07:51,920 --> 00:07:55,440 Benjamin wins. Actually, no, that wouldn't be a 121 00:07:55,440 --> 00:07:58,680 good example. But take an event where an 122 00:07:58,680 --> 00:08:05,280 American won the 2025 World Championships like the like 123 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:09,440 Cordell Tinch in the Hunt 110 hurdles, won gold in the 110 124 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:13,720 hurdles in Tokyo. But say for example, Freddie 125 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:17,640 Crittenden wins the World Ultimate Championships, right? 126 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:22,600 If you're USATF, it's not in your selection criteria yet. 127 00:08:22,800 --> 00:08:24,720 But this is something you're going to have to determine as to 128 00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:27,360 like which one of the two, those two athletes will take one of 129 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:32,360 the wild card spots in addition to the other spots that will be 130 00:08:32,360 --> 00:08:37,360 determined at the US Championships in 2027. 131 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:44,600 So this is this is new. Winners of the 2026 World Race 132 00:08:44,600 --> 00:08:47,440 Walking Tour and Combined Events Tour also get a wild card to 133 00:08:47,440 --> 00:08:50,480 Beijing. The leading hammer performers on 134 00:08:50,480 --> 00:08:53,880 the 2026 Continental Tour will get a wild card, and then the 135 00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:58,520 2027 Diamond League champions will get a wild card to Beijing. 136 00:09:00,000 --> 00:09:01,840 I'll stop there Pre. What do you make of just sort of 137 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:07,520 like the ultimate champion and the world champion getting wild 138 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:10,560 cards because it is going to pose for certain countries? 139 00:09:10,560 --> 00:09:14,680 It's it's, it's a very, it might only be like one or two cases, I 140 00:09:14,680 --> 00:09:16,480 think a couple. Cases. 141 00:09:16,480 --> 00:09:19,320 Yeah, exactly. I mean, I, I think the only real 142 00:09:19,320 --> 00:09:24,200 kind of country that probably is likely to have this issue is 143 00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:28,880 Team USA in terms of having two wild cards in there in this or 144 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:32,000 two athletes with wild cards in the same event. 145 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:35,480 So, you know, maybe there's a small chance that I don't know, 146 00:09:36,760 --> 00:09:40,520 Keely wins that I don't know. So someone there's someone I 147 00:09:40,520 --> 00:09:41,920 don't think it even applies in the 800. 148 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:45,280 So it doesn't, I don't I Kenya maybe Kenya is probably the only 149 00:09:45,280 --> 00:09:47,320 other one that might have something of a different. 150 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:52,120 Kenya Dorcas Ewoi wins the 1500 at in Budapest, but Faith 151 00:09:52,120 --> 00:09:54,440 Kippyegon has the 1500 gold medal. 152 00:09:54,760 --> 00:09:58,120 That's where they're going to have to determine who's going to 153 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:00,400 get the one wild card spot. Or do you take? 154 00:10:00,920 --> 00:10:03,160 Is it possible then to take two wild cards? 155 00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:04,800 No, so that's that's the point, right? 156 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:07,520 So you can have one wild card and then your three regular 157 00:10:07,520 --> 00:10:10,960 selections. Now I suspect the reality is 158 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:14,800 like because of the way Kenyan selection works, those two 159 00:10:14,800 --> 00:10:16,280 athletes will almost certainly go anyway. 160 00:10:16,280 --> 00:10:21,800 Whilst if you in the case of Team USAI, imagine USATF will 161 00:10:21,800 --> 00:10:24,240 probably give an order of priority. 162 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:26,880 And I, I don't know what they will conclude on that, but I 163 00:10:26,880 --> 00:10:29,840 imagine they will give an order of priority on those wild cards. 164 00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:33,080 And obviously if the athlete with the other wild card doesn't 165 00:10:33,080 --> 00:10:36,360 come in the top four at USA, they might get left at home. 166 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:41,120 So that that that or I can see that being case. 167 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:44,680 So yeah, I don't, I don't know exactly how, how that will that 168 00:10:44,680 --> 00:10:48,000 will pan pan out. It's a problem for another day. 169 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:51,560 It's a problem that we'll start to think about, I think after 170 00:10:51,560 --> 00:10:53,800 the results of the World Ultimate Championships. 171 00:10:54,600 --> 00:10:58,080 All right, so marathon pathway to the World Championships, you 172 00:10:58,080 --> 00:11:01,000 either run the time or you have to be a top five finisher at a 173 00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:04,400 Platinum Label marathon during the qualification window and you 174 00:11:04,400 --> 00:11:08,640 automatically qualify as do winners of Gold Label marathons 175 00:11:08,640 --> 00:11:13,200 held in 2027 up until May 2nd. So if you are a Gold Label 176 00:11:13,200 --> 00:11:19,080 marathon between January and May 2nd of next year and you win, 177 00:11:19,240 --> 00:11:21,480 that could be that's an interesting 1. 178 00:11:21,560 --> 00:11:24,680 I don't think I I remember that being the case before. 179 00:11:26,280 --> 00:11:29,680 But yeah, set it like I don't know offhand. 180 00:11:29,680 --> 00:11:32,480 Is Dusseldorf like a gold label marathon? 181 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:34,960 Yeah, I don't know. But yeah, that that is 182 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:36,800 definitely. So then if Alex Mayer went and 183 00:11:36,800 --> 00:11:40,200 won Dusseldorf, like does he qualify for the World 184 00:11:40,200 --> 00:11:44,160 Championships by, by by this letter of the law, then? 185 00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:46,800 Yeah. So that'll be another 186 00:11:46,800 --> 00:11:50,400 interesting thing to kind of look out for is now maybe this 187 00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:53,160 spreads the talent pool outside of the majors to a couple of 188 00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:57,400 those gold label marathons in the early part of 2027, area 189 00:11:57,400 --> 00:11:59,600 champions. So winners of area championships 190 00:11:59,600 --> 00:12:02,640 and individual events, excluding the marathon, can also qualify. 191 00:12:04,600 --> 00:12:07,400 That's an unlikely one to ever happen, though, or it's very, 192 00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:11,000 very limited to it's only if no one else from that area. 193 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:15,400 So South America doesn't have anyone in an event, or if Africa 194 00:12:15,400 --> 00:12:18,560 doesn't have anyone in one of the field events, then that area 195 00:12:18,560 --> 00:12:22,280 champion can go. But it's, you know, it means 196 00:12:22,280 --> 00:12:25,480 that no one else in the entire continent has qualified for the 197 00:12:25,480 --> 00:12:26,560 world. Championship, well, we've seen 198 00:12:26,560 --> 00:12:28,120 that. I think with the 10K, right, 199 00:12:28,120 --> 00:12:32,280 There's been a couple like the South America gets one person in 200 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:35,120 through that. All right. 201 00:12:35,160 --> 00:12:38,960 The next thing basically the other thing that now people I 202 00:12:38,960 --> 00:12:40,600 think are paying a little bit more attention to, which is 203 00:12:40,600 --> 00:12:44,120 something that we wrote about and talked about before is that 204 00:12:44,120 --> 00:12:47,560 the world rankings formula has changed so that it puts more 205 00:12:47,560 --> 00:12:52,720 weight on results across on results scores and less on 206 00:12:52,720 --> 00:12:54,880 placing scores. We talked about this on the show 207 00:12:54,880 --> 00:12:57,320 a couple months back. And so when we do this write up 208 00:12:57,320 --> 00:13:00,480 that you'll be able to find on CITIUS MAG.com that Preet has 209 00:13:00,480 --> 00:13:03,440 been working on, we will link to to that piece as well. 210 00:13:03,440 --> 00:13:08,280 And it's something that we kind of spoken about beforehand and 211 00:13:08,280 --> 00:13:11,560 plays into things when you'll learn just a second of the 212 00:13:11,560 --> 00:13:15,560 events that are going to be eligible for all of this. 213 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:18,480 All right. So the biggest thing and 214 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:21,800 analyzing sort of this change is that World Athletics has 215 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:24,240 previously tried to do the 5050 split. 216 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:28,960 But even if you look at the 2025 World Championships, you know, 217 00:13:28,960 --> 00:13:33,880 52 of the 56 athletes that competed in the 800 were people 218 00:13:33,880 --> 00:13:38,040 who had hit the standard. The 800, of course, is an event 219 00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:43,040 that kind of got broken in the last two years, and you had a 220 00:13:43,160 --> 00:13:45,320 slew of people running crazy fast. 221 00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:49,200 And so that was one where there was only people, four people who 222 00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:54,280 entered via the world rankings. Same thing if you look at the 223 00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:58,480 1500 and 5K, those were events where most people who qualified, 224 00:13:58,920 --> 00:14:01,800 qualified by hitting the standard, some, many of them in 225 00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:04,920 the 5K indoors. We'll get to that in just a 226 00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:08,160 second. So by making these standards 227 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:13,000 tougher, that is what World Athletics is hoping shifts 228 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:17,040 things so that 60% of the athletes come from the rankings. 229 00:14:17,040 --> 00:14:22,240 So if we look at and we put up a couple graphics on the CITIUS 230 00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:29,120 MAG Instagram story of just the differences in what the 231 00:14:29,120 --> 00:14:30,880 standards are. So let me read through just sort 232 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:33,520 of, I'm not going to go through every single event. 233 00:14:33,520 --> 00:14:36,000 Well, let's focus on the distance events because I know 234 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:41,520 that that is of most interest to our listeners. 800 is now 143 235 00:14:41,520 --> 00:14:45,720 for the men, 157.5 for the women. 236 00:14:46,040 --> 00:14:50,480 The 1500 is 330 for the men, 358 for the women. 237 00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:55,800 The 5K is 1250 for the men, 1436 for the women. 238 00:14:56,240 --> 00:15:02,080 The 10K is 2648 for the men, 3040 for the women. 239 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:08,760 The marathon is 2O6 flat for the for the men and 2/23/20 for the 240 00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:12,720 women. The 3K steeple is eight O 8 for 241 00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:20,440 the men, nine O 6.5 for the women, and all of those except 242 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:25,360 for the women's 10K got faster from 2025 to 2027. 243 00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:31,520 The biggest changes are on the men's side, the 5K standard got 244 00:15:31,520 --> 00:15:35,600 11 seconds faster, the 10K standard got 12 seconds faster, 245 00:15:36,440 --> 00:15:42,200 and on the women's side, the 5K standard got 14 seconds faster 246 00:15:42,440 --> 00:15:45,280 and the 10K standard slowed 20 seconds. 247 00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:53,200 The women's 3K steeple also got 11 1/2 seconds faster for the 248 00:15:53,200 --> 00:15:56,840 women. So let's let's pause right 249 00:15:56,840 --> 00:15:59,520 there. Pre what did you make of the 250 00:15:59,520 --> 00:16:01,400 standards getting faster and tighter? 251 00:16:02,760 --> 00:16:04,480 Well, I mean, it wasn't a surprise, right? 252 00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:08,320 The whole point is to try and make it so that you know that 253 00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:12,320 that the rankings do matter. And I think this so this this 254 00:16:12,320 --> 00:16:13,720 shouldn't have come as a surprise to anybody. 255 00:16:13,720 --> 00:16:16,040 I don't think we were That's not unexpected. 256 00:16:16,240 --> 00:16:19,440 I mean, some of the standards like 143 as the under me 257 00:16:19,440 --> 00:16:21,800 standard looks absolutely bonkers, right? 258 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:25,560 But but this. Comes one episode after Kyle was 259 00:16:25,560 --> 00:16:29,400 just on the show saying 1:44 and 1:45 are no longer like fast 260 00:16:29,400 --> 00:16:32,440 times for for 1500 guys. Especially when everyone's 261 00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:35,000 running one 41142 last year. Yeah. 262 00:16:35,200 --> 00:16:39,240 Well, now they have to run sub 143 to make to, to, to qualify, 263 00:16:39,240 --> 00:16:42,440 which is, which is crazy. But I, but I think or to get the 264 00:16:42,440 --> 00:16:44,240 entry standard. And that's, that's what's most 265 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:47,440 important, right? The reality is that the whole 266 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:52,120 point of this is that people can't just in a one off race run 267 00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:57,400 the standard and, or there will be only a very, very top tier of 268 00:16:57,400 --> 00:16:58,560 athletes who are able to do that. 269 00:16:58,560 --> 00:17:03,880 And I went through and I, I looked at who during 2024 and 270 00:17:03,880 --> 00:17:07,720 2025, how many athletes would have actually hit these new 271 00:17:07,720 --> 00:17:11,520 standards. And maybe as an example on the 272 00:17:11,520 --> 00:17:14,920 men's side, and, and this is maybe what tells you how crazy 273 00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:21,240 800 has gotten is that in, let's see, men's 800 in 2024, eleven 274 00:17:21,240 --> 00:17:24,880 people hit the standard. In 2025, sixteen people ran sub 275 00:17:24,880 --> 00:17:29,120 143. And obviously the field size is 276 00:17:29,120 --> 00:17:34,480 56, but I think what you can see is, and again maybe with the 15 277 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:40,800 as well as an example, eight people ran sub 330 in 2024 and 278 00:17:40,880 --> 00:17:46,840 12 people ran sub 330 in 2025. So it's not close to the 40% 279 00:17:46,840 --> 00:17:50,320 that World Athletics are advertising as what they want to 280 00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:54,800 get to, but they are well aware that over the next 18 months, 281 00:17:55,200 --> 00:17:57,120 it's quite possible that people get faster. 282 00:17:57,320 --> 00:18:02,200 Or just look at that 3K in Shanghai, right? 283 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:06,760 There were 14 men who went under 730 in one race, right? 284 00:18:06,760 --> 00:18:09,600 And I think if you look at these distance races, you have one 285 00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:13,360 quick race and immediately you have 810 people under the 286 00:18:13,360 --> 00:18:15,200 standard. And then you have another quick 287 00:18:15,200 --> 00:18:17,880 Diamond League or another quick race and you have another 10 288 00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:20,640 people. So I think there's also a 289 00:18:20,640 --> 00:18:25,800 recognition that that is kind of the issue that you don't 290 00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:27,640 actually, it's very, very hard to control that. 291 00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:29,880 So here what they're trying to say is, look, it's going to be 292 00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:31,600 really, really hard to hit the standard. 293 00:18:32,000 --> 00:18:35,120 It means people can still hit it and the very top athletes will 294 00:18:35,120 --> 00:18:40,320 still hit it, but everyone else is going to have to try and work 295 00:18:40,320 --> 00:18:44,840 on their rankings. I don't think I'm as quick to 296 00:18:45,520 --> 00:18:49,920 ring the alarm as some people are that the United States won't 297 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:54,080 be able to field a team of three in most events. 298 00:18:55,360 --> 00:18:59,760 I kind of feel that, you know, now that this is out there, 299 00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:02,120 there's enough time for people to kind of know where they have 300 00:19:02,120 --> 00:19:05,600 to be before the US championships and they won't 301 00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:10,160 leave it to having the to chase the standard or do numbers 302 00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:15,840 crunching at USAS. But the you know, the United 303 00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:20,120 States distance running is at an all time level right now. 304 00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:24,800 And yet when you look at what the 5K standard has become 1250, 305 00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:28,440 only three American men have ever gone faster than that. 306 00:19:29,880 --> 00:19:33,160 And all three of those guys are still active and around men's 307 00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:37,200 10K2648. Only two guys have ever run that 308 00:19:37,200 --> 00:19:40,240 fast. One of them is still on the 309 00:19:40,240 --> 00:19:45,240 track women's steeple nine O 6. Only four Americans have ever 310 00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:50,080 run that fast. So the easiest way is that those 311 00:19:50,080 --> 00:19:53,880 guys, if if those active people who have achieved those times 312 00:19:53,880 --> 00:19:59,040 already are just the top three finishers at US as and they have 313 00:19:59,040 --> 00:20:01,240 run this time during the qualifying window, then that 314 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:04,040 makes it pretty straightforward. But I do think that, you know, 315 00:20:04,040 --> 00:20:05,120 we're going to be pretty important. 316 00:20:05,120 --> 00:20:08,440 Great when it comes to US, as at times when people will have to 317 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:11,320 do some live numbers crunching and they'll turn to us and be 318 00:20:11,320 --> 00:20:15,640 like, hey, like did they make the team or not? 319 00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:20,000 And it'll be fun because we've kind of, you know, made that 320 00:20:20,000 --> 00:20:21,320 you're. Going to have to fly me into 321 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:24,440 2027 USAS now just to do number crunching in the background 322 00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:26,040 right? Just to just to have the 323 00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:31,080 calculator out. I don't think AIAI has caught up 324 00:20:31,080 --> 00:20:34,840 to just sort of the, well, you know, I wouldn't put it past it 325 00:20:34,840 --> 00:20:38,200 by 2027 USAS I'm sure it'll be an app. 326 00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:42,800 Maybe we developed that, an app that allows you to just the 327 00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:44,640 World Athletics scoring calculator. 328 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:49,320 I'm I'm surprised has not been developed as an app yet, but. 329 00:20:49,360 --> 00:20:50,600 That would make it so much easier. 330 00:20:50,960 --> 00:20:52,120 Yeah. But the one thing that I was 331 00:20:52,120 --> 00:20:55,480 going to say is the people that it makes it really difficult for 332 00:20:55,640 --> 00:20:59,200 is the likes of a surprise finisher in the top three, 333 00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:01,320 right? Particularly like Collegians, 334 00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:02,880 right. We had that issue with Parker 335 00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:06,120 Wolf when he came top three and there was not anything he could 336 00:21:06,120 --> 00:21:08,880 do to to then then get to the Olympics. 337 00:21:09,120 --> 00:21:13,760 But also then the likes of Ethan Strand, James Corrigan, they've 338 00:21:13,760 --> 00:21:16,440 been, they've been these athletes that have gone out, Dan 339 00:21:16,440 --> 00:21:18,680 Mihalski, they they've gone out and they've had to run the 340 00:21:18,680 --> 00:21:21,400 standard shortly after the trials, right? 341 00:21:21,800 --> 00:21:25,800 And now if you're not in a position in the rankings like it 342 00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:28,080 is probably going to be pretty difficult, particularly if 343 00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:30,680 you're a collegiate athlete where you've probably been in 344 00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:35,400 relatively slow collegiate distance races through the 345 00:21:35,400 --> 00:21:38,840 season and you're only talking outdoor ones. 346 00:21:39,040 --> 00:21:42,720 So you'll have run conference, you'll have run regionals and 347 00:21:42,720 --> 00:21:46,040 you'll have run NCAA's all championship races and you might 348 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:48,920 have run one or two regular season races, but most of them 349 00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:51,760 don't have rabbits or or wave lights anyway either, right? 350 00:21:51,760 --> 00:21:55,160 So, and, and they're also not high category meats, which are 351 00:21:55,160 --> 00:21:57,200 going to boost your ranking. So you're not going to have fast 352 00:21:57,200 --> 00:22:00,440 times, you're not going to have placing points from from 353 00:22:00,440 --> 00:22:02,520 ranking. So your world rankings, if 354 00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:05,480 you're a collegiate athlete are not going to be great. 355 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:07,680 And that is that is fundamental issue. 356 00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:11,000 And we've seen collegiate, you know, we've seen these three one 357 00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:13,080 collegiate races. So maybe there is a little bit 358 00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:16,840 more there of a fast racing, but having one fast race actually, 359 00:22:16,840 --> 00:22:19,440 especially in the 15 and the 8 doesn't do you much good, right? 360 00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:22,600 You need to have three or four or five and you can get a couple 361 00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:24,760 of those in at at USAS potentially. 362 00:22:24,760 --> 00:22:26,360 But even then USAS might not be fast. 363 00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:28,480 So all the heats might not be fast, right? 364 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:31,280 It might be the final could be fast, but the the heats might be 365 00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:33,960 fast. So this this kind of then 366 00:22:33,960 --> 00:22:38,720 becomes an issue for those kind of surprise athletes that make 367 00:22:38,720 --> 00:22:41,440 the top three. It's a fairy tale story and we 368 00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:44,480 sort of lose a little bit of that possibility. 369 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:48,640 But I think for everyone else who's a pro athlete, I think 370 00:22:48,720 --> 00:22:52,000 those who are in contention should have a good enough 371 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:56,120 ranking. If you're a 333 guy in in the 372 00:22:56,120 --> 00:23:00,440 USA, those guys should be in on rankings. 373 00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:03,000 I would I would still expect those guys to be in in the 374 00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:06,320 rankings for the 1500 as an example. 375 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:10,840 So had these rules applied to 2025, let's take a little 376 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:14,320 another hypothetical example. And had Cooper Luckenhouse run 377 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:18,080 one second slower, right? So he would have not run 142, 378 00:23:18,440 --> 00:23:22,760 whatever it was, it would have been 143, you know, decimal 379 00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:27,760 system, a decimal. He would not have gone the 380 00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:31,600 world's right, because one, he'd been running high school meets 381 00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:34,960 all year long. And those are not worth 382 00:23:34,960 --> 00:23:37,320 anything. He would have had to have chased 383 00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:41,800 the standard couple days later to try and win 1, refined a sub 384 00:23:41,800 --> 00:23:44,600 143 race, maybe get into the next Diamond League or whatever 385 00:23:44,600 --> 00:23:49,000 it was. But his likelihood of boosting 386 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:52,360 his world ranking with enough races before the World 387 00:23:52,360 --> 00:23:55,080 Championships probably would have been really, really 388 00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:59,080 difficult to try and pull off. So it's stories like that that I 389 00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:03,600 think like it'll be important to if you're a professional runner 390 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:08,600 now, your job is to really push your agent to get you into some 391 00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:10,800 good meats and structure your season. 392 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:14,000 Don't stay healthy, Don't skip out on any opportunity that's 393 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:16,840 given to you because let's now dive into just sort of the the 394 00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:22,920 category change standards now have to be run at category C 395 00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:27,000 meets or higher. And I think if it's 5K or 10K 396 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:31,040 you can run the standard in the in a category E, right? 397 00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:36,760 A category E road race, So it's Rd. races, but yeah, not not 398 00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:41,560 for, yeah, not on the track. This shoots the NCAA system in 399 00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:47,040 the foot because not a ton of these meets are well, many times 400 00:24:47,040 --> 00:24:48,840 they're not even on the World Athletics calendar. 401 00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:53,640 And then two, they're not they're category F or D meet. 402 00:24:53,640 --> 00:25:00,520 So if you run like, for example, that Marko Langan and Liam 403 00:25:00,520 --> 00:25:06,520 Murphy race from last year in at Duke at a twilight meet, I mean, 404 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:10,600 would not count it it. And had it been, you know, under 405 00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:14,160 the standard, it would not have counted for world's qualifying 406 00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:18,840 because it was at a category F meet or whatever. 407 00:25:19,360 --> 00:25:24,680 So the other part of this is when you look at what is on the 408 00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:28,760 World Athletics calendar here in America, that is a category C 409 00:25:28,760 --> 00:25:32,240 meet, there aren't a whole lot of options out there. 410 00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:35,600 So what this is also going to do, it's it is going to force 411 00:25:35,600 --> 00:25:38,440 American athletes to have to head out to Europe. 412 00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:44,160 The Europe circuit is back now. That is, unless more meets pop 413 00:25:44,160 --> 00:25:46,680 up in the United States like sound running. 414 00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:51,800 And and I think what I will say there right is I think to get 415 00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:56,760 the bronze level status it a large part of it is about having 416 00:25:56,800 --> 00:26:00,680 prize money at certain minimum level and having a certain 417 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:02,800 number of events. And even then for bronze level 418 00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:06,160 meets, it's kind of in terms of the event like make up, it's a 419 00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:09,480 little bit more flexible. So I think in the US 420 00:26:09,480 --> 00:26:12,360 particularly, that level of prize money is not that high. 421 00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:15,640 We know that there's there's meats in the UK that I was just 422 00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:18,640 talking to a couple of people today, like meats in the UK, for 423 00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:21,160 example, that have just even tried to get like challenger 424 00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:24,880 level World Athletics status. And that has changed completely 425 00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:28,040 their incentives and the way they've had to do prize money at 426 00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:30,320 their meats, which actually has ironically made it more 427 00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:33,160 difficult to get the athletes that they kind of won at the 428 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:35,200 level of meat that they're hosting. 429 00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:40,320 So it, it's, it's very interesting, but I think in the 430 00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:44,320 US that amount of money that is required is actually not that 431 00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:47,200 much from AUS perspective. In a lot of other countries it's 432 00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:49,520 a lot more money or it feels it's, you know, relatively 433 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:52,000 speaking. But in the US that amount of 434 00:26:52,000 --> 00:26:54,680 money is I think, you know, they, they could find that. 435 00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:59,080 So I think if people want to, they can set up some category C 436 00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:01,000 meats or convert some of these meats to category C. 437 00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:04,800 The more difficult part is just actually falling within kind of 438 00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:07,720 probably some of the other rules that World Athletics have around 439 00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:10,440 these category meetings. So maybe that's that's the 440 00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:12,520 second. Part of events, diversity of 441 00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:15,000 events, like those kinds of things kind of play into factors 442 00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:19,600 sometimes from the World Athletics standpoint of choosing 443 00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:22,400 what category a certain meet is going to be. 444 00:27:23,360 --> 00:27:24,560 Yeah. I mean, if you think back to 445 00:27:24,560 --> 00:27:28,760 just sort of 2024 Paris when James Corrigan was chasing the 446 00:27:28,760 --> 00:27:33,840 standard, once the prize money, you know, was upped at that meet 447 00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:36,600 that took place at, you know, all comers meet at the 448 00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:42,160 University of Pennsylvania at Franklin Field, they upped it so 449 00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:44,880 that that way it would be a higher category meet and his 450 00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:47,920 score, he didn't wouldn't have to run as fast and his score 451 00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:49,880 would have gone higher. It would like his score would 452 00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:52,000 have been higher with a slower performance. 453 00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:55,640 In the end, didn't end up mattering because I think he hit 454 00:27:55,760 --> 00:28:01,960 hit the standard. But here's a a public plea to 455 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:07,160 all the millionaire track fans that are out there, which there 456 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:10,200 are some, you know, USA Foundation has a, you know, 457 00:28:10,200 --> 00:28:14,040 pretty good board of directors with some deep pockets that they 458 00:28:14,040 --> 00:28:16,160 want to just sort of give back to the sport. 459 00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:20,160 We just need to up the prize money on a bunch of these meets. 460 00:28:20,160 --> 00:28:24,320 And that way our athletes don't have to travel necessarily to 461 00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:29,000 Europe to chase, you know, this points and and that stuff, if we 462 00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:32,760 just elevate enough of a American circuit, which in a way 463 00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:36,760 their USATF is starting to try and take that step forward this 464 00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:40,640 time around with the USATF tour and that structure of meets in 465 00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:46,480 2026. But yeah, just a idea to float 466 00:28:46,480 --> 00:28:49,080 out there to American millionaires. 467 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:52,480 Yeah, I will. I think the other part of that 468 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:56,520 is that this kind of flags. Another issue that you've got is 469 00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:59,080 that getting entry into top level meets. 470 00:28:59,640 --> 00:29:02,720 How do you get entry? There is not a qualifying system 471 00:29:02,720 --> 00:29:04,880 to get into the higher category meets. 472 00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:07,320 It's very political. It's very political. 473 00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:09,200 Exactly. It's Who does your coach know? 474 00:29:09,200 --> 00:29:11,920 Who does your agent know? Who can you know who's 475 00:29:11,920 --> 00:29:14,040 sponsoring the meet? Is your sponsor sponsoring the 476 00:29:14,040 --> 00:29:15,360 meet? They can get you in that way. 477 00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:17,200 Did. You behave at the last time you 478 00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:19,920 were at this meet. If you're too rowdy at the after 479 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:23,320 party the year before, there's a chance you don't get invited 480 00:29:23,320 --> 00:29:24,920 the. Like, you know, if they think 481 00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:27,040 you're too demanding like that, that's often one of those things 482 00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:30,320 like if athletes say, oh, no, you complain about the hotel or 483 00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:32,240 the food or like, and then they're more like, oh, I can't 484 00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:33,920 be bothered to deal with that with that athlete. 485 00:29:33,920 --> 00:29:36,160 They're too like there could be all these kinds of things that 486 00:29:36,160 --> 00:29:39,400 that go on in the background. It's very subjective and there 487 00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:43,320 is nothing, there is nothing out there that says like, hey, we 488 00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:46,320 have to let you into this meet because you meet this sort of 489 00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:48,200 criteria. Now it's it's up to the meet 490 00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:49,800 directors themselves. Exactly. 491 00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:52,960 And sometimes you see like these gold meetings or, or diamond 492 00:29:52,960 --> 00:29:55,360 leagues and you're saying what is that athlete doing there when 493 00:29:55,360 --> 00:29:57,720 this athlete who wants to get in is sitting at home? 494 00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:03,280 And it's either because you know their agent as also an agent for 495 00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:06,560 one of the other star athletes at the meet and has said, OK, I 496 00:30:06,560 --> 00:30:09,760 will send my athlete, my star athlete to your meet if you also 497 00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:13,280 let my other athlete up and coming athlete come to your 498 00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:15,400 meet, right? Or if you don't let this other 499 00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:22,120 athlete into my race, say like, hey, I want my guy to go chase 500 00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:28,400 the 1500 world record, but I don't want this other person in 501 00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:30,960 the race. That could also happen. 502 00:30:31,440 --> 00:30:33,200 That was just a random example. I didn't say that. 503 00:30:33,360 --> 00:30:36,640 Specifically that very random, Chris, very random. 504 00:30:39,760 --> 00:30:43,360 Yeah, yeah, exactly. It's it's all very political. 505 00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:47,080 And I think and and this is the one part of the sport that if 506 00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:49,640 they're trying to drive towards professionalizing the sport, 507 00:30:49,840 --> 00:30:53,720 there needs to be a structure. And I think, you know, it has to 508 00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:55,640 be like, how do you get into a Diamond League? 509 00:30:55,720 --> 00:31:01,480 And it is very, very, you know, it's just so random at the 510 00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:04,560 moment that I think it, it can be unfair to athletes who don't 511 00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:07,360 have the right connections or who are up and coming, right. 512 00:31:08,640 --> 00:31:13,920 Yes, but then again, I also sometimes come back to the point 513 00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:18,720 of, you know, a lot of people will be very quick to point out 514 00:31:18,720 --> 00:31:26,040 like the imbalance of fairness towards the up and coming 515 00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:32,200 athlete or the athlete who Yeah. But sometimes I just think like 516 00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:35,560 the best of the best deserve like those spots in in the 517 00:31:35,560 --> 00:31:39,880 Diamond League. And honestly, like the kudos to 518 00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:43,400 World Athletics because in the past, like we viewed the Diamond 519 00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:45,760 League not necessarily as a league, but as as a premier 520 00:31:45,760 --> 00:31:48,520 circuit and a series of meets. But there hasn't been just sort 521 00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:51,120 of like the through line of knowing that all these athletes 522 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:54,240 are going to be competing at XYZ meet. 523 00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:57,600 This is definitely going to force an athlete to try and 524 00:31:57,600 --> 00:32:02,000 maybe sometimes stuff 34 Diamond League appearances in a year. 525 00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:06,040 And that's a good thing I think for how World Athletics is 526 00:32:06,040 --> 00:32:10,040 finally, I think like strong arming the system so that the 527 00:32:10,040 --> 00:32:12,800 top talent is showing up to those meets. 528 00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:16,880 When we look at just sort of like how world rankings kind of 529 00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:19,800 factor into things, it is very interesting because if you go 530 00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:24,320 out to a Category C meet and you go and run, this would be crazy 531 00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:29,240 to go out to the category C meet in San Juan Capistrano or 532 00:32:29,240 --> 00:32:33,720 whatever it is and you go blast at 12:55 K and you're a guy, 533 00:32:33,720 --> 00:32:38,240 right? Like you can earn as many points 534 00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:45,560 as going to a Diamond League and running, I don't know, 1313 or 535 00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:48,520 whatever it is. And that's just sort of like the 536 00:32:48,560 --> 00:32:50,640 the difference in how the scoring system works, where it's 537 00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:55,200 like you can go like you either are going to be forced to run 538 00:32:55,200 --> 00:33:00,600 crazy fast at a lower level meet or you will be rewarded for 539 00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:05,960 getting into a Diamond League and running, you know, not as 540 00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:08,600 fast time if you just went out and tried to time trial at a, 541 00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:12,080 you know, other meet. But the problem also sort of 542 00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:15,600 here is that all these Diamond League races are designed to be 543 00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:18,280 create fast with wave lights with Pacers. 544 00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:23,240 So I think that yeah, you'll still get more points because 545 00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:28,160 1311, who's running 13111312 nowadays in a Diamond League 5K, 546 00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:31,400 like it definitely skews more on the the faster side. 547 00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:36,360 So that's sort of where we're at right now with the the category 548 00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:42,120 shift within these 2027 rules. This episode of the CITIUS MAG 549 00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:46,440 Podcast is supported by Vellis. You know that walk back to your 550 00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:49,720 car after a long run? The one where every step feels 551 00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:53,440 like a negotiation? That's exactly the moment VELOUS 552 00:33:53,560 --> 00:33:56,720 is built for. 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Over the last, you know, decade 602 00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:59,200 or so, people flock to the Boston University track to go 603 00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:02,000 and snag their qualifying standard. 604 00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:07,680 And then basically from there, the rest of your outdoor season 605 00:37:08,120 --> 00:37:11,400 is whatever you want it to be. And you can go and train however 606 00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:13,880 much you want. You can race as little as you 607 00:37:13,880 --> 00:37:17,240 want once you get that standard. That's sort of like what we've 608 00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:21,600 seen happen in the past. But now World Athletics has 609 00:37:21,600 --> 00:37:26,720 chosen to do away with BU, not by like not certifying the track 610 00:37:26,720 --> 00:37:30,920 or like any of that stuff or making a blanket BU rule, but 611 00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:36,800 they just said no indoor times will count for events over 200 612 00:37:36,800 --> 00:37:42,360 meters for outdoor world championship qualifying. 613 00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:48,440 So that if we look at just who did that last year, a lot of 614 00:37:48,440 --> 00:37:51,600 people are guilty. You got Cole Hawker, snagged the 615 00:37:51,600 --> 00:37:55,680 standard at BU, then raced. I think what Oslo Diamond League 616 00:37:55,680 --> 00:37:59,800 didn't go so well, USA Outdoors because that's how he snagged 617 00:37:59,800 --> 00:38:04,520 the standard and then went out to the World Championships and 618 00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:07,800 won, won everything. Jimmy Gressier, the bronze 619 00:38:07,800 --> 00:38:10,480 medalist at last year's World Championships, also got his 620 00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:12,760 standard knocked out of the way at BU. 621 00:38:13,160 --> 00:38:15,480 And once they did that, they didn't necessarily have to go 622 00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:21,440 run, you know, Rome, Oslo. They didn't have to really pack 623 00:38:21,440 --> 00:38:23,360 up most of their schedule. You can focus on just sort of 624 00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:27,720 training or, you know, if you're cold, run more 1500s and five 625 00:38:27,720 --> 00:38:29,800 KS. Now, that's not going to be the 626 00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:32,680 case. So you cannot snag the standard 627 00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:37,080 at BU's track, and so people will have to instead shift their 628 00:38:37,080 --> 00:38:40,600 focus to running more 5 KS outdoors. 629 00:38:42,040 --> 00:38:45,560 You caught something in our group chat, you said, well, 630 00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:49,160 actually, did the Dempsey just become a little bit more 631 00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:53,560 important at the University of Washington 'cause that's not an 632 00:38:53,560 --> 00:38:56,840 indoor 200 meter track? Correct. 633 00:38:56,880 --> 00:39:00,840 And what it says is performances in running events conducted on 634 00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:03,600 an oversized short track. It's length is greater than 635 00:39:03,600 --> 00:39:09,520 201.2 meters or 220 yards, but no greater than 400 meters shall 636 00:39:09,520 --> 00:39:12,560 be valid and recognized as if they were achieved on a standard 637 00:39:12,560 --> 00:39:17,320 400 meter track. So yeah, the Dempsey I think is, 638 00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:21,080 is good. Yeah, Dempsey's good. 639 00:39:21,360 --> 00:39:27,240 Notre Dame is good. That is so funny because now do 640 00:39:27,240 --> 00:39:31,240 you think can? Someone say like, don't you 641 00:39:31,240 --> 00:39:35,040 think someone could like close off lane one and just get rid of 642 00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:38,800 lane one on BU on the BU track? You think they're size track? 643 00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:41,920 Well, I don't know, like I don't know. 644 00:39:41,920 --> 00:39:46,240 I mean, well, would it? Well, I mean, this is this is 645 00:39:46,240 --> 00:39:49,760 The funny thing, right? It's like, well, why wouldn't it 646 00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:52,840 like then you mate, you close the flame on, it's an extra 647 00:39:52,840 --> 00:39:56,840 whatever 2 meters or whatever it is you need to to make it over 648 00:39:56,840 --> 00:39:59,120 the the limit and then you're good. 649 00:39:59,200 --> 00:40:01,120 I don't know. I mean, I don't like turn. 650 00:40:01,120 --> 00:40:05,040 Great, you got you got some coaches now putting on tinfoil 651 00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:08,520 hats to try and, you know, come up with a conspiracy theory for 652 00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:11,200 this. I was that sounds much easier 653 00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:14,880 than my other idea, which was let's find this is I'm just plea 654 00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:16,280 pleaing to millionaires right now. 655 00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:19,760 We need another millionaire to go out and build a 201 meter 656 00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:24,120 track somewhere and put a roof over it, make it into a field 657 00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:28,760 house somewhere. And then now we've got our fast 658 00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:31,480 facility. Just replicate the the BU track, 659 00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:34,520 but make it 201 meters. I don't know. 660 00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:38,040 But yeah. So I mean, that's that's big 661 00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:42,160 because if you look at the 5K indoor all time list, I think 662 00:40:42,160 --> 00:40:47,080 every mark in the top 100 has been run at Boston University. 663 00:40:47,080 --> 00:40:51,280 So for for a while there had been rumblings that, you know, 664 00:40:52,120 --> 00:40:56,840 World Athletics was not too happy about even the top 665 00:40:56,840 --> 00:41:01,480 European athletes flocking to Boston to get this, you know, 666 00:41:01,480 --> 00:41:06,960 standard chasing done instead of going to Aleven or to any of the 667 00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:11,760 World Indoor Tour meets during the indoor season. 668 00:41:12,600 --> 00:41:13,360 Yeah, well, I think there's a lot. 669 00:41:13,360 --> 00:41:15,840 I mean, to be fair, there aren't any five KS in the indoor season 670 00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:19,640 right outside of BU and and like they're all three KS, right. 671 00:41:19,640 --> 00:41:22,360 So that's that's one thing. But the second part of it is, 672 00:41:23,440 --> 00:41:26,320 and, and I think this is where it's, it becomes really 673 00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:28,480 interesting. There are relatively few 674 00:41:28,480 --> 00:41:32,640 athletes who are capable of running, say what the standard 675 00:41:32,640 --> 00:41:36,680 is now a 1250, right, who couldn't then go and do that on 676 00:41:36,680 --> 00:41:38,880 a Diamond League at their first, first attempt, right. 677 00:41:39,240 --> 00:41:41,400 The athletes who are capable of doing that will be able to do 678 00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:44,920 that anyway. There there might be like 3 or 4 679 00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:49,680 athletes in the world who would be, oh, they ran 12:49 at BU and 680 00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:52,200 if they ran on the Diamond League, they'd run 1255, right? 681 00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:54,480 There might be 3 or 4 athletes in the world that that are in 682 00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:57,760 that kind of boat. And then once you go below that 683 00:41:57,760 --> 00:42:02,080 threshold, actually it's people that are looking to qualify for 684 00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:05,200 other stuff, right? It's whether it's NCAA's, 685 00:42:05,360 --> 00:42:08,960 whether it's European Championships, whether it's like 686 00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:13,120 other other things, right? And so it's not entirely clear 687 00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:14,280 whether it'll affect any of that. 688 00:42:14,280 --> 00:42:16,520 Like I, I mean, obviously it doesn't affect European 689 00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:20,120 Championships this year, but whether it, you know, those kind 690 00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:23,360 of selection processes will follow a similar mindset going 691 00:42:23,360 --> 00:42:26,080 forward or whether they they won't care so much, I don't 692 00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:28,840 know. And that's what we will have to 693 00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:34,000 go and see in the future, right, is do other kind of because 694 00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:37,560 otherwise actually like we have high level like club athletes 695 00:42:37,560 --> 00:42:41,560 from the UK who'll spend $1500 to go and fly out to Boston for 696 00:42:41,560 --> 00:42:44,280 a weekend to PR on that track, right? 697 00:42:44,280 --> 00:42:46,720 That's people come from all over the world, literally to Boston's 698 00:42:46,720 --> 00:42:50,360 PR, but they're not the people trying to qualify for for global 699 00:42:50,360 --> 00:42:54,600 championships. So it for us, obviously we talk 700 00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:58,080 a lot about BU in the indoor season, but actually the reality 701 00:42:58,080 --> 00:43:01,800 is that the number of athletes it impacts is actually quite 702 00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:08,280 small and especially at that top level, especially with the way 703 00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:09,480 the qualifying standards are now. 704 00:43:09,880 --> 00:43:13,920 And so I, I don't think, and, and then obviously the incentive 705 00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:16,440 is, well, OK, you might be able to run a slightly quicker time, 706 00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:18,320 it'd be you, but you don't get the placing point. 707 00:43:18,320 --> 00:43:20,520 So you might as well go and run it at a different higher 708 00:43:20,520 --> 00:43:23,400 category meet where even if you run a few seconds slower, you 709 00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:28,120 get more placing points. So that's I think the the 710 00:43:28,120 --> 00:43:31,680 equation that World Athletics is trying to encourage athletes to 711 00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:35,960 have in their heads is don't go to a meet with no crowd with no 712 00:43:36,040 --> 00:43:39,000 like prize money. Why not go to a meet with prize 713 00:43:39,000 --> 00:43:43,080 money with a crowd and try and build the sport with competitive 714 00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:49,880 races in other places. And it may not work in practical 715 00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:53,000 reality, but it will. But that's I think you can see 716 00:43:53,000 --> 00:43:55,880 the direction of their thinking. Yeah, no, it's pushing people to 717 00:43:55,880 --> 00:43:58,040 World Athletics affiliated events. 718 00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:01,200 Makes sense. Also, though, it did make for 719 00:44:01,200 --> 00:44:03,760 just a really fun Instagram graphic where the comments 720 00:44:03,760 --> 00:44:09,280 section is, you know, definitely a little sad to see this, you 721 00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:12,920 know, blanket ban on bee used track. 722 00:44:13,720 --> 00:44:16,840 But that's not the only change with indoor. 723 00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:22,600 I think we should note that World Athletics noted that 724 00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:27,520 indoor performances, it will still count towards world 725 00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:33,400 ranking and not necessarily, you know, not qualifying, not for 726 00:44:33,760 --> 00:44:36,240 hitting the standard, but it will count towards your your 727 00:44:36,240 --> 00:44:37,960 ranking like you kind of just said before. 728 00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:44,080 So that also, I guess is going to put even more importance on 729 00:44:44,080 --> 00:44:48,840 trying your best to get into the New Balance indoor Grand Prix. 730 00:44:48,920 --> 00:44:53,360 The Milrose Games leave in because those are going to be 731 00:44:53,360 --> 00:44:58,880 the highest category indoor meets where the talent is going 732 00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:05,240 to be there to run fast and also, you know the points are 733 00:45:05,240 --> 00:45:08,840 also going to be out there. So you have maximum points, 734 00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:11,880 maximum competition quality, maximum standard hitting 735 00:45:11,880 --> 00:45:15,200 opportunity, all taking or not standard hitting opportunity, 736 00:45:15,200 --> 00:45:19,240 but all of that taking place at those bigger indoor meets. 737 00:45:19,720 --> 00:45:25,400 But again, a lot of power there rests in the hands of the agents 738 00:45:25,720 --> 00:45:30,200 who control and the meet directors who control who gets 739 00:45:30,200 --> 00:45:32,560 what opportunity you know and where. 740 00:45:33,760 --> 00:45:37,200 So that is, you know, just the indoor season change. 741 00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:43,040 If you still have some Olipop left in your can pour some more 742 00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:50,480 out because Ramona is now also a loophole that has closed with 743 00:45:50,480 --> 00:45:56,680 the latest ranking shift or qualifying shift because the 744 00:45:56,680 --> 00:46:01,680 qualifying criteria here states that discus stroke performances 745 00:46:01,680 --> 00:46:05,320 for entry standards need to be achieved quote within the 746 00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:07,640 confines of a traditional athletics facility. 747 00:46:07,640 --> 00:46:12,400 End Quote. And so basically they just said 748 00:46:12,800 --> 00:46:15,400 middle finger to throw town in Ramona. 749 00:46:15,400 --> 00:46:19,840 OK, where you know, they just took advantage of so many 750 00:46:19,840 --> 00:46:24,040 favourable wind conditions to get people to hit the standard 751 00:46:24,720 --> 00:46:28,600 and now those you can still go to Ramona and throw and those 752 00:46:28,600 --> 00:46:30,880 marks will count towards your ranking. 753 00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:34,360 But if you, you need to hit the standard somewhere else. 754 00:46:35,040 --> 00:46:42,000 Of the 36 discus qualifiers in 2025, seventeen of them came 755 00:46:42,000 --> 00:46:47,520 from performances in Ramona. Eight of the top 10 on the all 756 00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:53,840 time list also set at Ramona. And 43% of the guys who hit the 757 00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:57,960 standard only did it at, at at Ramona. 758 00:46:57,960 --> 00:46:59,480 So like almost half of the the field. 759 00:47:00,600 --> 00:47:04,080 So, yeah, I mean, if you go on the Polythero's Instagram page, 760 00:47:04,080 --> 00:47:06,440 he put up a graphic and the comment section, there is a 761 00:47:06,440 --> 00:47:09,360 bunch of throwers kind of also pushing back on this. 762 00:47:09,360 --> 00:47:14,680 Because what you're doing is now you've put the burden on field 763 00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:19,680 event athletes to who are already won massively underpaid. 764 00:47:20,080 --> 00:47:24,600 And two, they don't have as many sort of resources compared to 765 00:47:24,880 --> 00:47:28,520 track athletes. Like now you're pushing them 766 00:47:28,520 --> 00:47:31,680 even to like even fewer opportunities that that are out 767 00:47:31,680 --> 00:47:35,520 there. But again, it was this a very 768 00:47:35,520 --> 00:47:38,040 similar thing sort of you could, you know, kind of hear the 769 00:47:38,040 --> 00:47:40,960 sentiments around World Athletics being like, they 770 00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:44,840 didn't necessarily love that. This is, you know, this week. 771 00:47:44,840 --> 00:47:47,600 It was. It was the BU of the throws. 772 00:47:48,680 --> 00:47:51,040 Yeah, exactly. And, and I think this this was 773 00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:54,240 fundamentally the problem that it just made it really hard to 774 00:47:54,240 --> 00:48:00,200 kind of say like a lot of the significant proportion, about 775 00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:02,720 half of those athletes couldn't throw anywhere near as far 776 00:48:02,720 --> 00:48:07,040 outside of that facility, right? They couldn't throw the standard 777 00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:10,840 outside of Ramona, which then the World Championships is not 778 00:48:10,840 --> 00:48:12,560 in Ramona. And look, you know, I can 779 00:48:12,560 --> 00:48:15,080 understand like having those opportunities for throwers is 780 00:48:15,080 --> 00:48:18,160 really good. And there's a lot of, you know, 781 00:48:18,200 --> 00:48:22,360 other factors around, you know, what what that meat does for 782 00:48:22,360 --> 00:48:24,880 throwing and it's kind of given the throws probably a lot more 783 00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:27,040 publicity. We don't talk about other random 784 00:48:27,040 --> 00:48:29,640 discus meets. The only discus meet we ever 785 00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:33,200 talk about is Ramona, right? So on this podcast as an 786 00:48:33,200 --> 00:48:37,960 example, right. So I think there is, there is 787 00:48:37,960 --> 00:48:40,720 obviously a lot, there's a lot of importance to it, but I think 788 00:48:40,720 --> 00:48:46,040 it does there is that issue right there for people who 789 00:48:46,560 --> 00:48:49,160 either weren't going to remainer, were they not able to 790 00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:51,040 go and qualify. I think it was interesting. 791 00:48:51,160 --> 00:48:54,320 So four of the five guys. So if you take the standard at 792 00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:58,520 67.20, which is being introduced to Beijing, there were five US 793 00:48:58,520 --> 00:49:01,040 throwers that exceeded it last year. 794 00:49:02,400 --> 00:49:05,640 And of those 5, only one did it elsewhere. 795 00:49:05,640 --> 00:49:07,760 Well, two did it elsewhere. One of them did it at 796 00:49:07,760 --> 00:49:10,760 uncertified meet. So only one officially did it 797 00:49:10,760 --> 00:49:14,560 outside of Ramona and the other 4 did not. 798 00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:20,480 And, and I think the point being that with the field events in 799 00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:24,640 particular, right, just because the way qualifying works for 800 00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:26,560 field events, and I think this is, this goes for all the field 801 00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:29,520 events, particularly the jumps and the throws where or sorry, 802 00:49:29,520 --> 00:49:33,800 the the horizontal jumps and the throws where you actually get 6 803 00:49:33,800 --> 00:49:37,000 attempts, 5 or 6 attempts per competition. 804 00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:41,280 And you can do multiple competitions week after week 805 00:49:43,720 --> 00:49:46,720 just because you know it. It's not the same as you know, 806 00:49:46,720 --> 00:49:51,120 people who are racing, you know, 1500 or, or a 5K or whatever 807 00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:54,520 they, you know you can't run a 5K every week for, for two 808 00:49:54,520 --> 00:49:57,000 months, right? But you can compete, you know, 809 00:49:57,000 --> 00:49:59,800 you can compete in another discus or shop for competition 810 00:49:59,800 --> 00:50:03,880 two days after your last one. So the point being you get so 811 00:50:03,880 --> 00:50:08,000 many more opportunities, you know, you got 4050 sixty 812 00:50:08,080 --> 00:50:12,200 attempts over the course of whatever to throw a standard or 813 00:50:12,440 --> 00:50:15,560 jump a standard, right, or to jump, you know, to throw your 814 00:50:15,560 --> 00:50:18,080 best. And So what tends to happen in 815 00:50:18,080 --> 00:50:20,880 those events is the world rankings are genuinely pretty 816 00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:26,440 reflective of the level of ability of each of the the 817 00:50:26,440 --> 00:50:29,920 throwers, right. So I think there I would say 818 00:50:29,920 --> 00:50:34,520 that it's not an unreasonable kind of approach to have to say, 819 00:50:34,520 --> 00:50:38,560 look, if people just go out and do 1 crazy throw in Ramona, 820 00:50:39,360 --> 00:50:42,040 that's probably not the way we want to have people qualifying 821 00:50:42,040 --> 00:50:44,640 because that maybe denies opportunities to other throwers 822 00:50:44,640 --> 00:50:49,960 who are really consistent. And it it wasn't quite, you 823 00:50:49,960 --> 00:50:51,840 know, that isn't quite the right, right thing. 824 00:50:51,920 --> 00:50:55,160 So I think there is definitely, you know, and as I say, because 825 00:50:55,160 --> 00:50:56,600 the rankings are genuinely reflective. 826 00:50:56,600 --> 00:50:58,480 And I think this is the problem in some of the other events, the 827 00:50:58,480 --> 00:51:02,120 rankings are probably a bit, a bit more difficult because if 828 00:51:02,120 --> 00:51:04,720 you have a bad 5K race, you know, you only get so many 829 00:51:04,720 --> 00:51:06,920 opportunities to run 5 KS and 10 KS. 830 00:51:06,920 --> 00:51:10,400 And you know, to their, the emphasis on rankings is a little 831 00:51:10,400 --> 00:51:12,880 bit more challenging, particularly if you're, say a 832 00:51:12,880 --> 00:51:14,600 collegiate athlete or, or whatever else. 833 00:51:14,600 --> 00:51:19,560 So I, I can kind of, but I can understand where they're coming 834 00:51:19,560 --> 00:51:22,680 from on Ramona. And as much as we had a lot of 835 00:51:22,680 --> 00:51:27,920 fun with Ramona. RIP Yeah, I let me read you some 836 00:51:27,920 --> 00:51:30,600 of the comments on the Polytheros Instagram and maybe 837 00:51:30,600 --> 00:51:33,320 you can react to them with with some additional thoughts. 838 00:51:33,320 --> 00:51:36,960 So this is from from Joe Brown. He said if this is how it's 839 00:51:36,960 --> 00:51:38,920 going to be, then they should also impose a minimum and 840 00:51:38,920 --> 00:51:42,320 maximum number of bronze level or above meets to be held in an 841 00:51:42,320 --> 00:51:45,360 area since we are at a severe disadvantage here. 842 00:51:45,440 --> 00:51:48,600 He means in the United States, for example, from my count this 843 00:51:48,600 --> 00:51:50,840 season, there are at least 20 meets in Europe. 844 00:51:50,920 --> 00:51:55,000 Bronze are higher and that that include the mensyscus in the 845 00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:59,480 United States, we have 6 or 7 and we have 6-7 if you count 846 00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:05,400 usas Yeah, I mean like kind of a problem. 847 00:52:05,520 --> 00:52:07,640 It's like those are going to need funding to be able to 848 00:52:07,640 --> 00:52:10,800 travel to some of the the of those 20 meets in in Europe. 849 00:52:12,080 --> 00:52:14,120 I don't think that necessarily World Athletics is looking to 850 00:52:14,120 --> 00:52:16,800 solve the problem of like a country having too few meets. 851 00:52:18,720 --> 00:52:21,520 It's just sort of like this is a, it's a professional sport 852 00:52:21,520 --> 00:52:22,480 GOAT. You're going to have to go out 853 00:52:22,480 --> 00:52:24,640 and go chase those opportunities. 854 00:52:24,920 --> 00:52:30,480 And and I think maybe there is a bit there of you've and maybe 855 00:52:30,480 --> 00:52:33,120 this is where, and I don't know how you can do it, but you kind 856 00:52:33,120 --> 00:52:34,400 of have to be quite clever, right? 857 00:52:34,400 --> 00:52:40,200 There are meats that take place that are, you know, like track 858 00:52:40,200 --> 00:52:41,760 Fest, right? That was, I don't know, I was 859 00:52:41,760 --> 00:52:44,480 that silver or bronze, that was a silver or bronze level meat, 860 00:52:44,560 --> 00:52:46,520 right. Obviously it didn't currently 861 00:52:46,520 --> 00:52:50,200 have any field events, but you could in theory, like you need 862 00:52:50,200 --> 00:52:53,120 whatever it is, the five grand or what do they? 863 00:52:53,440 --> 00:52:54,400 Oh, they didn't. OK, cool. 864 00:52:54,400 --> 00:52:56,600 Well, yeah, you could potentially tack on a couple of 865 00:52:56,600 --> 00:52:59,400 extra field events there, you know, for the cost of you need 866 00:52:59,400 --> 00:53:01,760 the five grand prize money or whatever it is that you need to 867 00:53:01,880 --> 00:53:04,560 to kind of the minimum level of prize money that is required. 868 00:53:04,960 --> 00:53:10,840 But there's probably a slightly lower cost threshold to tack on 869 00:53:10,840 --> 00:53:13,080 an extra field event. Now, I appreciate it may not, 870 00:53:13,120 --> 00:53:15,480 it's not as easy as that. I appreciate that there's like 871 00:53:15,480 --> 00:53:17,840 timings and meets and all the other stuff that goes on. 872 00:53:18,240 --> 00:53:21,360 But as I say, I think that's probably where you kind of have 873 00:53:21,360 --> 00:53:25,160 to look to say, look in the US there are so many meets, right? 874 00:53:25,200 --> 00:53:27,920 And there is money and appreciate there's not 875 00:53:27,920 --> 00:53:32,040 necessarily money in throws, but I think there are so many meats 876 00:53:32,040 --> 00:53:34,480 that take place in the US. So there might need to be a 877 00:53:34,480 --> 00:53:38,440 slight rejigging of how things work in the US, but there's also 878 00:53:38,440 --> 00:53:40,040 got to be a demand for the meats, right? 879 00:53:40,040 --> 00:53:42,240 And that that might be the issue, right? 880 00:53:42,240 --> 00:53:47,320 That if you've only got say, you know, 8/10/20 discus throwers in 881 00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:50,840 the US and you've got 100 discus throwers in Europe who from all 882 00:53:50,840 --> 00:53:53,800 the different European countries who are then going around this 883 00:53:53,800 --> 00:53:57,120 circuit of however many meats. And you've got 10 discus 884 00:53:57,120 --> 00:53:59,720 throwers in the US or 20 discus throwers who are going to go to 885 00:53:59,960 --> 00:54:01,560 how many meats you put on in the US. 886 00:54:01,880 --> 00:54:03,280 It is a bit of a challenge, right? 887 00:54:03,280 --> 00:54:07,360 That at that level to kind of then just have meats just for 888 00:54:07,360 --> 00:54:10,080 that, right? And that and especially because 889 00:54:10,080 --> 00:54:12,360 obviously a lot of the other discus throwers are in the US 890 00:54:12,360 --> 00:54:13,960 are in the collegiate system, right? 891 00:54:13,960 --> 00:54:17,200 So there's only then a various limited number that are sort of 892 00:54:17,200 --> 00:54:19,960 pros above that level. So I don't think there's a 893 00:54:19,960 --> 00:54:23,320 straightforward fix. And yeah, you can, you could 894 00:54:23,320 --> 00:54:26,600 probably argue the same for, well, what about other countries 895 00:54:26,840 --> 00:54:28,840 all around Asia and whatever, right? 896 00:54:28,840 --> 00:54:31,520 They probably don't have, you know, you know what I mean? 897 00:54:31,520 --> 00:54:35,080 And it's it, it's tough. It's it's it's tough. 898 00:54:35,080 --> 00:54:37,880 I think whatever you do that I don't think there's a perfect 899 00:54:37,880 --> 00:54:41,640 solution to any of these issues. And it's not an something that 900 00:54:41,640 --> 00:54:45,600 will be solved overnight. And yes, for some events is 901 00:54:45,600 --> 00:54:48,560 always going to be a struggle to get the right opportunities and 902 00:54:48,560 --> 00:54:51,000 the right meats. And it does seem a little unfair 903 00:54:51,000 --> 00:54:55,120 that, you know, this opportunity has been taken away from from 904 00:54:55,120 --> 00:54:57,560 some of the throwers who might have then been able to qualify 905 00:54:57,560 --> 00:54:59,760 for world champs. But at the same time, right, the 906 00:54:59,760 --> 00:55:04,720 reality is a maximum of three Americans can go to a World 907 00:55:04,720 --> 00:55:08,720 Championships, right? And so to throw the standard 908 00:55:09,440 --> 00:55:14,320 right, they can, you know, they can still go to Ramona and build 909 00:55:14,320 --> 00:55:18,240 a world ranking if they throw 70 meters three times in three 910 00:55:18,240 --> 00:55:19,400 different competitions in Ramona. 911 00:55:19,400 --> 00:55:22,160 Everyone's world ranking just won't be as crazy high, right? 912 00:55:22,160 --> 00:55:23,000 Like it's. They will. 913 00:55:23,000 --> 00:55:24,640 They will, yeah. They will get really good world 914 00:55:24,640 --> 00:55:27,000 ranking like out of that potentially, right. 915 00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:32,000 So I think there are ways, you know, if you're not going to be 916 00:55:32,000 --> 00:55:36,280 able to throw that standard anyway outside the stadium, then 917 00:55:36,640 --> 00:55:38,800 are you realistically going to be the kind of athlete who's in 918 00:55:38,800 --> 00:55:44,400 contention for a medal? Probably not, Probably not. 919 00:55:45,200 --> 00:55:48,840 But you know that. And and that's where kind of, 920 00:55:50,200 --> 00:55:53,680 yeah, it's it's kind of trying to create a fair system as far 921 00:55:53,680 --> 00:55:56,000 as is possible for all the athletes. 922 00:55:57,120 --> 00:56:01,360 And yeah, it's, it's not perfect, but I I can understand 923 00:56:01,360 --> 00:56:03,640 why they've done it. A couple more comments that made 924 00:56:03,640 --> 00:56:05,200 me laugh. Someone said saying this and 925 00:56:05,200 --> 00:56:08,040 then excluding the events from meets is a wild contradiction, 926 00:56:08,040 --> 00:56:10,000 'cause I guess they're referring to like the Ultimate 927 00:56:10,000 --> 00:56:14,560 Championships then. I mean, yeah, someone did make 928 00:56:14,560 --> 00:56:18,320 the point that like, you could still throw the world record at 929 00:56:18,320 --> 00:56:22,200 Ramona. It just won't count towards, you 930 00:56:22,200 --> 00:56:24,120 know, world championship qualifying, which is kind of 931 00:56:24,360 --> 00:56:26,680 nuts. And then this, this one was the 932 00:56:26,680 --> 00:56:28,760 best one. How about we only accept 933 00:56:28,760 --> 00:56:31,280 distance times without a rabbit and no pace lights, too. 934 00:56:31,280 --> 00:56:34,800 And I'm like, all right, don't tempt Mack with a good time. 935 00:56:34,800 --> 00:56:39,680 If if if Mack was in Sevco's shoes, that's what we'd we'd 936 00:56:39,680 --> 00:56:41,320 have. But no. 937 00:56:41,320 --> 00:56:42,800 Yeah. So that's as of right now. 938 00:56:43,920 --> 00:56:48,280 You know, the loophole with Ramona is closed. 939 00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:55,160 Final thought, because you know, we, we, we've, we've spent hours 940 00:56:55,160 --> 00:57:00,400 talking about the women's 10K. We got to kind of address the 941 00:57:00,400 --> 00:57:02,960 fact that they slowed it 20 seconds. 942 00:57:03,440 --> 00:57:08,400 And part of that was because last year no woman broke 3/30/20 943 00:57:09,160 --> 00:57:13,400 on the track. And I guess like that was due to 944 00:57:13,400 --> 00:57:20,080 1, you made this thing too tough to the Kenyans who did end up 945 00:57:20,080 --> 00:57:24,280 running a 10K last year, did so at altitude. 946 00:57:24,280 --> 00:57:26,840 And so those times I think were a little bit slower. 947 00:57:27,520 --> 00:57:30,680 The champion, the World Championships were are really 948 00:57:30,680 --> 00:57:32,240 hot. So they those weren't going to 949 00:57:32,240 --> 00:57:36,840 field fast times when you put everyone up really good against 950 00:57:36,840 --> 00:57:40,080 one another. So World Athletics recognized 951 00:57:40,080 --> 00:57:42,680 and it's like, hey, all right, we made this thing a little too 952 00:57:42,680 --> 00:57:44,920 complicated. People had to listen to Chris 953 00:57:44,920 --> 00:57:49,240 and Preet so much about it. Let's make it 3040 and go back 954 00:57:49,240 --> 00:57:51,440 to kind of where we were. In. 2024. 955 00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:54,560 So there's actually a second part to this and that is that 956 00:57:54,560 --> 00:57:57,000 they're also allowing Rd. times, right? 957 00:57:57,480 --> 00:58:03,480 And for the men, it's fine. They can go to any number of Rd. 958 00:58:03,480 --> 00:58:08,760 races, 10K road races, and they can try and run 2648 or run, 959 00:58:09,400 --> 00:58:14,120 run, you know, run a fast 10K, even if it's not 2648, run a 960 00:58:14,160 --> 00:58:17,160 2710 or whatever it is for the women. 961 00:58:17,880 --> 00:58:22,760 The problem is that mixed Rd. races do not count right for 5K 962 00:58:22,800 --> 00:58:24,600 and 10K. And so there is an 963 00:58:24,600 --> 00:58:28,160 acknowledgement in these standards that have been set 964 00:58:28,560 --> 00:58:32,360 that even though they've allowed, there are allowing Rd. 965 00:58:32,360 --> 00:58:38,640 times actually the women won't have have have far fewer 966 00:58:38,640 --> 00:58:42,480 opportunities to get them. So as an as an example, right on 967 00:58:42,480 --> 00:58:50,600 the track last year, 10 people got the 12:55 K standard, five 968 00:58:50,600 --> 00:58:54,880 people, five men got the 264810K standard. 969 00:58:55,640 --> 00:59:01,880 By contrast, in on the women's side, 13 women ran 1436 on the 970 00:59:01,880 --> 00:59:05,840 track, which is the new 5K standard and 10 women ran the 971 00:59:05,840 --> 00:59:08,880 3040 standard. And this is limiting it to three 972 00:59:08,880 --> 00:59:10,600 per country because obviously there's probably a bunch of 973 00:59:10,600 --> 00:59:13,240 other Kenyans and Ethiopians that ran those times that I'm 974 00:59:13,240 --> 00:59:15,720 not including in there because I have limited those two to three 975 00:59:15,720 --> 00:59:19,080 per country. But which is what obviously 976 00:59:19,080 --> 00:59:21,120 you're going to get out of the World Championships. 977 00:59:21,120 --> 00:59:27,200 So yeah, the point being that they are acknowledging that 978 00:59:27,200 --> 00:59:29,880 slight discrepancy between between the men and the women. 979 00:59:30,160 --> 00:59:33,640 And I think that's similarly well, it doesn't apply in in 980 00:59:33,640 --> 00:59:38,040 marathons. But again, I think there is also 981 00:59:38,040 --> 00:59:40,920 an acknowledgement that there is a, there is a big gap and there 982 00:59:40,920 --> 00:59:45,040 is a bit of a depth gap between the men's sort of distance like 983 00:59:45,040 --> 00:59:47,480 longer distance races and and women's longer distance races. 984 00:59:47,800 --> 00:59:50,440 And I think the biggest example of that, the best example of 985 00:59:50,440 --> 00:59:53,160 that is I will give you the women's steeplechase last year. 986 00:59:53,480 --> 00:59:56,640 So the new standard is nine O 650, right? 987 00:59:57,520 --> 01:00:01,560 Gabby Jennings ran nine O 6.7 or something. 988 01:00:02,160 --> 01:00:05,640 She just missed that standard right the next. 989 01:00:06,800 --> 01:00:09,280 The fastest person when you limit it to three per country. 990 01:00:10,040 --> 01:00:13,560 With Marwa Biziani of Tunisia, she ran 9 O1. 991 01:00:13,720 --> 01:00:16,200 There was a 5 second gap in the middle there. 992 01:00:16,400 --> 01:00:20,080 There's literally a massive golf right in that middle, middle 993 01:00:20,080 --> 01:00:25,920 section between, you know, between the top five or six 994 01:00:25,920 --> 01:00:29,400 athletes and then that you're going to see at a World 995 01:00:29,400 --> 01:00:32,480 Championships and then the next next tier of athletes behind. 996 01:00:32,520 --> 01:00:36,040 So I and and yes, we have had Europeans and we've had 997 01:00:36,040 --> 01:00:39,000 Americans running, you know, nine O 3 and stuff at the 998 01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:41,120 Olympic trials was at Falcon Steam and nine O 3. 999 01:00:41,240 --> 01:00:44,640 You know, that we've we've had women running in that in that 1000 01:00:44,640 --> 01:00:45,680 gap. I'm not saying that it's 1001 01:00:45,680 --> 01:00:48,280 impossible, but I think it just demonstrate it's just an 1002 01:00:48,280 --> 01:00:50,760 example. I think that demonstrates that 1003 01:00:50,760 --> 01:00:55,280 there is in whilst in the men's steeple literally everyone went 1004 01:00:55,280 --> 01:00:58,000 under that standard of whatever it was 815 last year, there was 1005 01:00:58,000 --> 01:01:02,360 nobody qualified on ranking. It was a very different and and 1006 01:01:02,360 --> 01:01:04,680 you know, that's why the standards reduced eight O 8, 1007 01:01:04,920 --> 01:01:09,040 which nine guys got last year when you limit it to three per 1008 01:01:09,040 --> 01:01:14,160 country. So I I think yeah, there is just 1009 01:01:14,160 --> 01:01:17,360 that you have to acknowledge that fact and and what athletics 1010 01:01:17,360 --> 01:01:21,960 credits to them have taken account of that in these in 1011 01:01:21,960 --> 01:01:25,920 setting these times. And the the thing we have to be 1012 01:01:25,920 --> 01:01:30,680 kind of clear on is, look, it's not a perfect science, right? 1013 01:01:30,680 --> 01:01:36,080 You could get one 10K race where 15 guys run 2648, right? 1014 01:01:36,080 --> 01:01:39,800 If it's the perfect day and they have the perfect rabbits and 1015 01:01:39,800 --> 01:01:43,440 whatever it is, I don't know, Jacob Kaplina runs in jump jumps 1016 01:01:43,440 --> 01:01:45,680 in and rabbits them all to to a crazy time, right? 1017 01:01:45,680 --> 01:01:51,320 I don't know. It's just like that's, that's 1018 01:01:51,320 --> 01:01:53,640 the kind of thing where you can't legislate for that. 1019 01:01:53,640 --> 01:01:57,120 And because these field sizes are relatively small, that can 1020 01:01:57,120 --> 01:02:00,160 skew the results like a couple of good Diamond League races or 1021 01:02:00,160 --> 01:02:04,080 whatever it is can, can really skew what goes on in terms of 1022 01:02:04,080 --> 01:02:07,880 their kind of filling the field with with rankings versus entry 1023 01:02:07,880 --> 01:02:09,760 standards. And if you don't happen to have 1024 01:02:09,760 --> 01:02:12,400 been in that race on the right day, like we were talking about 1025 01:02:12,400 --> 01:02:17,960 Conor Manse being in being in Boston this year, right? 1026 01:02:17,960 --> 01:02:20,320 It's like that was a magic day, right? 1027 01:02:20,360 --> 01:02:22,840 He can run Boston every year for the next 10 years. 1028 01:02:23,120 --> 01:02:25,880 And you might not get a magic day like that, right, where he 1029 01:02:25,880 --> 01:02:30,000 can run that fast in Boston. So it I think we have that with 1030 01:02:30,000 --> 01:02:33,200 our sport, that the conditions plus the confluence of the 1031 01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:37,200 athletes coming together on that day can result in some special 1032 01:02:37,200 --> 01:02:41,480 stuff which whatever World Athletics try and do with their 1033 01:02:41,480 --> 01:02:43,200 crystal ball, they're not going to be able to legislate. 1034 01:02:44,800 --> 01:02:50,880 For if you are, this is again, I think our, you know, kind of 1035 01:02:50,960 --> 01:02:57,200 reminder to the folks who will chase a 10K standard, go run 1036 01:02:57,200 --> 01:03:04,960 some Spanish cross country or go to any one of these Spain or I 1037 01:03:05,000 --> 01:03:10,240 mean, there's a couple in France Rd. races this fall and into 1038 01:03:10,240 --> 01:03:12,720 early next winter. If you're not, you know, 1039 01:03:13,000 --> 01:03:17,240 everyone kind of tends to try and snag the standard at the 10, 1040 01:03:17,560 --> 01:03:20,680 which will probably be the case next year, next March. 1041 01:03:20,920 --> 01:03:24,160 Every top US10K runner will be there. 1042 01:03:25,760 --> 01:03:30,200 But you can also delay. I'm looking at last year we had 1043 01:03:30,200 --> 01:03:34,560 23 women from various different countries, many of them Kenyan 1044 01:03:34,640 --> 01:03:44,240 and Ethiopian, run under 30-40 at a slew of 10K road races in 1045 01:03:44,240 --> 01:03:46,000 Spain. In fact, if you would have gone 1046 01:03:46,000 --> 01:03:51,360 to the Valencia 10K in January of 2025 and you would have 1047 01:03:51,360 --> 01:03:54,040 finished eighth, you would have had plenty of company. 1048 01:03:54,040 --> 01:03:57,240 You would have got, you ran 3029, you had plenty of company 1049 01:03:57,240 --> 01:04:02,320 to try and go run fast at those. So it's it's about time an 1050 01:04:02,320 --> 01:04:05,840 American heads out to to Spain to try and test those roads. 1051 01:04:06,440 --> 01:04:11,480 The 10, just as a point on that, the 10K cross country we I think 1052 01:04:11,480 --> 01:04:13,240 is gone. I can't see it in the news 1053 01:04:13,240 --> 01:04:15,040 really. Yeah, that's gone. 1054 01:04:16,120 --> 01:04:18,280 Make sure we write that up in the in the. 1055 01:04:20,080 --> 01:04:22,840 Yes, in the article, yeah. No, I can't. 1056 01:04:22,840 --> 01:04:24,400 Good riddance I. Didn't like it? 1057 01:04:25,080 --> 01:04:27,040 Well, I think, I don't think it achieved anything right. 1058 01:04:27,040 --> 01:04:31,360 There was, there was, it didn't quite, it didn't quite because I 1059 01:04:31,360 --> 01:04:33,560 think the point of it was to try and encourage more athletes to 1060 01:04:33,560 --> 01:04:36,880 go and run the the cross country tour on and like more top 1061 01:04:36,880 --> 01:04:39,120 athletes to go and run it. It didn't really achieve that. 1062 01:04:39,560 --> 01:04:42,760 And then you sometimes had athletes getting in through the 1063 01:04:42,760 --> 01:04:46,000 cross country rankings who just weren't competitive and, and 1064 01:04:46,000 --> 01:04:48,840 attract 10K. And so we didn't. 1065 01:04:48,840 --> 01:04:51,880 Although Nadia Batacluti is one of those athletes who got in via 1066 01:04:51,920 --> 01:04:54,320 the the the tag game. But I imagine if she really 1067 01:04:54,320 --> 01:04:56,640 wanted to, she could have gone and run the standard or, or or 1068 01:04:56,640 --> 01:04:59,000 whatever as well. But yeah. 1069 01:05:00,680 --> 01:05:07,120 All right, well, I can't believe we've done an hour on the 2027 1070 01:05:07,400 --> 01:05:10,800 World Championship qualifying system. 1071 01:05:11,680 --> 01:05:14,160 So I just wanted to quickly talk about the multi events because I 1072 01:05:14,160 --> 01:05:18,200 am here right now in Austria getting ready to go to get SIS 1073 01:05:18,200 --> 01:05:21,400 this weekend, which is obviously the the, the best multi events 1074 01:05:21,400 --> 01:05:24,400 meet in the world and probably my favorite meeting of the year. 1075 01:05:24,640 --> 01:05:28,600 But again, I think at Tathlon Decathlon they have increased 1076 01:05:28,600 --> 01:05:32,680 the qualifying standards only and it's actually really hard. 1077 01:05:32,680 --> 01:05:36,120 There's only like 6 heptathletes and four decathletes that got 1078 01:05:36,120 --> 01:05:41,560 the new standards last year. So it's even like out of the 24 1079 01:05:41,560 --> 01:05:46,800 person field, that's, you know, about 20% of the field getting 1080 01:05:46,800 --> 01:05:48,920 it. And with the heptathlon 1081 01:05:48,920 --> 01:05:53,080 decathlon, the world rankings are an absolute mess because 1082 01:05:53,080 --> 01:05:55,000 they can be skewed by indoor Marks. 1083 01:05:55,000 --> 01:06:01,800 And you know, it's, it's so with, with het Athlon decathlon, 1084 01:06:01,800 --> 01:06:06,200 I suspect people will be much happier with just having 1085 01:06:06,200 --> 01:06:08,880 standards which are a bit more set, a bit more reasonable level 1086 01:06:08,880 --> 01:06:11,920 because the world rankings just really skew things so much. 1087 01:06:13,240 --> 01:06:16,720 And yeah, it's so I think they're that that's probably, 1088 01:06:17,040 --> 01:06:19,720 that's probably a bit of a miss out of all of this, all of this 1089 01:06:19,720 --> 01:06:21,360 stuff. I think that that feels like the 1090 01:06:21,360 --> 01:06:24,800 biggest miss in terms of the the world rankings and trying to fix 1091 01:06:24,800 --> 01:06:28,080 stuff. All right, well, there you have 1092 01:06:28,080 --> 01:06:30,440 it. That's the big picture on the 1093 01:06:30,440 --> 01:06:34,240 2027 Beijing qualification system. 1094 01:06:35,680 --> 01:06:38,520 For the first time ever, if you want to get into the World 1095 01:06:38,520 --> 01:06:42,520 Championships via the standard, you got to run sub 10 for the 1096 01:06:43,080 --> 01:06:48,440 for the the 100. You got to break 330 if you're a 1097 01:06:48,760 --> 01:06:52,160 guy in the 1500. I mean, some of these times are 1098 01:06:52,160 --> 01:06:54,080 faster. These qualifying standards are 1099 01:06:54,080 --> 01:06:57,040 faster than performances it took to meddle at the World 1100 01:06:57,040 --> 01:06:59,320 Championships. But hey, that's part of World 1101 01:06:59,320 --> 01:07:03,520 Athletics's mission to push for 6040 World champion world 1102 01:07:03,520 --> 01:07:07,040 ranking qualifiers versus standard qualifiers. 1103 01:07:07,040 --> 01:07:13,880 So hopefully we've explained this to you in an easier way 1104 01:07:13,880 --> 01:07:17,400 than reading a qualifying document and we maybe made it a 1105 01:07:17,400 --> 01:07:23,120 little bit more fun as well. But I had this itch to talk 1106 01:07:23,120 --> 01:07:26,920 about world rankings, and I'm glad, you know, they put this 1107 01:07:26,920 --> 01:07:29,560 out there so that you and I can get into it. 1108 01:07:29,560 --> 01:07:34,000 So that does it for this bonus episode of the City of Smack 1109 01:07:34,000 --> 01:07:36,200 podcast, if you haven't already done so. 1110 01:07:36,280 --> 01:07:40,120 We chatted a lot in the last episode recapping all of the 1111 01:07:40,120 --> 01:07:44,880 action from the Xiamen Diamond League, LA Track Fest, and even 1112 01:07:44,960 --> 01:07:48,920 the even the enhanced games. Yes, and you can catch that in 1113 01:07:48,920 --> 01:07:52,720 the podcast feed as well. I will get back to doing some 1114 01:07:52,720 --> 01:07:55,880 interviews on this feed very soon. 1115 01:07:56,840 --> 01:08:00,080 Book deadline is drawing near, so that's become a little bit 1116 01:08:00,080 --> 01:08:04,080 more of a priority, but I'll get back to that very soon. 1117 01:08:04,240 --> 01:08:09,280 Preet Enjoy Gotzi's this weekend and we will catch you guys next 1118 01:08:09,280 --> 01:08:12,800 week. All right, that's a wrap on 1119 01:08:12,800 --> 01:08:15,080 today's episode. Thanks for listening, for the 1120 01:08:15,080 --> 01:08:18,040 time, the curiosity and for making this show part of your 1121 01:08:18,040 --> 01:08:21,160 routine or your run. A big thanks to our producer, 1122 01:08:21,160 --> 01:08:24,000 Jasmine Fehr and to everyone behind the scenes who helps make 1123 01:08:24,000 --> 01:08:27,160 the CITIUS MAG podcast happen. If you enjoyed today's episode, 1124 01:08:27,160 --> 01:08:30,080 a quick five star review on Apple Podcast or Spotify helps 1125 01:08:30,080 --> 01:08:33,279 people find this show and we read every single one. 1126 01:08:33,399 --> 01:08:36,479 You can find muchmoretrackandfieldcoverage@sidiousmag.com 1127 01:08:36,479 --> 01:08:38,880 and you can follow along across all of CITIUS MAG social 1128 01:08:38,880 --> 01:08:40,359 channels. We'll see you next time. 1129 01:08:40,600 --> 01:08:41,640 Thanks again for listening.