1 00:00:00,800 --> 00:00:05,120 It's most things Kenobi. We always have the high ground. 2 00:00:05,680 --> 00:00:19,840 Anakin. Hi everyone. 3 00:00:19,840 --> 00:00:23,080 Welcome to another episode of Most Things Kenobi, a podcast 4 00:00:23,080 --> 00:00:25,640 about Obi Wan Kenobi and all things Star Wars. 5 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:28,840 I'm your host, Leanne. And I'm your host, Lauren. 6 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:33,840 And before we get to this episode, we're going to read one 7 00:00:33,880 --> 00:00:36,800 of our Apple reviews because we said we'd mix it up and start 8 00:00:37,360 --> 00:00:38,960 doing things at the beginning of the episode. 9 00:00:38,960 --> 00:00:40,480 And, and this is one of those things. 10 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:48,760 Lauren has chosen 1. I have one from Mary and Chaz on 11 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:51,080 Apple. That's pretty much the only 12 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:52,600 place people can leave us reviews. 13 00:00:52,600 --> 00:00:55,240 You can leave US stars on Spotify, but you can't leave a 14 00:00:55,240 --> 00:00:56,800 review. And we have almost 100. 15 00:00:57,720 --> 00:00:59,680 I know we're doing pretty good on I know. 16 00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:03,040 We have a high rating on both. Yes, we, yeah, we do. 17 00:01:03,200 --> 00:01:05,760 I'm very proud of us and thank you for every, you know, 18 00:01:05,760 --> 00:01:08,680 everybody who's ever left a star or a review. 19 00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:10,400 We really appreciate it. We do. 20 00:01:11,400 --> 00:01:14,320 But this one is titled Fun in all capital letters. 21 00:01:14,960 --> 00:01:18,480 Yay. With an exclamation point and 22 00:01:19,000 --> 00:01:22,200 they said found your podcast through James Arnold Taylor. 23 00:01:22,200 --> 00:01:26,560 What a fun conversation. Friendly, family friendly and 24 00:01:26,560 --> 00:01:28,520 positive. Can't wait to listen to more. 25 00:01:28,960 --> 00:01:34,480 Family friendly? I don't what episode was that? 26 00:01:35,720 --> 00:01:39,280 Probably the James episode. It's like the only two episodes 27 00:01:39,280 --> 00:01:43,480 we've done where we don't swear. Well, listen, what was her name? 28 00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:44,960 He or she? What was their name? 29 00:01:45,480 --> 00:01:50,040 Mary and Chaz. Mary and Chaz, we are so sorry 30 00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:53,600 and we apologize for every episode you probably listened to 31 00:01:53,640 --> 00:01:55,720 after that that was not family friendly. 32 00:01:56,480 --> 00:01:58,920 You can always listen to our YouTube. 33 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:02,480 I bleep out the swears but it's not the same. 34 00:02:04,200 --> 00:02:07,240 Yeah, we're going to talk about passion in this episode. 35 00:02:07,240 --> 00:02:10,320 So just chalk it up to some passion, right? 36 00:02:10,919 --> 00:02:13,840 We feel a certain way about Star Wars and we are not. 37 00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:17,360 We're not going to hide it. We don't hold back. 38 00:02:17,480 --> 00:02:22,440 Just like that story that I told everyone at our our watch party 39 00:02:22,800 --> 00:02:27,800 that James saw something that we wrote about Obi Wan being hot 40 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:34,920 and I had to just look him in the eyes and admit that we think 41 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:36,640 Obi Wan is hot and we're not going to hide it. 42 00:02:36,640 --> 00:02:39,680 Not even from James Arnold Taylor and his wife. 43 00:02:40,240 --> 00:02:45,320 You know what though, He and his wife are such good friends to us 44 00:02:45,320 --> 00:02:48,520 and the show that they love us for it. 45 00:02:48,880 --> 00:02:50,560 Yes, they don't hold it against us. 46 00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:53,520 No, and we thank them for that as well. 47 00:02:53,960 --> 00:02:58,960 Yeah, bless their souls, letting us be our our weird wild selves. 48 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:01,000 That's just we have to be how we are. 49 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:03,440 That's it. There's no other person to be 50 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:06,920 besides ourselves. Thank you for Mary and Chaz. 51 00:03:07,560 --> 00:03:09,840 Yes, thank you. And if you guys, if anyone out 52 00:03:09,840 --> 00:03:13,960 there wants to leave an Apple review, preferably a +1, please 53 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:16,520 and thank you, we will read it on a future episode. 54 00:03:18,720 --> 00:03:22,360 All right, Leanne. Yes, Yes, Lauren. 55 00:03:23,480 --> 00:03:24,880 What? What are we doing today? 56 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:30,440 We're discussing the Sith code. However, we're coming at this 57 00:03:30,840 --> 00:03:34,600 from a sort of devil's advocate point of view. 58 00:03:34,600 --> 00:03:37,400 We're going to go through it as we've done in the past, but 59 00:03:37,400 --> 00:03:43,200 we're going to try and identify if the Sith actually had a point 60 00:03:44,840 --> 00:03:51,200 and it was just missed. So the follow up episode to 61 00:03:51,200 --> 00:03:54,600 today's episode. So our next episode will be us 62 00:03:54,600 --> 00:03:58,880 looking at the Jedi code line by line and seeing where they 63 00:03:58,880 --> 00:04:03,480 missed the boat. Yes, I I love this approach. 64 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:07,840 It's really, it's kind of letting us tap into our dark 65 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:10,800 side a little bit. And yeah, we don't do that a lot 66 00:04:10,800 --> 00:04:14,080 on this this show. No, it's going to feel weird, 67 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:18,560 but I think if we can come at this and the Jedi, don't forget 68 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:23,080 we are pro Jedi, we are pro Force, all of it. 69 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:25,680 So this is out of our comfort zone. 70 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:30,000 Yeah, we're going to have to come next episode to the Jedi 71 00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:33,440 Code and like question it. So it's it's going to be an 72 00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:38,560 exercise for us both and hopefully a fun listen for all 73 00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:40,680 of you out there. Yeah, I'm excited. 74 00:04:41,480 --> 00:04:48,000 Well, shall we, shall we approach this Sith Code with a 75 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:50,120 different point of view? It's all about point of view 76 00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:53,640 with Star Wars, isn't it? It is, and the thing that I 77 00:04:53,840 --> 00:04:57,320 still chuckle about is one of our very first episodes was 78 00:04:57,320 --> 00:04:59,960 talking about the Sith Code, or what it is to be a good Sith. 79 00:04:59,960 --> 00:05:04,080 And now I cannot read the Sith code without your voice in my 80 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:05,760 head on the first line. Oh. 81 00:05:06,480 --> 00:05:11,840 No. Because peace is a lie, bitch. 82 00:05:12,040 --> 00:05:14,920 Peace. Peace is a lie, bitch. 83 00:05:14,920 --> 00:05:20,840 And so we'll start there for any of you Ogs out there who have 84 00:05:20,840 --> 00:05:23,680 been listening since the beginning, that should be a a 85 00:05:23,680 --> 00:05:26,400 trip back in time for you. Yeah, seriously. 86 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:28,480 Well, let me introduce the first line then. 87 00:05:28,560 --> 00:05:32,240 Peace is a lie. There is only passion. 88 00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:37,560 How do we feel about this? On my darker days, I might 89 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:41,200 agree. Honestly, this is a very 90 00:05:41,200 --> 00:05:44,320 limiting. This is a limiting statement, 91 00:05:44,600 --> 00:05:48,520 but I too think there's some truth in it. 92 00:05:50,440 --> 00:05:52,400 This is where that difficulty comes in, right? 93 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:58,240 Yeah, it's against our nature. It is so if we look at this from 94 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:07,560 a Sith point, a Sith, A Sith's point of view, sorry, if you 95 00:06:07,560 --> 00:06:13,960 look at this from a Sith's point of view, they could technically 96 00:06:14,840 --> 00:06:16,360 wait. I have to be like pro Sith, 97 00:06:16,360 --> 00:06:19,760 don't I? I can't argue this. 98 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:21,960 I have to be pro. OK, let me try this again. 99 00:06:23,240 --> 00:06:27,400 If I look at this from a Sith's point of view, I could see where 100 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:29,400 they're coming from with like pieces of lie. 101 00:06:29,400 --> 00:06:34,880 Because honestly, the Jedi, what they're trying to do is not 102 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:38,680 working. So peace is a lie, bitch, is 103 00:06:38,680 --> 00:06:41,640 what they would come at them with, right? 104 00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:44,960 Because honestly, when did they ever succeed? 105 00:06:46,200 --> 00:06:49,360 This is really hard to do. It's really hard and I hate to 106 00:06:49,360 --> 00:06:54,640 be this negative because you know, nihilism is super popular 107 00:06:54,640 --> 00:06:59,000 right now and it's very seductive because it's easy to 108 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:04,400 be a nihilist. But that being said, from our 109 00:07:05,080 --> 00:07:09,520 planet Earth perspective, not just Star Wars, humans aren't 110 00:07:09,520 --> 00:07:15,680 super good at being peaceful. In fact this time period we live 111 00:07:15,680 --> 00:07:19,560 in, which is not a peaceful time period is the most. 112 00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:22,800 It's like the most peaceful time period in history, which is 113 00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:24,480 pretty messed up. That's crazy. 114 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:28,640 Yeah, Globally, there's not a lot of peace out there. 115 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:36,640 I think individual peace is more possible. 100% I was going to 116 00:07:36,640 --> 00:07:39,200 say that, but that is not what the Sith are here for. 117 00:07:39,280 --> 00:07:41,280 They think that's a lie because they don't live it. 118 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:48,960 Yeah. And really, I have been accused 119 00:07:48,960 --> 00:07:53,560 of being, quote, too passionate. I'm too emotional. 120 00:07:53,720 --> 00:07:58,320 I'm too all these limiting things that are false. 121 00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:02,080 If anyone's ever told you that you're too passionate, it's 122 00:08:02,080 --> 00:08:05,160 because they can't handle your passion. 123 00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:08,080 It's not your fault. It's how they deal with it. 124 00:08:08,240 --> 00:08:10,560 Yeah. That's a you problem, not a my 125 00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:11,880 problem. It really is. 126 00:08:12,400 --> 00:08:16,240 Yeah. So looking at this, there is 127 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:18,120 only passion. I can. 128 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:22,640 I can see where they're coming from because the Sith are so 129 00:08:23,280 --> 00:08:27,360 emotional, even though they claim to have control. 130 00:08:27,360 --> 00:08:30,720 We'll get to that line. They claim to have control, but 131 00:08:30,720 --> 00:08:37,320 they really, it's a it's messy. And so you can't be at peace if 132 00:08:37,320 --> 00:08:41,480 you're raging constantly. I'm thinking of you, Grievous. 133 00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:48,840 Well, and maybe they they are poking a hole in the idea that 134 00:08:48,920 --> 00:08:53,640 it's against your nature. So the Jedi are all about 135 00:08:53,640 --> 00:08:58,480 control and finding peace and like working towards peace. 136 00:08:58,520 --> 00:09:01,480 And is that going against your nature? 137 00:09:01,680 --> 00:09:04,320 Some would say for the betterment it's against your 138 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:07,000 nature, maybe to learn a higher way of living. 139 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:11,440 But maybe to the Sith, that's a bastardization of life where you 140 00:09:12,160 --> 00:09:14,560 step away from your natural self. 141 00:09:14,560 --> 00:09:19,080 You know, at our if we're not socialized at a very early age, 142 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:23,480 we'll very likely become. It kind of reminds me of like 143 00:09:23,520 --> 00:09:26,840 how dogs resource guard, you know, it's like this is mine and 144 00:09:26,840 --> 00:09:29,400 if you take it, I'll bite you kind of thing. 145 00:09:29,480 --> 00:09:33,800 Yeah. And maybe the Sith lean into 146 00:09:33,800 --> 00:09:37,360 that because that's the way we are brought into the world. 147 00:09:37,400 --> 00:09:39,880 I don't know. That's a very this is painfully 148 00:09:39,880 --> 00:09:43,120 negative for us. Look at who we're talking about. 149 00:09:45,520 --> 00:09:49,680 I would like to compliment passion because I think I don't 150 00:09:49,840 --> 00:09:53,360 consider passion a bad thing. How you use it and how it comes 151 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:56,640 across, yeah. But passion in and of itself, it 152 00:09:57,120 --> 00:09:59,200 drives people. It motivates people. 153 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:03,240 You know, if you have a passion project or your career is your 154 00:10:03,240 --> 00:10:06,720 passion or volunteering, helping people is a passion. 155 00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:11,520 That's not bad. In fact, you can find peace in 156 00:10:11,520 --> 00:10:13,840 passion, which is the ironic part. 157 00:10:14,680 --> 00:10:19,240 But yeah. You could passion is not bad. 158 00:10:19,240 --> 00:10:25,840 It's I think the association that gets it gets passion gets 159 00:10:25,840 --> 00:10:32,440 labeled as an emotional overload, you know, like you're 160 00:10:32,440 --> 00:10:37,160 reckless or and in the Sith case, they might be Anakin was 161 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:39,040 reckless. He had a lot of passion. 162 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:44,120 I do not think that Obi Wan was any less passionate than any 163 00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:46,480 other Jedi. He just controlled that shit, 164 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:51,280 which is ironic because we'll get to it, you know, later in 165 00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:53,640 the in the code. But I don't think passion is 166 00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:59,040 necessarily bad. When it doesn't say rage. 167 00:10:59,280 --> 00:11:01,360 No, it doesn't. It doesn't say anything. 168 00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:06,200 In the whole, honestly, in the whole code, there's no mention 169 00:11:06,200 --> 00:11:12,160 of anger or rage. It's just the the opposite of 170 00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:15,840 passivity is passion. Yeah. 171 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:17,200 And I don't. I like you. 172 00:11:17,440 --> 00:11:20,880 I don't think that's a bad thing, especially under most 173 00:11:20,960 --> 00:11:22,440 circumstances. I'm sure there are. 174 00:11:22,480 --> 00:11:25,200 There are when passion becomes obsession. 175 00:11:25,800 --> 00:11:28,640 Yes. Then that could maybe tip into a 176 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:31,240 dangerous area. But yeah, I agree with you. 177 00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:34,360 I don't think passion inherently is a bad thing or a negative 178 00:11:34,360 --> 00:11:37,080 thing. I also think it's very 179 00:11:37,280 --> 00:11:41,400 interesting that this is the first line of this entire code, 180 00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:48,040 because this code is a step by step how a Sith actually gains 181 00:11:48,040 --> 00:11:51,280 power and victory, right? This is the method that they 182 00:11:51,280 --> 00:11:57,320 must follow to get power, which is, yeah, the opposite of the 183 00:11:57,320 --> 00:12:00,000 Jedi code, right? It's they don't. 184 00:12:00,560 --> 00:12:05,600 It's power of self versus overwhelming power over others 185 00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:07,960 and civilizations and things. And that that was their goal. 186 00:12:07,960 --> 00:12:11,600 At least not all of the Sith. But Palpatine, you know. 187 00:12:11,800 --> 00:12:14,240 Yeah, there's a bit of hypocrisy in here too, right? 188 00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:18,200 Because right, power and and freedom, which comes up a little 189 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:20,640 later. Well, if there could only be 190 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:21,240 two. Well. 191 00:12:22,160 --> 00:12:26,480 That this is the whole. Thing, you know, like that there 192 00:12:26,480 --> 00:12:30,600 is no power and freedom when there's only two of you allowed. 193 00:12:30,600 --> 00:12:35,800 That's that's a cat and mouse game that has, you know, no 194 00:12:35,800 --> 00:12:37,800 ending but one. Yeah. 195 00:12:38,360 --> 00:12:43,280 OK, Sith, whatever. See, we can't do this without 196 00:12:43,680 --> 00:12:47,040 arguing against it as well, but. I guess. 197 00:12:47,640 --> 00:12:49,760 It's funny, like I said, this is an exercise. 198 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,280 Yeah, and like, name. Name me a happy Sith who is 199 00:12:53,280 --> 00:12:57,400 satisfied there aren't any. It's very true, it's very true. 200 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:01,280 But I can name many Jedi that were passionate that didn't get 201 00:13:01,280 --> 00:13:03,040 in the way of. Their peace. 202 00:13:03,800 --> 00:13:06,600 So this is very fun and interesting. 203 00:13:06,600 --> 00:13:09,920 I'm enjoying it. Me too, second line. 204 00:13:10,800 --> 00:13:16,480 Yes, through passion I gained strength again. 205 00:13:17,360 --> 00:13:19,960 Strength isn't inherently a negative thing. 206 00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:25,520 This is This is a strange one because it says I gain. 207 00:13:25,760 --> 00:13:31,280 In fact, the next the the three lines in succession here it says 208 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:34,560 I gain, I gain, I gain. Yeah, you're right. 209 00:13:34,560 --> 00:13:35,760 Which? Is very selfish. 210 00:13:36,480 --> 00:13:39,560 Who wants to feel helpless? Who wants to share? 211 00:13:39,760 --> 00:13:44,360 Not the Sith. They only are sharing with one 212 00:13:44,360 --> 00:13:48,200 other. And even then, just to kind of 213 00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:50,440 see if you'll turn against him in the future. 214 00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:56,320 To a test. Yeah, yeah, I could never be a 215 00:13:56,320 --> 00:13:58,160 Sith. I'm not a game player. 216 00:13:58,160 --> 00:14:00,440 This stuff would just drive me fucking crazy. 217 00:14:00,440 --> 00:14:08,000 But I could be like a sole practitioner like Ventress. 218 00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:10,840 Well, I was. I was actually considering 219 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:12,400 Ventress during this. Yeah. 220 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:16,800 She's an interesting case. How do you feel about Ventress 221 00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:18,680 when you think of of all of this? 222 00:14:19,480 --> 00:14:23,040 I feel like she deeply believed all of this to begin with 223 00:14:23,160 --> 00:14:26,760 because the Jedi had cast her out in such a like brutal way. 224 00:14:27,520 --> 00:14:33,360 But by the time Dooku betrayed her I think she was left 225 00:14:33,360 --> 00:14:35,800 somewhere in the middle where she had to make up her own 226 00:14:35,800 --> 00:14:37,720 beliefs. So she kind of piece mealed 227 00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:42,080 together the things that made sense to her but didn't, like 228 00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:46,680 stick hard and fast to the Sith code after, you know, going out 229 00:14:46,680 --> 00:14:48,120 on her own and being a bounty hunter. 230 00:14:48,120 --> 00:14:50,720 So sure, it's like Ahsoka in the Jedi code, you know? 231 00:14:50,880 --> 00:14:53,400 Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I don't know what do you? 232 00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:57,960 Think Ventress is interesting because once we got Tales of the 233 00:14:57,960 --> 00:15:01,680 Underworld or tales of whatever she was, what was her segment, I 234 00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:02,680 think. It was Underworld. 235 00:15:02,760 --> 00:15:09,760 Yeah, OK, it I felt a little bit like she had found some sort of 236 00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:14,400 peace. Yeah, but once she had let go of 237 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:17,800 the passion. Yeah, so if you work backwards 238 00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:23,560 in this code, it does an ironic thing of bringing you some kind 239 00:15:23,560 --> 00:15:24,960 of balance. But that's not what we're here 240 00:15:24,960 --> 00:15:28,120 to do. I just find passion. 241 00:15:28,560 --> 00:15:31,000 Strength could be an abuse of passion. 242 00:15:32,560 --> 00:15:37,600 Sure. Which I see in Vader, I see in 243 00:15:37,600 --> 00:15:41,760 Riva. Not that she's a true Sith, I'm 244 00:15:41,760 --> 00:15:46,520 just thinking of perhaps maybe like an abuse of the force. 245 00:15:47,600 --> 00:15:53,440 Not labeled Sith but not a Jedi, but using the force in this 246 00:15:53,440 --> 00:15:56,560 manner. She wanted strength, she wanted 247 00:15:56,560 --> 00:16:00,320 power, she wanted victory over Anakin or Vader. 248 00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:04,720 Just using her as an example. The more passionate she was, the 249 00:16:04,720 --> 00:16:10,520 more she could intimidate people and get her way and overpower 250 00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:14,000 her coworkers, if you will, the other sisters and brothers or 251 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:15,240 you know. Yeah. 252 00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:21,560 It's a depleting system though, even though it's built to get 253 00:16:21,560 --> 00:16:25,720 you more out of people and out of yourself, I think it's 254 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:29,840 depleting. Yeah, it's it feels like a 255 00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:34,800 process that calls the herd a little bit where you can start 256 00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:40,120 off passionate and then you you get strength and then the power 257 00:16:40,520 --> 00:16:43,280 comes. But I think that the thing 258 00:16:43,280 --> 00:16:45,880 that's really different from the Jedi, the Jedi believe in 259 00:16:45,880 --> 00:16:50,160 working with the Force and like letting the Force flow through 260 00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:52,400 them. And the Sith are the opposite. 261 00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:56,840 They believe in manipulating the Force and twisting the Force 262 00:16:56,840 --> 00:17:01,400 against its will to their power and their will and their 263 00:17:01,400 --> 00:17:06,760 benefit. And maybe over time, that's 264 00:17:07,599 --> 00:17:10,200 untenable. And the only one who's ever 265 00:17:10,200 --> 00:17:13,520 really been able to do it for a lifetime was Palpatine. 266 00:17:14,960 --> 00:17:20,160 Yeah, I mean, if you if you think of like the old, old the 267 00:17:20,200 --> 00:17:24,280 cyst, like the Ravens, OK, Yeah, they had a little more balance 268 00:17:24,839 --> 00:17:31,920 and they weren't so over. He was really powerful, but he 269 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:37,200 wasn't like a loose cannon, you know, You think a grievous I 270 00:17:37,360 --> 00:17:40,360 keep bringing. Him up, yeah, he is such a, he 271 00:17:40,360 --> 00:17:44,240 is a loose cannon. And honestly, Vader Vader's 272 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:46,960 barely not a loose cannon. Yeah. 273 00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:49,960 And then actually, maybe we should just talk about Dooku, 274 00:17:49,960 --> 00:17:54,240 because he would probably be the best example other than 275 00:17:54,240 --> 00:17:58,880 Palpatine, at least in the new era, not the Old Republic. 276 00:17:58,880 --> 00:18:03,640 But he, he was passionate, but he quelled it. 277 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:07,920 He harnessed his strength. He was a very good duelist. 278 00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:09,800 We've seen that. He trained. 279 00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:12,920 What's his name with the missing horn? 280 00:18:14,360 --> 00:18:17,400 Savage. Savage, he trained, he trained 281 00:18:17,680 --> 00:18:22,360 Ventress too, but he was very strong, you could argue 282 00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:26,680 extremely strong. He could, you know, harness 283 00:18:26,880 --> 00:18:29,800 Force lightning and all the other things that the Jedi don't 284 00:18:30,120 --> 00:18:34,800 practice. And if you really Rev yourself 285 00:18:34,800 --> 00:18:39,120 up, yeah, I could see. I could see becoming stronger 286 00:18:39,120 --> 00:18:40,680 through it. He's so. 287 00:18:40,680 --> 00:18:47,040 Different than Maul truly. And I guess this is more Maul 288 00:18:47,040 --> 00:18:51,440 from Clone Wars cause Maul in Phantom Menace is not like a 289 00:18:51,440 --> 00:18:55,400 raging he doesn't scream Kenobi, you know, like out in the 290 00:18:55,440 --> 00:18:58,960 desert. He's really kind of subdued in 291 00:18:59,360 --> 00:19:03,080 Phantom Menace he's when the character speaks, he has a very 292 00:19:03,080 --> 00:19:06,040 mild soft voice. He's not screaming. 293 00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:11,760 Sam brings the passion and and you can. 294 00:19:11,800 --> 00:19:16,920 Like the thing that sticks in my mind is in Clone Wars season 7 295 00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:20,080 where Maul goes into the reactor room after he breaks out of the 296 00:19:20,680 --> 00:19:23,240 Jedi vaults that the Mandalorians put him in. 297 00:19:23,400 --> 00:19:26,720 Or he doesn't break out. Ahsoka lets him out and he goes 298 00:19:26,720 --> 00:19:30,920 into the reactor room and just crushes the room with his brain 299 00:19:30,920 --> 00:19:32,960 basically. Like he reaches out and just 300 00:19:33,240 --> 00:19:37,320 collapses the reactors all by himself with no weapons at all. 301 00:19:37,920 --> 00:19:41,440 And you don't see Dooku do anything like that. 302 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:49,280 Very controlled, yeah. And it makes me wonder then, 303 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:52,200 like what the definition of passion was, because the 304 00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:56,480 strength, I feel like is kind of like what Dooku gives Savage, 305 00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:58,680 right? He's training him and he's 306 00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:03,440 giving him skills. But that real ultimate power 307 00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:06,880 over the Force, Savage never really achieved that the way 308 00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:10,480 that Maul did in particular. And. 309 00:20:11,200 --> 00:20:14,800 Just because you have strength does not mean that you have the 310 00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:18,200 rest of the fortitude. You need to actually start 311 00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:21,960 working with the force and and manipulating the force, which is 312 00:20:22,920 --> 00:20:27,640 I think is what's connected to the next line that through 313 00:20:27,640 --> 00:20:30,440 strength I gained power. Yeah, let's talk about it. 314 00:20:31,120 --> 00:20:34,560 I feel like the power is the control of the Force, not 315 00:20:34,560 --> 00:20:38,080 necessarily just riches and status. 316 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:40,800 And like, you know, City is trying to build this fucking 317 00:20:40,800 --> 00:20:44,480 insane empire that I don't know how he kept a handle on it 318 00:20:44,480 --> 00:20:49,280 'cause we've seen how governments work and it's not 319 00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:54,280 super efficient. So an empire that's 320 00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:57,000 intergalactic. I don't know how he keeps track 321 00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:02,040 of it all, but maybe he's got, you know, an app on his datapad. 322 00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:05,400 That's definitely it. Yeah, that's it. 323 00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:10,680 But yeah, that's how kind of I interpret the power. 324 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:13,320 Is that how you see the power? Do you see it more as like a 325 00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:20,040 tangible, tactile thing? I interpret the power as their 326 00:21:20,040 --> 00:21:25,280 physical strength because every time I watch someone who uses 327 00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:29,840 the Force in a dark manner, particularly a skilled, trained 328 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:35,200 and dubbed Sith, they do scare me in the fact that they're 329 00:21:35,200 --> 00:21:38,280 going to win this fight. They're going to win because 330 00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:40,760 they come at it with so much vigor. 331 00:21:41,640 --> 00:21:45,480 Unless they're fighting Obi Wan. Well, I there's a caveat here 332 00:21:45,480 --> 00:21:53,200 and I'll get to it. He's the caveat, but their 333 00:21:53,240 --> 00:21:58,160 interpretation of this is it starts with the pieces of lie 334 00:21:58,280 --> 00:22:01,240 because something has happened to each one of these Sith that 335 00:22:01,240 --> 00:22:05,720 made them fucking pissed, right? They got wronged, they got hurt, 336 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,680 something was taken from them. They want revenge. 337 00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:13,520 They all these very passionate, you know, labeled emotions that 338 00:22:13,520 --> 00:22:17,240 they're not channeling properly. They're channeling into strength 339 00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:20,160 in which in that that is then interpreted through their 340 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:23,760 physical manifestations of the Force when they're dueling or 341 00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:25,840 battling or plotting and all this stuff. 342 00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:32,680 And they just have to overwhelm their opponent with like all 343 00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:36,680 these angry tricks like, like Force light. 344 00:22:36,680 --> 00:22:41,480 Like remember when Rey got really, really pissed with Kylo 345 00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:43,760 Ren and that's when her Force lightning came out? 346 00:22:44,320 --> 00:22:46,920 I picture the strength and power like that. 347 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:52,200 She tripped over a level that she wasn't supposed to and she 348 00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:56,360 entered the realm of emotion that she quote was never 349 00:22:56,360 --> 00:22:59,200 supposed to and boom, force lightning. 350 00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:05,120 And I think it's damaging. We literally see it damage 351 00:23:05,120 --> 00:23:08,640 Palpatine from Mace right in in Revenge of the Sith. 352 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:11,880 It's damaging and bad and it drains and that's why I think 353 00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:15,760 this whole thing is a fucking joke at the end of the day. 354 00:23:16,120 --> 00:23:21,000 But I can see the point. The angrier they are, the more 355 00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:23,880 passionate they become, the more revenge they seek. 356 00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:26,440 Oh, it probably builds and builds in them. 357 00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:31,520 And then they have unlimited power, you know, like, it 358 00:23:31,520 --> 00:23:35,680 probably feels really good. So I totally get passion, 359 00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:38,720 strength, power, boom, I can overtake anybody. 360 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:43,480 How many times do we see Anakin duel freaking Dooku one-on-one 361 00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:46,800 and it was evenly matched and even kind of tipped in one way 362 00:23:46,800 --> 00:23:50,280 or another. Now OK caveat Dooku is never 363 00:23:50,280 --> 00:23:52,440 going to kill Anakin because that was never the plan. 364 00:23:53,400 --> 00:23:58,960 But Maul is fucking sloppy. He gets sloppy and that's that's 365 00:23:58,960 --> 00:24:01,080 the that's the fucking caveat with this shit. 366 00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:02,960 They get so wrapped up in their head. 367 00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:06,880 Whereas the Jedi Obi Wan is cool, calm, collected, controls 368 00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:09,080 himself and ultimately is the victor. 369 00:24:10,640 --> 00:24:12,520 Yeah. So while they may have more 370 00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:16,560 power and physical strength and all these other force tricks 371 00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:18,800 that they can use that the Jedi have locked themselves away 372 00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:21,080 from, the Jedi still come out on top. 373 00:24:21,080 --> 00:24:27,320 Because this is a lie, bitch. This is a lie, bitch. 374 00:24:27,360 --> 00:24:29,200 All of it. It's all a lie. 375 00:24:30,480 --> 00:24:37,160 I know it feels unsustainable. I think there's why there's only 376 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:39,640 two. Yeah, it's like you're a deeply 377 00:24:39,640 --> 00:24:43,320 destructive process and so you're betting against yourself 378 00:24:44,160 --> 00:24:47,800 if there's only two. And like, really? 379 00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:51,200 There's practitioners, but they're not all made equal. 380 00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:53,800 Nope. You know, and if if you're 381 00:24:53,800 --> 00:25:00,640 looking at the top 2 Sith during Clone Wars, it's Sidious and 382 00:25:00,640 --> 00:25:04,120 Dooku, and then they have minions who don't even really 383 00:25:04,120 --> 00:25:06,000 come close. Mm hmm. 384 00:25:06,360 --> 00:25:12,240 Then if you start on this path, it is it's. 385 00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:18,160 It's like a lie to get you invested so that the two at the 386 00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:20,480 top can use. You. 387 00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:23,560 Yeah, I guess that's the next line. 388 00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:28,160 Through power, I gained victory. Again, like what a seductive 389 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:30,480 thought to offer that to somebody. 390 00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:33,000 They offered it to Anakin. Palpatine did. 391 00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:37,080 Think of what you can do if you had my if you had my way, my 392 00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:39,520 power, if you came with me, If you, if you. 393 00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:41,560 You know all these seductive things, you. 394 00:25:41,640 --> 00:25:45,360 Learn things that Jedi would never even think about offering 395 00:25:45,360 --> 00:25:49,440 to you. Yeah, and if you're really 396 00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:52,640 suffering, who wouldn't feel drawn to that? 397 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:55,800 That's the thing. That's the thing. 398 00:25:56,480 --> 00:26:02,000 Because how angry was Anakin at the end of the Kenobi series 399 00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:06,120 throwing everything he had at Obi Wan, literally and 400 00:26:06,120 --> 00:26:11,440 figuratively burying Obi Wan because he was pissed and he 401 00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:13,440 wanted revenge and that's all he could think of. 402 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:17,720 And really it was the episode before, the one we just watched 403 00:26:17,720 --> 00:26:22,720 in our watch party, where Obi Wan outsmarts Vader because he's 404 00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:28,080 not blinded by this, you know, need that Vader is blinded by 405 00:26:28,600 --> 00:26:33,440 and he's able to like make his way through a problem like he 406 00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:39,040 did and outsmart Anakin because Anakin was he's like this. 407 00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:46,840 He's this this code, which is sad, but wouldn't you want that? 408 00:26:47,640 --> 00:26:50,800 And like we've said this in the past, that it feels like the 409 00:26:50,800 --> 00:26:54,560 Sith pray on people who are suffering and offer them kind of 410 00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:58,600 false hopes and bring them into the fold in order to manipulate 411 00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:02,560 them and use them up until they're not useful anymore. 412 00:27:03,520 --> 00:27:09,040 But if you're a person who is suffering and someone offers you 413 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:12,840 that you can feel strong again, that you can feel powerful 414 00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:17,800 again, that you won't be like, you'll have agency in your own 415 00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:19,280 life. Whereas the Jedi teach you the 416 00:27:19,280 --> 00:27:21,040 opposite. They teach you to let go of 417 00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:26,240 everything when you're in pain. Being told to let go of 418 00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:29,320 everything doesn't sound comforting, even though it is 419 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:33,720 probably the ultimate way to get over the pain. 420 00:27:34,160 --> 00:27:37,040 The Sith, instead, they bring that pain to the surface and 421 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:41,240 hold it there all the time and use it to fuel themselves. 422 00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:46,280 And I guess I understand why that would be appealing. 423 00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:49,320 If you're really suffering and and you know that that pain's 424 00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:51,880 going to be with you pretty much forever, you might as well use 425 00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:55,120 it to your benefit. But really you're using it to 426 00:27:55,120 --> 00:27:57,000 Sidious as benefit. Let's Right, right, right, 427 00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:58,600 right. I mean, there's all there's all 428 00:27:58,600 --> 00:28:02,160 like footnotes that we're not saying here that any good Star 429 00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:04,400 Wars fan would would understand. Yes, yeah. 430 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:10,760 I think they think that peace and control, I don't know about 431 00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:12,640 control. We'll say we'll go back to the 432 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:15,840 peace thing, because therein lies the issue or the strength 433 00:28:15,920 --> 00:28:18,520 for them. Peace is a weakness. 434 00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:21,480 And what do you want to be when you feel weak? 435 00:28:21,680 --> 00:28:26,920 You want to be stronger. And exactly like you said, if 436 00:28:26,920 --> 00:28:30,320 you look at it from Anakin's point of view and why he was 437 00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:35,320 seduced into this and why he became such a good Sith, is 438 00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:37,960 because he hurt. He hurt a lot. 439 00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:44,400 He was hurt by Ahsoka, Obi Wan, the Jedi, the Republic, all this 440 00:28:44,400 --> 00:28:47,640 stuff. And I, he wanted other people to 441 00:28:47,640 --> 00:28:51,960 feel the hurt that he felt. He wanted Obi Wan to feel. 442 00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:57,440 He said it in the Kenobi series. I want you to feel what I felt. 443 00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:02,600 And this is his all. This is like his first, possibly 444 00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:07,520 only time that he's had control to exhibit this over Obi Wan. 445 00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:09,800 When he drags him through the glass, the burning glass and 446 00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:12,560 stuff. I get, I kind of get it. 447 00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:14,880 I get it. Now I'm playing, I'm playing 448 00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:19,160 devil's advocate here, trying really hard to not sound like a 449 00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:22,960 terrible person. But when you hurt and you don't 450 00:29:22,960 --> 00:29:26,880 know how to work through it and you don't have the tools, this 451 00:29:26,880 --> 00:29:31,880 is a very inviting code. Yeah. 452 00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:36,240 And it would work for someone in that position, in that hurting 453 00:29:36,240 --> 00:29:39,320 position where they feel weak and all they want to do is win. 454 00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:42,080 Yeah, totally. It's. 455 00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:45,880 Actually kind of sad. I know it is sad. 456 00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:51,320 I mean the whole the whole idea of becoming a Sith and most 457 00:29:51,320 --> 00:29:56,880 people are suffering terribly or are are like Maul was basically 458 00:29:56,880 --> 00:30:01,520 sold into it against his will. His mother chose it for him. 459 00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:07,000 Yeah, like, almost all of them come from some really painful 460 00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:09,000 background. Even Dooku has a really sad 461 00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:14,280 childhood, Right. So, yeah, I totally agree with 462 00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:15,520 you. I think that there is. 463 00:30:16,480 --> 00:30:21,960 I can see why. And like Yoda says, it's easier. 464 00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:23,600 It is. Which of. 465 00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:29,360 I mean, that sounds so flippant because suffering as these Sith 466 00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:33,360 have suffered is not that's not easy no matter who you are. 467 00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:41,160 But yeah, I mean, Anakin's separation from his mother is 468 00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:46,880 enough to to wound that person into this. 469 00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:48,920 And and he had so much more than that. 470 00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:52,480 Like you said, it was Ahsoka and Obi Wan and the the council not 471 00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:54,920 believing him and just feeling alienated constantly. 472 00:30:55,520 --> 00:30:58,880 That's plenty to push a person into this. 473 00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:04,400 And that's not to say that people on the other side didn't 474 00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:09,120 have a rough childhood, because in real life, you know, earthly 475 00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:15,120 life, non galactic life, you can have one person from a shit 476 00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:19,800 family, shit circumstances, you know, whatever that may be to 477 00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:23,600 that person and one from completely opposite upbringing. 478 00:31:24,520 --> 00:31:29,680 And the person who came from a shit back background still has a 479 00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:33,000 choice. I could make something out of it 480 00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:39,240 and be better or continue whatever I was dealt and keep 481 00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:43,600 the keep the vadnais going. You know, not everyone who has 482 00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:47,640 suffered through something in their life chooses to be bad. 483 00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:52,480 You know, yeah, 100%. And so I really believe that I 484 00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:55,280 don't think there's a Jedi out there who also didn't have 485 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:59,640 something and out that go to our go to our taking children early 486 00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:02,480 episode from Jedi for more on that. 487 00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:06,080 But granted, they were taken before possibly anything could 488 00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:09,640 happen and raised in a closed environment, you know, but you 489 00:32:09,640 --> 00:32:13,800 can't just grow up and not have scuffles with kids and get made 490 00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:15,560 fun of. I mean, that's in any class. 491 00:32:15,560 --> 00:32:17,680 I don't care if they're Jedi or not, you know? 492 00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:20,080 What I'm saying, yeah, that's just a normal part of 493 00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:24,040 socializing. I don't mean socializing as in 494 00:32:24,040 --> 00:32:26,760 like hanging out. I mean like socialization like. 495 00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:31,280 I think there's a comic right I don't know if it's Canon, where 496 00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:34,240 Anakin gets picked on by his classmates because they're 497 00:32:34,240 --> 00:32:38,200 jealous of him and his power and doesn't he go like Obi Wan and 498 00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:39,840 say like why don't they like me or something? 499 00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:41,440 That's terrible. It's Canon, yeah. 500 00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:47,960 And then or well, Palpatine comes in and takes him out of 501 00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:50,480 the school and I don't know, they go on some like weird ass 502 00:32:50,480 --> 00:32:56,360 field trip, but yeah. And it is distinctly creating 503 00:32:56,360 --> 00:32:59,640 even more alienation for Anakin because instead of getting 504 00:32:59,640 --> 00:33:03,720 closer with the kids that he's contemporaries with, he gets 505 00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:06,480 preferential treatment from the Chancellor. 506 00:33:07,440 --> 00:33:12,360 It's just, yeah, it's it's all set up to drive a wedge between 507 00:33:12,360 --> 00:33:18,520 him and being able to integrate into the life he is trying to 508 00:33:18,520 --> 00:33:20,920 make for himself. Palpatine made it nearly 509 00:33:20,920 --> 00:33:24,040 impossible. Granted, like we've said a 510 00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:26,360 million times, Anakin ultimately had the choice. 511 00:33:26,360 --> 00:33:29,240 But he did. But I mean, it was stacked 512 00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:30,880 against him. Yeah. 513 00:33:32,120 --> 00:33:37,000 I could see where this is very attractive, all of these lines 514 00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:40,280 in the in the force, but I think the the last line is the most 515 00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:45,160 ironic. Through victory, my chains are 516 00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:50,560 broken. The force shall free me, I 517 00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:52,640 almost said. Shall set me free. 518 00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:54,640 But that was my brain like putting in. 519 00:33:54,640 --> 00:33:55,120 Words. Me too. 520 00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:57,800 My brain thought that's what it was until you read it out. 521 00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:03,920 Loud to force shall free me. This is hilarious because every 522 00:34:04,120 --> 00:34:10,360 motherfucking Sith family friendly has been has been 523 00:34:10,360 --> 00:34:14,159 chained by this code. Yeah. 524 00:34:15,199 --> 00:34:17,560 When did Vader release his chains? 525 00:34:18,360 --> 00:34:22,880 When he came to the light and followed his fucking son to the 526 00:34:22,880 --> 00:34:24,920 light side. Yeah, finally. 527 00:34:26,080 --> 00:34:29,360 He didn't even use the Force against Palpatine. 528 00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:31,639 Palpatine with the with the lightning. 529 00:34:31,639 --> 00:34:35,880 And you know, he didn't even, he just physically threw him over 530 00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:39,000 the the the ledge. He didn't do anything fancy. 531 00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:41,920 You're right, he didn't even use the force. 532 00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:45,840 I don't, I don't know how to, I don't know how to defend this. 533 00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:49,199 It's so fucking convoluted. I'm not going to. 534 00:34:49,199 --> 00:34:54,199 I'm not going to talk about it. How do you kill your master? 535 00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:58,320 How is that chains are broken? All of this is ridiculous. 536 00:34:59,800 --> 00:35:02,520 I can't contain myself. I can't be on their side. 537 00:35:03,160 --> 00:35:06,160 I know I do feel like the even though we're trying to defend 538 00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:08,360 it, it's really like a step ladder to. 539 00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:11,960 It is. To failure, it's like the 540 00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:14,200 following. These steps will ultimately like 541 00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:18,120 squeeze you so much that you don't even exist anymore. 542 00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:20,840 And you, you have this fallacy of freedom when really you're 543 00:35:20,840 --> 00:35:24,440 just enslaved to it now. I really do think that the 544 00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:30,440 choice of my chains verbiage here is is a very a specific 545 00:35:31,160 --> 00:35:35,920 analogy to use. Yeah, if you're as. 546 00:35:37,280 --> 00:35:41,080 It's implying that you have chains that you must be broken 547 00:35:41,080 --> 00:35:46,040 out of via this code. And if if the argument is that 548 00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:49,320 the Jedi, you know how. A great example is Anakin 549 00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:53,840 talking about Tarkin in the Citadel and saying that the Jedi 550 00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:56,880 don't go far enough sometimes. Yes, right. 551 00:35:57,600 --> 00:36:01,480 And if you're a Sith, you can go as far as you want, taking 552 00:36:01,480 --> 00:36:03,200 things to extreme. Very. 553 00:36:03,200 --> 00:36:07,960 Alluring, yeah, but that doesn't like, if you look at it that 554 00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:13,480 way, where like morality plays no part in your your choices and 555 00:36:13,840 --> 00:36:16,360 you can do whatever you want and use whatever methods you want. 556 00:36:16,360 --> 00:36:20,400 OK, fine, maybe that. But when we're talking about 557 00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:25,000 real freedom, you're not you. You're either a slave to your 558 00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:31,600 master, or now you've made yourself so angry and sick to 559 00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:37,480 achieve your power that you've made yourself sick enough that 560 00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:40,720 you don't even last that long. You crack under pressure or you 561 00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:43,520 you get so angry that someone gets the better of you. 562 00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:48,400 For most Sith you know, like yes there are the elite few. 563 00:36:49,080 --> 00:36:51,760 Mm hmm. The only one I I think of who 564 00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:55,040 like maybe really did have freedom was Sidious because he 565 00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:59,240 literally did whatever the fuck he wanted for generations and 566 00:36:59,240 --> 00:37:01,280 even brought himself back from the dead. 567 00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:06,880 Somehow, somehow. Somehow. 568 00:37:08,720 --> 00:37:14,440 But most of the other examples we think of, they really just 569 00:37:14,440 --> 00:37:17,400 suffered. Yes. 570 00:37:17,920 --> 00:37:21,680 Not that the Jedi didn't though. You know Obi Wan suffered 571 00:37:21,680 --> 00:37:26,720 plenty, so it'll be interesting to look at the the Jedi code 572 00:37:27,080 --> 00:37:30,800 with that in mind, knowing that plenty of Jedi still suffered 573 00:37:31,120 --> 00:37:32,760 even though they followed the code. 574 00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:36,040 Well we purposely did the Sith code first because it's in our 575 00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:40,760 natural, it's in our natural self to want to go Jedi 1st and 576 00:37:40,760 --> 00:37:42,440 then Sith. And we were like, no, we need to 577 00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:46,000 do Sith first and then come with the Jedi after we examine this 578 00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:51,120 from a certain point of view. And I really do think that this 579 00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:56,840 whole, the success of all of this has to lie in the 580 00:37:56,840 --> 00:38:02,400 individual being seduced by this feels wronged or hurt. 581 00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:06,640 And that is the weakness that the master preys upon to make 582 00:38:06,640 --> 00:38:12,520 The Apprentice. Yeah, They offer you something 583 00:38:12,640 --> 00:38:14,880 that you can't. You don't feel like you can 584 00:38:14,880 --> 00:38:17,560 offer yourself. You, you feel disempowered. 585 00:38:18,720 --> 00:38:22,640 And this is a way, it's very alluring. 586 00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:26,440 I I understand it for sure. I I do too. 587 00:38:26,440 --> 00:38:30,680 It's the kind of thing where you hope that you would never fall 588 00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:34,760 victim to someone praying on you in your weakest moment. 589 00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:39,440 You know, because people look for meaning when they're feeling 590 00:38:39,760 --> 00:38:44,040 this is that's why poetry is important and that's why people 591 00:38:44,040 --> 00:38:48,040 turn to religion when their world is destroyed because they 592 00:38:48,040 --> 00:38:51,840 need meaning. So it's kind of like a power 593 00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:55,080 vacuum where it does also leave you open to the wrong people 594 00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:59,280 coming in and maybe offering you something that if you were in 595 00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:01,840 your right mind, you wouldn't accept so. 596 00:39:02,280 --> 00:39:05,360 Yeah, yeah. The illusion is that you have 597 00:39:05,360 --> 00:39:08,920 more control this way. Yeah, because. 598 00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:11,200 In victory, you have the ultimate control. 599 00:39:12,480 --> 00:39:17,080 You, you've won, whatever that is, whatever you, you, the 600 00:39:17,080 --> 00:39:20,000 individual are searching for, you will have victory through 601 00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:24,320 these steps and then you'll be set free. 602 00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:29,520 But that's that's the irony in this is that none of none, none 603 00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:32,600 of them are free. Except for perhaps the one at 604 00:39:32,600 --> 00:39:38,080 the top. Well, and even think of say, say 605 00:39:38,080 --> 00:39:44,200 your ultimate goal is revenge. Once you have it, then what do 606 00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:46,720 you do? Work backwards. 607 00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:49,680 You need more victory, so you need more power. 608 00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:52,000 You know that's where it never ends. 609 00:39:52,280 --> 00:39:54,920 It never fucking ends. It's never enough. 610 00:39:55,640 --> 00:40:00,280 Yeah, we're just staring. At each other right now. 611 00:40:00,720 --> 00:40:02,600 Like what else is there to say? It's. 612 00:40:05,080 --> 00:40:10,120 Yeah, it's just never enough. Yeah, perhaps we should take 613 00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:12,160 that thought into the next episode. 614 00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:16,920 Yeah, I like it. When is it ever enough? 615 00:40:17,320 --> 00:40:20,880 Is does anyone reach? Yeah. 616 00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:23,560 Do the Jedi, is it ever enough for them? 617 00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:27,160 That's what I want to question next episode. 618 00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:29,760 Yeah, it's interesting. This was difficult. 619 00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:34,920 Yeah, this is hard. I think it's easier to pull 620 00:40:34,920 --> 00:40:38,800 apart something that portrays itself as good, like it. 621 00:40:39,040 --> 00:40:42,520 I think it will be easier, we'll see, to like, kind of poke holes 622 00:40:42,520 --> 00:40:45,760 in the Jedi code. It's a lot harder to find the 623 00:40:45,760 --> 00:40:49,000 good in something that you know is actually pretty bad and 624 00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:51,280 negative. We also have preconceived 625 00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:54,560 notions, we have biases because of the individuals that we know 626 00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:58,720 who use this code, who really exemplify this. 627 00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:03,880 So it's hard to justify their actions when we know how awful 628 00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:07,720 they were. If you come at it from a semi 629 00:41:07,720 --> 00:41:13,240 empathetic point of view, like in the instance of Anakin or 630 00:41:13,240 --> 00:41:18,880 Ventress who were truly wronged, there were things wrong in their 631 00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:20,760 childhood or in their upbringing. 632 00:41:21,840 --> 00:41:25,520 Where natural emotions are is human. 633 00:41:25,520 --> 00:41:30,200 It's human to feel, or should I say of that species or 634 00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:33,520 subspecies. Yeah, I just human is like a 635 00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:37,400 blanket term. Yeah, yeah, like Ventress isn't, 636 00:41:37,400 --> 00:41:41,200 but she is right. So yeah, all of that being said, 637 00:41:42,200 --> 00:41:47,640 I can understand why this would be a great thing to go into if 638 00:41:47,640 --> 00:41:50,000 the if something else isn't working. 639 00:41:50,960 --> 00:41:55,920 I feel, I feel actually a lot of empathy for all, all of them 640 00:41:56,000 --> 00:41:58,360 except for Sidious. Yeah, I know. 641 00:41:58,840 --> 00:42:02,680 Even Dooku, like I understand his disillusionment with the 642 00:42:02,680 --> 00:42:04,920 Jedi, I understand that completely. 643 00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:09,040 And I understand Ventress saying that the Jedi are awful 'cause 644 00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:17,400 she was treated pretty badly. And even Maul was taken by 645 00:42:18,320 --> 00:42:21,560 Sidious youngling. He didn't really have any choice 646 00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:22,640 in it. Savage oppress. 647 00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:26,120 Same thing in a fight to the death and kill his own brother 648 00:42:26,120 --> 00:42:28,320 just to be forced into this enslaved position. 649 00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:30,440 I feel compassion. I do. 650 00:42:30,440 --> 00:42:32,600 Yeah. Sidious, I it's hard. 651 00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:34,480 I don't know what to feel sorry for. 652 00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:40,320 Maybe maybe that he'll get his own episode. 653 00:42:43,400 --> 00:42:45,720 We've never done an episode on Sidious, actually. 654 00:42:46,280 --> 00:42:51,120 We haven't and I don't really know that much about his his 655 00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:53,280 back story, so it'd be interesting to do. 656 00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:57,000 But yes, this is this is challenging and this was 657 00:42:57,000 --> 00:43:00,080 difficult but interesting. Very. 658 00:43:00,480 --> 00:43:04,640 Yeah, Looking at it from the other side is I guess we, I 659 00:43:04,640 --> 00:43:09,000 guess what this boils down to is perhaps you and I really are on 660 00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:11,600 the light side after all. We can't help it. 661 00:43:11,600 --> 00:43:14,400 It's just I can't buy into this bullshit. 662 00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:22,720 This is a lie, bitch. There the end. 663 00:43:29,240 --> 00:43:33,000 All right, join us back Next time we are going to dissect the 664 00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:36,880 Jedi code and we're going to try and poke holes in it. 665 00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:42,040 I don't know how well we'll do since we were not able to really 666 00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:45,560 be into the Sith code. Maybe we can poke holes in the 667 00:43:45,560 --> 00:43:48,560 Jedi code, I don't know. But join us back next time and 668 00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:50,600 we will have a lively chat about that. 669 00:43:53,680 --> 00:43:58,240 Speaking of Lively chats, our hallways episode, people liked 670 00:43:58,240 --> 00:44:00,080 it. He did. 671 00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:04,840 In fact, the comment that I would like to share on this 672 00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:08,400 episode is about the hallway episode My Mom. 673 00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:12,400 Loved. It she loves, she thought it was 674 00:44:12,400 --> 00:44:16,840 hilarious and then the outro with you saying hallways. 675 00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:19,080 She's she said she listened to it three times. 676 00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:20,680 Now. This is this is a verbal comment 677 00:44:20,680 --> 00:44:24,200 I got from her on the phone. She's like, I listen to Lauren 678 00:44:24,200 --> 00:44:26,360 try and get that out like 3 or 4 times. 679 00:44:26,360 --> 00:44:30,160 It made me laugh every you can tell she doesn't want to say it, 680 00:44:30,160 --> 00:44:32,280 but she does. And I'm like, yes, that was, 681 00:44:32,400 --> 00:44:36,080 that's the fun part. And of course, if you're a 682 00:44:36,080 --> 00:44:40,280 patron, you can hear the mess that happened that was edited 683 00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:43,120 out because we do the behind the scenes stuff over on Patreon. 684 00:44:43,120 --> 00:44:46,120 But yeah. Yeah, it was even more. 685 00:44:46,120 --> 00:44:48,360 It was more, much more than what was in. 686 00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:52,240 Well, my mom loved it. She adores you. 687 00:44:52,720 --> 00:44:56,240 She loves this podcast, even if she doesn't understand 3/4 of it 688 00:44:56,240 --> 00:44:57,800 what we're talking about. But she loves it. 689 00:44:57,920 --> 00:45:00,760 So, well, thanks. We love you, Jeeta. 690 00:45:01,040 --> 00:45:06,520 We love you Mom, and we love all of our listeners and thank you 691 00:45:06,520 --> 00:45:09,800 so much for joining us here on the Most Things Kenobi podcast. 692 00:45:09,880 --> 00:45:12,520 If you would like to support the podcast by becoming a patron, 693 00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:14,920 head over to the Most Things Kenobi Patreon. 694 00:45:15,320 --> 00:45:18,640 You can also interact with us on our social media platforms, 695 00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:21,040 Tumblr, Instagram, YouTube, and Threads. 696 00:45:21,480 --> 00:45:24,280 And don't forget to subscribe on your favorite podcast player. 697 00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:28,320 If you enjoy our podcast, feel free to rate US on Spotify and 698 00:45:28,320 --> 00:45:30,760 Apple. And if you need just one place 699 00:45:30,760 --> 00:45:32,840 to find all these, head over to our website, 700 00:45:32,920 --> 00:45:38,120 mostthingskenobi.com. So until next time Myspace win, 701 00:45:38,840 --> 00:45:43,760 may the force be with you. Always, always.