You're you're, you've got this cool.
Like what is that called? Your tonal.
Is that right? I guess that's.
Tonal. I don't know man.
Tonal with a touch of Wes Anderson, have you?
Seen the tonal workout thing? The home exercise thing.
Tonal like get your body into you've seen it.
No, I want to know what you. Think of that.
OK, what should we begin? We.
I think we began.
This is Jason Schwartzman. I'm I'm Jason.
This is Adrian Brody. And we're here.
I'm Adrian Brody, and we're here on.
A 24. On the A 24 podcast, which I
might add is quite ingenious. Yeah, it is.
As you are in an A 24 film. Yeah.
And I just happened to be in a How crazy film.
I know. And you're wonderful.
Well, come on, let's well.
You were unrecognizable at 1st and then.
Yeah, well. I loved, I loved that I loved
seeing you. You were so free and you
revelled in that freedom. And it's a funny thing and I've
seen you in lots of work and, but obviously we've worked
together with Wes so many times and I love the specificity of,
of Wes's work and what it brings out in, in language and
mannerisms, etcetera. And it was so nice seeing you in
this other landscape, so to speak, right.
And I loved it. I really loved it how at ease
you were and it was great. So I just, I got a kick out of
it primarily because most of our interactions are working
together with Wes and, and and that even off camera dictates a
certain kind of rhythm in all of us because we're we're in this
kind of universe and you were in this entirely different.
That's so interesting space. And I got to watch you from a
new perspective as an as, as a great actor and doing your work
completely, you know, free of any of that.
And and I thought it was really special and I wanted to share
that with you anyway, even if we weren't doing that's a podcast
together, but I did, I do. Think that is so kind of you to
I mean, and I mean I feel like I just saw your film last night
and it was such an interesting feeling watching this movie
because I'm sitting there going like I I felt so much love and
curiosity and mystery about this person.
I've never seen anything like I mean your performance that it is
next level. Like to me.
It's like, I feel like it's the kind of thing that you see
people do like when they have like a really incredible like
game where they go like he hit 10 RBIs.
He, he made history that night, You know what I mean?
Where someone does like a where they get into a flow.
So a lot of flow and you know. It's like I don't know how to
how? You don't have, I mean, I, and I
hope I'm not being industry, but you wrote me the most beautiful
note like ever yesterday after the screening and I, I just was,
I was really moved. By that oh man, I've.
Been moved by that and yeah. It was funny.
I was on my on the way home, I was like in a car and sadly
there seemed to be an accident on the freeway and so everything
was at a dead standstill. So I just was sit like sitting
in this contemplating car that wasn't moving for a long time,
just looking out the window just like thinking of second
intermission. It was like truly like it was
like a yeah. And it was like it was kind of
an amazing thing to have the this moment after the movie by
myself in this vehicle looking out, just thinking.
And, and I mean, I have so many things that I would want to ask
you about and so many things I'm just so curious about and music
and just. Everything that you want to talk
about, we could talk about the film a bit.
And I'm happy to. I'd love to.
And I love, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm really, yeah.
Grateful you were there last night.
Oh my God, I man, I just, you know, I'm just so I'm, I'm just
blown away by it and I'm, I'm, I really don't.
I wish I had a thesaurus at times like this, but you know, I
I love this. What I love about the movie too,
is not to I don't want to make it uncomfortable like the big
before the movie starts, you know, this something has
happened. So just, you know, and then when
the movie begins, he's beginning this new life and he's having
setbacks, but things are going well.
Like things are moving along and you know that something's going
to. I mean, I felt this at the
intermission. I felt this terrible feeling,
yes. And I just thought it was so
amazing how it was structured that way because I really felt
like, oh boy, like, you know what I mean?
And I was like, OK, this almost at the beginning of the movie is
like the whole first part of it. I'm like sandwiched between the
past, which I haven't seen, and the future, which I don't know
what's about to happen yet. And so I was like, stuck in this
thing. And I was like just sitting
there. Everyone got up, you know, they
all go. I'm just like, sitting there.
Like Holy I. Find it the same way I can't
get. Up, I couldn't move.
I was, yeah, I was like, and I was just sitting there going
like, what is going to happen now?
I mean, and, and anything could happen now.
And I was just, I just thought it was so beautiful.
And I thought also what's fascinating not to ruin thing.
I mean, is it OK if I talk about the?
End you can talk about. Anything is at the end of the
movie, the speech that your granny grandniece makes.
You learn so much more about your character at the very, very
end. And I even thought I thought
that was an incredible thing too.
Like we've gone the whole movie with you and learned so much.
And then fine. And then she makes this speech
at the end and it's like one last thing that you and you're
like, wow. And they look at the look on
your face when you're sitting there and it's like, Oh my God.
And, and, and the other thing that I thought was so crazy was
imagine if you were really at one of these, at someone's
retrospective like that. That's just one, that's just one
building in their life. And you think about all that and
you think about when you walk through all these artists, a
retrospective of any artist, each of these.
And, and there must be one of those stories.
Yeah. I think it speaks to what we all
yearn for as our artistic people and is to at the end, the end of
that road of this journey of pursuing creative endeavours,
what is left behind and that and and what that what we're what
we're sharing and what what how those works speak to one another
and and how they open conversation.
And I know like my mother, who's such an influence, of course,
for me, as you know. And tell her, I said.
Yeah, well, she's, she's the, I just told her I was coming to do
this. She thought she says hi too.
She's never one, but she, she's just such an inspiration.
But she, she's spent her whole life to kind of work towards,
towards her work and leaving behind something.
And, and I, I really relate to that and also the fact that she
to, to play Laszlo and to reference my grandfather and his
journey as a Hungarian immigrant fleeing war in Hungary in 1956
and being a refugee and having language being an obstacle in
his new life and starting again in America and all of that.
I, I just was so, so moving to unearth the past, the past
within context to my own life and my own journey as an artist
and my own good fortune to have been born an American, to be an
American actor and not facing, you know, I could have been
Hungarian, I could have been born in Hungary and working on
an, my accent so that I can hopefully come to America and
get a role that it's just so hard.
It's so hard for, for people with that additional burden.
And I really understand that and respect that and wanted to help
tell that aspect of this story. So I think it's very relatable
you. Felt that I felt that in the
movie and all these scenes Peter Piper when you're constantly
working I there was something about this character I can't
describe, but it's like it was like a funny scene, huh.
It's a funny scene. Isn't it great?
And just like or he's saying like, what is the other stuff?
Like I will like he's saying we will or he says it's with AW and
he repeats it like over and over.
And I, I just love, I love it because this person is.
They always inverted it. My grandparents always and my
mother still does. They can't.
It's always the West and the V They're opposite.
It's always. Yeah, it's amazing.
So it's so familiar to me. I know it's.
It's just, it's just beautiful. And I also what I also just
said, just keep going. But what I said, I was sitting
next to people I didn't know. I didn't people I didn't know at
the movie. I didn't know who I was sitting
next to last night. But I just like it.
When it was over, I just was like, here, I'm just going to
tell you everything, I think. And I sort of was like, I love
this character because he's so strong and and I trust this guy
so much. And yet it was like like a pond
with like a thin layer of ice like he could, he would break.
So he broke quickly, which was so amazing and so shocking to
see and I couldn't imagine. I was wondering like just on a
technical levels, watching it going like this scene is crazy.
Like they haven't cut. They've done this whole thing
and now look where we are. I mean all in one and I'm
watching it and it's like you see this character one thing and
then it's like when they pour the water over the marble,
that's your character. I mean that's like and I'm just
like there, you would just break in a moment and I and it was
just so beautiful and and and it really was like I really hadn't
experienced that in a long time where it was like where it
really was like watching. I felt like sports, like I
didn't know what was going to happen.
And I also just love, by the way, in the movie you, there's
so much of that the director captain of people walking to
where they're going, because I feel like in so many movies,
people just cut they just cut to they go like, let's do it and
they're just but I love like these long.
I know what you mean. And this process of getting
everywhere, I loved seeing it because it, that's what this to
me, that's the story was everyone getting somewhere, you
know, And it was just like I, I loved those moments just
following when there was no talking, you know, and we're
just walking from one room to another to another to another.
It was just like really, it was refreshing to to see that and,
and, and, and just beautiful. And it's funny because did you
have a lot of ephemera and stuff or relics or archives of your
life of your grandparents? I have deep, deep memories and
we have some stuff I actually have which is fascinating.
And I don't know why he did it, but I remember, you know, he had
this old, remember those old rectangular tape recorder with
the cassette. Of course with the.
Push the red button to get into record mode.
Really chunky, nice. There was a very practical,
everyone had that. That's how you would record
something and built in my and I, my mother has a recording.
I don't know if she recorded it or my grandfather had recorded
it, but I remember him trying to get work and he aspired to be an
actor too. And but he was trying to get
work and he would, he had a recording of this.
And I've heard this recording and he sounds very much, even
even more extreme than Laszlo's accent.
But, and he would introduce himself and Plachy, my mother's
maiden name is Plachy. And he would say Plachy and say
it again. And I would like to apply for
the job. And what he and you could hear
the pause on the other end of the line.
And he would. Yes.
Oh, OK. Thank you.
And you could hear the rejection
and he'd call again someone else.
And I really remember what a struggle it was to go from.
He was a very charismatic man. He was very, very handsome.
And he was very, you know, he, he had a quite a life there to
go from that the hardships that they endure, the, the, the
there's so many details that are very personal that aren't really
just for public consumption, but are extremely vivid still.
And he passed away when I was, I think I was 7, you know, and I
remember he was there teaching me how to ride a bike.
I remember I, my dad taught me, but I remember when the training
wheels were just off and we were on my block that I grew up in
Queens and he was there. And I remember him saying,
anyway, I, it's, it's very interesting.
It's very interesting. And that stuck with me and many
stories. But we were such a close family.
My mom is an only child. I'm an only child.
So my grandparents were were it from the old world.
And it was so maybe because they sounded so distinctly different,
it struck me even more than anybody else.
They just nobody sounded like them.
Nobody was Hungarian, so and so to be able to have that as a
kind of guiding light in this, it's, it's really special and,
and to represent that because I feel like that is such a
universal thing. There's so many people from
whatever background, we are your family, you know, my family,
we're all the descendants of immigrants.
And there's been a lot of struggle.
No matter how you cut it, no matter who it is, there's a lot
of sacrifice. And it's an old, it's another
world and, and, and it is another world again.
So anyway, tell me that's why I was.
So much more killer, by the way, when she says Felicity says this
place is rotten, Yeah, that really broke my heart when she
said. Well, the disconnect between the
American Dream and and the hopes and dreams of people coming here
and to see to destruct the forces of greed and capitalist,
you know that extreme capitalist greed is like very hard.
I know what you mean too because my my grandparents on my dad's
side were from Warsaw and so they had like thick Polish
accents. My dad's side is also from
Poland. I don't know.
Don't know specifically if they were in Warsaw, but yeah.
And so I like that accent. It's like this, this Polish
accent and growing up in their house and they played Scrabble
every night. That's how they kind of learned.
And I remember the dictionary was such an important thing in
their house, the English, a huge dictionary.
And I remember as a little kid, I didn't know a word and then my
grandfather said, look it up. And like we went over and it was
like a little magnifying glass and you and it was like, you
have the power to look up these things in this book.
This is language and this is English and this is this.
And it was like, I remember at a very young age, like four or
five, like going to this giant dictionary with my Polish
grandfather and just, you know, the importance of, of words and,
and, and how it's there for you to to learn.
And it's there and I that. Just reminded me of the scene
where Laszlo was presenting to the town the the model.
Yeah, I added when I asked Gordon, my friend for the
flashlight, the torch, I added what, what is the can you pass
me the what, what is the, the, the torch?
Because my grandfather, I added that I love that my grandfather
would have a hard time remembering the English word for
things. And he would say, what is that?
What is the word for the yes, what is that?
That and I, I. Love that to honor.
That's crazy. Because it came to me because
they were calling a torch I I changed it to torch.
I think it was originally, I'm not sure, but I believe it was a
flashlight written and torch. It was that even just that
little line. It was like, I remember that
scene and then you take it and you said and I was like, that
felt so I just felt so I mean so real to me.
It was it was crazy. I to say that I had no know you,
but then also really to be like, man, I really don't.
This is a whole other person and by the way, this character.
I felt that about your performance, but this?
Guy's also so funny. I love how funny your character
is too. He has a his ability to like
laugh and make jokes and understand the moment or when to
leave a room. Like when he's getting yelled at
the beginning, like he's like, let's go.
Like I love his. He's just, he's got like a, he
like his skill, he's got this amazing like.
There's an awareness. Awareness.
Well, yeah, it's. Very it's a lot of experience,
right? You've lived in and yes, and,
and has seen it a lot and that I think gives you perspective to
say I'm I'm not going to get into it, but I'm not going to
take it. I'll see you later and.
Yeah, I love. There's a part to a fucking love
so much when you go, when you're walking with the sun and he kind
of infers something about your niece and you look at him in
your eyes do not. And he's looking all around and
you're like this and he's like staring at him.
And I thought, this is amazing because he's like, I don't give
a fuck. Who you are?
Lose this whole project. Yeah, now burn it all.
Down. You don't.
Yeah, yeah. And I was just like.
The I relate to that, yeah. No, but I just.
But I loved it because I loved the idea that at the end of
this, this is a decent man you know, but who's also met.
Very complicated, yes. Totally.
You know what I mean? And so it's just like, I was
just really, it was, it was moving.
And he's an artist. Yeah, So Speaking of flaws, tell
me about this, this Joe, and how this came about and how, how
specific all these nuances that you were doing and how, what did
Luca push? I love his work.
He's such a wonderful, sensitive
filmmaker. I really love what he does.
And I've spoken to him, not had the privilege of working with
him, but I, I. I shared.
With him, I, I know I would, I would love to work with him, but
I think. You would love it because I
could you. He, I met him through Tilda and
but he's just, he's just really special.
I think the way he communicates his ideas, I think maybe also
because, you know, you're also just he's, he's Italian and, and
the way he speaks is sort of like in a poetic, I don't know.
I, I really like it. I really like, I like the way
that he's sort of getting to what he's trying to say.
Like I remember one day, he said.
Like can you enter the scene and go look and it sounds.
Like a W you. Know.
But it was. But I got it.
But I got it like I was like, like this, like a little.
And I, and I was just like, got it.
Like, I mean, I hope I got it, but no.
So he, he called me and he's, he told me that he, he had read
this book when he was a teenager and it was a very important book
to him. And then he had this ability to,
to make it. And when I play this character,
Joe, who's who's at this bar and he said it, you know, we would
want to do lots of prosthetics on you.
Like, it was fun. I mean, it was amazing.
I didn't know it was that at first.
I was like, I hadn't seen you in a while.
I was like, yo, you went in. I was like Jason.
I was like, what? Why this at first I had this
fear like people were going to be like doesn't look any
different, but I get out of here.
But it was I had never done just prosthetics before.
Like, you know, it's like 4 or five hours.
This guy Jason Hammer, and holy cajolis, by the way.
Yeah, I was a side note. I was thinking about your mom
and I was thinking because I love Andre Kurtesh.
I mean, I grew up going to this growing, going up to his
apartment. He mentored her.
So on my I could look up when it was at the LACMA, but 15 years
ago or something, there was like a huge retrospective of his on
my birthday. It was my birthday that day.
And you know, I was having a weird day, didn't want to be
around anybody, whatever. I just drove to the, to the
Lochman Park, went in and there was a huge retrospect.
I'd never seen his stuff. I stayed hours and bought every
book and his he has one photograph that to me is like my
favorite photograph of these people in the rain with
umbrellas. It's like taken from above and
there's a big white arrow on the ground, a traffic sign.
And I have a picture of it and I have like, I have like pictures
of it. And I he, he's.
He loved, he loved my. Mom, he's amazing.
Always, Yeah. I can't.
We have a great picture of his of her, the sofa that's a famous
picture of his that he recreated or did with her like they were
kidding. Around.
Oh, really? Yeah, he, yeah, it was all of
that. I mean, that we don't have the
time to delve into all of that artistry and, and he's just
amazing human being. But all the all the stuff that
my mom has seen, too. Yeah, I grew up with
photographing Basque and Keith Haring drinking a Corona in
front of a nightclub in this cool patchwork jacket.
And I'm like, this, this is my city.
This is the New York that I grew up around.
And I'm like, man, it's just Times Square that era, like just
it's the stuff that, you know, made people want to make movies
and talk about stuff, the complexities of these.
Images. Are condition and and and the
kind of sea of humanity there it's just amazing so she she
captured all of that not to digress but so tell me about so
yeah and and and how Joe this. Guy so this guy basically no, it
was just very very simple because you know I had never
done warn of crazy prosthetics or anything and he had said do
you would you like to do it I said of course that sounds
wonderful and I had never really you know done like full weight
was completely covered my hair it's.
Claustrophobic. It was interesting, yeah.
You feel it. Was it?
Was it?
I didn't feel claustrophobic when I was in it.
When they were taking it off. I felt when they were putting it
on, I felt a little like, you know, you really start to notice
certain thing. I was just like trying I could.
That was the hardest thing, was like trying to budget my.
Yes, I know it. My head spit.
You know what? I mean like, I know it's like.
How do I budget this and like and so the?
Reason I say taking it off 'cause mine's gone by the end of
the day and I've poured all the emotions and I just don't have a
lot of, I know space for, you know, RIP it off, yeah, but.
I mean. Slowly mirror state and slowly
peeling it back and someone just ate a tuna sandwich.
I smoked a cigarette and breathing on you and they're
this close and there's four people because they they got
your turn around and you're you just cried or you spent and it's
just that's the hard part about exactly fine because I'm then
that's when I'm like it's claustrophobic because you you
need them. You need them to take it off.
You can't just get home. I know I I that was that was
that I the the like. Just like the the smells of
people's fingers. Your fingers in your mouth and
nose. And little sounds like of people
like putting like a comb in their mouth for a second to pull
some to become hypersensitive that.
Double clicking the. Everything, yeah.
Very old world. Kind of like sitting there just.
Like, know it well, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
So you know you've done it. Yeah, Yeah, it does a ton.
Yeah. But the but I will say that.
Kiln, Yeah. That little heating and so.
Cool. I mean I.
I love it. But I, I will say that I, the
weirdest thing for me though, was that because I was all
covered, people would come up and they'd say, you know, make
sure that you're drinking water because how are you doing?
Are you hydrating? And I'm, I was like, I'm fine.
But I didn't realize that this is not my skin.
I'm like, I, I was looking for my, I was looking to see if I
was sweating and I realized, yeah.
And I'm, that's amazing. And then I realized that for the
first day, oh, I'm under here and I am sweating profusely and
I'm entirely hot and uncomfortable.
It just, I wasn't, I wasn't in touch with it because I was just
basing it on my out how I was on the outside and it was just
fake. So just.
Got to think about your nuts. Yeah, exactly.
Yeah, but it was, by the way, I loved, I loved it.
I loved walking around and I and you know, it's one of these
things where it was such a fun character to do and, and Daniel
Craig is amazing and Drew Starkey in there and they're
really like also like we had just started, they had just
started the movie. So we were doing this stuff and
then I knew it when I was done. They were embarking on this
whole other journey. And so for me, there was a real,
there was a real playfulness and kind of they were, it was
nervous in the beginning and fun.
I loved it personally, just because I love when the
prosthetic. I loved how they limited what I
could do physically. Just kind of prop you up
somewhere. Exactly.
And I loved it. And so like, I love like, 'cause
you would never think about, you would never think about these
things unless. Was the, you know, belching and
all that scripted thing. Yeah, yeah, that's all scripted.
He did it. Well, yeah, no, that was all
scripted, but you know, I but it's one of those things where
it was like scripted, but I knew it.
I. You know.
But it was fun, yeah. The nuances, the nuances to when
and how and that that are fun to work with.
Yeah, I know. I, I, I, I could see you
enjoying. I I, I loved it.
That's what I said. I mean, I that's there's a a
freedom in that that I don't get to see you do and you do so
well, Yeah. And you should make sure you I
want to keep do a lot. More I will I will open spread
it. Spread your feelings.
Well, I had fun and you know, maybe one thing that had to do
with it was just before that movie, I had never really done
back-to-back things. Really, I've never had.
And I had just done something before that that was very down.
And so I knew going into that that I was going to play.
He was like, he's full of life. It helps to shed it, no?
Yes, and it's very in a weird way it was they almost like went
together. I've never had that before, but
it's like in many ways that was informed by the one before it
because I knew I was just so down in this other one that in
this one I could just go, you know, just be wild and crazy and
fun and upbeat. And it was nice to do that.
So it was fun. And I, I love working with those
people and I love the artists. I love the artists and Trinity
Todd I love. Yeah, I think that that is a
real special experience and must be special with Lucas guidance
of course. I mean, even the outside was
built inside, which was so crazy, like the set.
Yeah, like outside, like, like, no, like outs.
Like those streets were inside was so crazy.
Like, yeah, like outside the restaurants.
And so, yeah, so where the dogs kind of wandering through this
kind of back, the kind of depth of field where you're seeing all
that, that's an interior, exterior shot.
And I had never. A certain look to it that I, I,
I, you know, because we do this. You can tell.
That I'm, I, I couldn't tell it was inside, but I, I'm, I was
curious. I had to look it up.
I was curious where you were shooting.
Wait, can I just totally pivot to one other thing?
Because we're talking about one thing to another.
Did you just finish a play? Yeah, and it's funny because you
were I didn't want to like get back into let's talk about me
because you, you've been very generous and and spoke a lot
about this film and I I appreciate that.
But I did just got off the stage 4 four days ago and went to New
York and came here and we were doing 8 shows a week.
And I interestingly, because you were saying I, it was nice to
kind of shed this other role that was a bit heavy and jump
into something new. And I have not done a film since
The Brutalist really. I took a bit of a break.
And then we also were subjected to a Writers Guild strike and a
Screen Actors Guild strike that we had to stand by.
And so, you know, not many people were working, but I took
a bit of space and I had not done a play since I was a
teenager, really. And it was just something I've
been yearning to do, but had been quite intimidate isn't the
right word, But it's it's such a even though I started doing
started in the theatre and doing Off Broadway and many years in
acting school, it's been so long and I've developed a lifetime of
technique and familiarity with film acting.
I didn't, I don't really like the idea of projecting and I, I,
I like the intimacy that were afforded to, to speak in film
and listen and not have to make sure someone under an awning or
up in the in the balcony is gonna hear or see something.
And it ended up being a really wonderful experience.
Very, I think I learned a lot and, and loved the community of
actors I was working with. That was really the, the, the
best part was sharing that time together with actors who are all
so good and all, all, everyone lifting each other up and all
there for the right reasons. There's like, you can't make a
living doing theater, but you can sure get a great deal of
fulfillment. And they're all really,
everyone's lifting each other up.
And I, I just loved that. And, and also this kind of
communion with the audience and how it varied every night.
But all of that was a tangent. The, the thing that occurred to
me as in addition to doing 8 shows a week, I, the, the
Brutalist has received quite a bit of appreciation after
Venice. And I'm, I'm incredibly grateful
for it. So are are my my, my
responsibilities and kind of helping to make people aware of
the film started ramping up during the play and, and I found
myself talking a lot about Laszlo and this journey and
thinking about Pennsylvania of that time.
And it occurred to me the character that I play in this
play is it's based on a true story.
His name was Nick Yaris and he served 22 years on death row in
Pennsylvania for a crime he didn't commit.
And so much about it was this man enduring great injustice and
violated by people and circumstances within
Pennsylvania. And that is Laszlo's where he
lands and and much of his experiences exists within
Pennsylvania and all those hardships.
And I was like, what is it that's drawn me to to these two
things at the same time in my life?
They both came at the same moment.
Isn't that interesting? And maybe that there's just too
much injustice in the world. And I don't know, Pennsylvania's
a big state. I have no idea.
There's too much injustice for sure.
And maybe I that speaks to me and just interesting timing.
But it's but you but you're able to express it without it like
like how aware are are you of injustice or a statement like
that or wanting to? It's not.
Yeah, I know you're. You know what I mean, I don't
have the correct wording. Yeah, well, the the the enemy of
it being an emotional journey would be to be overly you.
First of all, it's embedded in the work.
It's, it's in the writing, it's in the subtext, it's in the,
it's just what speaks to me and what I find compelling and
worthy of all the work that it takes to, to delve in and, and,
and, and it takes someone like Brady.
It takes a filmmaker who has this first of all, a sensitivity
and understanding of these circumstances and and sense of
empathy of what what so many people struggle with in this
world. And an understanding of history
and an ability to weave the traumas that many have endured
and and are forced to contend with from the past and where it
still lies within society right before our very nose.
And to do that without saying I'm teaching you anything, but
just you're gonna feel something and you might recognize
something. And I think that's the beauty of
film because you are transported to another era and the beauty of
being an actor to inhabit and represent someone from another
time and how that individual's experiences speak to.
Elements that you relate to. Personally, and that definitely
other people may relate to and that it's all in there, baked
in, and then you're in this darkened room together and it
unfolds and it's very special. When it works, it's very
special. It's very special.
But the play, the play afforded me that as well.
And. I feel like.
You know, I'm very aware of my own good fortune.
I'm very aware of, you know. Our life has.
Many challenges, but. I grew up in Queens.
I grew up. Around a lot of people that had
made some pretty big mistakes. And this story in the play was
so much about a man, a young man who had made a couple mistakes
and then got implicated into things that he didn't even do
and was too. Naive.
And addicted to methamphetamine as a teenager and just a mess,
but wasn't guilty of the charges that he was incriminated for and
and was. Helpless and that this.
Giant system just oppressed and you know.
We could do another podcast because.
A 24 has a whole other movie about injustice within the IT
could bring in a third person into this.
Was it hard physically to do? It like to have a whole day free
and then do your job at night. For this, well, we had eight
shows, so. We had Thursdays and Saturdays,
a matinee edition. Oh wow.
It never really felt like I had a whole day free because I I
also haven't been able to sleep well because I'm I'm I think
retaining an entire play with it, the whole kind of third act
being essentially a lot on my shoulders that I I would wake up
numerous times the night with dialogue, various scenes every
night. Making sure I know it.
Or I don't know what it was, but it was, I've never experienced
that ever that I can recall. Maybe there'll be a big scene
and I'll wake up and I'm stressed and I'll run the scene
before I'm fully up. Or I'm, I'm, I'm making sure I
know the monologue and I know the, the, the bridges within
that, but not, you know, an hour and 45 minutes worth of
material. I had to play with a with.
No intermission in a film with a How funny was that?
How weird is that? It is also very.
Strange. And then do you think that?
And then how did that come about?
Someone said, would you like to be in?
Yeah. Lindsay Ferrantino.
Wrote it and she's an amazing writer.
You just would love it. You'd love.
Will you do it here? We'll see there.
I think it it's gotten very well received.
She'd, she'd probably like us to do it.
I mean, I'll consider it. I'm not sure yet.
It's a lot. It's a lot.
It's a lot, but it it was. Very gratifying.
It's just I got to get a movie going.
I got to get, I got to find a film and then let's see if I
find the right film and right project and film maker and I
feel like I have something meaningful that satisfies that.
Then I can say. OK, I'll take another break and
space to to perform and and and do do the do a play.
But I can see why. Actors are are yearning for the
stage and, and it's such a, it's such a different set of
challenges. You know, you make a movie and
you have these handful of scenes that you know are.
There'll be many that you really.
Relate to and then there'll be a handful of scenes that are kind
of complicated that you know, are going to be some work to
suss out and you know, maybe the filmmaker has a an idea for them
and you're not sure you you understand that well enough or
you're not going to be able to convey it.
And then when you get to that, you tackle that, you hopefully
prevail, but you get through it and it's the past tomorrow.
You buckle up and get to to work and work on the day's tasks, a
play. You have to unearth that and
discover it every day, all through rehearsal and then in
front of an audience every day. And then even though that may be
a difficulty, you've got to be so rooted and you got to jump
right into the next thing and the next thing and the next
thing and you have no time to think about how or what.
You have to kind of process it because you do have to learn
from it. But it's such a different way of
thinking and applying. You mean letting that night's?
Performance go to the next night or a scene by scene letting
yeah. Scene by scene and.
Processing. How to be better again but but
letting getting through those challenging moments.
And then? Being fully present in the other
moment that immediately proceeds or follows is a new thing for
me. It is.
I did not. I had not had to think on those
terms because I'm so used to compartmentalizing.
So we're going to do this heavy scene today and then and we're
doing that and then we might have a lighter moment right
after that, but I'm going to put it down.
I'm going to go outside. I'm going to shake it off a bit.
I'm going to do that. You don't have any time to shake
anything off. You have, you know it anyhow,
it's what about this? Did you?
Was it? Did you ever watch a video of it
in rehearsal or did you ever see it filmed?
No, I did watch. The understudy run, which was
really informative, was that he was quite good.
He was quite good and I learned a few things.
I joked with him. I was like, OK.
But I got to watch. I got to watch the play unfold.
I got to watch what everyone was doing.
I got to watch what my character wasn't experiencing and seeing
interesting. I got to watch blocking and got
to see where things needed to be more specific and for myself.
And it was good. It was helpful.
That's so interesting. Yeah.
I. Liked it?
I liked it. It was very interesting.
That's really interesting. What about was?
Let's talk about music. Yeah, perfect.
I want to. Talk about music with you.
Because we both love making music.
I mean Jason when he's on set or fun.
We were the last one we did with Wes.
We we, we shared and we had we all live Wes's films.
Usually everyone gets on, we all live in one hotel or sometimes a
house, which was amazing on Darjeeling.
I mean, first of all, Darjeeling was just like such an amazing,
amazing life experience. We kind of have to talk about
that a little bit just because that was my first meeting and
introduction to you and to Owen and to Wes and to Roman and and
and. Jen, I mean.
Every, all of you and the, the, the, the love and camaraderie,
camaraderie and intimacy of, of what that was the familial
quality of what it was, I think. More than any.
Other maybe Rushmore was different, you know, it was
different, but it was an earlier time in Les's work.
But more than the other films that I've been fortunate to
participate in, I felt like there was just such a close
emotional journey within the humor and his wonderful, unique
stylistic choices. And no, you're right, I I love.
The. Emotional truths that are hand
in hand with broad, broad fucking comedy.
Amazingly fun stuff. And these epic.
Brilliant. Yeah.
Bob Yeoman was shooting unless. His designing and man, that
film. But you know, it's funny because
I think. That also was the first time
that he had really worked that way too.
Like I think that was he was trying that afterlife aquatic,
right. So I think that there and it's
it's. Stuck and stuck, but I think
that. Was the the foray into it.
So I think in many ways, like the family thing you're talking
about was like that. Was the first time it.
Wasn't really. I mean, I had never experienced
that either. I'd never I I had.
Once, only once. Or the family kind of everyone
together. You mean that like that.
Yeah, like and. You and I going on that specific
to the to the storytelling. But yeah, but not.
I mean, I just, I just had never done.
And just like, So for me, it was just a dream.
Like we went on a hike around the lake.
One of the first. Yeah, the first.
Day we. Met and it's.
Just like Balsaman Lake, I just remember like, you know.
So much about that and it's it's, you know, it's hard to
forget because that's really like, that's kind of like, you
know, and just what I learned and your generosity and just the
whole thing was just like, you know, I was just so grateful.
We talked about grateful just like every second.
I was just like, holy shit, me too.
That was a love it. And I and.
I laughed so much too. And there was just, and, and
it's I. I don't even know if I was
laughing because things were funny.
I was laughing because things were just life.
It was so appreciating it. We were all out of our element.
And loving it. And it will never.
I mean, that's just so. Crazy, you know, shooting on a
moving train each. Day and I know if the.
We'd have to wake. Up we'd have our suits or our
outfits would be prepared in the room with a microphone in it.
In it, no makeup, no no make up period before going on the set.
Just get your stuff, get dressed, and get to the train
station before the. Train departed.
Or else you missed the set. Yes, and and nobody missed the
set right now, what would we have done?
Like what if you couldn't? You couldn't have missed Owen.
What if I always? Like Owen, I could just see
Owen, but you couldn't. Thought I was.
I thought I dreamt that that was 930 it.
Was 930 I. But no, we had to.
We had to. Literally leave the train
station because it was a train station.
We were trained on our live track.
I mean, we weren't on some private track going up and down
40 feet. I mean, we were going through
India. And I thought it was so smart
how they built. They had one long train and
they'd built one side of it. The sets were on one side and
they built a replica of it on the other side.
So on the way back, when the sun would be on the other side, you
just switch. And it was just, yeah, I mean,
to me, that's. Kind.
Of like, I just kind of and what I learned from that, that I
loved so much was the responsibility that each actor
has for each other. You know what I mean?
Like because I remember like there was a moment when you were
like, I think your glasses were you're like you're, I think your
thing was here, like looking out for each other.
I just felt like this is amazing, you know what I mean?
This kind of like real, like we are all doing this together.
Yeah, it was. I, I mean.
I'm I'm an only. Child that felt like it was with
some my brothers it was like that.
No, I feel that really. It was a really.
Touching. Journey.
And yeah, very. Very.
Really. Fun.
Poor you that W made you walk around all over India barefoot.
I mean, he's very brave like you.
Really. You really are.
I mean, we're all brave. I mean, you threw me down that
river, too. Yeah, I was saying didn't didn't
end well. But it's probably better to walk
around barefoot. It did not.
No, no, it was bad. It was bad.
Wait, but music? Well, because music actually was
really interesting because I remember during that time, well,
for me, like what was really interesting about that moment
was like, you know, I think like I was so focused growing up on
like I was so into like British Invasion, like Beatles and I
kind of missed like a whole giant chunk of things.
And I, and I think that during that time I had just gotten this
computer and like I was learning how to was, was beginning of me
kind of understanding production and, and, and like working.
And I remember you came in and you played me a bunch of these
like beats you had done. And it was like, really it was
like, OK, well, this is what you can do.
Like well, I feel the same way about.
This is what you can do if you can actually play.
No, no. But it was just like I remember.
Sitting there going like, OK, this is like, and so I still
think about it because like, because I remember we sat there
and we were listening and I was like.
Wow, like all these little. Levels and all these things and
I couldn't believe that it was just you had just done it like
and I still think back to that feeling of like, I want to and I
I'm not good yet still with the product, but that sort of like
I'm making beats in India. Do you?
Yeah. You came in and you played.
Me stuff I would make that I. You played me like. 40 minutes
of beats and they were all great.
And I remember just going like, fuck, like this is like.
But they weren't beat, they were song.
I mean, they were like pieces. Yeah, they're beats, yeah, yeah,
but they're. But they're.
But they're rudimentary. I mean, they're, yeah.
No, but they were they're yeah. But.
To me it's like when I. Imagine like that's what I'm
yeah, like so to this day, like, you know how you have these
weird like memories, like that's the one that I like when I
imagine like getting good at being able to.
I'm not good at that yet to this to this day, but I think of that
I don't have to. And that doesn't even have to
be. As I know but I but.
You always want to be. I like I.
Like it, but it was this, you know, but then and then I think
of you a lot too, because we were talking about like DJ,
little DJ apps and things on the phone.
And I got to show you this. I got, I got, I got a little DJ
thing for my son and I and he little portable rig.
I have one. It's like this big thing.
It's pretty. Great.
They're great. I mean, it's not that.
Portable. I mean, it's like pretty
portable, yeah, but there's an even smaller one that's.
Really. There's a little thing really
this big Yeah, that you plug into your iPhone or iPad, OK,
That's what I mean. I rocked a.
Party with that? Really.
I rocked. A whole show with with great
delays and effects and everything.
Yeah, I'll turn you on to that. I watched the Questlove Master.
Class did you? I saw.
I saw some of it, yeah. I liked a lot.
There was some, really. There was some pretty like.
It was pretty interesting just watching.
You told me to see that. Yeah, it was.
You. Oh, maybe.
Yeah. I liked his setup like I liked
his. Setup.
I liked his board. I liked his effect.
I mean, I like, but it was really like the one thing I'm
trying to figure out that was like, but so do you have all
your music? That's what I haven't figured
out is where is the mute? So many of these songs, I'm
going to mess What? Yeah.
Well, so many of them are like not there or available and I
can't. They're all over the place.
But I've also. I've fallen deeply into working
with one piece of equipment and then I will have a.
Friend, or I'll go to guitar. Center or something and I'll see
some new piece of gear and I'll be like, oh, you know, yeah, let
me try that and I'll start messing around with that and
then I'll forget how to make music on that old equipment that
I have really volumes of music on and it's so I've got stuff.
Yeah, I got. I don't remember.
How I I could probably figure out how to make a track on an
ASR but I was making beats on Asrs and EPS 16 pluses which
were these old school and Sonic and Sonic keyboards.
ASR back in the 90s ASR 10. ASR 10.
Yeah, ASR 10, I still have AI, still have one.
I still have a full perfect. Well, that's full 8088 key
really is our ten. Yeah, I used to go, I traveled
to Jamaica with it used to try. Now you can like go with your
iPad and make amazing music. But I would travel with my ASR
to Jamaica to visit my boys and go there.
And I remember making what at the time I was, I felt like my
masterpiece, like it just I was, I was, I was cooking.
And the problem with that my. Model of it.
When you had too many great layered samples, because it's a
sample sampler sequencer, when there was too much in it, it
would crash and you had to save everything on a floppy disk, and
I hadn't. Backed it up.
And oh, it didn't. It would crash, but there was a
thunderstorm and the power and surged and it went out after
like an 8 hour beat session that just was it's gone.
And it was probably my best work.
No, honestly, it's gone. Fuck me.
I may have cried. I know I yelled, but I may have
cried. It was that good.
Anyway, so I used to travel with this.
How were you bringing your sample?
In a? In a?
In a giant. Like roadie case.
Like I was like my yeah, go through luggage and pick it up.
Yeah, weighed a ton, but isn't that cool?
Isn't that interesting to? Know because I believe that in
like we're talking about acting with like makeup or character.
I believe that instruments do have they make you.
I believe they have songs in them in a way I mean that you
adapt to them. I find that I do like
definitely. I don't know about a digital
equipment, but I definitely would.
Yeah. Well, yeah, A.
Guitar. Guitar or even a piano or any
kind of one instrument that would have a personality that's
it's made it's that would someone assembled it but the ASR
10. Is but is an example I think of
of a digital instrument that analog but it has its but it.
Has. A It has a personality and it
has like and it has like a clock and it has a way that it, I
think Kanye does a lot of stuff still on the.
ASR Yeah, I know RZA did. Yeah, right.
No, that was the yeah. And like even like the APC, like
the MPC, the MPC 2000 and like they, you know, they have their
own yeah thing. And like you would even if and
you make certain kind of thing on it, like when you're saying,
you know, and it's true that like that's the one thing I'm
not good at either, is like I have I don't know how to merge
all my stuff. So I have like music on just
like different me too. No, me too.
And you need to then. Be serious.
Well, you got to back it up, but then you need to be serious and
you need to have like, time and money to be in a studio with
someone to help you, like an engineer to say, I want to
upload all this on Pro Tools. That's great.
I want to riff with that for a while, just record it and then
we can sample that riff or play with.
And that's, that's where I'm at these days with it, which I find
really fulfilling. But I, you know, it's time and
money before. Yeah, Yeah, I am.
But I, you know, I'm not doing anything yet with things.
But I, I scored clean. I made the whole.
Yeah, I made that whole score and I ended up doing it because
I was. Making beats while I made the.
Movie and I was like, wow, this is a theme.
I made a theme in in the state of mind of this character and
the zone I was in and it was like this kind of Rambo S kind
of feeling. I was like, yeah, that's a
theme. And then ultimately stuff I
started making even on an iPad. We we ended up I ended up having
an orchestra interpret and had a woman playing French horns and
cellos and things. It was just amazing.
But it was coming musically from the character.
It was in that interesting. Fuck yeah.
I think it's also. But you're you play a lot of.
Acoustic work, which is so beautiful and you sing I well,
I'm not a really good singer, but.
I I can but but the but the yeah, I play, you know, piano
and guitar enough to right and like to play along with people.
Well, that's amazing. I can't.
Yeah, I can't. Like, you know, I wouldn't be.
Like pass me the guitar versus like I would, you know, like,
but you know, it's nice and I it's soothing.
I love a guitar. It's very nurturing.
I used to carry a Martin backpacker just and I can't play
other than a few little chords I can't play, but I love it's very
it's a. It's a a whoopee.
I love having to like, it's like a nice blanket.
It's just there. Well, I think it's because they
go in my. Silly opinion.
I think it's because when you're holding a guitar, the sound goes
backwards too, through your body.
You know? I think that's like a nice
reverberation. Yeah, I think there's a.
Real like comes in. And yeah.
I think it's like the. Vibrations.
The vibration I. Even when you're tuning.
Something like when they're out of tune, you know, go whoa,
whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. And then as they get more in
tune, they go whoa and I. And I love that.
And I it's sort. Of how I feel when we're all
working is like that's it's like tuning, you know, it's and it's
like whoa, whoa, whoa, and it's all not that it's bad if it's
attitude, but you can feel it like when it's you can feel like
A and it and I sort of live for that moment, you know, that's
great. That's sort of like my whole
that's what I live for. It's like the tuning of people.
I like that that's. Yeah, I was just like guitarist
on yesterday. Really.
Yeah, just got to make. You jealous?
Yeah. You got a new.
Keyboard, yeah, yeah, it's pretty sad.
There's a bunch of gear out now. I know.
There's so much stuff I want. There's a great place in LA
where they have a lot of sense if you want good sense anyway.
But I I love all the gear too much.
How's the family? They're great.
Adult adult children. How my?
Daughter just turned 1414. Yeah, it's really.
Funny, I have a. 10 year old. And she, I said.
I'm leaving this last night, I said.
I'm going out to see his movie. Should I go to?
No, no, no, not you. You're not.
You don't go. See this one and said play.
And I'm like, listen. You could barely make it through
Wild Robot. You're not going to get through
the brutal. I've tried, you know, but then
while I was watching, I was going she they would love this
movie, you know, because it's they would love it.
They and I and I, it's so fucking beautiful and intent and
the music, by the way, is incredible and that is
incredible and. That is a real achievement, that
score. By the way, and seeing it last
night in the big screen, it was great.
Now the music is just epic. Yeah, it was fun by the.
Way just to say it last like. To sit in a theater that was
clearly so with that kind of by with strangers was fun like
because you realize. How?
Like I'm just talking and sharing my like, and the people
next to me are just talking about how they feel.
We don't even know each other. How great.
But that's a great movie, right? Where it's like you, you you're
compelled to just like, what do you think?
What's going on? Like the you know, you start
talking and it's like what? That's what a movie.
I mean, that's a great feeling, right?
It's just like the community and the people in the room all
wanting to just start to talk. And that was like, I was like,
what a triumph. I was like, this is this is what
it's all about, you know, And to me, it's just like, I don't
know, they're just, you know, everything you do is so great.
I'm just so happy that this movie is like but this one, this
one has some it. Has something really special.
Yeah. And it's, I don't know how you
did it. Should we say it?
Do some. Closing next question.
Question #2 I've enjoyed, I loved it chatting.
With you, pal, shut the. Mic cheers.
Cheers. Rock'n'roll.