1 00:00:00,800 --> 00:00:03,800 Okay, we're doing it. Okay, this is Robert Eggers. 2 00:00:04,500 --> 00:00:08,700 This is re Esther. And yeah, we're doing the a24 3 00:00:08,700 --> 00:00:11,000 podcast which is cool. We're doing it together. 4 00:00:11,300 --> 00:00:15,600 Yeah, which feels appropriate given that we're both friends 5 00:00:15,700 --> 00:00:20,500 totally and to like each other's work and the same stuff. 6 00:00:20,700 --> 00:00:26,100 Yeah speaking of which we have a goal which is we're trying to 7 00:00:26,100 --> 00:00:29,800 orient this discussion around the work. 8 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:34,400 Work of ingmar Bergman. We probably won't succeed but 9 00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:37,100 we're going to give it a shot. Yeah, I thought you I thought 10 00:00:37,100 --> 00:00:39,600 you were joking when you first suggested it, but I'm excited to 11 00:00:39,608 --> 00:00:42,500 dive in. I know that we're both devotees. 12 00:00:42,500 --> 00:00:45,200 You can probably see it in our work feels appropriate. 13 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:50,800 Yeah, we met a couple years ago. I was doing like a it wasn't 14 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:53,700 really a friends-and-family screening of hereditary. 15 00:00:53,700 --> 00:00:56,300 It was but it was like the because I well I think they're 16 00:00:56,300 --> 00:00:59,100 our friends and family of a 24, but I didn't know anybody there. 17 00:00:59,400 --> 00:01:00,800 Yeah. It's We're asked me to go to a 18 00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:02,700 screening of something that I didn't know anything about it. 19 00:01:02,700 --> 00:01:04,000 So everything was a horror movie. 20 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:07,500 I think was the first of those that we had done and the room, 21 00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:10,200 you know, like did not seem to love it. 22 00:01:10,500 --> 00:01:14,900 And I remember going up in front of the going up in front of 23 00:01:14,900 --> 00:01:18,600 everyone who had just seen the film like very like Stern faces 24 00:01:18,600 --> 00:01:22,900 that were like ready to cut me down to size and you and your 25 00:01:22,900 --> 00:01:27,600 wife Ali were sitting like near the front and you give me like 26 00:01:27,600 --> 00:01:32,900 two thumbs up and yet A very warm smile on your face and it's 27 00:01:32,900 --> 00:01:38,700 like I I like held on to that as my lifeline as people in the 28 00:01:38,700 --> 00:01:43,800 room proceeded to explain to me that you know, I was a bastard 29 00:01:43,900 --> 00:01:47,400 and I and I you know, I made a worthless moving. 30 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:50,000 Yeah. Well you did not I was totally 31 00:01:50,000 --> 00:01:55,000 blown away I especially cuz I had no expectations and and and 32 00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:59,100 it was fantastic and it was really I mean it was so smart 33 00:01:59,100 --> 00:02:06,300 and truly Inspiring to me and I was really like the some of the 34 00:02:06,300 --> 00:02:10,600 craft of the camera work. I didn't even perceive because I 35 00:02:10,600 --> 00:02:13,500 was so impressed with the breadcrumbs that you are laying 36 00:02:13,500 --> 00:02:16,800 with the with the screenplay. And anyway, it was a real joy, 37 00:02:17,100 --> 00:02:24,400 and I had the great pleasure of seeing the or a finished version 38 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:28,300 of mid Samar last night and it was great. 39 00:02:28,300 --> 00:02:31,300 It was great. I also I mean I also saw like an 40 00:02:31,300 --> 00:02:34,300 earlier version and I you know, I don't know what you cut but I 41 00:02:34,300 --> 00:02:38,100 felt like them was was tighter at had way more shit in it. 42 00:02:38,400 --> 00:02:40,400 Yeah, you know that when you like finish something When the 43 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:43,400 Music's there and the color it does just feel yeah. 44 00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:45,400 It's more substantial for sure for sure. 45 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:49,800 It's really excellent. And so now to try to shoehorn 46 00:02:49,900 --> 00:02:52,400 wait, wait, hold on. Oh that I just need to like I 47 00:02:52,400 --> 00:02:56,500 cannot like receive a compliment without like reciprocating when 48 00:02:56,500 --> 00:02:59,500 when I have one to give because eyes so I have not seen the 49 00:02:59,508 --> 00:03:02,700 finished. Version of the lighthouse but I 50 00:03:02,700 --> 00:03:07,500 did see a cut that was nearly finished and I have the feeling 51 00:03:07,500 --> 00:03:10,800 that you would never show a cut to anybody that isn't nearly 52 00:03:10,800 --> 00:03:14,900 finished. I I love the lighthouse and I'm 53 00:03:14,900 --> 00:03:20,000 so excited to see what it is now that it's done. 54 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:23,700 But what I saw I felt finished well, thank you. 55 00:03:23,800 --> 00:03:28,100 Like it's so beautiful. So beautifully done and really 56 00:03:28,100 --> 00:03:30,300 funny. I know I've said this before For 57 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:34,100 and you've had kind of an inscrutable Expressions, I don't 58 00:03:34,100 --> 00:03:38,400 know if this like if this feels right to you, but it really made 59 00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:43,200 me think of Harold Pinter who I love and I mean, I can't really 60 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:45,600 think of any other work that feels like Harold Pinter 61 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:49,700 besides, you know, I mean, like what else plays like the servant 62 00:03:49,700 --> 00:03:52,400 or you know, no man's land or like, you know the homecoming 63 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:58,300 and and this spelt to me a total like spiritual sibling and and 64 00:03:58,300 --> 00:04:02,000 even though it reminds me. Of Harold Pinter it also it 65 00:04:02,000 --> 00:04:04,500 reminds me of nothing else including Harold Pinter just 66 00:04:04,500 --> 00:04:08,800 feels it just feels like totally unique and yeah, it's okay. 67 00:04:08,800 --> 00:04:09,200 Okay. Okay. 68 00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:10,100 Well, thank you. Thank you. 69 00:04:10,100 --> 00:04:12,700 That's really early winter by way of no. 70 00:04:12,700 --> 00:04:14,600 No, that's way too kind of wave Bella. 71 00:04:14,600 --> 00:04:16,600 Terra would say pretty incredible. 72 00:04:16,700 --> 00:04:19,000 Well, thank you. Thank you that that's like far 73 00:04:19,000 --> 00:04:20,700 too kind. All right. 74 00:04:20,800 --> 00:04:23,600 I'm on this Bergman Mission. Damn it. 75 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:26,500 Okay. So everyone has close-ups like 76 00:04:26,500 --> 00:04:31,000 Bergman doesn't own close-ups, but there's something Less in 77 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:35,300 some of the center framed things in the latter portion of mid 78 00:04:35,300 --> 00:04:39,600 some are but the earliest stuff with Danny gave a sort of berg 79 00:04:39,600 --> 00:04:43,800 many vibe to me and I know that just because the movie takes 80 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:46,500 place in Sweden. I feel like people talk about 81 00:04:46,500 --> 00:04:50,200 Bergman in relation to Mid sommar in a way that maybe is 82 00:04:50,200 --> 00:04:55,400 like inappropriate, you know tarkovsky sacrifice people would 83 00:04:55,400 --> 00:04:58,800 always say that it's Bergman task which would really piss him 84 00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:01,400 off because he said this Has nothing to do with Bergman films 85 00:05:01,400 --> 00:05:03,800 except for spending this well, yeah, it's like it's like if you 86 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:07,700 have bergman's entire crew. Yeah designing and shit and film 87 00:05:08,300 --> 00:05:09,900 yoseob sense. He's in the film. 88 00:05:09,900 --> 00:05:13,300 Yeah. It's going to feel a little Burg 89 00:05:13,300 --> 00:05:16,300 mini right? I mean, we've talked a lot about 90 00:05:16,300 --> 00:05:19,900 Bergman before he's you know a hero of mine. 91 00:05:19,900 --> 00:05:25,300 I love his films. I was thinking a lot more about 92 00:05:25,300 --> 00:05:29,000 his work when I was making hereditary particularly. 93 00:05:30,200 --> 00:05:34,800 Cries and Whispers And I showed the crew Autumn Sonata because 94 00:05:34,800 --> 00:05:37,000 of the mother-daughter parallels. 95 00:05:38,600 --> 00:05:40,900 Yeah. I mean nobody shoots close-ups 96 00:05:40,900 --> 00:05:44,300 like him. I definitely when we were making 97 00:05:44,500 --> 00:05:48,200 hereditary again. I made my cinematographer 98 00:05:48,300 --> 00:05:50,300 pavel's poker. Gel ski is also one of my best 99 00:05:50,300 --> 00:05:52,600 friends. I made him watch Persona. 100 00:05:52,900 --> 00:05:54,700 Just cause I think those are like the most beautiful 101 00:05:54,700 --> 00:05:58,500 close-ups I've ever seen and I'm numb and I feel like there is 102 00:05:58,500 --> 00:06:03,000 this it's It's like a recent Trend but I'm seeing filmmakers 103 00:06:03,000 --> 00:06:06,800 like really clearly chasing the Berkman close up. 104 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:10,400 Even if you look at like PT Anderson who loved to talk early 105 00:06:10,400 --> 00:06:13,500 in his career about how he was like kind of chasing the 106 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:17,000 Jonathan Demi close up, you know in the windows look especially 107 00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:21,800 starting with the master that he's moving kind of like away 108 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:27,300 from Demi and Scorsese and Yamin towards especially Bergman in in 109 00:06:27,300 --> 00:06:28,900 the way. He frames close-ups and you 110 00:06:28,900 --> 00:06:32,900 know, obviously Kubrick To but I yeah there is this like the Box 111 00:06:32,900 --> 00:06:35,800 quality right where you give just enough? 112 00:06:36,100 --> 00:06:39,700 Yeah, you know Headroom and and you typically like bring the 113 00:06:39,700 --> 00:06:43,600 camera like two or three inches below the nose and it's and and 114 00:06:43,600 --> 00:06:47,400 you and you shooting in like 2 to 1 is that is a nice 115 00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:51,400 compromise for getting scoped and still getting really healthy 116 00:06:51,900 --> 00:06:54,800 close-ups where you're not like chopping people's like 117 00:06:54,800 --> 00:06:56,800 headpieces. This is there is out of their 118 00:06:56,800 --> 00:07:00,900 heads off so you it was it's nice to see I I love to to one 119 00:07:00,900 --> 00:07:05,500 II know that we Prevail and I chose two to one for hereditary 120 00:07:05,500 --> 00:07:10,500 because it was like Douglas sirk's yeah favorite aspect 121 00:07:10,500 --> 00:07:13,800 ratio or like, you know, his chosen aspect ratio. 122 00:07:13,900 --> 00:07:17,900 And you know, we were making, you know this domestic movie set 123 00:07:17,900 --> 00:07:20,700 in the house and yeah, it feels it feels right. 124 00:07:20,700 --> 00:07:23,500 It's like how do you get the height like, you know the width 125 00:07:23,500 --> 00:07:26,400 but also like some of the height but when you're indoors like 126 00:07:26,700 --> 00:07:29,700 that can box you in and then I was kind of surprised that we 127 00:07:29,800 --> 00:07:32,900 Landed on that for Midsomer because we you know, we said 128 00:07:32,900 --> 00:07:37,100 like let's try something else and then we just I mean on paper 129 00:07:37,400 --> 00:07:42,900 two to one for Midsummer seems like a perfect like I could see 130 00:07:43,500 --> 00:07:47,300 something box like one six six, even for hereditary. 131 00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:52,000 You went with Academy right for we went with 1-6 6-4 the which 132 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:57,700 we didn't want to go so boxy as Academy, but we wanted we did 133 00:07:57,700 --> 00:07:59,700 want X more height for for trees. 134 00:08:00,100 --> 00:08:02,500 And we did want something box here for the interiors. 135 00:08:02,500 --> 00:08:08,000 And of course so that film we shot on Alexa and because for 136 00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:10,800 anamorphic because the sensors for three and we were using 137 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:14,000 these like old lenses. We were actually you got more of 138 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:17,100 the like lens characteristic that was really cool and 139 00:08:17,100 --> 00:08:19,900 something that then for the lighthouse shooting on 35 140 00:08:19,900 --> 00:08:24,200 millimeter in an even stupider aspect ratio. 141 00:08:24,300 --> 00:08:28,500 We were able to take advantage of so like going going back to 142 00:08:28,500 --> 00:08:32,500 this the close-ups. It's really fascinating to see 143 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:36,700 the progression that I'll actually start with Virgin 144 00:08:36,700 --> 00:08:39,500 Spring which is the first spending goes. 145 00:08:39,500 --> 00:08:44,000 Yes, the first venue confessed and to see in the the faith 146 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:47,500 Trilogy and the early like series the work on trying to 147 00:08:47,500 --> 00:08:52,900 capture naturalistic lighting and I feel like shame sort of is 148 00:08:52,900 --> 00:08:57,800 the most realistically lit of all of the of the nyqvist 149 00:08:57,800 --> 00:09:02,500 Bergman collaborations then Come out on the other end with the 150 00:09:02,500 --> 00:09:06,700 super super flat color lighting that like to for certainly for 151 00:09:06,700 --> 00:09:10,000 my own films. I would never ever ever in a 152 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:13,500 million years want to emulate who knows but right now like 153 00:09:13,500 --> 00:09:16,800 that seems like so far away from what I'm doing. 154 00:09:16,900 --> 00:09:19,400 I'm curious to hear your thoughts on it because it's 155 00:09:19,600 --> 00:09:23,700 obviously they were trying to like over bergman's career and 156 00:09:23,700 --> 00:09:27,100 their collaboration looking for Simplicity great and also 157 00:09:27,600 --> 00:09:32,100 lighting that on the He's people you could capture like every 158 00:09:32,400 --> 00:09:36,600 emotion any change of color of Flesh color in the cheek. 159 00:09:36,700 --> 00:09:38,400 You could you could get it with this kind of lighting. 160 00:09:38,400 --> 00:09:41,000 And what's also really interesting is that in some 161 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:44,400 parts of Fanny and Alexander. It's weirdly atmospheric, even 162 00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:46,500 though actually has no fucking atmosphere if you know I'm 163 00:09:46,508 --> 00:09:52,400 saying so I know I know I know my curmudgeonly DP Jaron 164 00:09:52,400 --> 00:09:58,400 blaschke sort of bothers him. Well, you know, I see what 165 00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:01,400 you're saying, especially yeah, I Guess shame would be the most 166 00:10:01,400 --> 00:10:04,000 naturalistic. Although I guess like passion of 167 00:10:04,000 --> 00:10:06,500 Anna is like the color version of the color version of that. 168 00:10:06,500 --> 00:10:08,700 Yeah, which is it's like pretty drab. 169 00:10:08,700 --> 00:10:11,700 Yeah, and then I definitely see what you mean about the flatness 170 00:10:11,700 --> 00:10:15,600 of like for instance his TV work like scenes from a marriage, but 171 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:19,100 even even it's even like even cries and Whispers is pretty 172 00:10:19,100 --> 00:10:21,100 flat. I mean, I know that there's like 173 00:10:21,100 --> 00:10:24,300 think about like all the like the fill and the night Interiors 174 00:10:24,300 --> 00:10:28,000 like he certainly never like he's never like trying he's not 175 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:30,200 saying this is a match. Each. 176 00:10:30,200 --> 00:10:32,500 All right, our wolves better example, right even though this 177 00:10:32,500 --> 00:10:34,100 is the lighting a little more stylized an hour of the wolf. 178 00:10:34,100 --> 00:10:37,000 But like this is a match and I'm going to have a lamp set up to 179 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:40,600 like try to emulate like what this lamp light or this matched 180 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:42,800 light it Fire Light is doing on someone's face. 181 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:47,300 Like it's lit theatrically it with some Phil and there is some 182 00:10:47,400 --> 00:10:50,400 Shadow but I'm not worrying about the Practical light source 183 00:10:50,400 --> 00:10:52,300 would be the light source. No, that's true. 184 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:54,200 Yeah. I don't know if like he would 185 00:10:54,200 --> 00:10:57,800 argue, you know kind of blurring the line between a dream and 186 00:10:57,800 --> 00:10:59,600 reality. That's for sure that that might 187 00:10:59,800 --> 00:11:01,500 Be convenient. I mean certainly in cries and 188 00:11:01,500 --> 00:11:04,900 Whispers it actually maybe helps, you know, well and also 189 00:11:04,900 --> 00:11:08,500 also like those those red rooms the flatness of the lighting is 190 00:11:08,500 --> 00:11:10,400 really serving the film Well, you certainly wouldn't 191 00:11:10,400 --> 00:11:13,300 experience the rooms as read if it were if it were yeah, I'd 192 00:11:13,300 --> 00:11:15,800 more Curious Cara. Yeah, and they're well and you'd 193 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:18,500 have a lot more of you know contrast in the Reds exactly but 194 00:11:18,500 --> 00:11:22,000 there is something about just like that like fire truck red. 195 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:24,700 It's amazing. That's just so powerful and also 196 00:11:24,700 --> 00:11:29,100 like just like shows his background in the theater. 197 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:32,600 Yeah. Yeah, so like for listeners who 198 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:36,800 may not know like Bergman like one of his his final Masterpiece 199 00:11:36,800 --> 00:11:39,300 or whatever Fanny and Alexander. He said he was retiring for 200 00:11:39,300 --> 00:11:43,200 making films and he retired for making films that were supposed 201 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:45,900 to be released theatrically, but he still need a lot of TV movies 202 00:11:45,900 --> 00:11:49,000 and TV plays even if any bugs and it was also made for TV and 203 00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:50,900 probably my despite it being a TV movie. 204 00:11:50,900 --> 00:11:53,200 It's probably my favourite film. Yeah. 205 00:11:53,200 --> 00:11:56,100 It's amazing. It's got his like trademark 206 00:11:56,100 --> 00:12:00,400 brutality. He's got the the the The 207 00:12:00,400 --> 00:12:03,100 monologue that like seems to make its way in almost every 208 00:12:03,100 --> 00:12:06,700 Bergman film where like a man like positions a woman in front 209 00:12:06,700 --> 00:12:09,600 of a mirror and just like and reserved our dresses her down. 210 00:12:09,900 --> 00:12:13,800 But but also it's I think it's the one Bergman movie where the 211 00:12:13,800 --> 00:12:18,300 comedy like holds up today all the like 50s comedies and like 212 00:12:18,300 --> 00:12:21,200 the one or two early 60s comedies. 213 00:12:21,200 --> 00:12:23,700 I just want to I can't stand them. 214 00:12:23,800 --> 00:12:25,100 I don't like Smiles of a summer night. 215 00:12:25,100 --> 00:12:27,700 Even I like it. It's good farce. 216 00:12:27,700 --> 00:12:29,600 It's not my favorite, but it works. 217 00:12:29,700 --> 00:12:32,200 As far as but ya know Fanny and Alexander, you've got to fart 218 00:12:32,200 --> 00:12:34,300 jokes. Yeah, and they're in their den 219 00:12:34,300 --> 00:12:38,700 with the you know, the yeah the drama of um, okay. 220 00:12:38,700 --> 00:12:44,400 So I think like the a 24 gods are not smiling on us for being 221 00:12:44,400 --> 00:12:48,900 maybe like to obscure what feel like we could get more obscure. 222 00:12:48,900 --> 00:12:58,200 Oh we could but like, you know, let's see, but yeah, it's cool. 223 00:12:58,200 --> 00:13:03,800 I mean to also think about but what about tarkovsky's influence 224 00:13:03,800 --> 00:13:11,900 on Bergman well Tarkovsky is influence on Bergman. 225 00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:15,000 I mean, I know that the two loved each other. 226 00:13:15,500 --> 00:13:22,600 I wonder if I wonder if seeing Andrei rublev like did anything. 227 00:13:22,700 --> 00:13:26,600 Yeah, I mean perform like bergman's check because Bergman 228 00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:29,500 changed so much so much these like from through a glass 229 00:13:29,500 --> 00:13:33,300 Darkly, which is also I guess while he was location Scouting 230 00:13:33,300 --> 00:13:37,400 For That film he like he found four which is you know, the 231 00:13:37,400 --> 00:13:39,500 island that he spent the rest of his life on yeah. 232 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:43,600 I wonder if like there's some something about fora that like 233 00:13:43,900 --> 00:13:45,900 change his Outlook even made these like two documentaries, 234 00:13:45,900 --> 00:13:49,900 but for that plays sort of like a Michael apted like Up Up 235 00:13:49,900 --> 00:13:51,500 series contribution. Yeah. 236 00:13:51,500 --> 00:13:54,300 Yeah, and so he like became obsessed with this place. 237 00:13:54,300 --> 00:13:57,500 Anyway, we are probably moving into like obscure territory, but 238 00:13:57,500 --> 00:14:00,800 well, but I will like I just like there is a couple like for 239 00:14:00,800 --> 00:14:06,000 my understanding he saw Yvonne's childhood and that began to get 240 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:09,600 him to try to create Cinema as dream. 241 00:14:09,700 --> 00:14:11,900 In a way, I mean not that he hadn't done that before but he 242 00:14:11,900 --> 00:14:13,900 felt like that was a key for him. 243 00:14:13,900 --> 00:14:18,100 And then there's a story about him and spend nyqvist watching 244 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:21,700 Andrei rublyov at like 1:00 a.m. With no subtitles. 245 00:14:21,700 --> 00:14:26,000 Just like oh my God, this is the greatest thing I've ever seen 246 00:14:26,200 --> 00:14:29,800 and I just love that image, you know, but but yeah, okay and 247 00:14:29,800 --> 00:14:32,300 then tarkovsky kind of abandoned like the style of those two 248 00:14:32,300 --> 00:14:35,500 films, which I actually I mean under blood for me is definitely 249 00:14:35,500 --> 00:14:38,100 like the peak. I mean the staging of the Bell 250 00:14:38,100 --> 00:14:41,100 making stuff is just Any time you watch it. 251 00:14:41,100 --> 00:14:44,300 You can't believe it talk about not having a sophomore slump 252 00:14:45,800 --> 00:14:48,600 like it's like holy cow. It's so impressive. 253 00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:54,000 So what about everyone's least favorite topic certainly mine 254 00:14:54,200 --> 00:14:59,600 genre our films and genre. Like I've like cries and 255 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:04,300 Whispers is way scarier than any horror film and an hour of the 256 00:15:04,300 --> 00:15:08,500 wolf is not as scary as cries and Whispers even though that's 257 00:15:08,900 --> 00:15:11,000 the closest thing. Thing Bergman made to a horror 258 00:15:11,000 --> 00:15:13,700 film in most people's mind cries and Whispers our life of 259 00:15:13,700 --> 00:15:16,800 marionettes orbit. Also like him like desperately 260 00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:20,000 packing like everything. He like took from Freud and like 261 00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:22,800 just like eating being as literal as yeah, as one could 262 00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:25,700 possibly be. Yeah, but but like like what 263 00:15:25,700 --> 00:15:29,300 about genre? And I mean, I like I think 264 00:15:29,500 --> 00:15:31,900 hereditary is a horror movie like Ivo. 265 00:15:31,900 --> 00:15:35,100 Yeah for people who not like it's not like I get why yeah. 266 00:15:35,200 --> 00:15:37,200 Yeah. Actually don't get why I like 267 00:15:37,200 --> 00:15:43,100 i-i-i mean Is like absolutely unabashedly a horror film like 268 00:15:43,100 --> 00:15:46,800 that was the goal and I feel like I was like Miss quoted like 269 00:15:46,800 --> 00:15:48,900 crazy. I mean, I'd rather like just 270 00:15:48,900 --> 00:15:51,900 never speak ever and just like release the movie sure you have 271 00:15:51,900 --> 00:15:54,600 to do the press and yeah, it's just a Minefield because you 272 00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:57,300 just say something kind of flippantly and then it becomes 273 00:15:57,300 --> 00:16:00,600 like your statement on the film, but no like Wizard of Oz for 274 00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:03,200 perverts. Yeah, which I was like drunk and 275 00:16:03,200 --> 00:16:05,100 you know, I mean I'm fine with it. 276 00:16:05,100 --> 00:16:08,400 But yeah, but I wouldn't want it to be you know, like my mom did 277 00:16:08,400 --> 00:16:12,400 Cover of the blue. Ray I hereby designate it Samara 278 00:16:12,700 --> 00:16:15,000 right Wizard of Oz for permits the dead that was not my 279 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:17,600 intention but like it was the first thing I said and like now 280 00:16:17,600 --> 00:16:20,400 it's you know the last word but I think I said something about 281 00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:25,000 like, you know, it's a it's a family tragedy that like becomes 282 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:27,700 like a nightmare in the fact that I like wasn't actually 283 00:16:27,700 --> 00:16:30,700 using the word horror. It is somehow the Omission 284 00:16:30,700 --> 00:16:34,200 became like a statement. But yeah, it's a horror movie of 285 00:16:34,200 --> 00:16:36,200 course like that. That's what I want to do it 286 00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:39,000 there people like crawling on the walls, you know, yeah for 287 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:41,500 sure. Our and then you know mid some 288 00:16:41,500 --> 00:16:44,600 are is maybe something else? I don't know. 289 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:48,400 I mean, it's horror adjacent. I feel like yeah, I feel like an 290 00:16:48,400 --> 00:16:50,300 asshole even saying the word adjacent. 291 00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:55,400 I see it as a fairy tale more than anything especially because 292 00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:58,500 of just like her trajectory like her Arc. 293 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:02,200 If anything I think like the trick of the movie or like what 294 00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:05,700 I was what I kind of got excited about doing was like everybody 295 00:17:05,700 --> 00:17:08,500 else like every other visitor in that film including her 296 00:17:08,500 --> 00:17:12,500 boyfriend like it's a folk horror movie like without any 297 00:17:12,800 --> 00:17:16,200 shame or without any like pretensions to something else. 298 00:17:16,200 --> 00:17:19,300 It's a folk horror movie, but for her, it's like this perverse 299 00:17:19,300 --> 00:17:22,500 wish-fulfillment fantasy that like, you know is just 300 00:17:22,599 --> 00:17:27,500 ultimately a fairytale wear like this community could be seen as 301 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:31,400 a, you know date. I want them to be read at least 302 00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:34,200 on first viewing before you kind of get a sense of what this 303 00:17:34,200 --> 00:17:36,700 thing really is like that they're like this real place 304 00:17:36,700 --> 00:17:39,400 with like a real history and like Rich traditions. 305 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:43,800 But you know, I can't watch the film anymore without seeing them 306 00:17:43,800 --> 00:17:47,600 like as strictly manifestations of Danny's like will and it's 307 00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:51,100 cool the this version the finished version, you know, or 308 00:17:51,100 --> 00:17:54,300 maybe it's also just watching it again because as we all know 309 00:17:54,300 --> 00:17:58,100 watching films multiple times is important to really 310 00:17:58,100 --> 00:18:01,700 understanding them. It felt so much more from 311 00:18:01,700 --> 00:18:05,200 Danny's perspective partially and some of the like visual 312 00:18:05,200 --> 00:18:07,800 effects treatment two things, but even just in the editing 313 00:18:07,800 --> 00:18:10,600 choices that at least that's how I appearance at the second time 314 00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:13,800 and and and everything you're saying like we're everything you 315 00:18:13,800 --> 00:18:16,700 just said really resonated with my experience of watching it the 316 00:18:16,700 --> 00:18:18,900 second time last night. That's great. 317 00:18:18,900 --> 00:18:21,100 So it was it was pretty sick. By the way. 318 00:18:21,100 --> 00:18:28,300 Did you ever watch any of those like 70s English TV folk horror 319 00:18:28,300 --> 00:18:32,100 like mr.james things that I sent you my God, I didn't it's okay 320 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:34,200 fuck. No, I was really excited about 321 00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:35,600 it. But you sent it to me exactly at 322 00:18:35,600 --> 00:18:38,300 the time where like where you were done was neglecting 323 00:18:38,300 --> 00:18:41,400 everything that anybody At me and I understand and I like, you 324 00:18:41,400 --> 00:18:43,300 know just burned like every bridge in my life. 325 00:18:43,300 --> 00:18:46,100 That's fine except for with the people who know what it's like 326 00:18:46,100 --> 00:18:48,200 to make a movie and like, you know, just kind of yeah, you're 327 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:50,500 going to be Emma here and it's fine before we move on. 328 00:18:50,500 --> 00:18:54,200 I want to know like, you know, what what genre you'd like place 329 00:18:54,200 --> 00:18:57,900 the which in but I'm really interested to know like how you 330 00:18:57,900 --> 00:19:02,700 might categorize the lighthouse. Yeah, I would again I completely 331 00:19:02,700 --> 00:19:06,300 understand why people don't see the witch as a horror movie that 332 00:19:06,300 --> 00:19:08,600 it was certainly my attempt to make a horror movie. 333 00:19:09,300 --> 00:19:11,500 So, I saw it. Is that even though certainly 334 00:19:11,700 --> 00:19:15,300 like the family drama is more important. 335 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:18,400 I mean like you see it a witch flying on a broomstick. 336 00:19:18,400 --> 00:19:21,000 I mean, maybe that's scary but like that certainly it's 337 00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:22,700 awesome. It's really were trouble. 338 00:19:22,700 --> 00:19:26,700 Whatever should be even if it wasn't successfully so but for 339 00:19:26,700 --> 00:19:31,600 my money that was horror and the lighthouse if I've had to like 340 00:19:31,600 --> 00:19:35,300 designate a genre it would be the literary genre of a of a 341 00:19:35,300 --> 00:19:39,100 weird tale like Mr. James, Blackwood. 342 00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:43,700 But is something else you can then that but that would sort of 343 00:19:43,700 --> 00:19:46,900 be even have the octopus right exactly left graph exactly. 344 00:19:47,300 --> 00:19:52,200 But but but it certainly was just something idea that I had 345 00:19:52,200 --> 00:19:56,200 that got out of control and my brother and I wrote it and had 346 00:19:56,400 --> 00:20:01,400 it had fun. But I think it's also funny how 347 00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:07,400 the different ways in which odours of a certain caliber like 348 00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:11,600 will or won't talk about Jean. You or say their film is genre 349 00:20:11,600 --> 00:20:15,300 or like laughs off the idea of genre being important and even 350 00:20:15,300 --> 00:20:19,000 more interestingly is where people who are sort of 351 00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:22,900 sophisticated filmmakers feel that like horror genre. 352 00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:27,700 Whatever that means to them is like not something that one 353 00:20:27,700 --> 00:20:30,800 could consider art that can really talk about what it means 354 00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:35,800 to be a human being but is rather just some sort of cheap 355 00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:41,000 commercial thing, but obviously these whores Stories things like 356 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:45,300 hereditary that actually do like probe the darker side of 357 00:20:45,300 --> 00:20:49,300 humanity in like a serious way. Like that's incredibly 358 00:20:49,300 --> 00:20:52,900 important. Yeah and and should be respected 359 00:20:52,900 --> 00:20:54,000 man. Yeah. 360 00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:56,600 No, I agree. I mean there was at least like a 361 00:20:56,608 --> 00:21:01,600 five-year period in my adolescence where like horror 362 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:05,000 movies were like, the only thing I had this a binder this 363 00:21:05,000 --> 00:21:09,000 three-ring binder that I just kept I kept adding. 364 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:13,200 Like badly photocopied like black and white because that's 365 00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:16,000 all I had because we had a black and white printer images from 366 00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:19,300 the internet from horror movies. So there's just like I like drew 367 00:21:19,300 --> 00:21:22,700 a lot and so I guess like that's that was the point was a weird. 368 00:21:22,900 --> 00:21:25,700 I guess. I have like a collector's thing 369 00:21:25,700 --> 00:21:28,100 where I just never actually went through this thing, but I just 370 00:21:28,100 --> 00:21:31,700 kept adding to it. So is this compulsive? 371 00:21:31,700 --> 00:21:34,500 Do you still have it? I'll be I'm sure it's somewhere. 372 00:21:34,500 --> 00:21:37,400 I mean it would take I mean it's going to be in some box like 373 00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:42,600 somewhere in my in my family's Home, I'd be curious to see how 374 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:48,800 much of your Primal narrative began their, you know act like 375 00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:52,200 everyone makes the same movie or write the same book or paint the 376 00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:53,600 same painting over and over and over again. 377 00:21:53,600 --> 00:21:56,600 I think what it was to is that there were films that really 378 00:21:56,600 --> 00:21:59,400 really affected me and scared me. 379 00:21:59,500 --> 00:22:02,300 I was really impressed Nimble as a kid and there were a few 380 00:22:02,300 --> 00:22:04,300 films. I just like I saw them too young 381 00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:08,000 didn't know how to process them. Like I was clearly like, I mean, 382 00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:11,300 I'm sure I made. Ian's like subconsciously that 383 00:22:11,300 --> 00:22:14,600 like, you know like that then, you know, like enhanced 384 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:20,000 everything like Carrie really really depalma's film really 385 00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:22,200 destroyed me. I wasn't able to watch it again 386 00:22:22,200 --> 00:22:25,700 until like my 20s and and then I realized like it's like a really 387 00:22:25,700 --> 00:22:29,100 sad comedy but right but it's no but as he for a kid, I mean, 388 00:22:29,100 --> 00:22:32,900 it's it really like I could not get the image of Piper Laurie 389 00:22:32,900 --> 00:22:36,300 like chasing Sissy Spacek around this like candlelit house like 390 00:22:36,300 --> 00:22:38,900 out of my head. She's got this like horrible 391 00:22:38,900 --> 00:22:41,600 smile. And she's you know holding a 392 00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:44,300 knife and like that that just like has like come back to me. 393 00:22:44,300 --> 00:22:47,000 And so many ways just like Still Still. 394 00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:49,800 I'll have like a nightmare about that and that and that is sort 395 00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:54,700 of like weird tone of that film that's like unrealistic almost 396 00:22:54,700 --> 00:22:58,300 kind of unprofessional and exist and sentimental with the Pinot 397 00:22:58,300 --> 00:23:01,400 DiMaggio school. Yeah, like 400 for it for a kid. 398 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:04,100 I can see that being like very disturbing especially because 399 00:23:04,100 --> 00:23:07,400 it's like it's so dissonant with like the sort of Disney 400 00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:12,200 Spielberg like thing that Is supposed to be yeah movie 401 00:23:12,200 --> 00:23:15,200 viewing if you don't absolutely and it is it is that artifice 402 00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:17,300 and that like there's like a romance to it. 403 00:23:17,300 --> 00:23:20,100 That's really upsetting and then I talked about it this so much 404 00:23:20,100 --> 00:23:23,200 on like the Press tour for hereditary that I like, you 405 00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:25,300 know, kind of I don't want to talk about it again, but if 406 00:23:25,308 --> 00:23:27,800 we're talking about things that affected us like Cook the Thief 407 00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:30,800 His Wife and Her Lover saw that too young that like really 408 00:23:30,800 --> 00:23:34,200 bothered me and like a deep deep way. 409 00:23:34,700 --> 00:23:39,500 And remember there was a like a kid's cartoon 30 minutes long. 410 00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:42,700 Long called the Snowman but like I don't know why that is I think 411 00:23:42,700 --> 00:23:47,000 it's like a kick like a girl or a little boy that like get on a 412 00:23:47,008 --> 00:23:49,500 snowman's like back and like fly through the world. 413 00:23:49,500 --> 00:23:52,500 It's I can't remember even what the story was but I just 414 00:23:52,500 --> 00:23:57,300 remember that it like bugged me. So I it's hard to tell I know 415 00:23:57,300 --> 00:24:00,800 that there's something about like the Maudlin when combined 416 00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:03,500 with something. I don't know like the modeling 417 00:24:03,500 --> 00:24:06,600 the grotesque when they kind of meat as a kid. 418 00:24:06,600 --> 00:24:09,000 I like couldn't process that. Yeah, and there's also just like 419 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:12,200 a mean-spirited The Nest to certain films that like really 420 00:24:12,200 --> 00:24:15,000 bug me as a kid and then I kind of became obsessed with like 421 00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:18,900 that tradition like I saw blue velvet and Like Clockwork Orange 422 00:24:18,900 --> 00:24:22,500 when I was just very young and I hated them but then I like I 423 00:24:22,500 --> 00:24:24,600 like being obsessed and I couldn't stop talking about it 424 00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:27,000 and then they obviously became like, you know, some of my 425 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:30,900 favorite films I still like, you know blue velvet there's nothing 426 00:24:30,900 --> 00:24:34,000 original about like loving blue velvet, but it is it is just 427 00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:37,800 it's just a lot of the greatest thing ever like ever I mean, I 428 00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:40,700 don't know if you had this experience but I certainly like 429 00:24:40,700 --> 00:24:43,500 the things I hated when I first encountered them because they 430 00:24:43,500 --> 00:24:48,400 felt kind of evil or just like like just off and those are the 431 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,700 things that kind of I kept returning to and they became 432 00:24:50,700 --> 00:24:54,200 obsessions and Fascinations. And then I mean, I don't know 433 00:24:54,200 --> 00:24:57,300 what I do in my own work because I'm like too close to it. 434 00:24:57,300 --> 00:25:00,800 I my nose is like certainly like right up against this movie. 435 00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:05,200 I have no objectivity, but I imagine that there's you know 436 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:08,800 that I'm I can see myself like kind of still. 437 00:25:09,700 --> 00:25:13,100 Sling with what it is that fascinates me about narratives 438 00:25:13,100 --> 00:25:14,700 like that. What about you? 439 00:25:14,700 --> 00:25:19,000 I mean, I mean like just you know, like what what got to as a 440 00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:22,300 kid like what and yeah, what what were your early influences? 441 00:25:22,300 --> 00:25:25,800 Like what were the films that you like first like I assert I 442 00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:28,500 certainly read a lot of scripts like as a teenager that like 443 00:25:28,500 --> 00:25:31,700 were extremely derivative of like one or two things sure site 444 00:25:31,700 --> 00:25:34,900 ranked wanted like wished that I had made like, I wonder if it's 445 00:25:34,900 --> 00:25:37,400 other people's experience of like when you first start making 446 00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:40,900 things like me, I think we're all we're All derivative in the 447 00:25:40,900 --> 00:25:46,100 beginning and it was I remember seeing some Picasso exhibit in 448 00:25:46,100 --> 00:25:50,300 my twenties being really happy to see that after his sort of 449 00:25:50,500 --> 00:25:54,500 academic what we would call photo-realistic period that then 450 00:25:54,500 --> 00:25:57,900 he was just painting like any other Impressionists before he 451 00:25:57,900 --> 00:26:02,200 became I mean but better but it was just like what everyone else 452 00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,200 is doing and then and then he became himself. 453 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:09,500 I actually even the which to me feels like derivative. 454 00:26:09,700 --> 00:26:12,500 Like it's you know, like I feel like it wears his influences on 455 00:26:12,500 --> 00:26:14,600 its sleeve much more than the lighthouse like I think you can 456 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:18,000 identify influences in the lighthouse for sure. 457 00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:22,700 But I feel like it collectively it sort of I think I'm starting 458 00:26:22,700 --> 00:26:26,100 to become myself a little more which hopefully I'll continue to 459 00:26:26,100 --> 00:26:30,000 do but yeah, I mean whatever for Mary Poppins to like Conan the 460 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:33,900 Barbarian like in Ridley Scott's Legend, I don't know and Star 461 00:26:33,900 --> 00:26:35,900 Wars and Indiana Jones and all that crap. 462 00:26:35,900 --> 00:26:41,500 I think the the first movie that wasn't a movie that would be 463 00:26:41,500 --> 00:26:45,700 easy to access that was very influential which I've also 464 00:26:45,700 --> 00:26:47,500 talked about plenty is Nosferatu. 465 00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:50,100 Yeah. I saw an image of Max Schreck in 466 00:26:50,100 --> 00:26:53,700 a book about vampires and Elementary School library and at 467 00:26:53,700 --> 00:26:56,900 that time especially in like real New Hampshire, like it 468 00:26:56,900 --> 00:26:58,300 wasn't you couldn't just you know, whatever. 469 00:26:58,300 --> 00:27:03,000 So we had to like go to the video store 45 minutes away and 470 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:06,300 order it and then wait for it to come in the mail and whatever 471 00:27:06,300 --> 00:27:09,900 and I wore that VHS out but it's funny because as a kid I could 472 00:27:09,900 --> 00:27:14,000 watch shit that I think is boring today just being 473 00:27:14,300 --> 00:27:18,300 intrigued by what are adults up to like like like I do have a 474 00:27:18,300 --> 00:27:21,600 fondness for Marks and Ivory films, but I definitely do. 475 00:27:21,700 --> 00:27:25,200 Yeah, but like the bad like the boring ones like even as a kid, 476 00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:28,000 like if my parents would be watching it should be like that 477 00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:31,400 the bostonians like I wouldn't worry about it was going on but 478 00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:34,200 you just but it was just like interesting to watch grown up 479 00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:38,700 people doing weird things, but I don't know and and to bring it 480 00:27:38,700 --> 00:27:42,100 back to life. I mean to Bergman like seven 481 00:27:42,100 --> 00:27:44,600 seal. I watched Pretty Young and 482 00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:47,800 certainly now like it seems like a crappy High School play a 483 00:27:47,800 --> 00:27:51,500 little like not to be I mean that's going way too far, but 484 00:27:51,500 --> 00:27:52,200 you know what? I mean? 485 00:27:52,300 --> 00:27:55,500 No, it's definitely like it belongs to his like early period 486 00:27:55,500 --> 00:27:59,200 like big test really literal like extremely like there's 487 00:27:59,200 --> 00:28:02,100 there's like a broadness to it. But yeah that kind of you know, 488 00:28:02,100 --> 00:28:04,400 but it brought us to the fall. So incredible, it's also 489 00:28:04,400 --> 00:28:06,100 Caroline. It's so well-written but I mean 490 00:28:06,100 --> 00:28:09,100 Max fun see those chainmail is like a sweater. 491 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:13,100 Silver it's like, you know, I'm but I know that the budget was 492 00:28:13,100 --> 00:28:17,200 very low and and it certainly Works speaking of Lynch that 493 00:28:17,200 --> 00:28:20,700 struck me the other day that like Robert this could not be 494 00:28:20,700 --> 00:28:22,900 true. But that Robert Blake's mystery 495 00:28:22,900 --> 00:28:24,900 man. Who's like one of the scariest 496 00:28:24,900 --> 00:28:28,500 things in cinema to me like in Lost Highway like couldn't have 497 00:28:28,500 --> 00:28:31,400 existed without death. Yeah. 498 00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:35,700 I did that did that it was kind of struck me recently and again, 499 00:28:35,700 --> 00:28:38,100 I could be wrong. So even the pale. 500 00:28:38,100 --> 00:28:41,000 Yeah the pale face to face. And also but just like there is 501 00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:46,000 a certain kind of Grimace that death makes the sort of taunting 502 00:28:46,400 --> 00:28:51,000 fun sito's character that you know, Robert Blake and his just 503 00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:54,800 Robert Blake Enos. Yeah, the stretched grimaces 504 00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:57,600 just so scary way. What about what about I want to 505 00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:01,100 ask you what is it that kind of like first Drew you to like 506 00:29:01,100 --> 00:29:05,900 esoterica because clearly like you have this real fascination 507 00:29:06,100 --> 00:29:11,700 with bygone eras and like I mean you you Of you clearly like a 508 00:29:11,700 --> 00:29:14,800 person who loves creating worlds, but you also really love 509 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:18,000 like recreating worlds. Yeah, for some reason. 510 00:29:18,000 --> 00:29:20,800 I was really always into costumes and I used to wear 511 00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:24,600 costumes like to school. I used to ask for costumes for 512 00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:27,000 Christmas presents. I don't know like where that 513 00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:31,400 comes from, but I just I have that was something that was 514 00:29:31,400 --> 00:29:36,100 always really interesting to me. And so then like books about 515 00:29:36,100 --> 00:29:38,900 fashion history, like I know that I know that my grandmother 516 00:29:38,900 --> 00:29:42,700 who died Died wouldwould did some costume design for like 517 00:29:42,700 --> 00:29:44,800 Community Theater and like University ballet. 518 00:29:45,000 --> 00:29:49,000 So she had some like books when I was like super little like for 519 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:52,700 and stuff that had that were like, lushly Illustrated that I 520 00:29:52,700 --> 00:29:55,700 still have like one of them that I drew all over like it'd be 521 00:29:55,700 --> 00:29:58,100 like someone's like, you know, it's just like a bust of 522 00:29:58,100 --> 00:30:00,200 somebody and I would like Drew with markers their legs like 523 00:30:00,200 --> 00:30:03,100 really shitty like, you know, what is like six for whatever 524 00:30:03,300 --> 00:30:06,500 and then my grandfather collected Antiques and he knew a 525 00:30:06,500 --> 00:30:11,300 lot about them and so that became A germ of something so 526 00:30:11,300 --> 00:30:15,400 and then when we would go on like family trips to like like 527 00:30:15,600 --> 00:30:18,800 Colonial Williamsburg and Plymouth Plantation things that 528 00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:20,400 a lot of people thought they were boring. 529 00:30:20,400 --> 00:30:23,400 I fucking loved it. You know, I was like, yeah, like 530 00:30:23,400 --> 00:30:26,300 I want to be a blacksmith. This is great. 531 00:30:26,300 --> 00:30:30,100 And I love talking to the living history nerds. 532 00:30:30,100 --> 00:30:33,600 Like I thought it was the coolest thing and then there was 533 00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:39,700 another this is like a sort of gross story, but my dad Dad 534 00:30:39,700 --> 00:30:44,700 taught at the University of New Hampshire and there is a art 535 00:30:44,700 --> 00:30:50,500 show by this Lafayette and immigrant Hyman Bloom and he was 536 00:30:50,500 --> 00:30:53,400 like a New England painter who had this retrospective that was 537 00:30:53,600 --> 00:30:58,300 like really amazing and he had all these like hellish imagery 538 00:30:58,300 --> 00:31:04,200 of like demons and astral planes and stuff like these huge scale, 539 00:31:04,300 --> 00:31:07,200 you know, and I thought it was and my dad met him and my 540 00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:09,400 parents got along with he and his wife and he would come over. 541 00:31:09,700 --> 00:31:12,500 And I was just enamored of this artist is because at the time I 542 00:31:12,500 --> 00:31:18,200 wanted to be a visual artist and and he was like a very wizardly 543 00:31:18,700 --> 00:31:22,100 person in my eye, but he was very gentle and I would talk to 544 00:31:22,100 --> 00:31:24,700 them about comic books and Star Wars and stuff and he was like 545 00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:31,100 down to hear it, but he gave me two books of one. 546 00:31:31,100 --> 00:31:34,700 That was like only durrrr and one that was like Martin shown 547 00:31:34,700 --> 00:31:38,100 Gower and other northern Renaissance people and he was 548 00:31:38,100 --> 00:31:42,400 like if you if you can Draw this you can draw anything and I kind 549 00:31:42,400 --> 00:31:47,500 of threw my comic books away like metaphorically anyway, and 550 00:31:47,500 --> 00:31:52,300 I kind of abandoned being interested in pop culture 551 00:31:52,300 --> 00:31:55,500 things. Mostly at that point. 552 00:31:55,500 --> 00:31:58,600 Then I said, I would still kind of like occasional, you know, go 553 00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:01,500 I was like obligatory really see the like Christopher Nolan 554 00:32:01,500 --> 00:32:06,300 Batman movies like into my early 20s and eventually in there are 555 00:32:06,300 --> 00:32:09,200 great for what they're you know and Nolan's it's just great. 556 00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:12,800 Yeah. But you know, you know had the 557 00:32:12,800 --> 00:32:16,600 taste of a fucking dilettante since it's a little kid. 558 00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:18,700 I don't know what to say. It's kind of it's like saying 559 00:32:18,700 --> 00:32:22,000 all that makes me want to vomit but is the case. 560 00:32:22,200 --> 00:32:24,100 Yeah. No, I mean I've been to your 561 00:32:24,100 --> 00:32:25,100 apartment. I don't think it's where you're 562 00:32:25,100 --> 00:32:29,100 living now, but I saw your little you know, like punishment 563 00:32:29,100 --> 00:32:31,400 room where you just feel like filled with books. 564 00:32:31,700 --> 00:32:34,500 Like I definitely noticed a lot of like first editions in there 565 00:32:34,500 --> 00:32:37,700 and it definitely felt like, you know the room that belonged to 566 00:32:37,700 --> 00:32:39,400 somebody who like, you know has spent his life. 567 00:32:39,500 --> 00:32:43,900 Life going into like used book stores looking for you know 568 00:32:43,900 --> 00:32:47,500 out-of-print books, which I recognize because that you know, 569 00:32:47,500 --> 00:32:52,300 I know I'm not that far away from being that person myself. 570 00:32:52,400 --> 00:32:54,000 Well, that's why we get along buddy. 571 00:32:55,200 --> 00:33:01,000 It's so Birdman like to work with the same crew and he liked 572 00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:05,300 to work with the same like Troupe of actors, and I'm I 573 00:33:05,300 --> 00:33:08,600 think I think many most filmmakers wish that they had 574 00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:13,100 that that they That Core group of actors that they were working 575 00:33:13,100 --> 00:33:16,100 with so closely to get these incredible performances and you 576 00:33:16,100 --> 00:33:20,000 know and often like next step is to hit or miss pretty great. 577 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:23,200 Yeah, but Hannah and Her Sisters that that's pretty that's 578 00:33:23,200 --> 00:33:25,000 incredible. I'm just saying but well, okay. 579 00:33:25,100 --> 00:33:27,100 The only mrs. Are like when he's like chewing 580 00:33:27,100 --> 00:33:30,300 the scenery and like Conan or Flash Gordon, right? 581 00:33:30,700 --> 00:33:33,100 Obviously, that's what he needs to be doing. 582 00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:37,300 But it's not the same work that he's doing with you kind of know 583 00:33:37,300 --> 00:33:39,300 if he's in a Hollywood film like it's a go. 584 00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:42,700 This guy has a supporting role. He's he's gonna be the bad guy, 585 00:33:42,700 --> 00:33:43,900 right exactly. He did it. 586 00:33:43,900 --> 00:33:47,800 He might have an accent so he's obviously going yeah, that's not 587 00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:53,300 English. So so working on your second 588 00:33:53,300 --> 00:33:55,700 film. How much were you able to bring 589 00:33:55,700 --> 00:33:59,800 on crew from hereditary? How much did you want to talk 590 00:33:59,800 --> 00:34:00,700 about that? Yeah. 591 00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:07,900 Well, so pizzelle my DP and I have been working together since 592 00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:13,400 grad school since we Since AFI and he's just one of my best 593 00:34:13,400 --> 00:34:16,900 friends and we have a you know, this great shorthand and we just 594 00:34:16,900 --> 00:34:20,300 like share the same taste and see things in a very like in the 595 00:34:20,308 --> 00:34:24,699 same way and we argue like very, you know, very little very 596 00:34:24,699 --> 00:34:28,400 infrequently and then and I would say like when there is a 597 00:34:28,408 --> 00:34:32,000 misunderstanding like we take it like very badly like unset if if 598 00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:34,600 it turns out that we thought we understood each other but like 599 00:34:35,199 --> 00:34:38,500 we had different ideas like we get like upset and like need a 600 00:34:38,507 --> 00:34:42,699 minute. He and I have this total 601 00:34:42,699 --> 00:34:48,000 shorthand and you know, he's just I I love the guy and I'm 602 00:34:48,000 --> 00:34:51,100 very grateful for that relationship in my life. 603 00:34:51,400 --> 00:34:54,500 Not just professionally but he's also just like, you know a 604 00:34:54,500 --> 00:35:00,800 beautiful person and then you know, I had a really incredible 605 00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:06,300 time on hereditary with my production designer and costume 606 00:35:06,300 --> 00:35:11,600 designer and was Gracie. And Olga milk, I've worked with 607 00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:14,400 organelle by the way, unlike short films when I was like in 608 00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:17,500 the dregs of the New York in the garbage pail. 609 00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:20,500 Yeah, she's fantastic. I loved it. 610 00:35:20,500 --> 00:35:24,300 And you know, the only reason that I didn't work with them on 611 00:35:24,400 --> 00:35:28,500 Midsomer for instance is because Midsomer was a project that I 612 00:35:28,500 --> 00:35:32,000 got started. I guess almost five years ago 613 00:35:32,000 --> 00:35:35,600 and we had a Swedish production designer named Henrik Stenson 614 00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:39,500 who was on from the beginning. He did an incredible job and he 615 00:35:39,500 --> 00:35:44,700 and I kind of had this dialogue going for you know for years and 616 00:35:44,900 --> 00:35:48,700 and he was building this like really I mean giant lookbook, 617 00:35:48,700 --> 00:35:52,200 you know, and he'd send it to me and it was filled with you know 618 00:35:52,500 --> 00:35:56,100 references and I would then like kind of like remove certain 619 00:35:56,100 --> 00:35:57,800 references. They don't want working for me 620 00:35:57,800 --> 00:36:01,100 and then I'd add my own and then that would provoke him to add 621 00:36:01,100 --> 00:36:04,000 more and then he'd send it to me and then I'd add more and take 622 00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:08,800 out some and I mean this thing like is like, you know 300 623 00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:12,800 pages. Um, and that was really great 624 00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:17,100 because once we dove into pre-production, we had no time 625 00:36:17,100 --> 00:36:20,100 like we had to build this entire Village and just over two 626 00:36:20,100 --> 00:36:22,400 months. It was it was really big and we 627 00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:23,900 could have only done it in Hungary. 628 00:36:23,900 --> 00:36:27,400 So he did an amazing job. I think I think he almost lost 629 00:36:27,400 --> 00:36:30,300 his mind just from you know the pressure of it. 630 00:36:30,300 --> 00:36:33,500 And so did I by the way, I mean like the water was always like 631 00:36:33,500 --> 00:36:35,400 just up to my nose on on this film. 632 00:36:35,700 --> 00:36:38,400 There were there were times on set that I had to just like walk 633 00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:42,200 to a corner and like cry when I probably like shouldn't admit 634 00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:46,600 but I like the recruit people who are probably like, you know, 635 00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:49,800 who either like caught it and saw that like the director was 636 00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:53,100 crying in the corner or that or I maybe looked like I was like 637 00:36:53,300 --> 00:36:57,800 laughing maniacally either way. It's probably like a troubling 638 00:36:57,800 --> 00:37:01,100 site. So that was a really great 639 00:37:01,100 --> 00:37:06,300 collaboration and I'm really proud of his work and then we 640 00:37:06,300 --> 00:37:11,100 worked with a Hungarian costume. Enter again because we needed 641 00:37:11,100 --> 00:37:17,000 somebody local named Andrea flesh who is really are under a 642 00:37:17,000 --> 00:37:19,500 flesh. I'm used to calling her Andrea, 643 00:37:20,000 --> 00:37:25,800 but really really I mean brilliant woman like so so good 644 00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:30,400 at what she does and I mean the reason I that I actually like 645 00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:33,800 hired her and was kind of immediate was because she did 646 00:37:34,100 --> 00:37:39,300 Peter greenaway is Tulsa Looper suitcases or the Tulsa Looper. 647 00:37:39,400 --> 00:37:42,100 Yes, but like, you know a I think a couple like a couple of 648 00:37:42,100 --> 00:37:44,300 them because I think there are I don't know how many volumes 649 00:37:44,300 --> 00:37:48,700 there are and it's not necessarily a film that or a 650 00:37:49,100 --> 00:37:51,300 video piece. I don't know what you'd call the 651 00:37:51,300 --> 00:37:52,500 Tulsa Looper suitcase. I don't know. 652 00:37:52,500 --> 00:37:54,800 I don't know. Yeah, have you seen it? 653 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:58,500 It's but I've been reading about like all of his Antics. 654 00:37:58,700 --> 00:38:02,400 It's like hilariously difficult. It's like a return to what he's 655 00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:06,100 doing in the beginning with like the Falls, but like even more 656 00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:10,400 inaccessible. Anyway, I know He's probably a 657 00:38:10,408 --> 00:38:15,700 very big brutal person to work with and and so I was impressed 658 00:38:15,700 --> 00:38:21,400 that she like made it through a green away a green away run and 659 00:38:21,500 --> 00:38:24,900 and so she was incredible and you know, we did as much as we 660 00:38:24,900 --> 00:38:28,700 could with the time and the budget like we definitely had 661 00:38:28,700 --> 00:38:31,300 ideas for the costumes that like, you know, kind of just 662 00:38:31,300 --> 00:38:33,800 like net. We're they were never actually 663 00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:39,600 where they alter wishing like they certainly there's like Was 664 00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:43,600 it all Scandinavian or is there some Slavic influence in the in 665 00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:46,500 the clothing of the villagers? Yeah, I mean there was 666 00:38:46,500 --> 00:38:50,900 definitely like Slavic influence and I also thought I like saw 667 00:38:50,900 --> 00:38:53,600 like a like an embroidered Elizabethan coif. 668 00:38:53,800 --> 00:38:58,200 Yeah. No, it's a stew like we I think 669 00:38:58,200 --> 00:39:01,700 it's a I think it's a very successful like melange like it 670 00:39:01,700 --> 00:39:05,300 comes together as something that looks like uniform and and its 671 00:39:05,300 --> 00:39:07,900 own thing. But I was just yeah, we thought 672 00:39:07,900 --> 00:39:10,400 I saw these. Oh no you Finally did there are 673 00:39:10,400 --> 00:39:15,000 things that we pulled from, you know, like Russia from certainly 674 00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:19,200 from Scandinavia in an unreal would be able to like explain 675 00:39:19,200 --> 00:39:21,600 expounded much further. But you know, it was very 676 00:39:21,600 --> 00:39:25,600 important to us that like every costume had like like different 677 00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:28,900 runes Incorporated because like these costumes like belong to 678 00:39:28,900 --> 00:39:32,100 these people and like and they they have adopted runes that 679 00:39:32,100 --> 00:39:36,100 like represent them and and then beyond that we there was a 680 00:39:36,100 --> 00:39:39,900 Swedish consultant on the film or martyr martyr. - Carlton 681 00:39:39,900 --> 00:39:43,500 fists who I you know, it's just like the best guy ever and he 682 00:39:43,500 --> 00:39:47,400 sort of invented this this language called the affect 683 00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:50,100 language. That's the aspiration stuff. 684 00:39:50,200 --> 00:39:51,500 Yeah. Well, yeah, it's like the 685 00:39:51,500 --> 00:39:55,000 emotional sheet music right which is which is a combination 686 00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:58,800 of like the runic alphabet and then like all of these emotional 687 00:39:59,000 --> 00:40:03,100 hieroglyphs that you know are kind of made up but also drawn 688 00:40:03,100 --> 00:40:08,600 from several sources and I mean even like every pair of shoes, 689 00:40:08,900 --> 00:40:15,300 you know, Like has its own thing going on and yeah, we went as 690 00:40:15,300 --> 00:40:19,000 far as we could in the time we had like to prepare and it's 691 00:40:19,000 --> 00:40:22,400 very successful particularly the clothing for for me like, you 692 00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:25,000 know, put the clothing particularly like really 693 00:40:26,200 --> 00:40:28,100 belonged. Oh, well, thank you. 694 00:40:28,100 --> 00:40:32,100 I'm really proud of her work. I mean she is just like such a 695 00:40:32,100 --> 00:40:34,800 sweet person and her crew is like so great. 696 00:40:36,500 --> 00:40:39,100 So yeah, I guess that's my kind of lung. 697 00:40:39,300 --> 00:40:43,000 Ended Meandering answers to like, you know who like who I've 698 00:40:43,000 --> 00:40:45,900 worked with on these last two films in those departments. 699 00:40:45,900 --> 00:40:50,300 I mean in post-production, I've worked with Luke Johnson for 700 00:40:50,300 --> 00:40:54,300 both films. He was the assistant nice guy 701 00:40:54,300 --> 00:40:57,600 the nicest guy so smart. He was the assistant editor on 702 00:40:57,600 --> 00:41:01,000 hereditary and I was working with Jen lame who's also just 703 00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:03,500 one of my favorite people and you know at this point one of my 704 00:41:03,500 --> 00:41:09,900 best friends, but I yeah, so I'm Jenn lame is like, you know, One 705 00:41:09,900 --> 00:41:13,600 of my favorite people and she's actually now working on 706 00:41:13,600 --> 00:41:18,200 Christopher Nolan's new film. So she's like she's moving fast, 707 00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:25,000 but but Luke was so so was such a big part of editing. 708 00:41:25,300 --> 00:41:28,900 I'm hereditary that we like we you know, we just gave him an 709 00:41:28,900 --> 00:41:34,400 editor credit and then you know, I would have done Midsummer with 710 00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:38,000 both hint him and Jen again, but Jen was busy. 711 00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:41,900 Yeah, and so I just pulled on Luke and and and he's somebody 712 00:41:41,900 --> 00:41:43,800 that I will keep working with as well. 713 00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:47,400 Like he's definitely on the team at this point. 714 00:41:47,500 --> 00:41:50,500 Awesome. How about you I had the great 715 00:41:50,500 --> 00:41:55,000 Fortune to be able to work with virtually all my I mean are all 716 00:41:55,000 --> 00:42:00,000 my keys all from from the which on the lighthouse the thing is, 717 00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:05,400 I developed to larger Studio movies that like didn't happen. 718 00:42:07,100 --> 00:42:13,400 And so And the lighthouse became an option and and we were 719 00:42:13,400 --> 00:42:18,600 shooting in Canada again. It was very easy to get the gang 720 00:42:19,000 --> 00:42:25,800 back and we had and also had an accelerated prep period and we 721 00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:32,000 never could have built that world without working with Craig 722 00:42:32,000 --> 00:42:35,400 Lathrop and Linda Muir again, because we have the right 723 00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:38,900 language and the right working relationship already and it's 724 00:42:39,300 --> 00:42:46,400 tacular work Jaron blaschke the DP we work together on all of my 725 00:42:46,400 --> 00:42:49,100 short films that aren't embarrassing and I worked with 726 00:42:49,100 --> 00:42:52,400 him as a production designer on other directors things and yeah 727 00:42:52,400 --> 00:42:56,300 that shorthand and yada yada, but he's I mean, he's 728 00:42:56,400 --> 00:42:57,900 incredible. He's an artist. 729 00:42:57,900 --> 00:43:02,500 I don't use that word to describe very many people and 730 00:43:02,500 --> 00:43:06,200 and also I mean and it's a real collaboration in the my films 731 00:43:06,500 --> 00:43:12,500 are if and when they are praised For like the Cinematic language, 732 00:43:12,600 --> 00:43:16,500 it's it would not be that way without Jerry and I'm not I 733 00:43:16,500 --> 00:43:19,900 think you are like this, but I'm not like Scorsese sort of 734 00:43:20,100 --> 00:43:24,500 dictating like this is every shot and like and so please 735 00:43:24,500 --> 00:43:30,100 carry it out like it. We are working on trying to find 736 00:43:30,100 --> 00:43:38,800 the most like essential simplest language for each scene and and 737 00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:44,300 Louise Ford the editor also she I've been I've known her for 738 00:43:44,300 --> 00:43:47,800 basically as long as Jaron and we have the same tight-knit 739 00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:51,400 relationship and I must say that the edit and the color correct 740 00:43:51,400 --> 00:43:54,300 were the only parts of making the lighthouse that weren't 741 00:43:54,300 --> 00:43:57,200 fucking miserable and yeah credibly difficult and like same 742 00:43:57,200 --> 00:44:01,800 for me same here like everything was so hard, you know at the 743 00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:05,600 White House, but the edit was a joy not the loo and I didn't 744 00:44:05,600 --> 00:44:08,500 have her work cut out for us, but it was like quite quite 745 00:44:08,500 --> 00:44:11,600 Pleasant. Yeah, I'm with you on that and I 746 00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:13,000 and and before we move on from that. 747 00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:18,500 I also want to mention Lars Knudsen my producer who I met on 748 00:44:18,500 --> 00:44:21,600 hereditary that was definitely you know, like I could not have 749 00:44:21,600 --> 00:44:24,000 made it through this film without him and he and I just 750 00:44:24,000 --> 00:44:26,800 started a production company and I really love the guy. 751 00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:31,100 He's like, he's just a total enabler. 752 00:44:31,500 --> 00:44:33,900 Yeah Lars Lars incredible. I work and you worked with him 753 00:44:33,900 --> 00:44:37,200 which I going to working with him in the future. 754 00:44:37,300 --> 00:44:40,600 I mean also, I mean the lighthouse If we're like going 755 00:44:40,600 --> 00:44:44,100 this direction, which we should be RT features and new Regency 756 00:44:44,100 --> 00:44:49,100 and a 24 gave me like incredible Freedom. 757 00:44:49,100 --> 00:44:51,900 Yeah, I can't believe I made that movie. 758 00:44:51,900 --> 00:44:55,200 It's kind of nuts. So thanks guys. 759 00:44:55,300 --> 00:44:57,400 Yeah. No, I mean it feels a little 760 00:44:57,400 --> 00:45:00,600 sycophantic talking about a 24 on the 824 podcast yesterday, 761 00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:04,800 but they are incredible and I not that they're always perfect. 762 00:45:05,100 --> 00:45:08,700 No, I mean do you yeah, it's gonna sell the the satanic 763 00:45:08,700 --> 00:45:10,600 temple. Sorry, oh, okay. 764 00:45:10,600 --> 00:45:12,200 Yeah do it. I know what you're talking 765 00:45:12,200 --> 00:45:12,700 about. Yeah. 766 00:45:12,900 --> 00:45:17,100 Yeah, so we didn't have any stars for the which they 24 767 00:45:17,100 --> 00:45:19,400 family they need something special for marketing and they 768 00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:23,800 wanted to have the satanic temple endorse the film and I 769 00:45:23,808 --> 00:45:28,100 don't have anything against the satanic temple and like or their 770 00:45:28,100 --> 00:45:31,800 political agenda or anything like that at all, but I didn't 771 00:45:31,800 --> 00:45:34,800 want the movie indoors by satanic temple. 772 00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:37,800 Like I wouldn't want it being endorsed by something that 773 00:45:37,800 --> 00:45:41,900 called itself like, you know. no Christ Temple either and and I 774 00:45:41,908 --> 00:45:45,700 have I mean, I'm very authentic tons of personal philosophical 775 00:45:45,900 --> 00:45:49,800 like semi spiritual release it reasons for not wanting this and 776 00:45:49,800 --> 00:45:52,400 and also I said, you know people are going to think I'm a fucking 777 00:45:52,400 --> 00:45:56,000 Satanist not that there's anything wrong with that but but 778 00:45:56,000 --> 00:46:02,000 they did it anyway, and I hope it helped but when I went to 779 00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:07,500 scout a film that was not made in Poland the woman who was like 780 00:46:07,500 --> 00:46:10,300 running the film office said we don't Robert Eggers coming to 781 00:46:10,300 --> 00:46:13,900 Poland because he's a Satanist and did you not know this part 782 00:46:14,100 --> 00:46:16,900 II didn't know that. Yeah, and so we had to spend 783 00:46:16,900 --> 00:46:21,400 like a week like convincing them that I wasn't a Satanist before 784 00:46:21,400 --> 00:46:23,900 I could go Scout in Poland. Wow. 785 00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:27,400 Yeah. I think it's only fair that you 786 00:46:27,400 --> 00:46:30,700 should be able to speak speak out about it now here on there 787 00:46:30,700 --> 00:46:33,100 but yes, exactly. And so we'll see if they keep 788 00:46:33,100 --> 00:46:37,100 this in the podcast that'll yes. You will see that's a but other 789 00:46:37,100 --> 00:46:39,800 but really but they're very They're great. 790 00:46:39,800 --> 00:46:42,600 They're collaborative know they're they're great and look 791 00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:47,700 like when I left AFI in 2010, like there was nothing like 792 00:46:47,700 --> 00:46:49,200 this. Like I didn't know how I was 793 00:46:49,200 --> 00:46:52,400 going to make the film's I wanted to make because like I 794 00:46:52,408 --> 00:46:54,500 didn't see the platform before it. 795 00:46:54,700 --> 00:46:56,800 It was just like, you know, I wanted to make films that were 796 00:46:56,800 --> 00:47:00,500 not like achievable for like, you know, like 1 million dollars 797 00:47:00,500 --> 00:47:03,100 or like, you know, like a very very tight like, you know people 798 00:47:03,100 --> 00:47:06,200 sitting in rooms talking like budget and the fact that I was 799 00:47:06,200 --> 00:47:10,600 able to make hereditary as my first feature, Like a still I 800 00:47:10,600 --> 00:47:13,600 find staggering and and I'm so grateful for it. 801 00:47:13,600 --> 00:47:16,900 I recognize like how fortunate I was to be able to do it in that 802 00:47:16,900 --> 00:47:19,100 way. And the reason I you know, it 803 00:47:19,107 --> 00:47:23,000 took me 10 years to make a film and the reason I guess eight 804 00:47:23,000 --> 00:47:27,000 years after after a five and you know, the reason for that is 805 00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:30,100 because I was very stubborn. I did not want to do it. 806 00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:33,300 It's very important. Yeah, it's very important and 807 00:47:33,300 --> 00:47:37,300 I'm glad I did see you know, I'm glad I did wait, but yeah, man, 808 00:47:37,300 --> 00:47:41,100 it's aii. III will say that that you know 809 00:47:41,100 --> 00:47:45,600 a 24 going like wide with a film like the which are going wide 810 00:47:45,900 --> 00:47:50,200 with with a film like Midsomer tickles me that it's happening. 811 00:47:51,300 --> 00:47:54,100 Yeah, there are people who are going to walk into Midsummer 812 00:47:54,100 --> 00:47:58,600 that like maybe would certainly Nick never watch it and I'm sure 813 00:47:58,600 --> 00:48:01,200 they'll regret watching it but there are going to be there, you 814 00:48:01,207 --> 00:48:04,100 know, what about the other hand? There's going to be some some 815 00:48:04,100 --> 00:48:09,000 high school students who that's going to be there the first not 816 00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:13,000 Like weird movie they seen and that's going to be amazing for 817 00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:15,900 them. You know, you cut that like I 818 00:48:15,908 --> 00:48:20,200 had to cut off email contact because of like creepy a cult 819 00:48:20,200 --> 00:48:24,100 people unfortunately, but in the beginning I made myself 820 00:48:24,100 --> 00:48:28,500 available and it was amazing to get emails like like from like 821 00:48:28,500 --> 00:48:31,300 high school students who saw the Witch and didn't know you could 822 00:48:31,300 --> 00:48:33,500 do something like that with movies. 823 00:48:33,500 --> 00:48:37,200 Yeah, and that was super like super gratifying. 824 00:48:37,300 --> 00:48:40,900 That's the other side of like the Like the D cinemascore? 825 00:48:41,700 --> 00:48:43,200 Yeah, exactly. That's the other side people 826 00:48:43,200 --> 00:48:45,600 walk out and they're like that wasn't scary that was you know, 827 00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:47,400 like those boring and bullshit, you know? 828 00:48:47,400 --> 00:48:49,400 Yeah, but but you're going to and God bless him. 829 00:48:49,400 --> 00:48:50,200 Yeah. God bless. 830 00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:53,200 I mean I met maybe it'll like stick with them for like, you 831 00:48:53,200 --> 00:48:57,000 know another day or two and at least like kind of like bother 832 00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:00,300 them. Yeah bothered and so finally 833 00:49:00,300 --> 00:49:03,500 like sorry listeners. This is clearly my drum that I'm 834 00:49:03,500 --> 00:49:05,900 beating. Like what if we can if we can 835 00:49:05,900 --> 00:49:09,000 make it succinct like what about Bergman is so darn great. 836 00:49:09,900 --> 00:49:14,900 I mean, I don't know like a better like writer certainly of 837 00:49:14,900 --> 00:49:17,200 like monologues and dialogue for sure. 838 00:49:17,500 --> 00:49:23,300 Somebody who like is able to just create the most like Vivid 839 00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:28,200 interpersonal like Dynamics and in film and I think especially 840 00:49:28,200 --> 00:49:33,500 like from like 1961 on I can't think of anybody whose work is 841 00:49:33,500 --> 00:49:39,600 more devastating just as far as like character studies are are 842 00:49:39,600 --> 00:49:44,300 concerned and you know, there's like an economy to his like 843 00:49:44,300 --> 00:49:47,800 visual language that I mean, I mean, you know, you could put a 844 00:49:47,800 --> 00:49:50,800 lot of that on his his collaboration with spend Nick 845 00:49:50,800 --> 00:49:53,300 this but even like when he was making films with ganar Fisher 846 00:49:53,300 --> 00:49:57,600 like it's there for sure now like and so I I mean if anything 847 00:49:57,900 --> 00:50:00,400 it's like it's there in the seventh seal. 848 00:50:00,500 --> 00:50:02,600 Yeah. No, absolutely it is. 849 00:50:02,900 --> 00:50:06,200 Yep if sawdust and tinsel. I mean it's there from the 850 00:50:06,207 --> 00:50:08,700 beginning. Yes, absolutely and and I would 851 00:50:08,700 --> 00:50:13,400 say Out for me like that's a useful like tether to like hold 852 00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:16,900 on to as a filmmaker is like, you know, these films are so 853 00:50:16,900 --> 00:50:20,100 Artful. So beautiful like so impressive 854 00:50:20,500 --> 00:50:25,200 on a technical level and they've so rarely like go beyond what's 855 00:50:25,200 --> 00:50:28,800 necessary like he's able to be like, you know perfectly 856 00:50:28,800 --> 00:50:34,800 indulgent and also to like just eschew the extraneous like and 857 00:50:34,800 --> 00:50:37,900 and something that I find sorry it took as you have but it's 858 00:50:37,900 --> 00:50:41,700 something that I find. So inspiring though, I'm 859 00:50:41,700 --> 00:50:46,300 certainly not capable of it yet is that the indulgent shots like 860 00:50:46,400 --> 00:50:49,400 aren't experienced as indulgent often. 861 00:50:49,500 --> 00:50:52,200 Yeah, the opening of The Silence. 862 00:50:52,200 --> 00:50:56,100 Yeah is one of the train it's so incredible how it shifts 863 00:50:56,100 --> 00:51:00,400 perspectives and and and it's and it's quite complicated but 864 00:51:00,400 --> 00:51:04,800 you don't you're unaware of it and I feel like when I watch 865 00:51:04,800 --> 00:51:08,300 John Ford or or Hitchcock John Ford, I'm like, yeah, that's how 866 00:51:08,300 --> 00:51:09,000 you that's where you should put it. 867 00:51:09,200 --> 00:51:10,700 Good good, that's where you should put a camera. 868 00:51:10,800 --> 00:51:13,400 Yeah and like Hitchcock. It's like that's who should put 869 00:51:13,400 --> 00:51:15,000 a camera but that's a little surprised. 870 00:51:15,300 --> 00:51:19,300 But Bergman it's always like like why are you having wow, he 871 00:51:19,300 --> 00:51:21,300 put the camera there but that is the perfect place. 872 00:51:21,300 --> 00:51:23,500 I would never think that that's exactly where you're supposed to 873 00:51:23,500 --> 00:51:26,100 put it but that's the place. And again, it's unassuming. 874 00:51:26,100 --> 00:51:31,400 It's not you're not like a assaulted by like The Panache of 875 00:51:31,400 --> 00:51:33,300 the filmmaker and it feels instinctive. 876 00:51:33,400 --> 00:51:35,500 It's so is addictive. Yeah, it feels totally 877 00:51:35,500 --> 00:51:37,700 instinctive and I think there's something to be said also about 878 00:51:37,700 --> 00:51:42,100 you know, I mean people love to like DFI these filmmakers and 879 00:51:42,100 --> 00:51:44,300 you know say like they came up with this and like nobody had 880 00:51:44,300 --> 00:51:46,400 done anything like this before but I think there's something to 881 00:51:46,408 --> 00:51:49,400 be said about filmmakers being in dialogue with other 882 00:51:49,400 --> 00:51:53,300 filmmakers and just as you mentioned that you know Bergman 883 00:51:53,300 --> 00:51:57,000 and and Nick this to you know, watched tarkovsky's, you know, 884 00:51:57,000 --> 00:51:59,800 early films and like we're just blown away and it changed their 885 00:51:59,800 --> 00:52:02,100 way of making films and and Andrei rublev gets all the 886 00:52:02,100 --> 00:52:06,400 credit for kitchen sink like medieval worlds, but like 887 00:52:06,400 --> 00:52:10,400 obviously the Seven Samurai did that, you know, Way earlier, 888 00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:15,400 absolutely and even with the silence you can see like oh, 889 00:52:15,400 --> 00:52:18,200 when did the silence come out? Oh it came out a year after last 890 00:52:18,200 --> 00:52:21,000 year at marienbad, you know, yeah for sure the film set in 891 00:52:21,008 --> 00:52:24,200 this hotel that looks nothing like anything Bergen had done 892 00:52:24,200 --> 00:52:27,800 before right and looks everything like what he did 893 00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:30,100 afterwards. Yeah, you know, and I don't know 894 00:52:30,100 --> 00:52:34,400 II know that for fair me my film school was just watching films I 895 00:52:34,408 --> 00:52:38,600 loved and then like kind of digging in and to see what are 896 00:52:38,600 --> 00:52:41,200 the Is that those filmmakers were watching saying yeah, but 897 00:52:41,200 --> 00:52:43,200 what are the films that impacted those filmmakers and it's a 898 00:52:43,200 --> 00:52:46,800 rabbit hole that just like never ends how much you re watch 899 00:52:46,800 --> 00:52:51,500 movies a lot. I re-watched movies a lot to you 900 00:52:51,500 --> 00:52:55,400 know, kind of like to the detriment of you know to the 901 00:52:55,400 --> 00:52:57,800 exclusion of like, you know watching films for the first 902 00:52:57,800 --> 00:52:59,500 time, right? And so no, I mean like I have 903 00:52:59,500 --> 00:53:02,500 you I like I've ruined some films that I've studied and take 904 00:53:02,500 --> 00:53:04,800 it so many notes that I can't like I've like there. 905 00:53:04,800 --> 00:53:07,400 Yeah just enjoy has gone. Josh is right is gone. 906 00:53:07,500 --> 00:53:11,600 Yeah, but then but but You know you kind of I think there's like 907 00:53:11,800 --> 00:53:14,300 there was certainly a period where I was just like copying 908 00:53:14,300 --> 00:53:18,200 and then you get to a point where you've done like enough 909 00:53:18,200 --> 00:53:20,400 trial and error that like there's something in your system 910 00:53:20,400 --> 00:53:23,500 and you kind of have like a foundation and then you can 911 00:53:23,500 --> 00:53:25,400 William go off from there. Yeah. 912 00:53:25,400 --> 00:53:27,600 You keep you right here like earlier watching so much stuff 913 00:53:27,600 --> 00:53:30,900 in your like well, okay, like everything's an idea. 914 00:53:31,100 --> 00:53:32,400 Yeah, you know what, you know what I mean, you're like you're 915 00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:35,600 like well that was an idea that was an idea but like, you know, 916 00:53:35,900 --> 00:53:38,900 that's not my script that's their scripts and so on. 917 00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:42,600 I'm just we're just going to try to do it like all the it. 918 00:53:42,600 --> 00:53:48,100 Like I think Beck remember back. Yeah had a quote that was 919 00:53:48,100 --> 00:53:53,000 something to the effect of like no matter how much I try to like 920 00:53:53,000 --> 00:53:56,800 shape one of my albums like all the time with as far as like 921 00:53:56,800 --> 00:53:59,300 influences. I'm only left with what's inside 922 00:53:59,300 --> 00:54:02,400 of myself. Yeah, you know, and and I think 923 00:54:02,400 --> 00:54:06,900 as you become as you continue to become yourself more as someone 924 00:54:06,900 --> 00:54:12,600 who creates work, Like that sense of self emerges more, you 925 00:54:12,600 --> 00:54:15,900 know, and and so and so even if you're studying something for 926 00:54:15,900 --> 00:54:21,600 staging or lighting or whatever like it becomes less of like I 927 00:54:21,600 --> 00:54:25,900 need to do that and less of more like oh, yeah, like that's how 928 00:54:25,900 --> 00:54:28,700 I'm thinking about like my own ideas. 929 00:54:29,200 --> 00:54:32,400 I yeah, I I couldn't have said it better. 930 00:54:33,400 --> 00:54:38,600 I'm going to I think I think I couldn't I'm being told that 931 00:54:38,600 --> 00:54:39,900 it's time. To wrap it up great. 932 00:54:39,900 --> 00:54:42,300 I could keep this going for a long time same here. 933 00:54:42,300 --> 00:54:45,100 I it feels like we're just getting warmed up. 934 00:54:45,600 --> 00:54:47,800 Well, you should come over soon. Hang out with the baby. 935 00:54:47,900 --> 00:54:50,600 I'd love to I want to see Houston again. 936 00:54:50,600 --> 00:54:53,400 Okay. Well this is this was great. 937 00:54:53,400 --> 00:54:56,000 There's nobody I would have rather done this with same here, 938 00:54:56,100 --> 00:55:01,200 and I'm so excited for people to see the lighthouse which I think 939 00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:03,600 is a great film with a capital G. 940 00:55:03,900 --> 00:55:07,300 Thanks man who and and seen its some are see it see you in a 941 00:55:07,300 --> 00:55:12,200 second and a third and a fourth time and Notes destroy it yeah, 942 00:55:12,500 --> 00:55:16,500 take it down. All right, great for you know, I 943 00:55:16,508 --> 00:55:19,100 mean destroy it for the better if you know for your film 944 00:55:19,100 --> 00:55:22,800 students for to better your own filmmaking not right not saying 945 00:55:22,800 --> 00:55:24,600 like take down our he's movie. It's looking great. 946 00:55:24,700 --> 00:55:26,800 But you know, hey, like, you know, it's a free country.