1 00:00:10,840 --> 00:00:13,320 Hi everyone. Welcome again to Logical Bible 2 00:00:13,320 --> 00:00:17,160 Study where we dive into the scripture texts from today's 3 00:00:17,200 --> 00:00:18,560 Mass. And we're going to look at the 4 00:00:18,560 --> 00:00:23,640 Gospel reading for today, which is Matthew chapter 16 verses 21 5 00:00:23,640 --> 00:00:26,520 to 27. So we'll have a look at the text 6 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:30,270 and see if we can find out what is meant on the literal sense of 7 00:00:30,270 --> 00:00:34,230 the text, what what does it mean in its original context, which 8 00:00:34,230 --> 00:00:36,590 is what we're all about in this podcast. 9 00:00:36,830 --> 00:00:39,870 So Matthew chapter 16, verses 21 to 27. 10 00:00:41,470 --> 00:00:44,990 Jesus began to make it clear to his disciples that he was 11 00:00:44,990 --> 00:00:48,990 destined to go to Jerusalem and suffer grievously at the hands 12 00:00:48,990 --> 00:00:53,310 of the elders and chief priests and scribes to be put to death 13 00:00:53,390 --> 00:00:55,670 and to be raised up on the third day. 14 00:00:57,100 --> 00:01:00,940 Then taking him aside, Peter started to remonstrate with him. 15 00:01:01,660 --> 00:01:04,860 Heaven preserve you, Lord, he said, this must not happen to 16 00:01:04,860 --> 00:01:08,140 you. But he turned and said to Peter, 17 00:01:08,540 --> 00:01:12,660 Get behind me Satan. You are an obstacle in my path, 18 00:01:12,900 --> 00:01:16,740 because the way you think is not God's way but man's. 19 00:01:18,060 --> 00:01:21,790 Then Jesus said to his disciples, if anyone wants to be 20 00:01:21,790 --> 00:01:25,470 a follower of mine, let him renounce himself and take up his 21 00:01:25,470 --> 00:01:29,550 cross and follow me. For anyone who wants to save his 22 00:01:29,550 --> 00:01:33,870 life will lose it, but anyone who loses his life for my sake 23 00:01:33,870 --> 00:01:37,710 will find it. What then will a man gain if he 24 00:01:37,710 --> 00:01:40,310 wins the whole world and ruins his life? 25 00:01:41,030 --> 00:01:43,910 Or what has a man to offer in exchange for his life? 26 00:01:44,990 --> 00:01:48,110 For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of his father 27 00:01:48,110 --> 00:01:52,460 with his angels, and when he does, he will reward each one 28 00:01:52,460 --> 00:01:59,220 according to his behavior. So what's the context here? 29 00:01:59,940 --> 00:02:02,900 We've actually just had the famous passage where Peter makes 30 00:02:02,900 --> 00:02:06,220 his great declaration of faith, and then Jesus makes him leader 31 00:02:06,220 --> 00:02:08,620 of the church. He says, you are Peter on this 32 00:02:08,620 --> 00:02:11,380 rock, I'll build my church. I'll give you the keys to the 33 00:02:11,380 --> 00:02:13,460 Kingdom of heaven. So that has literally just 34 00:02:13,460 --> 00:02:15,810 happened. And you can hear that on the 35 00:02:15,810 --> 00:02:19,330 21st Sunday and Ordinary Time. It's also read on all sorts of 36 00:02:19,330 --> 00:02:22,610 feast days, So the feast of Saint Peter, the Celemony of 37 00:02:22,610 --> 00:02:26,250 Saint Peter and Paul. So that is a very famous passage 38 00:02:26,250 --> 00:02:28,930 and you can hear it all throughout the liturgical year. 39 00:02:29,330 --> 00:02:33,010 That leads straight into today, verse 21. 40 00:02:33,130 --> 00:02:36,770 Jesus began to make it clear. So what it literally says there 41 00:02:36,770 --> 00:02:40,630 is from that time Jesus began to show his disciples. 42 00:02:40,910 --> 00:02:44,390 Now that phrase from that time, it's actually a key marker in 43 00:02:44,390 --> 00:02:46,950 Matthew's Gospel. Matthew uses that when he's 44 00:02:46,950 --> 00:02:51,110 about to start a new section or a new major phase in his story. 45 00:02:51,110 --> 00:02:54,590 So he actually used it earlier, just before Jesus began his 46 00:02:54,590 --> 00:02:59,070 Galilee ministry in Chapter 4. So here the signal Matthew is 47 00:02:59,070 --> 00:03:02,950 giving us is that Jesus is now finished in Galilee and he's 48 00:03:02,950 --> 00:03:06,190 going to move to Jerusalem, so it begins the next big section. 49 00:03:07,230 --> 00:03:10,870 And the language here, from that time Jesus began to show his 50 00:03:10,870 --> 00:03:12,910 disciples. It implies that Jesus doesn't 51 00:03:12,910 --> 00:03:15,990 just give them this teaching once, He's giving it to them 52 00:03:15,990 --> 00:03:19,030 constantly. And it appears that the reason 53 00:03:19,110 --> 00:03:24,070 Jesus begins to teach them this now is because they, well, Peter 54 00:03:24,070 --> 00:03:26,110 in particular has just recognized that he's the 55 00:03:26,110 --> 00:03:28,710 Messiah. So Jesus realizes that they're 56 00:03:28,710 --> 00:03:31,670 now ready to hear about his destiny, now that they 57 00:03:31,830 --> 00:03:35,380 understand that He's the Messiah, at least partially, and 58 00:03:35,380 --> 00:03:38,020 he teaches them that he was destined to go to Jerusalem. 59 00:03:38,860 --> 00:03:40,860 So that phrase is interesting. Destined. 60 00:03:41,660 --> 00:03:44,980 Jesus is teaching them what he's about to say to them from the 61 00:03:44,980 --> 00:03:48,860 perspective of prophecy. It's not really I'm going to 62 00:03:48,860 --> 00:03:52,100 suffer, It's more according to God's plan of salvation. 63 00:03:52,300 --> 00:03:55,460 As made clear in the Old Testament, all of these things 64 00:03:55,460 --> 00:03:59,220 must happen to the Son of Man. So if he's thinking of Old 65 00:03:59,220 --> 00:04:02,220 Testament prophecy here, and in fact the word he for destined 66 00:04:02,220 --> 00:04:06,140 can also be translated must. So Jesus wants his disciple was 67 00:04:06,140 --> 00:04:09,620 to understand that these things that he's about to describe have 68 00:04:09,620 --> 00:04:11,540 to happen as part of his ministry. 69 00:04:11,860 --> 00:04:15,140 And they're not just going to be accidents or tragedies, though 70 00:04:15,140 --> 00:04:18,579 they might appear to be. So he's encouraging them when 71 00:04:18,579 --> 00:04:21,860 these events happen, to realize that he's prophesied them and 72 00:04:21,860 --> 00:04:24,380 they shouldn't be discouraged. They're actually necessary. 73 00:04:25,140 --> 00:04:27,420 So he predicts a whole lot of things that he will suffer 74 00:04:27,420 --> 00:04:31,300 grievously at the hands of the elders and chief priests and 75 00:04:31,300 --> 00:04:33,380 scribes. So these are the people who 76 00:04:33,380 --> 00:04:35,180 should have recognized that he's the Messiah. 77 00:04:35,420 --> 00:04:38,020 But here Jesus says those leaders are the ones who are 78 00:04:38,020 --> 00:04:42,260 going to reject him. He even says here I'll be put to 79 00:04:42,260 --> 00:04:43,940 death. So he's predicting his 80 00:04:43,940 --> 00:04:47,500 crucifixion. And then he says and be raised 81 00:04:47,500 --> 00:04:51,260 up on the third day. This is a very specific prophecy 82 00:04:51,260 --> 00:04:54,210 actually. Why is it significant that Jesus 83 00:04:54,210 --> 00:04:57,010 is in the tomb for three days? It's never fully unpacked in the 84 00:04:57,010 --> 00:05:00,490 New Testament actually the three days significance, one of the 85 00:05:00,490 --> 00:05:05,090 reasons is it probably taps into Hosea chapter 6 verses one to 86 00:05:05,090 --> 00:05:08,810 two. So there it says God will revive 87 00:05:08,850 --> 00:05:12,970 us after two days. On the third day he will raise 88 00:05:13,010 --> 00:05:18,170 us up to live in his presence. So in the context of Hosea, that 89 00:05:18,170 --> 00:05:21,330 refers to God raising up Israel after suffering. 90 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:25,840 So Jesus is kind of going to recapitulate this in himself. 91 00:05:25,840 --> 00:05:29,800 He's going to make the whole destiny of Israel summed up in 92 00:05:29,800 --> 00:05:31,560 his own resurrection on the third day. 93 00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:34,400 So notice Jesus predicts all these things. 94 00:05:34,960 --> 00:05:37,560 He says he'll be rejected, he'll be crucified, he'll be 95 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:41,320 resurrected on the third day. So Jesus knows exactly how the 96 00:05:41,320 --> 00:05:45,610 timeline is going to go. Unfortunately, the disciples did 97 00:05:45,610 --> 00:05:48,330 not recall a lot of these prophecies at the time that they 98 00:05:48,330 --> 00:05:51,650 were occurring, that it was only later after his ascension that 99 00:05:51,650 --> 00:05:56,090 they remembered all this stuff. Verse 22 Then taking him aside, 100 00:05:56,090 --> 00:05:59,410 Peter started to remonstrate with him or more literally 101 00:05:59,410 --> 00:06:00,970 rebuke him. So picture this. 102 00:06:01,570 --> 00:06:04,690 Peter is rebuking Jesus. He says, heaven preserve you, 103 00:06:04,690 --> 00:06:09,290 Lord or God forbid you Lord, this must not happen to you. 104 00:06:10,580 --> 00:06:12,820 So Peter thinks Jesus is being crazy. 105 00:06:12,820 --> 00:06:16,580 Jesus has just said I'm going to be crucified and abused and all 106 00:06:16,580 --> 00:06:18,100 sorts of stuff. And Peter thinks, what? 107 00:06:18,620 --> 00:06:20,620 So he's kind of thinking, what's gotten into you? 108 00:06:20,700 --> 00:06:23,260 Jesus, you're the Messiah, you're not going to die. 109 00:06:23,820 --> 00:06:25,980 So Peter is being pretty presumptuous here, isn't he? 110 00:06:25,980 --> 00:06:29,780 He's the disciple who's thinks he needs to correct his master. 111 00:06:30,220 --> 00:06:33,260 Pretty dangerous. But also keep in mind what the 112 00:06:33,260 --> 00:06:35,540 Jews believed about the Messiah at the time. 113 00:06:36,130 --> 00:06:38,730 The Jews did not really understand this suffering 114 00:06:38,730 --> 00:06:41,610 servant aspect of the Messiah, although that is there in the 115 00:06:41,610 --> 00:06:44,730 Old Testament. In Jesus time they focused more 116 00:06:44,730 --> 00:06:48,850 on this idea that the Messiah will be a victorious ruler sent 117 00:06:48,850 --> 00:06:52,370 from God to restore Israel. So that's the assumption Peter 118 00:06:52,370 --> 00:06:55,090 is operating under. He thinks Jesus is the Messiah 119 00:06:55,250 --> 00:06:59,210 and he thinks Jesus is going to be a victorious military leader. 120 00:06:59,570 --> 00:07:01,930 Rather, Jesus says I'm going to suffer and be killed. 121 00:07:01,930 --> 00:07:04,970 And that's not the way that they picture the Messiah at all. 122 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:09,760 So Jesus in verse 23 turned aside and said to Peter, Now 123 00:07:09,760 --> 00:07:12,640 Merck's Marc's version actually makes it clear that Jesus first 124 00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:16,400 sees the other disciples. So it looks like Jesus doesn't 125 00:07:16,400 --> 00:07:21,360 want the other disciples to be led astray by Peter's false 126 00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:23,680 outburst. He wants to keep them on the 127 00:07:23,680 --> 00:07:26,200 right track. So he has to correct Peter for 128 00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:29,880 the sake of the other disciples. And he says, strong language, 129 00:07:29,960 --> 00:07:33,920 Get behind me Satan. Now there's two interpretations 130 00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:37,470 here of what's going on. It could be that Jesus perceives 131 00:07:37,470 --> 00:07:39,990 that Satan is literally influencing Peter. 132 00:07:40,550 --> 00:07:44,630 So in that case, when Satan saw that Peter had confessed Jesus 133 00:07:44,630 --> 00:07:48,870 as Messiah, Satan wasn't happy with that, so Satan intervened 134 00:07:48,870 --> 00:07:52,350 to confuse Peter. And of course, we now get this 135 00:07:52,350 --> 00:07:57,030 contrast between Jesus blessing, sorry, between Jesus blessing 136 00:07:57,030 --> 00:08:00,750 Peter and giving him the keys. And now Jesus saying, put, Satan 137 00:08:00,750 --> 00:08:02,790 has possessed you. There's a big contrast. 138 00:08:04,190 --> 00:08:06,030 We know this. This is the kind of thing Satan 139 00:08:06,030 --> 00:08:09,070 would do, actually, because earlier in chapter 4, verse 8 to 140 00:08:09,070 --> 00:08:13,350 10, Satan had actually tried to exploit the human instinct to 141 00:08:13,350 --> 00:08:16,070 avoid suffering. That's how we tempted Jesus. 142 00:08:16,070 --> 00:08:19,470 Remember, he said you don't have to go to the cross, you can just 143 00:08:19,470 --> 00:08:21,350 have the glory now. That was one of the things he 144 00:08:21,350 --> 00:08:24,150 said to to Jesus. And now maybe he's tapping into 145 00:08:24,150 --> 00:08:27,590 Peter's own natural inclination to avoid suffering. 146 00:08:27,910 --> 00:08:30,950 And maybe that's why Jesus says get Behind me, Satan, because he 147 00:08:30,950 --> 00:08:36,460 recognizes that same tempter. Another interpretation of this, 148 00:08:36,460 --> 00:08:39,380 when Jesus says get behind me Satan, the Greek word for Satan 149 00:08:39,380 --> 00:08:42,900 just means adversary. So maybe he's not accusing Peter 150 00:08:42,900 --> 00:08:46,900 of being possessed literally by Satan or influenced by Satan, 151 00:08:46,900 --> 00:08:50,140 but maybe he's just saying get behind me, adversary, and that 152 00:08:50,140 --> 00:08:53,380 would fit as well. What about the get behind me 153 00:08:53,380 --> 00:08:56,220 bit? What it basically means is fall 154 00:08:56,260 --> 00:08:59,220 in line. So what Jesus is saying here to 155 00:08:59,220 --> 00:09:03,040 Peter, or maybe to Satan, is I outrank you. 156 00:09:03,120 --> 00:09:06,000 Now follow me rather than trying to lead me. 157 00:09:06,280 --> 00:09:10,080 It's a command to get in line for fall behind me. 158 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:13,840 And then he says to Peter, you are an obstacle in my path. 159 00:09:14,520 --> 00:09:17,240 More literally, what it says there is stumbling stone. 160 00:09:18,240 --> 00:09:20,520 Interesting, isn't it? There's a contrast between the 161 00:09:20,520 --> 00:09:23,800 rock that Jesus has just made him and now he's a stumbling 162 00:09:23,800 --> 00:09:26,470 stone. The difference is one of grace 163 00:09:26,470 --> 00:09:29,110 versus nature, really. When Peter speaks what the 164 00:09:29,110 --> 00:09:33,270 Father has revealed to him like he did earlier, he's the sturdy 165 00:09:33,270 --> 00:09:37,830 foundation stone that keeps the forces of darkness at Bay, which 166 00:09:37,830 --> 00:09:39,750 is what he's supposed to do as leader of the Church. 167 00:09:40,190 --> 00:09:43,110 But when that same Peter speaks from the standpoint of human 168 00:09:43,110 --> 00:09:47,670 weakness, apart from divine assistance, he is a stone that 169 00:09:47,670 --> 00:09:50,070 causes others to stumble. Interesting, isn't it? 170 00:09:50,070 --> 00:09:53,260 The two sides of Peter, when he's acting with the Holy Spirit 171 00:09:53,260 --> 00:09:55,300 and when he's acting just by nature. 172 00:09:55,580 --> 00:09:59,860 Big contrast. So Jesus says to him, get behind 173 00:09:59,860 --> 00:10:01,740 me, you're an obstacle in my path. 174 00:10:01,740 --> 00:10:04,500 So the kind of idea that Peter has just expressed, which is 175 00:10:04,500 --> 00:10:07,980 that you're the Messiah, you can't suffer Jesus, he declares. 176 00:10:07,980 --> 00:10:10,260 That's actually going to make things difficult for Jesus. 177 00:10:10,260 --> 00:10:12,540 Mission. That kind of thinking needs to 178 00:10:12,540 --> 00:10:15,660 stop. He says to Peter the way you 179 00:10:15,660 --> 00:10:19,250 think is not God's way, but man's What it actually says 180 00:10:19,250 --> 00:10:22,650 there more literally is you are not on the side of God, but of 181 00:10:22,650 --> 00:10:25,570 men. So the fact that Peter doesn't 182 00:10:25,570 --> 00:10:29,890 believe that Jesus will die is because he's the Messiah. 183 00:10:29,890 --> 00:10:32,850 That's just worldly thinking. So he's following common Jewish 184 00:10:32,850 --> 00:10:35,850 opinion not in accordance with God's truth. 185 00:10:36,410 --> 00:10:38,170 And the Catechism actually picks up on this. 186 00:10:38,170 --> 00:10:39,490 I'll include that in the show notes. 187 00:10:39,490 --> 00:10:43,650 It talks about world views of the Messiah versus the view of 188 00:10:43,650 --> 00:10:46,170 the Messiah that Jesus knows is the correct one. 189 00:10:48,060 --> 00:10:49,380 So that's what Jesus says to Peter. 190 00:10:49,380 --> 00:10:53,060 And Jesus is now going to make the point that not only must he 191 00:10:53,060 --> 00:10:57,340 as the Messiah suffer, but also all of his followers must be 192 00:10:57,340 --> 00:11:00,180 willing to willing to experience suffering as well. 193 00:11:00,180 --> 00:11:03,140 It's actually a necessary part of being a follower of the 194 00:11:03,140 --> 00:11:06,460 Messiah. Verse 24 Jesus said to his 195 00:11:06,460 --> 00:11:09,180 disciples. Now, Mark's version says there's 196 00:11:09,180 --> 00:11:12,460 crowds listening to him as well, but given that he generally 197 00:11:12,460 --> 00:11:16,620 speaks to the crowd in parables, his primary audience that he's 198 00:11:17,230 --> 00:11:20,230 sort of speaking to mostly here is probably his disciples. 199 00:11:21,230 --> 00:11:25,430 If anyone wants to be a follower of mine, let him renounce 200 00:11:25,430 --> 00:11:28,430 himself. So in that culture, it was 201 00:11:28,430 --> 00:11:30,230 common for rabbis to have followers. 202 00:11:31,230 --> 00:11:34,030 A Jew could listen to a rabbi and then choose to follow them 203 00:11:34,030 --> 00:11:35,750 if they wanted to, and they could actually follow them 204 00:11:35,750 --> 00:11:39,030 around the land. So Jesus here is giving the 205 00:11:39,030 --> 00:11:42,630 prerequisites for if anyone wants to be a follower of mine. 206 00:11:42,910 --> 00:11:44,910 Now notice that this implies a choice. 207 00:11:45,540 --> 00:11:48,420 If anyone wants to be a follower of mine, they must make a 208 00:11:48,420 --> 00:11:50,540 decision. That's kind of what's going on 209 00:11:50,540 --> 00:11:52,220 here. It's not an automatic thing to 210 00:11:52,220 --> 00:11:53,740 follow. Christ, there has to be a 211 00:11:53,740 --> 00:11:58,140 decision involved at some point. Let him renounce himself. 212 00:11:59,220 --> 00:12:02,260 Now the word therefore renounce, that's a legal term in that 213 00:12:02,260 --> 00:12:05,860 culture which signified complete disornment, not partial 214 00:12:05,860 --> 00:12:11,040 disornment, complete disornment. So Jesus here means not just to 215 00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:13,640 let go of selfishness and attachment, although that's 216 00:12:13,640 --> 00:12:16,400 probably in here. But as he's going to explain, 217 00:12:16,520 --> 00:12:20,600 Jesus is actually asking for a radical abandonment to God, even 218 00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:22,600 being willing to give up one's own life. 219 00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:25,720 That's what Jesus is trying to communicate to his listeners. 220 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:27,680 He's saying, look, if you want to be a follower of mine, it's 221 00:12:27,680 --> 00:12:30,840 not going to be easy. Perhaps they thought it was 222 00:12:30,840 --> 00:12:32,440 going to be easy up till this point. 223 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:35,160 He's now telling them there's going to be suffering and even 224 00:12:35,160 --> 00:12:37,930 death for some of you. And of course, we know that many 225 00:12:37,930 --> 00:12:40,010 of their disciples did die for the faith. 226 00:12:41,330 --> 00:12:46,330 He says let him renounce himself and take up his cross and follow 227 00:12:46,330 --> 00:12:49,170 me. So take up his cross. 228 00:12:49,170 --> 00:12:52,530 I mean, those words might wash over us a bit because we're, you 229 00:12:52,530 --> 00:12:55,290 know, when we hear the word cross, we think, of course Jesus 230 00:12:55,290 --> 00:12:58,210 cross, but Jesus hasn't been crucified yet. 231 00:12:58,850 --> 00:13:01,050 The Jewish people would have been quite familiar with this 232 00:13:01,090 --> 00:13:05,930 image of a crucifix of a cross because the Romans crucified 233 00:13:05,930 --> 00:13:08,910 Jews pretty commonly. It was very common, particularly 234 00:13:08,910 --> 00:13:12,190 in Jerusalem, to see Jews being killed by crucifixion. 235 00:13:13,190 --> 00:13:16,430 But here's the thing to mention cross or crucifixion in that 236 00:13:16,430 --> 00:13:19,750 culture, that Roman crucifixions were so brutal, so to even 237 00:13:19,750 --> 00:13:23,550 mention the word would bring to mind images of horrific 238 00:13:23,750 --> 00:13:26,030 suffering. So when Jesus here says takes up 239 00:13:26,030 --> 00:13:30,630 take up your cross, he doesn't just mean deal with your burdens 240 00:13:30,630 --> 00:13:31,910 in life. He's actually talking about a 241 00:13:31,910 --> 00:13:36,890 very extreme type of suffering that would that's what it would 242 00:13:36,890 --> 00:13:39,290 have been conjured up in the minds of the original audience. 243 00:13:39,730 --> 00:13:43,130 In fact, crucifixion was so bad that apparently even the Romans 244 00:13:43,170 --> 00:13:47,210 who invented crucifixion, or who perfected crucifixion, even they 245 00:13:47,210 --> 00:13:49,890 thought it was inappropriate to mention it in conversation. 246 00:13:49,890 --> 00:13:51,810 They even they didn't want to talk about it. 247 00:13:51,810 --> 00:13:54,650 That's how bad it is. So what does it mean here? 248 00:13:54,650 --> 00:13:57,570 When Jesus says take up his cross, he probably doesn't mean 249 00:13:57,570 --> 00:14:00,530 that he expects all Christian disciples to be crucified 250 00:14:00,530 --> 00:14:02,610 literally. He's probably using it as a 251 00:14:02,610 --> 00:14:06,420 metaphor, which means something like you need to make big 252 00:14:06,420 --> 00:14:08,940 sacrifices and bear heavy burdens. 253 00:14:09,420 --> 00:14:12,500 Now, Simon of Sirene, of course he literally did do this. 254 00:14:12,700 --> 00:14:16,660 Chapter 23, verse 26, he takes up Jesus literal cross. 255 00:14:17,500 --> 00:14:20,260 But here Jesus means in a metaphorical way you are going 256 00:14:20,260 --> 00:14:23,340 to need to bear heavy burdens and suffer if you want to be my 257 00:14:23,340 --> 00:14:26,180 disciple. This is something that we don't 258 00:14:26,180 --> 00:14:28,700 like to hear as 21st century Christians, particularly 259 00:14:28,700 --> 00:14:33,140 prosperity gospel kind of stuff. They don't like passages like 260 00:14:33,140 --> 00:14:36,430 this, but it's probably even more extreme than we think. 261 00:14:37,150 --> 00:14:39,910 Take up your cross implies extreme suffering in its 262 00:14:39,910 --> 00:14:43,110 original context, he says, And then follow me. 263 00:14:43,670 --> 00:14:47,110 So Jesus says that his followers must be willing to experience 264 00:14:47,110 --> 00:14:50,230 suffering just as he's about to experience suffering. 265 00:14:50,950 --> 00:14:53,670 So he's telling them the radical demands of discipleship. 266 00:14:53,670 --> 00:14:56,750 They need to be completely set apart to God if they want to 267 00:14:56,750 --> 00:14:58,710 follow him and truly be his disciples. 268 00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:02,480 Jesus is now going to extend his thought here a bit and he's 269 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:04,520 going to use some words that he's actually already used 270 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:07,320 before in Matthew's Gospel. He's going to talk about if you 271 00:15:07,320 --> 00:15:09,760 want to save your life, you'll lose it, etc. 272 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:13,680 Jesus has already said this in Matthew chapter 10, verse 38 to 273 00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:15,800 39. If you remember, he said that as 274 00:15:15,800 --> 00:15:20,240 part of the disciples, the discourse to the disciples, the 275 00:15:20,240 --> 00:15:23,120 fact that Matthew records Jesus saying it on two separate 276 00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:26,160 occasions. That confirms that Jesus often 277 00:15:26,160 --> 00:15:29,320 taught the same phrase on multiple occasions in multiple 278 00:15:29,320 --> 00:15:33,360 contexts. We sometimes think that Jesus, 279 00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:36,600 whenever he uses words, he uses it in exactly the same way all 280 00:15:36,600 --> 00:15:38,280 the time. It has to mean the same thing. 281 00:15:38,640 --> 00:15:42,200 Not necessarily. It was quite common in Jewish 282 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:44,960 circles at the time, particularly amongst rabbis, 283 00:15:44,960 --> 00:15:47,200 that would have a couple of key phrases that they would 284 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:50,800 continually keep using, but in different contexts. 285 00:15:51,080 --> 00:15:53,520 And they did that as part of memorization because it was a 286 00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:57,200 primarily an oral culture. A rubber would repeat things 287 00:15:57,240 --> 00:16:00,600 over and over again so that his audience would remember that 288 00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:02,600 phrase. And this is apparently one of 289 00:16:02,600 --> 00:16:06,000 those phrases. When Jesus here says anyone who 290 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:09,440 wants to save his life will lose it, anyone who loses his life 291 00:16:09,440 --> 00:16:13,200 for my sake will find it. That was echoing in the minds of 292 00:16:13,200 --> 00:16:15,720 many Christians, apparently because Jesus said it a lot. 293 00:16:17,380 --> 00:16:19,620 So for anyone who wants to save his life will lose it. 294 00:16:19,940 --> 00:16:24,140 The word here for life is psyche, and that can mean soul, 295 00:16:24,580 --> 00:16:26,540 but it can also mean physical life. 296 00:16:26,540 --> 00:16:29,020 So there's two possible meanings here, possibly both. 297 00:16:29,420 --> 00:16:32,740 When Jesus says for anyone who wants to save his life will lose 298 00:16:32,740 --> 00:16:37,060 it, he could mean he's telling them not to deny him at the 299 00:16:37,060 --> 00:16:39,300 point of death. As in, one must be willing to 300 00:16:39,300 --> 00:16:41,220 give up his literal earthly life. 301 00:16:42,330 --> 00:16:44,490 Don't try and save your life if you're in a life and death 302 00:16:44,490 --> 00:16:47,370 situation. Do not deny me or the gospel at 303 00:16:47,370 --> 00:16:49,970 the point of death. That could be one meaning or it 304 00:16:49,970 --> 00:16:52,410 could be a warning against sort of spiritual life. 305 00:16:52,410 --> 00:16:55,010 Here, as in it's a warning against worldliness and self 306 00:16:55,010 --> 00:16:57,090 protection. He's telling them that they need 307 00:16:57,090 --> 00:17:00,530 to be detached from those things, otherwise that will lose 308 00:17:00,570 --> 00:17:02,810 their spiritual life. They won't get to heaven, it 309 00:17:02,810 --> 00:17:06,369 will result in eternal death. Maybe he's talking about both. 310 00:17:06,990 --> 00:17:09,829 So then he flips it around and says, but anyone who loses his 311 00:17:09,829 --> 00:17:13,150 life for my sake will find it. What does that mean? 312 00:17:13,150 --> 00:17:15,950 Anyone who loses his life for my sake will find it. 313 00:17:16,470 --> 00:17:20,470 It could either refer to being martyred, as in if you die for 314 00:17:20,470 --> 00:17:22,750 the faith, then you'll inherit eternal life. 315 00:17:22,750 --> 00:17:25,190 That would fit. It could also mean giving up 316 00:17:25,190 --> 00:17:28,550 one's old life and possessions and then therefore they'll find 317 00:17:28,550 --> 00:17:30,510 their true life, their true spiritual life. 318 00:17:31,230 --> 00:17:35,780 So it's not clear which of those Jesus means, but certainly it's 319 00:17:35,780 --> 00:17:38,300 something like this. The only way to truly preserve 320 00:17:38,300 --> 00:17:42,140 oneself and to inherit one's true life is to give oneself 321 00:17:42,180 --> 00:17:46,500 away fully to Jesus. And that's what it means to find 322 00:17:46,500 --> 00:17:49,740 life. It means to find eternal life to 323 00:17:49,780 --> 00:17:53,100 enter the Kingdom of heaven. Scholars here have pointed out 324 00:17:53,100 --> 00:17:56,020 that Jesus demands a more radical even than a military 325 00:17:56,020 --> 00:17:59,020 general, because Jesus says anyone who wants to save his 326 00:17:59,020 --> 00:18:02,740 life will lose it, but anyone who loses his life for my sake 327 00:18:03,100 --> 00:18:05,890 will find it. So he's asking for allegiance to 328 00:18:05,890 --> 00:18:08,610 himself, not just to an army or to A cause. 329 00:18:08,850 --> 00:18:12,650 He says you need to be willing to lose your life for my sake. 330 00:18:13,410 --> 00:18:15,490 Very, very strong claim here from Jesus. 331 00:18:16,570 --> 00:18:19,690 Jesus is now going to use terms here that are drawn from 332 00:18:19,690 --> 00:18:24,010 commerce, so he's going to use words like profit, gain, 333 00:18:24,050 --> 00:18:27,010 forfeit, exchange. These are all kind of monetary 334 00:18:27,010 --> 00:18:30,170 terms. He starts by saying in verse 26. 335 00:18:30,870 --> 00:18:34,630 What then will a man gain if he wins the whole world and ruins 336 00:18:34,630 --> 00:18:38,630 his life or forfeits his life? That's a rhetorical question. 337 00:18:38,630 --> 00:18:41,870 The answer is obviously none. The audience, when I heard that 338 00:18:41,870 --> 00:18:43,790 question, they would have said, Oh well, the the answer is 339 00:18:43,790 --> 00:18:46,790 nothing. A man will gain nothing if he 340 00:18:46,790 --> 00:18:48,630 wins the whole world and ruins his life. 341 00:18:49,190 --> 00:18:52,550 So Jesus is trying to get the crowds to focus on eternal 342 00:18:52,550 --> 00:18:55,230 things rather than earthly things. 343 00:18:55,230 --> 00:18:58,340 He wants them to realize that yes, you know, there's things 344 00:18:58,340 --> 00:19:00,820 you probably want to pursue in this life, but in the end, what 345 00:19:00,820 --> 00:19:03,220 good is that going to be? If you gain the entire physical 346 00:19:03,220 --> 00:19:06,620 world but you lose, you ruin your spiritual life. 347 00:19:06,620 --> 00:19:10,300 What good is that going to be? He wants them to recognize that 348 00:19:10,300 --> 00:19:13,420 our spiritual life is more important than anything else. 349 00:19:13,980 --> 00:19:17,340 Forfeiting that should never be done for a lesser good, And that 350 00:19:17,340 --> 00:19:20,460 applies still today. We can pursue material things, 351 00:19:20,780 --> 00:19:24,660 but never at the expense of forfeiting our spiritual life 352 00:19:24,660 --> 00:19:29,470 and our relationship with God. Jesus says what has a man to 353 00:19:29,470 --> 00:19:33,390 offer in exchange for his life? Now we probably miss this, but 354 00:19:33,390 --> 00:19:37,790 Jesus here is probably alluding to Psalm 49 versus 7 to 9, which 355 00:19:37,790 --> 00:19:42,270 says this truly no man can ransom himself or give to God 356 00:19:42,270 --> 00:19:47,030 the price of his life, for the ransom of his life is costly and 357 00:19:47,030 --> 00:19:50,510 yet can never suffice that he should live on forever and never 358 00:19:50,510 --> 00:19:53,310 see the pit. So that's a clear teaching in 359 00:19:53,310 --> 00:19:58,540 the Psalms that even if someone were to give up his own life, 360 00:19:58,540 --> 00:20:03,140 that is not a sufficient ransom to inherit eternal life. 361 00:20:03,140 --> 00:20:05,660 That seems to be what that phrase is saying. 362 00:20:06,060 --> 00:20:10,180 So when Jesus, he says what can a man what what has a man to 363 00:20:10,180 --> 00:20:13,180 offer in exchange for his life? He's basically saying there is 364 00:20:13,180 --> 00:20:17,300 really nothing you can give in order to nothing physical you 365 00:20:17,300 --> 00:20:20,140 can give to inherit your spiritual life. 366 00:20:20,140 --> 00:20:22,500 So you need to pay more attention to your spiritual life 367 00:20:22,820 --> 00:20:25,180 than physical things. That's the overall thrust of 368 00:20:25,180 --> 00:20:30,740 this. Jesus is now going to use some 369 00:20:30,740 --> 00:20:34,020 really interesting language here that scholars have discussed for 370 00:20:34,020 --> 00:20:35,700 centuries and they're quite divided. 371 00:20:35,700 --> 00:20:37,740 Even if you look at a Bible commentary today, you will see 372 00:20:37,860 --> 00:20:39,420 all sorts of interpretations here. 373 00:20:40,260 --> 00:20:44,220 So I'll read out the entire phrase or the entire 2 verses, 374 00:20:44,220 --> 00:20:47,820 and then we'll dive into it. See what your mind thinks of, 375 00:20:47,820 --> 00:20:52,900 See what you think is the is the fulfillment of this passage. 376 00:20:52,900 --> 00:20:56,420 What is Jesus thinking of? Have a think about it and we'll 377 00:20:56,420 --> 00:20:59,540 see if that fits. For the Son of Man is going to 378 00:20:59,540 --> 00:21:03,820 come in the glory of his father with his angels, and when he 379 00:21:03,820 --> 00:21:07,420 does, he will reward each one according to his behavior. 380 00:21:08,300 --> 00:21:11,660 I tell you solemnly, there are some of these standing here who 381 00:21:11,660 --> 00:21:15,620 will not taste death before they see the Son of Man coming with 382 00:21:15,620 --> 00:21:18,980 his Kingdom. First thing to notice about this 383 00:21:19,020 --> 00:21:22,140 is verse 27, the first where there is 4. 384 00:21:22,890 --> 00:21:25,050 So there's a connection there from the previous passage. 385 00:21:25,290 --> 00:21:28,410 What he's about to say about the coming of the Son of Man and 386 00:21:28,410 --> 00:21:33,050 judgment is directly related to what he has just said about He's 387 00:21:33,050 --> 00:21:35,050 warning people not to lose spiritual life. 388 00:21:35,050 --> 00:21:39,250 So Jesus is about to explain why he just said what he said. 389 00:21:39,970 --> 00:21:43,930 He's about to explain the incentive for telling people 390 00:21:43,930 --> 00:21:46,210 they have to have a radical commitment to Jesus. 391 00:21:46,210 --> 00:21:48,530 Why is it they have to have a radical commitment to Jesus? 392 00:21:48,890 --> 00:21:52,240 It's because of what he's about to say here about the Last 393 00:21:52,280 --> 00:21:56,880 Judgment Day. Now, Mark's version adds in some 394 00:21:56,880 --> 00:21:59,680 more information at this point. So Mark's version here adds the 395 00:21:59,680 --> 00:22:03,880 phrases about anyone who is ashamed of me, etc, etc, and 396 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:07,160 anyone who is not ashamed of me. And so that fits in here as 397 00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:08,640 well. But Matthew has cut that out. 398 00:22:09,840 --> 00:22:13,320 Instead, Matthew starts this part by saying this. 399 00:22:14,280 --> 00:22:18,120 The Son of Man is going to come in the glory of his Father with 400 00:22:18,120 --> 00:22:21,340 his angels. So firstly, who's the Son of 401 00:22:21,340 --> 00:22:23,540 Man? That's the term for the Messiah. 402 00:22:24,260 --> 00:22:27,300 Jesus disciples expected the Messiah to bring in the Kingdom 403 00:22:27,300 --> 00:22:30,020 in a dramatic apocalyptic way. They saw the coming of the 404 00:22:30,020 --> 00:22:33,860 Kingdom of God as being a one time radical event where God 405 00:22:33,860 --> 00:22:36,500 sets up his Kingdom on heaven completely straight away. 406 00:22:37,340 --> 00:22:39,700 Jesus here is telling them that this is going to happen. 407 00:22:39,700 --> 00:22:41,580 It's going to happen at the final judgment. 408 00:22:41,580 --> 00:22:44,420 He that's what he says here. He says the Son of Man is going 409 00:22:44,420 --> 00:22:47,500 to come in the glory of his father with his angels. 410 00:22:47,870 --> 00:22:50,390 So he's telling his disciples here that that is indeed going 411 00:22:50,390 --> 00:22:52,950 to happen. But he doesn't tell them exactly 412 00:22:52,950 --> 00:22:55,070 when that will happen. They were expecting it straight 413 00:22:55,070 --> 00:22:57,790 away. Jesus is not going to comment on 414 00:22:57,790 --> 00:22:59,350 when it's going to happen at this point. 415 00:23:00,470 --> 00:23:04,270 And he says he will reward each one according to his behavior. 416 00:23:04,510 --> 00:23:07,070 What it actually says there is He'll reward each one for what 417 00:23:07,070 --> 00:23:09,750 he has done. If you know the Book of 418 00:23:09,750 --> 00:23:11,950 Revelation, well that should echo for you. 419 00:23:11,950 --> 00:23:15,980 Because remember, one of the last things Jesus says is in the 420 00:23:15,980 --> 00:23:19,540 Book of Revelation is behold, I am coming soon to bring my 421 00:23:19,540 --> 00:23:22,740 reward to give to each one for what he has done. 422 00:23:22,980 --> 00:23:26,260 So this is something Jesus says even in the Book of Revelation. 423 00:23:26,340 --> 00:23:30,500 Jesus is going to come back and reward or punish people based on 424 00:23:30,500 --> 00:23:32,460 their deeds. Notice what they're being 425 00:23:32,460 --> 00:23:35,380 rewarded or punished on. It's for what he has done. 426 00:23:35,380 --> 00:23:38,380 It's not for believing that he exists. 427 00:23:38,380 --> 00:23:40,700 It's not for believing that He's the Messiah even. 428 00:23:41,360 --> 00:23:45,520 And criteria of judgment in the New Testament is always for what 429 00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:47,680 he has done. Let's keep that in mind. 430 00:23:48,800 --> 00:23:50,960 Jesus main point here is something like this. 431 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:55,080 If anyone wants to get into the Messianic Kingdom, he needs to 432 00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:59,400 renounce himself and follow me. Anyone who focuses selfishly on 433 00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:03,240 his own life and does not lay himself down will not inherit 434 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:06,600 eternal life when the Son of Man comes in glory to set up his 435 00:24:06,600 --> 00:24:09,220 Kingdom. So that's how we sort of fit the 436 00:24:09,220 --> 00:24:11,460 first half of this reading. In the second-half together, 437 00:24:11,460 --> 00:24:14,620 they do connect well. Jesus wants the crowds to put 438 00:24:14,620 --> 00:24:17,740 things in perspective. One day there will be a Judgment 439 00:24:17,740 --> 00:24:18,900 day. Even if they don't know what it 440 00:24:18,900 --> 00:24:22,540 is, they need to be prepared for that judgment day and everyone 441 00:24:22,540 --> 00:24:24,420 will be rewarded according to their works. 442 00:24:24,740 --> 00:24:27,340 What kind of works would Jesus judge people on? 443 00:24:27,780 --> 00:24:30,260 Well, in the context of Matthew's Gospel, Jesus has 444 00:24:30,260 --> 00:24:33,660 actually already said quite a few times the kinds of things 445 00:24:33,660 --> 00:24:35,700 that are going to be focused on on Judgment Day. 446 00:24:35,700 --> 00:24:40,210 So we see that God will judge people based on their words. 447 00:24:40,450 --> 00:24:43,130 That's mentioned in chapter 12 on their thoughts. 448 00:24:43,130 --> 00:24:45,970 That's mentioned in the Sermon on the Mount and their actions 449 00:24:45,970 --> 00:24:47,970 as well. That's mentioned in chapter 450 00:24:47,970 --> 00:24:49,330 seven of the Sermon on the Mount. 451 00:24:50,490 --> 00:24:54,970 He also says in earlier in Chapter 6, just after the Our 452 00:24:54,970 --> 00:24:58,130 Father, Jesus says God will judge people based on their 453 00:24:58,130 --> 00:25:02,890 willingness to forgive others. And then later in chapter 25 of 454 00:25:02,890 --> 00:25:07,990 the Gospel, Jesus says we'll be judged based on our commitment 455 00:25:07,990 --> 00:25:10,910 to doing the works of mercy for those in need. 456 00:25:11,150 --> 00:25:13,750 So all of those will be involved on Judgment Day. 457 00:25:14,910 --> 00:25:17,270 The picture we get here when we read the entire Gospel of 458 00:25:17,270 --> 00:25:21,110 Matthew is that God and the Son will both be involved in 459 00:25:21,110 --> 00:25:24,350 judgment on the last day and they will take a big picture, 460 00:25:24,350 --> 00:25:27,710 look at a person's life and see how committed they were to the 461 00:25:27,710 --> 00:25:30,190 Kingdom and doing the will of the Father. 462 00:25:30,350 --> 00:25:34,430 All of that comes together, so that ends today's reading. 463 00:25:34,670 --> 00:25:37,430 There's actually one more line in this speech that Jesus gives, 464 00:25:37,430 --> 00:25:39,790 and it's quite an interesting one that's generated a lot of 465 00:25:39,790 --> 00:25:41,990 discussion. So that will be verse 28. 466 00:25:41,990 --> 00:25:45,710 That's not included in today's lectionary reading, but you can 467 00:25:45,710 --> 00:25:49,950 hear that last part of the speech on Friday of week 18 in 468 00:25:49,950 --> 00:25:52,430 Ordinary Time. You might like to chase that one 469 00:25:52,430 --> 00:25:54,430 down by looking at the podcast archives. 470 00:25:54,630 --> 00:25:58,830 So Friday of week 18 in Ordinary Time follows on from today. 471 00:26:01,170 --> 00:26:03,090 If we turn to the Catechism, we'll just go through a couple 472 00:26:03,090 --> 00:26:07,170 of key verses here which are worth looking at. 473 00:26:07,330 --> 00:26:12,410 So paragraph 736 of the Catechism says that we live by 474 00:26:12,410 --> 00:26:15,010 the Spirit. The more we renounce ourselves, 475 00:26:15,370 --> 00:26:18,530 the more we walk by the Spirit. This is in the section of the 476 00:26:18,530 --> 00:26:21,450 Catechism about the Holy Spirit. So basically the Church is 477 00:26:21,450 --> 00:26:24,730 teaching is to get more in touch with the Spirit. 478 00:26:24,730 --> 00:26:27,610 We need to renounce ourselves more, and that comes, of course, 479 00:26:27,610 --> 00:26:31,060 from this passage, paragraph 226. 480 00:26:31,060 --> 00:26:33,660 This is early in the Catechism about what it means to believe 481 00:26:33,660 --> 00:26:36,380 in one God. It says it means that we should 482 00:26:36,380 --> 00:26:41,260 make good use of created things. faith in God the only one, leads 483 00:26:41,260 --> 00:26:45,980 us to use everything that is not God only insofar as it brings us 484 00:26:45,980 --> 00:26:50,100 closer to Him, and to detach ourselves from it, insofar as it 485 00:26:50,100 --> 00:26:53,340 turns us away from Him. And then it goes on to give this 486 00:26:53,340 --> 00:26:56,020 beautiful prayer, and you can clearly hear the link there to 487 00:26:56,020 --> 00:26:57,620 what Jesus says about detachment. 488 00:26:59,110 --> 00:27:02,870 Paragraph 618 talks about how Jesus calls his disciples to 489 00:27:02,870 --> 00:27:05,990 take up their cross and follow him, and it goes on to talk 490 00:27:05,990 --> 00:27:08,950 about how Jesus left us an example that we should follow. 491 00:27:09,750 --> 00:27:13,110 Paragraph 2029 is about salvation and how we achieve 492 00:27:13,110 --> 00:27:15,950 salvation. And it purely just quotes this 493 00:27:16,390 --> 00:27:20,710 If any man would come after me, let him deny himself and take up 494 00:27:20,710 --> 00:27:23,710 his cross and follow me. That's the entire paragraph, 495 00:27:24,300 --> 00:27:27,460 paragraph 2029. So the Church sees in here an 496 00:27:27,460 --> 00:27:29,100 important teaching about salvation. 497 00:27:29,500 --> 00:27:32,660 If you want to be saved, if you want to be justified, then you 498 00:27:32,660 --> 00:27:36,540 have to come after Jesus. There's a discussion about the 499 00:27:36,540 --> 00:27:39,740 soul in paragraph 363. I'll include that in the show 500 00:27:39,740 --> 00:27:44,060 notes. And then also paragraph 1021 is 501 00:27:44,060 --> 00:27:48,100 a discussion about the judgment day and how Jesus is going to be 502 00:27:48,100 --> 00:27:52,350 involved in the judgment. And also the Second Coming is 503 00:27:52,350 --> 00:27:54,470 mentioned in that paragraph as well. 504 00:27:54,710 --> 00:27:58,070 So there's actually quite a few paragraphs to look at today and 505 00:27:58,070 --> 00:28:00,790 I'd encourage you to have a look at the sharing notes to check 506 00:28:00,790 --> 00:28:02,550 that out. Thanks for listening. 507 00:28:02,550 --> 00:28:03,670 I hope you learned something new. 508 00:28:03,790 --> 00:28:05,870 If you have, please share the podcast around.