1 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:11,760 Hello everyone and welcome to the Doctors of Running podcast 2 00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:14,400 where we, a group of doctors of physical therapy, discuss the 3 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:16,680 art and science of running and the stuff that we put on our 4 00:00:16,680 --> 00:00:18,400 feet. Today I'll be hosting. 5 00:00:18,400 --> 00:00:21,240 I'm Nathan Brown and I am here at the Round Table with Doctor 6 00:00:21,240 --> 00:00:25,720 David Salas and Doctor Matthew Klein and we are here for a buy 7 00:00:25,720 --> 00:00:27,760 or sell episode. It's been a while since we've 8 00:00:27,760 --> 00:00:30,360 done one of these and we have a lot of buy or sell that have 9 00:00:30,360 --> 00:00:33,360 inspired by your questions that you've left for us through 10 00:00:33,360 --> 00:00:36,240 e-mail and through YouTube comments and things like that. 11 00:00:36,240 --> 00:00:39,120 So thank you for interacting with us that we can create 12 00:00:39,720 --> 00:00:42,560 podcast episodes that are talking about the stuff that 13 00:00:42,560 --> 00:00:44,520 you'll care about. So thanks for engaging with us 14 00:00:44,880 --> 00:00:48,400 to give a little time stamp on the recording date for this It 15 00:00:48,400 --> 00:00:52,480 is Sunday, April 28th at halftime of game four of the 16 00:00:52,480 --> 00:00:53,400 Bucks. Pacers. 17 00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:55,520 Currently the Bucks do not have Giannis. 18 00:00:55,520 --> 00:00:58,720 They do not have Dame and Bobby got himself himself kicked out 19 00:00:58,720 --> 00:01:02,200 with a double technical and nobody cares about this except 20 00:01:02,280 --> 00:01:04,840 some of us at doctors running. We care about the NBA little 21 00:01:04,840 --> 00:01:06,920 bit, but that's not why people listen. 22 00:01:06,920 --> 00:01:09,240 But they're only down three at halftime. 23 00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:11,240 They're shooting like 60% from the field. 24 00:01:11,440 --> 00:01:14,120 There's a chance y'all and I could look like a fool when this 25 00:01:14,120 --> 00:01:16,720 releases 'cause this won't release for like 10 days where 26 00:01:16,720 --> 00:01:18,680 they'll be out, probably out of the playoffs at that point. 27 00:01:18,680 --> 00:01:21,080 But I gotta keep the keep the hope alive. 28 00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:23,840 What's What's the series at right now? 29 00:01:24,000 --> 00:01:29,840 1-2 We're down. 1-2 OK, we lost. We lost game two at home and 30 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:33,800 then game 3:00 we we, I don't know how he stuck around. 31 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:37,680 We went down like 20 in the first quarter and then we came 32 00:01:37,680 --> 00:01:40,520 back and sent it to overtime. Middleton hit some crazy threes, 33 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:44,120 like with with time expiring basically to tie it, and then we 34 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:46,520 lost in overtime. But it was a fun game and that's 35 00:01:46,520 --> 00:01:49,760 what basketball's about, right? Plus Bach, our media managers, A 36 00:01:49,760 --> 00:01:53,160 Pacers fan and I would be happy for him because they've had a 37 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:56,080 tough Rd. You know they have not been and 38 00:01:56,080 --> 00:01:57,600 we had a championship a couple years ago. 39 00:01:57,600 --> 00:02:00,800 Yeah, he's been a very loyal Indiana fan for a minute. 40 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:04,360 So I would be happy. I would be happy for him. 41 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:09,600 OK, that was 2 minutes too many to talk about the Bucks I'm sure 42 00:02:09,600 --> 00:02:11,920 for most of you. So let's move forward to our buy 43 00:02:11,920 --> 00:02:14,280 or sell episode because it's a buy or sell. 44 00:02:14,560 --> 00:02:17,760 I think that the best subjective is for you to answer one of 45 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:19,840 these buy or sell prompts for yourselves. 46 00:02:19,840 --> 00:02:22,200 We have a bunch here, who knows how many we'll get through. 47 00:02:22,200 --> 00:02:23,800 It depends on how long when did we get. 48 00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:26,720 But we're going to talk about everything from different 49 00:02:26,720 --> 00:02:29,320 training techniques and strength training techniques and how that 50 00:02:29,320 --> 00:02:31,120 impacts our ability to run faster. 51 00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:33,400 We're going to talk about running shoe related buyer 52 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:35,200 sells. We're going to talk about things 53 00:02:35,200 --> 00:02:38,840 about post race. It spans the gamut of topics, so 54 00:02:38,840 --> 00:02:41,360 it's going to go from like the heavy science stuff all the way 55 00:02:41,360 --> 00:02:43,640 to some fun stuff related to running culture. 56 00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:47,800 So you guys ready to dig in? Let's do it. 57 00:02:48,280 --> 00:02:49,560 Head nods. Perfect. 58 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:52,480 Let's do it. So our first one, our first buy 59 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:56,400 or sell is that plyometric training will help me at the 60 00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:59,560 marathon distance. So just to give a little bit of 61 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:03,560 context for people, plyometric training are exercises where 62 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:06,240 you're doing explosive type exercises. 63 00:03:06,240 --> 00:03:08,840 It might be something like box jumps, it could be something 64 00:03:08,840 --> 00:03:12,720 like a balanced lunge hop, it could be dropped squats there, 65 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:14,440 it's anything that's high velocity. 66 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:16,800 So the buy or sell is buy or sell. 67 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:19,880 That plyometric training will help at the marathon distance, 68 00:03:19,880 --> 00:03:21,640 but. David should go, for instance, 69 00:03:21,640 --> 00:03:23,280 he's actually been competitive at the marathon. 70 00:03:23,280 --> 00:03:25,920 Does this recently. Oh man, that's no pressure. 71 00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:29,800 I don't even know if I go that far, if I've been competitive or 72 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:31,880 not, but. I would say. 73 00:03:32,360 --> 00:03:34,520 That's me, everyone. I feel like let's, I mean, 74 00:03:34,520 --> 00:03:37,360 everyone's competitive at the marathon distance because that's 75 00:03:37,360 --> 00:03:39,520 what I love about running. No matter how fast or slow you 76 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:42,120 are, you're competitive somewhere probably with 77 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:43,400 yourself. That's what running is. 78 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:46,360 But David is the fastest by a lot so. 79 00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:48,480 Yeah, I'm going to. I'm going to be a hard buy on 80 00:03:48,480 --> 00:03:52,720 this and I'm going to come at it from an angle that I think a lot 81 00:03:52,720 --> 00:03:55,640 of people probably aren't thinking of now. 82 00:03:55,640 --> 00:03:59,720 The plyometrics and working on explosiveness and power and 83 00:03:59,720 --> 00:04:02,920 those types of things can make you faster in short distances 84 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:05,600 where you really need to capitalize on that amortization 85 00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:07,480 phase really explode off of your foot. 86 00:04:08,000 --> 00:04:11,160 And I guess a plyometric, First off like yeah, there's like a 87 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:13,800 couple phases to that where you land and you have to really 88 00:04:13,800 --> 00:04:15,600 absorb the load. There's a time in between and 89 00:04:15,600 --> 00:04:21,920 then you pop off and that really matters in the short distances. 90 00:04:21,920 --> 00:04:24,960 And does it matter as much in the long distances? 91 00:04:25,080 --> 00:04:29,280 I would argue that it does, But from a bone health standpoint 92 00:04:29,360 --> 00:04:32,640 with long distance running, that can be a relatively catabolic 93 00:04:32,920 --> 00:04:36,080 process where you have a lot of inflammation in your body. 94 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:38,560 If you're not taking care of yourself, you can really be 95 00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:42,480 breaking things down and you hear about stress fractures all 96 00:04:42,480 --> 00:04:45,320 of the time. And if you can incorporate some 97 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:47,920 level of skipping, some plyometric, whether it's box 98 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:51,360 jumps, A skips, B skips, even strides, I'll count that like 99 00:04:52,000 --> 00:04:54,960 karaokes, like get your bones stressed in a couple of 100 00:04:54,960 --> 00:04:58,040 different ways and that can really help on the anabolic side 101 00:04:58,040 --> 00:05:01,360 of things where you're building things up and might be able to 102 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:02,880 make your body a little bit more Hardy. 103 00:05:02,880 --> 00:05:06,200 Does it make you faster? Hard to say If it'll actually 104 00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:09,760 make you faster over 26.2? I would love to see some data on 105 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:11,040 that. I don't really know off the top 106 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:15,080 of my head. But from a health standpoint and 107 00:05:15,080 --> 00:05:17,480 keeping you healthy and making sure that your bones can 108 00:05:17,480 --> 00:05:20,800 actually take the training that you're doing, I think I'm a I'm 109 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:24,440 a bi on this. I I'll add on really quick 110 00:05:24,440 --> 00:05:27,840 because my brain actually I totally agree with your I'm 111 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:29,960 sorry I'm a hard buy on this as well. 112 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:33,720 I actually wasn't thinking about the bone health top of mind but 113 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:37,560 I completely agree with that And just for long term like your 114 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:41,320 longevity and keeping things where they should be 100%, there 115 00:05:41,320 --> 00:05:44,640 are a lot of studies that corroborate that plyometric 116 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:47,160 exercises. One study looked at a six week 117 00:05:47,160 --> 00:05:50,640 program another one looks at integrating plyometrics into 118 00:05:50,640 --> 00:05:53,040 your warm up. Both of those in recreational 119 00:05:53,040 --> 00:05:54,920 runners improved running economy. 120 00:05:55,160 --> 00:05:58,720 And so if you have a better, a more efficient time on the 121 00:05:58,720 --> 00:06:02,640 ground, which is all about short time and having an efficient 122 00:06:02,640 --> 00:06:06,360 stride, it's going to improve your ability to do that over 26 123 00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:08,920 miles. No, it's not, you know, 100 124 00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:11,000 meter dash, that's not what we're talking about here. 125 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:14,440 But your ability to improve your running economy is what actually 126 00:06:14,440 --> 00:06:16,640 matters the most over those 26 miles. 127 00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:19,920 So I would say there's a lot of evidence for the bone side and 128 00:06:19,920 --> 00:06:23,680 there's a lot of evidence for the running economy side, which 129 00:06:23,680 --> 00:06:27,200 is what really matters. And I think part of that is 130 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:30,880 there's another one of the studies that I was looking at, a 131 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:36,080 recent study, I think it was in 2022, compared heavy resistance 132 00:06:36,080 --> 00:06:40,760 training to plyometrics as it came to running economy 133 00:06:40,760 --> 00:06:44,640 improvements. And it was a systematic review 134 00:06:44,640 --> 00:06:47,240 between those two types of protocols and it was plyometrics 135 00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:49,480 that won out. Again, that doesn't mean that 136 00:06:49,680 --> 00:06:51,120 heavy resistance training is bad. 137 00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:53,480 We know it's good for things like bone health and all that 138 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:54,880 kind of stuff. But when it came to running 139 00:06:54,880 --> 00:06:57,240 economy, it was plyometrics that went out. 140 00:06:57,240 --> 00:07:01,280 So I am a huge buy on integrating plyometric exercise. 141 00:07:01,680 --> 00:07:04,120 That doesn't mean that everyone should add plyometrics right 142 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:07,800 away because they are hard to do and they're a different type of 143 00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:10,000 demand on your body. So if you're not ready for it, 144 00:07:10,160 --> 00:07:11,720 they could cause more harm than good. 145 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:16,000 Also, if you are like heavy into a training cycle and you are 146 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:19,560 trying to balance your recovery with your training load and you 147 00:07:19,560 --> 00:07:23,080 can't add on something like, yes it might be beneficial, but 148 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:25,840 maybe not right now. You know, save those plyometrics 149 00:07:25,840 --> 00:07:28,760 for another time to build your running economy for that new 150 00:07:28,760 --> 00:07:30,880 training block. But just because something's 151 00:07:30,880 --> 00:07:32,280 good doesn't mean we should add it. 152 00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:35,600 Now it all is going to depend on your circumstances, but you got. 153 00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:37,640 Mad oh, it's it. Definitely adding on to what you 154 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:40,360 two said and then adding on that comments from a programming 155 00:07:40,360 --> 00:07:42,960 standpoint, when you add things into your season, your 156 00:07:42,960 --> 00:07:45,280 progression is really important. If you're not training for 157 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:48,160 anything crazy or you're not close to a goal race, yeah, you 158 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:51,080 can totally add this stuff on. But like Nathan said, you have 159 00:07:51,080 --> 00:07:53,320 to be careful because while there's a very high benefit, 160 00:07:53,320 --> 00:07:55,880 there's also very high risk. There's some very good things 161 00:07:55,880 --> 00:07:58,480 you can think about before you just start jumping into this, no 162 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:02,960 pun intended about can you act, Do you actually have the force 163 00:08:02,960 --> 00:08:04,920 to produce this? Because doing platter metrics is 164 00:08:04,920 --> 00:08:07,960 working not only elasticity, but it's working on power. 165 00:08:08,320 --> 00:08:11,600 Power is a combination of force and velocity. 166 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:14,280 If you don't have the force to do this, you are putting 167 00:08:14,280 --> 00:08:16,920 yourself at risk. So having something that builds 168 00:08:16,920 --> 00:08:19,760 you into this safely is actually really important to go Hey 169 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:23,120 starting with some you know heavier resistance training 170 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:24,360 things like that is really important. 171 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:27,160 Before you go into this. I'm going to add to the their 172 00:08:27,160 --> 00:08:30,640 large buy on this my my bias in this being that my research is 173 00:08:30,640 --> 00:08:33,799 an aging matches runners and one of the things I found is that 174 00:08:33,799 --> 00:08:37,200 power elasticity, all that stuff is something we lose with age. 175 00:08:37,200 --> 00:08:39,440 And I think that's one of the biggest differences that I found 176 00:08:39,440 --> 00:08:42,200 in my research between those that have kind of a higher risk 177 00:08:42,200 --> 00:08:44,560 for certain types of injuries and those that don't and you 178 00:08:44,560 --> 00:08:47,720 already lose that stuff. So from an aging perspective I 179 00:08:47,720 --> 00:08:51,120 think doing some kind of strength training, the kind of 180 00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:54,840 the goal being eventually potentially over years working 181 00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:57,560 in doing plyos is really good because doesn't matter what age 182 00:08:57,560 --> 00:09:00,120 you are you know I know the, the, the, I know the systematic 183 00:09:00,160 --> 00:09:01,960 you're talking about the compared like heavy slow 184 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:03,320 resistance training to plyometrics. 185 00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:06,640 You although it's slightly different you can still get 186 00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:10,120 strength gains from plyometrics. And you see there's a lot of 187 00:09:10,120 --> 00:09:12,360 very good research in older individuals on this going, Yeah, 188 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:14,440 people should be jumping, you have to work into it. 189 00:09:14,840 --> 00:09:19,120 But I always think like the type of strength or supplementary 190 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:23,000 work you should do should be different than what your primary 191 00:09:23,000 --> 00:09:25,080 exercise is. Like if you're running for 192 00:09:25,080 --> 00:09:28,280 example, you don't need like if you're going to do something 193 00:09:28,520 --> 00:09:31,720 that to supplement that, it doesn't need to be high 194 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:33,760 repetition weights, that doesn't. 195 00:09:33,760 --> 00:09:36,080 You're already doing that. You want to work on different 196 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:37,840 systems and make sure you're balanced athlete. 197 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:41,200 So I think plyometrics and power is super important. 198 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:44,480 It's also very, again very related to sports performance, 199 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:47,160 economy and Eve over the marathon distance. 200 00:09:47,160 --> 00:09:49,720 When you do a lot of marathons, you can sometimes lose some of 201 00:09:49,720 --> 00:09:52,440 that speed. So maintaining that, I think 202 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:55,120 from balancing yourself out and from an overall health 203 00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:57,160 perspective is such a good thing. 204 00:09:57,160 --> 00:10:00,520 But as Nathan said, as like as David said, phenomenal for bone 205 00:10:00,520 --> 00:10:01,880 density. If you listen to the episode I 206 00:10:01,880 --> 00:10:04,720 did with Rich Willie, it was great talking about that. 207 00:10:04,720 --> 00:10:07,920 But as Nathan mentioned, you got to be careful when you do this. 208 00:10:07,920 --> 00:10:10,480 If your goal races in a week, you should not be adding this 209 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:12,160 in. This is a, hey, you know what, 210 00:10:12,160 --> 00:10:14,640 I'm in my base phase. I'm just kind of getting, you 211 00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:16,800 know, kind of my feet under me and I want to just add something 212 00:10:16,800 --> 00:10:18,640 new when I'm not adding too many variables in. 213 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:22,360 Yes, it's, it's powerful. It's also potent. 214 00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:24,680 So just be a little cautious, but it's great. 215 00:10:25,280 --> 00:10:29,000 And just to say there's, you know, just a call back to Rich 216 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:31,920 Willie's episode, the number of foot contacts that you need, 217 00:10:31,920 --> 00:10:34,960 that's how that's how plyometrics are dosed, is by the 218 00:10:34,960 --> 00:10:37,280 amount of times your foot hits the ground or your feet hit the 219 00:10:37,280 --> 00:10:40,040 ground. And it's can be as low as 25 220 00:10:40,040 --> 00:10:42,080 sometimes to have the benefit you need. 221 00:10:42,080 --> 00:10:44,560 So it's not a lot. And so it's easy to overdose 222 00:10:44,560 --> 00:10:47,560 this because it's like, oh, I should do you know, like 3 223 00:10:47,560 --> 00:10:49,960 different jumping exercises, three sets of 10. 224 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:53,040 So that's not what it is. It's much, it's much lower so. 225 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:57,600 Quality over quantity with any of the more intense strength or 226 00:10:57,600 --> 00:10:59,800 power training, it's not endurance running. 227 00:10:59,800 --> 00:11:01,560 You have to you're going to be working a different system. 228 00:11:01,560 --> 00:11:02,920 You got to focus differently. Cool. 229 00:11:03,680 --> 00:11:06,880 All right, This next buy or sell, we're turning to the shoe 230 00:11:06,880 --> 00:11:10,160 world. So the this one is super 231 00:11:10,160 --> 00:11:14,760 trainers that cost over $200 buy or sell. 232 00:11:14,760 --> 00:11:17,440 So some examples would be the Super blast. 233 00:11:17,960 --> 00:11:23,320 Another example would be the on cloud monster Hyper buy or sell. 234 00:11:23,880 --> 00:11:27,240 First of all, I'm gonna cause some problems. 235 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:30,280 I don't think that On Cloud Monster is a Hyper is a super 236 00:11:30,280 --> 00:11:33,000 trainer. I'm just going to put that out 237 00:11:33,000 --> 00:11:35,480 there. I think my justification is off 238 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:38,080 topic. The the midsole, the full length 239 00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:40,760 is not super foam. I think it's more closer to 240 00:11:40,760 --> 00:11:42,560 something like. I thought the platform was. 241 00:11:42,880 --> 00:11:44,880 No, no. It's it's the center. 242 00:11:44,880 --> 00:11:47,360 Part of it was the center. But not the whole thing. 243 00:11:47,440 --> 00:11:48,800 Well, the outer it's like a casing. 244 00:11:48,800 --> 00:11:51,760 It's almost like the. Spectrum, but it's also not like 245 00:11:51,760 --> 00:11:54,640 above the 40mm which I maybe that maybe that's. 246 00:11:54,960 --> 00:11:58,680 Right, Like the 40mm, it's not over 40mm. 247 00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:03,760 Yeah, The Skyward X. the Super Blast the What's the Skyward 0? 248 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:08,600 Skyward X, The Prime X Serious. Those I think are the Cloud 249 00:12:08,600 --> 00:12:09,280 monster. Hyper. 250 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:11,400 I don't. I don't totally think so. 251 00:12:11,880 --> 00:12:15,600 But yeah, is it just okay Fine? But answer the but answer the 252 00:12:15,600 --> 00:12:21,840 question. Over 2 / 200 I I it it depends. 253 00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:24,200 No, I'm going to do yourself, bro. 254 00:12:25,400 --> 00:12:26,880 You can always tell why it depends. 255 00:12:26,960 --> 00:12:30,000 Bro on that too. For. 256 00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:33,920 Certain products. Buy for other ones sell. 257 00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:38,160 So the Super blast for 200 bucks I actually think is a great deal 258 00:12:38,160 --> 00:12:41,880 220. 5. OK, 225, that thing is lasted 259 00:12:41,920 --> 00:12:44,440 forever. It's lasted twice as long as a 260 00:12:44,440 --> 00:12:48,080 lot of other shoes have for me. So for the Super Blast, I would 261 00:12:48,080 --> 00:12:52,680 definitely say a buy because it's got an incredible amount of 262 00:12:52,680 --> 00:12:55,800 versatility in terms of only 8.4 oz from Nice. 263 00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:57,520 So like that thing can still move. 264 00:12:57,520 --> 00:13:00,080 It's not the fastest shoe, but it could also handle long runs 265 00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:02,680 and if I had to do an Ultra, a Rode Ultra, that would be the 266 00:13:02,680 --> 00:13:05,000 shoe I would pick without even thinking about it. 267 00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:11,480 The Skyward X, the Prime X, still, I don't know, there's 268 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:13,440 there's some versatility concerns that I have. 269 00:13:13,440 --> 00:13:16,880 I'm sorry the hand motions, but yeah, buy for Super Blast, I 270 00:13:16,880 --> 00:13:19,400 might be a sell on some of the other ones. 271 00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:21,320 I don't know if I'm allowed to do that. 272 00:13:21,840 --> 00:13:25,080 David, what do you think? I think it's a tough answer 273 00:13:25,080 --> 00:13:28,400 because is it a buy for literally any shoe over $200.00 274 00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:30,760 at this point? It's crazy that the market is at 275 00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:35,600 this, but if I am going to look at it at face value, for what 276 00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:39,960 it's worth, at that category, super shoes at 250, super 277 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:45,040 trainers, give or take 200 to 225 and assuming that a normal 278 00:13:45,040 --> 00:13:50,320 premium trainer is going to be what, 170 now probably 17181? 279 00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:55,240 Yeah, you're right, 16150. So I think the Bondi is at like 280 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:59,440 170 now, right? I think, yeah, I know it's 281 00:13:59,440 --> 00:14:02,640 crazy. I think it's a tough one. 282 00:14:02,760 --> 00:14:08,640 I man. Nathan picked the cute. 283 00:14:08,640 --> 00:14:11,800 One of my favorite shoes. I don't know. 284 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:13,160 I'm. I'm going to be a bi. 285 00:14:13,320 --> 00:14:17,240 I'm going to be a bi and I I think it's going to be because 286 00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:19,600 of what it can add to the arsenal. 287 00:14:19,600 --> 00:14:23,240 Now, I do think there has to be some durability things that are 288 00:14:23,280 --> 00:14:25,240 addressed. If you're going to pay that much 289 00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:29,560 money for a shoe that's not a racing shoe, you know where it's 290 00:14:29,560 --> 00:14:30,880 OK. Well, this is streamlined for 291 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:32,520 performance. You're only going to get X 292 00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:35,360 amount of uses out of it. You're you're, you know what 293 00:14:35,360 --> 00:14:37,280 you're buying. You know, if you're going to get 294 00:14:37,280 --> 00:14:39,560 a shoe that's more on the training side of things, I want 295 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:42,360 it to be on the training side of things and I want to make sure 296 00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:46,040 that it can last on my feet. So some of this I think does 297 00:14:46,040 --> 00:14:47,920 still need a little bit more time to play. 298 00:14:48,240 --> 00:14:50,680 But three of my favorite shoes in the last couple years. 299 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:53,640 One of them was the Super blast. That thing is, I mean you can 300 00:14:53,640 --> 00:14:55,120 run that thing till the cows come home. 301 00:14:55,480 --> 00:15:00,040 Another one is the glad monster hyper. 302 00:15:00,040 --> 00:15:04,000 That thing has a thick slab of Helon HF the entire way, man. 303 00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:07,600 Dude, that's so. It's fairly, I mean it's on, 304 00:15:07,600 --> 00:15:09,720 it's fairly firm. It's not that I don't like it, 305 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:12,640 that's just it's so on. You got to soften your super 306 00:15:12,640 --> 00:15:15,640 foams. I don't know, I I find it very 307 00:15:15,640 --> 00:15:18,480 cushioned. I mean it's a little bit firm 308 00:15:18,480 --> 00:15:22,160 because of the the cloud tech around it, but I mean that's 309 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:25,480 what makes it a little firm, but the actual bouncy soft part of 310 00:15:25,480 --> 00:15:27,440 it in the mid line of that foot bed. 311 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:29,840 So now I want to put, I want to put some parameters on this 312 00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:32,680 because we obviously come at this from a perspective of 313 00:15:32,680 --> 00:15:35,080 people who get to test. I mean, look at our shoes behind 314 00:15:35,080 --> 00:15:37,360 us, we have all these shoes. So now let me frame oh, do you 315 00:15:37,360 --> 00:15:40,160 want to finish something before I frame it? 316 00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:44,920 This has been a very, very fun shoe for me and I'd said at one 317 00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:47,600 point in the chat I said shut up and take my money. 318 00:15:48,440 --> 00:15:49,320 Yeah, you did. Yeah. 319 00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:53,520 So you got to say bye. Nate Nate can say that like this 320 00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:56,240 has been like a shoe that has put a big smile on my face 321 00:15:56,240 --> 00:15:58,000 having some of that new generation tech and being. 322 00:15:58,000 --> 00:15:59,720 The Cloud Monster Hyper. Yeah, Sack shoe. 323 00:15:59,720 --> 00:16:01,440 Yeah. And the Skyward X is really nice 324 00:16:01,440 --> 00:16:02,880 too. I don't. 325 00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:05,960 I think I like the Cloud Monster hyper better, but there's been a 326 00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:08,280 few of these super trainers that have come out that I have really 327 00:16:08,280 --> 00:16:10,800 liked the SC trainer. I haven't liked that one as 328 00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:12,440 much. Is that even a super Trainer 329 00:16:12,440 --> 00:16:13,360 now? Is that over 40? 330 00:16:13,520 --> 00:16:15,480 Can you? SC trainer No, it's it's. 331 00:16:15,880 --> 00:16:18,880 Super trainer anymore, I mean. It's what do we define super 332 00:16:18,880 --> 00:16:20,040 trainer as whatever. But if. 333 00:16:20,320 --> 00:16:21,880 You're talking the cloud. It has to be over 40 334 00:16:21,880 --> 00:16:24,120 milliliters. Nathan, go, Nathan, go. 335 00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:26,920 Let me let me frame this a little bit and just see how you 336 00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:28,440 respond to this. So this doesn't have to be as 337 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:31,000 hard by or sell when you're thinking about this. 338 00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:33,520 Obviously, we have our perspective as people who are 339 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:36,440 able to test a ton of shoes. We do not pay out of pocket for 340 00:16:36,440 --> 00:16:39,320 most of the shoes that are behind us, which obviously 341 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:44,080 changes the, it changes the, the like visceral impact of having 342 00:16:44,080 --> 00:16:46,920 to hit by and seeing money come out of our bank account. 343 00:16:47,760 --> 00:16:51,960 Now if you're thinking about yourself or people you know who 344 00:16:51,960 --> 00:16:57,160 are like, hey, I'm into running. Like I like running and I just 345 00:16:57,160 --> 00:17:00,280 need to start from scratch because my shoes are worn out 346 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:02,720 and I need to buy another one or two pairs. 347 00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:05,480 Let's just say somebody who wants to get one or two is it? 348 00:17:05,480 --> 00:17:09,000 Is going the extra 50 bucks for a super trainer worth it for the 349 00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:10,760 people who are just going to? I'm going to put a. 350 00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:12,240 Well, you're changing the question. 351 00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:13,520 I am. I know I'm putting new 352 00:17:13,520 --> 00:17:15,760 parameters on it. Well, now, now it's a sell 353 00:17:15,760 --> 00:17:17,760 because this is someone who's just looking to get a pair of 354 00:17:17,760 --> 00:17:19,960 shoes on their feet. But I don't think super trainers 355 00:17:19,960 --> 00:17:22,400 are marketed at those. People tell me more. 356 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:24,480 I think it's AI think it's an unfair question. 357 00:17:24,839 --> 00:17:27,440 That that definitely. So that's I'm going to be honest 358 00:17:27,440 --> 00:17:30,080 Nathan, that's kind of what I was thinking about is I do I try 359 00:17:30,080 --> 00:17:34,440 to look at price as someone who is fairly cheap and also always 360 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:37,280 thinking about this in terms of like the Super blast. 361 00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:39,440 Yeah, again was that true that it lasted forever? 362 00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:44,000 I can't say again, even with the Skyward X that I'm wearing 363 00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:46,040 through the outsole a little bit quick, right. 364 00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:48,600 So for me, if I'm going to pay that much money, not only do I 365 00:17:48,600 --> 00:17:51,040 want the performance, I want the durability to last because it's 366 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:53,880 going to cost almost twice what other shoes are going to cost. 367 00:17:53,880 --> 00:17:55,400 So I expect double the durability. 368 00:17:55,680 --> 00:17:58,480 And thus far I'm just not seeing that. 369 00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:01,080 And you answer your question that further port pulls me 370 00:18:01,080 --> 00:18:02,720 toward a cell. As as much as I love the Super 371 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:06,080 blast and I would buy that with my own money, a lot of the other 372 00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:09,960 stuff yet is not where it's not far enough along for me to say a 373 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:13,600 definite buy. I think I'd rather have my you 374 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:18,320 know, $140.00 training shoe and then suck it up and have my like 375 00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:22,240 250 racing shoe rather than having two really expensive 376 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:24,160 ones. And the the other thing I would 377 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:27,360 say just from a variability perspective, again talking about 378 00:18:27,560 --> 00:18:30,080 you your, you know, just need a new pair of shoes. 379 00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:35,240 I'd rather have personally shoes that are different, right, two 380 00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:37,680 shoes that are different terms of a training suit and a racing 381 00:18:37,680 --> 00:18:41,160 shoe because I want different stimulus and especially for 382 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:45,000 runners out there on average that don't, again, we have had 383 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:47,000 to learn to adapt. Most people don't get the 384 00:18:47,000 --> 00:18:49,920 opportunity to test as many shoes, but there are some risks 385 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:52,920 associated with bouncing around a bunch of shoes all the time. 386 00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:55,800 We've also had, I had some minor aches and things here and there 387 00:18:55,800 --> 00:18:57,640 that I'm sure others do with theory. 388 00:18:57,680 --> 00:19:02,440 But I think overall I'm a sell because I'd rather in my mind 389 00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:05,560 have two distinctly different shoes than two shoes that are 390 00:19:05,560 --> 00:19:08,840 like almost too similar. Because I'm looking at this from 391 00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:13,040 a performance in hell, a health standpoint too, where why am I 392 00:19:13,040 --> 00:19:16,800 going to choose a a super trainer over that good racing 393 00:19:16,800 --> 00:19:19,120 shoe that's also durable and I can use for a couple different 394 00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:22,200 things, but that's me. So I think at the moment I'm a 395 00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:24,200 sell, even though I love the Super blast who would buy with 396 00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:25,880 my own money. David, anything else? 397 00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:29,440 No, I mean, with the change in the question, I think anyone 398 00:19:29,440 --> 00:19:31,760 who's hasn't had a pair of shoes in a while and is just looking 399 00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:34,240 to get anything on their feet should stay below 140. 400 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:36,600 Comment below if you say if you. Say so. 401 00:19:36,640 --> 00:19:40,960 I mean, I I think it's a bad caveat to the question, but no. 402 00:19:41,160 --> 00:19:43,240 I was fair. I was changing the question. 403 00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:45,200 I was. I was just giving a whole new 404 00:19:45,200 --> 00:19:47,960 scenario to the. Question I wasn't trying to like 405 00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:51,000 if I didn't run for three years, should I go buy a $200 pair of 406 00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:52,200 shoes? No, like. 407 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:54,640 I and I don't think I was saying that I I'm more. 408 00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:56,720 Was just saying like like they haven't had. 409 00:19:56,880 --> 00:19:58,920 In a while. No, they're no, they're running 410 00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:00,840 and they're just ready to replace their shoes. 411 00:20:00,880 --> 00:20:03,480 Like, let's say they've been running straight for 10 years 412 00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:06,120 and they usually have a couple pairs of shoes and they usually 413 00:20:06,120 --> 00:20:10,480 buy a cumulus and an 880 or something like that. 414 00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:13,440 Like, oh, is it worth the extra to try a super trainer? 415 00:20:13,440 --> 00:20:15,160 That's what that's the scenario I'm saying. 416 00:20:16,040 --> 00:20:17,960 I want to have large volume of the Vomero. 417 00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:21,320 Yeah, it's a great shoe. I think enough you're going to 418 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:24,760 see a lot of trainers actually just become a little bit more 419 00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:27,040 super as they start integrating these films anyway. 420 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:29,720 So yeah. Well, it's not overflowing. 421 00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:30,720 Are you a buyer? Sell. 422 00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:36,560 If so, first I was wrong. It is $200 for the Super blast. 423 00:20:36,600 --> 00:20:39,480 I wanted to look it up. So correct I've stand corrected. 424 00:20:39,720 --> 00:20:45,440 It is only 200 I would say if I if I found them on sale and also 425 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:48,320 like if you're a medical professional or like a APTA 426 00:20:48,320 --> 00:20:50,760 member, you can get discounts on a six. 427 00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:53,840 So that would put it in a realm where I would buy that shoe. 428 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:56,960 But I wouldn't have known to do that if I hadn't tested it out 429 00:20:56,960 --> 00:20:59,200 through doctors of running. And I probably wouldn't have 430 00:20:59,200 --> 00:21:01,920 taken the plunge. Just like with how I functioned 431 00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:05,600 functioned before this, like in buying my my footwear. 432 00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:08,160 So I don't know. Let's move on to the next 433 00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:11,320 question. I hope this one makes sense. 434 00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:12,880 Just as uncomfortable. All right. 435 00:21:12,880 --> 00:21:16,880 So this next one was inspired by some stuff that actually Andrea 436 00:21:16,880 --> 00:21:19,800 saw at a race when she was there. 437 00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:23,600 And so the buyer sells youth youths racing in vapor flies. 438 00:21:23,600 --> 00:21:27,160 So, like we should put parameters on youth. 439 00:21:28,120 --> 00:21:31,720 Do we think that it should be high school and under, or do we 440 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:34,080 think it should be middle school and under? 441 00:21:34,560 --> 00:21:36,800 I'm going to say middle school and under. 442 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:38,840 OK, that's where my brain was at. 443 00:21:38,840 --> 00:21:41,200 So when you think high school, what do you think, David? 444 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:43,600 Yeah, what I'm thinking high school, there's a couple of 445 00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:45,720 different pressures on these kids minds. 446 00:21:46,720 --> 00:21:50,720 If it's a runnable course and they're in a, they're in a 447 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:53,360 position where they might be able to get a scholarship and 448 00:21:53,360 --> 00:21:56,440 every second counts and who they're beating and where 449 00:21:56,440 --> 00:21:59,200 they're placing and are they making sections and are they 450 00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:03,680 making state and placing. I think that changes the dynamic 451 00:22:03,680 --> 00:22:05,720 a little bit. Not to say that all kids should 452 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:07,920 have it. I'm just saying certain people 453 00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:10,720 might want to put themselves in a position where they feel like 454 00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:15,800 taking on that extra dollar amount is worth it to them in a 455 00:22:15,800 --> 00:22:18,320 middle school sense. It's like, I don't know, they're 456 00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:21,960 so young. I don't there's nothing really 457 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:25,400 riding on someone who's below 9th grade. 458 00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:27,360 I mean, there's really nothing riding on anyone below 10th 459 00:22:27,360 --> 00:22:32,880 grade even. But I think at that point you're 460 00:22:32,880 --> 00:22:36,040 just developing, play different sports, have some fun. 461 00:22:36,040 --> 00:22:39,600 Like I don't see any need to throw super shoes on these kids 462 00:22:39,600 --> 00:22:41,800 and they're still developing in their proprioception. 463 00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:44,000 Their sense of balance and strength and like ability to use 464 00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:46,640 their body is also just not quite there yet either. 465 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:50,480 And so putting them in a super spongy compliant shoe might not 466 00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:55,680 be the best thing for them. Yeah, I I don't think I would 467 00:22:55,680 --> 00:23:01,520 put a super shoe on anyone under the age of 13, maybe even 15. 468 00:23:02,240 --> 00:23:05,200 Yeah, what about you, Matt? I would totally agree that when 469 00:23:05,200 --> 00:23:08,560 you're a middle schooler or a kid, the only performance 470 00:23:08,560 --> 00:23:11,520 enhancing things you should be utilizing is good nutrition, 471 00:23:11,800 --> 00:23:15,080 good sleep and adequate, appropriate strength training 472 00:23:15,080 --> 00:23:20,320 along with having a variety of sports and not doing too much of 473 00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:21,720 one. I think those are the only 474 00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:23,000 things that should be legalizing. 475 00:23:23,000 --> 00:23:26,640 We don't know the impact of using performance enhancing 476 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:28,440 shoes because that's what they are, right? 477 00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:32,000 The economy improving, whatever you want to call it, shoes on 478 00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,360 younger athletes that are still rapidly developing. 479 00:23:35,360 --> 00:23:37,400 I think when you start getting a high school and things are kind 480 00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:40,760 of getting a little into that, like you're you're developing a 481 00:23:40,760 --> 00:23:43,080 little bit more, Yes, you'll keep growing into college and 482 00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:45,600 stuff like that, but things are kind of finishing a little bit 483 00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:49,040 more in that like mid to late high school. 484 00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:52,560 Plus I can totally understand the pressures of getting a 485 00:23:52,560 --> 00:23:54,200 college scholarship or being competitive. 486 00:23:54,200 --> 00:23:55,760 I get that. But like David said, it's not 487 00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:57,440 the same thing in middle school or younger. 488 00:23:57,440 --> 00:24:01,680 So I think from a developmental standpoint, I would say a hard 489 00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:07,480 sell on super shoes for younger athletes in that that area 490 00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:11,160 personally until we have further data that says that there's not 491 00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:15,080 an impact or that you're really balancing things out. 492 00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:17,960 But I think, yeah, it's not. I think there's better places to 493 00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:19,400 invest that. I agree. 494 00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:22,360 I'm a cell as well and I think it also, y'all, I wasn't on the 495 00:24:22,360 --> 00:24:25,880 episode, I don't think, but y'all talked about kind of the, 496 00:24:27,240 --> 00:24:30,280 you know, the benefit of of doing your workouts in non super 497 00:24:30,280 --> 00:24:31,840 shoes to get some of that stimulus. 498 00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:35,000 And I think that I feel like that kind of holds true as you 499 00:24:35,000 --> 00:24:36,600 go into these these kids as well. 500 00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:39,320 Like there's you're you're just trying to like grow. 501 00:24:39,320 --> 00:24:42,240 That's all that's like. Your main objective is like. 502 00:24:42,240 --> 00:24:43,760 You should not have the. Pressure of Yeah. 503 00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:46,400 You shouldn't have the pressure of like, oh, you did hit this 504 00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:48,160 time. It's like, dude, just enjoy this 505 00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:50,600 so you don't hit it later. I'm a sell as well. 506 00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:53,080 All right, next question or next prompt? 507 00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:58,360 Regular super shoes such as Vaporfly, Alphafly perform 508 00:24:58,360 --> 00:25:03,640 better than five to 10K specific super shoes at that 5K to 10K 509 00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:05,480 distance. So this would be something like 510 00:25:05,680 --> 00:25:09,040 Takumi Sen versus Alpha Fly the Alpha. 511 00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:12,120 This would say the Alpha fly is actually better than Takumi Sen 512 00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:15,240 at those shorter distances. Buy or sell? 513 00:25:15,800 --> 00:25:17,480 I'm a sell. Great, man. 514 00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:18,440 What about you? I'm just. 515 00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:25,160 Kidding, moving on now. It's a funny it's a it's a sell. 516 00:25:25,160 --> 00:25:29,040 With the caveat there because I don't think that the regular 517 00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:33,960 super shoes are better than the 5K10K options for the 5K10K 518 00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:37,160 distance. I think they are as good as the 519 00:25:37,160 --> 00:25:41,080 five K 10K racers at those distances and it's going to 520 00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:43,920 really depend on the person on what they want out of the shoe. 521 00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:48,120 Like I could totally see someone taking a Takumi san over a Vapor 522 00:25:48,120 --> 00:25:52,040 flyer off a family in a Rode 5K or 10K and I might do it myself, 523 00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:54,440 especially if there's a lot of cornering or something on that 524 00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:57,880 course. But if it's a well groomed 525 00:25:57,880 --> 00:26:01,680 course, I I don't think that there's any performance loss 526 00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:05,520 wearing a Vapor Fly instead of let's say a Streak flyer Takumi 527 00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:08,280 san. You obviously see a lot of the 528 00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:12,960 pros wearing the regular super shoes in 5K10K situations. 529 00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:17,160 Didn't Chrissy gear just run like a mile in the CLX one? 530 00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,680 Yeah, she did. I got to double check that like 531 00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:22,600 so it's like obviously. I'm not surprised, honestly. 532 00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:25,680 That shoe like even though it's heavier like that thing has some 533 00:26:25,720 --> 00:26:28,160 bounce and it will surprise. You're like, what the Where'd 534 00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:29,440 this come from? What is this? 535 00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:31,640 Yeah. So like, you can totally race in 536 00:26:31,640 --> 00:26:33,800 the as long as the outsole. Is attacked, yes. 537 00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,520 For me, but I don't. I don't think they're better 538 00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:39,800 than the other shoes. They just are as good. 539 00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:43,720 So I think it really just depends on personal taste at 540 00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:45,480 that point and what you want out of the shoe. 541 00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:48,960 And I've got, I've obviously run 5K and 10K in the regular super 542 00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:52,080 shoe over the Tsukumi san. I have done that a few times, 543 00:26:53,200 --> 00:26:55,640 but that's usually well groomed courses that I'm going in 544 00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:58,320 straightaways on with minimal turns. 545 00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:00,960 If I really had to do a lot of turns, or even if it was a 546 00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:03,600 little bit of a cross style race, if there was some dirt or 547 00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:07,480 runnable grass or something and it wasn't a spike type of race 548 00:27:07,480 --> 00:27:09,400 like I might go takumi over those other ones. 549 00:27:09,640 --> 00:27:12,560 I I agree with David. I think it depends. 550 00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:16,520 For me personally it is going to be a buy actually because I do 551 00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:19,480 like I have been doing a lot better just because I think what 552 00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:23,200 we're training in right now with a lot more cushion, a shoe. 553 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:26,160 Like I used to use the endorphin elite for all my 5 KS because I 554 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:28,240 would be like oh you know what but I'm going to try this other 555 00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:30,520 shoe to see a fast high school and like I'm going to use the 556 00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:33,240 the fat the fast thing I can I can I feel most comfortable with 557 00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:36,400 which at that time was the indoor for the lead it's been 558 00:27:36,400 --> 00:27:38,000 replaced by something but that's OK. 559 00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:42,600 So I think yeah, I would. I think some of those shoes 560 00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:46,240 personally for me, I would probably go for the bigger thing 561 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:50,080 just because my mechanics aren't as comfortable with those the 562 00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:55,120 quote UN quote specific 5K10K shoes as much any more. 563 00:27:55,120 --> 00:27:57,400 And to add on that I haven't said anything about this, but I 564 00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:02,320 not too long ago ran a 1745 Stroller 5K in the Cielo X1 565 00:28:02,800 --> 00:28:05,520 around the Rose Bowl, which is a fairly, fairly hilly chorus and 566 00:28:05,520 --> 00:28:08,640 I did not expect that and I was like oh oh. 567 00:28:09,080 --> 00:28:11,400 Is that the one that replaced the elite? 568 00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:16,600 No, this, this one. Yes, you said something to 569 00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:20,000 replace the endorphin elite. Oh no, it's the meta Speed edge, 570 00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:21,320 Paris. Oh, OK. 571 00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:25,840 Yeah, yeah, that's solid. That's my go to like 5K10K. 572 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:28,560 Maybe if I did a half, I'd grab that first. 573 00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:31,360 Yeah, cool. Yeah. 574 00:28:31,360 --> 00:28:38,880 I I'm also a cell on this one with David pretty much the exact 575 00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:40,800 rationale. So I don't need to rehash it. 576 00:28:41,040 --> 00:28:44,040 I just think that it really depends on what you respond to 577 00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:48,960 and what you're ready to run in. And I think that some people 578 00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:52,120 respond just as well to Takumi Send, which we're talking about 579 00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:56,240 like it's not this high stacked, super high cushioned, stiffened 580 00:28:56,320 --> 00:29:01,800 plate plated thing like it is. But there are some 5K10K racing 581 00:29:01,800 --> 00:29:04,680 shoes that aren't the same as like a Takumi send. 582 00:29:04,680 --> 00:29:07,720 They're more traditional. They just have like a, I don't 583 00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:10,600 know, more flat construction and not all the rocker stuff. 584 00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:14,160 I do think like the rocker geometry and the foam technology 585 00:29:14,160 --> 00:29:15,920 and the stiffening agent still matter. 586 00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:18,720 But if they're in a lighter package, I think it just depends 587 00:29:18,720 --> 00:29:21,040 on what you respond to and ultimately you don't know unless 588 00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:24,320 you go get it tested out. So I I say they're not better, 589 00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:26,800 they're potentially better so, so. 590 00:29:27,200 --> 00:29:31,080 I I will say too like just one data point that we've had over a 591 00:29:31,200 --> 00:29:35,320 few different a few years now is looking at the company that Matt 592 00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:39,800 is wearing right now, Adidas, having that road record type 593 00:29:39,800 --> 00:29:42,320 event that they've been doing over the last few years. 594 00:29:42,480 --> 00:29:43,880 Literally. And that was a. 595 00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:46,480 It just happened, yeah. It didn't go quite as fast as 596 00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:48,280 previous years, but they were still cooking. 597 00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:52,400 I mean, you'll cook a. 354 Mile Rd. 598 00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:53,800 Mile, right? Yeah. 599 00:29:53,960 --> 00:30:00,360 And a 13 flat, 5K in the Takumi Sen and a 27 flat, they just 600 00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:04,120 barely missed going under 27. But a couple years ago, like 601 00:30:04,320 --> 00:30:07,920 there was like four or five guys under 27 and it's Akumi. 602 00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:10,880 I mean like that regardless of what shoe is on your feet, 603 00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:12,800 you're breaking 27 minutes on the road. 604 00:30:12,800 --> 00:30:16,000 That is insanely fast, so to say. 605 00:30:16,000 --> 00:30:18,480 Like would they have run faster than Audios Pro 3? 606 00:30:18,480 --> 00:30:22,240 I don't know if they would have, you know, like would they go, 607 00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:25,360 OK, so they're going to go around 26402630 on the road 608 00:30:25,360 --> 00:30:27,600 like. That difference, that running 609 00:30:27,680 --> 00:30:31,480 economy difference between like if the running economy 610 00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:35,920 difference between a hyper speed from ASICS and you know, an 611 00:30:35,920 --> 00:30:41,000 alpha fly is somewhere between one and 5% for people. 612 00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:43,920 Like the difference between a takumi send and the alpha fly is 613 00:30:43,920 --> 00:30:46,200 going to be like nothing, you know. 614 00:30:46,480 --> 00:30:51,560 So it's it's you're talking .2%. I'm making that number up, but 615 00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:53,480 it's very, very small. All right. 616 00:30:53,480 --> 00:30:55,520 I'm going to move us to our next, our next prompt. 617 00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:58,360 So the next one is still, we're still in shoe realm, still in 618 00:30:58,360 --> 00:31:02,160 shoe world and it's trainers without out rubber outsoles. 619 00:31:02,160 --> 00:31:05,240 So this would be rubberized Eva outsoles buy or sell. 620 00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:10,680 I mean, for me personally, Hard sell, hard sell. 621 00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:14,440 I like a train of the last more than 10 miles. 622 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:17,160 So this. Is a hard sell for me 623 00:31:17,240 --> 00:31:23,480 personally. Did did the like Carbonex three 624 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:25,560 and two? Did those last for you at all? 625 00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:27,760 No, I I shred. It through those, OK. 626 00:31:28,320 --> 00:31:35,320 I I will say what about the non? Cumulus because the new cumulus 627 00:31:35,320 --> 00:31:38,440 ditched their rubber. The real reason I have been 628 00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:40,240 running it because I didn't find it very comfortable. 629 00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:43,200 So I don't know. I got my my minimum testing 630 00:31:43,200 --> 00:31:45,200 miles and I'm like I'm going to go running something else. 631 00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:48,080 Like I if it just that the toe spring is too much. 632 00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:50,120 I'm sure other people love it. The toe spring is too much for 633 00:31:50,120 --> 00:31:52,120 me. So I don't know. 634 00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:54,120 David, what about? You. 635 00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:56,400 Yeah, I don't have those ones on me anymore. 636 00:31:56,400 --> 00:32:01,400 Like the Carbon X2 or yeah, the Under Armour Velocity Elite. 637 00:32:02,480 --> 00:32:03,920 I mind it. I'm, I'm a bi. 638 00:32:03,920 --> 00:32:06,800 I think for the right person it's it's great. 639 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:11,200 I think it softens that landing just a tad and like the traction 640 00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:13,640 on them aren't horrible. Like if you're running on well 641 00:32:13,640 --> 00:32:16,040 groomed Rd. surfaces, it's usually pretty good. 642 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:20,400 And yeah, I I don't know, I like the Mach 4 and Mach 5. 643 00:32:20,400 --> 00:32:23,960 I didn't have any issues there. My Carbon X2 lasted me 200 644 00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:25,600 miles. You know, that's what I can ask 645 00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:27,280 of it and it probably would have gone longer. 646 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:30,600 I just didn't really, I don't know, we had other shoes we had 647 00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:35,040 to run in. So yeah, I I'm not opposed to 648 00:32:35,040 --> 00:32:38,360 it, but I also don't tear up my shoes in five miles like Matt 649 00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:40,880 does. So I think it depends. 650 00:32:41,400 --> 00:32:43,480 For the listeners that has actually happened. 651 00:32:43,480 --> 00:32:45,720 Before, I think. I think he'll like. 652 00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:49,320 Literally shred an outsole off. Like, Not even like with rubber 653 00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:51,520 like he'll like. However, he scuffs his foot 654 00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:54,920 sometimes he'll rip off that posterior lateral piece, Yeah. 655 00:32:55,320 --> 00:32:58,600 My favorite thing when that happens, yeah, it'd be like like 656 00:32:58,600 --> 00:32:59,880 10 Mile. My favorite is when that 657 00:32:59,880 --> 00:33:01,520 happens. And then whoever the Rep is for 658 00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:04,080 the company is like, hey, can you send me like the number of 659 00:33:04,080 --> 00:33:05,200 that? Can we have we had a 660 00:33:05,200 --> 00:33:06,760 conversation? Like, yeah, it's just me. 661 00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:11,560 Sorry. I you know, I I may have been a 662 00:33:11,560 --> 00:33:15,920 buy on this like a year ago, but there is there's one experience 663 00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:17,600 that's pushing me to sell on this. 664 00:33:18,120 --> 00:33:22,640 Overall, I don't like the idea of like decreasing durability in 665 00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:24,440 something that we pay a lot of money for. 666 00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:27,920 To be fair, rubberized Eva versus just a straight up foam 667 00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:29,960 correct out. So because like some of them 668 00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:32,840 will thicken it a tiny bit like the Carbon X2 to do that. 669 00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:37,560 Yes, I I think the the thing that changed my mind was I I 670 00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:41,320 really loved the soft, that kind of soft landing that you're 671 00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:43,120 talking about, David, and how quiet it is. 672 00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:46,920 Like the Mach 5 was one of my favorites, not favorite trainers 673 00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:49,600 that year, but I did love that experience of just like how 674 00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:53,160 quiet and soft it was running. But they added rubber to the 675 00:33:53,160 --> 00:33:57,160 Mach 6 and I like it more. And so I think that like kind of 676 00:33:57,160 --> 00:34:00,960 changed my like OK, so maybe that didn't really enhance the 677 00:34:01,080 --> 00:34:04,000 although it's a it's a new super critical Eva phone that they put 678 00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:05,320 in there. So there's AI mean it's like a 679 00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:08,280 very different shoe. So it's hard to like directly 680 00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:11,800 compare those two. But I I I think across the 681 00:34:11,800 --> 00:34:13,800 board. I really like the idea of having 682 00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:17,679 a shoe that's going to last a long time that that rubber won't 683 00:34:17,679 --> 00:34:20,199 be the the OR the outsole won't be the reason why? 684 00:34:20,199 --> 00:34:24,040 Because right now the reason why we should typically sorry 685 00:34:24,040 --> 00:34:26,560 besides you, Matt, we get to the end of the life of a shoe is 686 00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:28,760 because we break down the midsole enough, which is what 687 00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:30,880 the shoe's supposed to do. So if a shoe isn't going to do 688 00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:36,639 that, I'm like that's kind of a bummer, but all right. 689 00:34:36,639 --> 00:34:38,480 I. I take off the midsole. 690 00:34:39,159 --> 00:34:40,199 Yeah, he just. Get rid of. 691 00:34:40,199 --> 00:34:41,159 Get into it. Enough, yeah. 692 00:34:41,679 --> 00:34:45,760 Yeah, he just runs in, you know, It's just the insole. 693 00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:47,800 Yeah, by default. All right. 694 00:34:47,840 --> 00:34:50,679 We are going to step out of running shoe world and we're 695 00:34:50,679 --> 00:34:53,679 going to go into other categories like training and 696 00:34:53,679 --> 00:34:55,239 professional running and things like that. 697 00:34:55,239 --> 00:35:00,880 So this next one is a training type question and it's buy or 698 00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:05,800 sell, the concept of run slow to run fast. 699 00:35:06,720 --> 00:35:10,400 So before you answer buy or sell is someone willing to explain? 700 00:35:11,240 --> 00:35:14,040 I feel like this is everywhere right now in terms of on social 701 00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:16,080 media. It's one of the most common 702 00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:18,680 things that you'll probably hear is run slow to run fast. 703 00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:23,320 Another way you may have heard it is zone 2 running but run 704 00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:25,960 slow to run fast. Somebody else want to explain? 705 00:35:26,440 --> 00:35:30,160 I would differentiate the two. I I would agree, but they're, I 706 00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:32,680 would say that they're pretty like when it comes to what you 707 00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:36,240 hear and see on social media, they are pretty tied together 708 00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:39,840 for a lot of people. So is the question going to be 709 00:35:39,840 --> 00:35:42,600 run slow to run fast or is it going to be zone 2 to run fast? 710 00:35:42,720 --> 00:35:45,000 Let's keep it run slow to run fast, OK? 711 00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:49,640 Because that changes my answer. All right, what's your answer? 712 00:35:50,040 --> 00:35:52,760 I mean, I'm actually a bi on the run slow to run fast, but to 713 00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:56,480 talk about the reasons why, it's on the recovery side of things, 714 00:35:56,880 --> 00:35:58,920 when you look at what most people are running in the 715 00:35:58,920 --> 00:36:02,520 marathon, I think the average person probably isn't breaking 3 716 00:36:02,600 --> 00:36:04,440 hours, right? What's What's the average 717 00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:07,520 marathon time like? Yeah, what is? 718 00:36:07,640 --> 00:36:10,280 We We can get that Nate's on it. I'm going to guess it's 719 00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:15,840 somewhere around high threes, low fours. 4/4 This is this is 720 00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:20,760 what Doctor Google says 4/14/29 for men and four 4209 for women. 721 00:36:21,200 --> 00:36:22,760 OK. And what mile pace is that? 722 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:27,240 So that'll be like a nine 915, like a little over 9 for men and 723 00:36:27,240 --> 00:36:30,040 then little bit under 10 for women. 724 00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:33,800 So I I think This is why this is a hard buy for me because how 725 00:36:33,800 --> 00:36:37,040 many people run at that pace on a daily basis when that's their 726 00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:40,160 race pace, right? Like that's that's the issue 727 00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:41,800 here. I think the larger thing that 728 00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:44,320 we're talking at hand is people are running at way too close of 729 00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:46,400 a percentage of what they're actually racing at. 730 00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:51,000 And I think if you can take the time to slow down on your easy 731 00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:54,480 days and really focus on that recovery piece and you get some 732 00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:57,800 good sleep and you come back, and then you do run fast at your 733 00:36:57,800 --> 00:37:01,480 workouts, you run slow so that you can run faster on the days 734 00:37:01,480 --> 00:37:03,760 that you're running fast. But if you don't ever run fast, 735 00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:06,200 running slower isn't necessarily going to make you faster. 736 00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:09,280 So at some point or another, you are going to have to test your 737 00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:11,200 gears out and you're going to have to do some workouts. 738 00:37:11,200 --> 00:37:14,880 But you can build off of your workouts better if you run 739 00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:17,600 slower on those easy days and really take care of yourself. 740 00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:20,360 Because you look at some of these people, it's like you got 741 00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:26,640 guys that are racing at 4:30 per mile for 26 miles or 44435 to 742 00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:32,040 4:40 if they're running in the load twos and they are running 743 00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:35,920 their easy days at like what, 7-8 minute pace a lot of times, 744 00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:39,920 even 9 sometimes like they are really slowing down some of 745 00:37:39,920 --> 00:37:42,320 these people. But then on the workout days, 746 00:37:42,320 --> 00:37:44,400 they're running like absolute savages. 747 00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:47,000 They're running faster than I can dream of on their workout 748 00:37:47,000 --> 00:37:49,960 days. And it's like there's a time to 749 00:37:49,960 --> 00:37:51,520 go slow and there's a time to go fast. 750 00:37:51,520 --> 00:37:54,840 And I think if you want longevity in the sport and you 751 00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:57,520 want to really build off of what you're doing, you can't dig 752 00:37:57,520 --> 00:38:01,400 yourself into the ground. And I'm like I when I say, run 753 00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:03,680 slow to run fast, that doesn't mean always run slow, that there 754 00:38:03,680 --> 00:38:05,920 is a time to run fast. I want to make that very clear, 755 00:38:07,720 --> 00:38:08,920 Yeah. I totally agree. 756 00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:11,720 I'm a I'm a I'm a bi on this as well. 757 00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:15,560 And I think the piece that gets missed when you're maybe again 758 00:38:15,560 --> 00:38:18,840 just kind of a call back to what you might see fed to you on 759 00:38:18,840 --> 00:38:22,120 social media is you miss that. Part of the reasons why that you 760 00:38:22,120 --> 00:38:25,840 run slow and a huge part is you're not going to get faster 761 00:38:25,960 --> 00:38:28,120 if you only run slow the whole time. 762 00:38:28,120 --> 00:38:29,800 Your legs do need to learn how to do that. 763 00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:31,520 You have to be able to generate that sort of power. 764 00:38:31,520 --> 00:38:34,560 There's a lot that goes into being able to run faster when 765 00:38:34,560 --> 00:38:36,920 you want to run fast. But if you're running your 766 00:38:36,920 --> 00:38:40,400 workouts hard and then you're kind of redlining all of your 767 00:38:40,400 --> 00:38:43,280 other easy runs, you're just not going to be able to recover. 768 00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:47,120 And I think part of running slow to run fast is a way to allow 769 00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:50,920 yourself to run in a sustainable manner, manner where you're not 770 00:38:50,920 --> 00:38:53,080 going to get injured. So you can just have consistency 771 00:38:53,080 --> 00:38:55,160 over years. And if you can have consistency 772 00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:56,680 over years, that's how you're really going to. 773 00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:59,280 The way you get faster at running is by running a lot, and 774 00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:02,800 you're only going to be able to run a lot if you are consistent 775 00:39:03,040 --> 00:39:06,320 coming from someone who's just come off of like months of not 776 00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:08,680 being able to run because of a a ligament tear. 777 00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:12,200 But I still holds true for me too, like I'm not reaching my 778 00:39:12,200 --> 00:39:14,800 potential because I haven't been able to be consistent in the 779 00:39:14,800 --> 00:39:17,400 running. And so I think that running slow 780 00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:20,000 allows you to really hit your workouts hard. 781 00:39:20,240 --> 00:39:22,080 It also allows your body to recover. 782 00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:26,000 I think the other part is that physiologically when you hit 783 00:39:26,000 --> 00:39:29,440 different intensities, it's called like the said principle 784 00:39:29,440 --> 00:39:32,240 is pretty ubiquitous for exercise prescription. 785 00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:35,760 And then the said principle is specific adaptation to impose 786 00:39:35,760 --> 00:39:38,320 demands. And so if you want your body to 787 00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:40,800 adapt in a certain way, you have to put the right stimulus on it. 788 00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:45,880 With the running slower puts you in a different intensity for 789 00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:48,680 your cardiovascular system, which stimulates different 790 00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:51,680 changes in your musculoskeletal and cardiovascular system like 791 00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:54,840 increased capillary density and increased mitochondrial density. 792 00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:58,840 All these things that work for aerobic exercise and you need 793 00:39:58,840 --> 00:40:01,600 them for those endurance events. So I think it's a combination of 794 00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:04,120 that longevity piece like you were talking about, plus the 795 00:40:04,160 --> 00:40:07,560 actual physiological adaptations that you want, you have to be. 796 00:40:08,000 --> 00:40:10,480 Getting some time in that easier efforts. 797 00:40:10,720 --> 00:40:14,680 I would like to also frame it in a way like when you think about 798 00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:16,480 it from the running slow standpoint. 799 00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:19,600 If you go and run 8 miles and you go and run quote UN quote 800 00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:22,480 slow slower than what maybe if you're pushing your easy days 801 00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:26,400 you're running for longer like you're you are literally on your 802 00:40:26,400 --> 00:40:29,520 feet for longer periods of time and you will create aerobic 803 00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:35,320 adaptations in that self. Like, I don't see your body. 804 00:40:36,080 --> 00:40:38,440 I don't know. It's not going to make the, it's 805 00:40:38,520 --> 00:40:40,600 not going to make or break it. Like if you go slower, like it's 806 00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:42,480 only going to help you on those easy days. 807 00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:44,680 Yeah. And I think actually it's a 808 00:40:44,680 --> 00:40:46,600 really good point because if you're training based off of 809 00:40:46,600 --> 00:40:49,000 miles or if you're training based off of time, that totally 810 00:40:49,000 --> 00:40:51,600 changes things. Because if you decide that 811 00:40:51,600 --> 00:40:53,680 you've just been running hard every run and you're like, I'm 812 00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:56,760 going to run slow now, your mileage will dip. 813 00:40:57,280 --> 00:41:00,520 Like if you want to do it smart. Because otherwise, like you 814 00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:04,000 said, if I go from running every run at AI used to do this, every 815 00:41:04,000 --> 00:41:08,680 run that I ran was like a 7 to 715 minute per mile And then I 816 00:41:08,680 --> 00:41:09,240 had to. Like. 817 00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:13,600 I know I was. This was there's a reason why my 818 00:41:13,600 --> 00:41:17,040 life from 2017 to 20, like 18, was terrible. 819 00:41:18,040 --> 00:41:21,200 But my running life, my actual life was just fine. 820 00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:23,560 But. I think. 821 00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:25,880 Just to make that, just to make that clear. 822 00:41:26,360 --> 00:41:31,240 But the yeah, so. But then when I brought myself 823 00:41:31,240 --> 00:41:33,960 to a slower pace, I wanted to keep running the same miles per 824 00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:37,960 week, but my hours running went so high and so I actually 825 00:41:37,960 --> 00:41:41,200 switched to a time based like, oh, I'm going out for 40 826 00:41:41,200 --> 00:41:43,840 minutes. That was a very nice change for 827 00:41:43,840 --> 00:41:46,280 me. And it wasn't hard for me to get 828 00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:50,120 over like my weekly mileage dropping because really our body 829 00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:52,640 doesn't know miles anyway. It knows time and intensity. 830 00:41:52,840 --> 00:41:55,240 And so if your body is getting the stimulus for a certain 831 00:41:55,240 --> 00:41:58,720 amount of time, you're going to adapt to that stimulus. 832 00:41:58,720 --> 00:42:00,440 So anyway, Matt, what do you got? 833 00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:03,400 Do you buy or sell this? I'm going to be the different 834 00:42:03,400 --> 00:42:06,080 person I'm going to say sell because I think there's a better 835 00:42:06,080 --> 00:42:08,880 way we can say this. So I do agree with it, but I 836 00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:12,480 would I think the better way we could say this is learn to run a 837 00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:17,280 variety of paces and know when to run each pace 'cause I. 838 00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:18,560 Feel like you just have to run fast? 839 00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:20,320 No, you're saying run slow to run. 840 00:42:20,360 --> 00:42:22,000 Fast. That's not because if you run 841 00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:23,760 slow and fast just creates a change. 842 00:42:23,840 --> 00:42:25,400 Of paces create a variety of paces. 843 00:42:25,440 --> 00:42:27,360 Yes, it's a dichotomy. Run slow to run fast. 844 00:42:27,400 --> 00:42:30,360 That's the definition of what? A But there are other paces 845 00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:34,080 besides just slow and fast learning to go hey like doing 846 00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:37,840 some like really fast strides at the end of a run is also good. 847 00:42:37,960 --> 00:42:40,600 Learning to run immediate moderate pace is also good. 848 00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:42,640 Like I think. I think we need to get out of 849 00:42:42,640 --> 00:42:45,040 that dichotomy. And I because I think people 850 00:42:45,040 --> 00:42:47,440 will get stuck on, oh, I'm only running fast, I'm only running 851 00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:49,520 slow instead of going, there's a variety of paces, like you're 852 00:42:49,520 --> 00:42:52,000 not going to run your 5K pace for a marathon and vice versa. 853 00:42:52,000 --> 00:42:54,840 It's kind of learning, especially through effort to go, 854 00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:57,560 what does this feel like? And I think a lot of times it's 855 00:42:57,560 --> 00:43:00,000 a very negative connotation with running slow. 856 00:43:00,240 --> 00:43:01,640 It could be like, hey, you know what? 857 00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:04,760 You need to run at a kind of a certain effort level for today 858 00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:06,880 to be able to recover rather than saying, oh, you're running 859 00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:09,120 slow because there's negative connotation with that, Which I 860 00:43:09,120 --> 00:43:11,720 know sounds, maybe that doesn't sound like it sounds dumb. 861 00:43:11,720 --> 00:43:14,640 But I think it's important for how you look at yourself, 862 00:43:14,640 --> 00:43:16,440 especially when you start getting into like high 863 00:43:16,440 --> 00:43:18,440 schoolers, like go tell a high schooler to go, hey, run slow. 864 00:43:18,440 --> 00:43:20,320 And like, I don't want to post that on Strava. 865 00:43:20,440 --> 00:43:23,240 Whereas if you say hey, like I want you to keep this in a very 866 00:43:23,240 --> 00:43:26,840 controlled low level effort so we can recover for tomorrow 867 00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:29,840 because tomorrow's going to be a moderate run or tomorrow's going 868 00:43:29,840 --> 00:43:34,280 to be a hard run I think. There's a time they don't slow 869 00:43:34,280 --> 00:43:38,320 down if you say that, though. Oh yeah, I was super controlled 870 00:43:38,320 --> 00:43:42,520 at my 6:20 and they race at like a 605 and I'm like, yeah, bro, 871 00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:44,600 no, that was not. That was not. 872 00:43:45,280 --> 00:43:48,560 But I teach people. I teach people to run at a like 873 00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:52,080 learn to have different gears rather than just fast and slow. 874 00:43:52,080 --> 00:43:54,400 Yeah, I think the differentiation when I say like 875 00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:56,480 run slow to run fast later that doesn't. 876 00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:59,680 Necessarily. Apply 5K pace like there is a 877 00:43:59,680 --> 00:44:02,360 day where you're going to have either a 5K type workout, maybe 878 00:44:02,360 --> 00:44:04,960 you're on the track doing 4 hundreds, 8 hundreds K's, 879 00:44:04,960 --> 00:44:07,280 whatever. And then that day might also be 880 00:44:07,280 --> 00:44:09,360 a long tempo run, but it's a different stimulus. 881 00:44:09,520 --> 00:44:11,440 Right. I I think I just get, I get 882 00:44:11,440 --> 00:44:13,560 concerned because people take things to the stream of social 883 00:44:13,560 --> 00:44:16,840 media like oh I'm just going to only run slow and then all of a 884 00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:19,800 sudden like one way to go run a 5K and then they like blow up 885 00:44:19,800 --> 00:44:22,840 the 1st 100 or they get hurt, which I've actually seen happen 886 00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:25,360 where people like, oh I thought I need to run slow and somebody 887 00:44:25,360 --> 00:44:29,000 like absolutely sprints the 5K and then like pulls A hamstring 888 00:44:29,000 --> 00:44:30,960 at your local like your local front run. 889 00:44:30,960 --> 00:44:35,480 You're like what are you doing? Like, so learning to pace and do 890 00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:38,200 the right thing at the right time is is, I think, a better 891 00:44:38,200 --> 00:44:39,720 thing. And I'll just trademark that. 892 00:44:40,000 --> 00:44:41,400 Start putting that out on social media. 893 00:44:41,400 --> 00:44:42,440 Get famous. I'm just kidding. 894 00:44:42,440 --> 00:44:44,560 I don't want theme. I want to be left alone. 895 00:44:44,720 --> 00:44:46,080 Now that was a good differentiation. 896 00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:48,280 No, it's good. And I think we all agree. 897 00:44:49,120 --> 00:44:51,440 Yeah, But it's important, especially when you come to 898 00:44:51,440 --> 00:44:53,200 actually, like, communicating about this stuff. 899 00:44:54,040 --> 00:44:56,440 All right, we have a couple more here. 900 00:44:57,960 --> 00:45:04,160 Buy or sell the post race beer. Sell card, sell. 901 00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:08,520 No, no offence, but like when I when I'm getting to the end of a 902 00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:11,440 race and I like I I will run all out. 903 00:45:11,920 --> 00:45:15,160 A beer is not what I want. Like I want to like have 904 00:45:15,160 --> 00:45:17,920 something easy on the stomach, hydrate appropriately, not have 905 00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:20,520 alcohol in my system. That might be me though because 906 00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:24,360 when I I am in those situations I am extremely sensitive things 907 00:45:24,360 --> 00:45:25,920 that get put in my system and I will. 908 00:45:26,520 --> 00:45:29,000 From personal experience, I don't know how professional this 909 00:45:29,000 --> 00:45:33,360 is, having done a few beer miles in college, if you've exercised 910 00:45:33,360 --> 00:45:38,000 intensely, for me personally, alcohol is very intense and it 911 00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:40,720 hits hits me very hard. So I I don't like that so I'm a 912 00:45:40,720 --> 00:45:43,160 hard sell. A beer is the last thing I'm 913 00:45:43,160 --> 00:45:44,520 thinking about after I almost died. 914 00:45:44,720 --> 00:45:53,560 I mean, to be fair, anyone who's racing, working very hard and 915 00:45:53,560 --> 00:45:56,480 when they finish, I don't think anybody is like, yeah, give me a 916 00:45:56,480 --> 00:45:59,040 beer the second they finished the race. 917 00:45:59,040 --> 00:46:01,400 I just a lot of people. There's a lot of people like 918 00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:03,760 just. Yeah, had it right there at the 919 00:46:03,760 --> 00:46:05,400 finish. Line right right there and then 920 00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:10,800 that's that is admirable to go run 220 something that's like 921 00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:13,560 alright let's do it. That's the post race at like 922 00:46:13,560 --> 00:46:15,240 workout. It's like, can I shotgun this 923 00:46:15,240 --> 00:46:19,360 beer after this? But I think give yourself 1015 924 00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:21,320 minutes. Slowly make your way over when 925 00:46:21,320 --> 00:46:24,520 your body has settled and I'm a bi. 926 00:46:24,600 --> 00:46:27,520 I don't know, I like it. Most races give it to you for 927 00:46:27,520 --> 00:46:29,720 free, you know they give you at least one. 928 00:46:30,680 --> 00:46:32,680 Helps numb the pain a little bit too. 929 00:46:32,680 --> 00:46:35,960 I mean, even though it does hit you a little bit more like those 930 00:46:36,680 --> 00:46:40,200 cramps in your calves and your quads and stepping off of curbs 931 00:46:40,200 --> 00:46:44,080 and all the misery that you feel after raises, it kind of masks 932 00:46:44,080 --> 00:46:45,840 it a little bit so. It's like you're talking about. 933 00:46:45,840 --> 00:46:49,080 The analogy Hammer just have a little yeah, yeah, you just have 934 00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:50,480 a little bit. Get some carbs back in. 935 00:46:50,480 --> 00:46:54,320 You like that's not a bad thing. Nathan. 936 00:46:54,320 --> 00:46:55,760 Tiebreaker. It's funny, I'm. 937 00:46:57,040 --> 00:46:59,760 And for the culture? I'm going to say I'm a bi, but 938 00:46:59,800 --> 00:47:02,800 but here's my personal experiences when it comes to it 939 00:47:02,800 --> 00:47:06,000 is like I finished the race in my mind. 940 00:47:06,000 --> 00:47:10,880 I'm like, oh, the idea of a beer with friends, like commemorating 941 00:47:10,880 --> 00:47:13,800 this day sounds really fun. Like at the at the 10th, you 942 00:47:13,800 --> 00:47:16,440 know, after you finish. So my mind is there. 943 00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:21,800 My body is like, I don't want like anything right now. 944 00:47:21,800 --> 00:47:24,480 So like usually I don't even want, I don't know, depends on 945 00:47:24,480 --> 00:47:25,720 how hot it is that day or whatever. 946 00:47:25,720 --> 00:47:27,120 But usually I don't really want anything. 947 00:47:27,800 --> 00:47:31,520 And then and I taste it in my mouth, I'm like, this is great. 948 00:47:31,520 --> 00:47:34,240 So my tongue's happy. And then I get like two or three 949 00:47:34,240 --> 00:47:36,240 sips in and I'm like, no, I'm done. 950 00:47:36,520 --> 00:47:41,080 So I go through this like like it's just this battle of like 951 00:47:41,080 --> 00:47:45,240 yes, no, yes, no, yes. But our local like five mile run 952 00:47:45,240 --> 00:47:46,960 that I want you all to come out here and do it. 953 00:47:46,960 --> 00:47:48,240 It's in March. The Bach run. 954 00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:52,120 It's a super fun event at our it's called the Bach run like 955 00:47:52,600 --> 00:47:55,040 point Bach is the like Bach beer kind of thing so. 956 00:47:55,040 --> 00:47:56,960 We should probably get Bach to run that. 957 00:47:57,120 --> 00:47:59,240 Bach needs to run the Bach, Yeah, yes. 958 00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:03,560 Intense, intense super shoe we could file. 3 pairs of apple. 959 00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:06,680 Flies so we can run fast. That would be super fun, but 960 00:48:07,400 --> 00:48:10,800 basically they have a huge beer tenants at our local brewery and 961 00:48:14,040 --> 00:48:17,840 I don't know what we do is they they give you, you get 3 beers, 962 00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:20,680 you get a lot of beer after this race and I just bring. 963 00:48:20,680 --> 00:48:22,920 That's a lot. After I bring it now, I bring it 964 00:48:22,920 --> 00:48:26,360 now, Gene, and I fill it up with the beers and I bring it home 965 00:48:26,360 --> 00:48:27,840 and put it in the fridge for later. 966 00:48:28,040 --> 00:48:30,960 Now that that's that's the win right there. 967 00:48:32,760 --> 00:48:35,120 I'm never talking about right after the race, not like I'm 968 00:48:35,240 --> 00:48:36,920 going to take this and save it for later. 969 00:48:36,920 --> 00:48:39,040 Yeah, I'm just saying. That also I'm cheating. 970 00:48:39,040 --> 00:48:42,920 Yeah, so I'm. OK to clarify too, like after 971 00:48:42,920 --> 00:48:46,440 like a 5K or 10K, it's like I don't know if I really want it. 972 00:48:46,440 --> 00:48:47,840 I think it's more half marathon up. 973 00:48:47,960 --> 00:48:50,680 Sure, because it's a different type of fatigue that you feel at 974 00:48:50,680 --> 00:48:51,600 the end. Right. 975 00:48:51,760 --> 00:48:53,000 I can. I can see that. 976 00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:56,600 I think For me as as as soon as I finish, the first thing I'm 977 00:48:56,600 --> 00:48:59,360 thinking about is I know this is going to suck later. 978 00:48:59,360 --> 00:49:01,840 So what can I do to optimize any kind of recovery? 979 00:49:01,840 --> 00:49:04,920 And I I know there there is actually some research on this 980 00:49:04,920 --> 00:49:07,880 and the research is a little bit varied on this. 981 00:49:07,880 --> 00:49:11,880 And so I personally alcohol is not really a nutrient. 982 00:49:12,160 --> 00:49:14,800 So if you're gonna get carbs in, I think there are from a 983 00:49:14,800 --> 00:49:18,120 performance standpoint, I think. That's not the point. 984 00:49:18,520 --> 00:49:20,920 Though ways to do, I'm just saying giving my reason, take 985 00:49:20,920 --> 00:49:22,040 her. Heart in the shot, I don't know, 986 00:49:22,040 --> 00:49:25,760 it sounds like. So one of the first like real 987 00:49:25,760 --> 00:49:30,480 five KSI did in high school was called the Crawfish Crawfish 988 00:49:30,480 --> 00:49:33,760 Crawl, which I was actually also working at as like 'cause that 989 00:49:33,760 --> 00:49:35,560 the Fit right Northwest was sponsoring it. 990 00:49:35,560 --> 00:49:40,280 So I went down there to what's Cook Park and we I finished. 991 00:49:40,480 --> 00:49:42,920 I don't think I won. I think it was like second but 992 00:49:42,920 --> 00:49:46,720 it was a good like 17 ish minute 5K and they were giving out 993 00:49:46,720 --> 00:49:51,680 shots of vodka at the end some some like liquor company was 994 00:49:51,680 --> 00:49:54,560 there and I was like that no. Like I was underage, she were 995 00:49:54,560 --> 00:49:58,000 like, even if I was above like 21, I was like, no, no. 996 00:49:58,000 --> 00:50:01,320 No, doing a shot after a race would be hard. 997 00:50:01,440 --> 00:50:04,920 No thanks that I don't even oh. OK. 998 00:50:04,960 --> 00:50:07,640 So I have one more question. But do we just want to end it 999 00:50:07,640 --> 00:50:08,680 there? All right. 1000 00:50:08,680 --> 00:50:10,120 If you got one more, I will do one more. 1001 00:50:10,280 --> 00:50:12,880 OK. Is the lasted one more hard? 1002 00:50:13,440 --> 00:50:14,520 One sip and then we'll. Do. 1003 00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:16,160 Don't. Don't give us a lame one. 1004 00:50:17,320 --> 00:50:20,120 Well, now I'm nervous. Do one that no, you gotta do one 1005 00:50:20,120 --> 00:50:23,120 that causes drama like that we end on just like. 1006 00:50:23,320 --> 00:50:25,800 Like I'm just gonna this is the one that this is the one I. 1007 00:50:25,840 --> 00:50:26,880 Got. Take me and yell at Matt. 1008 00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:30,920 That's all we're asking for. So buy or sell minimalist 1009 00:50:30,920 --> 00:50:33,480 footwear is a dying breed. Sell. 1010 00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:38,000 Sell being that it is a dying breed, or buy being a Wait, 1011 00:50:38,080 --> 00:50:39,720 what? So minimalist footwear is a 1012 00:50:39,720 --> 00:50:41,920 dying breed. If you buy that, you mean it's 1013 00:50:41,920 --> 00:50:44,720 you think it's dying out. If you sell it, it means it's 1014 00:50:44,720 --> 00:50:47,440 not dead. It's not a dying. 1015 00:50:47,440 --> 00:50:50,080 I I I'm a David. Because not think it's a but I 1016 00:50:50,120 --> 00:50:51,800 agreed. Yeah, yeah, I'm a sell too. 1017 00:50:52,280 --> 00:50:55,040 I'm a sell because I think there will always be a place for it. 1018 00:50:55,040 --> 00:50:58,400 Some people like having lower to the ground shoes, more flexible 1019 00:50:58,400 --> 00:51:01,600 designs. I think like even with how 1020 00:51:01,600 --> 00:51:04,040 extreme things have been getting, you're seeing more of a 1021 00:51:04,040 --> 00:51:07,320 push towards like these Vivo Barefoots or like these types of 1022 00:51:07,720 --> 00:51:10,280 shoes that are very low profile. Maybe not for the running 1023 00:51:10,280 --> 00:51:13,520 standpoint per SE, but like walking around I'm seeing way 1024 00:51:13,520 --> 00:51:16,840 more like minimalist footwear again, where I think people kind 1025 00:51:16,840 --> 00:51:19,520 of felt things tipping way too far in One Direction, where 1026 00:51:19,520 --> 00:51:23,400 they're almost craving some of that more minimalist designs. 1027 00:51:24,280 --> 00:51:26,800 So I I don't think it's going away. 1028 00:51:26,800 --> 00:51:28,200 I don't think it's a dying breed. 1029 00:51:28,200 --> 00:51:32,760 I think it's it's here to stay. It might not be as numerous as 1030 00:51:32,920 --> 00:51:36,520 the Max Cushion shoes right now in the abundance that that it 1031 00:51:36,520 --> 00:51:39,000 is, but I don't think it's a dying breed by any means. 1032 00:51:39,280 --> 00:51:40,960 I'm a follow up on that. I totally agree. 1033 00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:43,760 I was really surprised. 0 Shoes has been great. 1034 00:51:43,760 --> 00:51:46,520 I've really enjoyed a lot of their shoes as something I don't 1035 00:51:46,520 --> 00:51:49,640 necessarily run at the in them primarily, although I will run 1036 00:51:49,640 --> 00:51:52,080 to test them. It's a great shoe to walk around 1037 00:51:52,080 --> 00:51:54,360 in. I was really surprised when I 1038 00:51:54,360 --> 00:51:56,360 was in the PDF Portland airport recently. 1039 00:51:56,360 --> 00:51:59,840 I saw probably four or five people wearing 0 shoes and I was 1040 00:51:59,840 --> 00:52:01,960 like, oh, sweet. I was like, yeah, I have several 1041 00:52:01,960 --> 00:52:02,760 patients. I do, yeah. 1042 00:52:02,760 --> 00:52:06,520 I I agree that I don't think it it's not at the height of where 1043 00:52:06,520 --> 00:52:09,520 a minimalist stuff was. It's now a a salt, say, 1044 00:52:09,520 --> 00:52:11,360 appropriate category of footwear. 1045 00:52:11,640 --> 00:52:14,040 I don't think that type of footwear is appropriate for 1046 00:52:14,040 --> 00:52:16,160 everyone. I think a lot of people aren't 1047 00:52:16,160 --> 00:52:19,120 willing to don't have the necessary work and background 1048 00:52:19,120 --> 00:52:20,800 stuff to be able to use that appropriately. 1049 00:52:21,000 --> 00:52:23,560 But I think it's not dying. I think if anything, there's 1050 00:52:23,560 --> 00:52:27,240 more interest because whenever you have an extreme on one side, 1051 00:52:27,240 --> 00:52:30,040 you're going to see a little bit of a little more chatter on the 1052 00:52:30,040 --> 00:52:31,960 other extreme. So I think yes. 1053 00:52:31,960 --> 00:52:33,840 I don't think it's a dying breed, so sell for sure. 1054 00:52:36,240 --> 00:52:40,320 It's a sell for me as well. I think no matter how in vogue, 1055 00:52:40,320 --> 00:52:45,200 maximal or maximalist or shoes are, you're going to have a 1056 00:52:45,200 --> 00:52:48,240 group of people because there there is going to be people with 1057 00:52:48,240 --> 00:52:51,560 a very niche philosophy on this like very staunch, like this is 1058 00:52:51,560 --> 00:52:54,680 the way. And so that that group is always 1059 00:52:54,680 --> 00:52:58,160 going to exist and there's there is a lot of good things out 1060 00:52:58,160 --> 00:52:59,920 there about the benefits of these kinds of shoes. 1061 00:52:59,920 --> 00:53:01,480 So I think they're going to be there. 1062 00:53:01,480 --> 00:53:06,160 I think they should be there. I myself like would love my body 1063 00:53:06,160 --> 00:53:09,320 to be in a resilient enough spot where I was usual utilizing them 1064 00:53:09,320 --> 00:53:12,080 as a tool more often in my running as well. 1065 00:53:12,080 --> 00:53:15,440 You know I think that would be cool a cool way to do easy runs. 1066 00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:18,600 You know my 30 minute easy stuff like in minimal issue that would 1067 00:53:18,600 --> 00:53:22,840 be awesome I think just to get a very very different stimulus on 1068 00:53:22,840 --> 00:53:25,680 the body. So I don't know. 1069 00:53:25,680 --> 00:53:28,200 I I agree with you all. I think it's it's here to stay 1070 00:53:28,200 --> 00:53:31,400 and it should and I hope it does and I hope it doesn't die out 1071 00:53:31,400 --> 00:53:35,320 that these companies who do a good job making it that they can 1072 00:53:35,960 --> 00:53:37,720 stick around and keep doing well. 1073 00:53:37,880 --> 00:53:40,040 Actually the probably one of the most telling things would be 1074 00:53:40,160 --> 00:53:42,960 finding someone who just knows their sales that would tell us 1075 00:53:42,960 --> 00:53:45,400 if it's a dying breed or not like how are they doing? 1076 00:53:45,440 --> 00:53:47,560 So I. I would bet money that in most 1077 00:53:47,560 --> 00:53:51,720 traditional running stores that it's probably not a primary 1078 00:53:51,720 --> 00:53:52,680 thing. Sorry. 1079 00:53:53,680 --> 00:53:55,880 But the companies themselves are probably doing I. 1080 00:53:56,040 --> 00:53:58,440 Think that companies are themselves are doing well, but 1081 00:53:58,440 --> 00:54:01,760 just that's not the end thing in running retail right now. 1082 00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:05,680 But I think there's still a place, a good place for them and 1083 00:54:05,680 --> 00:54:07,440 they're definitely selling online for sure. 1084 00:54:08,480 --> 00:54:10,520 Well, great. Thank you everybody for joining 1085 00:54:10,520 --> 00:54:14,200 us for this buy or sell episode. Feel free to drop other things 1086 00:54:14,200 --> 00:54:16,280 below, whether it's your take on some of these. 1087 00:54:16,280 --> 00:54:17,720 Oh, you want something? Say something, David. 1088 00:54:17,720 --> 00:54:19,600 Yeah, yeah. It could be a subjective buy, 1089 00:54:19,600 --> 00:54:22,160 sell, buy, sell on the books making the NBA championship. 1090 00:54:22,800 --> 00:54:24,720 I'm a hard sell on that, even me. 1091 00:54:25,480 --> 00:54:29,560 They are just they're struggle Buss and but don't tell me the 1092 00:54:29,560 --> 00:54:31,520 score, don't look it up and don't tell me. 1093 00:54:31,520 --> 00:54:32,880 I I don't have it up. I've. 1094 00:54:32,880 --> 00:54:35,480 I've since my Warriors got knocked out man. 1095 00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:36,520 I'm just. Checking. 1096 00:54:36,520 --> 00:54:41,600 Out that horrible loss to the Kings like I'm still I'm I'm 1097 00:54:41,640 --> 00:54:42,280 bad. I haven't. 1098 00:54:42,280 --> 00:54:43,840 I've barely watched any games this. 1099 00:54:43,920 --> 00:54:46,760 Playoff, So I'm. Still, I'm still sad boy about 1100 00:54:46,760 --> 00:54:47,760 that, but. I'm sorry. 1101 00:54:49,480 --> 00:54:53,080 Well, if you want to drop below your thoughts on the Bucks or 1102 00:54:53,080 --> 00:54:55,640 the Warriors, David does need your condolences. 1103 00:54:56,000 --> 00:54:59,400 Bach, our media manager, would love you cheering on his Pacers. 1104 00:54:59,400 --> 00:55:02,400 If you're looking for a team to jump on and bandwagon, they 1105 00:55:02,400 --> 00:55:05,360 could be your option, assuming that they had the Bucks lost 1106 00:55:05,360 --> 00:55:07,440 tonight and they'll probably lose the next game. 1107 00:55:08,120 --> 00:55:10,800 But if you want to keep following what we're doing, you 1108 00:55:10,800 --> 00:55:13,480 can go to doctorsrunning.com. You can check us out at Doctors 1109 00:55:13,480 --> 00:55:16,400 of Running on All social Platforms and we look forward to 1110 00:55:16,400 --> 00:55:17,280 talking to you all next time.