1 00:00:09,040 --> 00:00:12,080 Hey everyone, and welcome to the doctors Running podcast where we 2 00:00:12,080 --> 00:00:14,960 a group of doctors physical therapy, talk about the art and 3 00:00:14,960 --> 00:00:17,040 the science of the things we put on our feet today. 4 00:00:17,040 --> 00:00:20,080 I have Dr. Andrea Myers with me, and what we're going to do is 5 00:00:20,080 --> 00:00:23,960 talk about differing opinions. We have to Bach has a name for 6 00:00:23,960 --> 00:00:27,480 this type of episode, but surprise, we have a shoe that we 7 00:00:27,480 --> 00:00:29,000 are having different experiences with. 8 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:32,159 So we have, of course, are going to talk through not our 9 00:00:32,159 --> 00:00:34,400 different disagreements, but our different experiences with this 10 00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:36,960 shoe because we know that different people are 11 00:00:36,960 --> 00:00:40,680 experienced, different shoes, different people, different 12 00:00:40,680 --> 00:00:43,000 people are going to experience shoes differently. 13 00:00:43,160 --> 00:00:46,320 I can't talk. And today we have the Brooks 14 00:00:46,320 --> 00:00:49,920 Hyperion Max 3, which this is going to be an interesting shoe 15 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:52,560 because this has been Andrea, correct me if I'm wrong, This 16 00:00:52,560 --> 00:00:55,240 has been a favorite of yours in this series, Not this current 17 00:00:55,240 --> 00:00:57,720 version, but the series has been a favorite. 18 00:00:57,720 --> 00:00:59,200 And I've had some different opinions on this. 19 00:00:59,200 --> 00:01:02,400 And of course, version 3 is very different than the other ones. 20 00:01:02,400 --> 00:01:06,520 And then, of course, in fair tradition, our opinions are very 21 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:09,120 much switched, right? Yeah. 22 00:01:09,600 --> 00:01:13,800 Yeah, Hyperion Max 1 is definitely my favorite shoe 23 00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:17,440 since the Beacon. I think I'm on my 4th pair of 24 00:01:17,440 --> 00:01:20,760 these and I'm going to stop buying them after that. 25 00:01:20,760 --> 00:01:24,120 But I just. I love Max one, It can do 26 00:01:24,120 --> 00:01:26,560 everything. I'd run a marathon in it if 27 00:01:27,080 --> 00:01:32,680 super shoes didn't exist. Hyperion Max 2, I liked it. 28 00:01:32,720 --> 00:01:37,400 I found it less versatile because they made it taller and 29 00:01:37,400 --> 00:01:40,800 they made it just like Hyperion Max one I could use for track 30 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:43,560 workouts and 2:00. I definitely can't because of 31 00:01:43,560 --> 00:01:46,680 the higher stack. I it's a little firmer, just 32 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:49,440 feels a little more clunky. I found it was better for like 33 00:01:49,440 --> 00:01:53,960 easy runs or like you know, slightly harder than easy runs. 34 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:57,560 The three is like a totally different shoe. 35 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:01,520 It fits different. The ride is different. 36 00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:05,160 It is really a true super trainer now, so some people are 37 00:02:05,160 --> 00:02:10,840 really going to like that, but this is nothing like this, 38 00:02:11,640 --> 00:02:14,240 absolutely nothing. These are two completely 39 00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:18,840 different shoes and really the Hyperion Max one has been 40 00:02:18,880 --> 00:02:23,200 replaced by Hyperion 2, which I that's another shoe I love. 41 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:24,720 I put a ton of miles on that shoe. 42 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:29,160 But this shoe, you and I just wrote our reviews of it. 43 00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:34,320 And like often happens, one of us messaged the other, Wow, we 44 00:02:34,320 --> 00:02:35,960 don't agree on anything on this shoe. 45 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:40,600 Let's record an episode. And I mentioned this with the in 46 00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:42,960 the previous episodes, but we when we're writing stuff, we 47 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:45,760 obviously go and read what the other person says that we try 48 00:02:45,760 --> 00:02:48,440 try not to bias each other. We're just curiosity going 49 00:02:48,440 --> 00:02:51,440 wonder how you know Andrea's experiences. 50 00:02:51,440 --> 00:02:55,680 I wonder how either Bach or Dave or Nate, we're always curious on 51 00:02:55,680 --> 00:02:57,080 how people are doing this and it's just funny. 52 00:02:57,080 --> 00:02:59,280 We're like, oh, we're having I'm literally writing the opposite 53 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:03,320 review on a lot of this stuff. So I have to admit that I had 54 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:07,040 the, again, not surprising based on our history, had the exact 55 00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:11,040 opposite experiences with the Hyperion Max one and two where 56 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:14,800 actually not fully Hyperion Max one was OK. 57 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:17,680 I didn't think it deserved to be called Max because even then 58 00:03:17,680 --> 00:03:20,160 there were super trainers out there that had maximal stack 59 00:03:20,160 --> 00:03:21,840 heights. And I'm like, OK, we need to 60 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:24,440 have a read the definition of what Max is. 61 00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:27,920 It wasn't a bad shoe. I just felt like the heel bevel 62 00:03:28,360 --> 00:03:31,400 was really aggressive and didn't transition very well for me. 63 00:03:31,400 --> 00:03:34,000 And it kind of felt really slappy personal, like it was 64 00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:37,560 very centered heel bevel and very sharp. 65 00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:41,760 And just if I could get ahead of it, it felt decent for workouts, 66 00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:45,640 but I just didn't as soon as I got the review and I stopped and 67 00:03:45,640 --> 00:03:48,800 I'm like, OK, I'm going to move on the hyper Max 2. 68 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:51,640 I think the stack height certainly increased. 69 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:54,800 And it was like, OK, now the name makes sense, but a lot of 70 00:03:54,800 --> 00:03:58,080 people called it a super trainer where the foam really wasn't 71 00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:01,440 bouncy. That shoe felt so stiff. 72 00:04:01,720 --> 00:04:03,600 Whereas again, another shoe, I'm like, I'm going to get the 73 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:05,840 minimum miles out of this and hopefully I don't piss off any 74 00:04:05,840 --> 00:04:09,520 one of my metatarsals or my plantar fascia and just survive 75 00:04:09,520 --> 00:04:11,080 and get this through, get through this. 76 00:04:11,440 --> 00:04:13,880 And yeah, like I I could understand where things were 77 00:04:13,880 --> 00:04:16,560 going, but it's like it just wasn't there and I didn't think 78 00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:20,519 it was competitive other things. And then here comes the Hyperion 79 00:04:20,519 --> 00:04:22,160 Max 3 where I'm like, here we go again. 80 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:25,600 And I put on I'm like, oh, like I like this. 81 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:28,040 Like I like it. I think better than the Super 82 00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:29,680 blast. This is really crazy, even with 83 00:04:29,680 --> 00:04:32,520 this medial cut out, which again, hasn't bugged me as much 84 00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:34,520 as I thought. So And then Andrew's like, I 85 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:36,560 don't like this. It's heavy. 86 00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:39,040 And the, my dad's trip, they ruined it. 87 00:04:39,040 --> 00:04:41,640 And I was like, we definitely have to talk about this. 88 00:04:41,640 --> 00:04:45,200 So as always, we're going to do this as a comparing 2 shoes, two 89 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:47,440 different people and see why are we experiencing things 90 00:04:47,440 --> 00:04:49,160 differently. And let's start off with the 91 00:04:49,160 --> 00:04:50,840 upper first. So Andrew, what did you 92 00:04:50,840 --> 00:04:52,600 experience with the upper? Although this is usually the 93 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:55,680 thing we usually agree on. So, but what'd you experience? 94 00:04:56,680 --> 00:04:59,320 All right. The upper is very different than 95 00:04:59,440 --> 00:05:02,880 the one. I mean, there's no similarities 96 00:05:02,880 --> 00:05:06,360 between the two. It's kind of a progression of 97 00:05:06,360 --> 00:05:09,360 the two, this tighter knit upper. 98 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:13,400 But really this, this is a whole redesign. 99 00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:19,200 You can kind of see that the orangish red part is one piece 100 00:05:19,200 --> 00:05:23,760 of material and then there's basically like this sock like 101 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:28,480 part that makes up the heel and then the tongue. 102 00:05:29,080 --> 00:05:36,040 And I really did not like this part of the upper where the 103 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:38,880 tongue folds under the main part. 104 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:42,960 No matter what I did, I could not get this part to lay flat on 105 00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:45,560 my foot. It just folded up and it kind of 106 00:05:45,560 --> 00:05:49,480 irritated it. So no matter like I would stop 107 00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:52,000 and like try to pull it out and flatten it out, but it just 108 00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:55,000 never sat right. So I feel like that could be 109 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:58,880 refined. This beige part is really thick 110 00:05:59,200 --> 00:06:01,840 and I think it adds too much weight and it makes the shoe 111 00:06:01,840 --> 00:06:04,280 warm. So I think hopefully for version 112 00:06:04,280 --> 00:06:06,000 four they can thin that out a little bit. 113 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:11,160 This orange material is very stiff, so there's not a lot of 114 00:06:11,160 --> 00:06:14,840 give to it. But what really changed the fit 115 00:06:14,840 --> 00:06:18,840 of version 3 the most for me? You can see how much padding 116 00:06:18,840 --> 00:06:22,440 there is in the heel. I almost never do well with this 117 00:06:22,440 --> 00:06:24,960 much padding in the heel because I feel like it just shoves my 118 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:27,120 foot forward and that's exactly what it did. 119 00:06:27,560 --> 00:06:32,080 So on most of my runs I had a lot of pressure on my big toes. 120 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:36,960 I did take this up to 10 miles like my kind of standard weekly 121 00:06:36,960 --> 00:06:40,880 10 mile up tempo run, but my big toes were definitely sore 122 00:06:40,880 --> 00:06:45,040 afterwards and I was pretty glad that I was done putting miles on 123 00:06:45,040 --> 00:06:47,600 the shoe after that. So I would I would very much 124 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:51,120 agree where this upper, this is a knit, right? 125 00:06:51,120 --> 00:06:53,800 Like it feels like some kind of knit material. 126 00:06:53,800 --> 00:06:57,200 Am I wrong on that? I mean I would call it a mesh. 127 00:06:57,200 --> 00:06:59,600 Like a mesh. I feel like yeah. 128 00:06:59,920 --> 00:07:01,640 There's a lot of companies starting to use some kind of 129 00:07:01,640 --> 00:07:04,040 combination of those two where you know, it's actually 130 00:07:04,040 --> 00:07:07,160 surprisingly thin in some areas and you get these overlays of 131 00:07:07,160 --> 00:07:08,960 thicker pieces of supposed to create structure. 132 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:11,880 It's very low volume. It's very snug. 133 00:07:12,240 --> 00:07:15,440 It to me, I was like, oh, this might be too snug for me, but 134 00:07:15,440 --> 00:07:17,360 then the upper did. I got 50 miles in my pair. 135 00:07:17,360 --> 00:07:20,640 It did break in where it feels kind of I hate to use the word 136 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:23,800 sock like, but it does where it's pretty compressive. 137 00:07:23,800 --> 00:07:26,960 But then on the run I would usually forget about it and then 138 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:28,960 it was until I was walking when after I was like, oh this is 139 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:32,120 definitely a little snug. So it didn't bug me as much when 140 00:07:32,120 --> 00:07:34,320 the upper broke in. But I will totally agree with 141 00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:39,240 you that it's snug lower volume and it's this one semi one piece 142 00:07:40,360 --> 00:07:43,800 tongue that's very thick. And for the life of me I cannot 143 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:46,480 get this thing to sit flat without creasing. 144 00:07:46,760 --> 00:07:50,240 So shorter runs, that was fine. I did my first eleven mile run 145 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:53,000 in this, which is right now a long run for me, which when 146 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:54,880 you're pushing a stroller is a long, long way. 147 00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:58,280 But the tongue is really thick throughout its length. 148 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:00,720 And so it does put a good amount of pressure on the top of my 149 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:03,800 foot, which is good because a if I need to tie the laces tighter, 150 00:08:04,040 --> 00:08:06,480 that would take care of that. It wouldn't be a cause much 151 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:09,160 pressure. But it continues up into this 152 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:12,040 little tab here where it just creates a little bit too much 153 00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:14,760 pressure right in my tail, cruel joint, like right where the 154 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:17,240 ankle bends that I definitely noticed. 155 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:22,360 And I realized the essentially loosen the laces on the run 156 00:08:22,360 --> 00:08:24,200 today and that took care of it a little bit. 157 00:08:24,200 --> 00:08:26,800 But I don't I don't know if I'd use this for soup. 158 00:08:26,800 --> 00:08:29,040 Even though the sole feels great for me. 159 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:33,200 I don't know if I would use it on longer long runs like 1820 160 00:08:33,280 --> 00:08:34,799 just because I'd be a little bit concerned. 161 00:08:34,799 --> 00:08:36,720 But if you're someone that a tongue never bothered to use 162 00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:39,080 then then don't worry. And maybe having some thicker 163 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:40,400 thoughts might take care of that. 164 00:08:40,400 --> 00:08:45,600 But yes, warm upper, very padded, feels a lot thicker than 165 00:08:45,600 --> 00:08:48,280 it actually is and it definitely gets really warm. 166 00:08:48,440 --> 00:08:52,800 Heel is super padded back here and fortunately the padding does 167 00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:55,920 offset how stiff this heel counter there is. 168 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:59,200 But I am it is starting to bug me just a little bit. 169 00:08:59,200 --> 00:09:01,960 My calcaneus was on my left side, was a little sore today, 170 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:05,200 but thicker upper so not necessarily the full on racing 171 00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:06,960 type upper. So we actually agree 172 00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:11,200 surprisingly on the upper, but let's talk about the sole where 173 00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:12,800 we are not going to agree as much. 174 00:09:12,800 --> 00:09:14,720 So talking about what you experienced under flood. 175 00:09:15,680 --> 00:09:18,040 All right, so first of all, I don't know if we mentioned this 176 00:09:18,040 --> 00:09:21,280 already, but this is the first iteration of the Hyperion Max 177 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:25,560 that has Piba. So it has DNA Gold, which is 178 00:09:25,680 --> 00:09:29,400 Brooks Piba material. It's a dual layer midsole. 179 00:09:29,400 --> 00:09:33,320 So from what I read online, we don't have the official spec 180 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:38,040 sheet, but supposedly the other layer is DNA Flash 2, which is 181 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:41,320 the midsole that was used in versions one and two of the 182 00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:46,040 Hyperion Max. But I love the feel of DNA Gold. 183 00:09:46,040 --> 00:09:49,920 Like I really like the way that the midsole feels To me, it 184 00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:51,680 feels like Peeba. It's awesome. 185 00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:55,040 It's not soft. I don't feel like I'm sinking 186 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:57,560 into the shoe, and it's definitely bouncy. 187 00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:00,480 The rocker geometry is really nice. 188 00:10:00,480 --> 00:10:04,280 Like you really, it's the type of shoe that feels like it kind 189 00:10:04,280 --> 00:10:08,080 of helps you run a little bit easier, which is what a super 190 00:10:08,080 --> 00:10:12,520 trainer is supposed to do. What I didn't really like about 191 00:10:12,520 --> 00:10:16,400 the shoe, it just it's heavy. I can't remember what the weight 192 00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:22,600 is but it's like oz heavier at that. 9.9 oz So it's like almost 193 00:10:22,920 --> 00:10:25,440 what is it? Like an an ounce and a half 2 oz 194 00:10:25,440 --> 00:10:28,120 heavier than version one. What? 195 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:34,160 What did version 1 and 2 weigh? Version 1 was like 6 oz for men 196 00:10:34,160 --> 00:10:37,640 and high fives for oh wait I have it right here. 197 00:10:38,760 --> 00:10:46,920 Version 1 was 7.5 oz for men's, 96.7 for women's 8, and version 198 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:52,360 2 was 9.1 oz for men's 9 and 8.1 oz for women's 8. 199 00:10:52,400 --> 00:10:57,040 Yeah, so it's what 2 1/2 and version 3 is 9.9 oz, right? 200 00:10:57,080 --> 00:10:58,240 I think so. Yeah. 201 00:10:58,320 --> 00:11:04,680 So actually let me bring, I have Yep, 9.280g and men's size 9, 202 00:11:04,680 --> 00:11:07,120 women's size 10 1/2 'cause we it was, we don't have women's 203 00:11:07,120 --> 00:11:12,200 sizing specs at the moment. But it's also much taller stack 204 00:11:12,200 --> 00:11:14,600 height. It's a 45, it's huge, 45 205 00:11:14,600 --> 00:11:17,080 millimeters in the heel, 37 on the four foot for an 8 million 206 00:11:17,080 --> 00:11:18,960 drop. So that that thing is towering 207 00:11:18,960 --> 00:11:21,840 off the ground. And it's yeah, it is. 208 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:24,880 It's 2 1/2, almost 2 1/2 oz heavier than the original 209 00:11:24,880 --> 00:11:27,840 version and almost an ounce heavier than version 2. 210 00:11:28,400 --> 00:11:29,760 Keep going, by the way. So like what? 211 00:11:29,760 --> 00:11:33,920 So what do you feel? So while I like the feel of DNA, 212 00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:36,360 Gold like it, it's a bouncy midsole. 213 00:11:36,360 --> 00:11:39,280 It's nice. I don't like how it fits. 214 00:11:39,320 --> 00:11:42,560 It hurt my big toes and it feels heavy on foot. 215 00:11:42,920 --> 00:11:46,360 And you know, it's a common refrain for me when I test these 216 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:50,320 super trainers, they all feel OK, but they just feel too 217 00:11:50,320 --> 00:11:52,600 heavy. The only super trainers that 218 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:56,480 I've continued running in after testing them are the New Balance 219 00:11:56,480 --> 00:11:59,240 SC Trainer one, which is kind of funny because that was like the 220 00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:03,720 heaviest one ever. But that one, it was so rockered 221 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:07,240 and so firm. Honestly that too just felt like 222 00:12:07,240 --> 00:12:11,840 it ran for me, like I was in the middle of like real I. 223 00:12:12,840 --> 00:12:15,160 Why did we not do a A1 on that one? 224 00:12:15,200 --> 00:12:18,160 That's the one of the bounciest, softest shoes I've ever run. 225 00:12:20,600 --> 00:12:24,360 The SC trainer, I could be like half dead and put that on and go 226 00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:28,680 run 3 miles. So like that, that outweighed 227 00:12:28,680 --> 00:12:31,720 it's incredibly high weight. I think it was 11. 228 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:35,040 Oz It was like 11 and a half, 11.8 something. 229 00:12:35,040 --> 00:12:38,920 It was, it was heavy, yeah. Yeah, and then Puma Magmax, 230 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:42,920 which has an even higher stack height than Hyperion Max 3, but 231 00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:47,280 is like at least an ounce lighter, Yeah, and doesn't have 232 00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:49,880 a plate. So it it just has a more 233 00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:52,640 responsive feel than Hyperion Max 3. 234 00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:57,600 So basically, even though I like the midsole, I like the 235 00:12:57,600 --> 00:13:02,560 geometry, it's just it's too heavy for me to choose it over 236 00:13:02,920 --> 00:13:07,760 so many other shoes that have a similar feel and are either 237 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:11,240 lighter weight or have even better rocker geometry. 238 00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:15,400 So when I need a shoe to just like do the running for me, I 239 00:13:15,400 --> 00:13:19,000 would choose a different shoe. So Magmax is actually slightly 240 00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:23,000 heavier than the Yeah, So that one's 10.3 oz. 241 00:13:23,000 --> 00:13:25,000 Men size 9, women size 10 1/2. This is 9. 242 00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:29,280 So similar weights, right? It's also taller, it's a 47 mil, 243 00:13:29,280 --> 00:13:31,880 which that that makes sense and I could feel that it's 47 the 244 00:13:31,880 --> 00:13:36,960 heel. I just forgot what it was 39 in 245 00:13:36,960 --> 00:13:39,360 the forefoot. So also 8mm drop, but just a 246 00:13:39,360 --> 00:13:41,640 little bit higher. But that's interesting. 247 00:13:42,400 --> 00:13:44,040 So why do you think you experience? 248 00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:47,520 So the fit makes sense, but like midsole wise, why do you think 249 00:13:47,520 --> 00:13:50,320 you're experiencing that? And then I'll I'll dive into 250 00:13:50,320 --> 00:13:52,360 what I've been experiencing and and give a. 251 00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:57,920 Do you mean like the feeling of cushion and resilience or the 252 00:13:58,280 --> 00:14:00,640 dislike of weight? I think it like, so again, it's 253 00:14:00,640 --> 00:14:03,040 this shoe is supposed to be set up with a geometry that's 254 00:14:03,040 --> 00:14:04,960 supposed to feel faster. It's supposed to be a super 255 00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:07,640 trainer, but that weight is really on your mind. 256 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:09,160 So why? Why do you think that other than 257 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:11,200 the obvious going, yes, it is heavier than a lot of the other 258 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:11,960 ones. So like what? 259 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:15,040 What else do you think might be contributing to why you feel 260 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:17,680 that? So I think and actually I wrote 261 00:14:17,680 --> 00:14:19,440 the DPT section of our review on this. 262 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:22,440 So this shoe has a medial cut out. 263 00:14:22,880 --> 00:14:26,400 And when I first got the shoe I was like, oh, Brooks made a Hoka 264 00:14:26,520 --> 00:14:30,760 CLO X1 basically with the cut out move to the medial side. 265 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:35,440 And you know, we've talked extensively about like the one 266 00:14:35,440 --> 00:14:40,560 versus the two. I like the medial cut out of the 267 00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:46,040 CLO X1 version 2 because I feel like it just helps me move 268 00:14:46,040 --> 00:14:50,680 medially more easily, But I don't think that the medial cut 269 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:54,840 out of this shoe is enough to actually do much for me. 270 00:14:55,280 --> 00:14:58,680 And part of that is even though it's got a cut out here, you've 271 00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:02,920 got this whole solid piece that runs the whole length of the 272 00:15:02,920 --> 00:15:06,480 shoe. And if I'm landing here, this 273 00:15:06,480 --> 00:15:10,520 cut out here isn't going to do a whole lot for my mechanics. 274 00:15:10,520 --> 00:15:14,760 I wish I had the Cielo X12 Point O up here to show it, but 275 00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:20,120 basically in that shoe, the whole lateral side of the heel 276 00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:25,520 is like its own island. So that totally changes the ride 277 00:15:25,520 --> 00:15:29,240 of the shoe. So despite this cut out, which 278 00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:34,640 should make the shoe feel even more rolling and responsive, I 279 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:38,160 just don't think it's significant enough to overcome 280 00:15:38,160 --> 00:15:41,120 the stiffness here for my mechanics. 281 00:15:43,720 --> 00:15:47,600 I think, I really think that's the main issue in that shoe for. 282 00:15:47,960 --> 00:15:52,200 Okay this is perfect because I actually have a somewhat similar 283 00:15:52,200 --> 00:15:55,880 experience but it does something very differently for me so I'll 284 00:15:55,880 --> 00:15:58,920 dive in where I agree it is not the light issue. 285 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:01,760 I think the DNA gold though is phenomenal. 286 00:16:01,760 --> 00:16:06,440 I Brooks never sent us the Hyperion Elite four or the Elite 287 00:16:06,440 --> 00:16:09,880 4PB and I have been scouring eBay and I'll be very honest 288 00:16:09,880 --> 00:16:14,080 that last night I just lost out by like a a couple dollars at 289 00:16:14,080 --> 00:16:15,920 the last second on a pair on eBay. 290 00:16:15,920 --> 00:16:18,760 It was size 10 1/2, so maybe a little bit big for me, but it 291 00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:21,040 has been a pain trying to get a pair of those because it they 292 00:16:21,040 --> 00:16:23,560 are like sold out everywhere. And of course, knowing me, I 293 00:16:23,560 --> 00:16:25,040 don't want to pay full price for everything. 294 00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:28,920 So I'll go look every single place under the sun to to try to 295 00:16:28,920 --> 00:16:31,360 get it. So I was trying, but first 296 00:16:31,360 --> 00:16:33,040 experience with DNA gold is phenomenal. 297 00:16:33,040 --> 00:16:35,840 It's like there's a lot of variations of Peeba foams out in 298 00:16:35,840 --> 00:16:37,920 the market right now. And it's just like, I feel like 299 00:16:37,920 --> 00:16:41,200 we kind of in some shoes have gotten moved away from like that 300 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:44,800 OG nice bouncy like, Oh, this is definitely a Peeba foam. 301 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:47,480 Like that's what this feels like where it's like, Oh, this has 302 00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:50,520 got some good bounce to it. It is balanced very well with 303 00:16:50,520 --> 00:16:52,600 the DNA flash too, which I have hated. 304 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:55,600 And I think this combination is much better because I have 305 00:16:55,720 --> 00:17:00,000 disliked every time I'm like, Oh gosh, flash like, and I, and 306 00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:02,640 Andrew knows this, that in the chat I make jokes about like, 307 00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:04,640 Oh, look, you can't wear any clothes with this because you 308 00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:06,079 have to flash people and it's not great. 309 00:17:06,079 --> 00:17:08,640 And that's probably going to BJ's probably going to edit that 310 00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:09,720 out, but I'm going to leave that in there. 311 00:17:09,720 --> 00:17:12,480 But I just don't like DNA flash. It doesn't compress really well 312 00:17:12,480 --> 00:17:15,599 under foot, but this combination does really well where it feels 313 00:17:15,599 --> 00:17:18,920 like kind of my experiences with super trainers have been they 314 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:21,560 are still training shoes, but they can go faster. 315 00:17:21,560 --> 00:17:24,000 And when you change your mechanics than the right of the 316 00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:26,960 shoe really changes. And I felt like that's exactly 317 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:29,640 what the shoe does where it's, you know, I keep holding the 318 00:17:29,640 --> 00:17:31,080 left side. It's held up longer than I 319 00:17:31,080 --> 00:17:32,760 expected it to. I'm still digging through this, 320 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:35,480 but I got 50 miles where I can go for an easy run and it 321 00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:39,320 doesn't feel like this crazy unstable, like crazy bouncy 322 00:17:39,320 --> 00:17:41,560 thing I can't control, which is what happens when I go for a run 323 00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:44,200 in like super shoes, super racing shoes. 324 00:17:44,480 --> 00:17:46,560 It feels really good. It feels cushioned, but it still 325 00:17:46,560 --> 00:17:49,560 rolls me along. This is probably one of the best 326 00:17:49,720 --> 00:17:51,920 heel bubbles I think I've experienced, especially from 327 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:54,720 Brooks, where it's just this very large one. 328 00:17:54,800 --> 00:17:58,560 It's not as aggressively curved as the previous versions and 329 00:17:58,640 --> 00:18:01,800 it's got a nice posterolateral aspect that feels to me very 330 00:18:01,800 --> 00:18:03,600 stable. It's not centered like the 331 00:18:03,600 --> 00:18:06,200 previous ones. So and it just the lateral side 332 00:18:06,200 --> 00:18:09,200 compresses really well. But I will warn you if you have 333 00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:12,480 lateral heel instabilities, this shoe is not going to be 1 for 334 00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:15,720 you because it does toss you a little bit lateral here and 335 00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:18,480 which feels great for me. It might not feel good for other 336 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:22,680 people, which also I think offsets this midfoot because 337 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:25,400 when I'm standing here I feel that and I feel like I feels 338 00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:27,520 like I'm tilting inwards on the run. 339 00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:30,760 I noticed it a tiny bit but I was able to get through a long 340 00:18:30,760 --> 00:18:32,240 run in the shoe and it didn't bug me at all. 341 00:18:32,240 --> 00:18:35,320 I was very afraid that I was going to like fatigue out and a 342 00:18:35,320 --> 00:18:36,920 lot of super shoes will do that to me. 343 00:18:37,280 --> 00:18:39,840 Didn't didn't do it actually hold up and I agree it's because 344 00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:43,120 the actual width of the shoe and this cut out is so small. 345 00:18:43,120 --> 00:18:46,360 When you move in a decent speed you'll just roll through it and 346 00:18:46,360 --> 00:18:48,200 you won't notice it. Now some people with with 347 00:18:48,200 --> 00:18:51,120 supination stability needs in the midfoot, this actually might 348 00:18:51,120 --> 00:18:54,440 work because it definitely is a little medial there, but not 349 00:18:54,440 --> 00:18:56,960 enough that like a lot of people like me that only have mild 350 00:18:56,960 --> 00:18:59,920 stability shoes, knees are going to have an issue with and then 351 00:18:59,920 --> 00:19:02,400 the forefoot. I think this rocker is long 352 00:19:02,400 --> 00:19:04,840 enough that it's not as stiff of the previous version, but when 353 00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:07,360 you pick up the pace, the DNA gold, the amount of it here has 354 00:19:07,360 --> 00:19:10,560 such a nice bounce where I've literally done everything. 355 00:19:10,560 --> 00:19:13,360 I've done a track workout where this shoe is really should be 356 00:19:13,360 --> 00:19:15,360 too large to do that, but still was able to do it. 357 00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:17,520 Done fart luck, did a temple run in it. 358 00:19:17,520 --> 00:19:20,920 Have now done a long run easy run and it's just to me a really 359 00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:23,480 good example of a super shoe. Does the upper need some work? 360 00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:25,600 Absolutely it does. And I think a lot of weight can 361 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:28,600 be taken off of it, but I really enjoyed it thus far. 362 00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:31,280 And I will say this, and I like to heal here 1000 times better 363 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:35,040 than what I do in the Super Glass and the upper, it doesn't 364 00:19:35,040 --> 00:19:36,880 taper as aggressively as a Super Glass. 365 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:39,520 So I think in a way it's actually a little bit better. 366 00:19:39,520 --> 00:19:43,120 So I like this a little better, which I never thought I would 367 00:19:43,120 --> 00:19:45,960 say. And I think ironically, that 368 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:49,240 midfoot cut out, I think for you isn't big enough for me. 369 00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:52,760 It's just small enough that it doesn't impact my mechanics 370 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:54,400 where I can still get through this. 371 00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:58,080 I think the lateral heel bevel, because I land back here and it 372 00:19:58,080 --> 00:20:01,080 compresses so much back here that it just works really well 373 00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:04,360 for my mechanics, makes it feel less unstable because I'm so 374 00:20:04,360 --> 00:20:07,640 medially sensitive. And then yeah, I just think I'm 375 00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:10,440 reacting very well to the P backs plate. 376 00:20:10,880 --> 00:20:13,760 And the DNA goal or just again, that seems to be able to adapt 377 00:20:13,760 --> 00:20:17,040 to whatever I need. And because of that geometry at 378 00:20:17,040 --> 00:20:20,080 balance, it's offsetting the weight for me, but doesn't sound 379 00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:22,200 like it's offsetting the weight for you, which is interesting. 380 00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:23,640 Have you tried to do a workout in these? 381 00:20:23,920 --> 00:20:28,120 I did like a 10 mile long run at like, I don't know, 710 pace in 382 00:20:28,120 --> 00:20:31,000 it and it was fine. But the whole time I was 383 00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:35,560 thinking, I like one of my favorite long run shoes is the 384 00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:39,960 Mizuno Wave Rebellion flash tube, which I think is a little 385 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:43,120 lighter than the shoe, I think quite a bit. 386 00:20:43,120 --> 00:20:47,280 And yeah, yeah. And that shoe, that shoe for me 387 00:20:47,280 --> 00:20:50,600 is like borderline. Like I can use it if I've got 388 00:20:50,600 --> 00:20:54,160 like a 10K pace or 5K pace workout, but it feels a little 389 00:20:54,160 --> 00:20:57,360 heavy. The Hyperion Max 3 just felt 390 00:20:57,360 --> 00:21:00,400 like it crossed that like wait line where it's like, yeah, I 391 00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:05,120 can do this like up tempo, medium long run in it, but it's 392 00:21:05,120 --> 00:21:08,240 not like out of all the shoes I have, I'm not going to pick it. 393 00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:11,640 Ironically, this is the exact show I'd pick for that that 394 00:21:11,640 --> 00:21:15,440 type. Of workout, of course, yeah. 395 00:21:15,480 --> 00:21:17,720 So it's like this is, this is the example that we always talk 396 00:21:17,720 --> 00:21:19,280 about that different people are going to have different 397 00:21:19,280 --> 00:21:21,760 experiences. And this is a really great 398 00:21:21,760 --> 00:21:23,960 example. And so again, I think it's the 399 00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:27,360 geometry and how well I'm responding to the DNA gold that 400 00:21:27,360 --> 00:21:28,800 makes it feel lighter. Is it? 401 00:21:29,000 --> 00:21:30,480 I still though, I would agree with you. 402 00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:33,960 What I personally use is for a racing shoe, no, I probably 403 00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:36,800 would not. It's very comfortable and now I 404 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:39,000 trusted enough to be able to throw it on for most things, but 405 00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:42,640 it's still on the heavier end. However, I think a lot of 406 00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:45,600 recreational runners will do much better in a shoe like this 407 00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:49,120 than a lot of the Super shoes because super shoes are very 408 00:21:49,120 --> 00:21:51,840 aggressive, very stiff. I think that the geometry of 409 00:21:51,840 --> 00:21:54,280 this is it's still a little stiff and it gets stiffer when 410 00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:57,240 you start picking up the pace, but it's less aggressive and 411 00:21:57,240 --> 00:21:59,680 protective enough that I think a lot more people are going to do 412 00:21:59,720 --> 00:22:02,080 better in this type of shoe to be on. 413 00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:04,560 Like the average runner is going to do a lot better with this 414 00:22:04,840 --> 00:22:07,960 than something even like and we haven't tried it that the 415 00:22:08,160 --> 00:22:13,000 Brooks, you know, the Hyperion elite for PB or the elite 5, 416 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:15,600 which is a looks very good. So I'm actually slightly scared 417 00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:18,240 of that shoe, Brooke said. They're gonna send it and I'm 418 00:22:18,240 --> 00:22:20,240 like, I wanna test this, but I'm also scared. 419 00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:23,280 But what do you think about like super trainers and being 420 00:22:23,280 --> 00:22:26,880 alternative options for as compared to racing shoes for the 421 00:22:26,880 --> 00:22:28,320 general population? Yeah. 422 00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:31,520 So I find it interesting that actually both of us have now 423 00:22:31,520 --> 00:22:35,680 said about different shoes, the geometry and performance of the 424 00:22:35,680 --> 00:22:38,240 foam made-up for the weight of the shoe. 425 00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:39,880 I said that about the SC Trainer 1. 426 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:42,080 You said it about the Hyperion Max 3. 427 00:22:42,520 --> 00:22:46,840 And in a way we, we've been saying that about even a lot of 428 00:22:47,200 --> 00:22:49,840 the heavier super racing shoes out there, right? 429 00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:53,240 Like yes, these are all heavier than racing flats, but the 430 00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:56,880 benefit that you get from the rocker geometry, from the 431 00:22:56,880 --> 00:23:01,320 responsiveness of the foam is worth the difference in weight. 432 00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:05,760 So again, and the whole point of doing these episodes where we 433 00:23:05,760 --> 00:23:09,240 talk about our different experiences and shoes is that 434 00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:13,520 specs aren't everything. Just because a shoe is heavier 435 00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:16,360 or just because a shoe has a higher stack height than you're 436 00:23:16,360 --> 00:23:19,960 used to doesn't necessarily mean it's going to be a bad shoe for 437 00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:21,800 you. You've really got to put it on 438 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:24,520 and test it out and see how it feels with your mechanics. 439 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:29,320 And I absolutely, for a lot of runners, they're just aren't. 440 00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:33,640 And you guys did an episode on this recently about stable 441 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:38,160 racing shoes and how there just aren't any true stability racing 442 00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:41,320 shoes out there. So for people who need something 443 00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:44,760 with a little more control, some of these super trainers are 444 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:48,080 going to be a better choice because they're typically a 445 00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:52,480 little bit wider base. This foam isn't quite as 446 00:23:52,480 --> 00:23:55,640 compliant. Yes, there's a rocker geometry, 447 00:23:55,640 --> 00:24:00,240 but it's not as aggressive as say, running in like a Vapor Fly 448 00:24:00,240 --> 00:24:05,000 or the CLOX one. So absolutely people should 449 00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:08,400 consider these super trainers as they're racing shoes, especially 450 00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:10,800 if we're talking about like half marathon and marathon. 451 00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:14,200 Like I for sure if I was running a marathon right now, the shoe 452 00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:18,080 that I would probably think about picking would be the CLO 453 00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:21,480 X1 version one. Or did I say that right? 454 00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:25,320 I don't know if I'm saying that. That one just called the Hoka 455 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:32,760 Cielo X. 11.0 or whatever, but and I kind of almost considered 456 00:24:32,760 --> 00:24:36,040 using it for a 5K2 just because even though it was like almost 9 457 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:41,680 ounces, that shoe was so bouncy and it was nuts. 458 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:44,600 Like I remember doing a workout and I'm like, this is like I was 459 00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:46,640 warming up. I'm like this whatever, like 460 00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:49,360 just as heavy and then as soon as it hit the ground like, oh, 461 00:24:49,360 --> 00:24:51,720 that's why that person used this for the US Rd. 462 00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:53,960 Rd. mile championships and what? Like Chrissy? 463 00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:55,840 Yeah, I was. Like this is insane. 464 00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:58,560 Like this is so bouncy. And then it was one of the few 465 00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:00,760 shoes with that lateral cut out that I think you hate, but I 466 00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:03,120 love because. No, I actually like. 467 00:25:03,120 --> 00:25:04,040 Yes. No, this was. 468 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:05,320 It doesn't. David doesn't. 469 00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:07,720 David doesn't like it that you liked it and I was like, how 470 00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:09,880 could you like this? It throws me so lateral. 471 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:11,640 I like it too. So I guess that's one of the few 472 00:25:11,640 --> 00:25:16,160 shoes we agree on. But it's just, you know, as an 473 00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:18,200 elite runner, when you start talking about some of the new 474 00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:22,560 shoes that are coming out like the Adidas, the audios Evo pro 475 00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:25,240 one or the new which we just talked to. 476 00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:28,560 I we neither of us have tried this, at least at this time. 477 00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:30,840 We'll see if Adidas sends it. But what is it the meta speed 478 00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,040 ray? Is that what it's called? 479 00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:38,240 So that shoes like mid 4 1/2 oz like I love. 480 00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:42,320 So go to YouTube, by the way, and go look at David the initial 481 00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:44,560 impressions video that he posted where you see like it. 482 00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:47,960 Apparently it's like the the the new foam is like the softest 483 00:25:47,960 --> 00:25:52,120 thing anybody's experience and you can see his ankle, his ankle 484 00:25:52,120 --> 00:25:54,800 is all over the place and the number of people that are just 485 00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:56,840 like your ankle mechanics look terrible. 486 00:25:56,840 --> 00:25:59,200 Never do that. I am this profession you. 487 00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:02,280 I don't ever run an issue. It's like he's still running 488 00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:03,320 fine. It would he take it for a 489 00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:04,840 marathon? I don't know, like even if 490 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,080 somebody like David's going and he says this like I'm not sure 491 00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:09,040 if I would take this for a marathon, but like 5K10K 492 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:11,440 absolutely. And there's going to be some 493 00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:13,600 elites that are going to have and that's part of what makes 494 00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:16,360 them elite is better motor control, better ability to 495 00:26:16,360 --> 00:26:19,200 produce forests better, quicker ability to do it better to be 496 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:21,960 able to control it. The rest of us mortals aren't 497 00:26:22,320 --> 00:26:24,120 that's not necessarily appropriate. 498 00:26:24,120 --> 00:26:28,400 And so learning what's going to optimize your performance, you 499 00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:29,960 need to separate yourself from the elite. 500 00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:32,040 Like, you know, Andrea, maybe you have a different opinion 501 00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:34,760 because you're, you're competing now on an, on an international 502 00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:38,600 level as a masters athlete. But like, I don't consider my, 503 00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:41,160 and I, I'm pushing a stroller an hour, 20 minutes. 504 00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:42,600 I, I don't consider myself elite. 505 00:26:42,600 --> 00:26:45,920 I consider myself more of a like recreational sub elite. 506 00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:48,360 And a lot of times to this day, like I'm running and stuff 507 00:26:48,360 --> 00:26:50,040 because I'm testing it. And even with racing stuff, I 508 00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:53,120 still like I have to run in the fastest shoe and I'm going, what 509 00:26:53,120 --> 00:26:54,800 shoes going to help me perform best? 510 00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:57,240 And sometimes I'm getting close to the point I'm like, I'm not 511 00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:00,160 exactly sure if it's this super shoe, but the thing that holds 512 00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:02,400 me back going, I need to test this super shoe for a race and 513 00:27:02,400 --> 00:27:03,840 see how it goes. And I hope I survive. 514 00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:07,400 So, you know, it's, I think for the rest of us. 515 00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:10,360 And yeah, right. I, I would have, no, if I had to 516 00:27:10,360 --> 00:27:12,800 go run a marathon, I would, I would run in this because I, I 517 00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:14,080 don't care about the illegal stack, right? 518 00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:17,240 Like I'm not a pro athlete like the rest of us, all of us. 519 00:27:17,640 --> 00:27:18,800 It doesn't matter what's illegal. 520 00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:21,280 We're not like running like first place and all these men 521 00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:23,280 are like you just don't don't worry about that. 522 00:27:23,360 --> 00:27:25,480 It's it's only if you're like a professional athlete. 523 00:27:25,480 --> 00:27:27,680 This needs to be a case. And I get most of you are not 524 00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:29,680 professional athletes. You some of you don't see your 525 00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:31,160 Mac like it, but you're not I'm just kidding. 526 00:27:31,160 --> 00:27:33,440 I'm being married. It's me being. 527 00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:37,160 Hard like to correct here that I am definitely not an elite 528 00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:39,760 athlete. I am happy to be a masters 529 00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:43,040 runner where I can still compete, but I certainly know 530 00:27:43,040 --> 00:27:48,200 where my times fall. So yeah, and I like running a 531 00:27:48,240 --> 00:27:51,280 track mile in the streak fly. For a second. 532 00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:54,760 I was like, no, you have to run in spikes. 533 00:27:54,760 --> 00:27:57,000 But it's like, no, I think I'm going to run faster in the 534 00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:00,080 streak fly. And that's like a nice place to 535 00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:01,960 be. Like from a mental standpoint, 536 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:05,160 like I'm going to choose what I think is best for me, not what 537 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:07,760 like marketing says is best for me. 538 00:28:07,800 --> 00:28:09,280 And. That's a lot of why we do this 539 00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:10,920 and we mean mode to offense to the marketers. 540 00:28:10,920 --> 00:28:12,640 We know that your job is challenging and you have to 541 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:15,120 adapt every single year to changing things and trying to 542 00:28:15,120 --> 00:28:18,120 get language to sell a product. We, we understand, but for the 543 00:28:18,120 --> 00:28:21,200 consumer, we do this because we want to help you make better 544 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:24,200 decisions about shoes and realizing that what you see an 545 00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:28,120 elite athlete wearing isn't necessarily the best thing for 546 00:28:28,120 --> 00:28:30,200 you, right? And learning what's best for 547 00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:33,040 you, learning what you run your fastest in oftentimes is what's 548 00:28:33,040 --> 00:28:34,880 most comfortable. And I don't mean what's the 549 00:28:34,880 --> 00:28:38,400 softest or the like fastest on your feet, but it's what's going 550 00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:40,640 to get you to the finish line, What's going to get you through 551 00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:42,640 your training healthy, Because there's no point running a shoe 552 00:28:42,640 --> 00:28:44,440 you're going to get injured constantly in. 553 00:28:44,680 --> 00:28:47,680 If that's you know, you want the the thing that's the most 554 00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:49,760 comfortable, that that's best balance for you and it's going 555 00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:52,480 to get you through your training healthy is only then can you 556 00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:55,040 actually finish the race. And that's why we talk about 557 00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:56,560 this stuff. Exactly. 558 00:28:56,920 --> 00:28:57,440 Yep. So. 559 00:28:57,680 --> 00:28:59,080 Yes. Anything else? 560 00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:02,000 Any of the thoughts? I think we covered, I think we 561 00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:04,640 had another good discussion on our disagreements. 562 00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:07,080 And again, it's coming down that we just did this with the 563 00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:10,760 Vaporfly for not too long ago, but the Nike Vaporfly for but 564 00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:14,800 again, geometry, even fit can change how a shoe feels under 565 00:29:14,800 --> 00:29:18,440 foot. Geometry, midsole design, even 566 00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:21,080 where outsole rubber is. All of these things can change 567 00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:22,880 how you perceive a shoe compared to somebody else. 568 00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:26,120 And that's why it's really important that if you are going 569 00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:29,680 to listen to people review shoes that you really think about who 570 00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:31,880 the person is in front of you. And I'm going to say this 571 00:29:31,880 --> 00:29:34,760 because our goal isn't for you to only listen to us. 572 00:29:34,760 --> 00:29:36,800 Our goal go, here are some opinions. 573 00:29:37,000 --> 00:29:39,680 We want to teach you some things because we are clinicians, we 574 00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:41,840 are researchers, we are educators. 575 00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:43,960 Our goal is to educate you on helping you make better 576 00:29:43,960 --> 00:29:46,360 decisions. If you happen to come to us and 577 00:29:46,360 --> 00:29:48,000 that's where you get your info, awesome. 578 00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:51,080 But if you also find that with us, any of the other great 579 00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:54,000 reviewers out there, that you match better with them, please 580 00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:56,280 go listen to them, right? Because you need to match. 581 00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:58,600 You need to look for the people that you match best with because 582 00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:01,680 people experience shoes very differently, even if it's the 583 00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:03,440 same shoe. We have lots of evidence show 584 00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:06,680 that and lots of experience. So hopefully we may be one of 585 00:30:06,680 --> 00:30:08,920 those people. If not, please find someone that 586 00:30:08,920 --> 00:30:12,840 matches you because again, as I just said, it's different things 587 00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:14,720 for each shoe. And hopefully Andrew and I's 588 00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:17,680 talks help you realize that more and help you figure out what 589 00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:20,320 might influence these things specifically for you. 590 00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:23,040 As always, you can find us on a variety of different channels. 591 00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:25,920 So of course on YouTube or on Spotify, iTunes and many 592 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:27,560 different places you can listen to podcasts. 593 00:30:27,760 --> 00:30:30,040 We also have written content on Doctors Running where the 594 00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:32,560 majority of our written reviews come out and all the OG stuff 595 00:30:32,560 --> 00:30:34,360 comes from. But you can also find us on 596 00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:38,560 social everywhere from LinkedIn, Instagram, X, which I think Bach 597 00:30:38,560 --> 00:30:41,960 has been making a bigger push in where we post digital content 598 00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:43,520 and links, of course, to the things that we're doing. 599 00:30:44,320 --> 00:30:46,440 As always, we also do this because we really want to help 600 00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:47,320 you. We are. 601 00:30:47,320 --> 00:30:48,560 I'm going to stick with this tagline. 602 00:30:48,720 --> 00:30:51,120 We are not influencers. Our goal is not to influence 603 00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:52,240 you. Our goal is to educate you 604 00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:54,000 because we want you to make better decisions about what 605 00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:56,960 you're putting on your feet so you can run better and hopefully 606 00:30:56,960 --> 00:30:59,560 run healthier. So you actually don't need us 607 00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:01,120 and you can figure this out on your own. 608 00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:03,440 Our goal is to have you be independent and learn something. 609 00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:05,560 So as always, we hope this helps and hope you have it.