It's gonna put some butts in the seat.
Welcome to remember 64 where this week.
We become the New World Order, brother.
Welcome to remember, 64. Welcome to the show, everyone.
My name is David. Angelo and if I ever go
Hollywood, I won't be calling up the hulkster.
I'm going with staying baby. Yeah, that's just a somewhat
vague quip about her level 21 games, WCW versus n wo World
Tour and even more specifically WCW NWO Revenge, a new guest
will be joining the show momentarily to talk about the
game and I'm very excited to have them on.
It was his idea to play these games and to play Revenge
specifically and it's going to be a blast to talk about before
that though. Always can check us out.
Patreon.com slash remember 64 show where you can get all these
episodes days. Early help us shape the show,
going forward, and even get some bonus content, like, hearing,
what else we're playing outside of the Nintendo 64, as well.
If patreon isn't your thing. No problem, whatsoever.
Give us a rating on your podcast app of choice Spotify, Apple
more specifically than anything else.
But all that is always very, very helpful.
We're not in this to make money or any of that stuff.
So if a little rating will get us up there rankings a little
bit more, people can hear the awesome stuff that we're doing
then all the better. So thanks very much for that.
And without further Ado, let's bust out the history books,
everyone I'm learning. It's time to head back to
November 1997 and October of 1998.
Now, admittedly like some other sports games and wrestling
games. There's an a ton to go off of
when it comes to the history of the development of the games
themselves. But WCW versus n wo World Tour.
Was thq's first attempt at making a championship title game
for the N64. Console.
It was also the North American version of virtual pro wrestling
that was released in Japan and also featured some WCW
characters. But I'm not going to dive too
too deep into that as Japanese titles.
Like this will likely be something that we will be
covering on, remember 64 as the show continues.
So look out for that. Now, speaking of the roster and
characters in it Hall of Famer, Ric Flair is a somewhat
surprising addition to World Tour because right around this
time, he left WCW to go back to the WWF and became a Hall of
Famer from there for years and years to come all this.
While the two companies were battling it out for Monday night
wrestling Supremacy. More on that in just a second
virtual pro wrestling to which is the sequel to The previously
mentioned game in Japan, also known as the predecessor to WCW
NWO Revenge. All of these games are all being
made around the same time and build off of Ideas, as time went
on. Now Revenge was released less
than a year after World Tour in North America and really tries
to throw the player into the epic battle between the two
groups. We are going to talk about that
more in a moment but there was more going on around WWF and
WCW. It wasn't just about what the
show was itself. So to catch you up briefly, at
least a little bit. This was essentially the battle
for Monday night, TV ratings throughout the 90s.
Yes. They've got their show in the
can their shells been taped later tonight.
Mick Foley, who wants wrestled. Here's Cactus Jack is going to
win their world title. Now, WWF reign supreme, for the
most part for years, but incomes WCW, and Eric Bischoff who
creates a type of direct competition.
That really hadn't been seen in years.
The sports entertainment fan base became more and more splits
and this was more than They Coke versus Pepsi type of rivalry.
This was to juggernauts fighting for money, TV time, and
ultimately talent that would make them the Victor.
In the end, long story short wrestlers like Hulk Hogan made
their way to WCW and even became what is called a heel or a bad
guy with Hogan doing that. I mean, anything can happen on
WCW, why wouldn't you want to watch it moves like this made
the Monday night Wars. A spicy addition to an already
spicy as hell, entertainment, Venture Inn.
Pro wrestling on TV. Now that's a very, very basic
and short way of going through it, you can definitely find more
detailed and more knowledgeable people to talk about it.
But that's essentially what it came down to.
In the end though, it mostly ended.
When this happened, Vince McMahon purchased, I own my own
competition for the first time ever and sports entertainment
history. This broadcast is not only being
Here on TNN. It is also being seen across
Turner, Network television Time. Warner is practically begging me
to buy WCW and I have agreed. All right, back to the games,
both of these titles, both World Tour and revenge sold, great on
the Nintendo 64 Revenge, placing 27th all time for the console
and Wilt or not far behind at 37th.
A total of mated, 3.2 million copies worldwide between these
two games. To put that in perspective,
Revenge alone, sold more than the Heavy Hitters.
Like the first two Turok games Kirby 64 Mario Golf and Paper.
Mario, remember 64 is proud and, oh, so happy to be a part of the
Tokyo. Beat podcast Network, Alex.
Hi. I'm Ray.
How would you explain our show? No more.
Are you a nerd having trouble transitioning from your 20s to
30s to 40s and Beyond age? With us?
Not at us, Mardi gra, but blow. Are you tired of the man?
Keeping you down. If you see something, say
something. Do you enjoy the family?
Computer capsule Computing? We got them all.
No more Whoppers. We out live to the queen.
She said it couldn't be done. No I'm fading.
Come back. I can't do this alone.
Do you enjoy number munchers and his numbers?
What you call? Then listen to No More Whoppers,
only on the Tokyo beat Network. All right, let's move on to
welcome our guests. Let's talk about the N64 and
these awesome wrestling titles WCW and wo World Tour and
revenge. All right, as always everyone to
remember 64, it's time to have a special guest on.
And this time, I am very, very excited to have an old friend
from the back. In my day podcast, he's been a
guest on that a couple times. I was a guest on the GameCube
was cool podcast at least once I think.
But but Mike is here bike, welcome to the show.
How are you, man? Thanks Dave.
I'm doing great. And I'm glad to be here to talk
about a console, that's not the GameCube, that's not the case.
Exactly, I have had your, your co-host from the think a few
podcasts on a couple of times. As we've said, I've said with
Neil, I feel like every time I've had them on, it's been a
racing game. So he's almost like the racing
guy. So next time you get to a racing
game, I might have to have it back on but you guys also have
as of this recording, you guys also have something exciting
coming up because you did an awesome thing.
You actually It wrapped up the GameCube library and went
through every single game, which is amazing.
And if anyone wants to listen to it, the GameCube was cool.
Podcast is so much fun. These guys did such an amazing
job, go back and just find the game.
You want to our series of games, you want to listen to they got a
covered which is great but now that that's over you guys have a
fun New project coming up in 2023.
Let's let's talk about that a little bit.
Sure. Yeah we're going to be talking
about a bunch of other games. And movies and albums and kind
of doing similar stuff for you guys do.
I'm back in my day, just talking about, you know, Nostalgia and
the podcast going to change the name.
It can't just be GameCube is cool anymore, unfortunately.
But it's going to be unlocking. What was cool.
So things are still going to be cool.
And yeah, we're just going to go back on some Nostalgia, gonna
focus on mainly that era late 90s, early 2000s, the era of N64
and GameCube because that's what we know.
That's what we want to talk about.
Our first episode is going to be Kirby's Return to Dreamland.
I know that's not an early 2000s game but we talked about we
would always bring that that game up a lot on the show
because there was not a real Kirby game on the GameCube and
we were always lamenting that and return Dreamland was
supposed to be a GameCube game and it just kept getting pushed
back and eventually was on the Wii.
And of course, there's the deluxe edition that's coming out
for the switch very soon as well.
So that's gonna be our first episode.
And we'll also have some revisit some, the GameCube episodes, the
early ones. We did when we didn't know how
to podcast yet. So just just getting started.
It's all good, man. That's that's fair.
That's awesome. Honestly, I'm excited.
I'm happy. You guys have awarded yourself a
few months off which is nice. To like, we were saying before
we record, it's good to have just a little breather every
once in a while, and, and it's cool man.
It's exciting to get that started.
So I'm happy for you guys. That's a lot of fun.
So so check that that out. What's the name of the podcast
again? So everyone can hear it
unlocking. What was cool unlocking?
What was cool will be Coming up later this year in the spring of
2023. If you are hearing this before
that and if you he ran after, go find it on your podcast for you.
So, okay, let's get into the N64.
As I always do with new people that are on the show, what's
your experience with a Nintendo? 64 Neil has told me there's
mixed feelings about it between the two of you and between
yourself and and just sort of how things were growing up
around that time. Let's, let's talk about it.
What's your experience the N64 before we dive into some Saline
action. Sure.
So, so, the running gag that Neil and I have a lot, is the
fact that I hate the N64, and now, that's kind of came.
Welcome to the show kind of game for me, just not having as much
of experience with the N64, and, of course, I actually don't hate
it. I actually really like the in
support. I think I was a little jealous
actually, because I didn't get to have won my first Home.
Console was the GameCube. I didn't have home consoles
before that, my parents were really into Just the handheld
stuff. They didn't really want me
playing a lot of games at home in front of the TV or something
about being in front. I know.
I know, I hear ya. I mean, I have a gay boys and
stuff too. So it's like here.
Yeah, I was five years old and I had a Game Boy, like, you is,
that's amazing. Yeah, but they cared about the
TV stuff, so, great. I only got to play in 64.
It friends houses, I didn't actually know Neil when the N64
was said at the time, but I lived It's like down the street
from a kid and his older brother and they had an N64 and of
course, was a classic older brother has all these violent
video games and all these other things over and play them and
you don't tell your parents. And, and that was my experience
kind of growing up. Initially was, was playing and
64 at friends houses and it was really strange to me with the
controller. Like that was the biggest thing
that really kind of took me for a run.
I was like, what is this? I don't have to, but she holding
a Gameboy and then going to that Yeah, it was, and I had played
the PS1 a little bit, too, like, right on.
And I'm just like what this is so strange, like, why are there
three hands here? But I we played Smash Bros, that
was the main thing we would play over there and we played
wrestling games and the one that I specifically remember is
Revenge and I remember because I was really really into wrestling
at this time I probably played it in like 2000 when wrestling,
I was 8 years old. This like the most hype you can
be as an eight-year-old is playing wrestling games.
And watching Monday, Nitro and Monday to.
Yeah. So it was like that was like our
life and I don't really remember a lot of other games on the N64
other than like Star Fox and some of the other ones, but I
didn't really even go back to the NCC were very much either.
As I got older for one, a lot of the games, as I'm sure you are
realizing and has you're playing them are kind of tough to go
back to with the back Enos. It's a very good Miss.
It's very hit and miss. Yeah.
Because there are yeah, of course some Like Conkers Bad Fur
Day that are so much fun to go back to you today.
But a game like GoldenEye in my opinion at least is actually not
that fun to go and play during a because it's there just are
especially in the shooting. Genre like it just comes so far
and it's hard to go back 25 years.
This, there's this big and big or or just set standard at a
certain point and it's hard to, it's okay to go a little bit
further back, look, even the GameCube games like it, you
know, there's a way to go back to those and It's, it feels
pretty damn good. Even with a controller that may
not be. That is that feels a typical
now. But like there's a certain level
of standard of feel and play there.
So I see what you mean. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
Yeah. So it's, it's, it's funny to
like kind of go back to a couple of these games now, as an adult,
going playing on the N64 online service on the switch, which no
WWF games are on, which is 90 said about playing stuff.
Like pilot wings of this game is so good, like yeah.
How good this game is as hard as a very hard game.
And, and the difficulty levels that you kind, of forgot as a
kid, like, playing Majora's Mask, I remembered one the 3D's
after had playing it at my friend's house and somehow
beating it like I can't. I'm like, how did like
eight-year-old me have any idea? How to play this game?
No, especially that hard. Especially yeah.
Yeah. So it's really funny to go back
to like, NCC for nowadays. But yeah, that's kind of my my
history with it. It's not a large history.
I've only Played maybe about 10, or 11 games on.
Yeah, before and and I don't hate it, it just wanna just got
to make sure that that's covered.
Yeah, no, that's funny. Hey, you gotta, you gotta own
it. You gotta just run with the
running gags, you just gotta go with it.
That's fine. It's all good.
Like, for me, my whole thing is, I mean, I it's probably not the
best Mario Kart game but I think the best Murr, I quote, unquote,
think the best Mario Kart game is the first one but really, I
mean 8 is the best one like You really look at it.
Like telling this Nest version is very hard today, especially,
if you did not grow up with that like really, oh, I just got.
Yeah, I just think I have so much Nostalgia for me.
It's just like jumps up all these seats.
It is that fair? Probably not.
But here I am. Whatever it is what it is.
All right. Let's talk wrestling man.
Because there are a decent amount of wrestling games by THQ
Aki. The companies that the put a lot
of these games together on the Nintendo 64, not all of them,
but most of the ones that you would think of one of my
favorite games of all time is WWF.
No, mercy. I think that is like the
Pinnacle of wrestling games. Almost pretty much of all time.
So I'm always comparing wrestling games to that.
It was the one that I died at the time.
I think it costs, 80 or $90 for the cartridge and that was one
of the games. Like you were saying similarly
we're your parents. Wouldn't you know, want you to
sit in front of the TV or have like certain rules when you're a
certain age? They Want me to buy wrestling
game. So they said, if you really want
to, you need to get the money for that and to get together 80
or $90 when your whole the site the time, maybe 13.
Maybe when I came out, roughly around there like that, it's not
easy. You know, how many, how many
loonies I found on the on the school in the school parking lot
but whatever. I put it together and I got that
game and I loved it but there's a lot of choice out there and
this WCW, I guess there's a pair work.
I played a little bit of both but World Tour and revenge are,
you know, the predecessor in the sequel.
But revenge is mostly what we're talking about here.
Because I will say right now that if you compare, the two
revenge is the go-to, it's got to be like, it's just it just
improves on everything that World Tour was.
Whether it's the music, whether it's the way, the characters
look, whether it is the ring, what characters are in.
It also changes obviously because it's like a year later.
So the roster changes, So you said, you played this a lot WCW
NWO Revenge, you know, what was this?
I guess it was over at your friend's place where you doing
lots of the multiplayer action. I guess that's pretty much what
it was. That's basically all we played
but just multiplayer tag, team played, I would sometimes like
myself, clear the cruiserweight ones because I knew all those
guys, I was one of the big reasons I want to play that nice
but like, for me, it just was it was interesting to go back and
look at the history of WWE. You see W and just kind of go
back to that time when there wasn't the Monday night Wars,
for a couple of years there because I remember watching
Monday, Nitro a lot. My, my dad was really into
wrestling but like not in like a not in like a way where he would
take me to wrestlemanias and stuff.
It just was like, interested in it.
Yeah. And II was like, I was like
doing research, you got me down a rabbit hole when you a great
come on this episode. Hey, I did the same thing I did.
Did a lot of research and like it was really interesting about
like Nintendo's own relationship with wrestling because there's a
lot of exclusive wrestling games on not only the N64 but also the
GameCube to had four or five WWE.
I guess at the time. Yeah, whines on.
Just for the GameCube exclusive, which is yeah, pretty crazy to
me. I remember when we were doing
those episodes, I was, I was pretty surprised and yeah,
looking at the NCC for when we have no World Tour, we have wars
Zone. We have Revenge.
Obviously we have attitude attitude.
Nitro Mayhem backstage, assault Wrestlemania 2000.
No mercy. And most of those were actually
exclusive to. Yeah yeah, yeah, pretty quietly.
Yeah. And I was like, looking, I'm
like why like, why was this? Yeah.
And, and from what I could find, one of the big reasons was that
Nintendo consoles had such a large user base among younger,
kind of children and teenagers, which was the demographic for
wrestling games and wrestling in.
Earl and 64. In particular had just such a
large library of these kind of like family friendly games
almost and it was very appealing.
I guess the Publishers who wanted to have wrestling games
targeted towards that kind of audience I guess.
So just the control scheme like having exactly that.
That controller even though it's a weird-ass controller for three
hand, and the people, it actually worked really well for
the kind of like Combos and almost Button Mash and that you
would end up having to do. It's amazing how Well, it works
because like I think the intuition is for most people I
would say it's like oh it's got a joystick and I'm going to put
my hand on the joystick but really you're playing with the
d-pad, right? Yeah, I default to that because
I'm just so used to it from when I was younger.
So like it's fine for me to pick up this game and be like, Oh,
I'm just going to use the d-pad because I just assumed that's
what the controls were. Even though, I think I have, I
had very, very little experience with the WCW games.
But I knew that it was made by the same company as the ones
that I loved from. Wrestlemania 2000 and no mercy.
And I'm like, well, I'm just gonna, I'm just pick it up.
I'm gonna play the d-pad and like Gap.
Boom, jump in and that's it. But so easy.
It's so easy and it rocks. And I think you're right.
Actually, I wanted to touch on the point where you're like, the
Publishers wanted to make sure like this was the console that
they were sort of gearing for or shooting for.
And just the fact that there are four controllers, just the fact
that you have tag teams you know every week competing, it's a
perfect. Excuse to have four players, and
four people sitting and playing your game.
It doesn't matter if they all own the game or they all, or
just one of them does, like, you can go and have a good time
regardless. Because there's always, it is
always a way to have all four controllers involved if you
wanted to. So I think that's in itself
completely works. So this is, it's huge.
Yeah, did you have you said you recognized a lot of the
characters? A lot of them were wrestlers was
their go-to or a couple of go twos Of course.
So yeah, I kind of had different go to use depending on what you
know, Clay and I guess we were in I guess you could say because
there's sixty three characters. I think in this game, that's one
of the things that blew my mind as a kid was, it's really wild.
You have to remember I had just come from playing Smash Bros and
C4 which at the time had nothing.
Yeah. So I was like, that's a lot.
Like and then you go to this, which is just stupid the amount
of People in this like and and even though today, I'm looking
at the list, I'm like, oh my God, it's like the name drops
her crazy because you kind of forget who WCW had the time.
Yeah, this is we're kind of all over the place too, and of
course, the NWO stuff that was going on.
But for me, I would always do how come Hollywood Hogan and the
time, because I just, I knew him from watching old wrestling
videos that my dad had. He was a big Hulk Hogan fan.
He loved Andre the Giant as well.
So he has like the, the WrestleMania whatever.
That was when he like opens slams, not one.
I thought was just like they might be one.
That's gonna say, I think, actually, it's well.
And so I always really liked Hulk Hogan growing up and I had
my little Hulk Hogan action figures.
I was a big fan of the Big Show as well.
Yes, picture was so good. Usually, they're taking on the
Andre, the Giant Persona almost is the Giant in this game.
Yeah, Macho Man. Randy Savage.
Again, all goes back to Hawk Hogan with their kind of view
that they were having. In.
I forget the whole thing but he became Hollywood because he was
like, fighting really? I don't know.
I don't know, thinks. I mean this is, is it really
matter? I mean, it's like, we gotta make
Hogan bad, I do know some of the rabbit hole that I went down.
Obviously, this is less about the game than it is about, just
what happened was that? Like they asked sting to be him
essentially. So either the company wanted to
pick, either him or sting to be, they offered it to either them,
to be the bad guy, to be NWO, essentially, or the Leader of
NWO and sting said, no, he's like hell, no, I'm not doing
that. So it's kind of strange feel
like it would, it would yeah. Suit him a little bit, but it is
interesting that I think it's more interesting than when you
really think about it. That Hogan did it because he was
always for 15 years leading up to that point the, like the good
guy like he is, you know, eat your Wheaties, good guy, Hulk
Hogan, right? And then all of a sudden, he
just turns It's so the exact storyline reason.
I can't pinpoint. Exactly why.
But he just, I mean that's usually what happens when
there's like a heel turn like unless someone I don't know
punches you in the face it's like I just I'm just going to be
bad guy because F this but that's fine.
It's mid 90s, it's fine. The one character that I also
played as for because those are all NWO ones I was mentioning
there. Yeah.
CW CW one that I played as the most is definitely Diamond
Dallas Page do yeah. He be only because he was
actually one of the cheapest ones you could use because he
had three different versions of his Diamond Cutter.
Oh, I didn't know that our fault.
Yeah, crazy, huh? That's awesome.
Yeah, that's, that's the other thing with these with these
games, all of them really is that the finishers were always a
ton of fun, you know, I think the sort of energy bar, or
Spirit bar, depending on, which one you're playing at.
Yeah, yeah. I think the We have funds were
energy and then this one was Spirit like, yeah, but every
time they did it like I put, so I played both, I played World
Tour and played Revenge. Definitely spent more time in
Revenge for sure. Just because it just felt better
like some of the moves, like even even like simple ones like
Hogan's big boot or a choke slam or whatever felt like a little
bit off and World Tour and then just like, you know, 11 months
later when this game came out, they really like fine-tuned all
the animations Everything was much more accurate and like, oh,
wow, this is automatically, I felt like my first match.
I just played, who did I play as?
Oh, Rey Mysterio jr. Which by the way, Rey Mysterio.
So hell yeah. I'm going to just do that.
I love us. I always loved the high-flying
characters in these games are just all the WCW for ones.
I believe they were. Yeah.
And that Clump. Exactly.
Yeah, so I was like, oh, I'm gonna try him and recognized
probably a couple of his moves from you know, later, WWE WWF.
Stuff. But that match lasted like three
minutes. I just played some random kind
of this whatever. But the like all the moves felt
better my automatically like. Wow, this is just a whole other
thing. So the the the funny part I
think I played at one point against, I remember what
Guerreros kid's name was. So it's, it's not Eddie jr.
Is it? No, no.
It's I literally had it up here. Oh yeah.
Chavo Chavo Chavo. Chavo Guerrero.
Yeah, so he walks out with a t-shirt that says, my favorite
wrestlers Eddie Guerrero. Yeah.
This is amazing. I don't remember if that was
actually a shirt that they wore anyone War like this alert, so I
didn't recognize him when he first walked out of.
Like, that's a great t-shirt and then the name popped up on the
bottom, I'm like, this is genius, I love it, so funny.
So yeah, so how did it feel playing the game?
Like now like, dude I know we sort of said, like, you know,
the controls work and everything but did it feel Feel like it
made sense, and if L feel good to kind of go back to it, this
many years later, honestly, it did.
And that was really surprising to me.
I was like, kind of because it was one of those things that I
had a bunch of friends. I remember going to University,
and one of the things we were talking about was games,
obviously, and one of those like ones that you would always bring
up, would be like WCW, like Griffin's.
Like that's like, the game. And like, it's so good and you
just like, kind of like, keep that going.
Right? And without planning it, because
you're just in your head, you're like, it's a great game.
I don't want to spoil it and because sometimes, you think
these games are great, you go back and like, oh yeah, this is
terrible. 100% 100%. But this was the seamlessness of
the controls was the biggest thing for me that I was like,
wow. Like this is, this is so easy to
just pick up and play and I find a lot of these.
Even the GameCube games that I would go back to.
I had to like, go into the settings and modify everything.
So, try and get myself Myself in the zones.
Like play it like a lot of shooters for GameCube error, for
example, all use, I forget, I think it's called like the south
paw control scheme where it's like, you are moving the wrong.
It's like the c-stick is the one that's moving the camera and
yeah not moving you. Yeah.
It just like it's all reversed, right?
Yeah. He's Call of Duty based in
revolutionize, the entire thing, right?
And I was kind of waiting for this for for revenge and I was
like oh wow like I know exactly what to do the d-pad.
Like yes, like so good on here. R and L do Same thing.
It's just like everything's yeah.
And it was, it was weird. The muscle memory like clicked
right away. I had so much fun playing it the
world. Like the one thing that I
actually didn't remember. Yeah, not being in there was
commentators. There is no commentators.
I forgot that. Yeah, it doesn't have
commentating. It doesn't have it.
Yeah, because I think no mercy. Does it does not, it does mercy.
Does not know. So, that's the other thing I was
sort of looking. Does I forget which one?
I don't remember for Wrestlemania.
Does World Tour did not? But there might be or is there's
one with j.r. and I was like oh my God like right.
Like this is why I like playing wrestling came to.
Yeah, here today. Are you scream?
Yeah, I know it's tough. Yeah.
I know. Know know, yeah, 2000 might have
it but but no mercy didn't. So that's the thing, I kept
comparing things to No Mercy which I, you know, again is to
me is like the Pinnacle one. So it's sort of a hard
comparison also came out like three years two years after this
one. So it's Of course, they're going
to advance it but I was a little disappointed but again compared
to No Mercy but like the sort of like quote-unquote story or
Championship modes are just like match after match after match
whereas with no mercy. It's literally like like a
timeline where if you win you go left, if you lose you go, right?
And it just goes back and forth and it's like this story that
you can unlock depending on how you do and who you face and you
know there's all these different matches that are thrown into it.
There's like quote-unquote cut scenes where the guys are
chirping, each other and like, all that stuff is so awesome and
it changes when you win a championship, the next time you
go in, if you want to play as someone else, you can fight the
person that you just want. As, or you can go and the story
resets itself as the champion. So there's like multiple layers
to it. So I expected like, like, maybe
some cutscenes here and there, between little bit of dialogue,
but really, it's just like guy after guy.
After guy comes out and whatever.
It's funny because it just keeps going like that.
That's, there's nothing wrong with that, but but I was like,
oh, I wish there was just like a little bit more, because there's
also no character creator to, which kind of kind of sucks in a
wrestling game. That's, that's huge, I find, but
it's also hard to give them too hard of a time because of when
this game came out and what they're capable of fitting onto
this cartridge. So I you have to perfect the art
a little bit, I think until you get there.
So I'm not going to, I'm not like Pissed about it.
I just didn't notice the difference I guess is what I'm
saying. Now, it's fair and I think no
mercy is very much a product of what WWF was trying to do, which
was the focus on the storyline. Yeah, we're WCW was always
about, just like the raw, I like Talent, the rods just like
fighting each other, which they always said during the show's.
It's like, we're the best. And like, well yeah, their ass.
And yeah, and you, you do feel that like compared to No Mercy,
I think. At least at the multiplayer is
still better. And Friends.
There is no mercy. Yeah, because it just like, it's
that pick-up-and-play, it's that the fluidness of it.
It's hard to. Like I was trying to think,
like, I'm like, how can I word this properly, because anything
like what makes this actually better, but I just think the
fluidness of it. The fact that you have like
everyone in this roster here. Yeah, the fact that like, for
me, a big thing was, was going, you know, to my friend's house
when I was like, eight years old, picking this up and playing
it and never, having to having played a wrestling game or
something before this, and I think that's a huge Thing.
Yeah, with this game is the fact that you could have like your
little cousin come over and play this game and have a fun time.
It's an ease of use thing, like it is, and it's a great game
where it's easy to learn and also, you know, hard to master,
right? Yeah.
And it gives that that level of difficulty where it's okay.
Well, you know, I could like screw around in the ring and I
do some fun like high-flying acts and I can go and like grab
stuff from outside the ring and hit people with it's like
whatever. That's the fun stuff that I can
just like fool around with ya. Then there's like the other
level of like, okay, like I can actually get pretty good with
these characters. I can get these combos down, I
can get their moves. I, they actually all have a lot
of different moves. Yes.
And finishers to, there's a huge and again, 60 characters.
And they all have like, so many different moves.
You're probably thinking of like 300 developed moves at this
point that have to go into this game.
So a lot of effort was spent on actually, making them pretty
true to themselves to. Yes.
And that was like, for the time The 98 like that's crazy.
Yeah. It is it really is like it's
like wrestling in any form. A lot of it is the outrageous
personalities. If you don't have that with
voiceover which they didn't or couldn't do what the game or a
series of these games, you got to do that in some other way.
Whether it's the way they look the way they move all of that
stuff like has to add up to that not only so you know who you are
you can recognize them play your favorite wrestler and everything
but like just all of that sort of And together is great.
I think you're right. I think a lot of that goes a
long way in the presentation. Like, it doesn't mean that it's
perfect, but it's like, it's it has that feeling to it and it's
hard to pinpoint exactly what it is.
But it's definitely there in this game.
And I wasn't the largest WCW Watcher or fan at the time when
this game particular came out. But just as this was coming out
in just after is, when I started watching wrestling and being You
know, huge fan of the rock and all that kind of stuff like that
was. That's that's what I what I
loved. So also the way the game looks
and feels is a big part as a career just saying, but the
graphics are something for sure that you wanted to mention
because I like it's a huge jump in one year it is and it's like
you know if anyone's listening this and they were watching like
footage or they like look back on this game.
Like, you know, 25 years old. So yeah, it looks rough 25 years
later but at the time this was crazy.
This was so realistic compared to other wrestling games over
out there. Yeah, like World Tour.
I'm talking about revenge, so World Tour, which is just a
year. I think you said the 11 months,
but 11 months November, and then October, it's like what?
And it's just like, yeah, the faces are like melting like
ride. It look like like like crappy
action figures. So honestly, there was a couple
guys Like like even like someone like Ric Flair who is like very
obviously Ric Flair just look like you know they just smudged
something on the screen and we're just like sure he's got
white blond hair, let's back that he's wearing tights.
Sure let's say he's Ric Flair. Yeah, I mean the moves made
sense in both in World Tour, he's not in Revenge but and what
the moves that made sense, the music can set all that stuff but
like unless you knew who Ric Flair was like you were just
playing some guy. Yeah, 100%.
Yeah and that's what's another the crazy thing is the fact that
they were able to develop the graphics in less than a year to
really stand out and and you like like looking at it again it
looks a little rough but you know who everyone is.
Yeah. Well, not like as soon as you
see it as even in the ring, you know, immediately you're like
okay but like I know who that is.
I know that's DDP like I yes I know that's that's how can I
know? That's a Ray Mysterio.
Like it's yeah, it's easy to kind of Point these guys out and
even like And there's even like a bit more complicated ones.
Like Sting, you know, he's gonna have all his makeup and stuff on
or like, no Burgers. Like this.
Like, I don't like there's, there's, there's a lot of effort
that to have to go into this, especially with the costumes to
everyone has, at least two, or maybe three, gosh, thanks.
I think to 24 is the at, like, I think it's for, because it's
like, some of them are just color changes, and okay, that's
fine. You know, a lot of the
characters in real life. They did not necessarily change
all that much. But like, you know, a couple of
them have a jacket on A couple of them don't, you know, it's,
but you can also go ahead and so big one.
Like, that's the one. I think.
I've, right, where the his yellow jumpsuit, you know, his
tights or whatever that he had at like that.
That's this iconic. Look, which is classic
Hulkamania look. Yeah, yeah, exactly.
So, and I think that was the look, I picked every single time
I played as I know, that's the thing.
I always have. Go choose for certain
characters, so I'm like, no, I like this one.
No, I like this one. I know that somebody typically
were, but I don't care. I like this one.
I'd same thing with no mercy. I did the same thing all the
time. I was just like yeah you know if
I played a stone-cold I had the best on every time as opposed to
going with our statites or have to have them that they have to
have the knee brace. Like he just you had to have
that on right? Like for what reason, I don't
know, just because that's what I thought I recognized.
Yeah. And and and all of that though
like its true, like everything looks very polygonal and
pixelated and you know, all of that, sort of chunky, like
everyone's very chunky, you know, especially if you're a
bigger guy like Goldberg Hogan, you know, giant like Big Show.
All these guys Nash like all these guys look very look, like
like, literally like a, like a polygon or a, you know, just a
square, just sort of piled on top of each other or whatever.
But it's okay. Like it just, it gives them a
distinct look and makes them look big and buff and sort of,
in their character and it again, they get all those little
details. Right?
Sure. They're pixelated, you know,
Goldbergs tattoos on his arms and stuff like, yeah, they just
look like Like sort of black polygons and black pixels and
everything but like you know it's Goldberg because it just
yeah stands like them. He looks like them his face in
Revenge looks a lot more like him.
So it's all of that stuff is super fun night.
I love these red like these wrestling games in general.
Are just I like that they're not perfect with the way that they
look honestly. Like, I think that there's like
a personality to that and as like a little bit of a charm to
it, you know, that imperfection is something.
That there's something there. I don't know what it is.
I know what the word is, but there's something there.
Yeah, no, no charm. Charm is the word for this game.
I think as a whole it's you can't not have fun playing it.
Like you're never going to have a bad time picking this game up
no matter what mode you pick. If there's there's the Monday
Night Raw obviously and they're sold out.
There's superbrawl bash the beach.
How is the beach? - the beach is a fun one.
They're all fun and like honey. Yeah, but it's just a fun game,
and it's honestly, just looking a wholesome good time for
wrestling. Yeah, it's seriously.
As it's like, I think it makes it so good as well, thinking of
it today because wrestling games kind of suck.
Now, I am absolutely sad. It's really hard to get a good
one, man. It really is.
It is, and it's, you know, some people kind of say they're like,
well, you know this, Game is so good because it was, you know,
very Arcadia, the time. And that's like what you kind of
like to play when it's the arcade Enos of wrestling because
that's what wrestling kind of is.
Yeah. But I would kind of disagree
with that because this game doesn't go fully that arkady
sense. I'm just like you bash people
and they fall down and like it just gonna go flying off the
mat. Yeah, there's like I was saying
before their skill in it, there's massive that you have to
get into this case. There's timing and everything to
like, reversals and blocking and all those, that's all timing,
it's all about and Sort of managing like where you going to
do your damage to the guy's head is arm as leg, like all those
little things, it's easy to it can be easier or easy ish to
just stumble upon that. But, that's a good thing, you
know, he's do that by accident, like, oh, he's holding his head
now because I did a few, you know, clothes lines or whatever
it might be or Capaldi DTS or sounds like, oh, okay.
Now, I understand that. I could, I wonder if I could do
that to the guys leg next match and like, I think that's great.
I think, you know, there's a visual aspect to that At that
it's instant understanding. Like you said, if you've never
played this before or a game like this, boom, you got it.
You look, you can get it in 5 minutes honestly.
Yeah, which is great. And it's a big thing to look for
me. When I was a kid playing this,
like I had played Street Fighter and like, Soul Calibur.
And honestly, most of those games, I just Button Mash, I
kind of need some combos, but it was mostly button mashing.
And this like, going back to it again like this this week and
playing it. I was like Like yeah, I actually
know how to use these controls. Like I don't have this is a
Button Mash like meets it and I remember what I'm doing here,
that's a cool. There's a there's a sense of
Pride with that to that. Yeah.
It's like oh, what I'm doing is actually like in, like like
inflicting and like changing what's going on on-screen
instead of just like, mashing building.
Oh, something happened. He's down.
Yeah. And there's something magic
about that playing multiplayer, too.
Because like I think I bet if me and you sat down and person and
played a one-on-one in this, like we're playing We would be
playing this mental game with each other of like what move
should I do next and everything? I know that's a fighting game in
general, like I get that but like there's something about it
with these because there's something about the way that you
grapple when you're going to time to punch or kick when you
might run, if you're gonna, you know, turn the guy around, if
you're going to him, when he's on the ground, like, all those
little things that come into play and again, yes, fighting
games have all aspects of that in different ways, but like, I
remember playing Lane this game obvious for me was more so 2000
and no mercy. But games like this, which very,
very similar controls if not exactly the same which by the
way, this is what perfected it. So you're not going to get no
mercy, which I love without this game.
So revenge is, is the, is this the predecessor without this,
you get none of that playing against people and it being
intense without us. Actually, like, saying really
anything to each other because we were just showing Do it.
And I feel like if we sat down and did it would be the same
thing they'd be like, yeah, yeah.
Fuck you. I got together.
All right. No.
Don't hold your head already know.
Yeah. Submit know every time.
Yeah. It's pretty silly.
Meanwhile the palming it that's that was the trick upon the the
joystick. You would get a faster.
Yeah. So there you go.
Little trick. If I don't speak it, This game
up just mess around with a joystick while you're on the
ground. If you're like, if it's one of
those long 15-minute matches which in these games is like
pretty long. That's that's, you gotta do.
Yeah. I was surprised at how quick
some of the match. I felt like a lot was happening.
Then the match was over like, oh, that was only six minutes so
crazy. Okay.
But it's fun because because that that that flow like you
were sort of explaining before is there from start to finish.
So it's a pretty, it's pretty solid in that way.
So I like that. Anything we've missed about the
game or games. I don't know.
Look we got it. We got most of the time most of
it like you you kind of mentioned the Cons with the fact
that the championship wasn't great in terms of just fighting
everyone. It's fun.
It just doesn't. Yeah that's all yeah that's all
that was one of my cards I had here too.
Yeah I this was just because I played Hogan a lot.
I always wished Hogan's finishing move is the leg drop
and some his little poke in the eye thing.
Yeah. That was a bit of A letdown for
me because I really liked him growing up.
Yeah, and the commentators, like I said, I wish this game just
had commentating, but, you know, no games really had that kind of
voice over at the time, so I get it.
Yeah. And even then it would probably
pretty minimal and be pretty repetitive after a while maybe
when we were younger. We wouldn't really care.
But like, what would they fit in there?
Like 25 lines and like, that was at sure, that's a good point.
So it's good point. So it's fine and them.
You know what? Oh, that's the other thing
before you even start any matches, I don't know if you
were if you re watch the intro. Of course, I did.
What in Joan. It is.
Okay, so literally because I like, yeah, because it's it's I
mean I love the No Mercy one. I love that song.
I Love The Way They sort of. Like everything's so sort of
Dynamics and like, oh I I'm curious I do not remember the
Revenge one at all. I'm gonna I'm gonna watch this I
sat there. This thing is over five minutes
long, it is so long. It's a weird intro to because
like at the intro, the intro because it's like this pickup
truck. Coming along from Atlanta and
it's I don't who's driving it. But I know that's thing is
they're saying is there with with a burning barrels and yeah.
Yeah, like what? And then just so good and then
it goes for another four minutes.
It's a crazy Sizzle reel. Yeah, it's awesome.
It has like so many it goes on for so long because like show
all these different moves and whatever.
And I'm not saying this is like a - it's just, it's cool.
How they put such a big thing together and really try to like,
hype it up and whatever, and then they, then they show like
NWO. And then they show the different
WCW guys. And, you know, I think they're
trying to sort of like show the story a little bit.
Yeah. And then at the end you just get
like the freeze frame of Hogan and sting he's looking at each
other like oh I want to see Them just like punch each other or
something. But yeah it's but it's cool.
The music was fun. Yeah yeah.
Yeah. Just get you thinking to get you
to play it. Yeah, but it's like I know that
I know that. No mercy.
One is at least a few minutes long.
Maybe it is. Also five minutes, I don't know,
but I was sitting there going like, this is, yeah, that's
pumping me up. I'm good?
Yeah, let's go for it and then I looked at it.
I was like, holy shit. That was almost six minutes ago.
And I saw that, that truck come down the road.
Like, holy shit. It was good though, man.
I love it. They're having fun.
That to, right? Like that's the thing, like, you
could tell that the developers are just like, all right, we're
just gonna, we're gonna crush it with this video.
We're just going to put some awesome like rock sort of.
I don't even know what you would describe that kind of music
really, just get all. Yeah, yeah, a new metal.
It's probably what it is. Yeah, Nu metal with no lyrics.
Yeah, it's essentially what it is.
All right? So WCW games, I would say, if,
if you have World Tour, Lying around or C copy of it.
You'll have fun. But honestly if you have a 64 in
you want to pick up either of the of these to WCW NWO games
just search for Revenge. Instead I would say I think
that's that's the way to go and every aspect of the game.
I think it's just an improvement so it's worth the extra couple
bucks. It's worth the clearly legal
download. It's worth the going to search
for it in your parents attic. Like whatever revenge is
awesome. So Matt, thanks for suggesting
the game. These, these were only somewhat
on my radar of like, oh, I got to place a wrestling games
mainly because I just want to play, No Mercy, which is sitting
behind me on the Shelf, but I could do that anytime and
whatever's, but it was fun to go back and play this.
So as I've done with other episodes, thanks for suggesting
these games. Thanks for suggesting Revenge
was awesome to go back to it. Yeah, of course.
I mean, I love to go back to WCW in that time, it was, you know,
it's a very much a time capsule for me.
So yes. It's good to Play It Again.
Awesome! Awesome!
Alright, so one more time, if you're listening to this before
the spring comes around with 2023 or after we check your
podcast feed. Where is everyone finding your
new stuff? As well as the GameCube was cool
podcast, which wrapped up in 2022.
Where's the new stuff going to be found and slow going to be
found on Spotify, on Apple podcast on everything.
If you search, the GameCube was cool.
Even in the distant future, you'll still find us.
So there's no problem there. So just search the game, keep
his cool. You'll The old GameCube episodes
and you'll find some new stuff that we're doing.
So yeah, pretty excited. Amazing.
Well, thanks for coming on the show, man.
And thank you, I'll be sure to come you back.
Come, get you back on considering you don't hate the
N64. From what I was told from your
co-host that, oh my God, I was so it's all good.
So, thanks for coming on the show, man.
Will talk to you soon and happy wrestling.
I appreciate it. Thanks Dave.
Thanks again for joining me on. Remember, 64 level 21 is now
behind us. We all have some wrestling
titles under our belts, or they are our belts, or we've won the
belt. Something well belts and
championships is in there somewhere.
Either way, thanks again for listening to the show.
Always feel free to give us a rating and let us know what you
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