1 00:00:00,440 --> 00:00:02,960 If you're trying to gain speed, we're going to cover some really 2 00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:05,640 good topics today. We're talking speed gains today. 3 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:08,360 Things like how do you speed sticks? 4 00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:11,560 What is the ideal speed training session look like? 5 00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:15,000 What are the key determining factors of if you have speed or 6 00:00:15,000 --> 00:00:16,920 not? And what are some, you know, 7 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:19,480 speed journeys that you might expect to be going through? 8 00:00:19,480 --> 00:00:22,360 I'm going to share some of what I've been learning and we have 9 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:25,640 an awesome guest, doctor Alex Ehlert today. 10 00:00:25,640 --> 00:00:28,920 He is spent a long time researching and looking at 11 00:00:28,920 --> 00:00:32,320 speed, fit, fitness, the body, how all these correlate 12 00:00:32,320 --> 00:00:34,200 together. We had a great conversation. 13 00:00:34,200 --> 00:00:37,280 He is awesome to follow on Instagram is always pulling out 14 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:40,920 these interesting insights and ideas that are research back 15 00:00:40,920 --> 00:00:43,360 data back. So love to follow that. 16 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:45,080 Yeah, let's get let's get right into it. 17 00:00:45,080 --> 00:00:48,800 Let's let's talk about speed. OK, so well, I sent over the a 18 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:51,800 video and kind of have told you a little bit about my speed 19 00:00:51,800 --> 00:00:54,560 journey. So I guess like what things have 20 00:00:54,560 --> 00:00:58,960 I left on the table that I could try or what do you think are 21 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:02,200 like some of what you've been seeing with with distance gains 22 00:01:02,200 --> 00:01:05,519 that that you would want to ask or learn about to see if for 23 00:01:05,519 --> 00:01:08,720 maxing it out? Yeah, First off, there's a lot I 24 00:01:08,720 --> 00:01:11,280 liked in there. So you kind of brought up a lot 25 00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:15,440 of the ways that you kind of explore different strategies and 26 00:01:15,440 --> 00:01:18,000 you're using feedback to kind of drive that prosper. 27 00:01:18,120 --> 00:01:20,960 Designing sessions where the feedbacks help pushing you in 28 00:01:20,960 --> 00:01:23,520 the direction you want is such a powerful tool when it comes to 29 00:01:23,520 --> 00:01:25,560 speed training. I don't think many people 30 00:01:25,560 --> 00:01:27,880 appreciate how much of a skill it is. 31 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:30,840 It's not just a matter of you can't just out effort it 32 00:01:30,840 --> 00:01:32,880 completely. There's a degree if you have to 33 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:35,520 learn how to coordinate at faster speeds than you're used 34 00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:39,600 to and build the skill of using your body efficiently and 35 00:01:39,720 --> 00:01:42,240 reaching that point of being slightly uncomfortable, but 36 00:01:42,240 --> 00:01:45,680 learning how to coordinate over time, there's this kind of like 37 00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:48,160 skillful expression of what you have. 38 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:51,400 I think you did a really good job of kind of dialing that in 39 00:01:51,400 --> 00:01:55,720 of I kind of view it as a guided exploration of movement in a way 40 00:01:55,760 --> 00:01:58,040 when you're talking about these kind of speed training sessions. 41 00:01:58,040 --> 00:02:01,160 But it may also explain why even though you weren't training 42 00:02:01,240 --> 00:02:04,560 really frequently, you were still making gains because just 43 00:02:04,640 --> 00:02:07,520 you're giving yourself opportunities to learn what 44 00:02:07,520 --> 00:02:11,320 works for you, learn ways that kind of help you move that 45 00:02:11,320 --> 00:02:13,760 needle in the right direction from a speed perspective. 46 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:17,200 But then you even acknowledge some of the maybe potential 47 00:02:17,200 --> 00:02:20,280 limitations in your video of you weren't really focused on the 48 00:02:20,440 --> 00:02:24,280 fitness side quite as much. You didn't dip as much into the 49 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:27,760 kind of consistent speed training sessions where you're 50 00:02:27,760 --> 00:02:29,960 really trying to maximize everything with kind of 51 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:32,400 consistent exposure to that high speed. 52 00:02:32,480 --> 00:02:36,400 And then some of the tools like speed sticks, which I think are 53 00:02:36,400 --> 00:02:40,400 not the only way to gain speed, but in my opinion can be a very 54 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:43,560 useful tool, both from like a technical standpoint, but also 55 00:02:43,560 --> 00:02:46,680 just a way of forcing you to have to move faster than you're 56 00:02:46,680 --> 00:02:50,280 used to and some of the kind of processes that come along with 57 00:02:50,280 --> 00:02:52,080 that. So yeah, I think there's 58 00:02:52,280 --> 00:02:54,720 definitely a few opportunities and the fact that you were able 59 00:02:54,720 --> 00:02:59,160 to get to 180 plus with with kind of the bare minimum of, 60 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:02,000 hey, I've got a driver and I've got some feedback and let's get 61 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:03,800 after it. Like that's obviously a really 62 00:03:03,800 --> 00:03:08,400 good start, but excited to keep tabs on the the 190 mile per 63 00:03:08,400 --> 00:03:11,080 hour. Well, I, OK, I want to get to 64 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:14,400 speed sticks. I want to get to some of your 65 00:03:14,400 --> 00:03:17,600 research recommendations. But I guess maybe just for 66 00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:20,200 context, I'd be curious, like is anything come to mind when I 67 00:03:20,200 --> 00:03:24,760 ask, like what's the best story or like case study you've had of 68 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:27,880 someone that you have seen gain speed? 69 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:30,000 Does anything come to mind of like, hey, this person started 70 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:32,680 here, they did this, this and this, and then two years later 71 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:35,000 they got to this or anything. Does anything come to mind? 72 00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:38,880 Yeah, there's a few I'd save myself as a really interesting 73 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:42,560 case study to start with. So for some kind of context, I 74 00:03:42,560 --> 00:03:45,800 was a Division One college golfer, a kind of a failed 75 00:03:45,800 --> 00:03:49,000 aspiring tour pro. Wanted to turn professional and 76 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:51,280 play 1. Compete for a living. 77 00:03:51,320 --> 00:03:54,920 Realized pretty quickly that my game wasn't there so decide grad 78 00:03:54,920 --> 00:03:57,000 school is a better route and kind of fell in love with 79 00:03:57,160 --> 00:03:59,920 learning about how high performers do what they do. 80 00:03:59,920 --> 00:04:04,000 So went on to kind of the exercise Physiology piece first 81 00:04:04,000 --> 00:04:06,760 thinking I'll learn about kind of the fitness side. 82 00:04:06,760 --> 00:04:09,640 And then over the years it's kind of expanded a bit to some 83 00:04:09,640 --> 00:04:12,960 of the bio mechanics and using data and technology to help that 84 00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:15,480 process. But I essentially started 85 00:04:15,480 --> 00:04:18,560 working out a lot just as kind of an experiment to see I'm 86 00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:22,000 learning all these things after I can stop competing and through 87 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:24,600 a lot of trial and error and kind of playing around with 88 00:04:24,600 --> 00:04:27,080 different strategies. First, from kind of a gym based 89 00:04:27,160 --> 00:04:31,440 perspective, I did slowly gain probably about 8 to 10 miles an 90 00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:34,280 hour of speed. I didn't do a whole lot of kind 91 00:04:34,280 --> 00:04:37,400 of formal speed training in the way I would now, but there were 92 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:40,320 some I'm going to go out and swing really hard once in a 93 00:04:40,320 --> 00:04:42,640 while and see where I'm at. Then I essentially just burnt 94 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:45,720 out from golf and I've been doing a lot of research working 95 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:48,080 with golfers. I'm still in the golf space for 96 00:04:48,080 --> 00:04:51,880 the last 10-12 years or so, but played and practiced very little 97 00:04:51,880 --> 00:04:54,320 myself. And it was probably the last 98 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:57,480 year when I kind of got the bug to see like, I wonder what my 99 00:04:57,480 --> 00:05:02,520 speeds AT and I was swinging something like 1/13, 1:14, but 100 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:05,760 had the physical tools in place where I'd been working out 101 00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:08,840 consistently. I knew a lot about what my swing 102 00:05:08,840 --> 00:05:11,840 needed to look like to swing faster just from studying the 103 00:05:11,840 --> 00:05:15,240 bio mechanics and occasionally using myself as kind of a 104 00:05:15,560 --> 00:05:17,880 example of how I'd analyze a golf swing. 105 00:05:17,920 --> 00:05:21,760 And so within about 3-4 months of kind of couple times a week, 106 00:05:21,760 --> 00:05:24,720 some high effort work for speed sticks, some more kind of 107 00:05:24,720 --> 00:05:28,560 technical work, I was able to gain about 12 to 14 miles an 108 00:05:28,560 --> 00:05:32,480 hour swing speed probably over a winter, so November to January 109 00:05:32,480 --> 00:05:34,880 type deal. And then it did slow down from 110 00:05:34,880 --> 00:05:37,040 there. But I was, I'm pretty 111 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:41,200 consistently swinging the 1:20 to high one Tees now when even 112 00:05:41,200 --> 00:05:45,200 at college I was probably a Max out at about 1:11, 1/12. 113 00:05:45,840 --> 00:05:49,720 So that's probably a less common example of someone that 114 00:05:49,720 --> 00:05:52,960 completely took a break from the game, built the physical tools, 115 00:05:52,960 --> 00:05:56,040 but then came back to it and applied that to as kind of a 116 00:05:56,040 --> 00:05:58,800 fresh slate. But more recently, what I see a 117 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:03,480 lot of is especially kind of golfers that are prioritized, 118 00:06:03,480 --> 00:06:07,360 maybe accuracy and distance are very short game specialists that 119 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:09,840 have never really swung fast before. 120 00:06:09,840 --> 00:06:14,200 They'll have this really quick initial gain of four 5-6 miles 121 00:06:14,200 --> 00:06:17,520 an hour within even a couple sessions because for the first 122 00:06:17,520 --> 00:06:21,920 time ever, they allow themselves to take some swings where the 123 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:26,360 goal is just focused on making that speed number go up and not 124 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:29,600 having to worry about also making solid contact and where 125 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:31,840 is the ball going to go. And so they go from this kind of 126 00:06:31,840 --> 00:06:36,360 constrained, maybe very simple and stable swing pattern to 127 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:38,880 suddenly allowing themselves to use the ground a little 128 00:06:38,880 --> 00:06:41,800 differently and rotate a little more and a little faster. 129 00:06:42,200 --> 00:06:44,960 And then they kind of surprise themselves when the number jumps 130 00:06:44,960 --> 00:06:48,280 up within a few seconds sessions and take some of that and apply 131 00:06:48,280 --> 00:06:51,800 it to their own game. So even relatively good golfers, 132 00:06:51,800 --> 00:06:55,520 former college players, a few many tour guys that you know 133 00:06:55,520 --> 00:06:59,040 would start at 1:10 and we'd get them up to 115 fairly quickly. 134 00:06:59,560 --> 00:07:01,080 They're going to plateau from there. 135 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:03,720 It doesn't continue to go up, but there is. 136 00:07:04,480 --> 00:07:08,120 It is fun to see someone that's never really tried to move in a 137 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:12,080 way like that where they kind of glass shattering moment of I 138 00:07:12,080 --> 00:07:15,280 could swing faster if I just leveraged bio mechanics a little 139 00:07:15,280 --> 00:07:18,720 more efficiently. Yeah, no, I think that most of 140 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:22,680 us grew up without ever trying to swing hard. 141 00:07:22,720 --> 00:07:25,680 And so there are immediate gains you can pick up just by trying 142 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:28,120 to do that. But then you're right, that 143 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:31,680 plateau comes and then you have to work through that. 144 00:07:31,720 --> 00:07:34,760 And I'm guessing that's where a lot of your research is, is come 145 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:37,800 into play of like, how do we breakthrough plateaus that 146 00:07:37,800 --> 00:07:40,880 people run into? And so maybe walk through some 147 00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:45,240 of your, you've got some crazy diagrams going that I've seen on 148 00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:47,200 your Instagram. You've got some really good, 149 00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:52,000 really good articles and and your newsletter kind of on speed 150 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:53,000 and stuff that you're doing there. 151 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:55,520 So what path do you want to take us here when? 152 00:07:56,080 --> 00:07:56,400 I. Talk. 153 00:07:56,640 --> 00:07:59,400 Talk to those folks who have hit plateaus because I know in these 154 00:07:59,400 --> 00:08:02,760 days it feels like a lot of people have at least tried to 155 00:08:02,760 --> 00:08:05,920 gain speed. Yeah, I think recently, so for a 156 00:08:05,920 --> 00:08:09,160 long time, I've always been kind of frustrated by, it's not just 157 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:12,880 golf, but a lot of sports, a lot of areas becomes very siloed 158 00:08:12,880 --> 00:08:15,440 over time where you kind of have your fitness specialists, you 159 00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:18,320 have your swing specialists, and that's always going to be the 160 00:08:18,320 --> 00:08:19,960 case. It's hard to be an expert in 161 00:08:19,960 --> 00:08:23,320 everything at once, but I've always kind of gravitated 162 00:08:23,320 --> 00:08:26,080 towards trying to how do we bring these pieces together? 163 00:08:26,680 --> 00:08:29,240 And I have kind of specialties in certain areas. 164 00:08:29,240 --> 00:08:31,920 I'm a certified strength coach. I've done a lot of research in 165 00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:33,280 the strength and conditioning area. 166 00:08:33,280 --> 00:08:37,120 But I realized very quickly that to really maximize performance 167 00:08:37,120 --> 00:08:40,120 or even work with a coach together with a player, I need 168 00:08:40,120 --> 00:08:42,320 to be able to kind of understand their perspective a bit. 169 00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:45,040 So that was kind of when I became interested in speed, I 170 00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:47,920 immediately tried to kind of think about where do all these 171 00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:51,760 pieces fit together? And some of it stems from Sasha 172 00:08:51,760 --> 00:08:55,480 Mckenzie's work as well with he had that paper a few years ago 173 00:08:55,480 --> 00:08:58,760 with like energy transfer to the swing with amateur golfers. 174 00:08:58,760 --> 00:09:02,320 And I started creating kind of my own framework of, of speed 175 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:04,920 from there. But this idea of essentially to 176 00:09:04,920 --> 00:09:08,240 swing faster, you need to do one of a few things and it's you 177 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:10,680 need to perform more work on the club in a way that's going to 178 00:09:10,680 --> 00:09:13,200 accelerate it into the ball with with higher speed. 179 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:16,080 And like from his research, he took it from kind of a work 180 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:18,840 energy perspective of essentially it comes down to 181 00:09:18,840 --> 00:09:22,240 either producing more force or torque to the club during the 182 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:25,960 downswing in a useful way, usually along the hand path. 183 00:09:25,960 --> 00:09:27,440 That's kind of how he describes it. 184 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:30,120 Or you need to create more time or distance to produce that 185 00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:32,280 force. And so that could be creating a 186 00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:35,520 bigger hand path or rotating more, giving yourself more 187 00:09:35,520 --> 00:09:38,920 opportunity to apply more total force or do more work on the 188 00:09:38,920 --> 00:09:43,120 club during that downswing. And So what ends up happening is 189 00:09:43,120 --> 00:09:45,920 there's a few ways you can go about attacking that with the 190 00:09:45,920 --> 00:09:48,280 most direct way being improving your technique. 191 00:09:48,320 --> 00:09:52,120 And so that initial gain a lot of the time is when you have 192 00:09:52,120 --> 00:09:55,600 people that have never swung fast before, they start to allow 193 00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:57,600 themselves to explore different ways of moving. 194 00:09:57,600 --> 00:10:01,720 And you you'll naturally, if you focus all of your efforts on 195 00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:05,040 just making the speed go up and especially if you remove the 196 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:07,560 ball or use something like a foam ball. 197 00:10:07,560 --> 00:10:12,240 Like I know Luke Benoit's been on here kind of shows or your 198 00:10:12,240 --> 00:10:15,160 videos before, but I kind of took that idea from him. 199 00:10:15,160 --> 00:10:19,040 For speed training specifically, you'll notice people start to 200 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:22,600 kind of try to use the ground move a little differently. 201 00:10:22,600 --> 00:10:26,160 And then that feedback kind of allows you to find the movement 202 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:28,920 patterns that work. So a lot of people, especially 203 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:31,920 when they're starting at a low baseline, have never swung fast 204 00:10:31,920 --> 00:10:33,880 before. They'll have that initial spike 205 00:10:33,880 --> 00:10:36,600 within the first few weeks and that's very exciting. 206 00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:39,880 But the reality is there's only so far you can go with those 207 00:10:39,880 --> 00:10:41,720 quick games. From there, it's going to be 208 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:45,280 this more subtle refinements of your technique to get better at 209 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:48,280 applying forces to the club and moving your body in a way that's 210 00:10:48,280 --> 00:10:50,160 going to be biomechanically efficient. 211 00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:53,840 And then there's also going to be the slow, more progressive 212 00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:56,880 adaptations to the body if you approach it from a physical 213 00:10:56,880 --> 00:10:59,080 side. And it's kind of then this more 214 00:10:59,240 --> 00:11:01,800 very subtle improvements. And then you'll have these 215 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:04,280 occasional breakthroughs when it all comes together. 216 00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:08,920 So it becomes much more of a very slow nonlinear up and down, 217 00:11:08,920 --> 00:11:11,480 and then maybe breakthrough for a few miles an hour and then 218 00:11:11,480 --> 00:11:14,600 plateau again. What I tell people is if you 219 00:11:14,600 --> 00:11:18,600 understand where and why that happens, then you can expect it 220 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:21,760 and you're not going to get discouraged when you have this 221 00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:24,760 initial response and then you're going to plateau. 222 00:11:24,760 --> 00:11:27,480 But it's all part of the process as you're kind of gradually 223 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:29,680 building out the pieces to make that next jump. 224 00:11:29,760 --> 00:11:32,760 Yeah, So I love you said we broke it down really simply. 225 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:35,600 There's two ways that you're going to swing faster is 1. 226 00:11:35,600 --> 00:11:39,640 You can apply more force over a longer period of time. 227 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:42,480 I think I got that right. So that that just means like 228 00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:44,880 that longer backswing kind of queue, right? 229 00:11:44,880 --> 00:11:49,200 Like if that's that's why these long drive guys are really large 230 00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:51,200 and their hands are super high, right? 231 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:54,640 And just like way up there and as far back as they can go. 232 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:57,600 And then the other thing if you want to hit it swing faster is 233 00:11:57,600 --> 00:12:00,320 you have to apply more force in the swing, right. 234 00:12:00,360 --> 00:12:04,440 I think most people should start with trying to create a longer 235 00:12:04,440 --> 00:12:06,160 hand path to be able to apply more force. 236 00:12:06,160 --> 00:12:07,560 Right. Like that's such low hanging 237 00:12:07,560 --> 00:12:09,480 fruit for most people. Yeah, absolutely. 238 00:12:09,480 --> 00:12:13,120 And the reality is a lot of the kind of cues or feels that a lot 239 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:16,920 of people kind of use to swing faster will hit one, if not both 240 00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:18,680 of those pieces in different ways. 241 00:12:18,680 --> 00:12:22,680 So like the fast and dynamic backswing occasionally will 242 00:12:22,680 --> 00:12:25,720 allow people to get kind of that bigger hand path, but it's also 243 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:29,000 going to have this secondary advantage of basically allowing 244 00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:31,920 the muscles to be more active as you're kind of changing 245 00:12:31,920 --> 00:12:34,720 direction at the top. So it's very similar. 246 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:36,520 I use the example of vertical jumps. 247 00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:38,920 One of the reasons you jump higher when you allow yourself 248 00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:42,040 to squat down first, especially kind of a quick transition out 249 00:12:42,040 --> 00:12:44,560 of the bottom, is that by forcing yourself to have to 250 00:12:44,560 --> 00:12:47,480 break out of the bottom to kind of decelerate before you re 251 00:12:47,480 --> 00:12:50,960 accelerate up, your muscles have to start activating sooner. 252 00:12:50,960 --> 00:12:53,920 And it kind of takes some of the slack at perhaps those kind of 253 00:12:53,920 --> 00:12:57,280 contractile machinery so that as soon as you're ready to go back 254 00:12:57,280 --> 00:12:58,920 up, they're already kind of firing. 255 00:12:59,080 --> 00:13:01,520 The second piece on top of that is you have that kind of stretch 256 00:13:01,520 --> 00:13:04,400 shortening cycle, which a lot of people probably heard about, But 257 00:13:04,400 --> 00:13:06,800 this idea if you're going to have this kind of rapid stretch 258 00:13:06,800 --> 00:13:10,480 and store elastic energy, and if you use that properly and you 259 00:13:10,480 --> 00:13:13,360 have the right kind of combination of physical tools in 260 00:13:13,360 --> 00:13:15,800 place, you can use that to actually produce more force. 261 00:13:15,800 --> 00:13:19,440 So something as simple as like learning how to swing faster, as 262 00:13:19,440 --> 00:13:22,160 long as you're able to sequence it efficiently, which is where 263 00:13:22,160 --> 00:13:24,480 some of that skill learning kind of comes into place. 264 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:28,080 And there's going to be a bit of a no one-size-fits-all type 265 00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:30,840 solution that'll work better for some people than others. 266 00:13:30,880 --> 00:13:33,160 You can actually hit kind of both of those pieces very 267 00:13:33,160 --> 00:13:36,680 quickly and that's usually one of the kind of early cues a lot 268 00:13:36,680 --> 00:13:39,080 of people will find successful in those kind of first few 269 00:13:39,080 --> 00:13:40,440 weeks. Got it. 270 00:13:40,840 --> 00:13:42,560 OK, we're we're talking plateaus. 271 00:13:42,560 --> 00:13:44,160 I'm going to share my screen with you. 272 00:13:44,320 --> 00:13:49,440 And this is my spreadsheet that I have of the last started in 273 00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:55,800 May of 2024, right. So I had already I guess been 274 00:13:55,800 --> 00:13:57,280 trying. I'd already seen my probably 275 00:13:57,360 --> 00:14:00,680 biggest jump when I first tried to swing harder, right. 276 00:14:00,680 --> 00:14:03,840 So this is pretty much all plateau land, but over the 277 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:07,000 course of, you know, a year I went from my top being, you 278 00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:13,320 know, kind of one 22174 kind of stayed kind of the club head 279 00:14:13,320 --> 00:14:18,240 speed stayed pretty similar, but I was able to probably organize 280 00:14:18,240 --> 00:14:20,840 my body a little bit better and and get better contact right 281 00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:26,040 over over time. And then this year, now that I, 282 00:14:26,040 --> 00:14:28,360 I went and worked with Colby 2 yay. 283 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:32,480 And he kind of like I was like, I, I was just pretty, I had 284 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:36,000 never done anything. I not a not a gym guy, not of a 285 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:38,840 workout guy. And and so he kind of opened the 286 00:14:38,840 --> 00:14:41,200 eyes of like, Oh yeah, you just like a really weak. 287 00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:47,200 So I was like, oh, OK. And so that has helped and it 288 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:52,040 was able to get to, you know, like mid 1 upper one 20s now. 289 00:14:52,640 --> 00:14:55,160 Yeah, the other day we did a video, actually this was with 290 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:57,280 because I hurt my knees. So I was with the PT buddy and 291 00:14:57,280 --> 00:15:01,120 was in his garage and we were working got up to 129 was the 292 00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:05,520 highest club at speed, right? So now it's it feels like this 293 00:15:05,520 --> 00:15:07,760 is just this is a grind at this point, right? 294 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:11,240 Is that, is that accurate in what you've seen And like what 295 00:15:11,240 --> 00:15:13,920 you've researched is like it's just, is this just work from 296 00:15:13,920 --> 00:15:15,840 here on out? Just a lot of hard work. 297 00:15:16,280 --> 00:15:19,680 Yeah, so a lot of it is also trying to tease out like you're 298 00:15:19,720 --> 00:15:23,200 you're kind of slowly teasing it out just through kind of natural 299 00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:24,880 exploration and talking with people. 300 00:15:24,880 --> 00:15:29,120 But what is kind of the next adaptation you need to make the 301 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:31,480 next jump? So early on it could be those 302 00:15:31,480 --> 00:15:34,240 kind of low hanging fruit from a technical standpoint where 303 00:15:34,240 --> 00:15:37,120 you're just you have the, you know, you're not using the 304 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:39,520 physical tools you already have very efficiently. 305 00:15:39,520 --> 00:15:43,440 And so early on, it looks like you'd kind of probably maybe had 306 00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:46,840 a spike in club head speed early on, just which naturally kind of 307 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:49,040 happens when you start to try to swim faster. 308 00:15:49,400 --> 00:15:52,320 And it looks like for a while it was actually like the thing you 309 00:15:52,320 --> 00:15:55,400 needed was to learn how to swing fast, but also strike the ball 310 00:15:55,400 --> 00:15:57,280 fairly well. So that's where that kind of 311 00:15:57,280 --> 00:15:59,240 translation of ball speed comes up. 312 00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:02,720 And after you kind of get those low hanging fruit, it's 313 00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:06,000 essentially you can continue to try to refine and find those 314 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:08,440 little margins from a technical perspective. 315 00:16:08,440 --> 00:16:11,080 And there are ways you could continue to kind of push the 316 00:16:11,080 --> 00:16:14,280 lever little bits at a time. But if the low hanging fruit are 317 00:16:14,280 --> 00:16:17,720 gone and you're pretty close to like, hey, I've gotten all I can 318 00:16:17,720 --> 00:16:21,280 get out of my existing body, then I'm upgrading kind of the 319 00:16:21,280 --> 00:16:25,920 engine size and allowing, I kind of refer to the physical side as 320 00:16:26,200 --> 00:16:29,040 more indirect way of gaining speed, but it gives you more 321 00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:31,560 opportunities. So if you have a mobility 322 00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:34,880 limitation, just stretching or just improve and that's not 323 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:38,600 going to necessarily guarantee that your club head speeds going 324 00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:40,720 to spike up. But what it does is it gives you 325 00:16:40,720 --> 00:16:43,320 more options that you can then apply to your swing. 326 00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:47,320 So if you couldn't rotate before and you get a little more mobile 327 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:50,720 and a little more flexible, you then have more kind of movement 328 00:16:50,800 --> 00:16:53,800 opportunities or movement strategies at your disposal that 329 00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:56,560 you can play around with. Maybe I can get a little more of 330 00:16:56,560 --> 00:16:59,840 that hand path length now and I have to go back and practice 331 00:16:59,840 --> 00:17:02,240 that. What we'll see a lot of the time 332 00:17:02,240 --> 00:17:05,960 is when someone goes from fairly weak on the force side and they 333 00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:07,760 add a little bit of that extra force. 334 00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:11,599 That can usually be a pretty quick transfer of a few mph 335 00:17:11,599 --> 00:17:15,640 because you just basically could use the same movement fuel or 336 00:17:15,640 --> 00:17:19,079 feels or cues, but you just have a little more force capacity at 337 00:17:19,079 --> 00:17:21,520 your disposal. So you can be a little more 338 00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:23,200 aggressive pushing off the ground. 339 00:17:23,240 --> 00:17:26,520 You can rotate or kind of produce force through the upper 340 00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:28,440 body and through the chain a bit better. 341 00:17:29,000 --> 00:17:33,120 What I'll see a lot of people is kind of underappreciated piece 342 00:17:33,120 --> 00:17:36,080 of the swing, if you're swinging really fast is going to be the 343 00:17:36,080 --> 00:17:38,480 transfer of momentum or energy through the trunk. 344 00:17:38,560 --> 00:17:41,400 And if you're really weak, that can be a really kind of energy 345 00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:44,240 leak for a lot of people is even if they're pushing into the 346 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:46,600 ground with a lot of force. If you're not getting that 347 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:50,080 momentum up to the club very efficiently, then you may be 348 00:17:50,080 --> 00:17:53,040 losing a few mph. But as soon as someone gets 349 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:56,120 stronger kind of throughout the muscles, the hips, the trunk, 350 00:17:56,440 --> 00:17:59,800 the upper extremity, then that kind of whole kinetic chain can 351 00:17:59,800 --> 00:18:02,800 get a bit more efficient. So from there it's then, you 352 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:06,880 know, gaining you can start to maximize kind of the speed 353 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:10,480 related adaptations of certain muscles that have to act at 354 00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:12,800 really high speeds during the swing. 355 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:16,000 So a lot of the upper extremity tends to have to produce force 356 00:18:16,000 --> 00:18:18,920 really quickly and move very quickly while kind of continuing 357 00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:21,440 to build out the lower supports what you're trying to do from a 358 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:24,920 technical perspectives. Well, you, you nailed it. 359 00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:29,880 That is so when I was with Mark Blackburn, we we were on the 360 00:18:29,880 --> 00:18:34,560 force plate and so I was able to apply as like 210% or something 361 00:18:34,640 --> 00:18:39,040 of vertical force. It was too late, right. 362 00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:42,200 So it never got to the the club. So that doesn't really matter. 363 00:18:42,200 --> 00:18:44,520 And then we're doing the, you know, some of the TPI test with 364 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:46,760 the Med ball. You know, just I'm below was 365 00:18:46,760 --> 00:18:50,800 below average on the lay down, the lay down and you get up and, 366 00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:53,640 you know, Chuck it over your head one. 367 00:18:53,680 --> 00:18:57,560 So like your spot on there. That is like a very accurate 368 00:18:57,560 --> 00:18:59,360 thing. And I'm guessing I'm pretty 369 00:18:59,360 --> 00:19:01,800 common in that like I, I would, I would assume that they're 370 00:19:01,800 --> 00:19:05,680 probably a lot of people that have that same kind of thing 371 00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:08,200 going on. Yeah, absolutely. 372 00:19:08,200 --> 00:19:12,400 So I mean it's very common, especially in the golf space. 373 00:19:12,400 --> 00:19:15,400 Well, not even necessarily just in the golf space, but even the 374 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:17,960 people that have a bit of training experience, they're not 375 00:19:17,960 --> 00:19:20,720 always training in a performance related way. 376 00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:23,680 Like maybe they kind of grab a program and it's kind of your 377 00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:27,960 bodybuilder inspired, high volume type physique related 378 00:19:27,960 --> 00:19:30,120 type training. And the reality is when someone 379 00:19:30,120 --> 00:19:33,760 first starts doing any sort of fitness, like the easiest and 380 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:36,480 biggest gains you can make from a fitness and health perspective 381 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:38,560 is going from doing nothing to doing something. 382 00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:42,760 So most general programs will work pretty well for a while. 383 00:19:42,760 --> 00:19:45,040 Once you're trying to really maximize kind of your 384 00:19:45,040 --> 00:19:48,640 performance potential from like a swing speed perspective, then 385 00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:51,880 it's time to start thinking about how the body performs, not 386 00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:55,320 just kind of your general physique related type training. 387 00:19:55,320 --> 00:19:59,280 And a lot of people don't train in a way that's really efficient 388 00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:02,760 for kind of producing high levels of force, for one, but 389 00:20:02,760 --> 00:20:05,320 then definitely learning to transfer energy through the 390 00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:06,840 body. And that's essentially. 391 00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:10,240 What the golf swing is, is you can get a lot of speed out of a 392 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:13,400 relatively small body if you're really good at transferring 393 00:20:13,400 --> 00:20:15,600 energy through the system. But then when you combine that 394 00:20:15,600 --> 00:20:18,920 with a big engine too, that's when you're going to have a very 395 00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:21,800 large ceiling or really high ceiling for speed when you 396 00:20:21,800 --> 00:20:25,640 combine it with good technique. What, what are some of those 397 00:20:25,640 --> 00:20:29,040 things that you've seen have a big correlation from a fitness 398 00:20:29,280 --> 00:20:32,240 perspective to speed then? Yeah. 399 00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:35,560 So from a lot of the research we've done both kind of formal 400 00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:38,880 academic research, but then I've just tested a lot of golfers 401 00:20:38,880 --> 00:20:41,880 over the years and continue to do so with some of kind of my 402 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:44,640 current jobs. The by far the strongest 403 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:47,520 correlation from a physical perspective is what we call 404 00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:51,000 vertical jump impulse. And impulse essentially is like 405 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:53,440 the total amount of force you produce over a given amount of 406 00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:55,720 time. So going back to kind of the 407 00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:59,680 mechanics of swing speed, Sasha kind of went from like a work 408 00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:03,120 energy perspective of how much work you can form during the 409 00:21:03,120 --> 00:21:06,240 downswing, which is basically force over a given amount of 410 00:21:06,240 --> 00:21:08,120 distance. You can look at it in a very 411 00:21:08,120 --> 00:21:11,000 similar way with impulsive momentum of like I'm trying to 412 00:21:11,000 --> 00:21:14,480 build my momentum into the club, and that's dependent on how much 413 00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:16,960 force I produced basically during the time of the 414 00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:19,160 downswing. So it's a similar concept, 415 00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:22,240 slightly different mechanical terms, but essentially it's how 416 00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:24,760 much vertical force you can produce during this kind of 417 00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:27,040 movement jump during specific phases of it. 418 00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:30,040 There's probably a couple of reasons for that being a really 419 00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:33,600 strong correlation. One, I mean, we know the lower 420 00:21:33,600 --> 00:21:37,360 body plays a really important role where ground reaction force 421 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:40,480 is, is very important in terms of being able to build up and 422 00:21:40,480 --> 00:21:42,840 transfer that momentum through the body gives you 423 00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:44,840 opportunities. If you're really powerful from a 424 00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:48,040 lower body perspective, as long as you can time it up correctly, 425 00:21:48,040 --> 00:21:51,200 you have the raw capacity of putting force into the ground if 426 00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:53,400 you need to. The second piece is probably 427 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:57,040 pretty simple that people that are pretty athletic and pretty 428 00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:59,840 good across the board tend to also be good at jumping. 429 00:21:59,880 --> 00:22:03,040 So it's usually a pretty easy process Oxy if just overall 430 00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:05,840 athleticism in my opinion, but there are other are other 431 00:22:05,840 --> 00:22:08,520 pieces. So we've seen that upper body we 432 00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:12,520 call like ballistic strength or thinking less so the maximum 433 00:22:12,520 --> 00:22:16,600 weight you can lift, but kind of fast application of force from 434 00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:18,760 the upper body tends to correlate really well. 435 00:22:18,760 --> 00:22:21,960 So your medicine ball throws like you mentioned before, tend 436 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:24,720 to be pretty easy field based tests of this. 437 00:22:24,960 --> 00:22:28,400 And some of the labs will use something like force plates. 438 00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:32,560 So we'll have like an isometric bench press or a a test of how 439 00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:36,120 fast you can apply force into a force play for example is kind 440 00:22:36,120 --> 00:22:39,640 of a measure of this like fast dynamic force or or this 441 00:22:39,640 --> 00:22:41,960 ballistic capabilities of the upper body. 442 00:22:42,120 --> 00:22:45,400 So those tend to be really good ones where pretty predictive of 443 00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:49,200 how much of an engine you have for kind of producing speed 444 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:53,080 within the swing. And then kind of the secondary 445 00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:55,680 factors will be some of the kind of mobility pieces of do you 446 00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:59,000 have an obvious mobility limitation of if you're 447 00:22:59,000 --> 00:23:03,680 incredibly immobile in the trunk and hips, then there can be some 448 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:07,000 low hanging fruit there as well. Tell me about the SO the 449 00:23:07,000 --> 00:23:10,400 vertical vertical jump impulse. What was the? 450 00:23:11,120 --> 00:23:13,080 Yeah. So it's usually a counter 451 00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:15,160 movement jump, which is essentially what most people 452 00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:17,840 think of as your traditional vertical jump that we usually do 453 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:21,120 hands on the hips to just kind of isolate the lower body 454 00:23:21,120 --> 00:23:23,600 specifically. So jump height for a long time 455 00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:27,000 is used as kind of the primary. It's the easiest kind of lower 456 00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:30,720 body power metric if you can kind of just about everyone has 457 00:23:30,720 --> 00:23:33,640 probably done a vertical jump test at some point, especially 458 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:35,640 if they participate in any sort of sport. 459 00:23:36,040 --> 00:23:39,440 The only issue, and it's that it by itself is a good predictor of 460 00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:41,400 kind of club head speed potential. 461 00:23:41,400 --> 00:23:45,640 The only down side of it is that it is biased against heavier 462 00:23:45,640 --> 00:23:48,880 golfers where being a bit bigger and especially if you're big and 463 00:23:48,880 --> 00:23:52,120 strong can actually have advantages within the golf swing 464 00:23:52,120 --> 00:23:55,160 because it's a sport where you're not actually having to 465 00:23:55,160 --> 00:23:59,040 like displace yourself through the air quite as much as you 466 00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:01,720 would if you're jumping or sprinting in another sport. 467 00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:05,160 There's advantages to being able to kind of maintain contact with 468 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:07,240 the ground. So it's more about the total 469 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:10,680 force you're putting into the ground, less so than how much 470 00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:12,680 you get your body to explode off the ground. 471 00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:15,720 So impulse is essentially just a measure of like if you think 472 00:24:15,720 --> 00:24:19,600 about basically from the bottom of the squat during a vertical 473 00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:23,440 jump until you leave the ground or just measuring the total 474 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:25,760 amount of force you put into the ground during that time. 475 00:24:25,880 --> 00:24:28,720 And it sounds fancy, but it's it's essentially just how much 476 00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:31,160 force did you put into the ground to make yourself go up? 477 00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:34,880 And we can actually estimate it really accurately if even if you 478 00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:37,600 don't have a force plate, I'll actually just measure jump 479 00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:39,160 height if I don't have a force plate. 480 00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:42,000 And if you know the person's body mass, so how much they 481 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:44,840 weigh in kilograms, there's actually equations to really 482 00:24:44,840 --> 00:24:47,840 accurately estimate how much force they would have had to put 483 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:51,040 that into the ground to make themselves go that high off the 484 00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:53,200 ground. It sounds like a fancy metric. 485 00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:56,080 It's essentially just jump height, taking into account how 486 00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:57,120 heavy you weigh. Got it. 487 00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:01,760 OK, so V1 just sent me over pressure plate and I was dinking 488 00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:05,960 around with it and they have a they have a jump height test. 489 00:25:06,080 --> 00:25:10,320 So let's say I go measure myself and the jump and I'll I'll have 490 00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:12,000 to, I'll have to message you what it was. 491 00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:13,080 And you tell me if that's good or bad. 492 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:16,320 But like, let's say somebody's like, oh man, this, this is not 493 00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:18,360 good. I need to, this is a problem for 494 00:25:18,360 --> 00:25:20,440 me. I can tell it's under where, you 495 00:25:20,440 --> 00:25:23,960 know, my average is just give us the minute spiel on like how, 496 00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:25,640 how would you help someone improve that? 497 00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:26,720 Can they improve that? Yeah. 498 00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:29,520 So generally, yeah, you absolutely can't improve it for 499 00:25:29,520 --> 00:25:32,040 one. But generally, if kind of that 500 00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:35,360 vertical impulse or whatever you want to call it, your kind of 501 00:25:35,360 --> 00:25:39,520 jump performance test is low, or especially if you do a couple 502 00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:42,080 other tests and it seems like they're pretty low on the force 503 00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:44,920 side across the board. The generally the first thing 504 00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:48,360 we'll try to figure out is if it's kind of a strength or kind 505 00:25:48,360 --> 00:25:51,800 of peak force issue, or is it that they have some strength, 506 00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:53,640 but they're not good at expressing it quickly. 507 00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:55,960 So that'll usually kind of be the follow up. 508 00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:58,680 In a lot of cases, if it's someone that doesn't have much 509 00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:01,400 training experience, it's usually going to be starting 510 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:04,120 with building up kind of strength, their ability to 511 00:26:04,120 --> 00:26:07,920 produce a lot of force quickly or a lot of force first. 512 00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,240 So think of it building up the engine or the foundation. 513 00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:14,280 And the reason for that is when you get stronger, there's a lot 514 00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:17,040 of things that happen that generally set the stage for 515 00:26:17,040 --> 00:26:19,720 future kind of speed related gains down the road. 516 00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:23,400 So it's generally better to kind of build up that foundation of 517 00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:26,680 just being able to produce force in the 1st place before you try 518 00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:28,880 to learn how to use force really, really quickly. 519 00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:32,840 The second piece is a lot of the like strength training, the type 520 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:35,840 of training that you use for building up strength also tends 521 00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:39,280 to come with some beneficial things from like injury and 522 00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:43,240 general well-being standpoint of that kind of higher force output 523 00:26:43,240 --> 00:26:46,200 will be beneficial for kind of adapting some of the connective 524 00:26:46,200 --> 00:26:48,560 tissues. And the number one thing we can 525 00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:51,000 do for someone from a fitness perspective, if you're working 526 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,480 with a competitive golfer, is making it so that they can 527 00:26:53,480 --> 00:26:57,240 tolerate the demands their sport more often and be able to 528 00:26:57,240 --> 00:27:00,240 practice and play as much as they want to play without having 529 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:01,880 to worry quite as much about injury. 530 00:27:01,880 --> 00:27:04,440 So that strength training perspective is usually the 531 00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:07,520 starting point because it builds the engine while also kind of 532 00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:10,440 building that robustness or the resilience against stress. 533 00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,080 Then the next piece from there as you layer on kind of the 534 00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:16,480 speed related side of it's not enough to just produce a lot of 535 00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:18,560 force. The golf swing tends to be fast 536 00:27:18,560 --> 00:27:20,600 and dynamic. We're going to start moving to 537 00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:24,000 things like jumps, medicine ball throws, things where you have to 538 00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:27,080 load the ground quick and learn how to transfer energy through 539 00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:29,360 the body. And that's essentially formula. 540 00:27:29,360 --> 00:27:32,320 A lot of it is just programming. And then in a way that we're 541 00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:35,680 balancing, we're really getting a really strong stimulus so that 542 00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:38,840 the body's going to adapt, but without overdoing it, where 543 00:27:38,840 --> 00:27:41,320 they're going to be fatigued and it's going to affect the other 544 00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:44,320 stuff they're trying to do, which in golf they tend to play 545 00:27:44,320 --> 00:27:46,080 a lot. They want to be able to play in 546 00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:48,760 practice a lot. So we don't want them incredibly 547 00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:51,640 sore or unable to recover between workouts. 548 00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:54,960 So that really is more the art of working with golfers is how 549 00:27:55,120 --> 00:27:58,480 navigate their schedules more set than the training itself. 550 00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:00,840 How important is is this jump aspect? 551 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:03,600 Like is it often that you're saying like this, you have to go 552 00:28:03,600 --> 00:28:06,600 and prove this like and this is the number one thing you got to 553 00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:10,240 go do is, is that frequent that that's when you when you talk to 554 00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:12,560 players that that's the thing. It's I kind of think of it is 555 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:15,560 it's not probably jumping specifically that matters as 556 00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:19,240 much as jumping brings a lot of valuable things with it in terms 557 00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:21,840 of what it does in terms of your ability to use the ground. 558 00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:25,200 So during the golf swing like even things like could be think 559 00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:28,080 about a vertical jump. One of the reasons those outputs 560 00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:31,000 from kind of those vertical jumps probably correlate pretty 561 00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:34,520 well is it is actually a decent proxy for how we use the ground 562 00:28:34,520 --> 00:28:36,760 within the swing. It's lacking the kind of 563 00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:40,480 rotational component, but really fast golfers tend to kind of 564 00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:43,560 upload during the backswing. So their center mass will move 565 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:46,520 up just a little bit and then they kind of on wait and they 566 00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:49,400 kind of fall into their lead side and then they explode out 567 00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:51,840 of it. And some people will still stay 568 00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:54,800 relatively grounded and some people literally almost kind of 569 00:28:54,800 --> 00:28:57,920 jump to kind of clear out space and rotate around that lead 570 00:28:58,120 --> 00:28:59,920 regardless. It's almost like a less 571 00:28:59,920 --> 00:29:03,360 exaggerated vertical jump in terms of how the body's kind of 572 00:29:03,440 --> 00:29:05,880 going up. You're on waiting, breaking 573 00:29:05,880 --> 00:29:08,720 hard, and then kind of accelerating out of it in terms 574 00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:10,360 of rotating around that lead leg. 575 00:29:10,560 --> 00:29:14,600 And so people that can train the body to get really good at doing 576 00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:18,360 that in a more extreme fashion. So things like jumps or loaded 577 00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:21,880 jumps, they're going to build up that capability of having the 578 00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:25,600 raw ability from a neuromuscular standpoint to then apply that to 579 00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,400 the golf swing. So my goal from a fitness 580 00:29:28,400 --> 00:29:31,120 perspective is if I can get you really good at jumping and if I 581 00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:35,080 can get you really powerful from a lower body perspective, then 582 00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:38,320 you have the tools in place where now it's time to learn how 583 00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:41,160 to kind of time that up and sequence it within the kind of 584 00:29:41,160 --> 00:29:43,880 swing motion itself. And that's where more the 585 00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:47,040 specific technical work or speed training work comes into play. 586 00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:50,560 The other piece is that a lot of good things just happen across 587 00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:53,040 the body with just really good lower body training. 588 00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:56,280 It's kind of the foundation of a good strength and performance 589 00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,840 training program is, you know, a lot of good adaptations happen 590 00:29:59,840 --> 00:30:03,560 in terms of both the strength component, the power component, 591 00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:07,160 as well as kind of the building up the tissues that are going 592 00:30:07,160 --> 00:30:10,320 to, you know, allow you to practice often and and not get 593 00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:12,080 hurt. Vertical jumps tend to be a 594 00:30:12,080 --> 00:30:14,920 pretty good foundational piece of those programs. 595 00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:16,080 Got it. So what? 596 00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:17,560 What would you expect? My jump to me? 597 00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:20,600 So I'm 6 feet tall. How much do I weigh? 598 00:30:20,600 --> 00:30:22,400 180 lbs? Something like that? 599 00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:24,760 Like is that enough to guess? Like what? 600 00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:26,160 What am I going to go see, do you think? 601 00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:28,080 And what would be good? Or bad? 602 00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:29,800 Yeah. That's why you're on the spot. 603 00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:34,000 The first piece, being a technology guy, is it's going to 604 00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:35,520 depend a bit on how you measure it. 605 00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:40,280 So from like if you do hands on hips, strict form, the other 606 00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:42,600 piece will be kind of which tool you use to measure it. 607 00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:44,960 So there's like forest flights are kind of considered the gold 608 00:30:44,960 --> 00:30:48,320 standard, but there's contact mats and all sorts of different 609 00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:50,200 options. I can use a smartphone app 610 00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:53,720 that's really actually pretty accurate for vertical jump. 611 00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:55,960 I generally measure it in centimeters mainly because 612 00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:59,000 that's a lot of the kind of formulas are built around that. 613 00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:02,120 And your size. If you're jumping probably in 614 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:06,680 the kind of like 35 to 40cm range with like that hands on 615 00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:09,880 hips, which I'd have to do the math to convert it. 616 00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:12,240 That's probably going to put you in a pretty good spot from that 617 00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:17,840 like impulse measurement where we have kind of normative data 618 00:31:17,840 --> 00:31:20,920 based off of what we see from golfers of different levels. 619 00:31:20,920 --> 00:31:25,080 Anywhere from kind of your pro golfers have tested a few long 620 00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:27,520 drivers and they tend to even be on the higher level. 621 00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:30,400 And I'll even often like the people are really trying to push 622 00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:32,400 speed. There's pretty good normative 623 00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:34,520 data out there from like Major League Baseball. 624 00:31:34,520 --> 00:31:37,400 I tend to use like if you're really serious about this, we're 625 00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:39,640 not going to just stop at what other pros are doing. 626 00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:43,600 We're going to push for the kind of next level up, which a lot of 627 00:31:43,600 --> 00:31:46,760 your baseball batters tend to have a lot of the same physical 628 00:31:46,760 --> 00:31:49,880 attributes that would be really useful from a golf perspective 629 00:31:49,880 --> 00:31:52,320 as well. OK, I'm going to go do it. 630 00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:54,320 I've got. Yeah, I've got the pressure, the 631 00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:56,520 sensor mats. I'll send you a video. 632 00:31:56,520 --> 00:31:57,600 I'll post a video. Here's. 633 00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:01,920 The and give you a score. How about that? 634 00:32:02,400 --> 00:32:05,800 Yes, yes, OK. So we've got the jump aspect and 635 00:32:05,800 --> 00:32:09,600 then you talked about the second aspect was, sorry, ballistic. 636 00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:13,920 Upper body power, but the ability to accelerate the upper 637 00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:15,720 body really fast. There's, there's going to be 638 00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:19,400 more pieces on top of that. But in terms of like basic proxy 639 00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:23,880 test, things like a seated chest pass for distance with a 640 00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:26,200 medicine ball throw is a really easy test to do. 641 00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:29,000 So I think that's part of the TPI testing as well. 642 00:32:29,000 --> 00:32:31,360 I've done it quite a bit. And when I was doing kind of 643 00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:34,440 formal research or if I'm just testing a golfer, it's a very 644 00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:37,520 quick and easy way of we take away the lower body body. 645 00:32:37,520 --> 00:32:40,280 Can that upper body just generate a lot of Ford that I 646 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:43,160 usually like to do something rotational in nature as well. 647 00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:46,160 So rotational medicine, Paul throat works really well as kind 648 00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:49,320 of a secondary 1 to see. Can they translate that into 649 00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:52,440 kind of a rotational pattern? So those three right off the 650 00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:54,880 bat, can they put a lot of force into the ground quickly? 651 00:32:54,880 --> 00:32:57,960 Can they produce a lot of force quickly from the upper body? 652 00:32:57,960 --> 00:32:59,640 Can they do it kind of rotationally? 653 00:32:59,920 --> 00:33:02,840 That's already going to tell me if someone's good across all 654 00:33:02,840 --> 00:33:04,480 three of those. That gives me a lot of 655 00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:07,120 information. If someone is really poor across 656 00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:09,840 all three of those, we know there's there's some workers, 657 00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:13,160 there's I guess spinning in a positive light with a little bit 658 00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:15,680 of work on the physical side, they probably have a lot of 659 00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:17,800 potential to gain speed. Yep. 660 00:33:18,040 --> 00:33:20,440 OK. So we've covered those aspects. 661 00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:22,600 I want to know your thoughts on speed sticks. 662 00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:24,680 I was reading a bit some of your stuff that you've talked about 663 00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:27,080 them and it's kind of interesting you're using more of 664 00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:32,040 like how to change a swing versus swing faster almost is 665 00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:34,600 what it sounds like a little bit of the mindset behind them. 666 00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:37,280 Yes, I think there's a few ways that they work. 667 00:33:37,280 --> 00:33:40,320 One, I think they fall really nicely into kind of the previous 668 00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:43,840 conversation of when you think about when you're normally 669 00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:47,240 practicing or playing, you have all this different feedback that 670 00:33:47,240 --> 00:33:49,600 you're kind of tuning into and you're going to tend to 671 00:33:49,600 --> 00:33:51,640 prioritize some or the over the other. 672 00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:55,360 Think about probably the thing that overrides everything is how 673 00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:57,120 did I hit it and where did the ball go? 674 00:33:57,400 --> 00:34:00,560 Essentially that kind of outcome related type feedback when 675 00:34:00,560 --> 00:34:03,760 you're playing or practicing, it could be really hard to kind of 676 00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:07,880 explore new ways of moving when you're also really concerned 677 00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:09,040 when you're going to hit it poorly. 678 00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:14,080 So Speed 6IN a way are actually really kind of extreme way of 679 00:34:14,080 --> 00:34:17,120 what we talked about before where you're basically focusing 680 00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:19,120 all your feedback and just swinging fast. 681 00:34:19,199 --> 00:34:22,440 And so we're taking away the ball, we're taking away feedback 682 00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:25,800 about how you strike it, where the ball is going, how the ball 683 00:34:25,800 --> 00:34:27,800 is flying. And we're giving you a radar and 684 00:34:27,800 --> 00:34:30,440 here's your speed. You have the stick swinging 685 00:34:30,440 --> 00:34:33,239 faster. And a lot of people, especially 686 00:34:33,239 --> 00:34:35,719 in the short term, if they're not used to moving really 687 00:34:35,719 --> 00:34:39,080 athletically or dynamically within the swing, will find that 688 00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:41,880 they tend to use the ground a bit differently. 689 00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:44,760 You rotate a little differently when they just have a speed 690 00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:46,560 stick and a swing radar and nothing else. 691 00:34:47,159 --> 00:34:48,560 So I think that's the first piece. 692 00:34:48,560 --> 00:34:52,840 It's a lot of people will almost immediately gain a few mph if 693 00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:56,199 they have pretty efficient or inefficient swings at baseline 694 00:34:56,199 --> 00:34:58,920 or they haven't really ever swung fast before. 695 00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:02,240 Because it just sets up the environment for like, okay, it's 696 00:35:02,240 --> 00:35:05,720 kind of a safe environment to try moving differently because I 697 00:35:05,720 --> 00:35:08,960 don't have to worry about hitting it 100 yards, right, or 698 00:35:08,960 --> 00:35:10,520 hitting it out of bounds. Yeah. 699 00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:12,960 The second piece is, I think there are some interesting 700 00:35:12,960 --> 00:35:16,240 things that happen when you take something that's close enough to 701 00:35:16,240 --> 00:35:18,360 a Golf Club and modify it in some ways. 702 00:35:18,360 --> 00:35:21,640 So I kind of view it as really like a skill acquisition tool, 703 00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:24,800 which I think in the future, like really good coaches will 704 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:28,040 learn how to promote specific movements in the swing using 705 00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:30,920 speed sticks as kind of a constraint on what they're 706 00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:33,360 trying to do. And good coaches already do this 707 00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:36,440 with different tools already. But for example, one of the 708 00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:39,960 issues I had when I started this new speed journey was that I was 709 00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:42,920 realizing I was kind of whipping the club away with my hands. 710 00:35:43,000 --> 00:35:46,280 And, you know, I wasn't kind of moving off the ball really 711 00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:48,400 efficiently. I wasn't loading the ground to 712 00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:50,920 kind of create that backswing momentum. 713 00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:54,200 And when I started swinging the heavier speed stick, even if I 714 00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:57,040 wasn't trying to swing it all out because my goal wasn't 715 00:35:57,040 --> 00:36:00,640 necessarily like make this number go as high as possible. 716 00:36:00,720 --> 00:36:03,520 What I realized is when it's a little heavier than you're used 717 00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:06,520 to, I was being forced to kind of to push off the ground and 718 00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:09,960 kind of load the trunk a little more dynamically to get that 719 00:36:09,960 --> 00:36:13,240 momentum going because there's a bit more inertia to overcome. 720 00:36:13,240 --> 00:36:15,760 And then in transition, I had to kind of sequence a little 721 00:36:15,760 --> 00:36:17,640 differently. I had to kind of lead with the 722 00:36:17,640 --> 00:36:20,560 hips a bit better and use more of that proximal to distal 723 00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:23,400 sequencing because otherwise it kind of pulled me out of 724 00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:26,360 position and it's hard to just like arm swing it down. 725 00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:29,320 And so I started working it into, it's just kind of like a 726 00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:33,200 drill where I'd use like the slightly heavier speed stick and 727 00:36:33,200 --> 00:36:36,760 just kind of focus on like these using the big muscles to kind of 728 00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:39,560 drive the momentum and then transferring it up the chain. 729 00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:43,000 And it kind of was a nice way to kind of promote some of those 730 00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:45,000 movements I was looking for in the swing. 731 00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:48,080 And then with the faster of the light ones, it's really a great 732 00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:51,400 way to challenge, like, can I apply that at faster than normal 733 00:36:51,400 --> 00:36:54,240 speeds? And one of the first adaptations 734 00:36:54,240 --> 00:36:57,720 that happens, whether it's the gym or something technical like 735 00:36:57,720 --> 00:37:00,920 the golf swing, is that when you add a new challenge, a new 736 00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:03,600 movement challenge to the mix, your body's going to try to 737 00:37:03,600 --> 00:37:06,840 figure out how to coordinate things differently to accomplish 738 00:37:06,840 --> 00:37:11,040 your task around that challenge. So in this case, you force your 739 00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:14,040 body to move a little bit faster than you're normally used to 740 00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:16,800 move in, and your body has to kind of go through this process 741 00:37:16,800 --> 00:37:20,840 of how can I move to make that number continue to go up while 742 00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:23,360 swinging something that's a little wider than I'm used to. 743 00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:26,920 So I don't think it's anything necessarily magical, but I think 744 00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:29,960 just things happen. It's kind of this, you learn to 745 00:37:29,960 --> 00:37:33,600 explore different ways of moving when you make these slight 746 00:37:33,600 --> 00:37:37,760 changes to the weight of the club and then you have feedback 747 00:37:37,760 --> 00:37:39,520 to kind of guide that exploration. 748 00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:42,840 But I do think overtime, there's probably a degree of the 749 00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:45,640 overspeed. It's a very good way to get some 750 00:37:45,640 --> 00:37:49,400 degree of kind of speed related adaptations in terms of moving 751 00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:52,160 certain body parts faster than they're used to training. 752 00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:54,960 And there are kind of neural adaptations that can occur 753 00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:57,880 overtime with learning how to activate those muscles quicker 754 00:37:57,880 --> 00:37:59,760 than usual. So there's probably a degree of 755 00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:02,640 that as well, but that's going to be more your slower burn 756 00:38:02,720 --> 00:38:05,960 where some of the kind of quick coordination movement related 757 00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:08,080 stuff, it's going to be kind of those quick jump since. 758 00:38:08,920 --> 00:38:11,760 Got it. How much is some of these jumps 759 00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:14,280 like is I think about the plateau that I'm on right now 760 00:38:14,560 --> 00:38:17,920 and kind of the small gains. How much do you think is fitness 761 00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:20,640 related, getting stronger and improving the body? 762 00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:24,600 And how much do you think is like neurological of just like 763 00:38:24,600 --> 00:38:27,680 learning to adapt to these new forces because a lot of it 764 00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:31,480 feels, you know, out of control and wild when you're speed 765 00:38:31,480 --> 00:38:33,880 training. Like what do you think the 766 00:38:33,880 --> 00:38:36,440 balance is between kind of those factors? 767 00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:37,800 Like how do you think about that? 768 00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:40,520 Yeah, I think a very simple way of thinking of it is kind of the 769 00:38:40,520 --> 00:38:43,760 physical side is going to be kind of raising your ceiling and 770 00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:47,200 then the kind of skill speed training type stuff is going to 771 00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:48,880 be how close to that ceiling you are. 772 00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:50,400 So it's kind of this progressive. 773 00:38:50,520 --> 00:38:53,640 Let's take a couple examples. You may have someone that has 774 00:38:53,640 --> 00:38:57,480 like a very poor engine, so they're relatively weak, maybe 775 00:38:57,480 --> 00:38:59,960 they're pretty small. They may have this kind of 776 00:38:59,960 --> 00:39:02,720 initial jump, but they run into that ceiling really quickly. 777 00:39:02,720 --> 00:39:05,760 So they kind of Max out. At some point they need to be 778 00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:07,920 able to produce more force and produce it quicker. 779 00:39:07,920 --> 00:39:12,000 Or they have some just you can only make a old, you know, old 780 00:39:12,000 --> 00:39:14,360 car with a bad engine move so fast. 781 00:39:14,360 --> 00:39:17,480 Even if you put the best driver in the world behind the wheel, 782 00:39:17,480 --> 00:39:20,160 at some point you got to upgrade the engine to actually kind of 783 00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:22,280 learn to drive faster in that case. 784 00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:24,560 I won't take this personally, That's fine. 785 00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:27,440 The other example is like, especially if you think about 786 00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:31,000 someone that maybe like picks up long drive after being like a 787 00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:34,680 professional baseball player or a talking with like Martin 788 00:39:34,680 --> 00:39:36,680 Borgmeyer. He has this pretty extensive 789 00:39:36,680 --> 00:39:39,240 history of being a really good athlete playing basketball. 790 00:39:39,240 --> 00:39:42,160 And he probably had a lot of those physical tools in place. 791 00:39:42,160 --> 00:39:45,960 So he probably had this massive kind of opportunity to benefit 792 00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:49,920 from the technical and the more speed training specific side of 793 00:39:49,920 --> 00:39:53,560 things where he credits a lot of the more technique or and kind 794 00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:57,560 of focus speed training work in kind of getting up to those 141 795 00:39:57,560 --> 00:40:01,120 fifties swing speed, two 25230 ball speed. 796 00:40:01,240 --> 00:40:04,280 So in his case, it's like he probably had this massive, 797 00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:06,640 almost all of it came from technical work. 798 00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:09,960 It's he had already laid that foundation over many years and 799 00:40:09,960 --> 00:40:12,080 then. The fitness side can continue to 800 00:40:12,080 --> 00:40:15,080 build up that potential over time or maybe you kind of morph 801 00:40:15,080 --> 00:40:16,920 what that fitness work looks like. 802 00:40:17,200 --> 00:40:19,920 So if you're plenty strong, you're probably going to focus 803 00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:22,920 more on the speed side or maybe it's just making sure you don't 804 00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:25,600 get hurt so that you can practice more of the speed 805 00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:28,600 related stuff more often. But the short answer is like, I 806 00:40:28,600 --> 00:40:30,840 think for most people, it's going to be this case and you're 807 00:40:30,840 --> 00:40:33,360 bridging that gap, you're running into that ceiling and 808 00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:36,120 then you need to take some time to build up that ceiling higher 809 00:40:36,120 --> 00:40:38,240 and then you can make those those leaps again. 810 00:40:38,240 --> 00:40:42,080 So it's building the engine and then the the speed training side 811 00:40:42,080 --> 00:40:45,720 or the technical size, learning to express what you have and so 812 00:40:45,720 --> 00:40:47,880 that they kind of go hand in hand, if that makes sense. 813 00:40:48,240 --> 00:40:48,840 Got it. All right. 814 00:40:48,840 --> 00:40:51,360 Two more questions. One grip strength. 815 00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:53,280 Any thoughts on that? Does that matter? 816 00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:55,480 Do you care any any research on on that? 817 00:40:55,560 --> 00:40:58,000 It's a great question and I love seeing both sides of the 818 00:40:58,000 --> 00:40:59,320 equation. So on. 819 00:40:59,480 --> 00:41:03,640 It's more complicated than people think, but the reality is 820 00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,240 1 when we talk about correlations between grip 821 00:41:06,240 --> 00:41:09,040 strength and swing speed, there's a couple factors at 822 00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:11,160 play. The first that makes it really 823 00:41:11,160 --> 00:41:14,800 tricky to actually run those analysis is that grip strength 824 00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:16,920 is a really good proxy for overall strength. 825 00:41:17,040 --> 00:41:20,560 So they use it in longevity research as a quick and easy way 826 00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:24,480 to measure just overall strength of a person because people that 827 00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:27,360 have really strong grips tend to be really strong throughout the 828 00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:29,560 body. So that's the first piece where 829 00:41:29,560 --> 00:41:31,880 it's not necessarily an indicator of something golf 830 00:41:31,880 --> 00:41:33,760 specific. It's just that strong people 831 00:41:33,760 --> 00:41:36,640 tend to have strong grips and being strong tends to be good 832 00:41:36,640 --> 00:41:39,120 for a lot of things, including a swinging a Golf Club. 833 00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:42,320 That being said, I think there are some specific benefits of 834 00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:47,640 having good grip strength. So for example, argument that I 835 00:41:47,640 --> 00:41:50,400 think that if you have plenty of grip strength, you're able to 836 00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:54,120 put enough force into the grip without it being excessive 837 00:41:54,160 --> 00:41:56,160 effort. I think there's a lot of benefit 838 00:41:56,160 --> 00:41:58,280 to that. Whether you get that by just 839 00:41:58,280 --> 00:42:01,680 being strong in general, that that's one thing more 840 00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:04,920 specifically, like a piece that I've become really fascinated by 841 00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:07,880 is this idea of kind of centrifugal force in the swing. 842 00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:10,320 Or you can think about it of having to put force into the 843 00:42:10,320 --> 00:42:13,640 club to like basically carve out its path as you approach 844 00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:16,240 impacts. But someone that's swinging 845 00:42:16,240 --> 00:42:20,440 fairly fast, so that you have someone swinging 115 a 120 miles 846 00:42:20,440 --> 00:42:23,960 an hour just to keep that club moving and it's kind of 847 00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:28,080 semicircular path and release into the ball, you're going to 848 00:42:28,080 --> 00:42:32,120 have to be putting basically pulling on that shaft with well 849 00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:36,360 over £100 worth of force. So you're going to have to be 850 00:42:36,360 --> 00:42:39,600 really pulling on that club to keep it from flying straight 851 00:42:39,600 --> 00:42:42,520 into the ground, actually get it to curve up into the ball. 852 00:42:43,080 --> 00:42:45,800 And so you'll kind of talk about some people kind of pulling up 853 00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:47,960 through impact. If you have a lot of grip 854 00:42:47,960 --> 00:42:52,040 strength, that can help, you can get around that by just 855 00:42:52,040 --> 00:42:55,440 basically using the other big muscles efficiently too. 856 00:42:55,440 --> 00:42:58,480 So you kind of think about that. I think in my opinion, one of 857 00:42:58,480 --> 00:43:01,640 the roles of the vertical force is that if you're able to post 858 00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:04,720 up really powerfully on that lead leg, you can kind of 859 00:43:04,720 --> 00:43:08,720 perform that pole with basically your whole body versus just 860 00:43:08,720 --> 00:43:10,720 having to pull with your hands specifically. 861 00:43:10,760 --> 00:43:13,360 But the last length of that chain is going to be the grip. 862 00:43:13,440 --> 00:43:16,680 So if you don't have the ability to put force into the grip of 863 00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:18,840 the club, you're probably going to get limited in terms of how 864 00:43:18,840 --> 00:43:22,160 fast you can swing, or at least your ability to control a fast 865 00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:23,840 moving swing. That makes sense. 866 00:43:24,680 --> 00:43:29,000 Good, good answer. I guess last, last question, 867 00:43:29,000 --> 00:43:32,280 just like what's your ideal speed session? 868 00:43:32,280 --> 00:43:34,760 So I guess just for context, like the things that I track and 869 00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:39,320 what I've done, just whether it works or not, it's just like I 870 00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:44,120 found, hey, 3045 minutes in the gym beforehand is like, we'll do 871 00:43:44,120 --> 00:43:49,520 wonders for for your speed. And then just like hitting 40 to 872 00:43:50,040 --> 00:43:54,400 70 golf balls, taking some time in there to just use the crap 873 00:43:54,400 --> 00:43:57,040 out of video so you can actually see what you're doing, working 874 00:43:57,040 --> 00:44:00,520 on a few different cues that you need to work on. 875 00:44:00,560 --> 00:44:02,880 That's been the formula that I've just, it's typically like 876 00:44:02,880 --> 00:44:05,320 an hour and a half, right? Like it just takes a long time 877 00:44:05,320 --> 00:44:07,560 when you add the gym component in and all that crap. 878 00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:10,920 What's your perfect speed training session I look like? 879 00:44:11,040 --> 00:44:14,520 It's a bit bit tricky. I'll, I'll give it a single 880 00:44:14,520 --> 00:44:17,320 answer, but part of it is I kind of have sessions that are built 881 00:44:17,320 --> 00:44:20,480 out for different purposes. So during certain parts of the 882 00:44:20,480 --> 00:44:23,640 year, like early offseason, for example, if I've got a golfer 883 00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:26,160 that really needs to increase their speed, we're going to push 884 00:44:26,160 --> 00:44:29,400 kind of the pure club head speed potential a little harder early 885 00:44:29,400 --> 00:44:30,480 on on. And then we're going to 886 00:44:30,480 --> 00:44:34,280 gradually transition and more and more focus on learning how 887 00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:37,320 to strike the ball at speed. I say launch a bit more of the 888 00:44:37,320 --> 00:44:40,240 kind of transfer work and getting it to actually apply to 889 00:44:40,240 --> 00:44:42,520 the course. But if we're kind of focused on, 890 00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:45,840 just like let's say my goal in a session is increasing ball speed 891 00:44:45,840 --> 00:44:50,000 or club head speed, almost always going to have at least 892 00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:53,280 20. Obviously the 2030 minutes would 893 00:44:53,280 --> 00:44:55,440 be great for kind of the physical side. 894 00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:58,240 But it's going to basically go through a process of getting the 895 00:44:58,240 --> 00:45:02,160 heart rate up, getting some blood flow, getting really from 896 00:45:02,160 --> 00:45:04,600 like a physiological perspective as getting the muscle 897 00:45:04,600 --> 00:45:07,480 temperature and blood flow kind of increased because that 898 00:45:07,480 --> 00:45:10,800 actually puts it in a much better position to produce force 899 00:45:10,800 --> 00:45:12,680 and speed. So you're literally warming up 900 00:45:12,680 --> 00:45:15,440 as part of the process. We're going to do some dynamic 901 00:45:15,440 --> 00:45:19,560 mobility to kind of just get the key joints moving and make sure 902 00:45:19,560 --> 00:45:22,360 that the joints are prepared to move in the way we want to. 903 00:45:22,440 --> 00:45:24,600 I'm going to finish up the physical side with something 904 00:45:24,600 --> 00:45:27,640 intense and it's low volume. It's not going to be anything 905 00:45:27,640 --> 00:45:30,440 that wears you out and things like vertical jumps, something 906 00:45:30,440 --> 00:45:32,800 kind of explosive, One, because it feels good. 907 00:45:32,800 --> 00:45:35,440 You feel like you're about ready to move fast and I think the 908 00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:38,200 psychological components important for speed work. 909 00:45:38,200 --> 00:45:41,720 But two, it's doing some things in terms of making sure those 910 00:45:41,720 --> 00:45:43,440 muscles are warm and kind of primed. 911 00:45:44,120 --> 00:45:47,760 Then I'll have kind of a call specific, I call it a warm up, 912 00:45:47,760 --> 00:45:50,760 but I essentially I'll do some things like I call them opening 913 00:45:50,760 --> 00:45:53,080 up the backswing and opening up the downswing. 914 00:45:53,080 --> 00:45:55,920 So with club in hand, I'm kind of working into progressively 915 00:45:55,920 --> 00:46:00,080 bigger ranges, this kind of a golf specific dynamic mobility. 916 00:46:00,640 --> 00:46:03,680 And then I have ramp up swings essentially where I'll start at 917 00:46:03,720 --> 00:46:07,040 fairly low effort and I'm progressively increasing the 918 00:46:07,040 --> 00:46:10,520 effort as kind of an extension of my warm up until I'm hitting 919 00:46:10,520 --> 00:46:13,480 pretty close to kind of my expected, you know, training 920 00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:15,600 speed. One thing I have started working 921 00:46:15,600 --> 00:46:19,120 in is before I get into the Max effort stuff like driving 922 00:46:19,120 --> 00:46:23,360 speeds, I do like to sandwich that at the start and the end 923 00:46:23,360 --> 00:46:27,360 with like gamer swings or hitting a ball, but I'm trying 924 00:46:27,360 --> 00:46:30,200 to swing fast but efficiently as well. 925 00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:33,600 So trying to make speed feel easy just because I've found 926 00:46:33,600 --> 00:46:36,520 that it becomes less an adjustment when I then I have to 927 00:46:36,520 --> 00:46:39,520 go back and learn how to swing fast and strike a ball well as 928 00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:41,560 it's well. So kind of building up kind of 929 00:46:41,560 --> 00:46:44,600 the skill component and bringing the focus back at the end to 930 00:46:44,600 --> 00:46:48,200 like, all right, it's not just making this number go up, it's 931 00:46:48,200 --> 00:46:51,000 also striking a ball efficiently and it's striking it well. 932 00:46:51,600 --> 00:46:53,440 And then the middle of the session is going to be, you 933 00:46:53,440 --> 00:46:56,040 know, I have a few different kind of structures of what it 934 00:46:56,040 --> 00:46:58,360 looks like, but it's generally going to be trying to push the 935 00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:01,400 speed to pretty high levels. And sometimes I'll mix in where 936 00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:04,600 I do a couple swings with a speed stick and then kind of 937 00:47:04,600 --> 00:47:07,400 immediately go into my driver swings, especially if I'm 938 00:47:07,400 --> 00:47:10,560 looking for a very specific type of movement in my swing. 939 00:47:10,640 --> 00:47:14,360 Or sometimes when I just whip the lightspeed stick around, it 940 00:47:14,360 --> 00:47:17,480 just kind of gets me amped up for actually taking the driver 941 00:47:17,480 --> 00:47:19,320 and swinging fast right afterwards. 942 00:47:19,320 --> 00:47:21,880 So that's essentially the structure sometimes, sometimes 943 00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:25,920 I'll make it quick, but an ideal ones probably 45 minutes to an 944 00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:28,200 hour. Once speed starts to drop off 945 00:47:28,200 --> 00:47:31,520 then then I call it quits and I focus more on the kind of like 946 00:47:31,640 --> 00:47:34,000 gamer swings at the end. How many balls are you hitting 947 00:47:34,160 --> 00:47:38,280 do you think? I've tried to more and more fine 948 00:47:38,280 --> 00:47:41,200 tune my warm up where I can get in and out quickly. 949 00:47:41,360 --> 00:47:44,480 It's probably going to be somewhere if you ignore the ramp 950 00:47:44,480 --> 00:47:46,520 up swings that I kind of consider a warm up. 951 00:47:46,520 --> 00:47:51,000 I'm usually trying to shoot for somewhere in the like 25 to 30 952 00:47:51,000 --> 00:47:53,760 Max effort. You definitely could go more 953 00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:56,960 than that, but I've I've tried more and more to make it so that 954 00:47:56,960 --> 00:48:00,720 I feel like I can get to those Max speeds as quick as I can. 955 00:48:00,720 --> 00:48:04,680 One, just to get in and out and not have to spend all day doing 956 00:48:04,680 --> 00:48:07,320 it. But two, just from a workload 957 00:48:07,320 --> 00:48:10,920 perspective, I like the idea of if I can develop sessions where 958 00:48:11,040 --> 00:48:14,240 we can get the same stimulus but with less total work and less 959 00:48:14,240 --> 00:48:18,040 total kind of loading the joints, then that's usually a 960 00:48:18,040 --> 00:48:20,400 good thing when you're working with golf as well. 961 00:48:21,200 --> 00:48:23,680 Yeah, no, it's interesting. I mean, there are clips of 962 00:48:23,680 --> 00:48:26,520 Bryson saying, you know, his speed sessions are 120 balls, 963 00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:29,040 you know, just like massive amounts of of shots. 964 00:48:29,040 --> 00:48:32,040 So it's, it's interesting to hear different thoughts of that. 965 00:48:32,040 --> 00:48:34,600 And I like yours because, yeah, deficiency is huge. 966 00:48:34,680 --> 00:48:37,440 Trying to not take two hours to do to get faster. 967 00:48:38,280 --> 00:48:40,960 Yeah, I mean, I'd say a big part of that is is going to be you 968 00:48:40,960 --> 00:48:43,560 can work up to that. Like what I'd recommend is 969 00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:45,600 Bryson's probably built up to that and same thing. 970 00:48:45,600 --> 00:48:48,480 A lot of the long drive competitors, they've built up to 971 00:48:48,480 --> 00:48:51,400 that ability to do it over the course of months where their 972 00:48:51,400 --> 00:48:53,680 bodies are so used to swinging fast. 973 00:48:53,680 --> 00:48:56,600 And it's a lot of it too. It's like an easy way that I've 974 00:48:56,600 --> 00:48:59,440 found is a lot of people when they first start, they may not 975 00:48:59,440 --> 00:49:02,560 need much more than 15 or 20 balls before their speed starts 976 00:49:02,560 --> 00:49:05,120 to drop off. And then maybe you up that here 977 00:49:05,200 --> 00:49:07,440 more depending on how much time you want to spend. 978 00:49:07,560 --> 00:49:11,280 I'll generally use kind of speed drop offs as a way to tell me 979 00:49:11,280 --> 00:49:14,240 when to stop. So if if speed is plateauing and 980 00:49:14,240 --> 00:49:17,280 dropping off and it's not coming back up, if I give myself a 981 00:49:17,280 --> 00:49:20,240 little extra rest, that's usually kind of a sign to call 982 00:49:20,240 --> 00:49:22,560 it quits and and live to fight another day. 983 00:49:23,040 --> 00:49:25,720 Got it, got it. Do you care at all about like 984 00:49:25,720 --> 00:49:28,400 how fast you're like, do you care if you're just like 1 after 985 00:49:28,400 --> 00:49:31,480 the other go, go or do you feel like you're hit OK, stop back, 986 00:49:32,280 --> 00:49:34,800 recover, OK, hit again. Like, does that matter to you at 987 00:49:34,800 --> 00:49:36,560 all? I've played around with 988 00:49:36,560 --> 00:49:38,680 different ones. I'd be lying if I said I had the 989 00:49:38,680 --> 00:49:41,000 perfect solution. I think there's probably a 990 00:49:41,000 --> 00:49:43,640 balance between. You can get into a rhythm, you 991 00:49:43,640 --> 00:49:47,320 can keep the muscles a bit warmer and it feels better to 992 00:49:47,320 --> 00:49:51,160 hit a few in quick succession. What I'm trying to avoid though 993 00:49:51,160 --> 00:49:56,240 is if having like heart rate just spite people really high 994 00:49:56,240 --> 00:49:58,480 for long periods of time. So I'll usually kind of have 995 00:49:58,480 --> 00:50:01,960 quick succession and then let things kind of ease back in and 996 00:50:01,960 --> 00:50:04,840 then get back into it. A lot of it is just from like a 997 00:50:04,840 --> 00:50:08,800 physiological perspective. Fatigue definitely can disrupt 998 00:50:08,800 --> 00:50:11,360 both the coordination piece if you're trying to think about 999 00:50:11,360 --> 00:50:14,840 building like better patterns at speed, not just like massive 1000 00:50:14,840 --> 00:50:17,160 speed. I don't care how how I 1001 00:50:17,560 --> 00:50:21,200 definitely from like a speed related from like how fast the 1002 00:50:21,200 --> 00:50:24,240 muscle fibers are contracting, how fast you can send signals 1003 00:50:24,240 --> 00:50:26,520 down to the muscles to activate them. 1004 00:50:26,520 --> 00:50:28,840 Fatigue can very quickly effects that. 1005 00:50:28,840 --> 00:50:31,840 So I generally don't want it to be where I'm like completely out 1006 00:50:31,840 --> 00:50:33,640 of breath and just fighting through it. 1007 00:50:33,640 --> 00:50:36,080 So it's kind of soon as the heart rate's starting to get up 1008 00:50:36,080 --> 00:50:38,800 there and I'm a little out of breath, I ease it back down and 1009 00:50:38,800 --> 00:50:41,560 then kind of ramp it back up. So a bit of both I'd say. 1010 00:50:41,720 --> 00:50:45,440 But I'm definitely open to some people say that they love that 1011 00:50:45,440 --> 00:50:48,400 kind of like they need 2030 balls back-to-back to back to 1012 00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:51,760 kind of get up to speed. So could be of an individual 1013 00:50:51,760 --> 00:50:53,840 piece as well. Well, this is fun. 1014 00:50:53,840 --> 00:50:55,760 There are a bunch of other questions I want to ask. 1015 00:50:55,760 --> 00:50:57,120 I feel like we're just getting started. 1016 00:50:57,120 --> 00:51:00,360 But you are great to follow on Instagram. 1017 00:51:00,400 --> 00:51:02,680 You've always got some interesting stuff you're posting 1018 00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:04,480 there. I guess get give folks that will 1019 00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:07,320 do the intro at the end here, but give give folks the rundown 1020 00:51:07,320 --> 00:51:10,040 of kind of like you've talked a lot about speed and the research 1021 00:51:10,040 --> 00:51:11,440 work you do. What do you do? 1022 00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:14,040 What's some of your background? Yeah, we're just, we reverse 1023 00:51:14,040 --> 00:51:15,240 things around here. It's exciting. 1024 00:51:16,160 --> 00:51:19,560 Intro at the end. Yeah, I'd say the the rundown is 1025 00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:23,200 I essentially was a lifelong golfer. 1026 00:51:23,200 --> 00:51:27,480 I wanted that to be some part of what I do, regardless of kind of 1027 00:51:27,480 --> 00:51:30,160 where life and my occupation takes me. 1028 00:51:30,160 --> 00:51:33,880 I'm a sports scientist by trade. So essentially I'm a Masters in 1029 00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:37,920 exercise Physiology, a pH. D In human movement sciences, I 1030 00:51:37,920 --> 00:51:41,040 spent some time in the academic world, so I have something like 1031 00:51:41,040 --> 00:51:46,800 25 peer reviewed publications with probably now fifteen of 1032 00:51:46,800 --> 00:51:50,960 those being golf related in some capacity across kind of strength 1033 00:51:50,960 --> 00:51:53,480 and conditioning. We have some like launch monitor 1034 00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:57,840 validation type papers, did some early papers on warm ups and 1035 00:51:57,840 --> 00:52:01,240 things like that for golf, still publish quite a bit. 1036 00:52:01,240 --> 00:52:04,920 So I still work with some kind of academics in that world. 1037 00:52:04,920 --> 00:52:08,480 But essentially I kind of consult with golfers. 1038 00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:12,640 I try to put out educational material through social media 1039 00:52:12,640 --> 00:52:16,320 and and then I also do kind of the peer reviewed research side. 1040 00:52:16,320 --> 00:52:19,520 So my day job is working with a flywheel training company called 1041 00:52:19,600 --> 00:52:22,280 Xerfly, kind of the applied sports science side. 1042 00:52:22,280 --> 00:52:26,000 But then I also generally have some kind of private 1043 00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:29,440 consultation clients in the golf world working on either speed 1044 00:52:29,440 --> 00:52:31,640 fitness, some combination of those. 1045 00:52:31,640 --> 00:52:35,400 And then I've currently the director of golf Sports science 1046 00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:39,280 for a new Golf performance facility called PGA Frisco or 1047 00:52:39,280 --> 00:52:43,400 Sports Academy PGA Frisco, which is housed within the PGA of 1048 00:52:43,400 --> 00:52:46,520 America Coaching Center. So I'm helping them with a lot 1049 00:52:46,520 --> 00:52:50,000 of the physical assessments, using technology and data to 1050 00:52:50,000 --> 00:52:52,600 kind of improve the fitness process with golfers. 1051 00:52:53,600 --> 00:52:55,320 Love it. And you've got a newsletter. 1052 00:52:55,320 --> 00:52:57,760 I've I've read through your, your newsletter articles and 1053 00:52:57,760 --> 00:52:59,640 stuff are are we are we doing those regularly? 1054 00:52:59,640 --> 00:53:02,520 Do do we need some motivation to keep you going on those or what? 1055 00:53:02,520 --> 00:53:05,440 What's what's happening there? I need to get back to it. 1056 00:53:05,440 --> 00:53:08,880 If anyone has good topics, suggestions I'm happy to dive 1057 00:53:08,880 --> 00:53:12,560 back into it yet. The plan is to get back into do 1058 00:53:12,560 --> 00:53:16,280 it semi regularly. What I found was the last few 1059 00:53:16,560 --> 00:53:19,640 took a lot out of me in terms of the amount of work to fit 1060 00:53:19,640 --> 00:53:20,440 together. So. 1061 00:53:20,560 --> 00:53:22,880 But yeah I'm trying to get back into a normal routine. 1062 00:53:22,880 --> 00:53:26,160 I'll probably try to post every either every two weeks or once a 1063 00:53:26,160 --> 00:53:28,880 month or something like that depending on how big of a top. 1064 00:53:28,880 --> 00:53:31,400 OK, we'll link those up, then we'll link those up when this 1065 00:53:31,400 --> 00:53:33,680 comes out. And then, hey, you let me know 1066 00:53:33,680 --> 00:53:35,600 when you got more coming out and we'll link those up too. 1067 00:53:35,600 --> 00:53:38,000 We'll we'll keep keep blasting those. 1068 00:53:38,000 --> 00:53:41,920 But Alex, it was it was super fun to to learn from you here 1069 00:53:41,920 --> 00:53:44,800 and dive into some more and we'll do it again because you 1070 00:53:44,800 --> 00:53:48,160 always I should just hit you up every interesting Instagram post 1071 00:53:48,160 --> 00:53:50,520 and just say, tell me more about this. 1072 00:53:50,680 --> 00:53:52,120 Sounds good, always happy too.