1 00:00:01,760 --> 00:00:05,560 Anyone with a child will tell you having a baby is life 2 00:00:05,640 --> 00:00:09,520 changing in all of the best ways, but in a lot of ways that 3 00:00:09,520 --> 00:00:13,480 are also hard at the time of pregnancy and that first year of 4 00:00:13,480 --> 00:00:17,480 early childhood is critical not just for mommy, but children 5 00:00:17,480 --> 00:00:19,480 biologically and developmentally. 6 00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:23,200 What happens in this really brief window of pregnancy? 7 00:00:23,200 --> 00:00:25,800 Infancy literally shapes your entire life course. 8 00:00:26,120 --> 00:00:28,360 And when I first learned like that, that this is when families 9 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:31,120 are poorest, I kind of freaked out because like, as a 10 00:00:31,120 --> 00:00:34,280 pediatrician, this is the most important window of child 11 00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:36,880 development. That's Doctor Mona Hannah. 12 00:00:37,120 --> 00:00:39,560 You might know her as the Doctor Who is at the center of the 13 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:44,000 Flint water crisis. Known as Doctor Mona, she has 14 00:00:44,000 --> 00:00:46,160 helped expose the Flint water crisis. 15 00:00:46,160 --> 00:00:51,000 In 2015, the Flint pediatrician who helped expose the dangerous 16 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:53,680 levels of lead in Flint. The turning point came when a 17 00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:57,000 local pediatrician found conclusive proof that the 18 00:00:57,000 --> 00:01:00,600 children of Flint were being exposed to high levels of lead 19 00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:04,319 in their water and prompted the state to declare an emergency. 20 00:01:05,080 --> 00:01:07,480 Doctor Mona helped to guide the city of Flint through a 21 00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:11,560 monumental public health crisis, and she fought for Flint to have 22 00:01:11,560 --> 00:01:14,040 safe drinking water flowing from their faucets. 23 00:01:14,600 --> 00:01:17,920 She's now taking on a different public health crisis, poverty 24 00:01:17,920 --> 00:01:24,720 during pregnancy. And we are the only country in 25 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:27,280 comparison to pure countries that does not have paid parental 26 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:30,040 leave. Doctor Mona's new program aims 27 00:01:30,040 --> 00:01:32,520 to change that, and it's called RX Kids. 28 00:01:33,320 --> 00:01:36,480 It is the nation's first community wide maternal and 29 00:01:36,480 --> 00:01:38,120 infant cash prescription program. 30 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:41,840 Yes, you heard that right. Cash prescriptions. 31 00:01:42,320 --> 00:01:45,920 A prescription for money. A program that is giving every 32 00:01:45,920 --> 00:01:50,760 expected mother in the city of Flint, no strings attached, cash 33 00:01:50,760 --> 00:01:54,840 funding to help with the myriad of expenses and financial 34 00:01:54,840 --> 00:01:57,520 stressors that come along with having a baby. 35 00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:01,080 RX Kids started in Flint in 2024. 36 00:02:01,480 --> 00:02:04,560 Now, a year later, they're in eight different Michigan 37 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:06,600 counties. Like, this is not a teeny itsy 38 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:09,639 bitsy pilot. This is like like the largest 39 00:02:09,800 --> 00:02:13,240 cash transfer program right now in the country and we are 40 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:16,120 literally eliminating poverty and improving health. 41 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:21,640 Welcome to Path Breakers, a show about what it takes to cut 42 00:02:21,640 --> 00:02:25,160 through the noise and read tape and all of the other obstacles 43 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:27,960 to progress. I'm Tracy Pearson and I work on 44 00:02:27,960 --> 00:02:30,600 the communications team at the Kresge Foundation. 45 00:02:31,200 --> 00:02:33,480 And I'm Jamie Bennett, and I work at the intersection of 46 00:02:33,520 --> 00:02:35,880 arts, culture, and equitable community development. 47 00:02:36,560 --> 00:02:39,400 On each episode of this series, we talk with a different path 48 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:41,600 breaker who's forging a new way forward. 49 00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:45,720 Today, we're talking to Doctor Mona Hanna about what happens 50 00:02:45,720 --> 00:02:49,400 when you ensure economic stability for new mothers and do 51 00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:52,280 it in a way that centers love and trust. 52 00:02:57,600 --> 00:03:00,720 Well, let's get started. So, Doctor Mona, you saw 53 00:03:00,720 --> 00:03:04,800 something that others were unwilling to see in Flint, or 54 00:03:04,800 --> 00:03:07,320 perhaps unable to see what within. 55 00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:10,160 You refuse to look away. And of course, I'm talking about 56 00:03:10,160 --> 00:03:12,840 that very, very unfortunate situation with the water. 57 00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:16,720 What gave you sort of the moral clarity to act even when other 58 00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:20,000 institutions resisted seeing what was sort of before them? 59 00:03:20,920 --> 00:03:23,840 So, Tracy, you pretty much kind of summed up the title of my 60 00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:25,720 book, which is what the eyes don't see. 61 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:29,680 So there was a blindness. There was a blindness in Flint 62 00:03:29,760 --> 00:03:35,280 to our kiddos, to the to the problem, to the, to the place so 63 00:03:35,280 --> 00:03:39,800 many people refuse to see this crisis, this emblematic 64 00:03:39,800 --> 00:03:42,920 environmental and public health crisis that was potentially 65 00:03:43,440 --> 00:03:46,600 threatening, you know, the future of an entire population 66 00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:49,320 of children. And when I heard about the 67 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:53,360 possibility of lead being in the water in Flint, like I could not 68 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:59,360 Unsee like once I once I heard that possibility, like my life 69 00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:02,280 changed. And that was driven by a lot of 70 00:04:02,280 --> 00:04:03,880 things. But most importantly, it was 71 00:04:03,880 --> 00:04:07,160 driven by kind of my role as a pediatrician in the community. 72 00:04:07,160 --> 00:04:09,760 Like I have literally taken an oath to protect children. 73 00:04:10,200 --> 00:04:12,720 And that means not just making sure that they're healthy today 74 00:04:12,720 --> 00:04:15,280 and doing their checkups and giving their vaccines, but it is 75 00:04:15,280 --> 00:04:18,160 about making sure that our kids have the brightest future 76 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:21,200 possible. And knowing that there was lead 77 00:04:21,200 --> 00:04:25,560 in the water, even the potential of lead in the water, really 78 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:30,120 afforded me a choiceless choice of just moving forward, being 79 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:34,360 driven by our kiddos, and making sure that they had the brightest 80 00:04:34,360 --> 00:04:37,400 future possible. And how did you even know there 81 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:39,160 was lead in the water? I mean, I know there was some 82 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:43,080 conversation about this, but I mean, you don't work in water. 83 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:45,480 You don't work in public works. I'm guessing you're not a 84 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:47,960 welder. Like, I mean, how did this come 85 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:50,080 to be known and so present for you? 86 00:04:50,320 --> 00:04:53,040 Jamie, I actually am a welder. No, just kidding. 87 00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:56,400 I'm not a welder. I'm not a plumber, but, you 88 00:04:56,400 --> 00:05:00,720 know, I was. I was a kid that grew up in 89 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:04,560 metro Detroit that really got into environmental activism, 90 00:05:05,160 --> 00:05:08,360 helped shut down an incinerator when I was in high school in 91 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:10,520 kind of Kresge's backyard in Madison Heights. 92 00:05:10,960 --> 00:05:14,680 And that kind of environmentalism pushed me into 93 00:05:14,680 --> 00:05:17,360 a career in environmental health, but pushed a lot of my 94 00:05:17,360 --> 00:05:20,320 peers that were so involved in this environmental 95 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:23,640 environmentalism in high school into other really awesome 96 00:05:23,640 --> 00:05:26,480 environmental careers. So my best friend in high school 97 00:05:26,480 --> 00:05:29,960 became an environmental engineer and lo and behold, became a 98 00:05:29,960 --> 00:05:33,960 drinking water expert. She worked at the EPA, went on 99 00:05:33,960 --> 00:05:38,360 to work at like other water agencies in DC, and then she 100 00:05:38,360 --> 00:05:40,800 decided to come back home to Michigan to be closer to her 101 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:43,080 family. So my bestie, who I've known 102 00:05:43,080 --> 00:05:47,200 forever, who is of all things a drinking water expert, was at my 103 00:05:47,200 --> 00:05:49,000 house. And like, we were just hanging 104 00:05:49,000 --> 00:05:52,400 out chilling. Our kids were playing, and it 105 00:05:52,400 --> 00:05:56,000 was through her that I learned that Flint's water wasn't being 106 00:05:56,000 --> 00:05:58,520 treated properly. And because it wasn't being 107 00:05:58,520 --> 00:06:03,120 treated properly, it was going to be super corrosive, which 108 00:06:03,120 --> 00:06:05,800 meant that whatever was in the plumbing was going to come out 109 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:07,360 of the plumbing and into the drinking water. 110 00:06:07,360 --> 00:06:11,640 So it was my high school girlfriend over a glass of wine 111 00:06:11,680 --> 00:06:15,440 in my house with our children running around that first kind 112 00:06:15,440 --> 00:06:18,800 of, you know, let me know of the possibility of lead being in the 113 00:06:18,800 --> 00:06:21,280 water. So make all kinds of friends, 114 00:06:21,280 --> 00:06:24,800 stay connected to besties. You know, I think that's one of 115 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:29,000 the most important lessons I've learned is, is just how critical 116 00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:32,640 it is to, you know, be surrounded by people who do 117 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:34,600 different things. You know, we live in a very, 118 00:06:34,760 --> 00:06:37,520 very siloed environment. We hang out with folks who are 119 00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:40,400 just like us. And it is so important to hang 120 00:06:40,400 --> 00:06:42,800 out with all kinds of different people, with all kinds of 121 00:06:42,800 --> 00:06:45,200 different backgrounds and experiences, because we ask 122 00:06:45,200 --> 00:06:47,720 different questions and we come up with different solutions. 123 00:06:48,640 --> 00:06:52,880 Yeah, I, I, what I'm hearing is community because I have a 5 124 00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:56,240 year old and an 8 month old and so much of what I know about 125 00:06:56,240 --> 00:07:00,000 mothering, I get through community and, you know, we 126 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:01,920 solve our problems in that community. 127 00:07:01,920 --> 00:07:04,680 And I love my pediatrician and I love the school system, but it's 128 00:07:04,680 --> 00:07:08,320 when I'm in community with other and different types of parents 129 00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:11,080 and caregivers that I learn and get so much. 130 00:07:11,080 --> 00:07:15,080 So I love that that is where that dialogue happened and how 131 00:07:15,080 --> 00:07:18,280 that sort of got the ball rolling on this really big issue 132 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:21,560 being addressed. I want to ask you, how did you 133 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:25,080 arrive in Flint? Oh, that's a great question and 134 00:07:25,080 --> 00:07:27,520 I'll only spend like the next two hours answering it. 135 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:33,640 So, so I, my family immigrated to this country when I was about 136 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:36,680 four or five. So we are Iraqi American. 137 00:07:36,680 --> 00:07:40,280 So came here kind of for freedom and opportunity and an American 138 00:07:40,280 --> 00:07:43,440 dream, but actually landed in the Upper Peninsula, Michigan. 139 00:07:43,600 --> 00:07:46,120 My dad did a postdoc at Michigan Tech University. 140 00:07:46,320 --> 00:07:50,400 He's a metallurgical engineer. After a few years in the UP, he 141 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:53,600 came, we came downstate and he worked at General Motors and my 142 00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:59,160 mom became a teacher and grew up in metro Detroit, like so much 143 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:03,680 of the Arab American diaspora. Went to school at the University 144 00:08:03,680 --> 00:08:06,680 of Michigan for my undergrad in environmental health, which I 145 00:08:06,680 --> 00:08:09,880 kind of created on my own, but then went to medical school at 146 00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:12,520 Michigan State University, the College of Human Medicine, which 147 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:15,760 is this really neat and different kind of medical 148 00:08:15,760 --> 00:08:18,280 school. You know, it's really kind of, I 149 00:08:18,280 --> 00:08:21,400 think the embodiment of the Lane Grant University. 150 00:08:21,400 --> 00:08:23,840 It's all about serving the people of our great state. 151 00:08:24,680 --> 00:08:27,200 And you know, it's the very first community based medical 152 00:08:27,200 --> 00:08:30,600 school in the country with this mission of serving the 153 00:08:30,600 --> 00:08:33,919 underserved and really kind of a primary care focus. 154 00:08:33,919 --> 00:08:36,440 So it was definitely kind of the work that I wanted to do. 155 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:39,960 And from the beginning of the medical school, you know, they 156 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:44,440 had a focus of, you know, training clinicians in all parts 157 00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:47,040 of the state. So there's been AUP campus like 158 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:49,880 forever about campuses throughout the state, and 159 00:08:49,880 --> 00:08:53,280 there's been a campus in Flint for over 60 years training 160 00:08:53,280 --> 00:08:57,160 medical school students. So I was a medical student and 161 00:08:57,160 --> 00:09:00,200 where I did my last two years of medical school in Flint. 162 00:09:00,760 --> 00:09:03,120 And that is where I fell in love with the city. 163 00:09:03,240 --> 00:09:06,200 I fell in love with the people. I fell in love with the history 164 00:09:06,200 --> 00:09:08,680 and the grit and the loyalty and the pride. 165 00:09:09,120 --> 00:09:11,400 And that's also where I fell in love with Pediatrics. 166 00:09:11,400 --> 00:09:13,120 I just fell in love with the little people. 167 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:15,200 And then I left. I left to Detroit. 168 00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:17,760 I, I went to the Children's Hospital Michigan in Detroit, 169 00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:19,720 where I did my my residency training. 170 00:09:20,320 --> 00:09:22,720 I stayed another year as a chief resident, stayed a few more 171 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:26,080 years at Wayne State University. And then in 2011, the 172 00:09:26,080 --> 00:09:30,640 opportunity came to come back to Flint as a residency director. 173 00:09:30,640 --> 00:09:33,160 And it was just this kind of perfect moment for me to give 174 00:09:33,160 --> 00:09:37,680 back to a city that had given me so much and to kind of be in a 175 00:09:37,680 --> 00:09:41,320 position to train the next generation of pediatricians to 176 00:09:41,320 --> 00:09:44,280 really not just treat, you know, ear infections, but try to 177 00:09:44,280 --> 00:09:46,320 address these upstream inequities that make our 178 00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:49,680 patients sick. Tracy, how does it feel that she 179 00:09:49,680 --> 00:09:53,720 picked Flint over Detroit? Yeah, I, I love for both, love 180 00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:56,920 for both. We've spent some time in the 181 00:09:56,920 --> 00:09:59,600 Children's Hospital in Detroit. So thank you for your service 182 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:01,680 and and your colleagues service there. 183 00:10:02,640 --> 00:10:05,160 But you know, it's for the babies, and I want all babies to 184 00:10:05,160 --> 00:10:09,320 have excellent care babies. All babies, all babies. 185 00:10:09,440 --> 00:10:15,680 I love, I love children's. I was there before it became a 186 00:10:15,680 --> 00:10:18,120 for profit, you know, I was there. 187 00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:20,320 I don't, maybe I'm being nostalgic or I was there during 188 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:23,800 the best time. So, you know, and I, I'm, I am 189 00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:26,400 so grateful for my training and for the ability to be there. 190 00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:28,880 And I never thought I would, would have left children's 191 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:32,320 because it was an amazing place. It's a massive free standing 192 00:10:32,320 --> 00:10:35,720 Children's Hospital. I was in charge of training of 193 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:40,160 hundreds of people. It was, it was joyful work and 194 00:10:40,160 --> 00:10:44,360 like, I actually like, I didn't want to leave and that I, I, my 195 00:10:44,360 --> 00:10:46,080 colleague pushed me to interview in Flint. 196 00:10:46,080 --> 00:10:47,280 I'm like, I am not going to Flint. 197 00:10:47,280 --> 00:10:50,440 Like, why would I go to Flint? It is this tiny, tiny hospital. 198 00:10:50,760 --> 00:10:53,840 Like why would I leave Detroit? She's like, just go, just check 199 00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:57,200 it out. And, you know, it was when I 200 00:10:57,200 --> 00:11:00,680 went to Flint, you know, I realized like, you know, the 201 00:11:00,680 --> 00:11:03,080 same struggles are in Detroit that are, are in Flint, You 202 00:11:03,080 --> 00:11:06,120 know, and this is another community where they they need, 203 00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:10,560 they need people, they need folks who care kind of who are 204 00:11:10,560 --> 00:11:12,040 leading kind of with their heart. 205 00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:15,720 And, and it was a challenge. And I love challenges. 206 00:11:16,360 --> 00:11:18,440 So that's one of the reasons that I came back to Flint. 207 00:11:18,720 --> 00:11:21,280 But I think the biggest reason that I came back is that 208 00:11:21,280 --> 00:11:25,040 Michigan State University was about to take a deep dive in 209 00:11:25,040 --> 00:11:28,520 Flint in terms of public health. They were doing something that 210 00:11:28,520 --> 00:11:31,280 had never been done before. They asked the community of 211 00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:35,880 Flint, hey, if we were going to like build public health here in 212 00:11:35,920 --> 00:11:37,600 in Flint, like, how would we do it? 213 00:11:38,360 --> 00:11:42,480 So all of MSU's public health programming is based in Flint, 214 00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:45,880 and that's driven by community. The community identified big 215 00:11:45,880 --> 00:11:48,080 issues that they wanted the university to work on. 216 00:11:48,560 --> 00:11:51,240 The university hired translation researchers not to just like, 217 00:11:51,240 --> 00:11:55,040 observe and study, but really to make make things better. 218 00:11:55,880 --> 00:11:59,600 So that is also what drew me back to Flint to be able to be 219 00:11:59,600 --> 00:12:04,160 part of this round up, never been before done effort to work 220 00:12:04,160 --> 00:12:08,880 hand in hand with community to address big issues in in public 221 00:12:08,880 --> 00:12:11,120 health. And can I ask, I don't mean to 222 00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:14,520 be dense, but sort of when I think about health and when I 223 00:12:14,520 --> 00:12:17,760 think about doctors, right? There's someone I go see in a 224 00:12:17,760 --> 00:12:21,200 room once a year who sort of, you know, pokes at me, prods at 225 00:12:21,200 --> 00:12:23,400 me, writes me prescription if I need it, right? 226 00:12:23,400 --> 00:12:26,280 I mean, health and doctors is something that take place in a 227 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:28,280 closed room in a hospital or clinic. 228 00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:31,760 But help me into understanding what this public health is. 229 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:36,240 Jamie, that is, that is such, such a good question. 230 00:12:36,840 --> 00:12:39,000 And I think this is kind of something that a lot of folks 231 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:42,080 are confused about. They're like, there's healthcare 232 00:12:42,400 --> 00:12:48,160 and there's health and we spend and we people confuse the two 233 00:12:48,160 --> 00:12:50,560 like aren't they the same thing? And they're actually not the 234 00:12:50,560 --> 00:12:53,960 same thing. So Healthcare is that, that 235 00:12:53,960 --> 00:12:59,120 one-on-one that that, you know, often in a hospital or clinic 236 00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:00,920 encounter that we have with people. 237 00:13:01,600 --> 00:13:04,360 And we spend a lot of money in this nation. 238 00:13:04,360 --> 00:13:08,160 Actually we spend more than any other country on healthcare, 239 00:13:08,520 --> 00:13:11,600 which is by and large a sickness based system. 240 00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:15,400 It's a profit driven sickness based system that is after the 241 00:13:15,400 --> 00:13:20,960 fact and reactive. We don't focus on health, and 242 00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:23,840 that is keeping people healthy. And that's often what the kind 243 00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:25,640 of the domain of public health is. 244 00:13:26,160 --> 00:13:30,000 It is stronger environmental regulations, it is economic 245 00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:33,640 stability. It is universal childcare. 246 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:37,280 It is, you know, all these other things which are normal in other 247 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:40,000 countries that keep people healthy. 248 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:43,720 And because we don't spend much on public health and because we 249 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:47,920 spend so much on healthcare, our health outcomes as a nation are 250 00:13:47,960 --> 00:13:50,960 actually kind of terrible, you know, in terms of maternal 251 00:13:50,960 --> 00:13:54,840 mortality and morbidity and infant outcomes and life 252 00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:58,440 expectancy. So there is a mismatch in terms 253 00:13:58,440 --> 00:14:02,560 of where we invest and what our outcomes are because we don't 254 00:14:02,560 --> 00:14:05,280 invest in prevention and public health. 255 00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:10,360 So I often say like we are, we are putting really expensive 256 00:14:10,360 --> 00:14:15,920 band aids on bleeding social wounds because we are not 257 00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:20,280 investing in health and we are reactively spending a lot on 258 00:14:20,280 --> 00:14:23,560 healthcare. So that that kind of brings us 259 00:14:23,560 --> 00:14:29,040 to this RX Kids program. So what is RX Kids? 260 00:14:29,360 --> 00:14:33,720 Oh my gosh, Jamie, Ark's Kids is like pure love and joy. 261 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:37,880 We call Ark's Kids a prescription for health, hope 262 00:14:37,920 --> 00:14:41,360 and opportunity. So, you know, as I, I'm a 263 00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:44,400 practicing pediatrician to this day, and it is my greatest joy 264 00:14:44,400 --> 00:14:46,240 when I get to hang out with our kiddos. 265 00:14:46,920 --> 00:14:51,640 And for so long, you know, I have felt frustrated as a 266 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:56,120 pediatrician because I have been unable to treat this really 267 00:14:56,280 --> 00:14:59,960 terrible pathogen, this thing that makes kids and communities 268 00:14:59,960 --> 00:15:04,360 sick, which is poverty. And I end up treating the 269 00:15:04,360 --> 00:15:07,720 consequences of poverty, be it misappointments or developmental 270 00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:11,600 delays or filling the thrive or childhood obesity or the list 271 00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:15,920 goes on, because we have not dressed this root cause, this 272 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:20,000 social determinant of health, which is, which is poverty. 273 00:15:20,160 --> 00:15:24,880 And it turns out that families are poorest in this maternal 274 00:15:24,880 --> 00:15:27,280 infant period. So, you know, all those folks 275 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:30,400 out there who are listening who had a child, like, Oh my God, 276 00:15:30,400 --> 00:15:33,640 when you are having a baby, like there is so much stuff you need 277 00:15:33,640 --> 00:15:37,000 to buy like car seats and strollers and diapers and 278 00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:39,680 packing plays and like, you know, the list goes on and on. 279 00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:42,560 It's estimated that just that first year of life is an added 280 00:15:42,560 --> 00:15:46,320 $20,000 in expenses. And this is happening at this 281 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:48,840 time of a perfect storm where income is dropping. 282 00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:52,080 Moms often have to come out of the workforce so there's a drop 283 00:15:52,080 --> 00:15:56,960 in income, expenses rise. So this is a perfect storm of an 284 00:15:56,960 --> 00:15:59,920 economic shock, the greatest economic shock in your life 285 00:15:59,920 --> 00:16:05,640 course. We have learned so much in terms 286 00:16:05,640 --> 00:16:08,640 of early childhood and the consequences of early adversity 287 00:16:08,640 --> 00:16:11,120 and toxic stress. Literally what happens in this, 288 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:16,040 this milieu, this, this, this short period of time predicts 289 00:16:16,040 --> 00:16:20,400 what happens on later in life. And we as a society, as a nation 290 00:16:20,400 --> 00:16:23,040 have been abandoning our Mamas and babies. 291 00:16:23,320 --> 00:16:26,200 So when I'm in clinic and I'm holding a little newborn in my 292 00:16:26,200 --> 00:16:30,600 hands and that newborn is like wide eyed and staring at me, 293 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:33,920 right, with like bright eyed potential. 294 00:16:34,120 --> 00:16:38,760 Like, you know, it is so frustrating when I know that zip 295 00:16:38,760 --> 00:16:42,000 code that that kid is born into. And I know that that zip code 296 00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:46,200 and that that environment, that milieu that, you know, that 297 00:16:46,200 --> 00:16:49,080 situation is predicted of anything. 298 00:16:49,080 --> 00:16:51,320 You know, it is predicted of their life course more than 299 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:53,400 anything else that I can do as a clinician. 300 00:16:53,960 --> 00:16:59,680 So RX kids is like this bold, impossible effort to say no, to 301 00:16:59,680 --> 00:17:02,240 refuse the status quo. And, and kind of in the same 302 00:17:02,240 --> 00:17:06,079 spirit of our work with the water like flip story, the the 303 00:17:06,079 --> 00:17:09,839 story of our environmental crisis more than the story of a 304 00:17:09,839 --> 00:17:11,720 crisis. It is a story of resistance. 305 00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:14,119 It is a story of a group of people that came together and 306 00:17:14,119 --> 00:17:18,000 said, no, we can do better on behalf of our kiddos. 307 00:17:18,040 --> 00:17:20,839 And we resisted. And since then, we have been 308 00:17:20,839 --> 00:17:24,359 building hand in hand with community and so many partners, 309 00:17:24,680 --> 00:17:27,640 a model of recovery to make sure our kids have the brightest 310 00:17:27,640 --> 00:17:30,000 future possible and to make sure that kids everywhere, in 311 00:17:30,000 --> 00:17:32,680 communities, everywhere don't have to go what we have gone 312 00:17:32,680 --> 00:17:35,280 through. And in that same spirit of 313 00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:40,280 resistance, we are now resisting to have our babies, our precious 314 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:43,280 babies, being born into and growing up in poverty. 315 00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:48,240 So RX Kids is this impossible effort of eliminating poverty 316 00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:52,000 for Mamas and babies. So every pregnant Mama in the 317 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:56,520 city of Flint gets $1500 in the middle of pregnancy and then 318 00:17:56,520 --> 00:17:59,160 once a baby is born it is $500 a month. 319 00:17:59,280 --> 00:18:05,000 It is for everyone, no strings attached, no conditions. 320 00:18:05,680 --> 00:18:10,720 And that universality and that unconditionality conveys these 321 00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:16,080 really important values, dignity and deservingness and love. 322 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:18,480 Love. This is a program built on love 323 00:18:18,840 --> 00:18:21,640 and trust and freedom and choice. 324 00:18:21,800 --> 00:18:25,520 All of these values that are not seen in other kind of social 325 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:29,280 programs that often are stigmatizing and shameful, 326 00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:32,520 shameful and often administered in very kind of systemically 327 00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:35,640 racist ways that have vilified our Mamas and our babies. 328 00:18:35,880 --> 00:18:39,920 So we are up ending all of that with RX Kids. 329 00:18:39,920 --> 00:18:43,160 So that's what RX Kids is. And it started in Flint. 330 00:18:43,240 --> 00:18:46,600 We're in eight counties already in Michigan, and it's spreading 331 00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:49,040 all over the nation. Doctor Mona, you are really 332 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:52,200 talking to me. I will tell you just fully 333 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:55,840 transparent. When you are in that period of 334 00:18:55,840 --> 00:18:57,840 carrying a child, you feel so vulnerable. 335 00:18:58,040 --> 00:19:00,080 It's so. Hard, you know, you're, you're 336 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:02,480 making, you're going to, you're doing the test and you're going 337 00:19:02,480 --> 00:19:04,960 to the appointments and you got to buy this and you got to do 338 00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:08,480 that. And so to have that added stress 339 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:15,200 of financing all of this be removed, that, that is 340 00:19:15,280 --> 00:19:18,320 monumental for mothers and families and people just wanting 341 00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:20,560 to support mothers and knowing that they'll be OK. 342 00:19:20,560 --> 00:19:23,240 Like you don't have to worry about how you will get to that, 343 00:19:23,240 --> 00:19:25,600 to that doctor's appointment because you can pay for the Uber 344 00:19:25,600 --> 00:19:29,320 there now, you can pay for the, the, the, you know, whatever you 345 00:19:29,320 --> 00:19:33,000 need, medications you need. So it's wonderful. 346 00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:37,280 You can pay for a rent, you can pay for food, you can, you don't 347 00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:40,120 have to worry between diapers and dinner. 348 00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:44,480 And we, we hear that, we're seeing that in the data, that 349 00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:48,600 stress relief that, that mama's saying like, I can breathe a 350 00:19:48,600 --> 00:19:50,240 weights been lifted off my shoulder. 351 00:19:50,240 --> 00:19:53,080 I can be present. I can be the amazing Mama I 352 00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:55,120 always knew I was. Absolutely. 353 00:19:55,560 --> 00:19:58,320 And you said this word deserving this, and many policies are 354 00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:02,200 built on this idea of deserving this and it's terrible, but our 355 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:07,400 kids rejects that. The What message do you hope the 356 00:20:07,400 --> 00:20:10,480 program sends to Mothers of Flint, but also to policymakers 357 00:20:10,480 --> 00:20:14,400 across the country that can implement this in in various 358 00:20:14,400 --> 00:20:17,960 other communities? Yeah, so you know, Ark's Kids is 359 00:20:18,120 --> 00:20:22,680 once again, we started in Flint in January of 20/20/24, thanks 360 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:24,880 to Kresge and thanks to so many amazing partners. 361 00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:28,680 And then this year we are in the city of Kalamazoo. 362 00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:31,160 We're in five counties in the eastern Upper Peninsula. 363 00:20:31,160 --> 00:20:32,720 We're live in the city of Pontiac. 364 00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:34,960 It's about to go live in other kind of southeast Michigan 365 00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:38,040 communities. There's a, you know, there's 366 00:20:38,040 --> 00:20:40,800 legislation right now in the state to make it a statewide 367 00:20:41,120 --> 00:20:44,080 thing because everybody wants this. 368 00:20:44,080 --> 00:20:47,960 Everybody needs this. It is so common sense and really 369 00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:50,080 kind of we've had bipartisan support. 370 00:20:50,120 --> 00:20:53,440 All kinds of folks understand how hard it is to bring a baby 371 00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:55,480 into the world. Like, you know, people are like, 372 00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:57,320 Oh my God, Mona, your job is so hard. 373 00:20:57,320 --> 00:21:00,880 I'm like being a mom is so hard. Like that is the being a parent. 374 00:21:00,880 --> 00:21:03,720 It is the hardest job in the world is to be a parent, 375 00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:06,680 especially kind of in that in that first year life. 376 00:21:06,680 --> 00:21:11,280 So we're excited about the enthusiasm throughout the state 377 00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:12,560 and really throughout the nation. 378 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:14,800 There's a lot of other states that are looking at adopting our 379 00:21:14,800 --> 00:21:17,880 kids as well. And, you know, once again, it is 380 00:21:17,880 --> 00:21:21,160 about economic stability. And this is an an evidence based 381 00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:23,280 program. Programs like this are done 382 00:21:23,280 --> 00:21:25,560 throughout the world. This is not a new brilliant 383 00:21:25,560 --> 00:21:27,240 idea. You know, this is really based 384 00:21:27,240 --> 00:21:30,720 on mountains of evidence. We did something like this as a 385 00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:34,040 nation during the expanded child tax credit in 2021, where child 386 00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:36,120 poverty dropped to the lowest level ever. 387 00:21:36,400 --> 00:21:38,680 That was not renewed by one vote in the US Senate. 388 00:21:38,680 --> 00:21:41,880 So it became really important to do something of a, you know, to 389 00:21:41,880 --> 00:21:44,840 keep this work in the public imagination at a scale that 390 00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:47,400 hadn't been done before. Like we are running the largest 391 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:48,680 cash transfer program in the country. 392 00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:51,920 That's amazing. So that, you know, so yes, we're 393 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:55,160 eliminating poverty. We have amazing health outcomes. 394 00:21:55,520 --> 00:22:00,040 But Tracy, what what is the most exciting thing is these values 395 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:03,280 that we are sharing and the narrative work that we are 396 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:05,480 doing. You know, we celebrated the 397 00:22:05,480 --> 00:22:08,360 launch of Arcs Kids last year on Valentine's Day because it's 398 00:22:08,360 --> 00:22:11,440 about love. This year, the UP program was 399 00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:13,360 announced on this year's Valentine's Day. 400 00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:18,600 Every baby in Flint gets A and any Rs Kids community gets a 401 00:22:18,600 --> 00:22:21,720 onesie when they're born that says love and another onesie 402 00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:25,240 that says best baby ever and they get a card from the 403 00:22:25,240 --> 00:22:28,000 governor of Michigan. Every baby that says welcome our 404 00:22:28,000 --> 00:22:30,240 newest Michigander. We are so happy you're here. 405 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:32,400 We love you and we can't wait to see what you grow. 406 00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:34,880 Up and we care about. You, we care about you. 407 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:38,520 We care about you. So, you know, this work is about 408 00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:42,600 all these different outcomes, but it's also so much about how 409 00:22:42,600 --> 00:22:44,680 can we reimagine the social contract. 410 00:22:44,680 --> 00:22:47,960 Like how can we reimagine that relationship that individuals 411 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:51,280 have with government institutions and academia and 412 00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:53,840 philanthropy? And, you know, I was with a Mama 413 00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:57,200 yesterday who was part of the program and, and somebody asked 414 00:22:57,200 --> 00:23:00,000 her, like, when you think of this program, who do you think 415 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:03,480 is bringing you this program? You know, and the mom said, I 416 00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:07,480 see it as a whole community that has come together to support to 417 00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:09,520 support us. And that's what it is. 418 00:23:09,800 --> 00:23:12,720 Because like, you know, this program is led by a university 419 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:15,840 in partnership with a nonprofit, but the funding is public and 420 00:23:15,840 --> 00:23:18,720 private, the state dollars and federal dollars and 421 00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:20,560 philanthropic dollars and corporate dollars. 422 00:23:20,560 --> 00:23:23,680 So there's a whole community that has come together to 423 00:23:23,680 --> 00:23:28,200 support our, you know, our Mamas and our families in this kind of 424 00:23:28,200 --> 00:23:32,000 historic place based way. So, you know, those, those 425 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:36,200 values are like are, are so much that are part of this program. 426 00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:39,840 And and that's something that we, you know, hope to continue 427 00:23:39,840 --> 00:23:42,400 to instill as we continue to expand. 428 00:23:42,480 --> 00:23:45,080 And we actually seeing it play out, not just in these like, you 429 00:23:45,080 --> 00:23:48,080 know, anecdotal statements by moms, but like in our big 430 00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:49,800 surveys and our big research data. 431 00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:53,040 Our Mamas who are part of our kids feel more loved, they feel 432 00:23:53,040 --> 00:23:56,280 more respected, they feel more empowered. 433 00:23:56,880 --> 00:23:59,480 Our moms actually have more trust, which is amazing in 434 00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:03,640 government institutions. We actually even we are seeing 435 00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:07,160 more civic engagement in the last election, we actually had 436 00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:10,800 more women of childbearing age in Flint turn out to vote and 437 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:13,680 register to vote in comparison to any other community and in 438 00:24:13,680 --> 00:24:15,880 comparison to to men and older women. 439 00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:19,080 So really, really great other data points that's that are 440 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:22,240 showing that these values which we think are so critical to this 441 00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:26,360 program of once again of dignity and love and deservingness and 442 00:24:26,360 --> 00:24:28,280 trust are also being translated can. 443 00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:32,120 I ask. So this notion of cash 444 00:24:32,120 --> 00:24:36,440 prescriptions is so interesting for me because on the one hand, 445 00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:39,640 poverty seems like a relatively easy thing to cure. 446 00:24:39,640 --> 00:24:42,720 You just give someone more money, they're no longer poor. 447 00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:46,560 100% they don't need like 10 million parenting programs to 448 00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:47,680 tell them what they're doing wrong. 449 00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:49,440 They just didn't need to be not be poor. 450 00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:53,080 Well, and so then let me like, let me channel some folks that 451 00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:55,600 aren't aren't on board with this and say. 452 00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:58,640 Jamie, everybody's on board, Like everybody is on board with 453 00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:00,440 this. Well, except one vote in the 454 00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:01,920 Senate wasn't on board with. It. 455 00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:04,320 That's right. And and just to say that. 456 00:25:04,360 --> 00:25:06,920 So there's this notion that if you wrote me a different kind of 457 00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:10,040 prescription, you would tell me to take it three times a day. 458 00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:12,400 You would tell me to not eat grapefruit, you would tell me 459 00:25:12,400 --> 00:25:16,280 when to stop taking it. And I sort of don't want to ask 460 00:25:16,280 --> 00:25:19,880 this question because it's not a Jamie question, but how do we 461 00:25:19,880 --> 00:25:22,440 know that those families are going to do the right thing with 462 00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:25,400 that cash prescription? Because they, because that's, 463 00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:29,600 that's what they do, because our, that's based on massive 464 00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:33,720 global and domestic evidence that when families have the 465 00:25:33,720 --> 00:25:35,600 resources, they do what they need to do. 466 00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:39,840 So for example, in our research, it just in ours kids. 467 00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:42,520 So the most common thing that families spend their money on is 468 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:44,440 baby supplies. And when you breakdown baby 469 00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:46,880 supplies, it is diapers. That is the most common thing 470 00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:49,960 that folks spend their money on. Then it's food, rent, utilities, 471 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:53,080 transportation, childcare. And that is also consistent with 472 00:25:53,080 --> 00:25:55,280 the global evidence for the extended child tax credit, what 473 00:25:55,280 --> 00:26:02,080 people spent their money on. And then, you know, we, we can 474 00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:05,040 put requirements. So we could say, oh, you can 475 00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:07,840 only spend this money on food or you could only spend this money 476 00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,040 on this, or we could. But you know what, when we do 477 00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,160 that, it became the values change. 478 00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:14,040 It is telling our Mamas, we don't trust you. 479 00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:17,080 We don't trust you to, to know what, what is best. 480 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:21,000 And that's not what that's not what this is all about. 481 00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:23,920 But also when you Add all those requirements, those 482 00:26:23,920 --> 00:26:28,200 paternalistic patriarchal requirements, it, it costs more 483 00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:30,280 money, it it becomes administratively more 484 00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:32,960 burdensome. And that's also, that's also 485 00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:35,480 something that, you know, folks are not supported of. 486 00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:38,200 I think the reason that we have such bipartisan support for this 487 00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:42,160 program is because we are such an efficient program. 488 00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:45,520 There is very, very little bureaucracy. 489 00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:49,520 This is a low overhead program. It is also a very time limited 490 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:52,440 program, starts in pregnancy, either ends at six months or 491 00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:54,440 ends at one year. You know, it's just a short 492 00:26:54,440 --> 00:26:58,200 window of time, but, you know, we're not policing people. 493 00:26:58,200 --> 00:26:59,760 We're not figuring out who's in, who's out. 494 00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:03,600 The universality makes it really easy for folks to understand and 495 00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:07,440 it makes it easy to administer. If you add any of those things, 496 00:27:08,040 --> 00:27:12,360 it increases kind of the cost. So, you know, this week there 497 00:27:12,360 --> 00:27:17,120 was an article in The Detroit News about, about our kids. 498 00:27:17,200 --> 00:27:21,720 And it's kind of it's spread across the across the state. 499 00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:26,080 And there was a great quote. And I'm pulling up right now 500 00:27:26,160 --> 00:27:30,440 from the Mackinac Center for Public Policy, which is like a 501 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:35,680 pretty conservative think tank. And it, it gets right at that 502 00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:37,800 one. Looking forward, I'm going to 503 00:27:37,800 --> 00:27:40,000 get to it right now. I'm going to keep talking. 504 00:27:40,000 --> 00:27:40,720 Oh, here it is. OK. 505 00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:43,560 So the the director of research at the Mackinac Center for 506 00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:47,320 Public Policy said that while he doesn't believe it's possible to 507 00:27:47,320 --> 00:27:50,320 completely prevent the misuse of direct cash assistance, 508 00:27:50,760 --> 00:27:54,320 providing the subsidies without strings is still more cost 509 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:58,160 effective than the overhead and administration expenses that 510 00:27:58,160 --> 00:28:00,640 come with a more traditionally structured government social 511 00:28:00,640 --> 00:28:02,840 welfare program, He went on to say. 512 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:05,800 I think even recognizing that some of this money is going to 513 00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:09,160 be ill used is still more efficient than setting up a 514 00:28:09,160 --> 00:28:11,640 whole government program and trying to deliver services 515 00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:15,960 through a new arm of government. So that in efficiency is key. 516 00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:20,680 But once again, it's the values that we are sharing that we 517 00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:24,240 trust you to know what's best. And that flexibility to for 518 00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:26,480 families, like some families have diapers, but they need 519 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:28,320 food. Some families have food, but 520 00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:30,520 they need, you know, they need to pay their car payment and 521 00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:33,240 some families, you know, that's OK, but they need housing. 522 00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:38,480 So that flexibility also enables us to address so many different 523 00:28:38,640 --> 00:28:40,760 needs. And we're seeing that in the 524 00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:43,040 data. For example, we have massive 525 00:28:43,040 --> 00:28:44,600 improvement in housing stability. 526 00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:47,200 We had no evictions in our surveyed Mamas last year. 527 00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:50,760 We have less you. Had no evictions. 528 00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:54,400 No evictions in our low income Mamas that were so red last year 529 00:28:54,400 --> 00:28:56,520 in Flint, the poorest city in Michigan. 530 00:28:56,720 --> 00:29:00,720 We have no evictions in our surveyed moms and and this 531 00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:03,920 period of life has some of the greatest residential instability 532 00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:06,360 and we were able to address that housing crisis. 533 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:08,840 Our Mamas were able to pay for childcare. 534 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:13,240 So there's these Poly crises that we are facing, housing and 535 00:29:13,240 --> 00:29:16,960 childcare, affordability, health, maternal health, and 536 00:29:16,960 --> 00:29:21,000 this simple program that is administered so efficiently is 537 00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:25,800 addressing all of these crises. That's beautiful and amazing for 538 00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:29,200 them. I want to talk about you a 539 00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:31,920 little bit. This is a very path breaking 540 00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:34,360 program. Yeah, that's a great word, Path 541 00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:35,520 breaking. You guys should come up with 542 00:29:35,520 --> 00:29:37,440 like a podcast named Path Breaking. 543 00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:41,000 Such a good word. Double her Grant, Tracy. 544 00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:45,960 What would it take to scale our kids beyond Flint? 545 00:29:46,360 --> 00:29:49,160 And what role do you think sort of philanthropy, government and 546 00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:53,440 civic infrastructure? What would it take to make it 547 00:29:53,440 --> 00:29:55,000 possible? Other places? 548 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,080 You know, when we started our skids, just like everything that 549 00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:00,560 we have done in Flint, be it from pipe replacement or 550 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:03,040 environmental justice work, it's once again, it was never about 551 00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:06,080 Flint. It was about figuring it out and 552 00:30:06,080 --> 00:30:09,840 then sharing our best practices to to communities across. 553 00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:12,960 So you know, we figured this out in Flint. 554 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:16,760 We developed this plug and play program that that is that's 555 00:30:16,760 --> 00:30:20,960 already kind of spread across our straight and and that is 556 00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:24,920 easily, you know, scalable to the whole state and to to other 557 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:28,240 communities. So with dollars at the table, 558 00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:32,040 we're ready to go within months. We can launch in Detroit if the 559 00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:34,520 if dollars are at the table. We already have kind of 560 00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:38,760 commitment from the state, you know, with, for some of the 561 00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:42,040 funds. But right now we we need other 562 00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:44,560 match dollars to make a possible in other communities. 563 00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:47,920 So I think of especially philanthropy and I'm I'm 564 00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:49,840 stealing something that my Dean said. 565 00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:53,320 He's like, you know, I see philanthropy as a doula of this 566 00:30:53,320 --> 00:30:56,120 program, like it's helping bring it to life. 567 00:30:56,160 --> 00:30:58,560 You know, it's helping, it's helping birth it. 568 00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:02,760 But our goal is always to make this like a sustainable 569 00:31:02,800 --> 00:31:06,160 government, like scale public program. 570 00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:08,040 And and that's absolutely where we're headed. 571 00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:11,000 And did you, I was trying to do the math as you were talking. 572 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:16,360 It's what is It's about $7500 per mother to support her and 573 00:31:16,360 --> 00:31:19,240 her baby through the first year. Yeah. 574 00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:23,280 So in Flint and Kalamazoo, we've been able to raise so much money 575 00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:25,840 that it is a prenatal and 12 month program. 576 00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:29,520 But in our other communities like the UP and Pontiac and 577 00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:32,880 other places, it's a prenatal plus six month program based on 578 00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:34,680 how much money we've been able to raise. 579 00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:38,960 So in some places it's $7500 and in other places it's about 580 00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:43,400 $4500. So there's about 100,000 babies 581 00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:46,320 born in Michigan a year. So the math is not typically 582 00:31:46,320 --> 00:31:47,800 hard. So to do this for the whole 583 00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:52,720 state, it's about $750 million that would be needed per year if 584 00:31:52,720 --> 00:31:55,680 it was a 12 month program. And then if it was a shorter 585 00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:58,760 program, it'd be about $450 million a year that would be 586 00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:02,320 needed. And I, I can't, I can't see how 587 00:32:02,320 --> 00:32:05,200 we can't afford not doing this. Like, you know, once again, 588 00:32:05,200 --> 00:32:08,280 every hour, every day that goes by when a baby is born without 589 00:32:08,280 --> 00:32:10,720 the resources they need is a failure on all of us as a 590 00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:13,480 society. And we're already even showing 591 00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:17,080 kind of a cost savings, like we prevented about 40 NICU 592 00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:19,920 admissions last year. We have, you know, we've 593 00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:22,320 impacted birth weight and gestational age. 594 00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:24,760 We have less child welfare involvement. 595 00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:29,560 All of these afford cost savings to the state and to the society 596 00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:31,160 in the short term and the long term. 597 00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:34,040 And that's also consistent with kind of evidence on cash 598 00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:35,560 transfers in this window of life. 599 00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:38,240 And that's even before you get to the cost of what happens when 600 00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:41,120 a family is evicted or what I mean. 100%. 601 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:44,720 There's all of the sort of non healthcare costs that I mean, I 602 00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:48,040 can't believe I'm saying this, but $750 million seems cheap. 603 00:32:48,520 --> 00:32:52,600 No, it is, It absolutely is. You know, even if a mom lives in 604 00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:55,840 a community with a high rate of eviction, if even if she's not 605 00:32:55,840 --> 00:32:58,280 being evicted, but but there's a lot of people in the community 606 00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:02,240 being evicted, that alone can increase the rate of premature 607 00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:05,480 delivery and low birth weight. And that is a massive, you know, 608 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:09,640 health issue and a cost issue. So there's massive kind of 609 00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:11,720 benefits that are really unquantifiable. 610 00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:15,880 That's awesome. And then the Kresge Foundation, 611 00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:18,560 I'm sure there's another foundation, you know, called the 612 00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:21,680 Skillman Foundation. And one of the things that the 613 00:33:21,680 --> 00:33:25,800 Skillman Foundation sort of thinks a lot about is the Masai 614 00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:30,000 people in Africa have a greeting when they meet each other that 615 00:33:30,000 --> 00:33:32,600 goes and how are the children right? 616 00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:36,200 Not how are you not how was your day, not how are you doing? 617 00:33:36,480 --> 00:33:40,120 But how are the children right? Because they believe that if the 618 00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:44,280 next generation is doing OK, things are going all right. 619 00:33:44,600 --> 00:33:46,560 Do you any? Does that spark anything for 620 00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:48,640 you? Does that bring up anything up? 621 00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:52,440 I love that so much. And we're also grateful to the 622 00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:55,840 Skillman Foundation, who are supporters of our kids. 623 00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:59,200 They're actually funding the mailing of all the onesies to 624 00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:04,120 all the babies in the state. That's I love that. 625 00:34:04,120 --> 00:34:06,840 How are the children? That is that's what, that's my 626 00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:08,400 why. That's why I wake up every 627 00:34:08,400 --> 00:34:10,560 morning. That's why I do this work is for 628 00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:14,040 these kiddos. They are all our kiddos and and 629 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:17,600 they're not doing OK right now. We we do, we do not care about 630 00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:21,320 our our children kind of as a nation and and we need to do 631 00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:23,480 better and our kids is kind of one path forward. 632 00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:24,159 Yeah. Yeah. 633 00:34:25,280 --> 00:34:27,440 All right. We're we're going to close with 634 00:34:27,440 --> 00:34:30,800 our lightning round. Tracy, I'm just pulling up my 635 00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:32,440 list. And I will start. 636 00:34:32,679 --> 00:34:34,360 You were kicking us off. Yes. 637 00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:36,440 What? What's the first word your 638 00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:38,199 friends would use to describe you? 639 00:34:38,679 --> 00:34:42,000 Probably energetic. When you were 10, what did you 640 00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:43,400 think you were going to be when you grew up? 641 00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:46,440 A journalist. Me too. 642 00:34:46,800 --> 00:34:51,239 What age is the best age? Oh, I would say nine months. 643 00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:55,080 It is a sweet age. They sent a new miles new 644 00:34:55,080 --> 00:34:57,000 development in the last one, like every day. 645 00:34:57,000 --> 00:34:59,440 Like every day, babies at between 6 and 12 months are 646 00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:01,280 doing something new and it's so much fun. 647 00:35:01,520 --> 00:35:04,440 Xavier, my 8 month old just discovered his hands and all day 648 00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:06,760 long he's just shaking his hands and looking at him. 649 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:09,760 It's the best it's. So fun, So fun. 650 00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:13,560 Right now, what tabs do you have open on your computer? 651 00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:18,280 Oh my God. Three different e-mail accounts, 652 00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:22,640 my two different calendars, shopping like, all kinds of 653 00:35:22,640 --> 00:35:26,760 different things. Describe Flint in one word. 654 00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:33,680 Path breaking. Coffee or tea? 655 00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:37,720 Oh, coffee. What's the last song that made 656 00:35:37,720 --> 00:35:40,400 you want to dance? I've been playing R.E.M. 657 00:35:40,400 --> 00:35:42,800 In my car. So I'm I'm stuck in the like the 658 00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:46,360 1990s. So shiny happy people I. 659 00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:50,920 Love that close your eyes and make one wish for the next 660 00:35:50,920 --> 00:35:56,160 generation. Oh my goodness, that every baby, 661 00:35:56,160 --> 00:36:00,160 no matter the color of your skin, the country of origin, the 662 00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:04,840 zip code, the state of birth, the drinking water source can 663 00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:10,280 can be whatever they want to be. Who was one path breaker who 664 00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:14,120 made a way for you? So many pathbreakers. 665 00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:19,920 I'm, you know, my, my book is, is so much a tribute to so many 666 00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:23,320 folks who walk before me and walk alongside me, who you know, 667 00:36:23,360 --> 00:36:27,640 made, made me who I am. None of us is here because of 668 00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:30,400 just us. We we all stand on the shoulders 669 00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:34,240 of giants. You know, I, I'm going to, I'm 670 00:36:34,240 --> 00:36:37,440 going to stay close to the, the heart and say my mom, you know, 671 00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:40,000 my mom is a badass. She's a tough woman. 672 00:36:40,680 --> 00:36:42,520 She was a chemist back home in Iraq. 673 00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:44,800 She retrained. She became an ESL teacher here 674 00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:49,080 in Michigan. She's she's strong, she's smart. 675 00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:53,080 She's amazing. She's she's enabled me to be who 676 00:36:53,080 --> 00:36:54,640 I am. Say your mom's name. 677 00:36:55,280 --> 00:36:59,440 My mom's name is so her name is Talia, but in Arabic is Thalia. 678 00:36:59,920 --> 00:37:02,360 So but Talia that's. Awesome. 679 00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:05,200 If you had a pad big enough, what's the prescription you 680 00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:09,000 would write for America? I love this. 681 00:37:11,480 --> 00:37:14,920 I would well let's stay with the arcs because themes. 682 00:37:14,920 --> 00:37:22,720 I would end child poverty. Beautiful Doctor Mona, we just 683 00:37:22,720 --> 00:37:25,440 want to say thank you so much for all you have done for the 684 00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:27,760 state of Michigan, the young people in Flint. 685 00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:32,040 Thank you for joining us today. We really do appreciate you. 686 00:37:32,840 --> 00:37:35,120 And we want to make sure that we've got a link to your book, a 687 00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:37,520 link to that Mackinac article, and we'll put all that in the 688 00:37:37,520 --> 00:37:40,000 show notes. And we'll make sure that anyone 689 00:37:40,000 --> 00:37:43,000 who wants to bring RX kids to their community, their city, 690 00:37:43,000 --> 00:37:45,520 their state has way to reach out and get in touch. 691 00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:47,280 Thank you so much for what you're doing today. 692 00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:49,760 Thank you. Thank you, Tracy and Jamie. 693 00:37:49,760 --> 00:37:51,920 This was so much fun. Thank you for what you do and 694 00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:54,600 thank you to the Kresge Foundation and an entire village 695 00:37:54,600 --> 00:37:56,920 that has come alongside to support this program. 696 00:37:56,920 --> 00:38:04,720 Thank you. Doctor Mona Hanna is a 697 00:38:04,720 --> 00:38:07,960 pediatrician and professor with the Michigan State University, 698 00:38:07,960 --> 00:38:11,560 where she is also the Associate Dean for Public Health and the 699 00:38:11,560 --> 00:38:16,640 founder and director of RX Kids. We put a link to rxkids.org in 700 00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:21,560 our show notes. Path Breakers is produced by the 701 00:38:21,560 --> 00:38:25,280 Kresge Foundation, which was founded in 1924 with a mission 702 00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:28,880 to promote human progress. Today, Kresge works to expand 703 00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:31,320 equity and opportunity in America's cities. 704 00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:35,680 Read the stories of all of this season's Path Breakers and learn 705 00:38:35,680 --> 00:38:38,400 about our grant making and social investing work in 706 00:38:38,400 --> 00:38:42,760 Detroit, Memphis, New Orleans, Fresno, and cities across the US 707 00:38:43,000 --> 00:38:45,920 at kresge.org. To hear more stories from the 708 00:38:45,920 --> 00:38:49,200 Path Breakers, be sure to subscribe to the show wherever 709 00:38:49,200 --> 00:38:52,360 you listen to podcasts. Our producers are Juliet Hindley 710 00:38:52,360 --> 00:38:54,920 and Zach Rosen. Managing editor is Krista 711 00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:57,240 Yankee. Our show art is by Rochelle 712 00:38:57,240 --> 00:39:00,440 Baker and Creative direction by Alejandro Herrera. 713 00:39:01,840 --> 00:39:04,640 Thank you to my colleagues on the Human Services program for 714 00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:08,360 lifting up Doctor Mona and speaking her name as a truly 715 00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:11,520 phenomenal path breaker. We'll talk to you next week.