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If anyone asks about 
Stormbringer, you have to 

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clarify, have you played it on 
live? 

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Because if they have that 
context, you completely change 

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how you talk about it. 
Because if they know what it's 

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like now, they have a really 
strong expectation of what it's 

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going to feel like in the future
if they haven't tried it. 

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Victory for the Forsaken. 
For Lauderon for. 

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The Karen tour for. 
Pandaria. 

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For. 
Calendar to the burning region 

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for Gilnaeus or has not died, 
for the Lich King, for the 

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Sindora, for the Alliance, for 
the Horn for Azeroth. 

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Hello and welcome back to 
another episode of For Azeroth. 

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I am one of the hosts, the 
Truvilla. 

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Manny or or just Manny and I am 
joined by a very special guest. 

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Word up. 
Hello. 

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Word up. 
How are you? 

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Hello, I'm good getting in the 
swing of midnight so. 

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Yeah. 
Slowly, sure. 

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I I wish that it was slow, but 
sure. 

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But it just feels like we're 
running out of track so quickly.

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It's just been since Dragon 
Flight they've had this faster 

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development schedule and it is 
breakneck. 

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I remember, I don't know, I 
think Legion was the first time 

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I was really paying attention to
development styles because all 

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of the classes were changing and
the speed at which things 

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developed and we would get 
updates in that testing cycle 

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versus now is night and day. 
But for people who don't know 

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you, tell us a little bit about 
yourself. 

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And of course, you're a De 
Shaman. 

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How did you get into World of 
Warcraft? 

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I was, I was given the game by a
friend in high school or college

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actually at the time, and that 
was 19 years ago. 

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They don't play anymore, but I 
still do so. 

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And honestly the rest is 
history. 

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From I I started rating and then
I carried on rating the whole 

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time. 
I didn't start as a shaman, but 

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it didn't take very long and 
then I was just a shaman 

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forever. 
I play all the other melee, but 

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I'm still pretty heavily 
typecast as the shaman guy, so 

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I'm happy to take that. 
And yeah, I, I, I write guides 

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for enhancement. 
I have since wall odds of Drano 

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and I also do a couple of guys 
further melee specs on icy veins

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and I do wildheads enhancement. 
I occasionally do videos. 

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I've done quite a few more on 
midnight because there was very 

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limited shaman testers for 
midnight, just tests in general 

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during the alpha. 
So I sort of wanted to get the 

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word out that it wasn't as 
disastrous as many were saying 

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from the patch notes, and I 
otherwise bleeding as positive 

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as I can with what Blizzard are 
doing in any other space that 

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you may find me in, like Twitter
or unwaved articles or so on. 

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Of course, of course. 
And I, I know you from the Earth

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shrine doling out wisdom when 
you can or trying to like get 

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calmer heads to prevail. 
And so with midnight, we're 

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passing out for we're now in 
beta. 

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We've had two weeks worth of ray
testing with a week off in 

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between to sort of digest some 
things. 

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And so we've seen not only the 
changes that have come with the,

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I would want to call it 
streamlining more than pruning. 

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I feel like they sort of merged 
a lot of things or crossed over 

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a number of things to get to 
where we're at right now with 

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shaman. 
But how has shaman been with 

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this? 
Like pruning or streamlining? 

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So there's two sides to that 
coin for me. 

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The the first salvo that when I 
first saw it, my reaction was I 

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saw it ever so slightly before 
the notes came out. 

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So I didn't have the context of 
playing it. 

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There were a few things that 
immediately I was anti and 

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almost straight away sort of 
reconciled. 

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It's actually fine after trying 
it. 

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So that was sort of a great 
lesson in don't overreact to 

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most people because everyone's 
guilty of it, myself included. 

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The I would probably lean 
towards it being a mixed bag of 

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a prune and a streamline. 
There's definitely depending on 

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which thing you like of the 
current one or past ones, there 

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is just some straight pruning 
that's gone and it's you can 

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find like a hint of it, but it's
not really there anymore. 

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Things like all the frost spells
and so on, they're mostly just 

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dead, but the streamlining part 
they I think did. 

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We were easily one of the specs 
that needed it the most by the 

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end of War Within. 
I think it's quite easy to look 

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through all of the specs and see
some outliers of ones that 

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really, really needed some 
genuine attention to just sort 

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of get rid of all of the baggage
or things that are cool, but 

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they don't need to all be 
separate. 

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And they did a really, really 
good job of I was picking out 

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the things that they needed that
needed to stay and the things 

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that were kind of second fiddle 
things that you didn't need or 

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you can roll them in. 
And I think it plays 

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surprisingly similar. 
Considering the fact that it's 

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had an enormous list of changes.
I'd probably pitch it funnily 

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enough, like really close to a 
wall of Drinore play style, 

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which was one of my my all time 
favourites. 

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It's very similar in cadence, 
but it's got all of the cool 

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bells and whistles of like 
modern enhancement. 

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But the other side of the coin 
is while they're opening set of 

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patch notes were really good and
they did a really good job. 

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There was definitely some things
that needed a second pass or 

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someone to sort of take the 
feedback and think, should we 

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really stick with this? 
Is it right, Is it wrong? 

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Should we at least do something?
And despite about, I think we're

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closing in on three months since
Alva started, I haven't seen 

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hide nor hair of anything 
changing for us since there's 

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still quite a few bugs from week
1. 

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So that's a little alarming. 
But that's also the kind of 

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thing where if they do just sit 
down for a week or two and sort 

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of hammer things out, none of 
them are like massive problems 

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that are sort of world ending 
like pre War Within where you 

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had things where you could 
clearly see that once it 

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launched, if it launched like 
that, it was going to be 

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horrible. 
I think we're far away from 

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that. 
But it would be nice to have 

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just a second, second little 
touch up of we do hear this, 

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this is probably a good thing to
do. 

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One of the big changes I 
noticed, or rather that they 

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referred to, was the effect of 
hero talents on the rotation and

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how when you're playing Totemic 
versus Stormbringer, you're 

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playing very different 
rotations. 

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And so they brought them closer 
together so that the rotation is

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similar. 
In my in my playthrough, it 

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seems to favor leaning more 
towards a similar rotation of 

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1:00 than the other. 
What's your feelings of like, 

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the way that they've changed it 
in regards to the hero talents? 

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Oh, oh, this that that's a 
question. 

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That sort of rolls. 
Not only does it link to the the

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streamlining, but it also rolls 
back to like Dragonfly because 

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before hero talents came with 
the 2 split play styles 

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announcement was basically like 
the progenitor of a spec that 

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could do it. 
Because in Dragonfly we had two 

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completely separate, completely 
rotationally isolated builds 

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that you could play. 
And then in the War Within, that

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sort of is more common now 
because hero talents do that. 

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But I was obviously had those 
same 2 play styles fractured off

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and given a hero talent each and
they were still completely 

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different. 
And what I think they've done 

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here, it does a lot towards what
they were intending to do, which

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is to make the spec at least a 
little bit more approachable. 

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Because it is absolutely true 
from all so many conversations 

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I've had both with like veteran 
players and from people who just

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vaguely interested. 
The the spec is incredibly 

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intimidating when you're just 
handed the notes of, of how it 

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does it and what you'd need to 
know and how it how it 

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functions, what you need to 
learn to sort of get comfortable

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with it. 
Most people are given a small 

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list enhancements given not only
a long list, but then also a sub

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list of all the extra reading 
that you need to do and like a 

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textbook list of all these extra
chapters that you might need, 

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but not right now. 
But at least keep them in mind. 

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What they have done is 
definitely consolidated like a 

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core block of if you know this 
rule, it applies to both of them

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all the time. 
And I think that's really 

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important because what is 
biggest problem is they spend 

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rules for resources completely 
changing on their head is a 

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horrifying like consideration 
for a lot of people when we have

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a such an unusual resource to 
begin with. 

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But where they falter in it is 
that Totemic very clearly has 

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that that core and a thing on 
top that you do. 

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That's like the Totemic thing. 
That's really cool with the hot 

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hand extending, which by the 
way, I think is an incredible 

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design talent to go with the the
tempo in the middle. 

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I think those two are real 
highlights. 

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Whoever designed those. 
While Stormbringer on the other 

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hand, feels a lot like you doing
the core of Totemic and then not

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really anything else. 
So that's really disappointing 

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considering I think Storm Ring 
is really cool just on the face 

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and it's definitely very 
complicated alive, but it does 

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feel like that's the one that 
lost distinctly between the two 

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of them. 
Yeah, just with the changes to 

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wolves no longer being their own
talent. 

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And also the biggest thing that 
I felt that separated just Storm

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Bringer from like a base shaman 
was the fact that you had those 

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wolves that fed into the kind of
an ebb and flow of resource. 

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Like you would suddenly get a 
bunch of it and be playing at a 

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different pace. 
And then your wolves would fade 

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and you you would slow down in 
pace trying to get those wolves 

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again or get back to those 
wolves again. 

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But now wolves are no longer an 
active talent. 

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They are a passive talent. 
They no longer generate 

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resources, so they're just a 
damage amp based on 2 windows. 

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I think we've got fire and 
lightning wolves and nothing 

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else anymore. 
Yeah, there's there's the one 

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that comes from Doomens and the 
one that comes from Thundering 

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and then Storm Ring has got its 
own extra 1 from Doomens as 

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well. 
So there's, there's like those, 

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those 3 avenues of getting them.
That one I think is I, I found 

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it really difficult to talk 
about this one in a, in an 

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objective way because I've since
I've played enhancement since, 

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since TBC basically. 
I remember how cool it was that 

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you were getting the Warcraft 3 
spell as your big cooldown when 

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you level 280 in Wrath. 
And I remember all of the times 

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that they were really good and 
the even more times that they 

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were really useless, but they 
were always there and they 

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always really cool. 
They're like very visually, 

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that's the shaman thing now, 
that's the enhancement thing 

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when you see them. 
And now they're very not good. 

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They're they're, I don't mind 
them being a passive. 

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00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:55,440
It is a bit weird the way that 
they were basically you press 

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them every 20 seconds. 
They're not really a cool down 

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00:11:57,560 --> 00:12:02,120
anymore and the whole 
consolidating all of our Quill 

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00:12:02,120 --> 00:12:05,280
downs back into one or two 
buttons rather than 5 or 6 

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00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:07,640
launch sequence things that you 
need to know different orders 

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00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:12,160
for is obviously it's a broad 
thing they're doing to all specs

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00:12:12,440 --> 00:12:15,120
and I think it was more than 
necessary in our case. 

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But the way that Wolves got hit 
is just it stings a little bit 

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more than it probably should. 
That's one of those ones where I

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think the devs did it with all 
the best intentions, but not 

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realizing that there's a there's
an extra layer to why that 

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00:12:30,560 --> 00:12:32,600
specific thing is really cool to
people. 

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00:12:34,560 --> 00:12:38,520
So yeah, I think that's one that
people will visually notice 

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right out the gate. 
What would you say is more of a 

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success story for like the 
consolidation of cooldowns, even

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if it is like rotational 
cooldowns versus the big 

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two-minute 3 minute buttons? 
Oh, I think that the the 

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00:12:57,960 --> 00:13:01,000
integration of crash lightning 
into just being a a button that 

214
00:13:01,000 --> 00:13:04,480
you press all the time was a 
really, really good idea because

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00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:08,960
it covers it covers 5 or 6 
different bases from 5 or 6 

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00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:11,320
different eras of how 
enhancement is played all in 

217
00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:13,680
itself. 
Like it functions like a 

218
00:13:13,680 --> 00:13:15,880
maintenance buff that we had in 
Legion that have basically been 

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gone, but it also kind of 
functions like your mid range 

220
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kind of very important, but sets
of other things. 

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00:13:22,400 --> 00:13:26,400
But unlike unleash elements from
from mop and what and then it 

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00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:28,920
also does the AOE. 
It does a bit of cleave. 

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00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:30,880
It's also a background resource 
generator. 

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00:13:30,880 --> 00:13:34,840
It it's one of those buttons 
that one, it looks really cool, 

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00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:39,560
but two it never really got used
that much outside of just the 

226
00:13:39,560 --> 00:13:41,400
AOE thing. 
It's tuning has always been a 

227
00:13:41,400 --> 00:13:44,280
bit wonky. 
So we now will use it all the 

228
00:13:44,280 --> 00:13:46,480
time. 
It still looks really cool and 

229
00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:48,960
they're using it to plug a lot 
of gaps. 

230
00:13:50,400 --> 00:13:52,800
That one's a really good one, 
although that's hard to say 

231
00:13:52,800 --> 00:13:56,400
whether that's consolidating. 
I think the the whole Doom Winds

232
00:13:56,400 --> 00:13:59,240
ascendance thing was a good 
idea. 

233
00:13:59,760 --> 00:14:04,400
Does need some massaging choice.
So that's one of the ones that 

234
00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:06,200
I'd like someone to to take a 
second look at. 

235
00:14:06,440 --> 00:14:08,840
But that was a really good idea 
to give us the whole do you want

236
00:14:08,840 --> 00:14:11,960
one minute? 
Do you want 2 minute and varying

237
00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:17,160
degrees of strength and taking 
it off the GCD, which took me by

238
00:14:17,160 --> 00:14:23,520
surprise was was quite 
interesting and something that I

239
00:14:23,520 --> 00:14:27,280
thought would have been in a 
good idea long ago before the 

240
00:14:27,280 --> 00:14:29,440
War Within. 
I think just cutting primordial 

241
00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:33,240
wave, as cool as the button is, 
but it looks and all of the 

242
00:14:34,400 --> 00:14:37,720
advanced stuff that you could do
with it, just turning it into 

243
00:14:37,720 --> 00:14:41,960
the thing that Sundering does 
instead, which is equally a 

244
00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:44,240
little dated on the animation, 
but is it equally cool? 

245
00:14:44,240 --> 00:14:49,960
Shaman button, but a lot simpler
to just press and do was just a 

246
00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:53,920
good idea It it stops thundering
having that weird go between of 

247
00:14:54,160 --> 00:14:56,760
what's this supposed to do in 
between the specs. 

248
00:14:56,800 --> 00:14:59,320
It's very obvious it leads into 
a cool cool down chain. 

249
00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:05,680
So broadly I think that the 
consolidation of near everything

250
00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:09,360
that they did was the right 
direction to go. 

251
00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:14,640
It's just how far along the path
they reached in terms of getting

252
00:15:14,640 --> 00:15:17,880
it to the best spot it could be.
But none of them were like 

253
00:15:18,640 --> 00:15:21,040
things that I read and thought, 
Oh my God, what have you? 

254
00:15:21,400 --> 00:15:24,200
What have you been thinking? 
This is this is a terrible idea.

255
00:15:25,160 --> 00:15:27,720
So I think that's a positive. 
Absolutely. 

256
00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:31,880
OK. 
On the on the flip side, what 

257
00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:35,600
are the shortfalls that you feel
that need that second pass? 

258
00:15:38,640 --> 00:15:43,760
It depends on how how granular 
it would be in terms of the 

259
00:15:43,760 --> 00:15:46,880
feedback that I gave and that we
sort of echoed back to them a 

260
00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:50,280
few times. 
Like the top of the list is I 

261
00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:54,000
just don't think the tree has 
enough talents on it right now. 

262
00:15:55,240 --> 00:15:58,360
There's there's virtually no 
tension, especially the 

263
00:15:58,360 --> 00:15:59,920
Stormbringer as to like what you
pick. 

264
00:15:59,920 --> 00:16:02,920
It's very obvious. 
There's maybe one or two points 

265
00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:06,000
that are kind of like, well, 
I'll put it somewhere, but it 

266
00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:07,560
doesn't really matter where I 
put them. 

267
00:16:07,560 --> 00:16:11,200
I'll just throw it over here. 
And those would be the kind of 

268
00:16:11,200 --> 00:16:13,680
things for like even just their 
passive talent or just something

269
00:16:13,680 --> 00:16:16,480
that would maybe be a bit more 
simple as well. 

270
00:16:16,480 --> 00:16:18,920
This is obviously exactly this 
good rather than all of the 

271
00:16:19,000 --> 00:16:23,920
esoteric ones like attack speed 
and crit conversion to crit 

272
00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:26,600
damage. 
Like they're they read good, but

273
00:16:26,960 --> 00:16:29,000
are they good at? 
I don't know, they're very 

274
00:16:29,000 --> 00:16:36,920
mathy. 
I would say that Stormbringer, I

275
00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:40,720
just have to be a bit more 
critical on all the good things 

276
00:16:40,720 --> 00:16:43,640
that happened with Totemic. 
Stormbringer had its key thing 

277
00:16:43,640 --> 00:16:46,920
with Tempest being a tracking 
thing that you had to tackle, 

278
00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:50,240
which is a kind of worms related
to the UI that's been going 

279
00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:52,720
ongoing for quite a while. 
But turning that into just a 

280
00:16:52,720 --> 00:17:00,000
random proc isn't nearly as as 
fun or it's not as nearly as 

281
00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:01,800
engaging. 
It doesn't give it that sort of 

282
00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:07,599
Stormbringer feeling that you 
get when you play on live and 

283
00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:10,839
taking that out. 
The tree is fairly skinny to 

284
00:17:10,839 --> 00:17:13,480
begin with on live. 
If you take that and you take 

285
00:17:13,480 --> 00:17:18,359
the wolves that spawn from 
Tempest away, it's not it's not 

286
00:17:18,359 --> 00:17:21,000
really a tree that you could 
write home about. 

287
00:17:21,000 --> 00:17:25,599
As to doing anything like you 
can very clearly point out 

288
00:17:25,599 --> 00:17:29,120
Totemic does this and this and 
it's over going to other specs 

289
00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:33,960
across the game with classes 
like Farrell will do this. 

290
00:17:34,360 --> 00:17:37,640
You've got ravage proc so you've
got your vines that you bite 

291
00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:41,240
with very much a tangent over 
Demon Hunter with their glaves 

292
00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:43,960
and fell scarred with 
metamorphosis. 

293
00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:47,320
But Stormbringer, if someone 
asked me what's the hook that 

294
00:17:47,320 --> 00:17:50,480
you need to know if you're going
to play it? 

295
00:17:50,480 --> 00:17:51,920
What's like the important new 
thing? 

296
00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:56,240
I'd honestly struggle to tell 
someone something that very 

297
00:17:56,240 --> 00:17:57,480
distinctly changes in your 
gameplay. 

298
00:17:57,480 --> 00:18:00,520
I think you just play exactly 
the same as how you would if you

299
00:18:00,520 --> 00:18:03,120
didn't have it. 
So that one's probably the 

300
00:18:03,120 --> 00:18:04,520
biggest failure. 
And I think that's just the tree

301
00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:08,400
as a whole. 
Little, little more scathing. 

302
00:18:09,320 --> 00:18:12,800
But yeah, that's one of the ones
that I'm really hung up on. 

303
00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:14,840
I wish that someone would go 
back and look at that. 

304
00:18:15,000 --> 00:18:18,360
Between now and midnight release
I've been waiting every patch 

305
00:18:18,360 --> 00:18:21,320
week for something to show up 
and someone to just have said 

306
00:18:21,320 --> 00:18:27,400
anything about Storm Ringer. 
I'm not sure if you agree with 

307
00:18:27,400 --> 00:18:33,440
me, but I feel that shaman has 
this very weird class tree where

308
00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:37,000
there are just sections that are
not meant for enhancement. 

309
00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:39,040
They're just sort of like, we're
going to put this here so you 

310
00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:41,920
don't have to go through it, but
there's no value in it. 

311
00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:45,400
And so when you're talking about
the skinny trees in the spec 

312
00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:49,000
tree, I look at the class tree 
and I, and I look at things like

313
00:18:49,360 --> 00:18:52,400
Spirit Walker's grace and, and a
number of different talents. 

314
00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:58,760
And I, I spec into it. 
And I wonder what I'm doing with

315
00:18:58,760 --> 00:19:00,800
my points like this. 
There isn't that tension. 

316
00:19:00,800 --> 00:19:03,440
There isn't something that I'm 
like truly passing for. 

317
00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:05,840
It's like, I've got the point. 
So I guess I'm getting getting 

318
00:19:05,840 --> 00:19:11,960
this and throwing the rest here.
The the class tree has been a 

319
00:19:11,960 --> 00:19:14,280
real point of contention for I 
think. 

320
00:19:14,280 --> 00:19:17,480
Every single feedback post or 
article I've done since 

321
00:19:17,480 --> 00:19:20,720
Dragonflight released with these
trees, there has always been a 

322
00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:25,520
section that says the class tree
isn't very good, especially for 

323
00:19:25,520 --> 00:19:32,160
us, and I don't like it. 
Basically, there's it's not Even

324
00:19:32,160 --> 00:19:35,960
so much about the power in it. 
It is the exactly what you said.

325
00:19:37,040 --> 00:19:40,640
There are sections of the tree 
that just do nothing for There's

326
00:19:40,640 --> 00:19:43,640
no sort of conceptual point 
where you'd think I really need 

327
00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:46,400
this or this will do something. 
They're actually fundamentally 

328
00:19:46,400 --> 00:19:52,920
useless talents, and it's not to
put this any blame on the other 

329
00:19:52,920 --> 00:19:57,680
two specs, but I will say that 
at one point in the past there 

330
00:19:57,680 --> 00:20:01,160
were talents like that that were
our talents that we got on the 

331
00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:04,840
class tree and they would have 
been eternally useless for the 

332
00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:07,440
other two. 
And they were removed for 

333
00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:09,840
explicitly that reason. 
There is no reason for them to 

334
00:20:09,840 --> 00:20:12,160
have Maelstrom weapon or or 
Flurry. 

335
00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:15,760
Or for the reason Pharaoh Lunge 
showed up in our expect tree 

336
00:20:16,120 --> 00:20:20,120
against Yeah. 
And like, that's fine. 

337
00:20:20,120 --> 00:20:22,600
If we don't want them to have 
maelstrom and flurry because 

338
00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:25,360
they're useless to them, then 
why do we have spirit walks, 

339
00:20:25,360 --> 00:20:29,880
grace and nature swiftness? 
And why have we got talents like

340
00:20:29,880 --> 00:20:33,040
healing stream totem that are 
tuned to such a degree that we 

341
00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:37,920
have no use for it? 
Why is there so many like open 

342
00:20:37,920 --> 00:20:40,400
spaces for things that you could
do that are shaman related? 

343
00:20:40,400 --> 00:20:45,240
Like I'll throw throw something 
that'll probably come later, but

344
00:20:45,240 --> 00:20:49,600
our self healing for a hybrid is
pretty abominable and the spec 

345
00:20:49,600 --> 00:20:52,240
tree does nothing to help that. 
And the one thing that we did 

346
00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:55,120
have, as overpowered as it may 
have been in certain situations,

347
00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:58,720
got caught very early in the war
within with ancestral guidance 

348
00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:02,040
and still to this day, a bit of 
a shame, but I understand why. 

349
00:21:02,840 --> 00:21:06,160
But there's there's very little 
on that the class tree that when

350
00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:08,880
I look at it for other specs, 
I'm very clearly I see the thing

351
00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:12,760
at the bottom that I really want
to get to that I'm going to if I

352
00:21:12,760 --> 00:21:16,400
don't have this distinctly miss.
And when I look at my shaman, 

353
00:21:16,400 --> 00:21:20,480
what I'll pick like a few things
that I'll, I'd quite like to 

354
00:21:20,480 --> 00:21:25,120
have and I'll go towards the 
things that are sort of nice 

355
00:21:25,120 --> 00:21:27,360
benefits, but there's nothing 
that I'm sort of like really 

356
00:21:27,360 --> 00:21:28,560
excited. 
It's on the classroom. 

357
00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:31,320
I want to get this. 
It's sort of more of the, those 

358
00:21:31,320 --> 00:21:32,600
are the points. 
I'm going to go to the spectre 

359
00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:35,480
now at least I can pick 
something that I care about. 

360
00:21:36,360 --> 00:21:37,760
And that's a little bit sad, I 
think. 

361
00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:40,280
And we aren't. 
To make it clear, we definitely 

362
00:21:40,280 --> 00:21:44,080
aren't the only class like this,
but there's a very clear divide 

363
00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:48,480
between classes that have a cool
class tree and classes that have

364
00:21:49,000 --> 00:21:55,600
a class tree. 
So we've now discussed of course

365
00:21:55,600 --> 00:21:59,560
the hero tree and we've 
discussed the spec tree and now 

366
00:21:59,560 --> 00:22:03,120
the class tree. 
The one thing that we sort of 

367
00:22:03,120 --> 00:22:06,800
touched on a little bit, but I 
would love to to focus on a 

368
00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:12,760
little bit more is the new Apex 
talents because we're every spec

369
00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:16,760
is getting the Apex talent. 
We just talked a little bit 

370
00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:22,520
about about that Crash Lightning
is back in play and that's the 

371
00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:26,000
focus of our Apex talent. 
So like I guess they hit it out 

372
00:22:26,000 --> 00:22:30,480
of the park with these? 
I think our this one was one of 

373
00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:33,400
those ones where I saw so many 
people be really skeptical about

374
00:22:33,400 --> 00:22:36,080
it because they were so 
skeptical about the idea of 

375
00:22:36,080 --> 00:22:43,600
Crash not being an AOE button. 
I think it is a very good, 

376
00:22:43,920 --> 00:22:49,200
they're very well designed. 
The 2 middle points, they are 

377
00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:52,560
tax, they're good tax buttons 
for numbers, but they are quite 

378
00:22:53,040 --> 00:22:55,360
uninteresting relative to some 
of the other ones. 

379
00:22:55,720 --> 00:22:59,040
But the opening especially is 
very, very good. 

380
00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:03,440
That's very similar to say for 
anyone who played in Legion 

381
00:23:03,640 --> 00:23:07,000
Storm Surge of previously 
Stormbringer, but they couldn't 

382
00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:08,600
keep it called that with the 
hero tree. 

383
00:23:09,600 --> 00:23:12,600
Those resets were really 
important all the time and they 

384
00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:15,840
felt really good to get a storm 
Ringer reset on storm strike. 

385
00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:21,640
And obviously as time went on, 
because if you don't give 

386
00:23:21,640 --> 00:23:23,600
enhancement enough buttons to 
press, they end up just sitting 

387
00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:26,400
there doing nothing. 
Storm Ringer or Storm search has

388
00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:29,720
become so common or ways to 
press Storm Strike that it 

389
00:23:29,720 --> 00:23:31,240
doesn't really feel like that 
good. 

390
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:33,800
No matter how many times you 
glow the screen with effects to 

391
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:36,600
say you've got the proc, it 
doesn't make it any more 

392
00:23:36,600 --> 00:23:40,000
interesting that you got it. 
Whereas this one is is limited 

393
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:42,960
enough and it's on a spell 
that's very clearly important 

394
00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:46,000
enough. 
And then it can stack itself up.

395
00:23:46,400 --> 00:23:50,720
So you get like a a a sort of 
lingering pay off from doing 

396
00:23:50,720 --> 00:23:53,240
from getting the procs afterward
for all your next buttons. 

397
00:23:53,240 --> 00:23:56,960
And you can really impactfully 
see how much more damage your 

398
00:23:57,240 --> 00:23:59,760
like ancillary proc effects are 
doing. 

399
00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:02,480
I think that's really, really 
good. 

400
00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:09,480
The the proc, the the stacking, 
the final point is really good. 

401
00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:13,200
It's very hard to talk about 
because half of it is bogged and

402
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:14,480
you just get it for the first 
point. 

403
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:16,320
So you don't need to take the 
last point. 

404
00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:20,120
And it has been since the 
beginning, which is very 

405
00:24:20,120 --> 00:24:22,640
strange. 
And it does make it very hard to

406
00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:26,000
like objectively assess how the 
bottom of the tree is because 

407
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:28,720
you just don't take that point 
because you get it for free. 

408
00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:35,840
The AOE pool is, well, it looks 
like Lay Shen's thing. 

409
00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:37,800
So it's really cool because 
Lightning Whip was always really

410
00:24:37,800 --> 00:24:40,640
cool. 
It does a lot of damage, it 

411
00:24:40,640 --> 00:24:43,640
ticks fast enough that you're 
not really irritated by tanks 

412
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:48,680
moving things around. 
And it's also got sort of a dual

413
00:24:48,680 --> 00:24:51,920
purpose of you've got the pool 
for your AOE and you've got the 

414
00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:53,680
attack speed for your single 
target. 

415
00:24:53,760 --> 00:24:57,840
Which now, thankfully, when they
buffed attack speed a lot is 

416
00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:01,360
actually relevant again because 
the attack speed has been until 

417
00:25:01,360 --> 00:25:06,600
then effectively naked off the 
the face of the spec because it 

418
00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,640
really doesn't matter. 
When you take away storm surge 

419
00:25:09,640 --> 00:25:15,640
from imbues and just imbue 
damage in general now the autos 

420
00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:17,920
actually hit hard. 
That becomes a really well 

421
00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:19,680
designed talent that's dual 
function. 

422
00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:24,240
And so it's a universal. 
I can see those four points as a

423
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:27,120
locked in for like the 
foreseeable future in a lot of 

424
00:25:27,120 --> 00:25:30,760
cases, which is what they want 
visually. 

425
00:25:30,760 --> 00:25:32,360
Cool. 
So yeah, I'd, I'd rate that, 

426
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:34,280
rate it really high. 
It's definitely not one of the 

427
00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:36,520
ones that I saw and thought, oh,
I'm not going to be. 

428
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:38,320
I'm not happy about having to 
take those. 

429
00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:46,240
Yeah, I think that the hidden 
gem is how it works with the 

430
00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:49,160
imbues increasing those and 
making them stronger. 

431
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:55,280
I was, I wasn't quite sold on 
it. 

432
00:25:55,600 --> 00:25:57,080
I was like, Oh yeah, this is 
cool. 

433
00:25:57,080 --> 00:26:01,440
And I was still using it to like
enable my AOE. 

434
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:05,360
And then I believe it was your 
first video that you you put out

435
00:26:05,360 --> 00:26:06,800
where you're like, Nope, you 
want to be pressing this on 

436
00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:12,080
cooldown and then seeing the 
change from that actually kind 

437
00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:14,760
of pulled the spec, this spec 
together for me. 

438
00:26:17,080 --> 00:26:22,480
Taking all of this and taking it
into dungeons and into raids. 

439
00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:24,560
How is like the rotation 
feeling? 

440
00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:28,160
How are is enhancement feeling 
in in play? 

441
00:26:34,120 --> 00:26:37,000
With the UI issues aside, 
because it's impossible to talk 

442
00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:39,720
about midnight without 
mentioning it and it does make 

443
00:26:39,720 --> 00:26:43,000
the spec more much more 
difficult to sort of build a 

444
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:44,640
muscle memory because you're 
fighting against that. 

445
00:26:45,480 --> 00:26:49,880
If you extract that out of it, 
the the gameplay flow that it 

446
00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:54,400
has is really, really strong in 
terms of like how I have fun. 

447
00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:59,960
I find it it's it's got a lot 
more active decision making than

448
00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:02,520
sort of retailers ended up 
reaching because we've got so 

449
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:06,280
much gear that the decision 
making really is just very one 

450
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:08,680
note all the way down. 
Not like it was the sad 

451
00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:13,720
expansion is very good to be 
clear, but the especially things

452
00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:16,920
like having to decide you want a
one minute or a two-minute 

453
00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:19,440
cooldown. 
Both of the hero talents similar

454
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:22,400
but different in how they 
approach the damage, how 

455
00:27:22,400 --> 00:27:26,840
consistent they are. 
The 32nd burst window is still 

456
00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:29,520
there with thundering and 
basically power infusion 

457
00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:33,400
attached to it. 
The it's still got quite a few 

458
00:27:33,400 --> 00:27:35,920
like mix up moments. 
You've got your resets from 

459
00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:38,760
resources, you've still got hot 
hand with Totemic, you've got 

460
00:27:38,760 --> 00:27:41,520
your crash leash lightning 
resets and then your cool down 

461
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,200
is still. 
Frankly I think I cooled down. 

462
00:27:44,200 --> 00:27:49,520
Design, as complex as it is, is 
one of the coolest in how it 

463
00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:53,200
works across any spec in the 
game, and it still is. 

464
00:27:56,880 --> 00:27:59,920
Oh, what else? 
Oh, and I also, I'm a huge fan 

465
00:27:59,920 --> 00:28:02,600
from a dungeon perspective of of
Ride the Lightning. 

466
00:28:02,960 --> 00:28:05,680
I think that that that talents 
been sort of waiting there as a 

467
00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:09,120
hero, as a PvP talent for the 
better part of 10 years. 

468
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:14,880
And I think it may have come up 
at least 10 times since then of 

469
00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:16,920
why don't we just make this a 
spec talent? 

470
00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:20,080
Because it would just work. 
And it does just work. 

471
00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:22,480
It's it's a really good way of 
making those strikes that we 

472
00:28:22,480 --> 00:28:28,680
inevitably have to press in AOE 
still do a thing that's AOE and 

473
00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:32,280
it's cool. 
The only downside is the the 

474
00:28:32,280 --> 00:28:35,520
crash change to make it not AOE 
now splits. 

475
00:28:35,520 --> 00:28:39,560
But that's sort of an aside. 
I would say that dungeon wise 

476
00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:45,120
from a damage perspective, 
assuming the tuning is like it 

477
00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:48,960
is now, it is better than it is 
in the wall. 

478
00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:53,640
Then from a fun factor 
perspective, the only thing that

479
00:28:53,640 --> 00:28:57,480
I think will bounce people off 
is I think Totemic is quite 

480
00:28:57,480 --> 00:29:03,400
difficult to play properly, 
maybe harder than it is on live 

481
00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:08,160
even to get that right because 
you have to juggle hot hand and 

482
00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:10,320
extend it for such a long 
period. 

483
00:29:10,680 --> 00:29:15,960
And there is a not necessarily 
aggressive punishment for doing 

484
00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:18,440
that wrong. 
But you do get left in sort of 

485
00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:23,480
droughts of being effectively 
punished that you you let it 

486
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,000
fall off and now you have to sit
there and wait for it to come 

487
00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:28,000
back and then your AOE turns 
off. 

488
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:31,480
Or if you get it right, it's 
really good. 

489
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:34,920
But that's just the damage 
perspective because there's 

490
00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:37,840
definitely a second one. 
I'm sure you're about to mention

491
00:29:37,840 --> 00:29:42,080
that one. 
Well, I mean, go right into it. 

492
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:44,080
I, I, I feel like this is the 
natural flow. 

493
00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:47,320
Go ahead. 
On the, the other side of it is 

494
00:29:47,320 --> 00:29:55,200
the the defence side and we've 
never been the best at defence. 

495
00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:58,560
Well, we haven't been the best 
at defence since Legion when 

496
00:29:58,560 --> 00:30:04,480
they took away all of our really
good defence and expansion sort 

497
00:30:04,480 --> 00:30:09,040
of go up and down in terms of 
how much I feel like it's a 

498
00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:11,920
disaster. 
But it's never been like I'm 

499
00:30:11,920 --> 00:30:14,920
really, we're definitely going 
to be really living this 

500
00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:19,120
expansion and this one in the 
dungeon testing that I've done 

501
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:23,600
and the raids, it is 
excruciatingly obvious that we 

502
00:30:23,600 --> 00:30:27,040
have far less defence than 
everyone else that I've been 

503
00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:28,560
testing with. 
There's definitely a couple of 

504
00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:32,240
specific specs that I didn't 
play with, but from what I can 

505
00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:33,560
tell her. 
In the same boat as us. 

506
00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:40,800
But I can really tangibly feel 
how fragile I am on so many 

507
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:44,120
encounters so far and in 
dungeons. 

508
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:50,160
The change to maelstrom weapon 
so that the healers from after 

509
00:30:50,160 --> 00:30:54,080
we spend good from AI don't 
waste damage for it. 

510
00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:59,680
Damage resources bad from A we 
now have to spend an extra GCD 

511
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:04,960
to get there and the stacks they
sort of they change depending on

512
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:07,440
how much you spent last rather 
than just accumulating. 

513
00:31:07,520 --> 00:31:10,320
So if you spend 10 and then you 
spend 6, you know 6 of that 

514
00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:14,400
we've got the extra GCD there 
and it heals a lot less than on 

515
00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:16,760
live. 
So on live, if I'm in a panicked

516
00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:19,800
situation and I spend 10 
maelstrom on a healing surge, 

517
00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:24,760
I'm easily jumping 50% of my 
health and I'll feel a lot say 

518
00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:30,680
more stable in that moment. 
On the beta, if I deploy a 

519
00:31:30,680 --> 00:31:33,920
healing surge that with whatever
rage emails from sex I have 

520
00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:37,880
because I'm panicking, it might 
bump my health bar like 15%, 

521
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:42,760
which in the overwhelming 
majority of cases in especially 

522
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:48,080
the end game in midnight, 15% 
sort of doesn't tickle the rot 

523
00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:49,600
damage that's going on all the 
time. 

524
00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:52,680
So you're immediately in the 
same danger that you were right 

525
00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:56,760
before you pressed it. 
And we've got one or so we've 

526
00:31:56,760 --> 00:32:01,920
got one higher than average 
defence tool and one much higher

527
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:04,480
than average, not that good 
defence tool. 

528
00:32:04,480 --> 00:32:06,480
And those are the only other 
things we can do. 

529
00:32:07,440 --> 00:32:15,520
So I definitely feel like when I
when I look at the spread of 

530
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:20,760
what happened to others and just
the general landscape of how the

531
00:32:20,760 --> 00:32:24,440
game is built, how the balance 
between classes going to be with

532
00:32:25,360 --> 00:32:29,880
end game content effectively 
being dictated by who can not 

533
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:33,360
only do the most damage, but 
also live the most incisive 

534
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:38,320
lethal damage. 
It's really hard to see how we'd

535
00:32:38,320 --> 00:32:41,120
be anything other than a burden 
the higher that you go. 

536
00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:45,960
And you'd need someone very 
specifically tailored towards 

537
00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:49,720
having the tools to keep you 
alive because you can't do it 

538
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:53,000
yourself. 
And that really, really worries 

539
00:32:53,000 --> 00:32:56,600
me, more so than it it's ever 
worried me in the lead up to an 

540
00:32:56,600 --> 00:33:03,240
expansion. 
One of the big defensive changes

541
00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:07,280
that we got, of course, was the 
stripping away of our one of our

542
00:33:07,280 --> 00:33:11,960
defensive totems. 
It seems odd that they gave it 

543
00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:14,440
to us only to take it away so 
soon. 

544
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:17,400
Do you do you have any insight 
into why that happened? 

545
00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:22,040
Oh, I couldn't, I couldn't say 
why they did it. 

546
00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:30,160
I, I the, the story of the term 
itself is it it got added as a 

547
00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:33,880
sort of last minute right at the
end of development of the war 

548
00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:38,320
within testing. 
Mostly because I would say it 

549
00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:41,760
was a combination of one, people
were saying the class tree is 

550
00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:44,280
really bad and I have nothing 
that I care about, especially at

551
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:48,360
the bottom and two, people sort 
of identifying that yes, 

552
00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,080
enhancement, sorry, not 
enhancement shaman in general 

553
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:55,760
are very much lacking in things 
that they can use to live on 

554
00:33:55,760 --> 00:33:58,240
their own. 
When we compare it to other 

555
00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:01,280
specs, because obviously in the 
context of the war within, this 

556
00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:04,520
was before the prune that's 
happened now on defence that's 

557
00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:07,760
been unevenly applied. 
I have to say. 

558
00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:12,360
So back then, when you're 
competing with most specs that 

559
00:34:12,360 --> 00:34:18,239
have got either, two very low 
cooldown ones are for myriad 

560
00:34:18,840 --> 00:34:20,920
length cooldown ones where 
they've always got something. 

561
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:23,320
You look at Shaman and you've 
got one that's higher than 

562
00:34:23,320 --> 00:34:26,679
average and one that's way 
higher than average cooldowns 

563
00:34:27,159 --> 00:34:30,239
and nothing in between. 
You will always look at an 

564
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:36,000
encounter's cadence and see 
well, this, this and this. 

565
00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:37,760
We'll be able to cover it on 
this spec. 

566
00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:40,239
But for the shaman, what do they
do about the middle one? 

567
00:34:40,239 --> 00:34:41,560
Because they've not got 
anything. 

568
00:34:42,840 --> 00:34:43,880
So I think that's why they added
it. 

569
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:48,080
And now when they're starting to
prune, they think, well, what 

570
00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:50,440
does it really do that earth 
elemental doesn't? 

571
00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:57,240
And to someone who and now this.
This isn't to say that the the 

572
00:34:57,240 --> 00:34:59,320
devs don't play the game, 
because I absolutely don't 

573
00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:02,080
believe that at all. 
But I think to someone who 

574
00:35:02,080 --> 00:35:06,040
hasn't experienced how 
enhancement or just shaman in 

575
00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:10,080
general plays in end game 
content, it would be very easy 

576
00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:13,120
to strip the two spells that 
look kind of similar as the long

577
00:35:13,120 --> 00:35:17,560
cool down press to live button 
without realizing what function 

578
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:19,120
it serves of having two of 
those. 

579
00:35:19,720 --> 00:35:22,520
When you go into an encounter 
relative, how will the specs 

580
00:35:22,840 --> 00:35:25,200
handle it? 
And I think that's like a 

581
00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:32,440
misstep generally. 
But I also would say losing 

582
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:35,320
stone Bullock doesn't really 
move the needle. 

583
00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:36,640
Very. 
I don't think the stone Bullock 

584
00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:40,080
fixed the problem that we had, 
so removing it it makes it 

585
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:42,520
worse. 
But even if it didn't still been

586
00:35:42,520 --> 00:35:44,080
there, we'd still have the 
problem. 

587
00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:50,440
And changing earth elemental to 
now lose the 5% Dr. but not 

588
00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:54,920
taunt One, that's great, big fan
of it not taunting and get 

589
00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:58,440
itself itself killed anymore. 
But two, it's now a little 

590
00:35:58,440 --> 00:36:04,040
weaker in defence, it's a lot 
shorter, but it's on a lower ish

591
00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:07,240
cooldown. 
But the question is for three. 

592
00:36:07,240 --> 00:36:10,280
Minutes and then a minute 
duration to 30 seconds now, 

593
00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:13,560
Yeah. 
Yeah, it's basically it's sort 

594
00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:15,400
of like stepping in for Stumble 
Walk. 

595
00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:20,520
But the the thing with Earth 
Elemental is that 15% health is 

596
00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:24,240
nice, but is it 3 minute 
cooldown nice? 

597
00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:27,640
I don't know. 
And what are the situations 

598
00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:31,920
where you want 15% more health 
for 30 seconds and you have to 

599
00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:35,520
usually kind of stretch to find 
those. 

600
00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:39,080
You can find the situation where
you want the health for a 

601
00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:42,240
minute, because then it'll 
overlap quite a lot of things 

602
00:36:42,240 --> 00:36:44,320
that people want. 
But 30 seconds, it's a that's a 

603
00:36:44,320 --> 00:36:46,880
pretty aggressive cadence for 
dangerous mechanics. 

604
00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:50,520
So if if that covers those, then
there's a lot, much bigger 

605
00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:52,360
problem. 
Unity raid cooldowns for that 

606
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:56,560
anyway. 
So our defensive took it in 

607
00:36:56,560 --> 00:36:59,680
general just feels like it's 
from a different game when I 

608
00:36:59,680 --> 00:37:05,760
compare it across the board. 
And like my extreme opinion is 

609
00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:08,480
that I don't think that the end 
game that we have is going to 

610
00:37:08,480 --> 00:37:12,800
work long term without 
frustrations for specific people

611
00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:16,800
unless they just, and this is a 
the buzzword for people they 

612
00:37:16,800 --> 00:37:17,880
don't like. 
But I think they just need to 

613
00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:21,040
homogenize the fences a little 
bit where there's sort of like a

614
00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:25,000
baseline expectation of what you
can live if you play properly. 

615
00:37:25,760 --> 00:37:32,560
OK, I had had thought for a 
longest time since again we're 

616
00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:35,160
not blaming other specs. 
I just feel that when they 

617
00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:38,520
introduced Demon Hunter and 
Demon Hunter was a lot of Leech 

618
00:37:38,520 --> 00:37:42,240
and self healing that that's 
when they decided that shaman 

619
00:37:42,240 --> 00:37:45,000
could no longer do a lot of 
Leech and self healing. 

620
00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:51,040
Our dogs used to heal ourselves 
and I'm not entirely upset about

621
00:37:51,040 --> 00:37:54,280
that because it it was when they
started turning into genuine 

622
00:37:54,280 --> 00:37:58,080
offensive cooldowns instead of 
some hybrid defensive offensive 

623
00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:01,720
cooldown. 
But when you're looking at, like

624
00:38:01,720 --> 00:38:07,800
you said, healing stream totem 
that just over I think the 

625
00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:11,960
entire duration does about as 
much healing as like if you had 

626
00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:13,840
just done a healing tied on 
yourself. 

627
00:38:15,600 --> 00:38:23,080
It I wonder where they feel like
shaman defenses are supposed to 

628
00:38:23,080 --> 00:38:24,760
be strong with these duration 
things. 

629
00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:29,000
Are we supposed to be like the 
anti rots thing and then we need

630
00:38:29,000 --> 00:38:33,280
spot healing? 
But with the, with the damage 

631
00:38:33,280 --> 00:38:38,120
that you're seeing out in, in 
dungeons and in, in raids, are 

632
00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:41,680
you, is rot healing really the 
issue or is it more that we're 

633
00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:45,240
dealing with, I don't want to 
say it's close to Dragonflight 

634
00:38:45,240 --> 00:38:48,240
spike levels, but are we dealing
more with spiky damage? 

635
00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:53,520
Obviously with a with a grain of
salt, because eventually 

636
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:57,360
everything in keys becomes like 
lethal spike anyway. 

637
00:38:57,360 --> 00:39:00,520
So eventually you run into that 
problem. 

638
00:39:00,520 --> 00:39:04,920
So that's by the by the the like
the raid and the dungeons in 

639
00:39:04,920 --> 00:39:07,000
general. 
Rot is definitely relevant. 

640
00:39:07,960 --> 00:39:11,120
That's going on. 
But you, you tie it into like 

641
00:39:11,120 --> 00:39:13,160
how the healers are, how having 
to deal with it right now, 

642
00:39:13,160 --> 00:39:16,760
because they've changed a lot of
how healers cadence is with just

643
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:22,400
dealing with a fight in general.
And you, you spend now this 

644
00:39:23,240 --> 00:39:25,800
maybe a slight on the healers 
that I played with, but I I'm 

645
00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:27,600
hoping it's not. 
I, I think this is just a 

646
00:39:27,600 --> 00:39:31,080
general across the board thing. 
You spend more time than you 

647
00:39:31,080 --> 00:39:35,520
would normally be comfortable 
with on live, not at full 

648
00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:37,720
health. 
And it's fine. 

649
00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:43,560
It's supposed to be fine. 
And when you're put in bad 

650
00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:47,280
situations, you can usually do 
something to help them out when 

651
00:39:47,280 --> 00:39:48,920
they're struggling because 
something's gone wrong or it's 

652
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:50,480
particularly dangerous mechanic 
or so on. 

653
00:39:52,480 --> 00:40:00,560
In our case, we do spend more 
time at not Max health, but we 

654
00:40:00,560 --> 00:40:05,120
do so little self healing 
passively relative to every 

655
00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:11,480
other spec, 90% of other specs, 
just in case anyone wants to get

656
00:40:11,480 --> 00:40:14,440
it on my case about that one. 
But we do so little there that 

657
00:40:14,440 --> 00:40:16,960
even though you've got that 
extra overhead to let self 

658
00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:20,360
healing be relevant and sort of 
trickle in to help the healer. 

659
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:23,280
It doesn't matter because we 
just sit there getting lower and

660
00:40:23,280 --> 00:40:26,400
lower and lower until we 
actively do something about it 

661
00:40:26,720 --> 00:40:28,920
and it will take us a while to 
recover that back. 

662
00:40:30,360 --> 00:40:36,000
And for respect that's so fast 
and built on momentum, that's a 

663
00:40:36,000 --> 00:40:43,040
really unpleasant thing to have.
Be part of it because you don't 

664
00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:46,640
want the spec. 
In the case of say I'm going to 

665
00:40:46,640 --> 00:40:49,480
have to use comparisons with 
this like with Ferrell. 

666
00:40:49,640 --> 00:40:53,120
Ferrell self healing isn't 
great, but they do actively self

667
00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:55,240
heal as well with instant 
regrowth. 

668
00:40:55,680 --> 00:40:59,920
It's not good, but Ferrell has 
got natural downtime where if 

669
00:40:59,920 --> 00:41:01,880
you spend something in that 
downtime it doesn't matter 

670
00:41:01,880 --> 00:41:05,360
because everything still kind of
working in the background. 

671
00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:09,680
Whereas with enhancement, the 
way it's built is that when you 

672
00:41:09,680 --> 00:41:14,120
do anything other than your main
things, everything stops because

673
00:41:14,200 --> 00:41:18,200
it's all in the momentum of you 
keep rolling things over onto 

674
00:41:18,200 --> 00:41:21,000
each other. 
And you wouldn't want like a 

675
00:41:21,000 --> 00:41:25,160
Demon Hunter to when they want 
to heal, be like, OK, well, 

676
00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:27,520
you've just pressed i-beam, 
you've gone into meta, but you 

677
00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:30,240
need to heal. 
So why don't you stop and cast 

678
00:41:30,240 --> 00:41:33,360
this spell to make a soul that 
you run over and collect? 

679
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:36,280
It's it wouldn't be fun. 
And that's why they're built in 

680
00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:39,520
the way that their healing comes
from just being aggressive. 

681
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:42,320
And it didn't, it just doesn't 
match. 

682
00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:45,760
It clashes against everything 
else that the spec is doing and 

683
00:41:45,760 --> 00:41:50,840
it's really jarring. 
This is a very strange sort of 

684
00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:54,680
feel topic, but it's definitely 
relevant for us. 

685
00:41:54,680 --> 00:41:57,200
And I don't, I don't like it. 
I don't like how they've been 

686
00:41:57,200 --> 00:41:59,480
doing it. 
I think that they really need to

687
00:41:59,640 --> 00:42:01,800
just sort of address Shaman's 
defensives. 

688
00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:02,960
But I've been saying that for 10
years. 

689
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:05,840
So it's sort of like banging a 
drum. 

690
00:42:06,320 --> 00:42:12,480
If you recall, Paladins in their
halfway through dragon fight 

691
00:42:12,640 --> 00:42:16,520
makes they had nodes that were 
different for their different 

692
00:42:16,520 --> 00:42:18,440
specs. 
So protection versus retribution

693
00:42:18,440 --> 00:42:23,800
versus holy had different 
talents in their in their class 

694
00:42:23,800 --> 00:42:26,320
tree. 
We were just talking earlier 

695
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:30,240
about these dead ligaments in 
the our class tree. 

696
00:42:30,440 --> 00:42:32,040
I think there's there's space 
there. 

697
00:42:32,040 --> 00:42:37,240
I don't see why Ancestral 
guidance doesn't just fit so 

698
00:42:37,240 --> 00:42:45,080
easily in for in for enhancement
if they are still allowing a 

699
00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:49,840
priest to vamp themselves it 
seems. 

700
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:57,760
It seems in a similar vein, but 
what would you say would be your

701
00:42:57,760 --> 00:43:02,280
wish list for some enhancement 
changes? 

702
00:43:03,520 --> 00:43:06,520
Oh, do we mean defensive or 
offensive or both? 

703
00:43:06,520 --> 00:43:09,160
Let's say, let's say one 
offensive, one defensive. 

704
00:43:09,160 --> 00:43:11,000
Let's start with defensive 
because we're talking about that

705
00:43:11,000 --> 00:43:18,280
right now. 
The the easiest, easiest one on 

706
00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:21,440
the list is that you need to 
give Astro Chef 2 charges 

707
00:43:22,240 --> 00:43:24,360
because you've been doing that 
to all of the specs that have 

708
00:43:24,440 --> 00:43:27,720
have got that sort of unusual 
defence. 

709
00:43:27,720 --> 00:43:30,360
And you've even given it to one 
of the ones that had the already

710
00:43:30,360 --> 00:43:35,840
really good defensive to name no
names of anything that double 

711
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:40,920
jumps. 
So that would just be a complete

712
00:43:40,920 --> 00:43:43,080
freebie you can get. 
There's so many different 

713
00:43:43,720 --> 00:43:47,160
thematic or law ways that you 
could make us more defending if 

714
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:50,360
you really wanted to. 
And I could give a laundry list 

715
00:43:50,360 --> 00:43:52,600
of ideas that would be kind of 
cool that would work. 

716
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:58,040
But the easiest, simplest fix 
would just be give it 2 charges 

717
00:43:58,200 --> 00:44:01,360
and and honestly, you drop it's 
cool down to a minute and you 

718
00:44:01,360 --> 00:44:05,440
make us like demon hunters and 
that would probably take off the

719
00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:08,760
majority of the sting of us 
struggling to live. 

720
00:44:11,720 --> 00:44:13,920
You should go down healing 
stream told not being bad. 

721
00:44:14,040 --> 00:44:18,800
Give us ways to like heal 
passively when we generate X 

722
00:44:18,800 --> 00:44:20,360
like when we generate met raging
whales. 

723
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:23,080
So it just sort of naturally 
diffuses on us rather than 

724
00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:26,360
actively doing it. 
But yeah, the defence is just 

725
00:44:26,360 --> 00:44:29,480
such an enormous open space for 
them to do anything because 

726
00:44:29,480 --> 00:44:35,760
we've got so little right now 
that you you could make ank like

727
00:44:35,760 --> 00:44:39,120
a 3 minute cooldown and it 
probably wouldn't improve the 

728
00:44:39,120 --> 00:44:41,040
situation. 
That's how far behind we are. 

729
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:45,400
I feel so yeah. 
Oh man. 

730
00:44:45,920 --> 00:44:47,560
I'm hoping you're not getting 
taxed for Ankh. 

731
00:44:47,720 --> 00:44:51,000
It's like you can get up at any 
point, so you're going to be 

732
00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:55,760
more. 
Every 20 minutes, yeah, that's 

733
00:44:55,760 --> 00:44:58,880
that's an entire tangent that I 
could go on about for easily an 

734
00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:05,720
hour about how defenses for 
offense, it's really hard to 

735
00:45:05,720 --> 00:45:10,400
pick one. 
But the probably the easiest 1 

736
00:45:10,400 --> 00:45:14,840
is that I'd I'd really, really, 
really, really like them to do 

737
00:45:14,840 --> 00:45:18,240
something with Stormbringer to 
give any point of control on 

738
00:45:18,240 --> 00:45:21,160
Tempest. 
I can I can live with Totemic 

739
00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:24,680
the whole time like how it is. 
I think that could just ship and

740
00:45:24,680 --> 00:45:27,600
be fine. 
There's a lot of things that 

741
00:45:27,600 --> 00:45:29,760
they could do to just improve 
the entire package, but 

742
00:45:29,760 --> 00:45:32,840
Stormbreaker anything has just 
got this one glaring issue that 

743
00:45:32,840 --> 00:45:36,120
what they removed wasn't 
replaced by anything and what 

744
00:45:36,120 --> 00:45:39,520
they removed wasn't overbearing 
to begin with. 

745
00:45:41,360 --> 00:45:45,640
So like simple things like the 
chance for it to trigger is 

746
00:45:45,640 --> 00:45:47,200
higher during Doom Winds or 
ascendance. 

747
00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:49,160
That would be really simple. 
And that would mean that your 

748
00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:51,600
cooldowns mean that you have a 
point of control where you know 

749
00:45:51,880 --> 00:45:54,920
it's more likely that you're 
going to hit Tempest during 

750
00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:00,640
this. 
There's there's one that's 

751
00:46:00,640 --> 00:46:03,240
basically copying Ferrell, which
would be the like the first time

752
00:46:03,240 --> 00:46:05,320
that you cast crash each time 
you're into combat, you get 

753
00:46:05,320 --> 00:46:08,600
Tempest. 
So you can guarantee in mythic 

754
00:46:08,600 --> 00:46:10,920
plus that you can front load a 
Tempest without having to do all

755
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:13,840
the stupid pooling and carrying 
charges that we've had to do. 

756
00:46:13,840 --> 00:46:18,240
That's still going to be 
relevant, which I don't like of 

757
00:46:18,240 --> 00:46:20,880
just the simple thing of make 
storm strike do anything the 

758
00:46:20,880 --> 00:46:24,080
storm bringer, because when they
removed awakening storms, it's 

759
00:46:24,080 --> 00:46:28,240
just a kind of pointless button 
on the tree that's definitely 

760
00:46:28,240 --> 00:46:32,360
supposed to favorite. 
This is another one where I have

761
00:46:32,360 --> 00:46:35,280
like my own personal list of. 
I could rattle these off and 

762
00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:38,120
just beg for them, but it will 
be along with. 

763
00:46:38,280 --> 00:46:42,880
Our number one fishing tool now 
it's how we I hate that it's 

764
00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:44,360
sorry. 
It's one of those things where 

765
00:46:44,360 --> 00:46:47,160
they've like really obviously 
thought, well, Totemic has Lava 

766
00:46:47,160 --> 00:46:49,920
Lash and it's so very obviously 
the Lava Lash tree. 

767
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:52,640
We've been all these things that
are related explicitly to Lava 

768
00:46:52,640 --> 00:46:57,320
Lash and it shines through where
it makes the infrequent button 

769
00:46:57,480 --> 00:47:00,840
really frequent and really 
strong and really versatile. 

770
00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:05,120
And then you look at 
Stormbringer, which I'm not 

771
00:47:05,120 --> 00:47:07,880
going to say that it's namesake 
gives it away, but it's very 

772
00:47:07,880 --> 00:47:11,560
obviously supposed to use the 
storm strike or crash lightning 

773
00:47:11,560 --> 00:47:14,920
thing as it's like main 
leveraging tool to do the thing.

774
00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:17,760
And then you look through the 
tree and the one talent that had

775
00:47:17,760 --> 00:47:21,880
a mention of storm strike still 
kind of mentions it, but it's a 

776
00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:27,240
talent that's not to say 
worthless, but it's it's nowhere

777
00:47:27,240 --> 00:47:32,240
near what it used to be. 
And that feels like it's pulled 

778
00:47:32,240 --> 00:47:36,880
away from its sort of identity. 
It doesn't doesn't feel like 

779
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:41,000
it's got the oomph that 
Stormbringer had because I, when

780
00:47:41,000 --> 00:47:43,760
I was reviewing these, these 
hero trees leading up to the 

781
00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:48,240
wall within, it was really easy 
to sell Stormbringer to anyone. 

782
00:47:48,560 --> 00:47:52,160
Because the name, the way that 
it looks, the way that it feels 

783
00:47:52,160 --> 00:47:55,520
when you're playing it, it's 
really, it really captured like 

784
00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:57,600
the idea of what it was trying 
to do. 

785
00:47:57,800 --> 00:48:00,960
And then you'd look at Totemic 
and selling that, especially a 

786
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:03,160
launch was it was really 
difficult. 

787
00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:06,120
OK, wait, wait, wait, wait. 
We we have to put a disclaimer 

788
00:48:06,120 --> 00:48:08,480
here. 
Totonic at the launch of the War

789
00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:12,040
Within wasn't a tree that was 
anywhere near what it was even 

790
00:48:12,040 --> 00:48:14,880
in the next patch. 
And I I would say wasn't even 

791
00:48:15,040 --> 00:48:17,080
actually fully developed on 
launch. 

792
00:48:18,200 --> 00:48:20,960
It was. 
That's being quite generous. 

793
00:48:21,200 --> 00:48:24,560
I would, I would tentatively say
considering it was the middle of

794
00:48:24,560 --> 00:48:28,560
the expansion, it was, it was a 
miracle how well they brought 

795
00:48:28,560 --> 00:48:32,360
together that from what they 
initially passed because their 

796
00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:36,600
first pass of that tree and even
their second iteration was 

797
00:48:37,840 --> 00:48:41,680
dubious at best. 
And it was, it was really 

798
00:48:41,680 --> 00:48:43,560
fractured. 
It didn't have like an idea 

799
00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:44,920
behind it. 
It was just sort of throwing 

800
00:48:44,920 --> 00:48:47,360
everything at the wall. 
And I think they almost just 

801
00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:50,600
sort of use that as the way of, 
well, people kind of like this. 

802
00:48:50,600 --> 00:48:53,960
So let's just lead really heavy 
into this now, which is fine 

803
00:48:53,960 --> 00:48:55,600
because it worked out in the 
end. 

804
00:48:55,760 --> 00:48:57,960
That's great. 
Funny to see the situation's 

805
00:48:57,960 --> 00:49:00,160
reverse now. 
But we've now we've completely 

806
00:49:00,160 --> 00:49:03,920
inverted were you can sell 
Stormbringer on the the theme 

807
00:49:03,920 --> 00:49:07,720
and the name, but when you get 
to the gameplay part of it, 

808
00:49:07,720 --> 00:49:10,280
there's nothing that you can 
really sell people other than 

809
00:49:10,640 --> 00:49:12,480
Tempest sounds cool and it does 
a lot of damage. 

810
00:49:12,480 --> 00:49:20,160
But the way that it feels to 
play is my experience with it 

811
00:49:20,160 --> 00:49:24,760
has been if anyone asks about 
Stormbringer, you have to 

812
00:49:24,760 --> 00:49:26,680
clarify. 
Have you played it on Live? 

813
00:49:27,080 --> 00:49:30,520
Because if they have that 
context, you completely change 

814
00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:34,160
how you talk about it. 
Because if they know what it's 

815
00:49:34,160 --> 00:49:37,760
like now, they have a really 
strong expectation of what it's 

816
00:49:37,760 --> 00:49:40,560
going to feel like in the future
if they haven't tried it. 

817
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:45,000
Whereas if they haven't played 
it before, you can kind of 

818
00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:47,520
compare it to some of the more 
boring hero talents on other 

819
00:49:47,520 --> 00:49:51,800
specs and they'll get the idea. 
And it's not massively 

820
00:49:51,880 --> 00:49:55,040
disappointed or like 
disheartening, but it really is 

821
00:49:55,040 --> 00:49:58,800
for anyone who's experienced it 
because it's took such a massive

822
00:49:58,800 --> 00:50:02,360
change. 
So yeah, that's that's the 

823
00:50:02,360 --> 00:50:05,160
easiest one where every patch 
now I'll be watching for a storm

824
00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:07,560
ringer thing, even though 
there's other stuff that they 

825
00:50:07,560 --> 00:50:09,680
could do. 
That's that's my go to. 

826
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:15,080
Based on where things are right 
now, like how do you feel that 

827
00:50:15,320 --> 00:50:19,400
Shaman's damage profile works in
the raids and in the dungeons? 

828
00:50:19,480 --> 00:50:23,520
Do you feel like we're like 
we're too early to say numbers 

829
00:50:23,520 --> 00:50:27,880
wise, but in terms of like, hey,
now that Totemic is at a minute 

830
00:50:27,880 --> 00:50:30,320
and instead of being a 
maintenance buff, are we going 

831
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:33,760
to have the oomph as we go 
between packs? 

832
00:50:33,760 --> 00:50:36,880
Are we going to have the right 
damage profile for the bosses 

833
00:50:36,880 --> 00:50:43,920
that we've tested? 
I I think that right now our 

834
00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:48,480
damage profile is very, very 
good from a dungeon point of 

835
00:50:48,480 --> 00:50:54,000
view when you've got a one 
minute huge burst, because I the

836
00:50:54,000 --> 00:50:59,200
spec can play just do wins and 
do a lot of damage immediately 

837
00:50:59,200 --> 00:51:01,000
when a pack starts, no matter 
how big it is. 

838
00:51:01,320 --> 00:51:04,280
And it's it's really, really 
satisfying to do it. 

839
00:51:05,880 --> 00:51:07,520
That's just good. 
And then you've got the in 

840
00:51:07,520 --> 00:51:10,840
between 30 seconds, which 
primordial storm not as good as 

841
00:51:10,840 --> 00:51:14,960
it used to be by a lot, which is
kind of sad, but that one is I 

842
00:51:14,960 --> 00:51:17,880
think they can just reach in 
that the the in between of the 

843
00:51:17,880 --> 00:51:20,360
thundering plus haste is great 
too. 

844
00:51:20,960 --> 00:51:23,880
And you also are doing quite a 
lot of priority damage because a

845
00:51:23,880 --> 00:51:25,800
lot of your AOE stuff is coming 
off the fact that you're 

846
00:51:25,800 --> 00:51:28,200
pressing single target buttons 
on the thing that's important, 

847
00:51:28,600 --> 00:51:32,640
which naturally is like a really
high value profile to be built 

848
00:51:32,640 --> 00:51:35,560
around. 
It's not quite as good as 

849
00:51:35,560 --> 00:51:39,240
funnel, which we've had in the 
past as well. 

850
00:51:39,640 --> 00:51:41,600
It's kind of stupid to say that 
an enhancement had anything in 

851
00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:43,520
the past because it has 
literally gone through every 

852
00:51:43,520 --> 00:51:46,080
single different iteration of 
what type of damage profile spec

853
00:51:46,160 --> 00:51:50,240
and has have. 
But it's it's sort of the it's 

854
00:51:50,240 --> 00:51:53,120
only just behind funnel in terms
of if you do all of your AOE 

855
00:51:53,120 --> 00:51:57,720
from hitting a one thing really 
hard, then you're kind of funnel

856
00:51:57,720 --> 00:51:59,720
in anyway because you're just 
doing a single target thing. 

857
00:52:00,960 --> 00:52:07,960
So that part is really good too.
The rate on the other hand is a 

858
00:52:07,960 --> 00:52:11,760
complicated discussion because 
it's down to how the fights are 

859
00:52:11,760 --> 00:52:15,720
built, where some of them it's 
really good. 

860
00:52:15,720 --> 00:52:18,560
It's really good to have a one 
minute or two-minute and you can

861
00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:21,840
ship between them and you can 
see how the fight would be like 

862
00:52:21,840 --> 00:52:24,320
where the pain points would be 
solved by you changing these 

863
00:52:24,320 --> 00:52:31,320
around the size of the arenas. 
When it comes to Totemic, you 

864
00:52:31,320 --> 00:52:35,560
are still dragging at home 
around and it can be a little 

865
00:52:35,560 --> 00:52:38,480
bit irritating. 
You can lose Hot hand just by 

866
00:52:39,080 --> 00:52:41,960
things running away or you 
having to leave and not being 

867
00:52:41,960 --> 00:52:46,400
able to to roll it over. 
I think we'll eventually be able

868
00:52:46,400 --> 00:52:50,240
to play around it. 
But the bigger one of all of it 

869
00:52:50,240 --> 00:52:54,120
is that there's there's more 
than one encounter where the the

870
00:52:54,120 --> 00:52:59,800
cooldown timers seem almost 
intentionally built to get under

871
00:52:59,800 --> 00:53:01,520
the skin of one minute or 
two-minute people. 

872
00:53:03,120 --> 00:53:05,960
Salvador is the easiest example 
of this in the universe. 

873
00:53:05,960 --> 00:53:12,400
He has a damage amp and it comes
at 1:48 and last for like 15 

874
00:53:12,400 --> 00:53:15,520
seconds. 
So if at 1:48 you want a 2 

875
00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:18,280
minute class, you want them to 
hold virtually their entire 

876
00:53:18,280 --> 00:53:21,600
thing to get there versus like a
one minute 1, they're going to 

877
00:53:21,600 --> 00:53:25,640
hold for all of that too. 
And it keeps having this ever so

878
00:53:25,640 --> 00:53:27,520
slight desicc. 
But if you just so happen to be 

879
00:53:27,520 --> 00:53:31,280
one of the unique ones is a 1.5 
minute call down, well, that's 

880
00:53:31,280 --> 00:53:33,080
perfect. 
That's exactly what you want for

881
00:53:33,080 --> 00:53:38,880
the damage amp guy. 
So that part I think is that 

882
00:53:38,880 --> 00:53:41,800
that's not just another problem.
That's just the there's going to

883
00:53:41,800 --> 00:53:44,360
be that camp of people who think
why, why would you do this 

884
00:53:44,680 --> 00:53:50,760
intentionally? 
But I I still think that our 

885
00:53:50,760 --> 00:53:54,120
profile in general, it works. 
We do a lot of cleave. 

886
00:53:54,200 --> 00:53:58,040
It's impossible to not be 
cleaving with the spec, which 

887
00:53:58,480 --> 00:54:02,640
given the Raiders has exactly 0 
pure single target fights so 

888
00:54:02,640 --> 00:54:06,760
far, the disclaimer because two 
of them haven't been seen. 

889
00:54:07,640 --> 00:54:10,000
That's obviously good as well 
because you never want to be the

890
00:54:10,000 --> 00:54:12,680
spec that has to give something 
up to do it's AOE and we just 

891
00:54:12,680 --> 00:54:15,640
don't give anything up. 
You still just just do the thing

892
00:54:15,640 --> 00:54:19,840
for free. 
So I I think across the board 

893
00:54:19,840 --> 00:54:24,080
you you'd be hard pressed to not
see a reason for enhancement to 

894
00:54:24,080 --> 00:54:28,720
work, assuming it's tuned right 
in the whole raid, whether it 

895
00:54:28,720 --> 00:54:31,200
can lift those encounters and 
whether or not you'll enjoy some

896
00:54:31,200 --> 00:54:35,160
of them for a few reasons. 
Because there's quite a lot of, 

897
00:54:36,360 --> 00:54:40,440
let's say, not so melee friendly
design decisions that have been 

898
00:54:40,440 --> 00:54:44,800
made and not just the usual. 
This raid hates melee doom 

899
00:54:44,800 --> 00:54:48,320
posting genuinely. 
This is really not built for a 

900
00:54:48,320 --> 00:54:56,320
melee to be able to handle exist
in not half, but not far of half

901
00:54:56,320 --> 00:55:03,040
of the encounters so far. 
So that remains to be seen, but 

902
00:55:03,200 --> 00:55:06,920
I, I, it's, it's in a better 
state than we've launched before

903
00:55:07,400 --> 00:55:09,360
in expansions where we've ended 
up doing really well. 

904
00:55:09,360 --> 00:55:14,440
So I I'm relatively hopeful. 
Yeah, I'm really glad to hear 

905
00:55:14,440 --> 00:55:18,520
that. 
Obviously, the last thing that I

906
00:55:18,520 --> 00:55:20,720
want to talk about and like I 
thought we would get to the 

907
00:55:20,720 --> 00:55:28,160
sooner, but with the UI, with 
the cooldown manager and they've

908
00:55:28,160 --> 00:55:30,280
made of course some changes like
we were talking about with 

909
00:55:30,280 --> 00:55:34,640
accumulating storms for good or 
for I'll, you no longer need the

910
00:55:34,640 --> 00:55:42,920
cooldown manager to track that. 
But is Shaman Enhancement Shaman

911
00:55:42,960 --> 00:55:45,720
supported well enough in the 
cooldown manager? 

912
00:55:45,720 --> 00:55:47,840
And what are the things that 
it's succeeding in? 

913
00:55:47,840 --> 00:55:49,800
What are the things that it 
needs improvement for? 

914
00:55:53,280 --> 00:55:56,040
It's show me to be really honest
or just kind of. 

915
00:55:56,800 --> 00:55:59,120
I think, I think we have to be 
honest at this point. 

916
00:55:59,120 --> 00:56:03,160
Like I, I know, I know there's a
lot of doom and gloom, but I 

917
00:56:03,160 --> 00:56:09,880
think that being honest about 
it, I guess just as I phrase the

918
00:56:09,880 --> 00:56:11,960
question like they're what, 
what's the parts that they've 

919
00:56:11,960 --> 00:56:13,680
improved on? 
What are the parts that still 

920
00:56:13,680 --> 00:56:18,920
have the gaps? 
So there's definitely things 

921
00:56:18,920 --> 00:56:22,960
that they've removed that for 
better or worse, I think we're 

922
00:56:22,960 --> 00:56:26,160
exclusively so that they didn't 
have to worry about it in the 

923
00:56:26,160 --> 00:56:28,680
cooldown manager. 
And that's fine. 

924
00:56:29,360 --> 00:56:32,440
The the the whole Tempest 
spending 40 to get there. 

925
00:56:33,000 --> 00:56:36,440
I understand that. 
That's not that complicated. 

926
00:56:36,440 --> 00:56:41,080
Even like for the most like very
casual player, it's not 

927
00:56:41,080 --> 00:56:43,200
complicated to understand. 
The more I spend I eventually 

928
00:56:43,200 --> 00:56:48,560
get the thing, but representing 
that on the cooldown manager is 

929
00:56:48,560 --> 00:56:54,600
difficult to do and also 
blockading anyone from finding 

930
00:56:54,600 --> 00:56:58,480
some elaborate work around that 
definitely doesn't exist right 

931
00:56:58,480 --> 00:57:01,480
now. 
Honest. 

932
00:57:01,920 --> 00:57:05,800
To work out how you would have 
like calculated the the rate to 

933
00:57:05,800 --> 00:57:09,880
the next one would have been a 
massive advantage over somebody 

934
00:57:09,880 --> 00:57:11,560
who didn't have it. 
So that's fair. 

935
00:57:11,560 --> 00:57:16,880
I understand them removing those
things, but, and it's quite a 

936
00:57:16,880 --> 00:57:24,120
large but the cooldown manager 
is, but it's the only word that 

937
00:57:24,120 --> 00:57:26,400
I can use for it. 
Is is not up to standard for 

938
00:57:26,400 --> 00:57:29,440
what enhancement needs? 
Because enhancement is almost 

939
00:57:29,440 --> 00:57:34,240
entirely built around you 
keeping the extreme control over

940
00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:38,040
knowing the state of multiple 
buttons that overlap with each 

941
00:57:38,040 --> 00:57:41,360
other and you need to make 
decisions based on that. 

942
00:57:41,360 --> 00:57:44,080
There's not like a resource bar 
that can dictate how you do 

943
00:57:44,080 --> 00:57:46,120
everything. 
You have multiple plates 

944
00:57:46,120 --> 00:57:50,720
spinning and the cool down 
manager doesn't sufficiently let

945
00:57:50,720 --> 00:57:55,720
you customize the layout or 
display the information well 

946
00:57:55,720 --> 00:57:58,160
enough that I think that the 
average person could build 

947
00:57:58,160 --> 00:58:01,040
something that's comfortable for
them on a case by case. 

948
00:58:01,040 --> 00:58:03,440
And I think that enhancement is 
one of those specs were it is 

949
00:58:03,440 --> 00:58:07,440
case by case. 
The how you process information 

950
00:58:07,440 --> 00:58:11,000
when you're playing from the 
very, very, very top end players

951
00:58:11,000 --> 00:58:14,800
to the most casual person is 
completely different. 

952
00:58:14,840 --> 00:58:17,360
And anything that you need to 
restrict that level of 

953
00:58:17,360 --> 00:58:23,040
customization will hurt someone.
So I would say that we 

954
00:58:23,080 --> 00:58:27,160
definitely got hurt by that. 
And then the the biggest 

955
00:58:27,200 --> 00:58:33,840
elephant in the room is that no 
matter what, I would personally 

956
00:58:33,840 --> 00:58:38,640
recommend that everyone will 
need at least one add on to play

957
00:58:38,640 --> 00:58:43,040
enhancement in midnight. 
And you will require an add on 

958
00:58:43,040 --> 00:58:46,360
to do Maelstrom because Blizzard
aren't going to get that in 

959
00:58:46,400 --> 00:58:50,200
before the expansion. 
I can, I can't guarantee it, but

960
00:58:50,200 --> 00:58:53,760
I can give a very heavy promise 
that there will not be a 

961
00:58:54,680 --> 00:58:58,200
conversion to a resource that 
they very clearly intend to do 

962
00:58:58,880 --> 00:59:02,000
between now and launch. 
It'll come later, at which point

963
00:59:02,000 --> 00:59:04,640
you need an add on to confirm, 
convert that buff that's been 

964
00:59:04,640 --> 00:59:07,480
made on secret into a bar, combo
points, whatever. 

965
00:59:07,480 --> 00:59:10,840
Like bells and whistles you want
because an aura with a stack 

966
00:59:10,840 --> 00:59:16,200
counter or an inaccurate 
Blizzard overlay isn't nearly as

967
00:59:16,200 --> 00:59:19,600
useful as having the thing 
that's accurate showing that. 

968
00:59:19,600 --> 00:59:24,320
So that is a minimum requirement
that is completely separate to 

969
00:59:24,320 --> 00:59:26,240
any other spec. 
No other spec is going to be in 

970
00:59:26,240 --> 00:59:29,480
this situation where you require
an add on to do a function that 

971
00:59:29,480 --> 00:59:34,800
the CDM will never do and then 
the CDM itself. 

972
00:59:37,080 --> 00:59:42,080
This is a much broader criticism
of it, but I am incredibly 

973
00:59:42,080 --> 00:59:45,200
worried about the fact that 
there has to be someone curating

974
00:59:45,200 --> 00:59:48,120
what spells are in those track 
lists and need to make sure it 

975
00:59:48,120 --> 00:59:53,080
works. 
Because right now there are at 

976
00:59:53,080 --> 00:59:58,000
least 80,000 entries in the call
down manager across all the 

977
00:59:58,000 --> 01:00:00,720
classes and specs because every 
single one of them's got an ID 

978
01:00:01,720 --> 01:00:04,720
and so each one of those IDs is 
something that has had someone 

979
01:00:04,720 --> 01:00:08,040
going to call the manager and 
configure it and. 

980
01:00:08,480 --> 01:00:11,560
Having one person, because this 
is important enough that you 

981
01:00:11,560 --> 01:00:14,640
would need someone always 
looking at these each patch. 

982
01:00:14,920 --> 01:00:17,600
Having one person go through all
of those and make sure that it 

983
01:00:17,600 --> 01:00:21,720
works is a pretty, pretty 
daunting task to assume they're 

984
01:00:21,720 --> 01:00:22,680
going to get it right every 
time. 

985
01:00:22,680 --> 01:00:25,120
Because if it's not right on 
live, if something's not 

986
01:00:25,120 --> 01:00:27,360
working, you can make a weak car
and you can fix it. 

987
01:00:27,360 --> 01:00:30,720
You can you can make up for any 
mistake or slip up and it'll be 

988
01:00:30,720 --> 01:00:31,920
fine. 
You can carry on playing and 

989
01:00:31,920 --> 01:00:33,760
then it'll eventually fix it. 
You won't need any more. 

990
01:00:33,880 --> 01:00:37,160
That's fine. 
But in this case, like we've got

991
01:00:37,160 --> 01:00:40,720
some prime examples, forceful 
wins is in the cooldown manager 

992
01:00:40,800 --> 01:00:41,840
that doesn't do anything 
anymore. 

993
01:00:42,080 --> 01:00:43,800
It's just leftover from the War 
Within. 

994
01:00:44,440 --> 01:00:47,080
Crash Lightning doesn't work 
anymore if you take the Apex 

995
01:00:47,080 --> 01:00:49,680
talent because it changes the 
spell ID and no one's going to 

996
01:00:49,680 --> 01:00:52,600
change the spell ID to make it 
work with both hot hands. 

997
01:00:52,600 --> 01:00:55,080
If you don't have the talent, 
but you play Totemic when you 

998
01:00:55,080 --> 01:00:57,800
proc it from the totem doesn't 
track it because it doesn't work

999
01:00:57,800 --> 01:00:58,760
because it doesn't think you 
have it. 

1000
01:01:00,400 --> 01:01:03,360
There's a it's a lot of like 
little minor things that will 

1001
01:01:03,680 --> 01:01:06,880
get under the skin of people who
want to make it work. 

1002
01:01:06,880 --> 01:01:10,800
I'll like want to work with it 
because it's not working with 

1003
01:01:10,800 --> 01:01:13,480
us. 
And then because every add on 

1004
01:01:13,480 --> 01:01:17,880
has to draw from the cooldown 
manager, you're preventing 

1005
01:01:17,880 --> 01:01:20,760
anybody from being able to 
rectify it until they get around

1006
01:01:20,760 --> 01:01:25,320
to it. 
Yeah, like the the situation 

1007
01:01:25,320 --> 01:01:29,840
with the add-ons is that if if 
we were in a world where I could

1008
01:01:29,840 --> 01:01:33,360
100% trust the cooldown manager 
and I think that it had covered 

1009
01:01:33,360 --> 01:01:40,840
everything, you can reskin it to
some degree and get a extremely 

1010
01:01:41,120 --> 01:01:47,600
deep level of customization that
is not far removed from most non

1011
01:01:47,600 --> 01:01:53,720
computational live setups. 
But the cooldown manager is very

1012
01:01:53,720 --> 01:01:55,520
fragile. 
It can break itself. 

1013
01:01:57,000 --> 01:02:01,880
It's not wholly trustworthy and 
some parts of it just don't work

1014
01:02:01,880 --> 01:02:05,080
like in in enhancements case, no
one's got into add sound alerts 

1015
01:02:05,240 --> 01:02:07,760
because you so you can't do 
sound alerts if you want to play

1016
01:02:07,760 --> 01:02:09,920
enhancement right now. 
Obviously that will be fixed, 

1017
01:02:10,240 --> 01:02:14,200
but it's sort of a sign of how 
easily something can slip 

1018
01:02:14,200 --> 01:02:17,640
through and impact the call down
manager and then by extension 

1019
01:02:18,520 --> 01:02:23,680
your entire gameplay experience.
And because the call down 

1020
01:02:23,680 --> 01:02:28,560
manager is the be all end all 
source of calibrating your own 

1021
01:02:28,560 --> 01:02:32,360
add-ons to be incorrect. 
Not to say that there aren't 

1022
01:02:32,360 --> 01:02:34,920
other ways of doing it for 
certain things, like there are 

1023
01:02:34,920 --> 01:02:38,760
other UI methods of getting 
certain spells, but there are a 

1024
01:02:38,760 --> 01:02:41,480
few where it explicitly has to 
come from the call down manager.

1025
01:02:42,800 --> 01:02:47,240
So if that's not working, if it 
breaks the like link between 

1026
01:02:47,240 --> 01:02:51,000
whatever add on container yours 
is doing with the call down 

1027
01:02:51,000 --> 01:02:55,360
manager, it completely breaks 
and it shuts down entirely. 

1028
01:02:55,360 --> 01:02:57,360
And the call down manager breaks
your add on breaks and so on. 

1029
01:02:57,360 --> 01:02:59,600
Because there's like 1 hiccup in
it. 

1030
01:03:00,560 --> 01:03:02,640
These are all things that Adam 
developers will probably 

1031
01:03:02,640 --> 01:03:05,680
eventually get right, but it 
would be a whole lot easier if 

1032
01:03:05,680 --> 01:03:07,240
it wasn't. 
There wasn't this much friction 

1033
01:03:08,400 --> 01:03:13,160
on something that they're very 
obviously trying to indicate 

1034
01:03:13,200 --> 01:03:15,480
should be skinned if you want it
to look a different way. 

1035
01:03:15,480 --> 01:03:21,160
Because they said and in most 
cases have followed through with

1036
01:03:21,160 --> 01:03:23,880
letting you customize the entire
UI. 

1037
01:03:24,800 --> 01:03:28,880
Anything not related to combat 
in my opinion sounds a few 

1038
01:03:30,560 --> 01:03:32,280
things that are going to be 
fixed eventually. 

1039
01:03:32,520 --> 01:03:36,600
I think as they iterate is 
wholly customized. 

1040
01:03:36,600 --> 01:03:39,520
You can make it look exactly 
like LVUI or your own UI or 

1041
01:03:39,520 --> 01:03:43,320
anything you do everything with 
like a chat, your damage meter, 

1042
01:03:43,440 --> 01:03:47,880
almost their damage meter, your 
buffs, buff frame in the corner.

1043
01:03:47,880 --> 01:03:52,600
You can make them look a certain
way a new unit frames, but you 

1044
01:03:52,600 --> 01:03:56,800
can't do it effectively and 
consistently would be single 

1045
01:03:56,800 --> 01:04:00,960
most important part of the UI 
for anyone who's doing combat 

1046
01:04:00,960 --> 01:04:04,600
content, which is your 
information display. 

1047
01:04:07,000 --> 01:04:09,280
And I think that's come down to 
the restrictions they put in. 

1048
01:04:09,560 --> 01:04:14,720
Some of its philosophical, but 
some of it is just a case of I 

1049
01:04:14,720 --> 01:04:16,920
can't quite reconcile why 
they're being so stubborn on 

1050
01:04:16,920 --> 01:04:20,480
certain specific things and it 
and it hurts enhancement more so

1051
01:04:20,480 --> 01:04:28,480
than not all but some specs. 
And when you've got a design for

1052
01:04:28,480 --> 01:04:32,720
Midnight, that's I would say a 
distinct improvement for getting

1053
01:04:32,720 --> 01:04:37,480
people to give it a try. 
It's a crying shame that they're

1054
01:04:37,480 --> 01:04:40,480
almost definitely going to 
bounce into the UI and be 

1055
01:04:40,480 --> 01:04:43,680
playing in spite of it, not 
alongside it. 

1056
01:04:44,120 --> 01:04:46,840
And that's really sad because 
there's, there's definitely been

1057
01:04:46,840 --> 01:04:49,360
some really serious work that's 
gone into making the spec 

1058
01:04:50,280 --> 01:04:53,760
approachable but still feel like
the same and fun and good. 

1059
01:04:55,280 --> 01:04:58,880
And they're going to be 
indirectly impacted by the UI 

1060
01:04:58,880 --> 01:05:02,760
work making it less coherent and
less smooth. 

1061
01:05:04,560 --> 01:05:07,920
So yeah, that's my soapbox on 
the UII don't think it's as bad 

1062
01:05:07,920 --> 01:05:12,240
as everyone says it is, but I, 
I, I do distinctly feel for for 

1063
01:05:12,240 --> 01:05:15,120
our spec on this one. 
OK. 

1064
01:05:15,760 --> 01:05:19,400
No, I think that that is a 
great, great place to leave 

1065
01:05:19,400 --> 01:05:22,160
this. 
Thank you so much for taking the

1066
01:05:22,160 --> 01:05:24,720
time to talk with me here. 
This has been our amazing 

1067
01:05:24,720 --> 01:05:28,840
conversation when people want to
hear more about Enhancement 

1068
01:05:28,840 --> 01:05:31,160
Shaman. 
Where can we find your work? 

1069
01:05:32,720 --> 01:05:35,080
The best place to find mine is 
is I do the wild hedge 

1070
01:05:35,080 --> 01:05:37,760
enhancement guides and I do the 
ice veins and enhancement guide 

1071
01:05:37,760 --> 01:05:41,200
too. 
And I've also been doing video 

1072
01:05:41,400 --> 01:05:44,320
at which I intend to at least at
least do right up until midnight

1073
01:05:44,320 --> 01:05:45,720
launch. 
We'll see how it goes after 

1074
01:05:45,840 --> 01:05:49,280
because guide work becomes very 
time consuming, but that's on a 

1075
01:05:49,600 --> 01:05:51,000
word. 
Wow on YouTube. 

1076
01:05:51,000 --> 01:05:52,960
Now it's changed over. 
Thankfully, I've not got a bunch

1077
01:05:52,960 --> 01:05:55,280
of numbers anymore and that's 
the best place to find me. 

1078
01:05:55,520 --> 01:05:56,640
Or you can find me on Earth 
shrine. 

1079
01:05:56,640 --> 01:05:59,880
It's very easy to go in there 
and ping me and most of the time

1080
01:05:59,880 --> 01:06:01,640
I'll see it or I'll I'll respond
to it. 

1081
01:06:01,640 --> 01:06:05,040
Sometimes I forget or on Twitter
I'll I'll probably like 

1082
01:06:05,040 --> 01:06:09,080
commented something innocuous or
complaining on them. 

1083
01:06:09,080 --> 01:06:11,920
But it's it's not difficult to 
find me if you go searching. 

1084
01:06:13,040 --> 01:06:15,440
OK, I will try all of those 
spots. 

1085
01:06:15,760 --> 01:06:20,400
Thank you again so much. 
Word up and we will talk to all 

1086
01:06:20,400 --> 01:06:23,760
of you later for the prime 
episode, which will be out 

1087
01:06:23,840 --> 01:06:26,160
Thursday. 
Till next time guys, may all 

1088
01:06:26,160 --> 01:06:27,240
your hits be crit.