1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:03,280 Lex's window lights up like the beacons of Gondor. 2 00:00:06,760 --> 00:00:09,720 Yeah, Gondor calls for aid. Lex is Googling something. 3 00:00:12,600 --> 00:00:16,040 Victory for the Forsaken. For Lauderon. 4 00:00:16,560 --> 00:00:24,080 For the Karen Tour for Pandaria. For calendar to. 5 00:00:24,920 --> 00:00:32,040 The burning region for Gilnaeus, but has not done for the Lich 6 00:00:32,159 --> 00:00:40,800 King, for the Sindora, for the Alliance for the Horn, for 7 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:44,080 Azeroth. Hello and welcome back to 8 00:00:44,080 --> 00:00:48,600 another episode of For Azeroth. We are back from our trips 9 00:00:48,640 --> 00:00:53,040 abroad. We had Let's go all the way to 10 00:00:53,040 --> 00:01:00,320 sunny ish Boston and then we had Sean who jumped across the pond 11 00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:07,560 and went to London for LFG and then myself who took the garbage 12 00:01:07,560 --> 00:01:10,280 out. I just wanted to be included. 13 00:01:10,560 --> 00:01:14,800 Anyways, really glad to have us all back together. 14 00:01:15,720 --> 00:01:18,800 How is the World of Warcraft being treating you guys? 15 00:01:19,320 --> 00:01:22,320 Let's start with, let's start with you, Lex, because I know 16 00:01:22,320 --> 00:01:25,240 Sean does like going second. The World of Warcraft's been 17 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:28,320 treating me very well. I was obviously at the World of 18 00:01:28,320 --> 00:01:31,160 Warcraft 30th anniversary event, so that's been most of my World 19 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:33,080 of Warcraft experience, which is hanging out with World of 20 00:01:33,080 --> 00:01:34,800 Warcraft players and having a good time. 21 00:01:35,280 --> 00:01:38,600 I want to give a quick shout out to Queen of Murlocs, who won our 22 00:01:38,600 --> 00:01:42,960 Lore Trivia contest in our 30th anniversary, who's also a member 23 00:01:42,960 --> 00:01:45,200 of the Bonus Rule families. Congratulations. 24 00:01:46,480 --> 00:01:49,560 But I also, I finally did get back in to play some horrific 25 00:01:49,560 --> 00:01:51,480 Visions, which presumably we'll talk about later. 26 00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:54,600 So I won't get into my thoughts now, but I actually got on for a 27 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:57,960 while other than rating and we had fun and I popped around and 28 00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:01,720 it was a good time. OK, I'm glad to hear that. 29 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:06,400 And then, Sean, back from your travels abroad, how's the World 30 00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:10,080 of Warcraft been treating you? I think some congratulations are 31 00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:11,720 in order. Yeah, pretty good. 32 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:18,760 We killed Mythic Galliwicks on Sunday for a world ranking of 33 00:02:18,760 --> 00:02:24,160 480 and AUS rank because for some reason North American 34 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:27,280 guilds always give their NA rank, probably some inferior 35 00:02:27,280 --> 00:02:32,560 hearted complex, an NA rank of 168. 36 00:02:32,560 --> 00:02:36,320 I think it was pretty good. We were super happy with the 37 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:38,520 results. Was a great season for the team. 38 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:43,200 A lot of fun that fight, yeah, yeah, it was good stuff. 39 00:02:43,200 --> 00:02:45,440 Good, good stuff. The game has been quite good. 40 00:02:45,880 --> 00:02:49,880 Turbo boost hit so big power bump last week, which which 41 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:54,000 contributed to the early kill. But it's been a lot of fun so 42 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:57,760 far since I go back. Glad to hear that. 43 00:02:57,760 --> 00:03:00,000 I'm glad to hear that. And congratulations again. 44 00:03:01,320 --> 00:03:07,560 Now while you were busy jumping onto a plane, leaving on a jet 45 00:03:07,560 --> 00:03:11,000 plane, whatever the song is, we now know when you would be back 46 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:15,120 again. You listen to the episode and I 47 00:03:15,120 --> 00:03:20,640 think you had some thoughts about the turbo boost and I I 48 00:03:20,640 --> 00:03:23,320 just wanted to give you a chance to at least give your say to the 49 00:03:23,320 --> 00:03:27,560 audience. I think so. 50 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:29,800 My biggest great was a great episode. 51 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:34,640 Love the episode. A good podcast is when I am 52 00:03:34,640 --> 00:03:39,320 screaming at my radio as the the hosts are talking. 53 00:03:39,960 --> 00:03:43,120 The only thing I would like to say is specifically around the 54 00:03:43,120 --> 00:03:48,160 dinars is that and I I know I'm not alone in this feeling. 55 00:03:49,080 --> 00:03:55,840 I I I fully 100% believe that they should not have locked 56 00:03:56,400 --> 00:03:58,560 there's two. I have two issues. 1 I don't 57 00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:02,880 believe they should have locked the mythic track dinars at all. 58 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:05,960 All of the items should have been purchasable just like they 59 00:04:05,960 --> 00:04:09,280 were in Shadow Lands, just like they were in Dragonflight, right 60 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:14,120 from a vendor with upgrade tracks from 1:00 to 12:00 for 61 00:04:14,120 --> 00:04:17,360 everybody. Because you're telling what are 62 00:04:17,360 --> 00:04:18,079 we doing? Time? 63 00:04:18,079 --> 00:04:20,839 We're time gating. We're not time getting we're, 64 00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:25,600 we're, we're locking off gear from people in May of a patch 65 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:29,800 that launched in February for what arbitrary reason? 66 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:32,760 And, and the reason they gave and the part that made me scream 67 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:36,240 on my radio, the reason they gave and the, the thing that 68 00:04:36,240 --> 00:04:39,080 people are pointing at and saying, well, Blizzard said 69 00:04:39,080 --> 00:04:43,000 this, so that's it's OK that you have to kill the boss is the bad 70 00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:45,080 luck protection piece. Blizzard saying it's bad luck 71 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:47,760 protection. And, and, and I was one of them. 72 00:04:47,760 --> 00:04:51,840 I was had a discussion with some friends in my EU Guild where I 73 00:04:51,840 --> 00:04:53,760 said, look, I get it. It's bad luck protection. 74 00:04:53,760 --> 00:04:55,360 You, you didn't kill a mythic boss. 75 00:04:55,360 --> 00:04:58,280 You shouldn't get mythic loot, you know, it's meant to 76 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:01,640 supplement those people who are having a hard time getting those 77 00:05:01,640 --> 00:05:04,680 drops from those bosses that they've killed over and over 78 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:07,320 again, those rare pieces. And one of the people on my EU 79 00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:10,320 team pointed out to me how what kind of a bad luck protection is 80 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:12,240 it if you only have to kill it once? 81 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:13,920 How I killed the ones didn't get it. 82 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:16,320 Bad luck protection. Let me get that. 83 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:19,280 Let me get that loot now. That immediately makes it not 84 00:05:19,280 --> 00:05:24,560 bad luck protection because it's a rare drop if you're expecting 85 00:05:24,600 --> 00:05:28,120 if if the expectation is if I don't get my item, my rare drop 86 00:05:28,120 --> 00:05:32,800 item on my very first kill, then I warrant a bad luck protection 87 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:37,520 purchase of it, then I think that's what are we doing with 88 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:39,760 drop rates. Then everything should be 5050 89 00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:41,080 drop rate, right? If that's what we're. 90 00:05:41,080 --> 00:05:45,520 Saying so that's that's that's a bit better than 5050. 91 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:49,520 I got to ask you, how many times should it you be required to 92 00:05:49,520 --> 00:05:53,040 kill a boss for it to then be considered bad luck protection? 93 00:05:53,640 --> 00:05:56,840 Well, I think 0. So I, I, I, I, I will answer 94 00:05:56,840 --> 00:05:59,080 because your question is not that, but I think 0 it should 95 00:05:59,080 --> 00:06:01,760 just be available to everyone. But if you want it to be bad 96 00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:06,360 luck protection, I, I mean five maybe like it's, it's all an 97 00:06:06,360 --> 00:06:08,640 arbitrary number at that point, but I feel like you should have 98 00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:11,320 to have killed the boss enough times that you're feeling 99 00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:13,520 frustrated that you haven't gotten the drop you want. 100 00:06:13,520 --> 00:06:15,720 You know what I mean? If you kill it once, you're not 101 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:18,520 frustrated. Like my literally my team killed 102 00:06:18,520 --> 00:06:23,040 Mugsy the the dinars came out. We killed Mugsy that week. 20 103 00:06:23,040 --> 00:06:26,160 Raiders got House of Cards. 20 Raiders got House of Cards. 104 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:28,720 How is that bad luck protection? It's not. 105 00:06:29,160 --> 00:06:32,760 Well, I, I think it's more like maybe I'm, I'm, you know, steel 106 00:06:32,760 --> 00:06:35,160 manning Blizzard when I don't need to, but I, I think it's, 107 00:06:35,200 --> 00:06:37,960 it's maybe more that there just isn't really a word for what 108 00:06:37,960 --> 00:06:39,160 Blizzard is trying to do in bad luck. 109 00:06:39,160 --> 00:06:42,120 Protection is closest it, it feels like the IT what Blizzard 110 00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:45,320 was trying to express is that the goal of this is not to like 111 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:48,320 pre gear to help you push past bosses. 112 00:06:48,320 --> 00:06:51,680 It's to like kind of meet you where you're at and continue you 113 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:55,480 forward from there, right. Like it's it's not OK, continue. 114 00:06:56,320 --> 00:07:00,240 Unless you're a heroic Raider because you you can get heroic 115 00:07:00,240 --> 00:07:05,920 items simply by doing LFR. So Blizzard is saying mythic is 116 00:07:05,920 --> 00:07:08,120 on this tier that is so hard that you shouldn't get it unless 117 00:07:08,120 --> 00:07:11,240 you can kill it. But heroic the the quality of 118 00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:14,080 raid that is done by the vast majority of our players, we 119 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:15,960 don't think that actually requires any skill. 120 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:17,720 And you can have that with an LFR kill. 121 00:07:18,200 --> 00:07:23,480 That's tainted on your language. I would say if you look, if you 122 00:07:23,480 --> 00:07:28,960 look at the highest levels of competition, Mythic rating plus 123 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:36,720 12 now into resilient, no, no rewards of mythic plus, right? 124 00:07:36,960 --> 00:07:39,800 That's where they've set those restrictions where it's like OK 125 00:07:40,120 --> 00:07:43,280 at this point, once you're beyond all twelves and we know 126 00:07:43,280 --> 00:07:47,240 you're you're getting this yes, you can start purchasing these 127 00:07:47,240 --> 00:07:50,520 things once you have defeated these bosses. 128 00:07:50,520 --> 00:07:53,440 So we know that you're progressing through this right 129 00:07:53,560 --> 00:08:00,240 Then you can get these rewards. Now the issue I think, 130 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:07,720 especially with this raid is that the loot is so heavily back 131 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:09,600 loaded. Like there I had don't think 132 00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:17,800 I've seen as many sought after pieces so late into the raid as 133 00:08:17,800 --> 00:08:19,880 there has been with with this raid. 134 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:23,680 Typically there are some earlier bosses, some end wing bosses, 135 00:08:23,680 --> 00:08:25,720 which we didn't have really wings in this that have 136 00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:27,680 something that's like, yeah, that's your best in slot and 137 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:31,560 such that people can typically target before we get to the end 138 00:08:31,560 --> 00:08:33,919 boss. This this really felt more back 139 00:08:33,919 --> 00:08:36,760 loaded than than normal. Not saying that there's never 140 00:08:36,760 --> 00:08:41,159 been the most wanted piece on those last or penultimate plus, 141 00:08:41,360 --> 00:08:44,880 but more so than most. So it, it kind of compounded the 142 00:08:44,880 --> 00:08:47,240 issue. The other part with the deniers 143 00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:52,600 that I will point out is that in every season that has come out, 144 00:08:52,600 --> 00:08:57,920 it's being like the final season where the leveling up has 145 00:08:57,920 --> 00:09:00,760 automatically mean that, yeah, it's not going to be an issue in 146 00:09:00,760 --> 00:09:04,360 the next year. You're going to hit level 80 and 147 00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:06,680 it's not and you're going to replace it anyways. 148 00:09:06,680 --> 00:09:10,400 So it hasn't been as disruptive. And that's why it's part of what 149 00:09:10,400 --> 00:09:14,640 I was saying in in that previous episode is that they put more 150 00:09:14,800 --> 00:09:19,640 hoops, more brakes on this system because it is prone to be 151 00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:22,040 more disruptive. And I believe we had the 152 00:09:22,040 --> 00:09:25,040 conversation in the Discord. Make sure you are during that 153 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:29,760 conversation, folks bit load bit dot LY slash fast Discord where 154 00:09:30,320 --> 00:09:31,760 where the conversation continued. 155 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:34,680 And one thing I want to point out, somebody had said in there 156 00:09:35,880 --> 00:09:39,400 is that, hey, Blizzard, why don't you just nerf these 157 00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:43,600 trinkets if they're disruptive in the next patch and such? 158 00:09:43,840 --> 00:09:47,600 Which they do anyway. Which which they do anyway and I 159 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:51,040 don't want that to be the go to solution that doesn't. 160 00:09:51,200 --> 00:09:55,080 That doesn't feel good. I agree and and I'm glad you 161 00:09:55,080 --> 00:09:57,960 brought up the the concern of the power creep into the next 162 00:09:57,960 --> 00:09:59,440 year because Blizzard brought that concern up. 163 00:09:59,720 --> 00:10:02,400 That is a valid concern. And then they gave us six extra 164 00:10:02,400 --> 00:10:03,720 item levels in every piece of gear we have. 165 00:10:05,520 --> 00:10:08,400 Yeah. So are they concerned about it 166 00:10:08,400 --> 00:10:09,960 or or are they not concerned about the power cream? 167 00:10:10,120 --> 00:10:12,000 Did Ian give that quote? Because if Ian gave that quote, 168 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:14,520 then we know the answer is there's no actual that's just 169 00:10:14,520 --> 00:10:15,520 lip service. Because that's Ian. 170 00:10:15,520 --> 00:10:18,760 Quotes are just lip service. So I guess. 171 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:21,640 That's we'll find out anyway. I, I, I, I think the dealer 172 00:10:21,640 --> 00:10:24,200 should be on loud and, and I also think it's, it's kind of 173 00:10:24,280 --> 00:10:28,960 shitty that you, there's no way to go from if I buy a hero track 174 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:30,560 item. And I actually think the plus 175 00:10:30,560 --> 00:10:33,080 twelves is fine because those feel like bad luck protection 176 00:10:33,400 --> 00:10:36,120 because you have had the chance for those items to drop for the 177 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:40,240 last 12 weeks because they could have dropped myth track in your 178 00:10:40,240 --> 00:10:42,280 vault. So that actually is bad luck 179 00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:46,040 protection. I I feel that that's a double 180 00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:50,560 standard because like you just beat the final boss in, in 181 00:10:50,560 --> 00:10:53,560 Mythic this week. Yeah, there are people who are 182 00:10:53,560 --> 00:10:57,920 just getting 12. There are people who are just 183 00:10:57,920 --> 00:11:00,480 getting twelves this week. True, right. 184 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:04,240 Who may have just hit the resilient the resilient this 185 00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:07,160 week and that. To get those items in their 186 00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:10,400 vaults they only needed 10s. True, if you get If you run a 187 00:11:10,400 --> 00:11:12,800 10, you could potentially get any of those trinkets in your 188 00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:15,120 vault. Yes, but. 189 00:11:15,400 --> 00:11:16,840 But but I see, I do see your point. 190 00:11:18,320 --> 00:11:19,600 Yeah. Anyway, dinars are out. 191 00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:23,360 The the only other complaint I have with the DNR system is if I 192 00:11:23,360 --> 00:11:27,520 buy a heroic track dinar item and then I eventually kill that 193 00:11:27,520 --> 00:11:30,960 boss on mythic, there's no way for me to upgrade that. 194 00:11:31,080 --> 00:11:33,760 I'm stuck with the heroic track version of that dinar item 195 00:11:34,280 --> 00:11:37,080 unless I spend another of my dinar, which are limited to 196 00:11:37,080 --> 00:11:39,800 three on the mythic track version of that item. 197 00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:43,200 It just feels really disjointed and really poorly implemented. 198 00:11:43,200 --> 00:11:45,720 And I know players have been asking for a way to get 199 00:11:45,720 --> 00:11:49,920 deterministic loot from raid or from mythic plus forever. 200 00:11:51,080 --> 00:11:53,440 And Blizzard, I feel like this was their attempt at giving us 201 00:11:53,440 --> 00:11:55,400 it. But they definitely monkey pot 202 00:11:55,400 --> 00:11:59,560 us and made it so that it was. Hey, you said you want it, but 203 00:11:59,560 --> 00:12:01,760 we're going to bastardize it so that it's not actually any good 204 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:05,280 for you. Have fun dinars, don't get too 205 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:07,840 strong. Here's 6 item level anyway. 206 00:12:09,880 --> 00:12:11,440 Sorry with the item level though. 207 00:12:11,840 --> 00:12:15,680 Two weeks ago it'd been great. With the with the item level 208 00:12:15,680 --> 00:12:22,360 though, do you feel that that is a better way of helping people? 209 00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:26,560 It's like whatever loot you have here, you can add 36 item level 210 00:12:26,800 --> 00:12:29,320 levels to it. That should give you a push 211 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:32,960 through where it is a deterministic way of pushing 212 00:12:33,080 --> 00:12:36,040 your power up in a very deterministic way. 213 00:12:36,360 --> 00:12:39,120 But also you have to have that loot first. 214 00:12:39,200 --> 00:12:43,800 So you you're, you're kind of switching between the two, 215 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:45,600 doesn't have the cap sort of thing. 216 00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:50,080 If you had to pick between one of these systems to come back, 217 00:12:50,480 --> 00:12:52,000 which one would you have come back? 218 00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:55,600 And I'm going to throw this to you first, Lex, because I'd love 219 00:12:55,600 --> 00:12:58,200 to hear your opinion. It's like, hey, do you prefer 220 00:12:58,240 --> 00:13:01,320 being able to upgrade further or would you prefer being able to 221 00:13:01,320 --> 00:13:06,280 grab these dinars? Oh, I am going to make a spicy 222 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:07,920 take. I think I probably prefer the 223 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:11,600 dinars. I think that having the ability 224 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:15,760 to select loot is more beneficial and also like 225 00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:22,320 honestly kind of feels better to me that, you know, versus like 226 00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:24,520 if if I have something and I don't really like it, but I'm 227 00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:26,640 like, oh, sick, now I can make my kind of crappy drink it a 228 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:31,080 little bit better. That just isn't particularly it 229 00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:34,000 doesn't feel as particularly joyful to increase the stuff 230 00:13:34,000 --> 00:13:35,880 that I already have. But if I got a fun present, 231 00:13:35,880 --> 00:13:37,800 that's cool, right? We like a fun present. 232 00:13:38,240 --> 00:13:40,400 So I, I personally am a Dean artist, girly. 233 00:13:41,560 --> 00:13:43,520 I, I, I agree that the system is messy. 234 00:13:43,680 --> 00:13:46,200 I think that the DNR, frankly, I don't feel like I've ever had a 235 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:48,160 system where I'm like, this isn't a little bit messy. 236 00:13:49,360 --> 00:13:52,680 And I think it's strange that it's coming in season 2. 237 00:13:53,240 --> 00:13:55,760 I agree with that first final seasons. 238 00:13:57,160 --> 00:14:00,600 I think that it I, I, it should either be consistent or like the 239 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:03,760 I kind of agree that it sort of feels like they're flailing. 240 00:14:04,040 --> 00:14:06,760 So I don't think it's not like I'm like, I'm pro this method of 241 00:14:06,760 --> 00:14:10,320 DNR giving, but I do think that like it's fun to get to pick up 242 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:11,760 my own mood. I feel like I'm going shopping. 243 00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:19,480 OK, John, on your end. I'm, I'm, I agree with Lex I I 244 00:14:19,480 --> 00:14:22,640 obviously hate this version of the DNR, but just giving 245 00:14:22,640 --> 00:14:27,040 everybody six extra item levels on every piece of gear is going 246 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:31,800 to be much more damaging to the item levels next year than the 247 00:14:31,800 --> 00:14:34,920 three single dinar pieces ever possibly could have been. 248 00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:39,200 We're talking the difference between 2 trinkets and a weapon 249 00:14:39,600 --> 00:14:41,960 going into the next year versus everything you have. 250 00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:44,800 So now they either have to artificially inflate the level 251 00:14:45,720 --> 00:14:51,680 of next year's gear by 6 extra item levels or everybody will be 252 00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:55,400 like you already you if you are mythic geared character, which 253 00:14:55,400 --> 00:14:58,360 you can get done just by doing mythic plus at the plus 10 level 254 00:14:58,640 --> 00:15:01,320 and through crafting if you were at that level at the end of this 255 00:15:01,320 --> 00:15:03,000 season. At the end of a season you 256 00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:06,880 typically don't get any upgrades until you're in heroic raid and 257 00:15:06,880 --> 00:15:09,720 then usually the first couple of bosses of her grade you start 258 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:12,880 swapping those pieces out. If you are going if, if, if, if 259 00:15:12,880 --> 00:15:15,840 everything stays as normal going into next season, you will be 260 00:15:15,840 --> 00:15:19,120 pulling the final bosses in the heroic raid before you see an 261 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:21,120 upgrade. And that's going to feel 262 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:23,480 terrible for people. And the other option is we 263 00:15:23,480 --> 00:15:28,280 artificially inflate our item levels and then everybody says, 264 00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:30,440 oh, we're blowing up our reverse stats. 265 00:15:31,760 --> 00:15:37,800 If you guys think back to Dragonflight, both season 3 and 266 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:41,680 season 4 had a quite a large jump in the item levels. 267 00:15:41,680 --> 00:15:44,240 Actually might have been season 2 and season 3 had a quite a 268 00:15:44,240 --> 00:15:49,520 large jump in the item levels where we were spending a a bunch 269 00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:52,160 of time in the marriage still being like, OK, I guess I got to 270 00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:56,880 do this because the the huge gap between what we got last season, 271 00:15:56,880 --> 00:16:01,280 this season. Did you feel that that was kind 272 00:16:01,280 --> 00:16:03,160 of punitive? Did you feel that it kind of 273 00:16:03,640 --> 00:16:07,640 removed all the effort that you might have put in as some people 274 00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:09,240 have said? What do you feel like having 275 00:16:09,240 --> 00:16:15,600 that fresh restart made made the season more interesting to you? 276 00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:18,040 Like what side did you fall on really this time? 277 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:19,160 I'll throw it to you first, Sean. 278 00:16:19,600 --> 00:16:24,120 I hate that at the start of an expansion I expect that bag of 279 00:16:24,120 --> 00:16:26,360 spilling trope where I lose my power. 280 00:16:26,360 --> 00:16:28,480 I come in and I'm building up from the beginning. 281 00:16:28,800 --> 00:16:32,080 But in ex mid expand like mid expansion patch to patch. 282 00:16:32,840 --> 00:16:35,400 As a mythic Raider I should never be. 283 00:16:35,520 --> 00:16:38,120 I should never feel like I have to run normal for gear outside 284 00:16:38,120 --> 00:16:40,320 of my tear pieces or extremely right trinkets. 285 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:44,120 I should never be in a situation where I'm leaving mythic geared 286 00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:46,960 from the previous season and I need to get bracers out of a 287 00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:50,320 normal raid. That should be like if you're 288 00:16:50,320 --> 00:16:52,560 mythic rating. Normal should be just for 289 00:16:53,240 --> 00:16:54,680 extremely rare trinkets and items. 290 00:16:55,400 --> 00:16:58,520 Heroic is when you start getting those upgrades saying just drop 291 00:16:58,520 --> 00:17:00,240 it down if you're a heroic Raider. 292 00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:02,800 So you shouldn't need LFR for upgrade. 293 00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:04,560 You should be able to get them out of normal type thing. 294 00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:07,560 It's otherwise what are we doing? 295 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:10,960 It's we're an ARPG. If if every season we reset to 296 00:17:10,960 --> 00:17:13,880 0, we're an ARPG at that point. Like what are we? 297 00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:16,720 What are we doing? OK, Lex. 298 00:17:17,079 --> 00:17:19,599 I think it's kind of fun to be able to go and all of a sudden 299 00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:22,000 getting upgrades from world Crest again and you can like 300 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:24,599 kind of I, I guess I, I think I need to admit that I'm an open 301 00:17:24,599 --> 00:17:27,480 world girly and that really what I like to do is open world play. 302 00:17:27,480 --> 00:17:30,520 And so I like it when the game like rewards that and it doesn't 303 00:17:30,520 --> 00:17:32,920 feel like, oh, I would have fun. Like I'm looking at all these 304 00:17:32,920 --> 00:17:35,400 cool world crests on my map, but I can't justify spending the 305 00:17:35,400 --> 00:17:39,040 time to do them. So honestly, I kind of like that 306 00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:41,880 I kind of had a lot of fun in a mirror still like running around 307 00:17:41,880 --> 00:17:44,760 and like actually feeling like I needed to do things and like I 308 00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:48,480 could not, and not in like a grindy way, but in a like, Oh, I 309 00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:49,640 guess I get to play the game again. 310 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:52,400 Like, I guess the point is to go around and do things and like 311 00:17:52,400 --> 00:17:54,080 have fun and see all the, the gear. 312 00:17:54,320 --> 00:17:57,880 And I, I totally hear your argument and I, I guess I think 313 00:17:57,880 --> 00:18:01,720 that, like it. I, I, I think that you probably 314 00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:04,240 win that globally. I think that most people agree 315 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:07,080 and aren't excited when they're doing, you know, then they see 316 00:18:07,080 --> 00:18:10,640 world quests that have boosts. But I I thought it was fun. 317 00:18:12,760 --> 00:18:15,480 You know if you just stop raiding Lex, you get everything 318 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:18,440 you say you want. Just don't raid and you'll 319 00:18:18,480 --> 00:18:20,200 always get upgrades from world quests time. 320 00:18:21,480 --> 00:18:23,640 With my friends, I love my raid team. 321 00:18:25,200 --> 00:18:29,040 Yeah, we'll all just. Immediately ditch them. 322 00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:34,880 I, I, I don't think the, the solution is removing content off 323 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:37,040 the plate. It's making all the content 324 00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:39,040 valid for the people who want it to be valid. 325 00:18:39,040 --> 00:18:41,560 And I think that's what Blizzard's trying with like, you 326 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:44,440 know, the delves and everything to like make, to make it more 327 00:18:44,440 --> 00:18:47,400 open. Something that we didn't have 328 00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:50,640 much time to talk about actually. 329 00:18:50,640 --> 00:19:00,720 In fact, it came out as packs. Is is that in Legion Remix 330 00:19:00,720 --> 00:19:06,600 they're doing a Shattered World variant where the open world 331 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:13,000 content is going to be harder? Is that something that interests 332 00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:14,000 you? Lex says. 333 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:17,120 Like, hey, I want my open world content to be more rewarding. 334 00:19:17,120 --> 00:19:21,680 If they increase the difficulty of that open world content in in 335 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:24,960 respect to that and make it more rewarding, is that something 336 00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:26,880 that you're you're interested? In Oh, absolutely. 337 00:19:26,880 --> 00:19:29,640 I think that I I really, and I I've said this with delves and I 338 00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:32,440 will say this probably until the day I die, I want Blizzard to 339 00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:34,800 stop being scared of making open world content hard. 340 00:19:35,040 --> 00:19:39,280 I would like challenging open world content that that also has 341 00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:43,720 power like that gives me things in progress with my increasing 342 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:46,120 difficulties. I think that would be really 343 00:19:46,120 --> 00:19:48,400 fun. And I think that there's this. 344 00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:52,440 I think the the problem is, and again, I've said this many times 345 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:56,640 with Delves that the World of Warcraft community is so used to 346 00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:59,880 open world content being the silly thing that you face roll 347 00:19:59,880 --> 00:20:01,840 for the first week and then never do again. 348 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:05,440 That when they are faced with challenging open world content 349 00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:08,280 and they don't just get handed whatever the open world content 350 00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:12,520 is supposed to give them, it feels like an affront, right? 351 00:20:12,520 --> 00:20:14,800 Like it feels they're like, no, this was the thing that was 352 00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:15,960 supposed to be free, easy and nothing. 353 00:20:16,760 --> 00:20:18,160 And then they yell at the Blizzard devs. 354 00:20:18,440 --> 00:20:23,240 And I will say, I do kind of feel like what I, one of the 355 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:26,000 reasons that things feel like messy and things are being 356 00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:28,760 scattered is that the thing that I've said since the beginning, 357 00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:32,520 which is that I, I'm a little worried that Blizzard is overly 358 00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:35,200 responsive to the players. And because they are overly 359 00:20:35,200 --> 00:20:37,760 responsive, like I, I think I need Blizzard to go back to 360 00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:41,080 feeling comfortable putting their foot down and making a 361 00:20:41,160 --> 00:20:44,200 firm decision, right? Saying like, Yep, this is we've 362 00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:46,200 run the we've crunched the numbers. 363 00:20:46,200 --> 00:20:48,800 This is a good way to do it versus players are saying they 364 00:20:48,800 --> 00:20:49,920 want this. So we're going to figure out how 365 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:53,760 to make that happen. And anyway, this that was a long 366 00:20:53,760 --> 00:20:57,480 ramble on the side to I think that what we've seen with things 367 00:20:57,480 --> 00:21:00,120 like delves is players expected it to be very easy. 368 00:21:00,120 --> 00:21:02,640 Nothing who cares? They yelled at Blizzard when it 369 00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:06,760 wasn't a faithful and Blizzard folded and I I, I I guess I 370 00:21:06,760 --> 00:21:08,920 don't really trust Blizzard not to fold with open world content. 371 00:21:08,920 --> 00:21:12,720 I think that and I I'd like them to prove me wrong, but I think 372 00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:15,840 the Blizzard historically has proven that if the players yell 373 00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:18,440 at them when open world content doesn't feel easy then they will 374 00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:21,600 make it easier. OK. 375 00:21:22,480 --> 00:21:26,720 Sean, on your end, is challenging open world content 376 00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:30,080 something that you would like to see more of or is it something 377 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:32,760 that you feel could not really be done right? 378 00:21:34,520 --> 00:21:36,040 I don't think it could ever be done right. 379 00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:38,280 I mean they they gave us challenging open world content 380 00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:41,520 for zero like caverns. And as soon as all of the 381 00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:44,520 Raiders stopped doing the rares because there was no power in 382 00:21:44,520 --> 00:21:47,680 them anymore, all of the casual people who said they wanted 383 00:21:47,880 --> 00:21:50,760 content in the open world to be fun cried that the rares were 384 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:54,720 too hard to kill alone. And the same thing happened I 385 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:56,880 think on that island. This not the which? 386 00:21:56,880 --> 00:22:00,240 What was the? The island and dragon flight up 387 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:01,600 north? Forbidden Reach. 388 00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:03,120 Forbidden Reach. Same thing happened there with 389 00:22:03,120 --> 00:22:05,360 the rares. Why are these rares so high? 390 00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:08,680 I'm trying to kill us by myself. And obviously Lex was one of 391 00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:10,280 those people. She wants them to be hard, but 392 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:13,080 nobody else does. Lex. 393 00:22:14,160 --> 00:22:16,600 And the balance of rares is particularly complicated because 394 00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:20,320 it needs to somehow be balance like I, I, I think that, and I 395 00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:22,120 guess this kind of gets into the definition of open world 396 00:22:22,120 --> 00:22:24,680 content, right? Like how do you make it so that 397 00:22:24,680 --> 00:22:28,520 something like delves are are defined are called open world 398 00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:29,920 content, but they're kind of not? 399 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:34,640 I would not consider that. I would find, yeah, open world 400 00:22:34,640 --> 00:22:38,920 content is open world where anybody can come up and join it 401 00:22:38,920 --> 00:22:40,160 delves. I would consider instance 402 00:22:40,160 --> 00:22:41,040 content. OK, I'm trying. 403 00:22:41,040 --> 00:22:42,040 I swear to God somebody said that. 404 00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:43,680 Yeah. Sorry. 405 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:45,040 What do you say I talked over you like in? 406 00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:47,280 I just said I definitely agree delves should be harder, but I 407 00:22:47,280 --> 00:22:50,160 think open world content should be a face rule. 408 00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:52,000 I mean, I'm yeah, I don't really care though. 409 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:53,280 I'm not going to spend that much time there. 410 00:22:53,280 --> 00:22:54,760 I think whatever they do with it is. 411 00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:57,560 Fine, I think for open world content, I I don't, I'm not 412 00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:00,440 backing down on what I was saying, but I do think that if 413 00:23:00,600 --> 00:23:02,480 open world contents gonna be harder, they have to somehow 414 00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:05,800 find a way to like phase it or something so that you can feel 415 00:23:05,800 --> 00:23:08,480 the difference between 20 people hitting it in one right. 416 00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:12,280 Like I, I think that the issue with that, like, yeah, you know, 417 00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:15,760 you have to make it so that it's not going to fall over if the 418 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:18,720 entire server's playing, but also it's not going to, you 419 00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:23,280 know, like you don't have to queue to, to kill it basically, 420 00:23:23,360 --> 00:23:27,480 yeah. I think that based on what you 421 00:23:27,480 --> 00:23:32,320 guys are saying, I think that open world content needs to be 422 00:23:32,320 --> 00:23:36,520 less homogeneous. I think that when you have the 423 00:23:36,520 --> 00:23:40,240 general area where it's pretty accessible to everybody, kind of 424 00:23:40,240 --> 00:23:43,640 what we have now, you know, the quote UN quote face role, as you 425 00:23:43,640 --> 00:23:46,680 were saying, but just generally like people can solo this stuff 426 00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:50,360 at a relatively entry level item level so they don't feel stuck. 427 00:23:50,600 --> 00:23:54,280 But then you have certain pockets of the world, certain 428 00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:57,200 like corners of the world that have the elites that have the 429 00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:00,840 like more dangerous place, places to go. 430 00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:06,680 And then that can be where the the more challenging open world 431 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:10,040 content is. And if you do things like that 432 00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:15,520 and you like, I'm not sure if you guys were playing back in 433 00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:18,320 Mr. Pandaria, but obviously we've had Mr. Pandaria remix, 434 00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:21,800 but they had the timeless aisle and the time of aisle on the 435 00:24:21,800 --> 00:24:24,720 ground level. Things were pretty, pretty weak, 436 00:24:24,720 --> 00:24:28,200 pretty base level. And as you went up that path 437 00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:32,680 towards Ordon, the enemies got a little bit more complicated, a 438 00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:36,400 little bit harder hitting. Obviously people could gear 439 00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:39,200 through it and such, and I think the same would be true with any 440 00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:44,440 open world content. But the higher reaches, the 441 00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:48,480 nooks and crannies that have those more difficult enemies, in 442 00:24:48,480 --> 00:24:51,320 my mind just give a little bit better reward. 443 00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:56,560 They dropped rarer skins or higher qualities skins more 444 00:24:56,560 --> 00:24:59,320 frequently and such, so that people have a reason to keep 445 00:24:59,320 --> 00:25:01,640 going back there for professions or whatever. 446 00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:06,520 But you don't necessarily feel you're forced to go there 447 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:09,400 because you could still get this stuff elsewhere if that's where 448 00:25:09,400 --> 00:25:13,120 you feel like it meets your challenge sort of thing, if that 449 00:25:13,120 --> 00:25:15,760 makes sense. I have an argument to make and 450 00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:17,880 it's very half baked. I'm literally coming up with it 451 00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:19,560 as you speak, which is why I'm about to interrupt you with 452 00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:21,200 something completely different from what you were saying. 453 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:23,840 So it's probably going to be a bad idea, but I'm going to. 454 00:25:23,840 --> 00:25:25,080 I'm going to make this argument anyway. 455 00:25:26,000 --> 00:25:28,720 I think the open world content that Blizzard has made that has 456 00:25:28,720 --> 00:25:31,120 consistently been the most successful and people actually 457 00:25:31,120 --> 00:25:33,800 enjoy to the highest degree, or maybe it's just me and I'm a 458 00:25:33,800 --> 00:25:37,000 dork, are like the fun little games, right? 459 00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:40,680 The Stew, the theater troupe, that sort of thing where the 460 00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:43,680 point is like coordination with other people and like playing a 461 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:45,880 fun, silly little game. But also you kind of have to be 462 00:25:45,880 --> 00:25:49,000 on it, right? And I think that that's a space 463 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:53,920 where Blizzard could get creative and find ways to make 464 00:25:54,360 --> 00:25:57,880 the fun, cute little games a little bit more exciting and a 465 00:25:57,880 --> 00:26:00,240 little bit more interesting and a little bit a little bit 466 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:02,160 harder. Not necessarily in the like your 467 00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:05,240 gear needs to be at higher level to do this, but more in the like 468 00:26:05,360 --> 00:26:06,960 the mechanics are more complicated. 469 00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:09,160 It's more difficult to like coordinate with the other people 470 00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:11,760 and then figure out like, again, not you'd have to be thoughtful 471 00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:13,760 about how many people would be doing it at certain times. 472 00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:21,080 But I think that's actually a space where the team could dive 473 00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:26,680 into a more creative, more unique, more challenging sort of 474 00:26:26,680 --> 00:26:30,880 open world content that would actually draw people in. 475 00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:33,480 Am I lying? Do you guys not enjoy the fungal 476 00:26:33,480 --> 00:26:35,400 the fungal open world games that they give us? 477 00:26:36,120 --> 00:26:39,520 I love specifically the 2 examples you gave and I'm going 478 00:26:39,520 --> 00:26:42,200 to throw a nightfall in there. I think those are amazing open 479 00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:43,720 world content. If they made them harder I would 480 00:26:43,720 --> 00:26:47,880 never do them again. I have no desire to go to soup 481 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,680 and have to coordinate with the 3500 other people doing soup on 482 00:26:51,680 --> 00:26:53,400 who's going to put the fish head in the bowl. 483 00:26:53,720 --> 00:26:56,720 I like it because it's easy and I can mindlessly go through it. 484 00:26:57,400 --> 00:27:01,000 I actually and this this might come as a surprise to Manny, but 485 00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:03,800 in previous iterations, so the Super boom event, I was 486 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,560 notorious for AFK ING. I would just follow that tree 487 00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:08,360 around while everybody else did the work and I would collect the 488 00:27:08,360 --> 00:27:10,760 rewards and I loved it. The nightfall event, you can't 489 00:27:10,760 --> 00:27:12,960 do that, you have to. Your bar only fills based on 490 00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:17,600 your work alone and I enjoy the nightfall event exponentially 491 00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:20,200 more than I enjoyed the Super bloom event because they make me 492 00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:22,840 play and engage with it. But if they made it harder, I 493 00:27:22,840 --> 00:27:25,760 would never do it again because I'm not going there for 494 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:29,160 challenge, I'm going there to get some fun trans trans mog and 495 00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:31,040 just sort of vibe outside. That's fair, that's fair. 496 00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:33,320 That the point of it is that it is a silly I, I, I wonder if 497 00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:35,840 they would like again, they, they would have to do like some 498 00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:40,040 weird like hueing content thing or like instanced situation. 499 00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:41,240 Like maybe they could I, I don't know. 500 00:27:41,400 --> 00:27:43,360 I don't know, maybe I'm the only one who thinks it'll be fun for 501 00:27:43,360 --> 00:27:46,360 this to be like a fun way to, to make an open world challenge. 502 00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:49,320 I am nostalgic for soup now though, so thanks Soup was so. 503 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:52,760 Annoying. Yeah, soup was great. 504 00:27:53,040 --> 00:27:57,000 I, I enjoyed soup. I just felt that Dragonflight 505 00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:00,160 did way too many of those events on a timer. 506 00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:05,280 And that was the thing that I disliked about soup was the oh 507 00:28:05,280 --> 00:28:08,040 shoot, I missed it. I've got to wait three hours or 508 00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:13,520 did I get my weekly for like one of those trials of elements or 509 00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:16,800 water or anything like that? Those the timers were the part 510 00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:19,680 that I disliked about those. And so in my mind, I go to 511 00:28:19,680 --> 00:28:22,520 Mechagon. If you guys remember Mechagon, 512 00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:26,440 it had a bunch of different events that you could trigger. 513 00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:30,320 Somebody would get there 1st and be like, oh, I'm going to start 514 00:28:30,320 --> 00:28:34,000 like the entire slime protection thing, and then everybody would 515 00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:36,600 just swarm in and you'd have an event like that. 516 00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:40,640 The other reason I point to Mechagon is because Mechagon 517 00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:45,040 also included hard modes. If you did certain things, a 518 00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:48,160 harder version would start a start up that needed a little 519 00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:51,320 bit more complication. And if you did it without 520 00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:53,960 anybody really knowing what to do, yeah, you could fail that 521 00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:59,320 harder version, but you would still get the you still get the 522 00:28:59,320 --> 00:29:01,880 benefits of the base level. You just wouldn't get the better 523 00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:04,600 benefits. I think maybe that's the happy 524 00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:08,280 medium that I would want where it's like, let's have the start 525 00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:10,920 because people are here and they've they've triggered it. 526 00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:15,480 Let's have this bonus objective available for for people to do 527 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:20,880 if you if you trigger it and the event will complete should be 528 00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:23,800 relatively easy. But if you if you do this 529 00:29:23,800 --> 00:29:26,600 trigger like defeat the treasure goblin before it goes through 530 00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:29,840 the portal or or something like that, you get these extra 531 00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:32,840 bonuses. And I think that's a big thing, 532 00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:36,560 especially if they announce it probably like it used to be that 533 00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:39,400 TomTom and all of those things would be like this is spawning 534 00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:46,000 and everybody would swarm in with the I guess the clock 535 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:51,000 hitting 11 here on add-ons. Blizzard needs to make sure that 536 00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:56,720 they are like zone wide notifications of like this is 537 00:29:56,720 --> 00:30:00,160 spawning everybody get here. And I I think those those are 538 00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:02,280 fun. You can either call up your 539 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:05,080 friends or your guildies or random people in the area. 540 00:30:05,080 --> 00:30:08,240 We'll just swarm into that. And that I think if that's the 541 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:11,560 spontaneous world content that I enjoy, if you can scale to be a 542 00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:14,400 little bit more difficult, I would enjoy that even more. 543 00:30:14,720 --> 00:30:18,280 Yeah, I think what makes the the, the, the strength that open 544 00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:22,040 world content has that I think other contents lack is that just 545 00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:26,480 like really joyous short term community, right? 546 00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:28,640 That thing where we all come together and none of us know 547 00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:31,000 each other. We're not like actually we don't 548 00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:33,720 we don't have to communicate. So it's like nobody is actually 549 00:30:33,720 --> 00:30:36,680 getting annoyed at each other, but it just feels like you're 550 00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:39,080 part of a party, right? Like it feels you're in like 551 00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:41,160 you're in this big energetic, happy group. 552 00:30:41,760 --> 00:30:45,280 And I think that that is something that if Blizzard wants 553 00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:48,400 to make open world content more of a thing, that's something 554 00:30:48,400 --> 00:30:50,440 that they need to be prioritizing is that it's the 555 00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:53,840 sort of thing that joyously people together and you get to 556 00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:58,000 have this fun party, whether it's to, you know, wreck a rare 557 00:30:58,120 --> 00:31:01,840 or do an event or whatever. And, and I think I think I agree 558 00:31:01,840 --> 00:31:04,040 with you, Sean, and also encourage like make it so that 559 00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:06,720 people have to do it right, that you can't just join a group and 560 00:31:06,720 --> 00:31:09,960 then like let the three people who are actually invested handle 561 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:10,160 it. I. 562 00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:15,600 Don't remember how we got here but this was a great side side 563 00:31:15,760 --> 00:31:18,000 side tangent. This was fantastic. 564 00:31:18,240 --> 00:31:19,960 I'm going to go log in and do a soup after this. 565 00:31:21,880 --> 00:31:25,880 Well, one thing that people are logging in to do, one thing that 566 00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:31,760 I feel is a bit of content that scales really well right now is 567 00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:36,480 of course heroic Visions. I am really glad that they're 568 00:31:36,480 --> 00:31:45,040 back, but it feels like Blizzard has sort of fumble the launch of 569 00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:53,880 her of horrific Visions. And I I've said in the past, 570 00:31:54,120 --> 00:31:59,440 long before Sean, you joined the show, before Lex joined the 571 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:01,680 show. So for a long time, listeners, 572 00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:06,560 this is going to sound like a broken record for new listeners. 573 00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:13,720 Strap in. I generally dislike when 574 00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:18,080 Blizzard feels that it needs to socially police their player 575 00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:23,320 base. It is annoying, especially when 576 00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:29,560 it is heavy-handed. Players want to engage with your 577 00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:32,840 game. Let them engage at the pace and 578 00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:35,960 in the manner that they want to engage in your game. 579 00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:44,080 If you need to somehow throttle it, you must do it in the most 580 00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:50,120 nuanced way. It has to be that their 581 00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:55,160 progress, their literal progress through the system is that if 582 00:32:55,160 --> 00:33:00,920 they get to the rewards when you need it, rather than you put in 583 00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:04,480 an artificial wall that says no, friend, you don't get this until 584 00:33:04,480 --> 00:33:07,680 we say you get this. That is the worst thing to 585 00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:09,600 happen. Everybody who plays match at the 586 00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:13,480 gathering hates permission. Mother may I you don't get, you 587 00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:15,000 don't get to have this spell resolved. 588 00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:18,800 Nobody likes that when you go, when you go to the right and 589 00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:21,640 you're like, oh, I want to jump on this, this roller coaster and 590 00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:26,440 they go, Nope, that's that sucks, right? 591 00:33:26,560 --> 00:33:30,040 Nobody likes just being flat out said know before they even get 592 00:33:30,040 --> 00:33:34,000 to experience something. What people like to do is to try 593 00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:36,000 things to get in, get into stuff. 594 00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:40,360 And if they find their limits or they find where that wall is as 595 00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:45,280 they're doing it, so be it. But to look at a, in some cases 596 00:33:45,280 --> 00:33:48,840 to look at a vendor and say not available until week 3, 597 00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:52,800 horrible. And there's a lot to it. 598 00:33:52,800 --> 00:34:00,880 But I went through the horrific visions and it is pretty much 599 00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:04,480 what I remember. They've added in a few more toys 600 00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:09,600 and stuff but like mechanically it is fairly one for one without 601 00:34:09,600 --> 00:34:12,000 me having to worry about my own cloak level. 602 00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:15,400 And I am really glad to see this back. 603 00:34:15,400 --> 00:34:19,960 I, my, when I actually got in to play it, I was enjoying it. 604 00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:27,719 But all of what's been happening in the World of Warcraft around 605 00:34:27,719 --> 00:34:32,719 Horrific Visions has really soured it a bit. 606 00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:37,000 So I've got to, I've got to ask you to what has been your 607 00:34:37,000 --> 00:34:42,159 experience with Horrific Visions, both now and compared 608 00:34:42,159 --> 00:34:48,280 to how you originally played it And the gating, which thankfully 609 00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:54,280 Blizzard has pulled back on. What's your, what's your take on 610 00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:56,600 that? I'm going to throw this one to 611 00:34:56,600 --> 00:35:00,000 Sean first. So historically I love Horrific 612 00:35:00,000 --> 00:35:03,920 visions. They are in my opinion, no 613 00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:08,160 discussion even possible the best single player content 614 00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:11,040 Blizzard has ever designed, bar none period. 615 00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:13,600 Across the board nothing comes close. 616 00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:16,240 Now with that said, I didn't play challenge modes when they 617 00:35:16,240 --> 00:35:18,200 originally existed so maybe those are great, I don't know. 618 00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:19,720 I heard they were pretty good but. 619 00:35:22,600 --> 00:35:25,240 By your definition, you're good. Perfect by my definition. 620 00:35:25,240 --> 00:35:27,480 And then we rock. They're the best gameplay 621 00:35:27,480 --> 00:35:29,400 they've ever designed with the cloak. 622 00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:33,920 The one issue I had with Horrific Visions in the past was 623 00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:37,680 that they were limited in how many you could do a week by the 624 00:35:37,680 --> 00:35:41,120 vessels and Blizzard's credit they remove that. 625 00:35:41,120 --> 00:35:44,040 You can run Horrific visions till your eyes bleed. 626 00:35:44,440 --> 00:35:47,160 The only thing that limits you is your instance lock basically 627 00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:49,640 so you can run them as much as you want. 628 00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:51,560 And like you said, it's a it's a one to one. 629 00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:54,800 It is it's not almost the same. It's the same. 630 00:35:54,840 --> 00:36:01,040 It is one to one, identical, the same and it's great. 631 00:36:01,040 --> 00:36:03,600 It feels good. It's a nostalgia bump because 632 00:36:03,600 --> 00:36:07,480 we're coming into this stronger this season than we were when we 633 00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:11,400 got it in BFA. They are way easier now. 634 00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:15,040 So if you're playing this, First off, don't use the Sorodorman 635 00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:18,400 companion because it's it's currently buffing the mobs 636 00:36:18,400 --> 00:36:20,920 damage and health by more than double. 637 00:36:23,000 --> 00:36:25,720 So do it solo unless you're a healer and then find a friend. 638 00:36:26,480 --> 00:36:30,360 Do it solo as a tank or DPS because it is. 639 00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:34,360 If you're anywhere in the 475 plus item level range, you're 640 00:36:34,360 --> 00:36:38,360 going to face roll this and probably lower as well. 641 00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:43,880 I haven't done any lower geared characters and yeah, so I so I 642 00:36:43,880 --> 00:36:45,520 didn't play last night. I was at the Avril Lavigne 643 00:36:45,520 --> 00:36:47,840 concert in Halifax yesterday. It was amazing. 644 00:36:47,840 --> 00:36:52,720 She's fantastic. I cried thrice, but I so I came 645 00:36:52,720 --> 00:36:58,360 home today and in an hour I had completed everything that was 646 00:36:58,360 --> 00:37:02,720 possible to be done because of Blizzard's time gating with the 647 00:37:02,720 --> 00:37:06,720 exception of a full clear 5 mask run. 648 00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:11,000 So I cleared all the zones. I unlocked all five of the masks 649 00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:17,360 you can get this or 5 1/2 masks you can get this week and filled 650 00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:24,440 my hourglass of power as much as you can fill it, which is also 651 00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:26,680 time gated. They locked how much you can, 652 00:37:26,800 --> 00:37:29,840 and not only do they lock that you can fill it, they locked 653 00:37:29,840 --> 00:37:33,080 which direction you can fill it. So you can't just take your 654 00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:35,520 three or your four points that you're given this week and jam 655 00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:38,800 them all in the sanity decreasing column. 656 00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:41,080 You have to fill it up row by row. 657 00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:46,440 I can't purchase anything from the Heroic gear vendor yet 658 00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:51,200 because you have to do A5 mask run complete with that, which 659 00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:55,040 this week is extremely difficult as a solo player because one of 660 00:37:55,040 --> 00:37:57,400 the five masks you're forced to wear because you can only unlock 661 00:37:57,400 --> 00:38:00,400 5 full masks is the Long Night, which cuts your sanity in half. 662 00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:04,440 I'm certain exceptionally good players can do it, and you can 663 00:38:04,440 --> 00:38:06,720 probably do it as a group, maybe if your group is good. 664 00:38:06,760 --> 00:38:09,760 I will most likely try to get it before the end of the week, but 665 00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:14,120 I can't gain any more power until next week when the next 666 00:38:14,120 --> 00:38:17,000 row unlocks and then I can get two more. 667 00:38:17,560 --> 00:38:20,160 I can get the last three masks from Orgemar and then I won't 668 00:38:20,160 --> 00:38:23,440 have to run the Long Night. So we knew that some stuff was 669 00:38:23,440 --> 00:38:26,200 going to be locked behind doing it on Stormwind and Orgemar 670 00:38:26,200 --> 00:38:27,320 because that's how it was in the past. 671 00:38:27,320 --> 00:38:30,960 That's to be expected, but the other time getting the locking 672 00:38:30,960 --> 00:38:36,960 of the tree of power, the capping of when you could 673 00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:40,880 previously, the capping of when you could buy cosmetics, which 674 00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:45,480 has been removed and now which isn't an actual cap, but it 675 00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:47,120 it'll be. It'll feel like a cap for the 676 00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:51,200 majority of the players of being able to buy heroic weapons from 677 00:38:51,200 --> 00:38:52,520 the vendor, which isn't a big deal. 678 00:38:52,520 --> 00:38:54,080 You can get heroic weapons just put anywhere. 679 00:38:55,280 --> 00:38:59,920 But I mean, we're in, it's May 21st of a patch that started in 680 00:38:59,920 --> 00:39:03,000 February, just unlocked. Just just let us do these, 681 00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:05,400 please. And then lastly, the head 682 00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:08,720 enchant, the item everybody was looking for, which are 683 00:39:08,720 --> 00:39:14,600 corruptions in name only, Sinos, Sinos corruptions in name only 684 00:39:14,920 --> 00:39:18,280 that they have ruined. Everybody's just going to wear 685 00:39:18,280 --> 00:39:20,240 Void Ritual. That's all anyone's going to 686 00:39:20,240 --> 00:39:21,480 equip. There's no reason to equip 687 00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:23,840 anything else if you're a tank or healer. 688 00:39:24,440 --> 00:39:28,400 The all of the other ones that aren't void ritual do 33% less 689 00:39:28,400 --> 00:39:30,320 damage than they do if you're DPS. 690 00:39:31,040 --> 00:39:35,200 And even if you are adps void ritual is the highest damage 691 00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:38,680 increase by a decent amount. So just wear void ritual. 692 00:39:38,920 --> 00:39:40,360 Which good news you won't see it. 693 00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:42,800 It's just a stop bump so you don't even get the fun visual 694 00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:45,840 effects that we got from corruptions that is time gated. 695 00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:48,600 You can only get the lesser version this week and you unlock 696 00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:50,880 the greater version I think in two weeks. 697 00:39:53,160 --> 00:40:00,360 But it's like I I love Visions and I don't know who made these 698 00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:03,400 decisions. If they it feels like they hired 699 00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:06,320 staff back that had been laid off in the past and let them 700 00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:09,120 start making decisions again, I'd like for them to just stop 701 00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:10,840 letting those people make it. I'm glad they got hired back, 702 00:40:10,840 --> 00:40:12,800 that's great. But let's have the Dragonfly 703 00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:15,960 team come back and decide how we do this stuff, because the BFA 704 00:40:15,960 --> 00:40:18,440 team didn't know how to do it then and they're doing it shitty 705 00:40:18,440 --> 00:40:20,840 now. Yeah, sorry. 706 00:40:21,320 --> 00:40:24,920 I I do kind of like to be honest when I'm looking at the time 707 00:40:24,920 --> 00:40:27,880 gauge, the first thought that I have is bold of you to assume 708 00:40:27,880 --> 00:40:30,760 that I'm still gonna be doing this in two weeks like this is. 709 00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:33,480 And I, I feel like it kind of feels like Blizzard is 710 00:40:33,480 --> 00:40:36,120 frustrated that people like they, they have patches drop 711 00:40:36,120 --> 00:40:38,680 with a bunch of new content and everyone runs them for the first 712 00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:40,000 week and then stops playing them. 713 00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:45,520 Which like I get, but the solution there is not to just 714 00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:49,120 make it so that everyone like, we all give up after a week 715 00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:51,360 anyway and just don't ever get it right. 716 00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:54,680 Like I, I, I feel like this is the worst possible solution 717 00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:59,080 where I'm just like feeling like I, it just makes me feel like, 718 00:40:59,080 --> 00:41:00,600 OK, I'm fine. I guess I won't get it then. 719 00:41:02,080 --> 00:41:03,120 I did have a lot of fun with vision. 720 00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:06,960 So I was a healer in BFA and too shy to ask anyone to group with 721 00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:11,040 me, so I'm also kind of stupid. So I just kind of really didn't 722 00:41:11,200 --> 00:41:14,400 do with them at all. And so to go in as a especially 723 00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:18,040 Havoc Human Hunter is particularly well suited to solo 724 00:41:18,040 --> 00:41:20,400 content because it does self heal so heavily. 725 00:41:20,920 --> 00:41:23,320 So to be able to like go in as a havoc to even Demon Hunter, 726 00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:26,240 we'll say I didn't feel any different with Soradami. 727 00:41:26,240 --> 00:41:28,560 I, I equipped her to see if it was as bad as people said. 728 00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:31,240 And like, I think it was just such a faith role that like, I, 729 00:41:31,760 --> 00:41:33,400 it didn't, it didn't matter to me. 730 00:41:33,560 --> 00:41:35,720 Like I, I, I could just continue on through. 731 00:41:35,760 --> 00:41:39,680 I was still, you know, wrecking things, but I like they, they 732 00:41:39,720 --> 00:41:41,160 were, they were objectively very fun. 733 00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:45,480 I was having a lot of fun bopping around and just like 734 00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:48,520 live in my little dreams. But I I on the other hand I 735 00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:53,240 filled my 3 bars of thing and then I was like oh I can't get 736 00:41:53,240 --> 00:41:55,440 any better. OK, and I logged off. 737 00:41:57,560 --> 00:42:03,720 Yeah. So my character, I was doing 738 00:42:03,720 --> 00:42:11,360 this on my shaman it my character is about 6 high 670 is 739 00:42:11,360 --> 00:42:19,160 lower than 680 and it felt that it was much easier than I had 740 00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:23,960 ever done it when it first came around because of just the gear 741 00:42:24,400 --> 00:42:28,680 difference. Jumping back into it, 742 00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:33,360 remembering everything, doing A5 run without having to touch any 743 00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:37,400 of the potions was a little little over the top. 744 00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:38,840 Mask. Run not 5 mask. 745 00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:42,480 Run 5 areas. Sorry, all 5 areas. 746 00:42:42,480 --> 00:42:45,080 I've only done 1 mask. I haven't done all 5 masks 747 00:42:45,440 --> 00:42:47,360 right. I was ready to pray at the altar 748 00:42:47,360 --> 00:42:53,040 of Shamani there for a second. Shamans are quite good for it 749 00:42:53,040 --> 00:42:56,920 because it just in general guys treat this like a mythic plus 750 00:42:57,160 --> 00:43:00,280 the what's going to slow you down is how many pulls you need 751 00:43:00,280 --> 00:43:04,440 to do you pull everything that you need to you avoid stuff. 752 00:43:04,440 --> 00:43:07,400 You don't need to kill things as fast as possible. 753 00:43:07,400 --> 00:43:11,120 Just make sure you have that burst AOE going and that should 754 00:43:11,280 --> 00:43:14,800 just make these runs super smooth so you can actually get 755 00:43:14,800 --> 00:43:17,720 anywhere close to that instance cap you're talking about. 756 00:43:19,560 --> 00:43:28,160 But I found that one of the things that that really annoys 757 00:43:28,160 --> 00:43:36,040 me about this is Blizzard PR or whatever it is, they need to 758 00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:40,800 understand that expectations have to be managed. 759 00:43:41,280 --> 00:43:50,120 This would not be as rude of an upset if like literally the week 760 00:43:50,120 --> 00:43:53,560 before he has go through this, hadn't put out saying like, hey, 761 00:43:53,920 --> 00:43:57,080 we understand that this time gating has been bad and we've 762 00:43:57,280 --> 00:43:59,240 not really been putting out stuff. 763 00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:05,360 And like he can say that. And I think it was really good 764 00:44:05,360 --> 00:44:07,440 for them to acknowledge the issue. 765 00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:13,080 The one thing that should have been added on to that is this is 766 00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:19,560 not something that we're going to be able to have shifted for 767 00:44:20,640 --> 00:44:25,320 what we have coming next week or 11 point 1.5. 768 00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:29,080 We are going to have our team looking at that and reacting 769 00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:31,120 quickly. Then people would have had AI 770 00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:35,240 think a better managed reaction in mind. 771 00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:37,720 That they can. Don't make excuses for them. 772 00:44:37,800 --> 00:44:41,040 Three hours. It took them 3 hours to turn off 773 00:44:41,040 --> 00:44:42,760 the time getting on the cosmetics. 774 00:44:43,160 --> 00:44:45,880 On the cosmetics, I don't think that's enough. 775 00:44:46,560 --> 00:44:48,240 I genuinely. Turn it all off. 776 00:44:48,400 --> 00:44:51,000 But they could do it like thinking, sorry, I'm I'm not 777 00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:52,200 yelling. I'm not mad at you Manny. 778 00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:56,520 I'm mad at the situation. They could turn it all off. 779 00:44:56,920 --> 00:44:59,200 They could easily just they did it on the PTR. 780 00:44:59,480 --> 00:45:02,840 It came on the PTR the next day. They had it turned off for PTR 781 00:45:02,840 --> 00:45:05,680 testing. Do what you did there in live 782 00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:08,200 retail, please. Well, I think they need to do 783 00:45:08,440 --> 00:45:12,440 more than that. I think that for the longest 784 00:45:12,440 --> 00:45:17,240 time, the Blizzard developers have erred on the side of 785 00:45:17,240 --> 00:45:21,720 caution, giving us too little and then opening up the tap. 786 00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:26,280 And I understand the reasoning behind that because it's easier 787 00:45:26,480 --> 00:45:30,560 to start giving more than to try and claw stuff back. 788 00:45:31,040 --> 00:45:34,920 And so I understand why that is the way that they would air. 789 00:45:35,400 --> 00:45:40,960 I think that in a .5 and a .7 patch where you're about to make 790 00:45:40,960 --> 00:45:48,360 things obsolete anyways, I would actually say that all power from 791 00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:57,600 the visions is rendered obsolete on arrival because we have turbo 792 00:45:57,600 --> 00:46:02,320 boost pushing everything because we have the DN Rs being able to 793 00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:06,360 give you specific stuff. So this was the exact wrong time 794 00:46:06,600 --> 00:46:09,440 to be cautious. It was right after they had 795 00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:15,040 acknowledged the problem. It was right when that this even 796 00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:20,360 in its most free form would have given I think 0 problems. 797 00:46:20,360 --> 00:46:23,520 It would have supercharged some normal and heroic guilt. 798 00:46:23,840 --> 00:46:26,960 But I think that is such a minimal. 799 00:46:26,960 --> 00:46:31,520 Like, I mean it like a portion of those guilds, it's such a 800 00:46:31,520 --> 00:46:35,320 minimal impact and those guilds would have been happy for the 801 00:46:35,320 --> 00:46:41,040 problem. And so it's it's very weird 802 00:46:41,040 --> 00:46:47,120 because I respect Ian as being somebody who's very careful with 803 00:46:47,120 --> 00:46:49,240 his words. I think sometimes to a fault 804 00:46:49,240 --> 00:46:53,720 even he is very careful about what he says and the way he says 805 00:46:53,720 --> 00:46:59,880 it. But the team in general just 806 00:46:59,880 --> 00:47:03,520 needs to trust its player base a bit more at this point. 807 00:47:04,120 --> 00:47:06,320 We've grown up. We're not teenagers. 808 00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:09,400 We can decide when we're done ourselves. 809 00:47:09,400 --> 00:47:17,240 Now stop putting in these walls and stop trying to to like cage 810 00:47:17,240 --> 00:47:22,840 in the playpen and say no, Sean, you can't get your greater 811 00:47:22,840 --> 00:47:25,280 upgrade even though you've cleared through everything. 812 00:47:25,280 --> 00:47:27,080 You're going to clear through this tier. 813 00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:31,840 I think at this point, many of the people who are extremely 814 00:47:31,840 --> 00:47:38,800 pushing power or power focused have reached their AOTC limits. 815 00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:42,360 It would give them a bitter push to get to KSL to push into 816 00:47:42,360 --> 00:47:45,320 Mythic. And I think that giving people 817 00:47:46,160 --> 00:47:50,600 reason to try that is actually beneficial for the health of the 818 00:47:50,600 --> 00:47:53,640 game to be like, oh guys, we're we're never going to be stronger 819 00:47:53,840 --> 00:47:57,080 and we've cleared through this AOTC faster than we meant to. 820 00:47:57,400 --> 00:48:01,760 Why don't we try Mythic? And if the limitations of them 821 00:48:01,760 --> 00:48:05,040 doing that is because they can't pare down their team to 20 or 822 00:48:05,040 --> 00:48:10,120 they can't find more people to get to 20, that is so much 823 00:48:10,240 --> 00:48:15,040 better a problem than the what was. 824 00:48:15,040 --> 00:48:18,840 The truth of the matter here is that I looked at and said maybe 825 00:48:18,840 --> 00:48:21,840 I want to try this in three weeks when it's actually open 826 00:48:21,840 --> 00:48:26,040 for me to progress through that. That is never a good thing in my 827 00:48:26,040 --> 00:48:28,400 mind. I think it's still a bit of a 828 00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:33,320 reaction to the fact that, like historically World of Warcraft 829 00:48:33,320 --> 00:48:37,200 was the addiction game, right? Like it was the game that if you 830 00:48:37,200 --> 00:48:41,440 know, you'd go on like your whatever support forums existed 831 00:48:41,440 --> 00:48:45,280 before and be like, my husband plays World of Warcraft. 832 00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:48,240 Everyone's like, well, you got to accept never seeing your 833 00:48:48,240 --> 00:48:50,000 husband again or getting a divorce. 834 00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:54,560 Like, you know, I, I, I, it was like funny, this wasn't like 835 00:48:54,560 --> 00:48:56,520 traumatic to me as a kid. I think I've even told this 836 00:48:56,520 --> 00:48:58,640 story on this podcast before. But like, I remember it was like 837 00:48:58,640 --> 00:49:00,800 a running joke in my family because my dad played World of 838 00:49:00,800 --> 00:49:03,360 Warcraft that you asked dad a question and then you go do 839 00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:05,320 something else and you come back 5 minutes later because that's 840 00:49:05,320 --> 00:49:07,120 when he's going to process. You asked him a question, right? 841 00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:10,920 Would you know, again, it was, it feels like a funny story, but 842 00:49:10,920 --> 00:49:13,440 it, my father was so deeply addicted to World of Warcraft 843 00:49:13,440 --> 00:49:16,960 that like, you know, he would laser focus in which is tough 844 00:49:16,960 --> 00:49:23,480 when you have young children. So I think, but I, I think I 845 00:49:23,480 --> 00:49:25,400 kind of agree with you, Manny, that they're now reacting to a 846 00:49:25,400 --> 00:49:28,720 problem that hasn't been a problem for like probably a 847 00:49:28,720 --> 00:49:31,360 decade, right? Like if anything, right now, the 848 00:49:31,360 --> 00:49:35,400 issue is that people are like log, you know, don't do content 849 00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:36,560 for a significant period of time. 850 00:49:36,560 --> 00:49:40,640 Maybe that's my friend group, but I feel like we like I, I 851 00:49:40,640 --> 00:49:42,560 don't feel like I know anyone that I'm like, Jesus, man, how 852 00:49:42,560 --> 00:49:43,080 are you? Like? 853 00:49:43,480 --> 00:49:45,000 How do you have anything else going on in your life? 854 00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:46,280 You're playing too much World of Warcraft. 855 00:49:46,520 --> 00:49:50,080 I feel like everyone is, you know, pushes really hard for a 856 00:49:50,080 --> 00:49:56,960 few weeks and then raid logs. And so I think, I think that I, 857 00:49:56,960 --> 00:50:00,000 I do agree with you. When this conversation first 858 00:50:00,000 --> 00:50:02,680 started, I expected to go a different way that like World of 859 00:50:02,680 --> 00:50:05,280 Warcraft does have such a history of being such a dopamine 860 00:50:05,280 --> 00:50:07,760 lock that you do need to be thoughtful about how you're 861 00:50:07,760 --> 00:50:09,120 doing it. But I think the more I think 862 00:50:09,120 --> 00:50:11,160 about it, I think that problem is well and solved. 863 00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:13,480 And I think that at this point also, there's so many other 864 00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:15,280 dopamine locks competing for our attention. 865 00:50:15,520 --> 00:50:18,000 So like World of Warcraft is not the only thing that people are 866 00:50:18,000 --> 00:50:19,880 getting addicted to. And so we're probably going to 867 00:50:20,040 --> 00:50:22,840 be fine. And I think that we can allow 868 00:50:22,840 --> 00:50:25,960 players to manage their own time because we're no longer in a 869 00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:30,080 world where players managing their time means that, like, you 870 00:50:30,080 --> 00:50:34,080 know, the concept of a Wow widow is like common parlance. 871 00:50:35,320 --> 00:50:36,880 Yep. And we're, we're, we're coming 872 00:50:36,880 --> 00:50:39,040 into like, there's going to be people who hear this. 873 00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:41,040 They're like, yeah, but who cares if it's time gate every 874 00:50:41,040 --> 00:50:42,560 three weeks, Just come back and do it in three weeks. 875 00:50:42,840 --> 00:50:45,240 But we're heading into the summer, which means family 876 00:50:45,240 --> 00:50:47,000 vacations, time off work, travel. 877 00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:49,560 There are people who are not going to be able to do this in 878 00:50:49,560 --> 00:50:51,600 three weeks because their schedules fill up because 879 00:50:51,600 --> 00:50:53,680 they're doing stuff on the sun, right? 880 00:50:53,680 --> 00:50:55,040 This is the week they want to do it. 881 00:50:55,120 --> 00:50:57,720 And I'm just so tired of this loop this. 882 00:50:57,800 --> 00:50:59,480 And I agree with everything you both said, by the way, this is 883 00:50:59,480 --> 00:51:02,520 fantastic. Manny said it way more 884 00:51:02,520 --> 00:51:04,320 eloquently than I could have. So I'm going to vote to just 885 00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:08,760 make some wild claims here. I am just tired of this loop 886 00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:11,960 that we're on Where Blizzard does something that makes the 887 00:51:11,960 --> 00:51:14,240 player base angry. The player base gets upset. 888 00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:15,880 Blizzard goes back on what they did. 889 00:51:16,040 --> 00:51:18,040 Ian comes out and makes a statement telling us it won't 890 00:51:18,040 --> 00:51:19,880 happen again. Blizzard launches something 891 00:51:19,880 --> 00:51:21,760 doing exactly the thing that Ian said they won't do. 892 00:51:21,800 --> 00:51:23,560 The player base gets angry. Like, I don't know what game 893 00:51:23,560 --> 00:51:26,520 he's a director of, but it sounds awesome and I would love 894 00:51:26,520 --> 00:51:29,640 to play it, but it sure as hell isn't World of Warcraft because 895 00:51:29,640 --> 00:51:32,520 every time he tells us something won't happen again, they do it 896 00:51:32,680 --> 00:51:35,880 immediately, within a month. So like, I don't know. 897 00:51:36,640 --> 00:51:42,760 I, I mean to give, not to steal, man, Blizzard, as somebody once 898 00:51:42,760 --> 00:51:47,760 said in this show, but it's a large project. 899 00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:51,400 There are multiple teams dealing with multiple things that are 900 00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:55,440 coming down the pipeline. Not everything that Ian says is 901 00:51:55,440 --> 00:51:58,120 going to be implemented in the very next day. 902 00:51:58,520 --> 00:52:04,240 Or at all, ever. And so I think that the player 903 00:52:04,240 --> 00:52:07,640 base is always looking for that instant gratification. 904 00:52:09,240 --> 00:52:13,480 And sometimes it just can't happen that way. 905 00:52:13,960 --> 00:52:17,560 But there is a conversation to be had about like where the 906 00:52:17,560 --> 00:52:20,920 player base is at right now. Lex, you said at the beginning 907 00:52:20,920 --> 00:52:25,000 of the show where you're like, hey, maybe the devs shouldn't 908 00:52:25,000 --> 00:52:28,800 listen to the players sometimes. And she would like mark their 909 00:52:29,160 --> 00:52:34,520 their line and say no further. Sean, you just said that where 910 00:52:34,520 --> 00:52:37,720 it's like, like, hey, like they listen to us and it's great that 911 00:52:37,720 --> 00:52:41,200 they're listening to us. But then where's the actual 912 00:52:41,200 --> 00:52:46,760 change? Those are obviously conflicting 913 00:52:46,920 --> 00:52:48,520 when you put them right against each other. 914 00:52:48,520 --> 00:52:53,360 But when you allow for nuance, when you allow for some things 915 00:52:53,360 --> 00:52:57,800 to be like, hey, the data bears out and the and the community's 916 00:52:57,800 --> 00:53:02,400 right or the data bears out and sorry, guys, like this isn't 917 00:53:02,400 --> 00:53:03,800 something that we're going to do. 918 00:53:04,280 --> 00:53:08,240 Yeah, you're going to have sometimes where they do what you 919 00:53:08,240 --> 00:53:10,600 want and sometimes where they don't do what you want. 920 00:53:10,840 --> 00:53:15,680 There are going to be times where the like, what you're 921 00:53:15,680 --> 00:53:20,840 going to see and hear from the team is going to be exactly what 922 00:53:20,840 --> 00:53:22,600 you want. And then you're going to come on 923 00:53:22,600 --> 00:53:24,760 your favorite podcast and Manny is going to be saying stuff 924 00:53:24,760 --> 00:53:27,320 that's going to that. You're going to be like, what 925 00:53:27,320 --> 00:53:29,480 game are you even playing, Manny? 926 00:53:31,360 --> 00:53:35,320 And it's just because guys, they're catering to me. 927 00:53:35,320 --> 00:53:37,720 One time they're catering to Lex. 928 00:53:38,160 --> 00:53:40,840 The next time they're catering to Sean. 929 00:53:41,720 --> 00:53:46,680 Currently never. And I also honestly don't think 930 00:53:47,320 --> 00:53:49,760 like I, I, I hear what you're saying 100%, but I also don't 931 00:53:49,760 --> 00:53:58,880 think that what Sean and I are saying are directly in conflict, 932 00:53:59,160 --> 00:54:00,280 right? Like I see, I, I agree with you. 933 00:54:00,280 --> 00:54:03,000 It feels like it's in conflict, but I think that kind of what 934 00:54:03,000 --> 00:54:09,720 I'm reacting to is that the Blizzard team is making 935 00:54:09,720 --> 00:54:12,560 decisions based on like, like what people yell at them, and 936 00:54:12,560 --> 00:54:14,720 they're kind of trying to figure out what the people are yelling 937 00:54:14,720 --> 00:54:16,240 about. They're like, oh, the people are 938 00:54:16,240 --> 00:54:19,920 yelling because they feel like we have too many. 939 00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:23,800 Like, like, I don't know, I'm not thinking of a great way to 940 00:54:23,800 --> 00:54:27,080 word this, but like, everyone's screaming that they think that 941 00:54:27,080 --> 00:54:31,000 this mechanic is too difficult, so we're gonna make it easier in 942 00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:32,640 this way that makes sense to our devs. 943 00:54:33,120 --> 00:54:35,480 But because they're not coming up, like these ideas aren't 944 00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:37,440 coming from Blizzard, they're coming from people yelling 945 00:54:37,440 --> 00:54:40,240 internally and Blizzard kind of trying to translate rage into 946 00:54:40,520 --> 00:54:44,120 action. Umm, it's not being done in a 947 00:54:44,120 --> 00:54:46,280 like, how could we make the game better? 948 00:54:46,400 --> 00:54:49,520 It's being done in a oh, Jesus, people are screaming at us like 949 00:54:49,520 --> 00:54:51,640 about time gates and we said we're gonna listen to the player 950 00:54:51,640 --> 00:54:52,680 base. We have to do the player base 951 00:54:52,680 --> 00:54:54,360 says. And so we gotta figure out how 952 00:54:54,360 --> 00:54:57,280 to deal with time gates in a way that it seems like people want. 953 00:54:57,920 --> 00:55:02,840 And I want my game professionals who've made games for as long as 954 00:55:02,840 --> 00:55:06,440 I've been alive to make confident decisions based on 955 00:55:06,440 --> 00:55:08,280 their own expertise. I don't want them to make 956 00:55:08,280 --> 00:55:12,360 decisions based on people screaming at them and then being 957 00:55:12,360 --> 00:55:14,240 like, well, I guess we have to figure out what the player base 958 00:55:14,240 --> 00:55:15,320 wants. And it sounds like what they 959 00:55:15,320 --> 00:55:17,720 want is this, But I, I think it's similar. 960 00:55:17,720 --> 00:55:21,840 I think that they're like chaos is because they're like 961 00:55:22,400 --> 00:55:26,600 frantically trying to make everyone happy in the game and 962 00:55:26,600 --> 00:55:32,360 like, translate what they're saying versus knowing how games 963 00:55:32,360 --> 00:55:34,800 work and listening to feedback and listening to what's feeling 964 00:55:34,800 --> 00:55:38,440 frustrating and pulling that in and a like, OK, based on our 965 00:55:38,440 --> 00:55:41,760 expertise and how video games work, how do we make this 966 00:55:41,760 --> 00:55:43,880 possible? Instead of, well, players said 967 00:55:43,880 --> 00:55:45,520 they want this, we got to figure out how to make it happen. 968 00:55:46,000 --> 00:55:48,080 Does that make sense? Yeah, it does. 969 00:55:48,080 --> 00:55:51,040 And I I do think we're in like, I don't want them to figure out 970 00:55:51,040 --> 00:55:54,480 how to fix Boss XI, want them to figure out how to stop making 971 00:55:54,480 --> 00:55:58,520 bosses like Boss X. You know, that's it's not. 972 00:55:59,640 --> 00:56:03,560 And, and as long as they keep making boss XS, people are going 973 00:56:03,560 --> 00:56:06,080 to keep screaming and then it's going to this cycle continues. 974 00:56:06,480 --> 00:56:10,480 But if you just listen to the first one, you know, smoulder on 975 00:56:11,760 --> 00:56:15,000 in the mirror's a mirror's ale back to a mirror's ale or 976 00:56:15,000 --> 00:56:17,800 tendril. Stop making those boss XS. 977 00:56:18,560 --> 00:56:20,840 Then we don't have to keep saying it every tier up to this 978 00:56:20,840 --> 00:56:24,600 point, you know, and your world events, the world events are the 979 00:56:24,600 --> 00:56:26,320 same thing. We say these same things every 980 00:56:26,320 --> 00:56:28,320 time a world event comes out. Why are you gating? 981 00:56:28,320 --> 00:56:29,440 Why would you? Why? 982 00:56:30,680 --> 00:56:34,120 On what planet does gating cosmetics like forget the power 983 00:56:34,120 --> 00:56:35,960 stuff? They're gating because, OK, 984 00:56:35,960 --> 00:56:38,040 sure, you want to keep everyone in the even playing field for 985 00:56:38,040 --> 00:56:41,080 whatever reason, because it's this this side thing that is 986 00:56:41,080 --> 00:56:44,120 sort of fun. Maybe in three weeks is you. 987 00:56:44,120 --> 00:56:46,720 You wanted to be balanced, Cool. There's solo content. 988 00:56:46,720 --> 00:56:48,720 You want to make sure that Alex and I are at the same level? 989 00:56:48,760 --> 00:56:52,840 OK, cool. Who anywhere ever thinks we 990 00:56:52,840 --> 00:56:57,440 should probably get these cosmetics from BFA then I can 991 00:56:57,440 --> 00:57:00,880 farm in BFAI, can just fly. I can just go to nightlife and 992 00:57:00,880 --> 00:57:03,600 get them. Should probably get these. 993 00:57:03,720 --> 00:57:06,080 Hey, Jerry, you going for lunch? Yeah, hold on. 994 00:57:06,080 --> 00:57:07,600 Let me check with this time getting really quick on 995 00:57:07,600 --> 00:57:11,400 everything. This is going to go great. 996 00:57:11,400 --> 00:57:12,440 Oh, who's doing an interview today? 997 00:57:12,440 --> 00:57:12,760 Ian? How? 998 00:57:12,760 --> 00:57:13,480 Cool. We'll check that out. 999 00:57:14,120 --> 00:57:21,320 What game is it for? So I, I do want to apologize. 1000 00:57:21,320 --> 00:57:29,320 I, I meant to say that your two comments might sound like they 1001 00:57:29,320 --> 00:57:33,000 are in conflict, but they're not actually in conflict, right? 1002 00:57:33,960 --> 00:57:38,480 I meant to say that like, the devs can listen to the 1003 00:57:38,480 --> 00:57:42,760 sentiment, but not necessarily the words of something. 1004 00:57:43,240 --> 00:57:48,000 And so when a change comes through, it might not be the 1005 00:57:48,000 --> 00:57:52,080 change that you were asking for exactly, but it does work 1006 00:57:52,080 --> 00:57:57,040 towards the the problem. So I do apologize if I if I 1007 00:57:57,040 --> 00:57:59,640 misspoken with saying that like what you 2 are asking for is 1008 00:57:59,920 --> 00:58:05,320 completely incongruent and unable to to work together. 1009 00:58:06,440 --> 00:58:07,640 Yeah, stop trying to make us fight, man. 1010 00:58:07,640 --> 00:58:09,040 Yeah. Man, it's like that. 1011 00:58:09,040 --> 00:58:10,640 We fight because then we don't fight with him. 1012 00:58:10,640 --> 00:58:13,520 If, if, if you and I get together, Sean, we make Manny's 1013 00:58:13,520 --> 00:58:15,240 life so hard. He's over here trying to like 1014 00:58:15,240 --> 00:58:17,880 explain nuance. And we're like, actually, this 1015 00:58:17,880 --> 00:58:21,560 is terrible. Yeah, Manny's like well spoken 1016 00:58:21,560 --> 00:58:24,120 and his responses are all well thought out and very measured 1017 00:58:24,120 --> 00:58:26,520 and balanced and I'm like, what game is he making? 1018 00:58:28,520 --> 00:58:31,040 You, you definitely beat inflammatory this episode. 1019 00:58:31,040 --> 00:58:37,080 But like, I think that the, the thing that makes it work is when 1020 00:58:37,480 --> 00:58:41,120 you say an inflammatory statement and then the question 1021 00:58:41,120 --> 00:58:46,280 is why? Like we will give feedback, all 1022 00:58:46,280 --> 00:58:49,920 players will give their feedback on the forum and and such. 1023 00:58:51,040 --> 00:58:53,600 All players, actually everyone legally has to give their 1024 00:58:53,600 --> 00:58:55,880 feedback on the forum. It's part of the social 1025 00:58:55,920 --> 00:59:00,320 agreement you signed. I mean, I am a proponent of 1026 00:59:00,880 --> 00:59:04,800 required voting federally and and levels, but you know. 1027 00:59:04,800 --> 00:59:07,960 Things nothing says democracy like someone with no idea what 1028 00:59:07,960 --> 00:59:10,920 the what any of the candidates are about being forced about. 1029 00:59:11,080 --> 00:59:13,640 Sean, I'll fight you on this one, but not on, not on this, 1030 00:59:13,640 --> 00:59:19,400 all right? TuneIn next week for red versus 1031 00:59:19,400 --> 00:59:23,720 blue, which means different things in our different 1032 00:59:23,720 --> 00:59:29,040 countries. People should make their voice 1033 00:59:29,040 --> 00:59:32,280 heard, give feedback. The more feedback they have, 1034 00:59:32,640 --> 00:59:38,800 however rough or refined it is, is still better than allowing 1035 00:59:39,080 --> 00:59:41,920 certain loud voices talk for you. 1036 00:59:42,560 --> 00:59:44,440 Well, unless Blizzard feels like they have to do everything that 1037 00:59:44,440 --> 00:59:49,080 we say that it's worse. No, because I don't. 1038 00:59:49,480 --> 00:59:52,520 If everybody speaks what they want, they personally want and 1039 00:59:52,520 --> 00:59:57,840 not just parroting what like pawn, God, X or Sean says. 1040 00:59:58,400 --> 01:00:01,560 And I do want to be clear, all of my issues with Blizzard are 1041 01:00:01,560 --> 01:00:04,560 my issues. I give zero thought to how they 1042 01:00:04,560 --> 01:00:07,640 affect the community. They are my issues and my 1043 01:00:07,640 --> 01:00:10,280 concerns. I am not trying to speak for the 1044 01:00:10,320 --> 01:00:12,800 every man but. That's the point. 1045 01:00:12,800 --> 01:00:14,760 Like that's the conceit of this show. 1046 01:00:15,200 --> 01:00:18,920 That is literally why we have three people who play 3 1047 01:00:18,920 --> 01:00:22,360 different ways. We want different voices, and 1048 01:00:22,360 --> 01:00:26,280 Blizzard would benefit from every voice. 1049 01:00:26,280 --> 01:00:30,240 If every player said what they were, what they liked or 1050 01:00:30,240 --> 01:00:33,360 disliked about the game. No matter how stupid I might 1051 01:00:33,360 --> 01:00:37,120 personally think it is, I think that Blizzard would be better 1052 01:00:37,120 --> 01:00:42,400 for having that data set. The next level that I was trying 1053 01:00:42,440 --> 01:00:51,600 to get to was giving reasoning behind that I hate this, why 1054 01:00:52,640 --> 01:00:57,960 this is clunky, how I don't want to engage with this. 1055 01:00:58,080 --> 01:01:02,600 What would make it more appetizing for you, right? 1056 01:01:02,880 --> 01:01:09,040 Even if they don't take your your reason for like, hey, you 1057 01:01:09,040 --> 01:01:10,320 know what would make this better for me? 1058 01:01:10,520 --> 01:01:14,560 If I got 1000 gold just for logging in, they could still 1059 01:01:14,560 --> 01:01:16,400 take that. Could seem to be like, oh this 1060 01:01:16,400 --> 01:01:19,720 person wants to be more rewarded, how can we reward them 1061 01:01:19,880 --> 01:01:25,680 in a way that isn't as what Manny would consider stupid as 1062 01:01:25,680 --> 01:01:27,840 giving everybody 1000 gold every time they log in? 1063 01:01:27,880 --> 01:01:29,440 People 1000 gold every time they log in. 1064 01:01:30,120 --> 01:01:33,520 OK Lex, what happens when people keep logging in and logging out 1065 01:01:33,520 --> 01:01:36,320 every 5 seconds and then the game inflates? 1066 01:01:37,760 --> 01:01:40,080 Then we get to. Then we go, OK, OK, no, I'm, 1067 01:01:40,320 --> 01:01:42,200 I'm, I'm not actually going to make this argument. 1068 01:01:42,200 --> 01:01:44,200 But I am. I know, I know you weren't, but 1069 01:01:44,440 --> 01:01:47,600 but the but like the reason I actually threw that question, 1070 01:01:47,600 --> 01:01:50,560 even though like obviously Lex, you were just Oh yeah, doing a 1071 01:01:50,560 --> 01:01:54,120 throwaway sort of joke, right? Is that there are immediate 1072 01:01:54,120 --> 01:01:56,480 follow up questions and consequences for any 1073 01:01:56,520 --> 01:01:58,200 implementation that might be done. 1074 01:01:58,280 --> 01:02:00,640 And the reason that Blizzard might not do the the 1075 01:02:01,040 --> 01:02:05,720 implementation that we want, suggest or demand for is because 1076 01:02:05,800 --> 01:02:11,440 of things that we haven't considered further down, like I 1077 01:02:11,440 --> 01:02:13,840 think all of us. Conflict with the dastardly duos 1078 01:02:13,840 --> 01:02:16,520 we're getting in three weeks. We'll have to lay off half the 1079 01:02:16,520 --> 01:02:19,440 team every two weeks, so you know, that's the most important 1080 01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:21,080 thing that Microsoft can do right now. 1081 01:02:21,960 --> 01:02:27,800 The 11.5 box featured dastardly duos were getting 2 1/2 months 1082 01:02:27,800 --> 01:02:34,000 after 11.5 and only 18 days before 11 point 1.7. 1083 01:02:34,120 --> 01:02:37,040 I did have a moment today that I was like, God, wait, wasn't 1084 01:02:37,040 --> 01:02:38,560 there supposed to be a dastardly duo? 1085 01:02:38,560 --> 01:02:40,920 Did I miss that? Did that already happen? 1086 01:02:40,960 --> 01:02:44,680 I'm such a bad podcast host. Don't worry Lex, you did not 1087 01:02:44,720 --> 01:02:48,280 miss it. It is so bad that it it deflates 1088 01:02:48,280 --> 01:02:52,600 the patch so much where like these things that people 1089 01:02:52,960 --> 01:02:57,280 arguably could have been the most excited for are so far in 1090 01:02:57,280 --> 01:02:59,960 and then are about to get eclipsed by what's coming down 1091 01:02:59,960 --> 01:03:01,640 next. Like this thing is going to 1092 01:03:01,640 --> 01:03:06,600 launch 11 point 1.7 is like starting to eat up head 1093 01:03:06,760 --> 01:03:12,920 headlines. 11.2 is going to show up in the middle of this thing, 1094 01:03:12,920 --> 01:03:18,080 this thing coming out and people are going to just literally do 1095 01:03:18,080 --> 01:03:20,520 what you did Lex forget it existed. 1096 01:03:20,800 --> 01:03:26,840 And that to me is such a crime. I obviously Ian has had and the 1097 01:03:26,840 --> 01:03:32,560 team are aware that this level of gating is just not it. 1098 01:03:33,200 --> 01:03:36,880 I don't want to say that time gaining in general is not it 1099 01:03:36,880 --> 01:03:40,320 because I I do want to concede that there are points where it's 1100 01:03:40,320 --> 01:03:44,680 like, yeah, you do want to like space some things out, but this 1101 01:03:44,680 --> 01:03:46,720 is ridiculous. This is clearly ridiculous. 1102 01:03:47,320 --> 01:03:49,360 I don't want to beat that dead horse any further. 1103 01:03:49,560 --> 01:03:55,480 What I do want to say is for better or for worse, whoever you 1104 01:03:55,480 --> 01:03:59,440 are, if you're in the sound of my voice, go ahead and give your 1105 01:03:59,440 --> 01:04:02,520 feedback. Either throw it on to bit dot LY 1106 01:04:02,520 --> 01:04:07,040 slash fast discord right and we will hear it and it'll help 1107 01:04:07,040 --> 01:04:10,760 shape our opinions right. Go on to the forums. 1108 01:04:11,400 --> 01:04:15,120 Put that put that thought out there into the forums. 1109 01:04:15,360 --> 01:04:21,480 I think it was like Epidemi who like put out the the weight 1110 01:04:21,480 --> 01:04:27,200 within and that has stuck in my head all day, right? 1111 01:04:27,320 --> 01:04:29,200 Like, I think that's brilliant. In fact, I'm going to name this 1112 01:04:29,200 --> 01:04:31,440 episode the wait within. Right? 1113 01:04:31,680 --> 01:04:38,080 There you go, Epidemi, right? You anybody and their voice can 1114 01:04:38,080 --> 01:04:40,920 have that sort of influence to plant those ideas and get it 1115 01:04:40,920 --> 01:04:44,480 forward to like a much larger, larger audience than you may 1116 01:04:44,480 --> 01:04:46,960 even be expecting. So I say put it forward. 1117 01:04:47,920 --> 01:04:50,000 I don't know. That's my monologue. 1118 01:04:51,360 --> 01:04:57,440 I'll give mine in three weeks. We're going to have three weeks 1119 01:04:57,440 --> 01:05:00,400 of Dead Space and then and then your monologue there. 1120 01:05:03,520 --> 01:05:08,920 But I I do want to ask you, Lex, are you going to be playing this 1121 01:05:09,040 --> 01:05:10,720 in three weeks? Does this seem like something 1122 01:05:10,720 --> 01:05:12,120 that's going to hold your interest? 1123 01:05:12,360 --> 01:05:15,440 Did you play Horrific Visions back in BF? 1124 01:05:15,560 --> 01:05:18,960 AI didn't really in BFA, especially since I was healing, 1125 01:05:18,960 --> 01:05:21,200 so I I didn't like I was kind of scared to group. 1126 01:05:23,640 --> 01:05:27,640 I don't think so I don't know if this is going to hold my 1127 01:05:27,640 --> 01:05:30,200 interest for a week, but it was fun when I did it. 1128 01:05:30,240 --> 01:05:35,280 But I think it like, I, I think it would have been more fun if I 1129 01:05:35,280 --> 01:05:37,600 was, yeah, if I was able to like, grind out. 1130 01:05:40,720 --> 01:05:42,920 And, you know, like I've said multiple times on this podcast 1131 01:05:42,920 --> 01:05:45,400 now, every single thing in World of Warcraft has to compete with 1132 01:05:45,400 --> 01:05:47,760 snuggling with a puppy. And so am I going to want to do 1133 01:05:47,760 --> 01:05:49,880 Horrific Visions more than I want to snuggle a puppy in three 1134 01:05:49,880 --> 01:05:51,040 weeks? Probably not. 1135 01:05:51,240 --> 01:05:55,400 It's the same thing every time. Right. 1136 01:05:56,200 --> 01:06:00,800 And I, I think that that is a big problem for World of 1137 01:06:00,800 --> 01:06:03,120 Warcraft. Not horrific visions in itself, 1138 01:06:03,400 --> 01:06:06,840 but the fact that they are putting together these systems 1139 01:06:07,000 --> 01:06:13,200 that have a, that have a tail or shelf life that is far smaller 1140 01:06:13,520 --> 01:06:16,440 than they are putting the reward track. 1141 01:06:17,000 --> 01:06:23,080 I do not care what my Galaggio renowned track is at, even 1142 01:06:23,080 --> 01:06:25,760 though there is mounts at the end of it. 1143 01:06:25,880 --> 01:06:29,080 That to me is just like I don't want to go through that until I 1144 01:06:29,080 --> 01:06:35,080 hit renowned 20 there. The machina there are reward 1145 01:06:35,080 --> 01:06:39,600 their amounts that you could get and the grind rate on that is so 1146 01:06:40,400 --> 01:06:45,960 ridiculous that I'm done with it before I really pushed and 1147 01:06:45,960 --> 01:06:47,760 pushed into it. I haven't bought one thing with 1148 01:06:47,760 --> 01:06:49,520 that and I've already done with that. 1149 01:06:49,960 --> 01:06:53,800 I think that if Blizzard wants to allow people to walk away 1150 01:06:53,800 --> 01:06:59,120 from this game, they need to just allow us to progress 1151 01:06:59,120 --> 01:07:04,680 through it at a reasonable rate that we're like maybe playing a 1152 01:07:04,680 --> 01:07:08,000 couple of days or week longer than we than we would have just 1153 01:07:08,000 --> 01:07:12,800 to get that final award. But like 3 weeks from now, no, I 1154 01:07:12,800 --> 01:07:15,120 don't care. Two weeks from now, do I care 1155 01:07:15,120 --> 01:07:17,480 about nightfall? Not really. 1156 01:07:18,480 --> 01:07:21,880 Are you dive? Any of you open question to both 1157 01:07:21,880 --> 01:07:27,360 the audience and my 2 Co hosts. Are you guys going through the 1158 01:07:27,360 --> 01:07:30,440 undermine outside of when you have to raid? 1159 01:07:31,960 --> 01:07:35,680 No, I couldn't tell you that. No I don't. 1160 01:07:36,400 --> 01:07:39,160 I get cartel Rep from doing a dungeon every week and. 1161 01:07:40,960 --> 01:07:44,760 I actually have, I, I actually, I think it's not terrible if 1162 01:07:44,760 --> 01:07:49,280 patches are relatively short in holding our attention. 1163 01:07:49,720 --> 01:07:52,280 I think that's kind of the new. I think there's thing to be said 1164 01:07:52,280 --> 01:07:53,880 for like, if you want to say, oh, we're going to listen to the 1165 01:07:53,880 --> 01:07:56,880 player base, the play race is telling you in their actions 1166 01:07:57,080 --> 01:08:00,400 that they don't really want content that stretches out 1167 01:08:00,800 --> 01:08:03,080 right. And I, I think that that's an, I 1168 01:08:03,080 --> 01:08:06,040 think it's OK if an MMO is something that you play with 1169 01:08:06,040 --> 01:08:08,920 your friends heavily for a while and then like for however long, 1170 01:08:08,920 --> 01:08:10,800 you know, you pick something that's hard enough, that's going 1171 01:08:10,800 --> 01:08:13,560 to hold your attention for the amount you want it to and then 1172 01:08:13,560 --> 01:08:17,399 you kind of let it fizzle. I think that's fine. 1173 01:08:17,439 --> 01:08:20,319 I think that, and honestly, I think the only other option is 1174 01:08:20,359 --> 01:08:23,279 the type of MMO that we had in the early days of World of 1175 01:08:23,279 --> 01:08:25,479 Warcraft where, you know, everyone felt like they had to 1176 01:08:25,479 --> 01:08:28,600 be playing constantly 24/7. And I don't want that either. 1177 01:08:28,600 --> 01:08:30,520 So I think it's OK. I think it's OK that, you know, 1178 01:08:30,520 --> 01:08:34,520 patches are exciting for a couple weeks and then we go and 1179 01:08:34,520 --> 01:08:36,399 play other games and then we come back when another thing 1180 01:08:36,399 --> 01:08:38,200 comes up. Yeah. 1181 01:08:38,200 --> 01:08:40,479 And I like, I think that is great. 1182 01:08:40,880 --> 01:08:46,000 But my, my question is like, are there rewards and such that 1183 01:08:46,000 --> 01:08:48,720 people would be interested in? Right. 1184 01:08:48,840 --> 01:08:54,520 But even then, it felt like too much of A grind to go and get 1185 01:08:54,520 --> 01:08:57,040 that. And if there are like some 1186 01:08:57,040 --> 01:09:00,520 things that I could show you and be like, oh, that's cool, what's 1187 01:09:00,520 --> 01:09:01,920 that? And then I show you what it 1188 01:09:01,920 --> 01:09:04,439 takes to get that and you go, you know what? 1189 01:09:04,439 --> 01:09:06,840 I'm never going to bother. I think there's too many of 1190 01:09:06,840 --> 01:09:10,720 those things in the game right now. 500 jet pieces or whatever 1191 01:09:10,720 --> 01:09:13,560 the hell it is. I just, I mean, I just don't 1192 01:09:13,560 --> 01:09:14,960 like the zone. I don't like the drive system. 1193 01:09:14,960 --> 01:09:16,359 I don't like being forced into a car. 1194 01:09:16,720 --> 01:09:19,359 I'm growing weary of being underground. 1195 01:09:19,800 --> 01:09:23,040 I would I, I like some of the the trans mug and stuff, but I 1196 01:09:23,040 --> 01:09:26,160 just, it's not fun. I don't enjoy it. 1197 01:09:27,279 --> 01:09:29,040 And yeah, it's like there's like some chatting. 1198 01:09:29,040 --> 01:09:30,520 You know what it is? It's so I don't even know what 1199 01:09:30,640 --> 01:09:32,760 the the reward is. I just heard somebody talking 1200 01:09:32,760 --> 01:09:36,080 when they had to grind 500 pieces of chat and I couldn't 1201 01:09:36,080 --> 01:09:39,520 even be bothered to look up what chat was because that just 1202 01:09:39,520 --> 01:09:43,279 sounded so insane to me. They're like, I have to go do my 1203 01:09:43,279 --> 01:09:45,120 Chet runs with your what, what are you doing? 1204 01:09:45,120 --> 01:09:49,560 I'm digging through trash piles hoping to get a piece of Chet. 1205 01:09:50,560 --> 01:09:52,000 Like what? What is that? 1206 01:09:52,000 --> 01:09:54,840 What are we doing? What is what is happening right 1207 01:09:54,840 --> 01:10:00,120 now? It's a it is a acronym Lex. 1208 01:10:00,120 --> 01:10:02,320 Lex's Lex's screen has just I like my world. 1209 01:10:03,640 --> 01:10:05,280 Like what's the screen just gone, right? 1210 01:10:05,440 --> 01:10:07,600 I'm just trying to get allow her to like look it up. 1211 01:10:07,600 --> 01:10:10,240 It's an acronym, so you have to put the period in between each 1212 01:10:10,240 --> 01:10:12,200 letter that'll help you look it up. 1213 01:10:12,200 --> 01:10:14,200 Like you're like her screen just like dude, like. 1214 01:10:14,200 --> 01:10:15,680 I like this guy. Like what's? 1215 01:10:17,680 --> 01:10:20,960 Look at the pictures of guys in polo shirts and deck shoes. 1216 01:10:21,400 --> 01:10:23,680 What is happening? What is Sean talking 500 of 1217 01:10:23,680 --> 01:10:25,240 these? I don't want that either. 1218 01:10:25,760 --> 01:10:28,920 It's an audio show, so you like people may not have realized 1219 01:10:28,920 --> 01:10:31,840 what happened. Lex like tabbed over to a 1220 01:10:31,840 --> 01:10:36,440 different screen or something. At which point, like her, what's 1221 01:10:36,440 --> 01:10:42,920 the right descriptor? Her Milky complexion turned 1222 01:10:43,280 --> 01:10:45,400 further ghostly. You're going. 1223 01:10:45,400 --> 01:10:47,280 To have to mark this show as explicit. 1224 01:10:50,920 --> 01:10:55,040 Yeah, fun fact about me is that I don't use Google in dark mode. 1225 01:10:55,040 --> 01:11:00,120 So if I'm on camera and I switch over to Google, something bright 1226 01:11:00,120 --> 01:11:02,400 white light. Everybody knows the. 1227 01:11:02,920 --> 01:11:05,200 Whole neighbor, incredibly reflective. 1228 01:11:07,080 --> 01:11:10,240 Alexa's window lights up like the beacons of Gondor. 1229 01:11:13,720 --> 01:11:16,680 Yeah, Gondor calls for aid. Alexa's Googling something. 1230 01:11:26,720 --> 01:11:35,280 Well, until next time, no. But yeah, I honestly, this is a 1231 01:11:35,280 --> 01:11:37,320 great episode. I'm really glad that everybody 1232 01:11:37,320 --> 01:11:40,160 is back in the seats and we're we're talking again. 1233 01:11:40,400 --> 01:11:43,480 It's more of your stuff coming. I'm just hoping that it has a 1234 01:11:43,480 --> 01:11:47,440 little bit more of a shelf life and we will be back again next 1235 01:11:47,440 --> 01:11:49,720 week. So until next time, may all your 1236 01:11:49,720 --> 01:11:50,480 hits be good.