The most costly mistake high performance make is assuming
that competence alone creates influence.
A lot of people believe that their results will speak for
themselves, but in reality, influence is built through
strategic visibility, through relationship capital and
aligning yourself with the enterprise goals.
So you don't have to just focus on let me just get my job done.
It is your job to get your job done, to build strategic
visibility for yourself, to go out there and create
relationships with the decision makers and ensure that you are
proven that the work you're doing aligns with the vision of
the company. Hi there, are you a professional
or business owner teaching investors for sharing big ideas
about your presentations just are not keeping up with your
vision? That's exactly why I use Gamma
app or Proud partners. Gamma is an AI powered platform
that helps you build beautiful decks, documents and web pages
in just minutes. No complicated formats in no
design headaches, just clean modern presentations that
communicate your ideas clearly and professionally.
If you want to present like a pro, Sign up today using the two
start link in the description below and start creating smarter
with camera app. We are live.
Ladies and gentlemen, you once again welcome to the Kingdom's
podcast in Diary of the CFO. And today are going to be a
very, very, very special guest fighting out of Alberto, Canada
by way of Amanda Cameron Nadine, the superhero engraved Devo.
I'm so glad to be here if you're watching this.
Hi, thanks for watching. I hope you enjoyed the episode.
Whoa, whoa, whoa. Bonjour.
Bonjour, my Mozart, I said today on the Kingdom's podcast Summer
trip. Sava, Sava.
OK, OK. Masi, Masi.
Yeah, Masi Baku. So today on The Kingdom's
podcast, we're joined by a leader.
News journey from the Republic of Camry to the highest levels
of corporate North America is nothing short of remarkable.
Nadine Anibar is the Alberta back, a leader for risk advisory
at BDO Canada and the best selling author of quarterback,
which reached the number one on Amazon within 24 hours of
Billings. With over a decade of experience
crossing by PwC and KPMG, she has built a reputation for
helping organizations achieve sustainable growth by balancing
in technology risk with human integrity.
Beyond titles and accolades, Nadine represents a philosophy
of leadership rated in relationships.
She believes the quality of our lives is determined by the
quality of our connections. Today, she joins us to share the
strategy, discipline, and mindset required to architect a
legacy at the highest level. Nadine is an absolute honor to
welcome you to the game cast. Whoa, how are you once again?
I'm good. How are you?
I'm good, I'm good, you know, I'm happy.
I'm happy to have you on here and I'm in it.
I'm. Asking you, how are you?
Yeah. How are you?
Would I say I'm exhausted from reserving a lot of oxygen for
the introduction of the superhero?
No, you're not exhausted. You're fine.
You're happy to be here. I'm fired up.
You know, it's, it's really
amazing having somebody that, you know, would I say, share
similar backgrounds, similar experiences.
It just gives you a positive bias towards that person.
You know, the PC, the KPG, you know, influence you.
You have to talk to this person. You have to enjoy such a
conversation. Well, before we get up to that
best face of origin and of course a resilient story of
yours, your long term vision is to lead a Fortune 100 company.
Not Fortune 500, Fortune 100. That is a tall one.
Very specific. Yeah, I'm going to be that kind
of. CEO Amazing How did your early
years in Cameroon and your first professional experience at Smart
Track Africa shape the resilience required for that
scale of ambition? You did, you did.
You did a good homework on me before this podcast, so.
Thank. You my LES in Cameroon yeah, you
did a lot of people who remember I worked at smart track but but
I did so talking about my early years in Cameroon.
My early years in Cameroon shaped my understanding of
responsibility and opportunity because I was growing up in an
environment where progress required discipline, community
and faith, and principles like that build resilience and fuel
ambition. So like my first professional
experience at Smart Track Africa, it exposed me to an
emerging market. Cameroon is an emerging market.
It's not a developed market and in an emerging market structure
is limited, Expectations are very high.
You learn to do the absolute best with very imperfect
conditions, right? So you rely a lot on your
creativity to solve problems in an environment that a lot is
very onsetting. So I think, and I was an
internal auditor at Smarttrac. I think those early days working
as an internal auditor in Smarttrac, though Basic Cameroon
was a global organization because they had branches
throughout Africa. Working as an internal auditor
in an emerging market, having to put all of me to get things
right, really build the foundation of my resilience.
Living Cameroon coming to Canada now, a developed market, working
across all of these large organizations within the same
function. That price risk management tenor
audit gave me a 360 view on how an organization is being run and
how every part intersects with each other, every department
intersects with each other. That eventually informs the CEO
on how to make decisions on what strategic direction this
organization wants to go. I found myself in a position
where I I said I've seen a lot and my experience so far being
how 360 it is, has prepared me to lead a large organization.
And that's why I'm really intentional and specific when I
say that I'm going to be the CEO of a Fortune 100 company.
This is coming from experience built over the years in an
enterprise risk management function where I've advise
business unit leaders across the organization in both an emerging
market and a developed market. Giving me a very 360 well
grounded experience that whatever company I step into to
lead that company from point A to point B will be getting a
very refined professional. Wow.
Amazing, amazing. You know, it's quite interesting
that I studied economics for my first degree, right.
So looking at this from a global perspective, you talked about
emerging markets, developed markets, right, for a Fortune
500 company. But when I say branches across
different markets, how do you handle, would I say the
different moving parts across regions?
Like, what is your strategy on ensuring that each branch goes
to market and they actually complete favorably within the
political environment, you know, the social, cultural,
technological, the legal frameworks within, you know,
those different markets? Like how do you envision it
from, would I say, a better eye for you?
Yeah. So first of all, we need to
understand that that's that's not a one person's job and
that's not a one department's job.
So you're thinking about maybe expanding or establishing
presence in a foreign market. You have to look at legal, the
rules and regulation. You have to look at the
competitors, what the competitors are doing when it
comes to even pricing. How do you price your products?
What price? Like transfer pricing?
As well enter into the market, yeah, now transfer pricing has
to come in the tax, you have to look at taxation rule.
There's a tax department coming into the equation.
So if you are a CEO of that kind of company, you need to build
your a game team to tackle this expansion.
You have to have a solid legal team, you have to have a solid
transfer pricing team, you have to have a solid and marketing
team, you have to have a solid. I think it's going to be the
strategy team that is going to go in and do SWOT analysis,
strength, weakness, opportunity to look at what the competitors
are doing. And then it's you guys are going
to based on the results. Yes, yeah, you also have to do
look at the pastel analysis and it's based on the results of all
of this analysis that you see to together and make a decision.
The cash we need to there is you don't have to wait till you have
90% of the information to make a decision.
You should be able to confidently make a decision with
60% or 70% of the information that gets available to you.
But it's it's it's not a static thing.
You're constantly evaluating, you're constantly evaluating
maybe every six months, everyone year.
Are we still on the right track? Do we need to pivot?
Do we need to change course of action?
So the first thing that will make anyone feel as ACEO when
considering that kind of move is thinking that you are the master
of knowledge and or be or you're going to be able to do this by
yourself. You won't.
And that's why companies hire consultants.
That's why they're going to hire AKPMGAPWC and EY a video because
they have this, that specialization in house to
really come in and help you with things like this.
Amazing, amazing. So you've actually beats
credibility within the Beaker environment.
EYPWC So what is the most costly mistake high performance make
when trying to build influence inside highly structured
corporate systems? The most costly mistake high
performance make is assuming that competence alone creates
influence. Many, a lot of people believe
that their results will speak for themselves, but in reality,
inference is built through strategic visibility, through
relationship capital and aligning yourself with the
enterprise goals. So you don't have to just focus
on let me just get my job done. It is your job to get your job
done, to build strategic visibility for yourself, to go
out there and create relationships with the decision
makers and ensure that you are proven that the work you're
doing aligns with the visual of the company.
I think high performance that remain technically strong by
relationally invisible often plateau in their career because
influence is not only about performance.
You're supposed to have trust, clarity of voice, and you have
to clearly demonstrate how the work you do impacts the
organization's bottom line. That's the profit and the
organization's vision, where the organization is going.
Those who constantly demonstrate that they have what it takes to
align with an organization, to get it from point A to point B,
are the ones who are going to stay within an organization,
progress within an organization, and build influence.
But the people who just come in, get the the work done in silence
and get out, no one is gonna know.
So it's very important to do to hit all these pillars if you're
trying to build influence. Amazing, amazing.
The experience at PwC is coming in right now.
I used to tell my colleagues at PwC, you guys have been given
the chief code to succeed as a professional, The PwC
professional framework, leadership, technical
competence, thesis acumen, global acumen.
That is the ability to work with cross functional teams and
building relationships. Yeah.
What else do you need? I'd like for you to speak to how
much you appreciate that model and know how you actually
internalize it. Utilize it for your own account
career growth as well. That's exactly what I what I
what I expect and I like the way PwC articulates it.
It's not just the technical competence, it's the
relationship capital. It's being able to work across
service lines, understanding of global, a global perspective.
You cannot go to a client meeting and something really
serious has just happened in the political landscape or in the
economy landscape of the world that people are panicking about
it. And then you just go into the
meeting and you just go, good morning.
Let's jump into the walkthrough. Can you can we at least talk
about what's happening in the world right now?
It's it's very important. We are no robots, right?
I've hardly had a meeting where I went into the meeting and we
just went right into the meat of the matter.
You have to even if you it goes beyond, oh, how are you?
How was your day? How was your weekend?
What even the weekend. There was a war in Iraq and the
person you're speaking with on that call had family in that
country and you know nothing about it.
This is just the most basic way that a global perspective comes
into the picture. You don't know, you might think,
ah, that doesn't concern me. I don't even need to talk about
it. But at the end of the day, when
it comes to a job, you are relating with people and people
face all day every day. If you don't care about the
pressing that you're working with and you just want to get an
outcome out of the person, it's not going to go anywhere.
It's very much it's a people centric business.
You have to care about the people and you cannot care about
the people if all you care about is the technicality of the job
you're doing. You have to be a well-rounded,
balanced professional to succeed in the professional services
space and I'll say in in any career basically.
You know, so some some people you have different types of
leaders, some leaders are people oriented, some others are task
oriented. So I think that is the division
right there. But then the people centric
leaders tend to be more successful than the task centric
leaders. Speaking of the people Fest
leadership. I think.
You think what? Yeah, that's my philosophy.
My philosophy is people first leadership.
I wouldn't say that being a people first leader is what you
should 100% be or be a task central leader is what you
should 100% be. I think great leaders are able
to find a balance. Yes, I'm a people first leader,
but I do realize the times when I have to put my foot on the
ground and say OK giving you enough pass is impacting the
organizations bottom line. If you don't deliver this by
this day, I think it's no longer profitable for the company to
keep keeping you on the paycheck.
I'm capable of doing that even though my people and 1st leader,
so it's very important to know when you have to pull a trigger
or when to not pull a trigger. I consider myself a people first
leader because I tend to really invest more in people.
I think the onus is on the leader to invest in their team.
I feel like a lot of times some people make the mistake of
thinking leadership is a fancy title and people should serve
you. I think the responsibility of
leadership is enormous. It is your responsibility to
understand, at least to an extent, everybody that is a
direct report to you did their different frame of reference how
their live view was. Because we live in a world right
now where in every office, in every team at least, let's say
you have 10 people reporting to you.
And if you wanted to do a survey, this 10 people will
probably have come from 7 different countries.
There be somebody from India, somebody from Nigeria, probably
somebody from Cameroon, somebody from South Africa, there be
somebody from Brazil, there's somebody from Ghana, there be
somebody from Asia. It's, and all of these people
have a different way of seeing things.
They grew up doing things in a certain kind of way.
Your job as a leader is first to understand your people, not to
make your people see things from the way you saw things growing
up. So I tend to do the job of
understanding my people, understanding their frame of
reference, understanding how growing up was for them because
guess what? Different cultures, different
ways of life, different ways of doing things.
And it translates into the workplace.
You'll find that in some cultures you don't speak unless
you're spoken to, especially if you're the junior person.
And then people who come from that kind of culture will
translate that in the workplace in being most often silent.
Even when they're in a team meeting, their contribution will
not be heard because they will be silent.
Two kinds of leaders. One person can say Damilola
never speaks during meetings. I think she's reserved.
I think she's not a team player. I think she doesn't fit into the
team. So I think we are going to
severe this relationship. Another leader is going to say
Damilola hardly speaks. I would like to understand her
thought process and what's going on with her.
And then this leader takes the next step of understanding.
Damilola speaks with Damila. Tell me about growing up.
How is it like working in Nigeria?
And then Damila is going to say, where I come from.
I don't speak to the leader. First.
The leader has to speak to me before I respond.
I don't speak unless I'm spoken to.
And then, then the leader is going to realize in order to get
a contribution out of Damilola, I have to call her out to say
Damilola. I'd like to know what you think.
The next time they have a team huddle, the leader decides to
change the way this meeting is being run.
So instead of saying hi everyone, we are this face of
the project today, I'd like to know what everybody thinks.
And when you say I like to know what everybody thinks, The very
bold and confident people who grew up in environment, they
were encouraged to always speak up who speak up.
And and this other person will not speak up because that's not
their culture. And then you come in this day
after you've really understood what Daminola is, who Daminola
is, you come in and say, OK, hi, everyone.
We are at this phase of the project.
And today I'm going to be going person by person to understand
what your contributions are. I'm going to begin with
Daminola. Daminola, what do you think?
And then now Daminola starts speaking and you realize that
this person is stupidly intelligent and their
contribution is just very sound. Two kind of leaders.
Now this leader is able to to bring this person out of the
shelf. The other leader assumed this
person was not good enough and kicked them out.
So I tend to be the kind of person that do not make very
quick decisions or judgments about the competency of my
people. I get, I first try to meet them
where they're at, understand how they prefer to be communicated
with, understand what power dynamics look like based on
their culture, understand what communication looks like based
on their culture. And I realize that I get more
success with building a high performing team.
That's why I consider myself a people first leader.
However, it does not mean that if I find myself in a situation
where somebody is constantly slacking behind and is beginning
to impact the company's bottom line, I will not make the right
decision. I will.
So I think it's important that mostly that strike a balance
between people and task and take the right decision when it's
necessary. Of course, not too fast, not too
judgmental. Giving people the opportunity
and chances that they really need.
That is reasonable and strike a balance between putting people
1st and helping the company hit their bottom line.
Amazing. Amazing.
You just reminded me of a line from mixed martial arts fighter
Conor McGregor. He says position beats power and
timing beats speed. You know, and that is applicable
to, you know, different areas of life.
Position beats power and timing. You know, big speed is not about
time in the market for timing the markets actually to be a
good trader just as a leader as well.
It's about that balance between the concentration on the people
and the concentration on the task.
It's quite amazing you give this illustration.
Of course, the lady who was on the last episode of this podcast
talked about moving from Nigeria to Ireland.
And you know, she was that kind of person who don't like to
speak up to your meetings. And then she had a run in,
become manager, accused her of doing something and then the
manager reached out to her after the meeting.
I expected you to speak up. And then she was like, no, in my
culture, we don't speak up to authority or elders.
Wow, She said she meeting with the manager, right?
And then the manager spoke to her saying next time you have to
speak up for yourself, right. And she, she learns to, would I
say, act in a more favorable way for herself, because really a
lot of us will come from Africa, tend to have this culture of not
speaking up to say it's humble for you not to speak up, but you
go abroad and then it's a culture shock that you can
actually speak up for yourself. It's it's really, really
amazing. Yeah, a lot of people come here
and it impacts, it impacts us negatively in the workforce.
And I covered a lot of that in quarterback.
Yeah. So when I was writing
quarterback, I had seen a lot of amazing things about not just
the African culture, because I I also think in other parts of
Eastern part of Europe, the culture is the same as the
African culture. And I think Asia, Chinese
culture, that those culture are very huge on respect for the
elder faith hard work when they come to corporate North America.
And it's not just corporate North America because when I
published Quarterback, I had people reaching out to me from
UK, from Australia, telling me that they experience the same
thing. So it's, yeah, it's in most
developed countries, we struggle a lot with getting rewarded in
direct proportion to the work we do.
And that's basically because of our culture and our upbringing.
You get to work, you bury your head, you do the job, you come
back home, you pray, you go to church on Sunday, you know that
God is going to reward you for your work.
But corporate North America is not a church.
Everybody is facing their own self-interest.
And so you really, there's supposed to be a mindset shift.
But for somebody that you've grown in a certain way for over
30 years, 25 years of your life, 18 years of your life, migrated
to a new country, it's hard to begin to unlearn things that
have been ingrained in you for over 10 years, 20 years, 30
years to Start learning a new way.
Some people say, isn't that bragging?
Hell no, it's not bragging. You got the job done.
Exactly how do you talk about the fact that you got the job?
Done exactly you, you know, even for me or the personal notes,
right. So when I say I started this
forecast two years ago, yeah, two years and a few months and
now we're global top 2%. And sometime last year, I think
I was speaking, I think when I first got into the global
rankings, you get into the global top 10%, then you move to
top 5%, top three, top two, top 1.5 and top 1% in the world.
So we, we, we are going for that top 1% this year.
So it's interesting that I was talking about it and then
talking about my experience with KPMG, PwC, you know, looking for
accounts and fans and talking about the fact that I have an
MPA and my mother watched that episode and she was like, that
too much, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
I'm like, nobody's gonna know if you don't blow your trumpet.
And there was another episode with a guy who he's highly
branched, you know, in the world at what he does.
And then he was like, I did my research and you, I see you have
your MBA. I know you.
You'd worked at the B Cross there.
And then my mom was like, oh, wow, I see why you do this
thing. Because really, if you.
Yeah. So that's your mom trying to
read it still? Yeah, yeah, try to reinstall
those African values in you, but you're like, mommy, I'm
operating on the global stage now.
It's not just. Man you.
Have to hold the values close to your heart, but you need to know
what works on what stage. Yeah, because at the global
stage, first thing you reach out to a sponsor, they ask you what
are your numbers? OK, what sets you apart?
So if you don't brag about what you've been able to accomplish,
how would you be able to be compelling, you know, on a
global stage? Exactly.
I think for for for Africans watching us right now, you need
a mindset shift, need a reorientation to, yeah, you can
be humble, right, While still proud of yourself.
So I think our people have a distorted notion of what
humility is. They feel like being humble is
you having, would I say lacking your own self-confidence.
You know, you're not painting yourself as a star, as a
superstar. I.
Think that I think that the watch the phrase there is
confidence. Humility is confidence humility.
So when you talk about your accomplishments, you're not
you're not not being humble. And if you look at it very well,
the people who don't talk about their accomplishment are
probably lacking confidence to talk about it.
You have to bring both together. You have to be confidently
humble. It is your accomplishment.
Tell people about it. They will not know about it and
the reason why you have. To do that.
Is because everybody, yeah, because everybody is facing
their own front. Everybody is trying to create
the next best opportunity for themselves, so it is nobody's
job to go and do a research about you.
Sorry, it's nobody's job to go do research about you.
You're supposed to tell them who you are.
I like that it's nobody's job to go do research about you, the
people first leader. Nobody.
'S job to do, yeah. And you know, this is the age of
AI, you know, where people just act in a way in an ignorant
manner. I tell them she's been.
Do you have GPT? Like do you have any AI to
lawyers for the CES? Can you please just type that in
good English? That question you just you find
the answer. You know, the age of AI has
actually driven a lot of disruption.
And why do you believe people first leadership is is still not
optional, right, but essential for organization also.
Yeah. So why do I believe people first
leadership is not optional? Yes, right now in the in the age
of AI, AI beginning to do many more things.
You call a company, AI is the one talking to you.
You send an e-mail AI response to you.
Have you ever found a safe registration where you're like,
that means connect. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Can I, I don't know. I'm not talking about.
I know you. Yeah.
Like connect to a human. Connect.
Can I really just talk? To I get frustrated, so I get
frustrated. Yes.
And you get you get frustrated. So it's become so important that
companies double down on nurturing those human
relationships because those are the only things that will make a
difference. The human relationships are
going to be the huge differentiators right now.
AI cannot go out for coffee meetings with colleagues.
AI will not build bonding relationships for you with with
your team. AI will not have difficult
conversations with somebody on your team when they lost their
loved 1. So it is very important now more
than ever to double down and develop those skills of
emotional intelligence, cultural intelligence, empathy.
These are all little buckets under the human skills.
So organizations now more than ever need to retrain those in
leadership, those charged with leading other people to be very
apartment with emotional intelligence, empathy, cultural
intelligence. Because right now, where AI can
do almost everything is those organizations that still have
these human values that will have a competitive advantage.
Amazing. I have an episode with Andrew
apart from America, Andrew, it's titled Humans first, AI next,
humans first, AI next. And that's just the way it is
meant to be. So let's talk about risk, right?
A strategic risk and market leadership.
As Alberta's market leader for risk advising, you focus on
balancing eases risk with technology risk.
How come founders and executives position risk management as a
growth accelerator rather than just being a defensive function?
Organizations need to integrate risk into decision making
because if even you look at the world and the way it's rapidly
changing, you can make risk an optional function.
You need the risk enterprise risk management function side by
side with every decision you're making.
Is it like investing? You need to look at the risk.
Is it in hiring? You need to look at the risk.
Is it in considering what AI tool to implement into your
organization? You need to look at the risk
because there's also a risk of confidential data being exposed,
right? So I think organizations don't
need to, yes, organizations don't need to treat risk as that
function that they bring in where something has gone wrong.
It's already too late at that point.
Risk management has to be that function that we begin every
week because risk is embedded in everything we do.
So when you do that, you are actually being proactive and
putting in measures and controls in place to prevent costly
occurrences in the future that could impact your reputation.
Financial losses. I think reputational damage and
financial loss are the two biggest things.
Reputational damage and financial loss that can even
make the business, the company go out of business.
Because if it let's take for example, in a situation going
concerned, let's take for example, in a situation where
it's like a hospital and you, you, you implemented an AI tool
without risk considerations and patient's data is out in the
open. I don't ever see that kind of
hospital coming back into business.
I don't see that happening. OK, goodbye.
So yeah, it cannot be an afterthought.
Yeah, OK, so let's talk about the signals of integrity.
We work closely with boards and audit committees to strengthen
governance. So what are the three non
negotiable credible executive? Sorry, what are the non
negotiable signals of integrity that define credible executive
leadership today? I would say consistency,
transferability, and accountability.
Consistency between what you state as your values out there
and what actually happens inside.
Transparency about both your successes and failures, and
proper accountability leaders who demonstrate these signals.
They build trust with both boards, their employees, and
their stakeholders. Putting it plain and simple,
that's it. So what?
What would you say about being an authentic person?
You know, authenticity is actually very important.
Of course, a lot of people in the corporate world tend to put
up a fake face. The fake it to you make it
character, you know, and it's difficult to keep up with a
character if that is not the true you.
So how do you help individuals in that kind of a position?
So this is quarterback, I don't know if you can see this.
This is quarterback I this is a very interesting question you
just asked because I put a note in here.
I said, I don't know if you can see this.
I said, Nadine, you did this because, you know, this book
became a bestseller 24 hours after its release.
It was unbelievable. But the reason why I brought
this up is, yeah, in chapter, I think in Chapter 9 I spoke about
the power of authenticity, obtaining your identity,
consistency. Transparency.
And accountability are part of authenticity.
I'm going to Chapter 9 now. This is amazing FC.
This is highly aligned. The power of authenticity
Maintain your identity. This is Chapter 9.
The power of authenticity Maintain your identity.
I think it is very important that you are authentic.
Authenticity builds credibility. It helps people to trust you and
it is a first sign of leadership.
They realize that a lot of people in corporate spaces, it's
not, let me not say a lot because what percentage is a
lot? Some people struggle with
authenticity and they, they, they find put themselves in
situations where they have to fit a mold.
They have to talk a certain way, they have to dress a certain
way. I'd like to put out a catch 22
year. There's a difference between
authenticity and making an environment comfortable for
everybody. Let me use a very basic example
to differentiate what I'm saying.
You cannot be working in a team. And the kind of food you eat is
very spicy, a little cooked from the house, a lot of pepper.
And then you come to work, you put it in the microwave and the
smell gets everybody in the office coffee.
And then you keep doing it again and again.
And in your mind you say, well, that's my traditional food.
I have to eat. If the smell of the pepper is
talking, you get out. No, that's wrong.
So you have to be authentic, but not without making an
environment comfortable for everybody to coexist.
You have to be authentic, but you have to be considerate.
Another example is they can't say, OK, today the entire team
is going out to play golf and you say where?
Where I come from, we didn't play golf.
I'm not going to go. That's going to work against
you. You have to be authentic, but
you have to be wise. That's a team burning activity.
You don't know how to do it. Shrub anywhere and clap for the
others who are doing it right. So it's very important to be
authentic, but not at the cost of making an environment
uncomfortable for everybody else to coexist.
Yes, I. Think that is you.
Can be authentic, Yeah, And keep your authenticity.
And it could be something like, well, if this pepper is just too
much and everybody will be coughing in the office, maybe I
should rather just eat this food for dinner and take something
lighter for lunch in the office. Golf is not what I play.
How about I go there because for the team bonding and interact
with everybody else, clap for those who are playing and maybe
take one or two lessons because it's not something I grew up
playing. They should be your negotiables
and non negotiables when it comes to authenticity.
These are my values. I'm a Muslim, I'm a Christian,
nobody's going to force me to become an atheist.
That is black or white. That is not going to impact
anybody's coexistence in the workplace.
Stay true to your faith, but there are some other things that
will clearly impact. It's going to make some people's
chick turn red. Insist to do it, to say, OK,
this is me. Yeah, I'm being authentic.
Let me bring an example for myself.
Most African women are very loudly spoken, overly confident.
That's me. When I walk into a room, I
dominate the room. But I've had a lot of situations
where the people who report to me come to me and say some
that's why you speak to me. I feel scared.
And I'm like, Oh my God, why do you feel scared?
Like, Oh my God, your voice is sometimes loud.
It's very commanding. OK.
Oh, no, I wasn't really trying to shout at you.
So imagine if I said, well, that's the African woman thing.
If you can't take my voice is OK, I'm not going to have
anybody on my team like it or not.
But I have had to learn to tone it down sometimes when depending
on who I'm talking to so that the same message, I'm not
diluting the message can go through and be understood.
Remember, communication is two ways.
You have to say what you're saying, but the other person has
to understand what you're saying.
Now, if you take that authenticity bullshit and put it
at the front and you're like, well, I'm a strong black woman,
I'm gonna speak and scream to the top of my voice.
If you don't get it, you don't get it.
You failed the basic possible communication.
Exactly. The message did not communicate.
The reason why I brought in all of these examples is to say that
you have to be authentic. You have to maintain your
identity, but you have to read the room.
Amazing know when to draw the line but sometimes the line may
not be white or black if I be Gray like they did LinkedIn
photo. Well, OK, so global leadership
patterns right through your involvement in the Commonwealth,
Caribbean, Canada Leaders Dialogue, what patterns have you
observed about leadership excellence across different
economic environment? Nice that across different
economic environments, leadership excellence is defined
by adaptability, clarity of purpose, and respect for local
realities. Leaders who succeed globally
listen first. Sorry, the two.
Years one mouth for user, two years one mouth for.
Exactly, exactly. They listen first before they
prescribe solutions and then they align their strategy with
context rather than imposing uniform approaches.
So I can't leave Canada and go to Jamaica and I say this is how
we do it in Canada, This is how you should do it.
No, you have to have respect for local realities.
You should be able to adapt your leadership style based on the
realities of the localization you're operating in at that
time. And the only way you're gonna
succeed at that is if you listen first.
I was watching this master class about this CIA agent.
I think he worked under Obama and Obama has sent him on a
mission to North Korea to establish a, to establish a
strategic relationship with North Korea.
And so he was talking about, even though I think the primary
thing that they wanted to get out of North Korea, they did not
get, he said that on that mission.
That was the furthest they had gone in any negotiation whatever
with North Korea. And to him, he categorized that
is success and the reason why he categorized that and to him, he
categorized how far they went on that negotiation is success.
And this were the things he did differently when he went there
and he arrived. He didn't just go, OK, I came
for us to talk about this, let's go talk about this.
No, when he met with the minister he was going to meet
with, he accompanied him to the local Korea festivals, he danced
with the people, he went with him to his kids school event,
went to all the monumental places in North Korea.
He digested the culture and the way of life, and he saw that the
more he did that, the more they saw him as somebody who didn't
just come to get what he needed out of a negotiation, but
somebody who cared about the North Korean way of life, about
their values, about their principles.
And because he demonstrated that they were more receptive and
more friendly to him. You see, this goes back to what
I spoke about cultural intelligence and a leader being
the one that has the honors to meet people where they're at.
People are more like you're more likely to get.
Outcomes out of things. When you demonstrate that you
deeply care about the people you're working with beyond just
getting outcomes, even if just getting outcomes is your real
intention, if you don't demonstrate empathy, care, and
respect for their culture, that negotiation is going nowhere.
This is actually a very, very, super amazing illustration.
And then you just reminded me of something that I always tell my
guests, I have only two goals on this podcast.
That is to educate and to motivate.
And if you help me achieve those goals, I'm very happy with you.
So from me to you today, baby niever.
Thank you very much. I'm very happy for, you know,
doing my own job for me. Wow.
So let's talk about your book, your book, the quarterback
framework. Like so the quarterback
metaphor, like that book actually held an under one
position for 90. Why did you choose the
quarterback metaphor to represent the even grand
experience in corporate in North America?
Quarterback represents leadership under pressure.
Think about the qualities of an essential of an elite
quarterback. Pocket presence, composure.
It does not matter if the opponent is winning.
You keep playing undefeated with that undefeated spirit until the
final whistle is blown. Pocket presents.
It does not matter if somebody is shouting at you.
Stay calm. Confidence.
If your opponent is winning, you can't keep your spirit down.
You keep playing like it's a fair field because you know that
even if it's 10 minutes to the end of the game, you can still
emerge the winner. So when you look at the
qualities of an elite quarterback, those are the same
qualities I want the immigrant to possess in corporate North
America. It does not matter how many
times you get fired, you don't come back and say, my goodness,
I've been fired 2 times. I'm never going back to work.
So you keep fighting, you keep, you dust your resume, you go
back out there, you keep applying because trust me, until
the final whistle is blown, which is you're dead.
Nobody has won over you. You need to even remember that.
And with the quarterback mindset, you would know this.
Nobody can sit in a boardroom and make a decision about your
destiny. The worst they can do is say
that you're not a good fit for this company.
But guess what? If you have an undefeated
spirit, 2 weeks later you could be in a better company.
A local champion could be kicking you out and telling you
you're not a good fit for our company, and two weeks later you
are in Google if you didn't let your spirit go down.
So when I was writing quarterback, my goal was to
infuse the qualities of an elite quarterback into the mindset of
the reader. I want you to know that you are
the champion. The quarterback is always
playing in unfamiliar terrains. It's not.
The field that they're playing in is not always a field that
they know naturally. For immigrants, you're already
playing in an unfamiliar terrain.
You left your home country, you're in a new country.
It's an unfamiliar terrain. They gave me stuff, But failure
is not an option. Pocket present.
You wouldn't go to work and your manager scrolls at you and you
scrolled back. You dare not do that.
You know that when you do that. And if you're even black, if you
become an angry black woman, Pocket presents, you stay calm,
even under pressure, even in unpleasant situations, you may
take your teas and your respect because you know that you have
it in you. And if you realize that that's
not an environment, a good environment for you, you walk
away with your head high. Because guess what?
I'm qualified. I'm triple qualified.
I've surmounted a lot of mountains, living a whole new
country, starting life in a whole new other country.
It is not this little thing you're putting in front of me
that's going to make me act out of character.
I'm not going to act out of character.
I won't tarnish my reputation. Because of you, I have a
brighter future ahead of me. There are other fields for me to
play in bigger, bigger games more than this.
So I'm going to walk out of the situation with my head high, my
confidence and everything intact, and I'm going to be
playing in the bigger field 2 weeks later.
So it was very intentional titling the book quarterback and
the strategies that I wrote inside.
Because you are the quarterback of your career.
You are the mastermind. Nobody has the authority to
decide how that career goes except you.
The worst anybody can do is tell you I want you out of my
company, but they have no power to determine how far or how
short your career turns out. Because in your hands, you and
you alone. Basin, your career is in your
hands. And of course, Speaking of elite
level quarterbacks, what are your thoughts are Tom Brady?
Where does the best? The greatest of all time.
Out in the book, yeah, he's the
greatest. Oh wow.
You know, I, I really, really appreciate that guy and what his
views, what he represents. But what being sticks out for me
is the longevity of his career. Like how consistent consistently
hard working, because hard work is not interesting, it is
boring. Nobody likes to work hard, but
I'd love for you to speak to the power of consistency.
Another connecting dot I find between yourself and myself is
that we are African professionals, black African
professionals who have been able to recognize the power of
consistency, right? If you are consistent at
something over for a long period of time, yeah, the results will
be astronomers, the results will be exponential.
So I think about myself for example, starting two years ago,
right, within just two years, making it into the top 2% in the
world. For context, there are over 4
million podcasts in the world and to be in the top 2% amongst
the 4 million it made and being African, right?
And looking at the time, I see people who started in 2020, that
is COVID period. I was not even outside of the
country at the time, DC bar top 5% and you top 2% and people ask
me, oh, how do you get that high?
Look at the body of work. Go look at the body of work and
people see the massive number of episodes, right?
But it has always been every week, every week, every week,
every week. And at the end of two years, you
just see, whoa, so you have this massive body of work, right?
And you know, looking at organizations like Better Help,
Better Help is number one in the world, number one in the world
for online therapy. And they reached out to me and
said we admire your body of work and would like to partner with
you. It was humbling for me, you
know, and I think validation when when you get corporate
validation, it kind of humbles you and makes you feel
appreciated. Like I likely to speak to the
power of consistency, you know, for the young especially.
Young people. You know, listening to us today.
The sacred of your future is hidden in your daily routine and
the word routine is consistent. It's something you do every day,
every day, every day. You are going to get it really,
really wrong when you you think that oh, I'm just going to skip
the workout and then one day I'm not going, I'm just going to
take a setting drug and the weight just goes down.
No, it doesn't happen like that. In order to maintain a healthy
weight, a fit physique and it comes through the daily
consistent workout. It's not going to be 1 grand
gesture, gesture one day that is going to save the day, right?
Same with your career is consistently showing up every
day and consistently doing great work.
It's not one grand gesture one day that's going to make you an
excellent internal auditor or it's going to make you out, but
instant. It doesn't work like that.
So every time when I when I speak with youths,
professionals, I tell them that the secret of your future is
hidden in your daily routine. And that routine, everything
about that routine is consistency is boring.
Yes, it is boring, but you have to wake up and do it every day.
Amazing. I was Speaking of boring.
I remember having to write the professional exams, you know.
Yeah, back in those days, you know, studied every day, studied
every day, and then, you know, get the results.
It's really, really amazing. And it's kind of amazing.
How many kilometers? How many mountains?
How many, you know, seas and oceans we've had to cross to get
to where we are today? Cool.
You did it. You did it.
Oh, they did a rather plus what they did, you know.
And you know, it's something I'd like for you to speak quickly
about the faith aspect because I remember sometime last year I
was speaking with somebody and then I told them, but it's not
possible for me to feel like it is not possible.
Like we got all things are possible.
And did you know the probability, right?
If if a lot of times you wouldn't appreciate the, the
journey of an immigrant, especially the journey of a
black immigrant, right? If you're born in Africa, it
feels like you are not starting life at the point of origin.
You're starting at maybe -5 and you need to beat the odds to get
to the origin. 100. This should be a highlight reel
-100 you know, and then you're from Cameroon or from Nigeria.
Think about how, like, do you know how many accidents go to
save me from. Do you know how easy it is to
lose yourself, to lose your life, you know, in Nigeria or
Cameroon? And then I left there, Yeah,
moved, you know, countries and, you know, promotion after
promotion, denture after adventure.
Come on, you, you're, you're, you have come way too far just
to come this far. Do you ever think that way?
And of course, like what's the role of in your tribe and most
of. I like when you said that you
can never fail. It's impossible to fail and the
reason why that statement is true is because all things work
together for good to them that love the Lord and to those who
are called according to. His purpose?
And so if you believe that Romans 828, you realize that
that two principles hold true. The only thing that counts as
failure in this life is the chances you didn't take and the
chances you took but you gave in your mediocre self.
You didn't do your best, you took it for granted, but as long
as you took the chance and you gave it your best shot, what
comes out of it is the result. Now that result could be what
you want or what you know you'd want but depends on.
Depending on your faith level and your work with God, you are
able to see the message in either result you get.
Definitely you will be expecting a certain outcome in mind right?
A lot of people would think if I don't get the outcome I wanted,
I failed. No, no, you did not fail if you
didn't get the outcome you wanted.
But this was something you put in your best and you did
everything right and you were expecting outcome A.
You got outcome B. God has probably given you what
you need and know what you wanted.
And what you have to do is reframe your mindset and how
you're looking at it. Because chances are, the B you
got instead of the A is what is going to propel you forward,
depending on how you look at it. My greatest breakfast in life
have come from the things that a kind of mind would have seen as
failure, but they were just the best outcome that God wanted for
me. Preach it, preach it.
But it's it's amazing. Do you know what is my favorite
Bible verse? No Philippians chapter 4 verse
13. I can do all things.
Surprises strengthens me. Exactly.
All things. Not some things, not a lot of
things. All things we have to say yes,
yeah, yeah. I love that scripture.
Keep you going. You know, let's talk about
mentorship and financially to racing.
So mentorship is central to your work with Junior Achievement
Southern Alberta. How does teaching financially
Tracy to young people sharpen your strategic decision making
as a corporate leader? You know that anything that you
teach, the knowledge you have of in multiplies I mean CPA.
So definitely yeah, it's I understand finances and taxis
and investment because things that I learned.
However, it is in the teaching of it that my knowledge of it
has been refined and I genuinely enjoy doing it because teaching
young people how to grow money and save money and preserve
money and the tax system and how to take advantage of the tax
system that the tax haven, because this is a company that
is heavily taxed. Sometimes my boys pay up to 40%
in taxes. You need to understand the
things that the government has put in place to give you a tax
breeder, the tax free savings account, the registered
retirement account. If you don't take advantage of
all of these breaks that the government has put in place, all
you're going to do in this country is work and pay taxes.
And so I'm really passionate about helping people gain
financial freedom when I do these things and it helps me in
return. That's that's the gift to gain
part of it. I'm giving, but I'm gaining.
Amazing, amazing. I I love the way you framed it
that you know, if you know something, it sort of like gets
multiplied if you teach and that's another connecting dot
that yourself and myself have. I used to be a teacher, right?
I your CPA. I'm an ACA, so I taught
corporate reporting, financial reporting, financial accounting
for the professional students writing their professional
exams. And it's amazing the exponential
way in which I was able to understand the concepts.
Of course, it's one thing to study and pass exams on your own
is another thing for you to study for the purpose of
impacting that knowledge on another person.
And even when you're in the classroom, questions that
different individuals ask you make you see things from
different lenses, different perspectives, and it broadens
your horizon. It's a, it's a really, really
amazing thing to be a teacher, right?
So relationships and alignment, right?
You often say the quality of our lives depends on the quality of
our relationships. So how do you intentionally
evaluate and elevate your professional circle to ensure
alignment with your Fortune 100 CEO goal?
The quality of our lives depend on the quality of our
relationships. It goes down to people.
People are more likely to give opportunities to people that
they like and trust, not who is most competent.
People are more likely to work with people that they like and
trust, not who check the box on every qualification that was
mentioned on the job advert. So the most important capital is
your relationship capital. The most important currency you
have is your relationship currency.
And so for me, I don't take that lightly.
I do the work of investing into my relationships, the
relationships I want to keep. It's a lot of work to maintain
relationships, so you can't go having relationship with
everybody because you. Yeah, that's honest to all.
You can't go around have a relationship with everybody, you
know. It sounds more like the robotic
relationship, Yeah. That's not what I'm talking
about. That's not what I'm talking
about. Like.
Even let me interrupt you a bit. Let me interrupt you a bit.
I remember in London, this girl from Hungary, and then she was
telling me I want a relationship.
I want a relationship. I think, I think I'm having when
I say flashbacks it, it, it was like at a social event and you
know, with the accent. I want a relationship, want a
relation. Oh.
My God, Oh my God. You're telling me you can't keep
having relationship up or down? Maybe I should tell that person
you can't have relationship. No, no, you can't.
You can't. You can't just, it's at the end
of the day, it's gonna be very shallow, right.
And yeah, identify. Yourself in.
There's going to be. Don't spread yourself in there's
going to be close friends that going there's going to be
acquaintances, there's going to be professional networks.
You, you, you have to define for yourself how frequently you want
to keep contact with each of these buckets.
Maybe professional network. You want to say, hey, can we
grab a coffee every once in six months?
Because you know that in a professional space, these
relationships are very important, right That closely.
These are the ones where you can be calling on WhatsApp and you
guys are just gisting everyday. That's not what we're talking
about. I think now we are really
focused on maintaining the professional relationships.
It's very important to for the professional relationships you
want to maintain, even if it's a once a year coffee meeting, to
just sit and talk about how the year has been.
My very first employer in Canada 12 years ago, I think she was
the person who gave me my first years and then referred me to EY
12 years later without working there.
She and I have a coffee meeting January of every year just to
talk about how is life going, how's your career going?
Any areas you need advice from me?
Yeah, and once a year. And it is still a very solid
relationship. So to preserve a relationship,
you don't have to talk to them every day or go out with them
every month. It can be once a year or once
it's six months, but it could be a very quality one hour.
Just don't make relationships transactional that you're only
reaching out to somebody at a point where, oh, you're out of
job and you need another job and that's when you have to speak
with them. Nourish the relationships
throughout so that it's not a transactional something.
I think relationships should not be transactional.
Yeah, I totally agree with that. I totally, totally agree with
that. And of course, Speaking of, you
know, quality relationships, myself and yourself, we're able
to connect due to a quality relationship with our virtual
friend. So big shout out to Damilola if
you're watching this baby, they have the podcast today and
you're going to move to the rapid fire ground.
Are you ready to rumble? Let us go, let us go.
So I'm going to ask you 5 questions.
Just tell me what comes to your mind real quick and wrap it up.
So number one is the legacy metric.
So when you step into a Fortune 100 CEO bro, what is the first
structural change you will make to define the workplace of the
future? Our embed leadership development
coming into the core strategy with the focus on people first
leadership and striking the balance.
Amazing, amazing. It means first AI debt.
So #2 question the growth catalyst.
So what is 1 overlooked technology risk that leaders are
underestimated right now? Lastly.
Ethical governance of AI? None of it.
That, yeah, yeah, I appreciate that.
I appreciate that it's something that we have spoken on on this
show multiple times. And really for you articulating
it that way, I think you need, you deserve maybe in the next
Grammys would have a Nadine Niba with a nomination for the next
Rabbits. So, the essential assets beyond
your CPA and NBA, what single skill has generated the greatest
return in your career? Strategic visibility.
Amazing. Yeah, I love that.
I love that. You know, because when I think
about it, NBA, you have an AB as well.
I'm an ACA year CPA, Yeah, but the green economics as well.
But I think about to be what has really even me the greatest
returns has been relationship building.
It's not just about the credentials.
Yeah, it's about the relationships that you build a
lot the way. So let's talk about the
immigrant edge. What cultural value from
Cameroon do you protect fiercely in North American boardrooms?
Community. Amazing, amazing.
So I've. Never had a word.
You know, we, we, we grew up in a very communal.
The lifestyle back home is very communal.
Yeah. Very, very, Yeah, Highly,
highly. And even in corporate spaces, I
haven't dropped that part of me. And, you know, it's amazing what
we can do with technology these days.
You can also strengthen the bond of a community by leveraging our
technology tools to close feasible gaps.
So the final word If your lifes work were distilled into one
sentence for the next generation of leaders, what would?
One sentence for the next generation of leader.
Let's see of the rest of your life depends on the quality of
your relationship. Amazing you.
I keep saying this even at the experts.
Sounded like a broken record. But the fortunate and
unfortunate it is that it is 100% true, no lies told.
Yes, 100% true, no lies told. You know, this, it's, it's good
to always have, you know, sayings that you leave by or you
can even die by, right? And you keep repeating it.
It's amazing. I, I mentor like a group of
podcasters, right? And it's, it's crazy when you're
a pacesetter. As a Black person, I've been
privileged to mentor guys in the top 5% and two guys in the top
10% and one of them stole my life.
That I always tell people, and this is my authentic life.
You know? Alice say gratitude is good.
What's that? Please tell me.
Gratitude is good attitude, Yeah.
And when a person shares the time with you, they share their
life with you because the SI units were measuring life this
time. So thank you very much, Nadine,
for sharing your life and your time with me today on The
Kingdom's podcast and Diary of a CFO.
And for me, it is goodbye to the guys, right?
But guys, what's up, what's up? Watch our ads, you know what it
has on YouTube and Spotify. And always go for something in
your lives, right? Conceive belief, strive to
thrive and achieve. Lady Niba, do you want to leave
a shout out to anybody or do you have any last words before you
say goodbye? My last words to you is the
secret of your future is hidden in your daily routine, so stay
consistent. I'm amazing.
I love that. I love that I love that I love
that, I love that. I love that Consistency is a
weapon, and I like to say I weaponize consistency.
So you've heard it from me, you've heard it from the game.
So guys go out there and put in the work.
So it's goodbye from me, and of course it's goodbye from Dating
Bieber. Bye.