1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,440 You've moved from being the internal face of finance to the 2 00:00:03,440 --> 00:00:06,760 external face. That's a big, big shift, OK. 3 00:00:06,800 --> 00:00:09,560 You're then the person that's supposed to have all the answers 4 00:00:09,600 --> 00:00:12,440 as far as the board's concerned, as far as customers are 5 00:00:12,440 --> 00:00:16,320 concerned, the CEO stand to rely on you a lot. 6 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:19,520 So it is a lonely place. Before we dive back into today's 7 00:00:19,520 --> 00:00:20,960 conversation, I want to share something important. 8 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:23,040 This episode includes a pay partnership with Better Help, a 9 00:00:23,080 --> 00:00:24,800 platform designed to make starting therapy easier. 10 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:26,680 I know from my own journey as a leader and entrepreneur that 11 00:00:26,680 --> 00:00:27,840 life can sometimes feel overwhelming. 12 00:00:28,040 --> 00:00:29,640 There are seasons, severe stress, uncertainty, and 13 00:00:29,640 --> 00:00:31,760 pressure viewed up, and you need a safe space to process it all 14 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:34,240 that severe therapy comes in. Therapy isn't only for people 15 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:36,880 facing clinical challenges. It's the space to reflect, grow, 16 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:39,480 and find better ways to manage stress, relationships, and ethno 17 00:00:39,480 --> 00:00:41,360 goals. It takes courage to seek help, 18 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:43,360 but it's also one of the smartest investments you can 19 00:00:43,360 --> 00:00:44,680 make in your mental and emotional well-being. 20 00:00:44,760 --> 00:00:46,400 That's why I'm proud to highlight Better Help. 21 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:48,680 With Better Help, you see if you are a short questionnaire and 22 00:00:48,680 --> 00:00:50,760 get matched to the credential therapist in just a couple of 23 00:00:50,760 --> 00:00:52,080 days. If the first match doesn't feel 24 00:00:52,080 --> 00:00:54,160 like the right field, you can easily switch therapist at no 25 00:00:54,160 --> 00:00:56,080 actual cost until you find someone who should connect with 26 00:00:56,080 --> 00:00:57,200 you. Inside the platform, you also 27 00:00:57,200 --> 00:00:58,920 find tools like journaling and group sessions on different 28 00:00:58,920 --> 00:01:00,080 topics that can support your growth. 29 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:02,720 And with over 7000 reviews, 10 of 4.5 trust valid reason. 30 00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:04,440 Better Help is a platform you can rely on. 31 00:01:04,440 --> 00:01:06,720 So if you feel like you benefit from talking to a therapist, 32 00:01:06,720 --> 00:01:10,120 visit betterhelp.com/kingjames. That's betterhelp.com/kingjames 33 00:01:10,120 --> 00:01:12,040 to get 10% off your first month of therapy. 34 00:01:12,040 --> 00:01:13,920 Once again, this is OK partnership with Better Help and 35 00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:15,440 I encourage you to take that first step. 36 00:01:15,440 --> 00:01:17,160 If you've been thinking about it, sometimes the best 37 00:01:17,160 --> 00:01:25,210 investment you can make easy. Yourself Welcome to the King 38 00:01:25,210 --> 00:01:28,930 Dems Podcast, where we share the stories of extraordinary people 39 00:01:28,930 --> 00:01:32,130 and dissect hot, relevant topics that shape our world. 40 00:01:32,490 --> 00:01:35,170 From visionary leaders to trailblazing creatives, we 41 00:01:35,170 --> 00:01:38,530 uncover the mindset, strategy, and grit behind greatness. 42 00:01:38,770 --> 00:01:42,050 Whether it's business, culture, or personal growth, we ask the 43 00:01:42,050 --> 00:01:44,490 real questions. This isn't just conversation, 44 00:01:44,490 --> 00:01:48,050 it's transformation. The Kingdom's podcast, Your Next 45 00:01:48,050 --> 00:01:51,840 Breakthrough, starts here. Licensing Reimagined. 46 00:01:55,680 --> 00:01:58,520 Hi, ladies and gentlemen, and once again welcome to the 47 00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:02,360 Kingdom's podcast and Diary of a CFO. 48 00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:07,720 And today I've got one be a very important guest, Barton out of 49 00:02:07,720 --> 00:02:11,680 Newcastle, United Kingdom. Mcwalken, Kevin. 50 00:02:11,720 --> 00:02:18,720 Agro CFO Champion Appleby, how are you today? 51 00:02:19,520 --> 00:02:22,560 We're jumping into a boxing ring at a mola. 52 00:02:22,760 --> 00:02:26,120 Yeah, with an interject like that, should I have some some 53 00:02:26,120 --> 00:02:29,120 inspiring music playing behind me as I walk into the ring? 54 00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:33,400 Let's go, let's go. You know, I'm a martial artist, 55 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:36,880 you know, as well as a fight and expert. 56 00:02:37,560 --> 00:02:40,720 And the interesting thing is that life is a fight. 57 00:02:40,920 --> 00:02:43,600 Life is actually a fight. We, we have to fight a lot of 58 00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:47,240 factors, you know, even business, you should know that 59 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:49,920 you've been a business for years and you've had to fight a lot of 60 00:02:49,920 --> 00:02:53,000 wars and you know a lot of battles. 61 00:02:53,000 --> 00:02:56,440 And that is why you are inspiring the world, you're 62 00:02:56,440 --> 00:03:00,160 inspiring the next generation of CFOs and that is why you're 63 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:03,640 highly appreciated. Of course, you've fought many 64 00:03:03,640 --> 00:03:07,280 battles and of course, not what everything, but we've won the 65 00:03:07,280 --> 00:03:11,600 important ones in order to be where you are today, and you'll 66 00:03:11,600 --> 00:03:15,080 highly appreciate it. So I'm going to read your intro, 67 00:03:15,280 --> 00:03:19,480 especially curated for you. Today we are joined by Kevin 68 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:22,960 Appleby, powerhouse in the financial chip space. 69 00:03:23,320 --> 00:03:27,440 Kevin is the Head of Partnerships at Growth CFO, host 70 00:03:27,440 --> 00:03:31,320 of the Growth CFO Show Forecast and a mentor to finance leaders 71 00:03:31,640 --> 00:03:34,840 navigating the fast changing world of technology. 72 00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:39,160 A career spanning consulting, transformation coaching and 73 00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:44,320 fractional CFO leadership, Kevin has helped countless finance 74 00:03:44,320 --> 00:03:49,360 leaders move from isolation to E July, from numbers to strategy. 75 00:03:49,880 --> 00:03:53,920 On this episode of Indians podcast and directors, CFO will 76 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:57,400 dive into the mindset shift strategies and stories behind 77 00:03:57,400 --> 00:04:00,840 his journey and uncover the practical wisdom he shares with 78 00:04:00,840 --> 00:04:04,280 leaders around the world. Ladies and gentlemen on today 79 00:04:04,840 --> 00:04:12,360 Walker, Kevin, Mr. Go, CFO. Adam, thank you hugely for 80 00:04:12,360 --> 00:04:13,720 having me as a guest on the show. 81 00:04:14,000 --> 00:04:16,440 Really excited to be there. Be here today. 82 00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:20,920 That was a good introduction. AI wrote that very well for you. 83 00:04:21,200 --> 00:04:25,000 I am AI tati Mullah ICMS So what do you expect? 84 00:04:25,320 --> 00:04:27,200 Like trends knew the assignments. 85 00:04:27,840 --> 00:04:29,560 They knew what they were doing with that name. 86 00:04:29,880 --> 00:04:33,680 Yeah, they kept it a secret. So they just did not want, you 87 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:36,120 know, to be so open. That's why they did not need me. 88 00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:38,600 Artificial intelligence, they said, let's code it, let's code 89 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:40,240 it. You know, in more than 30 years, 90 00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:43,480 people will understand. And of course I love my initials 91 00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:47,480 AI so. Initial AI The future is yours. 92 00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:52,880 The future is yours, Alamola. The future is by and of course, 93 00:04:52,880 --> 00:04:55,640 you know, when I see people get angry and say, oh, AI is coming 94 00:04:55,640 --> 00:04:58,240 for our jobs. AI, I'm not coming for your jobs 95 00:04:58,240 --> 00:05:00,240 guys. I am here to assist you. 96 00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:04,960 AI is going to be an assistant, you know, not a not a 97 00:05:04,960 --> 00:05:09,680 controller, not a people's jobs. We are helping people to become 98 00:05:09,680 --> 00:05:14,080 more efficient so you can have a better quality of life and focus 99 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:17,640 on the major things, you know, major on the major and minor on 100 00:05:17,640 --> 00:05:20,000 the minor. And how do you do that by 101 00:05:20,000 --> 00:05:22,640 achieving efficiency. What does AI come to help to 102 00:05:22,640 --> 00:05:25,920 achieve as a human race? Efficiency at first, that is me 103 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:30,840 to the world at AI. So our let's delve into your 104 00:05:30,840 --> 00:05:32,280 journey and of course your mindset. 105 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:36,160 That's something I'd love to say that when you're employing a 106 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:38,720 person on your team, you need to look at three things, right? 107 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:42,760 You need to look at the mindset or the skill set and then the 108 00:05:42,760 --> 00:05:46,120 tool set. So if the mindset is right, you 109 00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:49,360 can train the skill sets and of course, the skill sets are 110 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:51,960 right. If you provide them with the 111 00:05:51,960 --> 00:05:55,640 right tool set, they will definitely excel at whatever it 112 00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:59,600 is that they do. Or Kevin, you've had to had a 113 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:04,160 fascinating caviar, you know, from TWC bullshit that PwC 114 00:06:04,160 --> 00:06:09,360 background right to IBM to bushel to EDF and a personnel, 115 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:12,520 our growth CFO. So what mindset shifts you know 116 00:06:12,520 --> 00:06:15,600 have actually defined your journey from being a consultant 117 00:06:16,240 --> 00:06:20,080 to being a mentor, coach and a person thought leader for? 118 00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:24,000 And the journey actually goes further back than that, Adam. 119 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:29,120 I'd, I'd already been spent three years of BDO qualifying to 120 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:31,960 be a chartered accountant, then ten years in the chemical 121 00:06:31,960 --> 00:06:38,760 industry before I joined PwC. But yeah, 25 years as a 122 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:45,000 management consultant with PPWCIBM and Michelle and then as 123 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:47,080 an independent consult by myself. 124 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:51,600 So lots of mind shifts have taken place along the way. 125 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:55,880 Journey from consulting to mentor and thought leader for 126 00:06:55,880 --> 00:06:58,840 CFOs. Like most of my career, it kind 127 00:06:58,840 --> 00:07:01,120 of happened by accident. Wow. 128 00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:04,480 People, people talk about planning a career. 129 00:07:05,360 --> 00:07:09,360 Problem is, you can probably see what's ahead for I'll use the 130 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:11,680 phrase the next 100 days because I love that phrase. 131 00:07:11,680 --> 00:07:13,920 But where do you want to be in three years time? 132 00:07:14,720 --> 00:07:17,160 You can give some sort of vague answer, but. 133 00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:18,960 Do you want to know? I want to be in three years 134 00:07:18,960 --> 00:07:24,720 time? Yeah, I want to be in 2020. 8 135 00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:28,080 That's probably a good answer. That's about as good as you get. 136 00:07:28,080 --> 00:07:31,200 3 as time you've been in 2028. But that's the whole point. 137 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:39,840 No, 2019 I'd I'd left full time consultancy, I was working 138 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:43,200 independently, but working actually with a, a bunch of guys 139 00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:46,360 who I knew back from PwC who'd formed their own consulting 140 00:07:46,360 --> 00:07:49,920 practice and we're working on a pretty big project. 141 00:07:49,920 --> 00:07:53,200 And along came this thing called COVID. 142 00:07:56,400 --> 00:08:00,520 We, we were working with the British police forces doing 143 00:08:00,520 --> 00:08:02,240 something called transforming forensics. 144 00:08:02,240 --> 00:08:06,560 It was a fascinating project. It was a huge project but I 145 00:08:06,560 --> 00:08:09,880 remember well my last face to face meeting with the client 146 00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:11,760 team. We couldn't just couldn't meet 147 00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:16,160 beyond one stage and for various reasons our involvement project 148 00:08:16,160 --> 00:08:19,640 was was tapering down anyway. But COVID was the end of it. 149 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:26,000 And I remember stopping off at a branch of Costa Coffee because I 150 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:28,680 had some time to go before I need to get to the next place. 151 00:08:28,680 --> 00:08:32,840 And a guy called Dan Wells been stalking me on LinkedIn and the 152 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:34,840 messages are going through, Oh, Kevin, I'm doing this thing 153 00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:36,960 called Grow CFO, give me a phone call. 154 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:39,840 And I did started speaking to Dan and one thing led to 155 00:08:39,840 --> 00:08:42,720 another. And Grow CFO ended up being my 156 00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:46,080 main involvement across COVID when it couldn't do anything 157 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:50,760 else. And beyond COVID now, if we'd 158 00:08:50,760 --> 00:08:56,080 sat down on New Year's Day 2020 and said, where do you want to 159 00:08:56,080 --> 00:08:59,760 be in three years time, Kevin? Well, I'd never met Dan. 160 00:08:59,760 --> 00:09:04,080 I'd never heard a gross CFO. Certainly nobody got any idea 161 00:09:04,080 --> 00:09:06,120 what this COVID thing was coming around the corner. 162 00:09:06,560 --> 00:09:09,800 So how on earth can you plan for three years ahead? 163 00:09:12,040 --> 00:09:15,680 All that I knew as I was going to 2020 was I'd started teaching 164 00:09:15,680 --> 00:09:18,640 in the classroom because a big thing of mine is to to give 165 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:20,480 things back to the next generation. 166 00:09:20,600 --> 00:09:23,160 And I suppose that's the mindset that's key here. 167 00:09:24,160 --> 00:09:28,200 I, I really do want to give something back to the next 168 00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:31,760 generation. I'd go to 2020. 169 00:09:32,120 --> 00:09:34,640 I was doing things in the classroom that no, I can reach 170 00:09:34,640 --> 00:09:37,520 out to more people if I take some of this training and put it 171 00:09:37,520 --> 00:09:42,760 online. COVID coming along forced me to 172 00:09:42,760 --> 00:09:45,040 do that. I ended up doing it as part of 173 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:48,800 gross CFO because I saw that Dan and I working together had much 174 00:09:48,800 --> 00:09:50,440 more power than us working separately. 175 00:09:50,560 --> 00:09:53,800 But no, really all the way through, it's been this idea of 176 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:56,760 I want to give back to the next generation. 177 00:09:57,320 --> 00:09:59,960 And a lot of the things I was doing in the classroom were all 178 00:09:59,960 --> 00:10:04,440 about that experience of being out on a consulting assignment 179 00:10:04,440 --> 00:10:08,640 and doing things for the client, asking the client's finance team 180 00:10:08,640 --> 00:10:12,480 for information and to answer questions and so on that they 181 00:10:12,840 --> 00:10:14,880 you couldn't easily answer. And then you'd go off as a 182 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:17,760 consultant, You'd apply your skills that came from activity 183 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:21,920 based costing, 0 based budgeting and so on to work out what 184 00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:25,480 things cost, where you could save money to match costs and 185 00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:28,040 revenues. Things that I believe should be, 186 00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:31,200 it should have been a natural skill to a commercial finance 187 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:34,240 team, but so rarely found at the client. 188 00:10:34,240 --> 00:10:37,920 So I ended up teaching folk how to do that sort of stuff in the 189 00:10:37,920 --> 00:10:41,560 classroom. Wow, interesting stuff. 190 00:10:41,880 --> 00:10:46,480 You know, it's the different level of understanding and 191 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:49,160 knowledge for me to be a teacher. 192 00:10:49,280 --> 00:10:52,680 I did teach professional accounts and students and I 193 00:10:52,680 --> 00:10:57,520 think I still feel blessed by that involvement in teaching 194 00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:01,880 over time because he made me become a very well founded 195 00:11:02,320 --> 00:11:05,600 professional and not just being, well, kind of professional, 196 00:11:06,040 --> 00:11:11,160 having that problem solving mindset, you know, And in 197 00:11:11,160 --> 00:11:13,400 economics, I learned that money is a store of value. 198 00:11:14,040 --> 00:11:20,320 And when you provide value to people, you won't in turn get 199 00:11:20,360 --> 00:11:24,240 value. So you are a very high value 200 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:27,600 person, right? And the whole journey from 201 00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:33,720 teaching to consulting has had just one common denominator even 202 00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:37,800 into thought leadership, right? That is solving people's 203 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:42,320 pinpoints, right? So what's your quick advice for, 204 00:11:42,520 --> 00:11:46,560 you know, intending CFOs, you know, junk up and coming 205 00:11:46,560 --> 00:11:50,920 professionals in terms of that growth mindset, I love the name 206 00:11:50,920 --> 00:11:53,520 of the show, growth CFO. And when you look at the name of 207 00:11:53,520 --> 00:11:56,720 my show, it has the title and of course the subtitle. 208 00:11:56,720 --> 00:12:00,520 The subtitle is growth mindset, leadership, AI and business 209 00:12:00,520 --> 00:12:03,160 insights. Of course, it very much fits 210 00:12:03,160 --> 00:12:06,600 into my philosophy. That is the growth that the 211 00:12:06,600 --> 00:12:10,000 mindset, the skill set and the tool set. 212 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:14,000 So from that framework, what's your advice to the young up and 213 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:16,400 coming generation? What kind of mindset should they 214 00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:18,480 adopt? What kind of skill sets should 215 00:12:18,480 --> 00:12:20,640 they look at developing? And of course, what kind of tool 216 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:23,920 sets should they look to utilize? 217 00:12:25,440 --> 00:12:27,920 Right, Tool Sets is the easy one. 218 00:12:28,280 --> 00:12:31,840 Don't worry about tool sets because what works today won't 219 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:34,960 work tomorrow and especially with AI coming along, you're 220 00:12:34,960 --> 00:12:37,840 going to have to be incredibly agile and move from tool to 221 00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:39,560 tool. The only advice I'd give the 222 00:12:39,560 --> 00:12:42,920 upcoming CFO is don't. Do not get stuck in the the 223 00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:45,320 past. You've got to keep looking and 224 00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:47,000 moving forward with the tool set. 225 00:12:47,640 --> 00:12:52,080 Skill set. Well skill set is really 226 00:12:52,080 --> 00:12:55,480 important. You will learn a certain set of 227 00:12:55,480 --> 00:13:01,760 skills to pass your exams. You learn another set of skills 228 00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:05,640 as you rise up through the finance function and have to do 229 00:13:05,640 --> 00:13:09,080 the various things that you would do within a business to to 230 00:13:09,080 --> 00:13:11,720 run finance. But there's there's a point 231 00:13:11,720 --> 00:13:18,000 where you switch from being a finance leader internally to 232 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:21,200 becoming ACFO. You switch from being the 233 00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:25,120 internal face of finance to being the external face of 234 00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:29,000 finance, and that means you've got to develop the right skills 235 00:13:29,000 --> 00:13:30,800 to be able to do that. A lot of that's about 236 00:13:30,800 --> 00:13:34,640 communication. It's about a communication, it's 237 00:13:34,640 --> 00:13:38,320 about a commercial mindset, it's about understanding where the 238 00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:41,520 other person's coming from. You will probably used as as 239 00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:44,200 head of finance to still having your nose in an Excel 240 00:13:44,200 --> 00:13:48,320 spreadsheet to producing a lot of the numbers yourself and to 241 00:13:48,320 --> 00:13:51,840 then be working as a a business partner with the rest of the 242 00:13:51,840 --> 00:13:56,200 business team. You move to CFO, you're copilot 243 00:13:56,200 --> 00:14:01,920 to the CEO, you are working with the investors, you're working 244 00:14:01,920 --> 00:14:05,560 with customers, you're working with suppliers, you may well 245 00:14:05,560 --> 00:14:09,960 have the bank to talk to. And the last thing you're 246 00:14:09,960 --> 00:14:12,000 probably doing is crunching the numbers yourself. 247 00:14:12,000 --> 00:14:16,000 And you really are stepping outside of your comfort zone and 248 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:22,920 you've got to learn to live with certain degree of discomfort as 249 00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:24,800 you do that. And that's when mindset, I 250 00:14:24,800 --> 00:14:27,040 think, becomes then very, very important. 251 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:34,800 We ask CFOs to be master of so many things these days that it's 252 00:14:34,800 --> 00:14:38,560 almost impossible to have all the skills you need. 253 00:14:38,600 --> 00:14:42,400 But having the right mindset helps you through. 254 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:46,240 The biggest challenge to a new CFO is probably impostor 255 00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:51,240 syndrome. It's probably lack of confidence 256 00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:56,200 and it's probably task overwhelm because you've you've probably 257 00:14:56,200 --> 00:15:00,400 not gone through there that process that delegates a lot of 258 00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:02,880 stuff that you should delegate. You're still very hands on 259 00:15:02,880 --> 00:15:05,840 yourself, yet you've got to be more hands off. 260 00:15:05,840 --> 00:15:08,440 So you've got thinking space and can advise the business. 261 00:15:09,120 --> 00:15:12,720 So mindset skill set, they're very strongly related. 262 00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:16,640 You've got to be in a position to constantly learn. 263 00:15:17,760 --> 00:15:22,800 The mindset has to be that that says I can do this, I just need 264 00:15:22,800 --> 00:15:28,920 to go and acquire the skills. I could do this because it just 265 00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:30,880 speaks to my favorite Bible verse. 266 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:33,800 Absolutely, absolutely. I can do all things. 267 00:15:34,000 --> 00:15:39,640 If you're open to picking up the skills, you're open to asking 268 00:15:39,640 --> 00:15:42,320 for help when necessary, asking for support. 269 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:45,320 And one of my big things is gratitude. 270 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:49,440 Be thankful for what you've got and the resources. 271 00:15:49,440 --> 00:15:54,360 And I'm thankful every day that I've been given all the 272 00:15:54,360 --> 00:15:56,680 resources I need and all the time I need to deliver my 273 00:15:56,680 --> 00:15:59,040 mandate. Gratitude is good attitude. 274 00:16:00,120 --> 00:16:03,080 Yeah, yeah. So long answer to a simple 275 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:06,200 question there. Thank you very much. 276 00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:11,200 You know, sometimes you need that long walk to feed up in the 277 00:16:11,200 --> 00:16:15,120 words of Nelson Mandela. So you talk about loneliness of 278 00:16:15,120 --> 00:16:18,920 a CFO seat. We often talk about how lonely 279 00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:22,400 the CFO world can E. Why do you think many finance 280 00:16:22,400 --> 00:16:26,040 leaders struggle in silence? And how can communities like 281 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:33,520 Grow CFO change that pattern? You've moved from being the 282 00:16:33,600 --> 00:16:36,320 internal face of finance to the external face. 283 00:16:37,000 --> 00:16:41,360 That's a big, big shift. OK, You're then the person 284 00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:43,760 that's supposed to have all the answers as far as the board's 285 00:16:43,760 --> 00:16:48,560 concerned, as far as customers are concerned, the CEO stand to 286 00:16:48,560 --> 00:16:52,640 rely on you a lot. So it is a lonely place. 287 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:56,720 Chances are you've got, if you're in that position of being 288 00:16:56,720 --> 00:16:59,960 part of a scale up, chances are you've got a fairly small team 289 00:16:59,960 --> 00:17:03,960 around you. You might not have a really 290 00:17:04,200 --> 00:17:07,960 strong #2 you may have somebody who's very good at doing the, 291 00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:11,359 the financial controllership sort of things, but are they 292 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:15,240 necessarily the commercial person that you need to bounce 293 00:17:15,240 --> 00:17:18,359 ideas off? And that's where the issue 294 00:17:18,359 --> 00:17:20,280 starts. Actually, it's one one of the 295 00:17:20,280 --> 00:17:24,160 reasons behind Gross CFO taking off in the 1st place. 296 00:17:25,520 --> 00:17:28,440 Dan Wells, founder. Dan was an equity partner in 297 00:17:28,440 --> 00:17:34,960 KPMG and he was talking on a daily basis to KPMG clients who 298 00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:39,240 were CFOs of scale UPS and he was finding repeatedly that 299 00:17:39,240 --> 00:17:41,760 every CFO was talking to had the same problems. 300 00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:45,200 And one of the concepts behind Grow CFO in the 1st place was 301 00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:48,800 the idea that if you could just get these CFOs talking to each 302 00:17:48,800 --> 00:17:53,080 other, they wouldn't have help to solve each other's problems. 303 00:17:53,600 --> 00:17:57,680 It's about networking, sharing experiences, sharing what works, 304 00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:01,360 what doesn't work, or just play, brainstorming what we've got to 305 00:18:01,360 --> 00:18:05,600 do. And that was born out as well in 306 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:09,960 the very early days of Grow CFO, we found ourselves very quickly 307 00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:14,520 in lockdown, lots of CFOs wondering what to do, how do we 308 00:18:14,520 --> 00:18:18,000 survive, how do we claim this grant that grant, how do we 309 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:19,720 replan what the business is doing? 310 00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:24,040 And we started something in Grow CFO called the Situation Room. 311 00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:27,040 Literally, we just advertised that, hey, we're going to run 312 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:28,600 this thing called the Situation Room. 313 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:32,080 Friday lunchtime, we're going to switch the Zoom cameras on. 314 00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:34,720 Here's the here's the link to join in. 315 00:18:35,680 --> 00:18:37,600 Come along and let's have a chat. 316 00:18:37,840 --> 00:18:41,360 Literally, that's how we started networking Grow CFO. 317 00:18:41,360 --> 00:18:45,080 We built a community up very quickly of people who just plain 318 00:18:45,080 --> 00:18:49,400 wanted to come along and talk and find out from other CFOs 319 00:18:49,840 --> 00:18:52,640 what on earth they were doing at the moment about all these 320 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:54,760 problems that had suddenly come along out of nowhere. 321 00:18:57,400 --> 00:18:59,240 Wow. That's the power of community. 322 00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:01,280 The power of community is very, very strong. 323 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:03,520 Yeah, I come from the city, takes a village to raise a 324 00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:05,640 child. And of course, businesses are 325 00:19:05,640 --> 00:19:10,120 like our children. We are what I say our 326 00:19:10,120 --> 00:19:12,800 brainchild. And yeah, it takes a lot to to 327 00:19:12,800 --> 00:19:15,520 view them. And it's honestly to the right 328 00:19:15,520 --> 00:19:20,960 ecosystem of our right minded individuals, right minded 329 00:19:20,960 --> 00:19:25,000 individuals, individuals with a good mindset, with the right 330 00:19:25,000 --> 00:19:28,520 skill set. And of course, utilize the right 331 00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:32,080 tool sets. So our Speaking of the rules 332 00:19:32,080 --> 00:19:36,800 here for ecosystem, are you able to tell us you know what makes 333 00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:40,720 it more than just a network? Like how does it empower the 334 00:19:40,720 --> 00:19:45,480 CFOs through collaborations, the technology adoptions, the 335 00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:48,280 leadership support? Like what are the nitty features 336 00:19:48,560 --> 00:19:53,400 that makes you different from just the regular community that 337 00:19:53,400 --> 00:19:56,200 just sits and talks, right? Because I have a very big 338 00:19:56,200 --> 00:19:58,880 program with no are too much talking. 339 00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:02,120 See, talk is cheap and a lot of people in this age of time 340 00:20:02,280 --> 00:20:07,080 suffer from something alcohol paralysis by analysis, right? 341 00:20:07,280 --> 00:20:12,320 They absorb a lot of education, but they lack implementation. 342 00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:16,440 So for me, I feel like success comes when you have the 343 00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:19,400 execution or the implementation of the education. 344 00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:22,640 Right. Then, yeah, have results. 345 00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:24,960 So I'll love for you to speak to that. 346 00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:29,200 Actually, that's sort of expanding on what we just talked 347 00:20:29,200 --> 00:20:31,560 about. That idea of getting folk 348 00:20:31,560 --> 00:20:35,320 together to brainstorm problems and sort things out for each 349 00:20:35,320 --> 00:20:39,960 other is something that's the kind of echoes across a lot of 350 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:42,640 the stuff we do now in the gross CFO community. 351 00:20:42,640 --> 00:20:47,000 We've got a membership platform and anybody come along and be a 352 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:50,080 grow CFO member for free and get some resources. 353 00:20:50,080 --> 00:20:53,800 But if you're a paid member, you get into the learning system. 354 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:57,800 A lot of it is, well, it's aimed at finance people, which makes 355 00:20:57,800 --> 00:21:01,240 us unusual because we've probably got more finance based 356 00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:04,440 training you find anywhere else that's that's the sort of 357 00:21:04,440 --> 00:21:06,120 self-service stuff fairly standard. 358 00:21:06,120 --> 00:21:10,280 There's video on demand training, but on top of that, if 359 00:21:10,280 --> 00:21:13,200 you're a grow CFO member, you can attend a certain amount of 360 00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:16,160 live training, virtual classroom training. 361 00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:18,640 It's like being in the classroom, but it's over Zoom. 362 00:21:18,680 --> 00:21:24,000 And we've spotted the power of getting folk together in small 363 00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:29,600 cohorts and letting them work together and spend an extended 364 00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:33,160 period of time so they can get to know each other and support 365 00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:37,000 each other. So we've got FP and a boot camp, 366 00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:40,360 a finance business partnering boot camp, both of which are 367 00:21:40,360 --> 00:21:44,280 available to gross CFO members, part of the membership. 368 00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:48,160 And the way they work, each one of them, we, we run them over a 369 00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:51,120 course of two months. And over those two months we do 370 00:21:51,120 --> 00:21:55,240 7/2 hour workshops in small groups. 371 00:21:55,240 --> 00:21:59,320 So we, we wouldn't really want more than somewhere between a 372 00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:03,840 dozen and 20 people in a cohort. And they'll work in the 373 00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:07,160 classroom with a trainer, they'll go into breakout groups, 374 00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:11,880 they'll do case studies, and every one of those sessions will 375 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:15,440 end with practical, implementable stuff you can take 376 00:22:15,440 --> 00:22:16,960 back to the workplace the next day. 377 00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:19,640 We call it experiential learning. 378 00:22:20,360 --> 00:22:24,520 I love that. Or you give people practical 379 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:29,640 skills they can use straight away #2 is you form peer groups 380 00:22:30,400 --> 00:22:32,520 that can continue and support each other. 381 00:22:33,360 --> 00:22:36,240 And we've got a couple of flagship programs as well. 382 00:22:36,240 --> 00:22:40,040 They're the future CFO program and the CFO program. 383 00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:43,720 Now both of those work in roughly the same way, but the 384 00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:47,240 period's bigger. They run for a year and the two 385 00:22:47,240 --> 00:22:52,120 hour workshop rather than being every week is once a month. 386 00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:56,680 So you take this community of a dozen people, we have an intake 387 00:22:56,680 --> 00:22:59,880 into once 1/4, so a dozen new people every quarter. 388 00:23:00,600 --> 00:23:06,320 And the only criteria for future CFO is I want to be ACFO in the 389 00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:11,400 next couple of years. However, I want to see how I can 390 00:23:11,560 --> 00:23:14,200 knock down all the obstacles that are currently stopping me 391 00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:17,400 getting there. So we put them into a cohort, 392 00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:22,000 take them through the program by the end of 12 months working 393 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:25,720 that cohort, you've formed a fairly strong networking group. 394 00:23:25,800 --> 00:23:29,040 One of the things we do in the very first session, we find out 395 00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:31,640 what people's individual skill bases are. 396 00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:34,840 We've got the CFO competency framework and grocery of us, 397 00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:38,360 everybody on the on the program's taken that how we know 398 00:23:38,360 --> 00:23:41,760 what everybody's core skills are, the strengths of their 399 00:23:41,760 --> 00:23:45,200 weaknesses. So in the first session, each 400 00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:48,840 person gets to present on the area they're strongest in. 401 00:23:49,240 --> 00:23:53,600 So straight away the whole of that peer group gets to see the 402 00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:57,680 power of the skills that are combined in the group and all 403 00:23:57,680 --> 00:23:59,240 the things they can help each other with. 404 00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:02,320 And then we take them through the program, they get to know 405 00:24:02,320 --> 00:24:05,720 each other better as they go through by working together in 406 00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:09,800 the breakout sessions and so on. And it's, it's a really, really 407 00:24:09,800 --> 00:24:14,560 powerful way of forming community forming, forming 408 00:24:14,560 --> 00:24:19,400 groups that are potentially lasting much longer than the the 409 00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:24,600 program itself. Interesting stuff are that's 410 00:24:24,600 --> 00:24:29,360 something I want to ask you and this is hinged upon our shared, 411 00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:33,400 when I say background at PwC and it's something I really 412 00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:37,800 appreciate that PwC empowered us with. 413 00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:42,680 That's the PwC professional framework for prison 414 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:45,320 professionals. No, it starts with whole 415 00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:51,880 leadership and business acumen, technical competence, global 416 00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:54,280 acumen and building relationships. 417 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:59,960 So these things that you do, those CFOs speak to all of the 418 00:25:00,080 --> 00:25:03,440 points, the criteria points between the PwC framework, 419 00:25:03,840 --> 00:25:06,680 right? There's something that I noticed 420 00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:12,720 that a lot of RBS CFOs tend to lack, which is pieces. 421 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:16,320 And you rightly tell me that's a commercial mindset. 422 00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:21,080 So I'd love to speak to that. Why is that, you know very much 423 00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:25,720 lacking amongst a lot of career CF OS and what have you guys 424 00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:30,600 done at Co CFO to tackle this very, very important problem? 425 00:25:32,880 --> 00:25:36,200 Why is it lacking? I think in general, when you're 426 00:25:36,320 --> 00:25:40,600 training to be a chartered accountant or similar 427 00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:45,360 qualifications, CPA, whatever, you're learning very much 428 00:25:45,360 --> 00:25:50,040 technical skills around debits and credits around how to 429 00:25:50,040 --> 00:25:53,120 account for the stuff that other people do. 430 00:25:53,120 --> 00:28:16,600 Nobody. Now you make you feel old. 431 00:29:11,680 --> 00:30:41,360 I'm going to say. Wow, focus on this hot product 432 00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:51,830 and the cash channels. Absolutely. 433 00:30:51,830 --> 00:30:53,390 You know, there's something I love to say. 434 00:30:53,390 --> 00:30:57,190 Revenues, vanity, profit to sanity, and cash is reality. 435 00:30:57,310 --> 00:31:20,640 If you wish, cash is clean. I guess you you ran into a 436 00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:23,880 technical issue. It is still the reporting is 437 00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:26,960 still on, but the Reaver side has this way of finding the 438 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:30,280 fluff and removing the fluff so that that's not a profile. 439 00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:32,120 Did you lose your Internet connection? 440 00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:37,280 I think it went flaky. Everything froze, then you 441 00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:40,160 disappeared. So I then clicked the leave 442 00:31:40,160 --> 00:31:43,440 button and came back in again. OK, OK. 443 00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:48,920 No worries, I think you can peek back from where you stopped if 444 00:31:49,200 --> 00:31:51,720 you cannot be collected. Do you collect where you 445 00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:54,200 stopped? Gosh, what we were talking 446 00:31:54,200 --> 00:31:56,000 about. OK. 447 00:31:56,720 --> 00:32:01,080 I remember, I know it was a question that I made an improv 448 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:02,920 on. So I think I'll just proceed to 449 00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:04,920 the next question. I think that. 450 00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:07,360 Yeah, that's probably the best bet and see where we get to. 451 00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:10,400 You might you might have to edit something out of an appropriate 452 00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:14,840 stop point. So yeah, I've got a feeling I 453 00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:17,040 was still talking after we'd lost the connection. 454 00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:17,440 So. Oh. 455 00:32:18,440 --> 00:32:21,200 OK, I think you're talking. Inside my end anyway. 456 00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:22,920 You were talking about the commercial mindset. 457 00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:24,760 You know, I talked about the. Yeah, that's right. 458 00:32:24,840 --> 00:32:27,440 That's mindset. Business acumen, Yeah, yeah. 459 00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:30,280 So do you want to add anything to it or should we proceed to 460 00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:33,600 the next question? Proceed to the next question. 461 00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:38,520 OK, OK, OK, let's go. So let's talk about the 462 00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:43,520 technology in finance, a very, very big theme in my 463 00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:47,360 broadcasters, AI in business. Again, when you look at the 464 00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:52,640 subtitle of the forecast, it is growth mindset, leadership and 465 00:32:52,640 --> 00:32:58,000 business insights. So you, Acro CFO, navigate the 466 00:32:58,240 --> 00:33:04,880 fast changing technology landscape from AI to the digital 467 00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:07,280 transformations. So like what trends should 468 00:33:07,280 --> 00:33:11,040 finance leaders prioritize to see where bands are going into 469 00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:13,800 the future? And of course, to me, valuable 470 00:33:13,800 --> 00:33:17,440 and valuable. OK, right. 471 00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:21,600 So, yeah, you're at the core of my role these days and grow CFO 472 00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:26,840 and I am spending less time doing the mentoring sorts of 473 00:33:26,840 --> 00:33:30,200 things and more time being head of tech partnerships. 474 00:33:30,200 --> 00:33:36,320 And we're talking to a lot of tech companies in all areas of 475 00:33:36,320 --> 00:33:40,120 the finance landscape, doing webinars with them and podcasts 476 00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:42,120 and so on. And one of the nice things for 477 00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:45,560 me is it's keeping me really up to date with what's going on. 478 00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:49,280 And tech is moving at a phenomenal rate. 479 00:33:50,360 --> 00:33:52,640 Yeah. But one of the interesting 480 00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:58,200 things for me is that in certain areas, we're still juggling with 481 00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:01,840 the same problems that I was dealing with 25 years ago in 482 00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,880 PwC. I'm seeing in the order to cash 483 00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:09,320 and the purchase to pay space, the transactional finance parts, 484 00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:13,840 really significant progress with AI agents making a big 485 00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:18,199 difference. But bring this back into what's 486 00:34:18,199 --> 00:34:20,159 the FP and a team doing planning, budgeting, 487 00:34:20,159 --> 00:34:22,000 forecasting. What about the cool reporting 488 00:34:22,000 --> 00:34:24,520 team and faster close and things like that. 489 00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:30,320 They are fundamentally playing with the same problems that we 490 00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:34,480 were talking to them about 25 years ago when I was part of the 491 00:34:34,639 --> 00:34:39,800 I Analytics practice in PwC. Back then, 25 years ago, we were 492 00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:44,480 talking to one or two clients about moving away from a budget 493 00:34:44,719 --> 00:34:48,320 to having a rolling forecast. Blowing up the budget was the 494 00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:50,400 theme. And in the other part of the 495 00:34:50,400 --> 00:34:53,840 analytics practice, we were talking to businesses about 496 00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:57,160 faster clothes, particularly quoted companies that needed to 497 00:34:57,160 --> 00:35:00,880 report to the Stock Exchange once 1/4 letting them understand 498 00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:04,640 that reporting faster meant an awful lot in terms of their 499 00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:08,360 credibility, things that the the way the market looked at them. 500 00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:14,760 And no move on 25 years. Have we seen significant change 501 00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:17,960 to move to rolling forecasts? No, we haven't. 502 00:35:18,160 --> 00:35:20,760 We still talk about it and think it's the the future. 503 00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:24,040 Have we seen significant change with fast lows? 504 00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:27,680 No, we haven't. We run a survey and grow CFO 505 00:35:29,000 --> 00:35:32,720 probably about 18 months ago now and found that the vast majority 506 00:35:32,720 --> 00:35:36,480 of companies do not close them on then before work day five. 507 00:35:36,480 --> 00:35:40,840 And there's a whole ramp of companies that still failed to 508 00:35:40,840 --> 00:35:43,200 close before work day 10. Wow. 509 00:35:43,960 --> 00:35:46,960 So nothing's changed. And that that then brings me 510 00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:51,200 back to tech and where are we at the moment? 511 00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:55,560 And there's a lot happening, huge number of innovations going 512 00:35:55,560 --> 00:35:58,320 on, huge number of things we can take advantage of. 513 00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:03,560 I'm seeing a little bit of analysis paralysis in the 514 00:36:06,160 --> 00:36:09,800 literally so much is happening, people don't know where to 515 00:36:09,800 --> 00:36:12,680 start. One of the nice things that 516 00:36:12,680 --> 00:36:14,760 we're doing through, through some of the things we do in 517 00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:16,680 gross CFO, through the web analysis, through the tech 518 00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:20,600 showcases, is that we are showing people the art of the 519 00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:24,440 possible. And we're taking away this thing 520 00:36:24,440 --> 00:36:28,040 that we talk about called AI into the practical. 521 00:36:28,040 --> 00:36:30,480 What can you do with it at the moment? 522 00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:32,520 That's that's really interesting. 523 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:36,760 You go into those core areas, planning, budgeting, 524 00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:39,960 forecasting, reporting. What is it that's still stopping 525 00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:43,400 us all moving forward? And it's not the technology. 526 00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:47,880 And this is where CF OS have really got to be on their game. 527 00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:51,960 I think the biggest set of skills ACFO needs in the future, 528 00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:55,560 the change of management skills. You can have the greatest AI 529 00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:59,320 tools in the world, but if it's garbage in, it's garbage out. 530 00:37:00,760 --> 00:37:04,760 You can have the greatest set of AI agents in the world, but if 531 00:37:04,920 --> 00:37:07,840 there are bottlenecks in your processors caused by people you, 532 00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:11,120 you're not going to close the books any faster or do a better 533 00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:13,640 forecast. If you've got to say, well, the 534 00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:16,240 reason we don't close till working day 5 is, well, we've 535 00:37:16,240 --> 00:37:18,840 got to wait for all of the invoices to be in from all of 536 00:37:18,840 --> 00:37:21,920 our suppliers and process properly so we can close the 537 00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:24,200 books. AI is not going to make any 538 00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:27,440 difference to that. This is sort your systems out so 539 00:37:27,440 --> 00:37:29,800 you can accrue for what you know you've ordered. 540 00:37:30,760 --> 00:37:35,480 Therefore, you can work on some very good estimates of what the 541 00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:37,800 month that monthly costs are going to be in. close the books 542 00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:41,400 earlier. It's changing people, it's 543 00:37:41,400 --> 00:37:44,600 changing process and it's changing mindset. 544 00:37:45,320 --> 00:37:48,640 At the moment again again we'll go back to mindset. 545 00:37:48,720 --> 00:37:50,160 What skill set? Tool set? 546 00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:53,200 The result of the tool set is only as good as the mindset and 547 00:37:53,200 --> 00:37:57,360 the skill set of the individual tool set I love. 548 00:37:57,360 --> 00:38:02,200 And it is in any sort of change, there are three elements. 549 00:38:02,200 --> 00:38:04,880 There are people, there are process, and there are systems. 550 00:38:05,800 --> 00:38:09,360 You change the systems without changing the people or the 551 00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:17,120 process, you get nowhere. So the great CFO will know how 552 00:38:17,120 --> 00:38:21,400 to work with their people, how to get the best out of their 553 00:38:21,400 --> 00:38:26,440 people, how to get their people really involved in the change, 554 00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:30,920 looking at how do we make things work better around here, getting 555 00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:35,760 them involved in the solution, working together as a team. 556 00:38:37,840 --> 00:38:41,120 The technology by itself will not get you anywhere. 557 00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:46,440 It's also two sets. Yeah. 558 00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:52,000 And you know when you look at this from your own experience, 559 00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:55,640 what have been the major bottlenecks in the cut off 560 00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:59,480 procedure and the cut off process for organizations? 561 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:09,280 Gosh, it always tends to be around waiting for bits of 562 00:39:09,280 --> 00:39:12,760 information in that cut off. Accrawls. 563 00:39:13,960 --> 00:39:16,560 Yeah, it's accruals. It's waiting for somebody to 564 00:39:16,560 --> 00:39:19,840 approve something. And really when you're you're 565 00:39:19,840 --> 00:39:24,840 looking at that close process, I think you've got to go back to 566 00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:27,520 the basics. You're going to get that huge, 567 00:39:27,720 --> 00:39:31,600 huge roll of brown paper out. You've got a blue tacket to the 568 00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:35,960 wall and you then go to attack it with post it notes and start 569 00:39:35,960 --> 00:39:40,160 saying what happens, what's the process here, who does what and 570 00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:42,680 when? And until you understand that 571 00:39:42,680 --> 00:39:46,400 whole process and where all the handoffs are, you aren't going 572 00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:48,320 to get anywhere in terms of changing it. 573 00:39:48,320 --> 00:39:54,520 It's always handoffs that could have been done simpler or 574 00:39:54,520 --> 00:39:59,880 easier, and bits of the process that have been put in because we 575 00:39:59,880 --> 00:40:03,880 needed it three years ago. Nobody. 576 00:40:03,880 --> 00:40:06,760 Once you put something into a process because it was dealing 577 00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:10,640 with some peculiarity, historically, nobody ever 578 00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:12,360 challenges taking it back out again. 579 00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:16,880 So processes tend to get a little bit top heavy, a little 580 00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:19,240 bit clumsy. We never go back and really 581 00:40:19,240 --> 00:40:23,200 review them and simplify them. Interesting stuff. 582 00:40:23,640 --> 00:40:27,800 You know you also run app will be consulting and coaching 583 00:40:28,240 --> 00:40:32,800 supporting businesses as both the coach and fractional CFO. 584 00:40:33,200 --> 00:40:39,160 So why do you think this blended model is so powerful for SM, ES 585 00:40:39,320 --> 00:40:44,160 or stack UPS or scale UPS? Yeah, I don't do much of that 586 00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:47,240 these days. I am pretty much tied up with 587 00:40:47,240 --> 00:40:51,320 doing things with gross CFO and any ages of such that I would 588 00:40:51,520 --> 00:40:54,240 have more time outside of that to myself. 589 00:40:54,240 --> 00:40:58,840 So I'm I'm not actually actively going around looking for those 590 00:40:58,840 --> 00:41:02,640 other clients. But if people come to me and I 591 00:41:02,640 --> 00:41:06,160 like what they're doing and think I can help, but great, 592 00:41:06,160 --> 00:41:09,120 we'll do something. What makes that a great 593 00:41:09,120 --> 00:41:13,040 combination? I think if you say that you've 594 00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:17,520 got that skill yourself of having taken a business from 595 00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:21,120 nowhere to somewhere and Dan and I've done that with Bruce CFO 596 00:41:21,120 --> 00:41:24,480 over the last six years, helped my daughter put her business 597 00:41:24,480 --> 00:41:26,840 together, help wife put her business together. 598 00:41:28,200 --> 00:41:30,680 There's something of a sweet spot of how do you get a small 599 00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:34,240 business off the ground and actually turn it into something. 600 00:41:35,400 --> 00:41:41,280 And then to be able to do that with a finance mindset as well. 601 00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:43,800 I don't know. That adds a much an extra layer. 602 00:41:43,800 --> 00:41:47,040 You know, there are there's lots and lots and lots of coaches out 603 00:41:47,040 --> 00:41:49,080 there. Most coaches will take the 604 00:41:49,080 --> 00:41:51,600 approach of talking to you about a problem and asking you 605 00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:54,920 questions to to the way that you they try to get you to solve 606 00:41:54,920 --> 00:41:57,560 your own problem. Yes, it's an approach, but I 607 00:41:57,560 --> 00:42:00,400 think a mentor is something different. 608 00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:04,160 A mentor is somebody who's been there, done that, built the 609 00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:06,560 T-shirt. And if you've done that, you 610 00:42:06,560 --> 00:42:08,480 have the financial skill set on top. 611 00:42:08,480 --> 00:42:13,920 You understand the money, you understand that you've got to 612 00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:17,680 have revenue to pay the costs. You've got to be able to 613 00:42:17,680 --> 00:42:20,280 understand what costs are necessary, what costs are not 614 00:42:20,280 --> 00:42:24,080 necessary, be able to give the sensible forecast when it's 615 00:42:24,080 --> 00:42:27,040 necessary. If you can join those coaching 616 00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:29,920 skills with the mentoring skills, with the finance skills, 617 00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:33,320 I think it's a very powerful package for the small business. 618 00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:38,040 Absolutely, yeah, personal. That's why the fractional model 619 00:42:38,440 --> 00:42:42,840 is very, very powerful. You know these small businesses 620 00:42:42,840 --> 00:42:47,840 cannot afford a full time finance experts are once you 621 00:42:47,840 --> 00:42:52,120 dedicate that time, you know, fractionally to them, it goes 622 00:42:52,120 --> 00:42:57,200 along where you're helping them to start up, scale up and sell 623 00:42:57,200 --> 00:42:59,680 out. So let's talk about the. 624 00:43:00,520 --> 00:43:03,160 It's the sort of business I like working with even before that 625 00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:06,240 scale, where they'd want a fractional you. 626 00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:09,040 We've probably got to the stage you want a fractional CFO 627 00:43:09,040 --> 00:43:11,640 because you're going through some sort of fundraise or 628 00:43:11,640 --> 00:43:13,520 something like that. You suddenly realize you need 629 00:43:13,600 --> 00:43:17,240 more than the bookkeeper. I think something appeals to me 630 00:43:17,240 --> 00:43:21,840 about the stage before you even get there, and you're trying to 631 00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:24,120 put that business together. You're trying to make your first 632 00:43:24,120 --> 00:43:26,520 sales. You're trying to figure out what 633 00:43:26,520 --> 00:43:29,480 your customers want. I love that bit of the journey. 634 00:43:30,640 --> 00:43:32,720 Yeah, that's a foundation. Yeah, of course. 635 00:43:33,160 --> 00:43:34,960 Yeah. Either foundation that destroyed 636 00:43:34,960 --> 00:43:38,360 what kind of writers do. So it's an essential to get the 637 00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:41,240 foundation right. If you put some finance skills 638 00:43:41,240 --> 00:43:44,640 into that, that very early piece that's that's pretty unique 639 00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:47,200 because most fractionals are looking at the companies 640 00:43:48,120 --> 00:43:52,480 probably 7 figures already. Yeah, in that group phase, the 641 00:43:52,520 --> 00:43:56,080 only one to accelerate what is already in motion, I can 642 00:43:56,080 --> 00:43:59,200 understand, you know, but different strokes and different 643 00:43:59,200 --> 00:44:01,800 folks. What I want to delve into the 644 00:44:01,800 --> 00:44:04,840 Next 100 Days, It's something you're very passionate about 645 00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:07,800 you, you love the terminology. And of course, you've got the 646 00:44:07,800 --> 00:44:12,520 Next 100 Days podcast. You always emphasized on 100 647 00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:16,640 Days springs for transformation. So how can finance leaders and 648 00:44:16,640 --> 00:44:20,680 entrepreneurs apply this to accelerate results without 649 00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:25,680 burnout? That's it without burnout. 650 00:44:25,680 --> 00:44:28,440 Well, that's why it is 100 days, because if it's longer than 100 651 00:44:28,440 --> 00:44:30,880 days, you do burnout. OK. 652 00:44:31,480 --> 00:44:34,280 I think it's looking back over at a career where I've done lots 653 00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:36,720 of projects. And if you've got a project 654 00:44:36,720 --> 00:44:40,560 that's got a reasonably big scope and you start going, you 655 00:44:40,560 --> 00:44:43,720 get to a point where you you kind of run out of steam or you 656 00:44:43,720 --> 00:44:46,520 do burnout or you lose the reason why you did this in the 657 00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:49,880 1st place. And quite often that point that 658 00:44:49,880 --> 00:44:53,720 you run out of steam is around about the 1900 day mark. 659 00:44:54,760 --> 00:45:00,720 So I've developed my own philosophy that says you pick up 660 00:45:00,720 --> 00:45:02,760 a scope for whatever it is you want to do. 661 00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:07,480 You don't put too much in it, but you put enough in it to be 662 00:45:07,480 --> 00:45:09,840 able to go at it for about 90 days. 663 00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:13,960 You get to the end of that, you look at what you've achieved, 664 00:45:13,960 --> 00:45:20,400 you review and you plan again for another 9000 days, OK? 665 00:45:20,640 --> 00:45:23,880 So it comes down to biting things off into manageable 666 00:45:23,880 --> 00:45:26,680 chunks. So you don't start getting at 667 00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:32,040 the end of, if you go to 100 days, 110 days, 120 days, you 668 00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:35,040 don't get the diminishing returns going after the same 669 00:45:35,480 --> 00:45:37,360 goals, objectives you've replanned. 670 00:45:37,360 --> 00:45:38,880 So you can focus on something else. 671 00:45:39,920 --> 00:45:43,240 There's also a little bit of something we talked about 672 00:45:43,240 --> 00:45:45,240 earlier. You don't know what you don't 673 00:45:45,240 --> 00:45:48,040 know. I took us back into 2020. 674 00:45:48,040 --> 00:45:50,280 We didn't know lockdown was going to hit. 675 00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:52,440 I didn't know I was going to meet Dan Wells. 676 00:45:52,440 --> 00:45:54,280 I didn't know gross CFO was coming along. 677 00:45:55,560 --> 00:45:59,520 I don't think you can plan for two years, for three years. 678 00:46:00,360 --> 00:46:05,240 So you don't what's out there. But you do know if I asked you, 679 00:46:05,560 --> 00:46:10,360 Adam Ola, what's the one thing if you could do it would make a 680 00:46:10,360 --> 00:46:14,320 difference in the next 100 days, you could probably give me a 681 00:46:14,320 --> 00:46:17,000 very good answer. Absolutely. 682 00:46:18,080 --> 00:46:21,240 You know, what is that one thing? 683 00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:26,160 There's another thing I'll add to 90 days is you can go 100 an 684 00:46:26,160 --> 00:46:30,400 inch in 100 directions or you can go 100 miles in One 685 00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:35,200 Direction. So don't think of five things of 686 00:46:35,200 --> 00:46:37,960 10 things that you want to happen in the next 100 days. 687 00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:40,480 Think of one thing. What is the one thing that's 688 00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:42,040 going to be the game changer for you? 689 00:46:43,200 --> 00:46:46,320 And focus on that. Work on it for 100 days and 690 00:46:46,320 --> 00:46:49,840 you'll get somewhere. I love that 100 days is up. 691 00:46:50,840 --> 00:46:53,840 Review plan again, ask that same question. 692 00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:56,480 What's the one thing that's going to get me somewhere in the 693 00:46:56,480 --> 00:46:58,800 next 100 days? Go work on it. 694 00:46:59,880 --> 00:47:03,200 Interesting stuff. It works the planning and it 695 00:47:03,200 --> 00:47:07,680 works from business planning and it works in the pro world. 696 00:47:08,760 --> 00:47:12,040 Project management is essentially in that process. 697 00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:14,920 What's your favorite project management tool? 698 00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:19,880 Piece of paper. Well, for me it's it's my 699 00:47:19,880 --> 00:47:21,720 calendar. I love calendar so much. 700 00:47:22,240 --> 00:47:26,200 I think that's the most important subscription I've ever 701 00:47:26,200 --> 00:47:29,800 had. What do I use in terms of tools? 702 00:47:29,800 --> 00:47:33,240 I've used Trello in the past as a project management tool. 703 00:47:33,320 --> 00:47:37,480 I've used back in bigger project world to use Microsoft projects. 704 00:47:37,480 --> 00:47:40,120 Was absolutely hated and currently I use Notion. 705 00:47:41,000 --> 00:47:43,000 Yeah. Notion, but OK. 706 00:47:43,280 --> 00:47:46,680 There's a difference between managing tasks and managing 707 00:47:46,680 --> 00:47:50,440 activities and thinking about what needs to be done. 708 00:47:51,320 --> 00:47:53,360 Thinking about what needs to be done. 709 00:47:53,560 --> 00:47:57,800 Big piece of paper posted notes? Stick them on, move them around 710 00:47:57,880 --> 00:48:01,200 till you've got a plan. Can't be this? 711 00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:04,240 I think you like us. Have you heard of Asana? 712 00:48:04,240 --> 00:48:07,560 Then yes, our marketing team uses uses Asana. 713 00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:12,800 Yeah, yeah, I think you've got to have that freedom of just 714 00:48:12,800 --> 00:48:16,120 being able to think when you're in the planning phase, what do 715 00:48:16,120 --> 00:48:20,600 you use to plan the project versus what do you use to task 716 00:48:20,600 --> 00:48:22,360 manage the project. And they're two different 717 00:48:22,360 --> 00:48:25,760 things. Absolutely. 718 00:48:25,920 --> 00:48:28,800 And of course, I hope our audience are taking a very, 719 00:48:28,800 --> 00:48:32,600 very, very bad notes. Let's let's talk about, you 720 00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:37,080 know, beyond the spreadsheets, beyond the tools, what are the 721 00:48:37,200 --> 00:48:42,680 personal qualities or the leadership traits, skills and 722 00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:48,200 mindset that separate an average CFO from a successful and 723 00:48:48,200 --> 00:48:54,000 transformational CFO? It's the ability to lead a team. 724 00:48:56,480 --> 00:48:59,600 For leadership, no wonder PwC put it right at the top. 725 00:49:00,200 --> 00:49:02,560 Yeah, it is. It's the ability to lead A-Team. 726 00:49:02,600 --> 00:49:07,160 The the CF OS success I believe isn't just down to them, it's 727 00:49:07,160 --> 00:49:08,920 down to the people they have around them. 728 00:49:09,240 --> 00:49:13,400 It's down to taking those people on a journey and achieving 729 00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:16,600 something together. So you have to be able to lead. 730 00:49:19,360 --> 00:49:21,760 That's a very difficult question. 731 00:49:23,960 --> 00:49:26,480 That's all depends. So the answer is going to be 732 00:49:26,480 --> 00:49:28,240 different for virtually everybody. 733 00:49:28,320 --> 00:49:31,680 It's going to depend on business circumstances, what's necessary 734 00:49:31,720 --> 00:49:37,640 and understanding the needs. And I think it comes down to and 735 00:49:37,640 --> 00:49:39,880 I believe strategies just down to one thing. 736 00:49:39,880 --> 00:49:42,840 It's stop, start, continue. What are you going to stop 737 00:49:42,840 --> 00:49:43,920 doing? What are you going to start 738 00:49:43,920 --> 00:49:45,080 doing? What are you going to continue 739 00:49:45,080 --> 00:49:48,200 doing? But I'd flip that question 740 00:49:48,200 --> 00:49:52,680 around if I was giving practical advice to ACFO today as to what 741 00:49:52,680 --> 00:49:57,600 should they be doing personally to augment where they are. 742 00:49:58,040 --> 00:50:00,760 We've got in gross CFO something called the CFO competency 743 00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:04,880 framework mentioned it earlier and you can go to our website 744 00:50:04,880 --> 00:50:08,400 and take the competency framework and it's you you self 745 00:50:08,400 --> 00:50:14,040 assess yourself across 40. Some of them are the commercial 746 00:50:14,040 --> 00:50:15,840 acumen that we talked about earlier. 747 00:50:16,080 --> 00:50:18,680 Some of them are the change skills, some of them are the 748 00:50:19,760 --> 00:50:22,400 mergers, acquisitions, fundraising skills. 749 00:50:22,400 --> 00:50:26,800 And what you can get is a profile of yourself across 45 750 00:50:26,800 --> 00:50:29,480 skills. And you can start working out 751 00:50:29,480 --> 00:50:34,200 where your own personal strengths and gaps are a great 752 00:50:34,200 --> 00:50:38,840 way of deciding how do I want to get better skills wise in the 753 00:50:38,840 --> 00:50:42,120 next 12 months. Have a look at that assessment 754 00:50:42,120 --> 00:50:44,800 and see where you where you're falling short versus where you 755 00:50:44,800 --> 00:50:46,840 think you should be or where your peers are. 756 00:50:49,880 --> 00:50:54,640 Who mentored you on your own way up and how has? 757 00:50:55,240 --> 00:50:58,520 You mentored. You mentoring others also shift 758 00:50:58,520 --> 00:51:00,840 your legacy in finance leadership. 759 00:51:03,720 --> 00:51:10,400 I would say I don't know I've ever had a formal mentor, but a 760 00:51:10,400 --> 00:51:14,720 lot go back to PwC days. In PwC consulting. 761 00:51:15,000 --> 00:51:19,600 Back when I was there, you had a line manager and you had a 762 00:51:19,600 --> 00:51:21,880 mentor. Your line manager may well 763 00:51:21,880 --> 00:51:24,240 change frequently depending what you're doing. 764 00:51:24,240 --> 00:51:26,280 And on top of that, you might have a project manager as well 765 00:51:26,280 --> 00:51:29,480 that you're working too. But your mentor stayed with you. 766 00:51:30,080 --> 00:51:33,600 So you're always talking about skills development, career 767 00:51:33,600 --> 00:51:37,600 progression and so on with your mentor. 768 00:51:38,000 --> 00:51:40,960 And actually I got into the position of really liking that, 769 00:51:41,280 --> 00:51:44,440 and that's when I started mentoring more junior people 770 00:51:44,560 --> 00:51:49,040 within PwC. So that's really sold me on the 771 00:51:49,040 --> 00:51:53,320 power of that relationship. But I guess I've always had 772 00:51:53,320 --> 00:51:57,920 people around that I've been able to talk to about things and 773 00:51:58,040 --> 00:52:04,440 bounce ideas off. So looking into the future, what 774 00:52:04,440 --> 00:52:09,640 was the vision for not just the next 100 days, but maybe the 775 00:52:09,640 --> 00:52:14,720 next 100 weeks and maybe 10/10/10 years? 776 00:52:14,760 --> 00:52:19,320 Like what exact you, you know, what role do you see for CFO 777 00:52:19,400 --> 00:52:24,720 playing in the global landscape, the global finance landscape in 778 00:52:24,720 --> 00:52:27,280 the years to come? What really excites you about 779 00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:30,480 the future? Gross CFO is the easy bit 780 00:52:30,480 --> 00:52:32,520 because I can see where we're going. 781 00:52:32,760 --> 00:52:37,360 I can see working with bigger finance teams, a lot more 782 00:52:37,360 --> 00:52:40,880 finance teams. We're going to have a bigger 783 00:52:41,040 --> 00:52:44,880 footprint outside of the UK. We've already got a reasonable 784 00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:48,400 footprint in the US, but that's where there's a huge, huge 785 00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:52,320 opportunity for growth. So I see gross CFO growing quite 786 00:52:52,320 --> 00:52:54,560 rapidly. Where do I see me in the next 787 00:52:54,600 --> 00:52:57,480 couple of years? Well, I'm coming to that age 788 00:52:57,480 --> 00:53:00,360 where I've got to make a very interesting decision of who I 789 00:53:00,360 --> 00:53:04,480 retire moment. The one thing that's stopping me 790 00:53:04,480 --> 00:53:08,520 from saying yes, I'll retire is so much tech change going on 791 00:53:09,920 --> 00:53:11,000 and. I. 792 00:53:11,000 --> 00:53:13,840 Don't. It's exciting and I don't want 793 00:53:13,840 --> 00:53:17,840 to lose where things are. I really enjoy being head of 794 00:53:17,840 --> 00:53:20,560 partnerships and having the opportunity to go and talk to 795 00:53:20,560 --> 00:53:22,800 these tech companies every day of the week. 796 00:53:23,480 --> 00:53:25,600 They'll run a webinar every couple of weeks to see the 797 00:53:25,600 --> 00:53:27,560 latest things that they're they're up to. 798 00:53:27,560 --> 00:53:30,640 And certainly in the next couple of years, I think there's going 799 00:53:30,640 --> 00:53:33,840 to be so much change going on, but I want to stay with that. 800 00:53:34,800 --> 00:53:39,640 Interesting stuff. So you talk about gratitude. 801 00:53:39,640 --> 00:53:41,520 Gratitude is also close to my heart. 802 00:53:41,520 --> 00:53:44,560 And of course for me to use a very big thank you for being on 803 00:53:44,560 --> 00:53:47,040 the show today. But I will not let you go 804 00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:50,320 without putting you through the Pacific Ring of Fire. 805 00:53:50,320 --> 00:53:53,400 I have 5 big fireground questions for you. 806 00:53:54,520 --> 00:54:00,920 OK, let's go. OK, so. 807 00:54:01,520 --> 00:54:04,440 That's from 2 good Geordie lads from our neck of the woods and 808 00:54:04,440 --> 00:54:08,320 deck. Number one, one book every CFO 809 00:54:08,320 --> 00:54:13,000 chicky. Well, to your Geordie's somebody 810 00:54:13,000 --> 00:54:16,120 who I would regard regard as a little bit of a mentor, Michael 811 00:54:16,120 --> 00:54:18,640 Heppel. Michael Heppel, How to Be 812 00:54:18,640 --> 00:54:20,600 Brilliant. The best personal development 813 00:54:20,640 --> 00:54:23,760 book ever written. Interesting stuff. 814 00:54:23,760 --> 00:54:28,400 So the next one is the biggest financial mistake businesses 815 00:54:28,400 --> 00:54:30,280 make in their first one. Quantity. 816 00:54:31,960 --> 00:54:37,000 Are probably spending too much money and waiting till they've 817 00:54:37,000 --> 00:54:40,560 got something they think is perfect before they try to sell 818 00:54:40,560 --> 00:54:42,840 it. Minimum viable product. 819 00:54:42,960 --> 00:54:45,680 Get it out there and find if anybody wants to buy it. 820 00:54:47,720 --> 00:54:52,320 Nice coffee, tea, or something stronger when you punch in the 821 00:54:52,320 --> 00:54:56,880 numbers. Coffee OK, preferably freshly 822 00:54:56,880 --> 00:55:00,680 ground from the beans. Ha ha ha, a guided coffee one 823 00:55:00,680 --> 00:55:04,840 underrated soft skill every finance leader must master. 824 00:55:07,240 --> 00:55:09,720 Underrated soft skill? Gosh. 825 00:55:11,120 --> 00:55:15,680 Thing is, these days I don't think there are any underrated 826 00:55:15,680 --> 00:55:20,400 soft skills left, but storytelling is certainly the 827 00:55:20,400 --> 00:55:24,120 big one. It's getting away from talking 828 00:55:24,120 --> 00:55:28,080 numbers and talking language that only accountants understand 829 00:55:28,360 --> 00:55:31,360 to talk in the language of the rest of the business. 830 00:55:31,760 --> 00:55:35,160 I love that I I leave for that. It's on my LinkedIn profile, 831 00:55:35,200 --> 00:55:37,960 Storytelling for impact, so proud of that. 832 00:55:38,320 --> 00:55:41,640 It's very important in this ageing time and I appreciate 833 00:55:41,640 --> 00:55:43,480 what one of my guests told me, she said. 834 00:55:43,560 --> 00:55:46,600 I am a modern day business philosopher, so picking that 835 00:55:46,600 --> 00:55:50,040 title and rather did Martin Davis a philosopher. 836 00:55:50,760 --> 00:55:52,240 Wow. And I've heard the very last 837 00:55:52,320 --> 00:55:56,080 question is, if you could give your younger self one piece of 838 00:55:56,080 --> 00:55:58,960 advice when starting at PwC, what would? 839 00:55:59,160 --> 00:56:05,480 That advice? Enjoy the journey, enjoy the 840 00:56:05,480 --> 00:56:08,480 journey. It comes back to you don't know 841 00:56:08,480 --> 00:56:11,120 what's around the corner, you don't know what's you can't plan 842 00:56:11,120 --> 00:56:14,720 beyond 100 days. I'd say lots of my bits of my 843 00:56:14,720 --> 00:56:18,840 career have happened as much by accident, certainly about being 844 00:56:18,840 --> 00:56:20,520 in the right place at the right time. 845 00:56:20,920 --> 00:56:26,120 And yet we spend so much time thinking about oh, when, if only 846 00:56:26,120 --> 00:56:28,120 this would happen, then everything be all right. 847 00:56:28,880 --> 00:56:33,160 Well now enjoy the journey, enjoy what you've got now and 848 00:56:33,160 --> 00:56:35,000 what's happening and be in the moment. 849 00:56:35,120 --> 00:56:38,320 Don't be always thinking, oh, it'll be great when we've got to 850 00:56:38,320 --> 00:56:40,120 this goal or that goal or the other goal. 851 00:56:42,240 --> 00:56:44,600 I think that's fantastic piece of advice. 852 00:56:44,960 --> 00:56:49,760 And of course with that I come to my line that I love so much. 853 00:56:50,440 --> 00:56:53,200 When a person shares their time with you, they share their life 854 00:56:53,200 --> 00:56:55,000 with you. The course, the SI uniform 855 00:56:55,000 --> 00:56:58,320 measure in life this time. And of course, an attitude of 856 00:56:58,320 --> 00:57:01,600 gratitude is good attitude. So for me, it is love and 857 00:57:01,880 --> 00:57:06,960 respect to you for being on the show today, The King Games 858 00:57:06,960 --> 00:57:11,320 podcast and Diary of the CFOI do not take your time for granted. 859 00:57:11,320 --> 00:57:15,240 I very much appreciate you know, you spending that fraction of 860 00:57:15,240 --> 00:57:18,760 the life with us to be sharing insights, educating and 861 00:57:18,760 --> 00:57:20,920 motivating. This means a lot. 862 00:57:20,920 --> 00:57:23,520 You're highly, highly appreciated and of course, 863 00:57:23,960 --> 00:57:26,680 looking forward to teacher collaborations and the first 864 00:57:26,680 --> 00:57:32,560 guys I did feature on Kevin, Apple forecast those CFO guys. 865 00:57:32,560 --> 00:57:33,960 I'm going to put it in the description. 866 00:57:35,360 --> 00:57:41,120 Go watch it and press the meet. You as always conceive the 867 00:57:41,600 --> 00:57:44,400 stratified and actually always go for something in your life 868 00:57:44,880 --> 00:57:46,720 right across your meet. It's goodbye, Akron. 869 00:57:46,840 --> 00:57:49,600 Kevin, I don't know if you want to leave a shout out to anybody 870 00:57:49,600 --> 00:57:52,520 or if you want to, you know, if you've any closer remarks, but a 871 00:57:52,520 --> 00:57:57,680 press for me it's goodbye. I think just thank you hugely 872 00:57:57,760 --> 00:57:59,480 for having me on your podcast today. 873 00:57:59,480 --> 00:58:02,160 It's been a really great experience. 874 00:58:02,160 --> 00:58:04,800 Really enjoyed chatting to you and talking about stuff that I 875 00:58:04,800 --> 00:58:06,600 hope is of value to the audience. 876 00:58:06,880 --> 00:58:08,640 Thank you once again. Wow. 877 00:58:08,680 --> 00:58:10,280 And of course, you're welcome once again. 878 00:58:10,280 --> 00:58:14,280 You're honest welcome actually, and it's not goodbye, but it is. 879 00:58:14,360 --> 00:58:18,960 See you guys again for me and from AI and KA.