Hi everyone. Today we talk about Finn Ops
what it is and why it's important.
And even how we, as Engineers can prevent from the company
spending a fortune on cloud costs, my guest has been a real
FrontRunner on this topic over Oblivion Me shows it one.
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Here's your host, Patrick akhil. Hey, Michelle.
How's it going? Hey, great.
Great to be here. Patrick, yeah, happy to have
you. So we invited you on to talk
about Philips. Yeah, it's kind of a new kid on
the Block and it's an up-and-coming topic which is
getting more traction and it's becoming a real important pillar
kind of cloud development, but let's start off with more of a
personal question of. Why are you passionate about
Phillips in the first place? Wow, yeah, that's interesting.
I think Took me time to figure that out too.
Yeah, and definitely passionate about it.
I think it's a bit crazy, but when I really look back at why,
God passionate about cloud in the first place.
Yeah, I can really identify that and well, I really am passionate
about technology. More even about what technology
enables right. I think just as really going
really, really back like electricity changed.
How we leave. I think, you know, in a broader
Sense. Technology.
Does that right? So electricity, we can see that
as a sort of Technology. Yeah.
And then nowadays, what I saw back in 2013 was that cloud was
the next big revolutionary technology that could have this
this impact. Yeah.
That was when I realized that. Okay, it was around the way
before. Yeah.
And I decided I wanted to go along with this and when I think
why is that is cloud really has this power to really democratize
technology on a really next level.
And bring this to phenotypes when I really started learning
about cloud and getting knowledge and I wanted to get
better and better. This it wasn't even a thing
phenotypes was in a term, it conceived.
This is kind of recent or Cloud financial management or even
cost optimization, but it kind of landed on me to do this.
Yeah, when I joined the believe in and I I started to get a lot
of energy out of doing this. Yeah.
And the reason is because is that basically what you're doing
is making a cloud more efficient.
Yeah. So if I look at that and I say
okay cloud is is an enablement to write its it democratizes
technology and what I'm trying to do with in Ops is to make it
even more efficient. So I'm making it easier to
democratize technology. And this is what I think why I
get so so much energy out of doing that and why I'm so
passionate about it? It's really just enabling
people. First of all Cloud enables a lot
of aspects, right? It's revolutionary in the fact
that developers have a lot more Tools in their hands now.
Yeah I think it democratizes technologies that very best way
to define what it does. Yeah, it democratizes technology
in the past. If somebody wanted to try
something they would have to buy a machine.
Yeah. And maybe you wouldn't be able
to do Do that some people in a lifetime?
Yeah, or get it approved in a company and nowadays.
It's so cheap to try an experiment, right?
Yeah, everybody basically with internet connection and a
computer, it doesn't have to be yours but you just need to have
access to that. Then you have access to a
plethora of infrastructure and software and anything that you
possibly need to build on a virtual level.
Yeah. There's So many options out
there. Now, that's probably where the
difficulty comes in as well. We had some guys over from
Boulder, come in a previous episode and they shared how
their Cloud Journey was going. And one of the things that they
mentioned and really stuck with me is that they couldn't copy
what they had as physical hardware, for example,
one-on-one to the cloud because that would not have been
beneficial to them, right? They would still have the same
pain points, so they really learn to leverage the cloud
cloud, native in some aspects. And Really use it in that way,
right? But they also mentioned that
there's so many options in kind of figuring how things work and
what's the most effective way of doing.
It also cost wise is that think, I know where that thin Ops term
came in. Yeah.
What is fin Ops? Yeah, so too, if I have to
Define phenotypes or Cloud financial management, it's
knowledge domain. In my opinion is not something
that eats its specific thing that you do know.
Oh, it's knowledge to me. Yeah, and it's something that
arised out of this need to cope with this Dynamic and
distributed nature of the cloud, but not the cloud itself.
That's the economic model of the cloud.
Yeah, it's really really different than the traditional
it that's a most organizations would Leveraging, the past, the
Act was Financial wise accounting-wise.
A lot easier to manage than the economics in the cloud.
Exactly. Because it's how it was.
Previously is an initial cost, right?
You invest in something that has, it's a depreciating asset.
Yeah, so, what we call the capex model, right?
Exactly capital expenditure that you buy something, then you have
that asset and then that asset. As a life, right time.
And this, it depreciates throughout that Lifetime.
And then you, you say, Okay, I, I bought this.
It's a thousand dollars. It's good for three years, five
years, seven years, depending on how your taxation goes, whatever
country you are, but you have a fixed asset, you know how it
works out, you know how, when it's going to be fiscally
speaking worth. Nothing.
Yeah and then you know that you're going to buy another one.
Exactly. Yeah.
My uh Cycle starts again, an upgraded version, slightly more
expensive or cheaper. If the technology got cheaper to
build that. Yeah.
But you're going to buy another one.
Exactly. And you have your capacity back?
And I need to start appreciating.
And there you go, the cycle starts, and then you track
assets, right? So, all days, you would have
those metal labels stick to every, every heart piece of
Hardware that you would have. Yeah, and was sort of easy,
right? So you get okay, I want To buy
networking equipment, right? So you bought 12 new switches?
Yeah. Then you have all these switches
every every single one of them has a serial number and you put
that on a database whatever you using to track that.
Yeah. And then you use it sort of easy
to calculate and it's which is capable of.
I don't know how many connections.
Yeah but it's a fixed number so you know the more Devices, you
need to connect more switches, you will need and so on.
So it's kind of predictable foreseeable.
It's easy to forecast, right? It's easy to budget how much
you're going to need. So now and that which allows
it's the same except you're not the one that's doing it right.
You're using it as a service and you're paying as you go.
Exactly. So it changed from this capex
model to op X. Right.
So operational expenditure and not only you use Of course use
that as a service but you do need to worry anymore about
those numbers for indigenous in one from one point of view, it's
great. Yeah.
From the user point of view right?
I don't need to worry about that anymore so I don't need to worry
if whatever I'm trying to build. It's going to work out.
Yeah. Because if it doesn't I just
shut it down and I don't have to pay any more free.
I don't need to make an investment.
I don't need to convince people to Put money on something and if
it doesn't work, I'm at risk. My career is at risk or, I don't
know. Something this whole project or
initiative is at risk. You can just start over and try
again for a few cents or a couple of dollars.
Yeah, yes. And whereas before you would
have to pay a lot of money on to do the same thing and this is
great for that person, for sure for the finance People, or the
budget owners. That it's arguable.
Right. It's not as predictable anymore.
Yeah. And financial people like
predictability. Yeah.
I'm not saying it's a bad thing. It's important.
It's really important to keep your cash flow and your
everything used to be healthy. And yeah some some some places
you have real though she re responsibility so if you if you
declare that you had a cost but you cannot explain that or it's
wrong. Yeah, you might go to jail or
so. So some accountants, some places
in some regulated Industries. They, they suffer with that too,
right? So there is a extremes.
I'm not saying this common, but there are ya, and it's important
to be able to track that. Exactly.
And there is a whole mentality shift on this.
Yeah, and I mean, if you, you told me that some guy, I'm gonna
repeat what you said. You said, if you ask an
engineer, how much the cloud is basically Ending.
They usually don't know, right? They can look at some numbers.
But if you say is it optimized, right?
Can we cut some costs here? Yeah, usually I have no clue
where to start. Yeah.
They are not thankfully. These this mentality slowly
changing. Yeah.
But normally you get, they don't know, but it's not that they
don't care. They're just not focused on
that. They are focus on making things
work or keeping them running, right?
So with the adoption, Increasing adoption of cloud.
People had to read it like probably ball the ball.com
people said they had to relearn how to do things right?
It wasn't the same it's not about just right where in terms
of infrastructure they're going to run is not one to one but how
they do it going Cloud native. Right.
So you have to recycle your knowledge and you have to
understand that you need to do things differently and the first
focus of that was probably how To run.
Yeah, yeah. How to make walk or run things
in the cloud and once you got that, figured out the second
major point, which should have been the first, but was probably
the second if we look historically, how this happened
was security. How do we make the secure?
Because then everything is in the cloud theory is accessible
right from anywhere. So you need to protect that to
make, sure that only who you want to access your information,
your data or your applications can do it.
Yeah. And And then it seems.
Okay. Now we figured that out, we know
how to do things in the cloud. Let's use cloud.
And then everybody started to use cloud.
And then what happened is that all of a sudden, Cloud bills
started to go up and up and up. And then somebody said, wait,
what's going on here? Yeah.
And and then what's going on, is that cloud adoption is
increasing and whereas okay, you don't have to pay a whole pie.
All those equipment as we were talking about anymore and going
through layers of approvals and asking permissions and making
business cases and following existing processes, right?
That everybody knows how to do. Yeah.
All of a sudden, you gave all this work force with access to
the cloud, right? So all your engineers developers
Architects, everybody, that has a login that K can go to a cloud
account, a subscription or a project depending on the Cloud
provider. They basically got an unlimited
credit card. Yeah where they can only buy
services from that cloud provider.
Yeah but they got an unlimited credit card and nobody's
checking what they are doing in. Exactly right.
Not even death. Yeah, so some people have this
naturally, right? This this I cannot.
I need to be responsible again. Not do again.
So, it ended with most people are not, you're not concerned or
or did they don't care? Yes.
Just as I said, they are not focused on this.
They are trying to figure out. How do I do this?
How do I, how do I make this better or how I just, don't mess
it up. Yeah, right.
It was shift, but Once you start doing things like this, you just
continue. Yeah, I mean, it's always been
the driver of kind of an engineer.
Let's take a product team. For example, their Drive is
delivering value for the End customer, right first.
It was probably on premise with something now move to the cloud.
And as you mentioned, you first try and make it happen and you
can probably do that. Then the next step is bringing
it to the customer, right? And that brings different
questions with it, security is one of them and then we actually
have that you're like, okay, we can use this.
This is the cycle, right? Except you don't really think
about write. The value always has a cost and
the cost aspect is changing now. But who then is kind of, I mean
I kind of can figure out who's responsible.
It's more of an overarching thing but you should be
responsible, I guess so it depends on your organization
right but normally when we talk about financial management, you
would be looking towards the CFO office and then coming down that
At stream. And maybe from the CIO, right?
Running the technology aside of a company and young of how, how
did we get here, right? How did you get from
experimenting the cloud to a running most of our production
environments in the cloud? Yeah.
And was it planned A lot of times?
It was not. Yeah, it's Noble happened
organically right. One team started.
It was a success. And then another one and then
another one and then came time for renewing.
Some Hardware contract is a yeah I not going to need this
anymore. I'm running the cloud.
Now think of how many cases happen because this was sort of
organic. Yeah, that people did move to
the cloud. And procurement departments were
not really in that Loop, right? So procurement gets in between
the chairs here, whereas they were super important making
negotiating all these contracts. Making sure that the company is
not being abused and so on. So on, they don't have even a
role in what nobody needs to go through procurement.
There are not usually in the loop.
It's now in climate anymore. Yeah, but then all they know,
No, sometimes. Is that a conflict is ending?
Yeah, and you're going to renew that contract.
Nobody's going to use that anymore.
Yeah. But the contract in capex is
okay, you buy it, it stays there for a few years.
Yeah. And then so how many of those
happened? Because there wasn't a planned
migration to the cloud or a plan Cloud adoption.
And and this is something that is a consultant.
I can see a lot that. Yeah, there are faces that just
don't, Look for me in a holistic way.
Yeah I just concerned of one aspect and If you bring fin Ops
into the picture, you were just trying to make sure that you
don't forget, one very important aspect of this.
Yeah. And phenotypes, as it runs
through, it gets from this financial aspect, right?
Cost of things but it also goes to the operation side.
So eventually you move from determining?
Are we sure that is a good use case.
That we moving to the cloud. We're going to make a things are
going to be better for us. Maybe more cost-efficient there
is this myth or that every if you move to the cloud,
everything will be cheaper. Hmm.
It might not be exactly the same.
The means and how you, how you use his, right?
And if you if you get there and if you really look at this
aspect once you running there you continuously optimize right
so you you it's never ending thing and you from a final
certain perspective. You can also Challenge and work
with your engineering teams and developing teams to get them
too. Could we do this now work and
deliver value to the customers and make it cheaper?
Yeah. Yeah.
Or make it more efficient. Yeah.
So it's it's, it's not about
making cheaper for the sake of money.
It's making more efficient. Yeah, it's making sure that you
are extracting, all what you can, and being smart on the
design level architectural level.
Yeah, so this is what I think it is.
It's very interesting. You it over arches everything.
Almost if full operating model, if you would From one optic.
Yeah, I get white like companies might be struggling with this
right? If they're already running
somewhere on premise. As you mentioned kind of big
bang shift to the cloud is not going to be as cost effective,
right? Because they already invested in
all this Hardware. Yeah.
So then it needs to be a gradual migration.
But then which parts do you Migrate?
How do you how do you face that out?
Yeah. So Cloud providers you have the
hyper skitters they normally have Programs to incentivize
customers to migrate to the cloud.
Yeah. And they usually ask to give
incentives. They ask in return that you plan
it, right? So, they don't require you to
move. Make a big bang move.
Yeah, they are. Actually, they ask you, build a
business case. Yeah.
And then go move to the cloud. Get active.
Sponsors within the company to make the make it happen.
Yeah. And then build a plan.
How do you going to make the shift?
And once they're how you're going to transform that, right?
So you can start with a simple lift and shift.
So run exactly what you running here.
They're just there. Yeah, yeah, in a virtualized
environment data center. If you want to call it Cloud
that it's We're simplifying definitely but you can start
there and then you can. Okay now let's learn.
And let's go native, let's refactor our applications.
Let's actually tear everything down.
Yeah, and build a brand new one. Yeah.
And this is how you start leveraging that.
And then once you start again, making it happen and you make
sure that it works, you make sure it's delivering some value
to your end customers and then Okay, what can we do better
here? Yeah, I get that kind of moving
back to Phoenix as kind of a knowledge domain, right?
So we have the same exact scenario in a product team.
That you have different competencies, right?
Some people are a bit more aware of security aspects that need to
be applied. When you're developing a
product, some people are bit more aware of the operational,
kind of thing, right? The devops mindset about
visibility and robustness and all that.
Do you think Finn Ops is also? And of a knowledge domain that
should be within a team. Yes, absolutely.
Yeah, right. I think it's going to be just as
Devops. Yeah, started to bring this
programming and development knowledge together with
operations knowledge, right? So there is no more.
Oh, when I tested this the cold on my virtualized environment on
my machine, it worked out. It's not working.
On production is good for its, is the networking guy's fault?
Yeah. It's not like they're so
patients. Not me.
So. I think the same way this
converged and it's it's almost expected that somebody working
with Cloud. Can have some tissues t-shaped.
Professional right. And there's a bit of both.
I believe that this going to be another expectation.
Maybe not yet but it's going to come.
Nobody's going to ask people, to be phenomenal Specialists.
Yeah. But they will ask people to have
From, at least an architectural point of view, the notion of
cost efficiency of India, workloads applications called
and this will be expected. And for now, I think this role
is being in many cases, centralized either in one person
for a whole Enterprise level organization sometimes, it's a
small team and they go and As a task force, right?
The identify where is the best place we can help with our
knowledge. Yeah and they go to that team.
Did that unit that department? Whatever it is and they work
together and if they do a good job, if they can scale Dirty by
on these collaborations, this interactions.
They are going to pass some knowledge to that department.
They're working with the team, they were working with passing
on. Okay.
Is a best practice that these how we make sure that reserve
some time on your Sprint planning.
I make a okay. What can we improve from a cost
efficiency perspective? Yeah and how they scaled this
even in a small team is by enabling visibility at all
stores there. So you mentioned this earlier so
usually they don't know that this is costing right?
Yeah. And that's true.
And this is where it starts in my Onion.
So let's enabling visibility and that will make people whole.
I didn't know that. Yeah, we are humans are exact
funny creatures, right? Once you have that knowledge and
once you see that this is happening.
Yeah. You somehow feel responsible,
right? If you see something that all
this is not going good, right? You see a trend, it's ever more
expensive and to deliver the same thing.
Yeah, seriously I'm not being really efficient here.
Yeah. And then you start doing
something to do to make it better.
So, The Motto. I preach normally is awareness.
Yeah, drives accountability which in turn demands awareness
because, you know, and then you going to do something about it
and if you feel accountable about it, you you want to know
again? How am I doing?
Right. And then, that cycle goes on and
on, and this is really positive for for companies, right, for
organizations. Leveraging Cloud.
Yeah. I I really like that that model,
right? And I really like that, the role
of Philips, there is to kind of kick that Kickstart that
awareness, exactly. People are not aware how you
going to find that, you're going to find it somewhere in a blog
post or, but is it applicable? And is it is it reliable or
stuff like that? But if it's within your
organization right within your environment, it's going to be in
the back of your mind. If you look at something like
on, maybe, maybe we should use this.
Or does it need to be real time? When the requirement is real
time is actually real time. Near real-time enough, right?
That could be a big haven't. So near-real-time is enough
because even With you take any sort of monitoring in the cloud
and we can see when something stops working, right?
You, you know, it stops immediately at all, that, that
can be real time with the billing side of cloud happens.
There is a certain lag and it depends a bit on what type of
service you're using within the cloud, some Services go as far
as billing on the millisecond. Yeah, which is - crazy ugly and
some Services, go to the hour, so you can have anything in
between. You can have a second, you can
have a minute or intervals of 10 minutes or intervals of 10
seconds, sometimes it really depends and if there's so many
ways. So so the information will
always come with a lag. Yeah.
And but this is fine as long as you, you get it information out
there and you make people aware of it.
You can expect a reaction. Exactly.
And if you don't make it visible.
Yeah, don't expect a reaction. People might not even know that
it's happening right now and it's is it.
It's not about care. It's about focus and knowledge.
So if I don't know what, what, what would I do?
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
Someone needs to kind of be a fire started in that way, but if
you are, if we're looking at your past, you've probably been
part of a task force, or you've seen kind of wear.
The cost can be reduced the most within a few different
organizations, what? Usually kind of the trend, where
can people really be more efficient usually from what
you've seen and also how much can you optimize?
Okay, so let me break this down the first.
Yes, I have been in a lot of optimization.
Projects or task forces. And yeah, what I?
What identify is What needs to be optimized is the visibility
aspect, right? Make sure that the information
is there and transparency, right?
If you don't get transparency through, it's going to be hard
to get people involved. Yeah.
And you can do a lot from a centralized point of view but
you cannot do everything. Yeah.
With that said, when I look into optimization of services are
normally three because components that can be
optimized. Yeah.
And those would be compute. And then storage.
Yeah. And then networking.
Okay. So that order yes, I would maybe
it depends on the use case, of course, a lot.
But if I have to generalize. Yes.
Okay. So compute is the most
sought-after service exact Cloud.
Yeah. So everything that we do demands
compute power and there is a lot of compute power available in
the cloud and there. Is a lot of flavors and there is
a lot of ways of consuming that and is overwhelming.
Yeah, so People tend to choose something and they stick to
that. Oh yeah.
And The pace of innovation in the cloud is so big and there is
always something coming up and even if you're doing something
that is really efficient. Now, it might not be a month
from now. Yeah.
And it's important to keep an eye on that aside of making sure
that you were using it properly. So, All three components yeah,
in the cloud. Have one single aspect in terms
of optimization which is one of the fundamental premises of
cloud computing. Which is elasticity.
So you pay for what he you need ya to use.
Yeah, and you, when you use it instead of all the time, the D
use, when you use it is not I'm actively using my machine.
Yeah, it's more when you run it right?
You pay for for that as long as it runs.
Yeah. You might not be using it but
you're still paying for that because their runs in the
background. Yeah, it's running in the fact
that you're not doing anything with it, doesn't matter.
You're running it. It's not available for somebody
else. Any other customer of that cloud
provider to use it? Yeah, you're running it.
You're paying for it. Yeah.
Yeah, nobody is running it. It's okay.
Is the cloud provider problem. But if it's not available to
somebody to use because you're running, you're going to.
So you pay for what we use, when you use it, it's more like when
you run it and then you have to be sure that you're using it
every time for every single moment that it is running.
Yeah. Yes.
And The, this concept of elasticity is not always fully
leveraged. Exactly.
And this is one component that goes across because there's no
better way to, to optimize, then in from a cost perspective,
they're not using. Yeah, that's right.
So you can write size things, you can make things.
Okay, I have this machine and I could use that mobile version,
right? A smaller version of that, it
would be enough. The same amount of water would
fit in that class. Yeah.
And I'm still good, right? Yeah.
So these would be right sizing and these also moves a lot, but
let's say there's no water at all.
I do need. I don't need this, only the
class. Yeah, so in the past, I okay, I
bought this class so it doesn't matter.
I'm not using it already paid for that.
Yeah, now in the cloud you can just say, okay, I don't need it.
Somebody else use it? Yeah, covid aside.
But you do have to but you do have to be conscious of that,
right? If you're still running.
It even though you're not using it, you're going to pay for it.
So. Yeah.
And and and it's about not only that it's only also about do I
know that I'm not making the best out of this specific
resource here, right? Do I have the tools to monitor,
not only how am I doing in terms of cost, know how I'm doing
terms of performers as well? Right.
And in storage, it's, it's funny.
We don't see so abstract, For us right now in the past you would
have a huge sand environments. Right?
The other you you would store you have the Unis there.
Whatever you use hard disks or any sort of device to store.
Yeah flash wants doesn't matter. The point is there was something
there at some point. This would be fully consumed and
then you would have to buy another one.
All right, we're clear. A up or make backups or nowadays
is so abstract it. It seems we have virtually
unlimited. Yeah feels like it right.
There is a cost for that so if you don't need that information
anymore you need to make sure that this gets deleted.
Yeah, otherwise you're going to pay for it forever.
I probably mean this forever because I don't think cloud is
going anywhere any soon. So, Think of a file.
Yeah. An object and you put it in the
cloud and you store it. It's a one megabyte.
Yeah. And you use this once.
You don't need it anymore, you could delete that but that's one
file. Yeah it's there that's how it
starts things of think of millions.
Yeah. Billions of objects right?
And they are still there available for you.
One API call away. Yeah.
But nobody will ever make that easy.
Like, oh yeah, I need to stay there, and if you cost you every
single mom, every single month, and this is how things get done
and you have tools and practices to to make sure that this does
not happen. Yeah.
And you create lifecycle management, right?
And then you make sure that. Okay I need this for one month
and then I got to take new pictures of the same product and
then I don't need these pictures anymore so you move them.
To an archive, which is going to be cheaper.
And you can say after a year, if I don't retrieve that from the
archive, just permanently delete that.
Yeah, and that's it. And the same for full volume
snapshot, or things like that. So, there is a lot of unused
things in the cloud, and when you talk about storage, yeah.
So when you talk about compute is more about the elasticity and
right-sizing that when you talk about storage it's about unused
and non-managed information. For how long it stays there
available fully available? Yeah.
On the MS. Pink it's there and you can have
in a cheaper storage category that will take one second to
retrieve that same object and it's going to be less than half
the price. Yeah it really reminds me of
kind of a real life example of someone that probably has too
much stuff in their house, right?
At some point. It's not going to fit.
Are you going to pay for a bigger house?
Probably not. You can throw some stuff away.
Exactly. Great.
Analogy. Yeah, it is and it's, it's also
both things kind of speak to to what we have on the networking.
Yeah, part. Because this is a cause that was
sort of fixed. Yeah.
In the past when you think about all the transfers that happen in
an IT environment in the past, you would have your on-prem data
center, right? Follow your discs, there your
son environment, your networking devices, your computer's, the
servers, or the end, The Edge Computers right there.
The users notebooks and everything and there is
information trafficking all the time and everything running
there. It's kind of it's for free right
now. And if you need to send an
email, well, you're already paying a fixed Bill to your data
Communications provider to have, I do DSL or Fiber sort of
connection, In your company and locate these paid, it's going to
traffic through the internet but the price is paid right?
And in the cloud that's not and you pay for everything that is
trafficking. Yeah.
Especially if it's US versus the internet so it goes moves.
So within your environment that's going to be fine and
normally if you breach of some sort of boundary so You know, if
it really goes out to the internet, then you're going to
start paying these. Something people were not used
to, and they don't even pay attention to that, but there is
a big component of the cost of the cloud there.
So in imagine that when you when you tie all those things
together, right within an organization, some aspects are
going to go wrong. Some aspects are going to go
right on average what would you say the the cost reduction has
been for the organizations who have been involved in my my
experience is that You can always find between 25 to 30
percent. Yeah, optimizations in the cost,
that's incredible. Yeah, and if you look at the
size of this Market I just saw Heidi see I think in September
mentioned that we would get to one point three trillion dollars
in Cloud by 25. Yeah and currently Gardener says
400 billion four hundred eight billion yeah this Revenue of
cloud. Yeah.
For this year. Yeah.
So that's a lot of money, 30% of optimization there.
Yeah, then yeah, there is a big, big Market at a big big need for
this. Yeah, I can imagine.
I mean, it's not going to come out of the box, right?
Someone needs to really bring that awareness within either an
organization and definitely within the teams that are using
it. Because right now, if everyone
had a credit card and your company owner, you're not going
to feel comfortable. Yeah, but that is how it It is
in the cloud kind of, it is take it to yourself, right?
Take it to your home, you leave your home to, come to work and
you you turn off the lights? Yeah, you leave your work and
you don't need that resource running in the cloud anymore.
Turn it off. And then you're going to stop
pay for that take ownership, right?
Be that person and learn try to learn and be informed about
that. Just the same way you had to
learn new things when you start working in the cloud, right?
Yeah. And you try to challenge If it's
not about saving money for the company is not about saving
money for the company, it's about extracting value from the
cloud. Yeah, delivering that value
somewhere. Right?
Find what makes you take? It's about sustainability.
So if you're not using a resource running in the cloud
provider data center, something's not being used and
it's a, they're probably going to shut that down.
Yeah. And it's going to be less carbon
footprint, exact? So find something that motivates
you to think of that. Yeah.
And Apply to your day-to-day. It starts small and it doesn't
need to be a big thing. You have a team doing that from
a central place? Yeah.
And then you, you do your little part of it.
Yeah, exactly. Make sure that you have the
visibility ask that from your company, if you don't have it
and start making a small changes, right?
Yeah. I love hearing that because
those small changes are going to add up, right?
And it's, those are really going to make the difference.
In the same way the files would Stack Up and become a
meaningful. Yeah.
And throughout Time really hurt financials.
Yeah, small changes will compound as well is that they
will bring big positive impact and I think that's all
technology is about, right? Yeah, make sure that yeah,
awesome. I really like, kind of hearing
about why you're passionate about Phillips in the first
place. The kind of going into what it
is and what it? What does it mean?
Exactly. And how our organization
struggling with this and how is it evolving down to?
Where can you optimize, right? The three, the three biggest
Costs in compute storage and network.
And then also when you've actually optimized right that 30
to 25 percent. That's a big slice money?
Yeah, I think of how much you're doing every month.
Yeah. And if you don't have the
visibility ask for that, you should get it.
And then think of there is a business case, probably for you
to start investing on this to have somebody to get specialized
in this and to get your team's to spend some time doing that.
So, yeah, go for it. Just do start small.
Exactly cool. I want to thank you for coming.
Well Michelle, I think you've had a watching you love talking
about this. I really feel that, man.
I I learned a lot, which is awesome.
That's great, pleasure to be here and let's keep on going for
sure. Sure, he shows it mine.
Everyone. Thank you.
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