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Hello and welcome to Drinks at 
the Bar, a podcast where we 

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break through the 4th wall and 
discuss everything about dance 

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and the theater industry. 
My name is Paul James Rooney, a 

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dancer, choreographer and dance 
teacher based in Copenhagen, and

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I am your host of Drinks at the 
Bar. 

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And today, I'm joined by my 
regular guest host, model, 

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activist, actress Monica 
Bellucci. 

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Hi everybody, I'm Monica 
Bellucci, director of the Dancer

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Studio London, classical ballet 
teacher and actor with the Royal

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Ballet. 
Here we will discuss everything 

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from hearing backstage stories, 
touring shenanigans, to deeper 

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issues like body image training,
the reality of being a freelance

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dancer, and the face of Cartier.
With Guest Professionals We are 

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with guest professionals. 
We are here to share our 

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knowledge, experience, and help 
you with any questions or 

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problems you may have about 
dance and navigating the dance 

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world. 
I really didn't know that Monica

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Bellucci was the muse and 
ambassador of Carte in 2000. 

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And 20. 
And literally was Googling her 

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today I was saying oh OK, that's
what she's. 

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Done. 
Fair enough. 

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Well done. 
How are you? 

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I am exhausted, OK? 
I've literally had 27 minutes of

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sleep. 
Last night Alan and I were 

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invited to the Bafta's after 
party sponsored by Netflix, 

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which was amazing, but it was a 
very late night. 

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Well, actually it wasn't that 
late. 

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We did get home at a reasonable 
hour, but then Alan had to leave

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for the airport very, very early
this morning. 

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So we're just very, very tired. 
I'm not as tired as my husband 

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because he's had to go straight 
into action. 

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But it was a lot of fun. 
But yeah, I am paying for it 

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today. 
How are you? 

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I'm fine. 
I wanted to hear more. 

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So what was the what was the 
party? 

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Tell me about the party. 
OK, so first of all, the call 

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time for the party was 9:30 PM, 
which is far too late for a lady

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of my age. 
Oh, you mentioned actually you 

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might have been doing some 
makeup. 

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Did you did? 
Did you end up saying yes to the

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job or? 
I I made myself available to 

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assist my fabulous celebrity 
makeup artist friend Neil Young,

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who was amazing, just absolute 
amazing. 

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I sometimes if he needs me, 
we'll assist him, which is a 

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great joy. 
It means I can dip my toe back 

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into the makeup world. 
Amazing. 

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But he all of his bookings 
didn't, he didn't basically need

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a second pair of hands for this 
booking, which actually turned 

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out quite well because it just 
meant I could relax and on 

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Sunday and, you know, Alan and I
could enjoy the day and we went 

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for a Sunday roast and spend 
some time together and then we 

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could relax and then get ready 
for this party last night. 

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So it was amazing. 
It was really, really amazing. 

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It was just a little bit late 
for me. 

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I like to be tucked up with 
Netflix and, you know, just 

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relaxing. 
But it was sometimes you have to

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push yourself, don't you? 
And go out and, you know, 

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listen, it was a really 
wonderful party. 

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At one point, Kate Hudson was 
stood behind Alan at the bar. 

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I spent most of the evening 
talking to an amazing actress 

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called Kush Jumbo. 
She's fantastic. 

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She was in The Good Wife, which 
I think you may have seen. 

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She's. 
Oh, I like the good. 

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One, she's the short hair. 
She's actually British, but she 

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plays within a moment. 
Oh, she's in The Good Wife and I

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think she is she even in the 
good fight as. 

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Well, I think so the. 
Follow up from that and I think 

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I saw her in something in Take 
one of those miniseries. 

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In England. 
Nine episode, yeah. 

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Exactly. 
Yeah, me too. 

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So that was that was a real 
thrill. 

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So she was lovely. 
So a little bit of celeb 

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spotting and it was very nice to
stop that, to talk to stork 

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stork to stalk Kush. 
So that was brilliant. 

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Yeah. 
So I had a fabulous night. 

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It was a nice little treat. 
And I am absolutely exhausted 

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today, but you know. 
Well, I was on for yet another 

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track as Swing in Sound of 
Music. 

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Life is full of surprises. 
So far we have done. 

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We've done two weeks of shows. 
I have not been on twice. 

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Wow. 
Yeah, so there's been a grand 

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total of two shows that haven't 
needed a swing, which is kind of

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incredible. 
But you know, it's kind of, you 

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know, it's that time of year 
where everybody's sick. 

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And in a musical it is slightly 
different from a dance, dance 

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company because, you know, yes, 
if you if you've got the flu, 

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you can't really go on or 
whatever. 

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But like, if you've got a, a 
sore throat, you can still do 

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Martha Graham's Lamentation or 
Sugar Plum Fairy. 

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You can't really sing Defying 
Gravity, you know, with 

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laryngitis. 
So, you know, there is that that

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difference in the musical 
theatre industry that people do 

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go off when a dancer wouldn't go
off, but that's because they 

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have to sing and you can't 
really sing if you have no 

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voice. 
So that, well, my, my week has 

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not been the most exciting in 
the world, but day off today. 

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So that's lovely. 
Yeah, yeah, but they've kept you

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very busy. 
Very busy. 

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Because it's such an early 
moment in the run and you've 

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been on more than some of the 
actual cast for a job that you 

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didn't sign up for, really. 
Completely. 

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You know, so it's you've really,
they've really utilised you to 

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the Max within like the first 
week. 

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Well, exactly. 
And also I when they offered me 

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the roll of swing, I thought, 
yeah, of course that'd be nice. 

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You know, a little bit of. 
Pop in and out. 

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Yeah, but also like a little bit
of drama being thrown in and 

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having to work on the fly and 
all of that kind of stuff. 

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That kind of excites me a little
bit. 

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But I also thought, you know, 
oh, OK, yes, I'll say yes to 

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this. 
And there'll be a couple of 

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nights when I don't have to go 
on and just relax and it'll be a

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bit chilled. 
It's been busier than if I 

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actually wasn't the cast. 
Yeah, and for for an evening 

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where you're not required to go 
on because everybody has signed 

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in, everyone's fit and healthy, 
they're all in for the show. 

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How long do you have to stay in 
the theatre until you can 

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technically leave safely? 
Well, funny enough, James and I 

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were discussing this. 
I think it was on the premiere 

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we were discussing this with my 
partner who is the stage 

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manager, and James was like, you
could go at the gunshot, which 

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anyone who's worked in Matthew 
born Swan Lake. 

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Here we go. 
Knows that that's when you go go

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home. 
There's a gunshot at the end of 

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Act 3:00, and basically most 
shows have like a point in the 

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show where you're allowed to go 
home if you are the swing or 

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something. 
And it's usually the last moment

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in the show where you would have
time to get changed, get into 

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costume and get on stage and be 
able to save the day kind of 

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thing. 
And I spoke to James about it 

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and I thought, well, yes, 
there's a final climb every 

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mountain reprise at the end of 
the show. 

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And just before that, it would 
be the final moment where I 

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could throw on a nun outfit, go 
on stage and sing the 10 O one 

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harmony and stand there in the 
graveyard. 

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But it's so close to the end. 
Anyway, that was just like, you 

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know what? 
I'm just going to wait till the 

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end of the show and then just 
go. 

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And I literally live A1 Kelly 
Clarkson song cycle ride away 

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from the theater. 
So it's not really the biggest 

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time saver to go 5 minutes 
earlier than the end of the 

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show. 
No, no, no. 

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And then you feel better because
at least you haven't missed, you

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know, anything, you're there if 
you need to go on, etcetera. 

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And also, sorry to interrupt 
also I want to be there 

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selfishly at the end of the show
so I can hear this sounds like 

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gossip but so I can hear any 
drama, but so I can hear if 

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anyone did get injured at the 
end of the show because then I'm

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prepared for the next day. 
Yeah, so you hear it in real 

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time rather than maybe getting a
text or a phone call the 

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following morning. 
Exactly. 

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So if someone has like, you 
know, something has happened at 

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the end of the show or something
happened during the show that 

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wasn't too crazy, but then they 
went to the stage manager after 

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the show and said actually, you 
know what? 

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My elbow is actually really bad.
I don't think I'm going to be 

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able to go on tomorrow, but I'll
let you know then. 

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I already get a heads up to look
at Jessica's track. 

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Yeah, yeah, it's always Jessica.
She's so unreliable. 

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I don't know why you keep 
employing her. 

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So today I wanted to talk about 
dance in the media. 

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Dance schools, on TV shows, 
ballet companies and films, that

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kind of stuff. 
Rihanna wearing Pointe shoes in 

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umbrella. 
Julia Stiles in Save the Last 

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Dance. 
Well, if we're going down that 

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road, let's start with a drink. 
Although I am on the sparkling 

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water today, I am rehydrating 
after a night of absolute chaos 

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and champagne. 
Well, maybe put a Barocca in 

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that water. 
That's not a bad idea, actually.

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Well, I have my second to last 
glass of my sparkly gin and 

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tonic. 
Oh, the glitter. 

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I have one more left the. 
Glitter tonic. 

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It's so fabulous when you pour 
it. 

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I actually even filmed it today.
Remind me where it came. 

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From it's a it's a gift from my 
friend who is South African and 

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it's a South African company. 
OK, so you couldn't replace it 

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even if you wanted to I suppose.
Was it? 

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Well, I actually met up with her
the other day and she said that 

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she needs to buy me another one,
so I didn't. 

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Say, Oh yeah, fabulous. 
Well, cheers and cheers to your 

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sparkling water. 
Yes, rehydration, all, all the 

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way. 
Honestly, I just, I had the one 

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glass of champagne that was just
refilled the entire evening. 

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It was unbelievable. 
And it's so easy to drink when 

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your glass is magically topped 
up. 

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So I had to be very mindful to 
sip and not just let the glass 

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be topped up 24/7 because it's 
just lethal. 

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It's very lethal. 
I even remember when you and I 

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would go to restaurants with 
Charles, for example, Charles 

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and he would take us out for 
dinner and then your wine glass 

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is just permanently filled up 
and you're kind of like, I swear

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I drank that glass. 
That's. 

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It is so it's lovely. 
Don't get me wrong, how lovely. 

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Oh, it is spoiled, but it is 
it's it can be deadly. 

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Well, cheers love. 
Cheers. 

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Let's get into this. 
Social media brought it to my 

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attention again because it's 
always been something that as a 

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dancer, you see films and TV 
shows about your industry and 

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you always kind of roll your 
eyes at it. 

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But it's quite a lot. 
Recently when you have 

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Instagram, for example, and you 
have adverts, commercials like 

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constantly bombarding your eyes 
and you see all these models 

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pretending to be ballerinas in 
campaigns and in shoots and even

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kind of your influences trying 
to be a ballet dancer in photo 

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shoes and it's just horrible. 
Yeah, I think especially for 

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classical ballet and like you 
say, point shoes, they just ask 

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these models to throw on the 
point shoes and and they don't 

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understand the aesthetic, never 
mind the skill and the technique

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that you need just to get up on 
points. 

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00:11:17,840 --> 00:11:22,360
So you're just met with, yes, 
probably a very beautiful model 

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wearing some very pretty ballet 
gear. 

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00:11:25,440 --> 00:11:31,320
But when you look at the feet 
and just how dangerous it it can

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be, but also dangerous for the 
eyes, for our eyes. 

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It it really I mean. 
It's vile. 

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It's when it's, it's the two 
things that do it to me. 

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The first thing is because they 
never tie the ribbons properly. 

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00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:50,560
No, there's always like a 
massive bow at the front of the 

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ankle and you kind of like, oh, 
or they cross it too many times.

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So it goes nearly all the way up
the shin and all the way up to 

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the kneecap. 
But then also they're never 

221
00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:06,960
broken in so it's like a rock 
solid Le Crusade pan on your 

222
00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:08,960
foot. 
Yeah, like a little weedabix, 

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00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:11,680
dry weedabix on the end of the 
leg. 

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00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:16,080
The only time I've actually seen
a model in a shoot pretending to

225
00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:19,880
be a ballet dancer and actually 
looking good is Kate Moss. 

226
00:12:21,000 --> 00:12:24,840
But again, we are talking about,
I think the shoot was Kate Moss 

227
00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:29,320
surrounded by dancers from the 
Royal Ballet Company and the 

228
00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:32,200
photograph was taken by Mario 
Testino. 

229
00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:37,400
So you have two people who are 
the top of their game doing it 

230
00:12:37,640 --> 00:12:43,440
and even they knew to hide. 
Kate Moss's feet only show her 

231
00:12:43,440 --> 00:12:46,600
from the waist up. 
And Mario Testino, I mean. 

232
00:12:47,320 --> 00:12:51,400
That's so funny, I literally 
that photo popped up yesterday. 

233
00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:53,520
Oh how odd. 
Black and white and it's dancers

234
00:12:53,520 --> 00:13:00,360
from the Royal Ballet Company 
and probably, probably late 90s,

235
00:13:00,360 --> 00:13:04,440
maybe or early 2000s. 
It literally popped up on 

236
00:13:04,440 --> 00:13:06,160
Instagram yesterday. 
And I was like, oh, because I've

237
00:13:06,160 --> 00:13:08,080
never seen it before. 
And she's kind of laughing. 

238
00:13:08,080 --> 00:13:10,840
And there's, she's surrounded by
some male dancers of the 

239
00:13:10,840 --> 00:13:12,880
company. 
But also there are some female, 

240
00:13:12,880 --> 00:13:15,360
the ballerinas on the other 
side, but within the same image.

241
00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:17,040
Yeah. 
But they crop the Super out. 

242
00:13:17,160 --> 00:13:17,600
Yeah. 
And. 

243
00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:20,960
That's the way to do it exactly.
But I mean you see, I mean I 

244
00:13:20,960 --> 00:13:24,320
don't really understand it 
myself because sometimes it's 

245
00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:30,000
even dancewear brands or very 
very up and coming new cheap 

246
00:13:30,000 --> 00:13:33,520
dancewear brands that use non 
dancers in photos, which for me 

247
00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:36,560
makes no sense. 
But even you're right. 

248
00:13:36,560 --> 00:13:42,800
But even big brand dancewear 
labels use on occasion, non 

249
00:13:42,800 --> 00:13:46,760
dancer models. 
And I guess they're trying to 

250
00:13:46,760 --> 00:13:50,760
say the message perhaps is, you 
know, this is dance wear, but 

251
00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:52,920
you know, it can be used for 
other it can be used for 

252
00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:56,560
athletics or whatever, you know,
gymnastics or whatever. 

253
00:13:56,640 --> 00:14:00,200
But it's it's just so 
distracting for the eye when you

254
00:14:00,200 --> 00:14:04,400
look at something designed. 
Again, I refer to classical 

255
00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:06,120
ballet. 
So you know the point shoes, the

256
00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:09,400
ballet types, the the line of. 
That's what it's really vile. 

257
00:14:10,080 --> 00:14:13,080
Yeah, just use lovely dancers 
where in abundance. 

258
00:14:13,760 --> 00:14:18,040
I tell you a a brand that does 
really nail it with their their 

259
00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:21,960
models, male, female and their 
child, their child models for 

260
00:14:21,960 --> 00:14:24,680
dance and that is. 
Is the dancers studio. 

261
00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:31,200
Is, and I am a little bit biased
here because it's one of my 

262
00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:33,920
favorite brands and we've 
already discussed my love for 

263
00:14:33,920 --> 00:14:41,160
their unitards, but where Moi 
where Moi nail it every time. 

264
00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:45,160
If you look at their they do 
campaigns and then go through 

265
00:14:45,160 --> 00:14:48,360
their online catalogue, you can 
tell they've really thought 

266
00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:51,360
they've really chosen the dancer
specifically to showcase what 

267
00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:54,640
they're they're showing off 
either the point shoe or the 

268
00:14:54,640 --> 00:14:57,800
leotard or whatever it is. 
And that's how it should be done

269
00:14:57,800 --> 00:15:01,240
because it's attractive and it 
and from a business plan 

270
00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:03,840
perspective, it makes you want 
to buy the thing because you 

271
00:15:03,840 --> 00:15:06,440
kind of think, gosh, if I buy 
that leotard, I'm going to look 

272
00:15:06,440 --> 00:15:09,320
like, you know, of course, but 
we all do it. 

273
00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:12,760
If I buy that item, I'm going to
get a sense of of feeling that 

274
00:15:12,760 --> 00:15:14,240
way or looking that way. 
It's just small. 

275
00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:17,280
Well, 100% because that's what 
happens with, I don't know. 

276
00:15:18,160 --> 00:15:21,360
Well, going back to Monica 
Bellucci, like being the face of

277
00:15:21,360 --> 00:15:23,360
Cartier. 
The reason that is, is that, oh,

278
00:15:23,360 --> 00:15:26,920
if I wear that jewelry or that 
watch, I'm going to look and be 

279
00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:29,480
like Monica Bellucci. 
It's the same kind of thing if 

280
00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:34,960
if I don't know if Yosvani Ramos
is wearing those hot pants and 

281
00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:37,080
that leotard, I'm going to look 
like that. 

282
00:15:37,080 --> 00:15:41,760
You know, it's a dancers 
celebrity in front of you trying

283
00:15:41,760 --> 00:15:43,520
to sell a product and that's how
it should be. 

284
00:15:43,720 --> 00:15:47,200
But it's a when while the one 
that used EMB dancers back in 

285
00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:50,320
the day wasn't it? 
Like Adela and I want to say 

286
00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:54,840
maybe even Cindy Jordan and 
James Forbat maybe as well. 

287
00:15:54,840 --> 00:15:55,760
Yeah. 
Yeah. 

288
00:15:55,760 --> 00:16:00,280
So what happened, particularly 
when I was at school, is that 

289
00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:05,680
you had where more UK where you 
had access to those lovely polar

290
00:16:05,680 --> 00:16:09,960
fleeces that everybody wore, the
dungarees and whatnot, which I 

291
00:16:10,240 --> 00:16:14,320
am obsessed with. 
And I actually, I actually 

292
00:16:14,720 --> 00:16:19,520
contacted Elizabeth Miege, who's
the founder, Co founder of Wear 

293
00:16:19,520 --> 00:16:21,880
More. 
Also she was dancing in E&B 

294
00:16:21,880 --> 00:16:24,840
company when I was there on loan
from the school. 

295
00:16:25,320 --> 00:16:28,000
And that's where I bought my 
first Wear More fleece. 

296
00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:31,600
And I have a black, I have two 
black ones. 

297
00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:39,160
I have a Navy blue 1 and I have 
and I have a burgundy 1, which 

298
00:16:39,160 --> 00:16:43,200
was my emergency back up fleece 
because there was a moment where

299
00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:45,720
we were rehearsing Swan Lake and
actually we were called in a 

300
00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:51,000
week earlier to help train some 
of the new Swans and I didn't 

301
00:16:51,000 --> 00:16:53,080
have. 
My sorry, I'm just loving the 

302
00:16:53,080 --> 00:16:55,760
fact this is called an emergency
fleece. 

303
00:16:56,680 --> 00:17:01,760
I so we we had this extra week 
put into our rehearsal schedule 

304
00:17:02,040 --> 00:17:04,359
and I didn't have my dancewear 
with me because I wasn't 

305
00:17:04,359 --> 00:17:06,599
expecting to to need it that 
that week. 

306
00:17:06,839 --> 00:17:09,760
So I made a special trip to 
remember when poor Sally used to

307
00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:12,560
be on West Street, where the 
same street where the Ivy 

308
00:17:12,560 --> 00:17:15,520
restaurant is. 
Well, poor Sally, the dancewear 

309
00:17:15,520 --> 00:17:18,960
shop used to be there, tiny, 
tiny shop, but it was packed 

310
00:17:18,960 --> 00:17:22,040
full of treats. 
And I just, I remember going 

311
00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:25,319
first thing before I had to be 
at Sadler's Wells for my first 

312
00:17:25,319 --> 00:17:26,960
rehearsal. 
I was like, Oh my God, can you 

313
00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:29,720
please tell me you have some of 
these, you know, polar, you 

314
00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:33,240
know, Eskimo, Waermoir, fleece. 
And they didn't have any darker 

315
00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:35,360
colours. 
The darkest, the darkest colour 

316
00:17:35,360 --> 00:17:39,840
was the like aubergine burgundy,
which is not really my vibe, but

317
00:17:39,880 --> 00:17:42,200
it was like I had to get it. 
And I still have that. 

318
00:17:42,200 --> 00:17:44,920
But they're in storage from 
India, so I only have access to 

319
00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:47,240
my black one. 
But what was the point? 

320
00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:48,600
I don't even know what we're 
talking about. 

321
00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:52,240
You just don't. 
We're just praising Wemoir. 

322
00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:56,040
I love. 
Fleas. 

323
00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:59,920
I mean, back in the day wasn't 
before the Wemoir fleece was 

324
00:17:59,920 --> 00:18:01,760
there? 
Lots of the dancers used to wear

325
00:18:01,760 --> 00:18:03,840
this kind of like baby romper 
thing. 

326
00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:05,840
Yes, that was the prequel to The
Fleece. 

327
00:18:05,920 --> 00:18:10,520
Yes. 
Yeah, you had one, I had two. 

328
00:18:10,520 --> 00:18:15,400
I had a short one in Navy blue 
and I had a dark coloured full 

329
00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:16,680
length one. 
Yeah, yeah, yeah. 

330
00:18:16,680 --> 00:18:18,720
I mean they're not. 
The irony is that they're not 

331
00:18:18,720 --> 00:18:20,400
flattering at. 
All. 

332
00:18:21,560 --> 00:18:25,280
They're really not, but it was 
the trend of the of the day and 

333
00:18:25,280 --> 00:18:27,320
just to go back to that form of 
conversation because we're 

334
00:18:27,320 --> 00:18:29,480
having multiple conversations at
the same time. 

335
00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:33,320
Yes, A&B dancers were used on 
the UK. 

336
00:18:33,360 --> 00:18:35,560
That was a point of that was my 
point. 

337
00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:42,000
So the UK website had the E&B 
dances right for the longest 

338
00:18:42,000 --> 00:18:46,040
time so that that that would be 
the place where I I would order 

339
00:18:46,040 --> 00:18:51,320
my face. 
OK then now we have Wenwa USA 

340
00:18:51,320 --> 00:18:55,880
and Wenwa Europe. 
That whole line has been cut 

341
00:18:55,880 --> 00:19:01,320
which is why I emailed Elizabeth
Miaos on LinkedIn to say where 

342
00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:05,200
can I get these fleeces from 
because I need a new one and she

343
00:19:05,200 --> 00:19:09,160
said the line has stopped now so
so something happened. 

344
00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:11,440
We're plotting her death. 
I was devastated. 

345
00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:14,240
Thankfully, Repetto do a very 
similar one. 

346
00:19:14,240 --> 00:19:15,440
Anyway, that's a whole other 
episode. 

347
00:19:18,120 --> 00:19:22,040
Just to wrap this up, we're. 
Supposed to be talking about 

348
00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:24,920
dance in the media and all we're
doing is talking about warmups. 

349
00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:28,160
This is really important, 
something happened between the 

350
00:19:28,160 --> 00:19:32,360
UK website and that, as opposed 
to global European USA website 

351
00:19:32,360 --> 00:19:34,440
where the UK website just got 
cut. 

352
00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:37,400
Much like this conversation is 
probably going to become. 

353
00:19:38,240 --> 00:19:43,920
I won't make the actual edit. 
Oh my God, I can't even remember

354
00:19:43,920 --> 00:19:45,600
what our point was. 
Let's move on. 

355
00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:48,840
I told you I was tired. 
We're talking about models. 

356
00:19:49,120 --> 00:19:53,400
We're talking about non models 
modelling dancewear and things. 

357
00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:56,000
OK, right. 
Moving swiftly on. 

358
00:19:56,000 --> 00:20:01,680
My God. 
So I'm a little bit too young 

359
00:20:01,680 --> 00:20:04,760
for fame. 
Like Fame, the TV series that 

360
00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:06,480
was around which? 
As am I. 

361
00:20:07,360 --> 00:20:11,520
Which, if you didn't know people
out there, Janet Jackson was in 

362
00:20:11,520 --> 00:20:12,800
fame. 
The TV series. 

363
00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:15,800
Yes, yes, very, very Janet 
Jackson. 

364
00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:18,800
But I'm too young for that and 
I'm I don't think I've ever 

365
00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:20,480
actually seen fame the film 
either. 

366
00:20:20,840 --> 00:20:26,160
Get out. 
I mean, I mean, I did, I did see

367
00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:28,720
Footloose and I did see 
Flashdance and everything and 

368
00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:30,880
they're all of their time 
period. 

369
00:20:30,880 --> 00:20:35,800
For me growing up, it was Save 
the last Dance center stage. 

370
00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:38,680
Billy Elliott. 
I, I mean, Billy Elliott hit me 

371
00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:42,720
at AI think I was about 1516 
when Billy Elliott came out. 

372
00:20:42,840 --> 00:20:47,000
Those are the the films that 
kind of showcased the dance 

373
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:51,160
world when I was younger. 
And yeah, for me, I remember 

374
00:20:51,160 --> 00:20:54,840
having a very big reaction to 
Billy Elliott and not a +1. 

375
00:20:55,760 --> 00:20:58,800
Really. 
I I thought the film was fine up

376
00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:01,000
until he auditioned for the 
Royal Ballet School, Right. 

377
00:21:01,040 --> 00:21:04,760
And then when he auditioned for 
the Royal Ballet School, I 

378
00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:08,640
obviously already then was an 
old jaded queen. 

379
00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:13,120
Yeah, because when there's when 
he's at the audition panel and 

380
00:21:13,120 --> 00:21:16,120
they say we just want to know 
what it feels like when you 

381
00:21:16,120 --> 00:21:19,480
dance. 
And literally at that point, you

382
00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:22,800
know, stood up, pointed at the 
TV and said, I call bullshit 

383
00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:25,080
because that is not what it's 
like. 

384
00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:26,680
I'm sorry. 
No, no. 

385
00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:30,760
Not at what? 
Not one point would the Royal 

386
00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:34,680
Ballet School or any other 
ballet schools out there when 

387
00:21:34,680 --> 00:21:40,240
they are auditioning hundreds of
11 year olds, would they stop 

388
00:21:40,240 --> 00:21:43,640
their little one in doing a solo
in front of them and say, so 

389
00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:45,400
what's it feel like when you 
dance? 

390
00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:48,880
That does not happen. 
And it made me, it made me 

391
00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:51,080
think, it made me a little bit 
angry watching it. 

392
00:21:51,080 --> 00:21:54,240
I think because probably because
I wish it was like that. 

393
00:21:55,360 --> 00:21:57,440
Because firstly, you don't get 
to dance a solo. 

394
00:21:57,600 --> 00:22:00,520
You don't get to show yourself 
after your basic best ability 

395
00:22:00,520 --> 00:22:04,200
and what you think suits you. 
Not that an 11 year old me knew 

396
00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:07,600
what suited me best. 
It was kind of harking back to 

397
00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:08,760
what we spoke about with 
auditions. 

398
00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:12,080
It was kind of a cattle call. 
And I remember I stood in, stood

399
00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:15,480
in lines and they would say 
right frontline, everybody point

400
00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:18,040
your right foot and they'd look 
at everybody cool, now point 

401
00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:20,200
your left foot. 
Now go in the splits, now go in 

402
00:22:20,200 --> 00:22:21,920
the center splits, now go in the
left splits. 

403
00:22:22,040 --> 00:22:23,920
And obviously there was some 
dancing as well, but there was 

404
00:22:23,920 --> 00:22:28,480
never a solo that you prepared 
and then then an interview 

405
00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:30,200
talking about what you thought 
about dancing. 

406
00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:32,760
And I, I think I got angry 
because I wished it was like 

407
00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:35,640
that. 
Yeah, I can appreciate that for 

408
00:22:35,640 --> 00:22:38,560
sure. 
And I think also perhaps it's 

409
00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:44,560
interesting because why not just
show how it really is? 

410
00:22:44,560 --> 00:22:47,320
If you're going to invest in 
creating something, I don't 

411
00:22:47,320 --> 00:22:51,160
understand why you have to 
create this imaginary scene or 

412
00:22:51,160 --> 00:22:55,040
dialogue or whatever it is to 
portray to the audience that you

413
00:22:55,040 --> 00:22:57,400
think the audience. 
I mean, I suppose this is a is a

414
00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:02,800
note to the directors of these 
dance, but if you're going to 

415
00:23:02,880 --> 00:23:07,080
spend energy and, you know, and 
time researching, you know, the 

416
00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:10,960
dance world, why not just show 
it as it is? 

417
00:23:10,960 --> 00:23:14,760
Does it really need all of the 
extra storytelling that doesn't 

418
00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:19,640
exist within the real realm of 
the industry to tell your story?

419
00:23:19,640 --> 00:23:21,960
I find it really interesting. 
It happens. 

420
00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:27,040
I mean, I'm not a fan at all of 
dance themed TV series or films.

421
00:23:27,360 --> 00:23:31,320
I mean, some I have watched out 
of intrigue for sure, but 

422
00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:33,240
they're never accurate. 
And it's like you said, it's 

423
00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:36,680
infuriating. 
And I just don't understand why 

424
00:23:36,880 --> 00:23:40,920
they have to be heightened in 
negative ways because people do.

425
00:23:41,120 --> 00:23:43,600
They take it as gospel. 
They believe that's how the 

426
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:46,480
industry is. 
The amount of people that have 

427
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:48,560
mentioned, oh, so you're a, you 
know, new people. 

428
00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:49,480
Oh, you're a dancer. 
Oh, great. 

429
00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:51,400
Is it really like Black Swan? 
Yeah. 

430
00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:54,920
Oh, my God, Do I really have to 
have this conversation again? 

431
00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:56,600
Like, what is it that you want 
to know? 

432
00:23:57,120 --> 00:24:00,120
And are you interested in 
knowing anything? 

433
00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:01,480
Reality. 
Yeah. 

434
00:24:02,040 --> 00:24:05,480
I mean, for me, what was quite 
funny is that Billy Elliott 

435
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:08,360
saves the last dance with Julia 
Stiles, my God. 

436
00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:11,080
And also kind of flashdance as 
well. 

437
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:15,720
They all kind of have that same 
audition to get into the school 

438
00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:19,320
story, you know, they don't fit 
in the box and then they do 

439
00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:22,160
their own thing at the audition 
and they get in anyway. 

440
00:24:22,560 --> 00:24:26,800
Yeah, which I don't know how 
based in reality that is, but 

441
00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:31,160
yeah, that's that. 
However, I will say with Centre 

442
00:24:31,160 --> 00:24:35,120
Stage, when that came out, yes, 
it's full of drama and sleeping 

443
00:24:35,120 --> 00:24:38,840
with the director and anorexia 
and stuff like this. 

444
00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:43,440
I actually felt that that movie 
was quite close to reality. 

445
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,120
Yeah, yeah. 
As horrible as that sounds and 

446
00:24:46,120 --> 00:24:49,640
the issues that are in that 
movie, I actually think it it's 

447
00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:52,320
not as crazy as Black Swan 
because obviously Black Swan is 

448
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:55,000
kind of like a horror thriller 
kind of movie thing. 

449
00:24:55,360 --> 00:24:58,960
I felt that center stage was out
of everything I've seen pretty 

450
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:02,440
accurate. 
I mean the sleeping with 

451
00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:08,080
directors and the and the 
anorexia and you know, the way 

452
00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:11,520
the cast list goes up and all of
that kind of stuff is pretty 

453
00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:12,920
accurate. 
Sorry, but. 

454
00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:15,960
Yeah. 
I mean, they definitely, they 

455
00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:20,880
definitely touched on things 
that were based in some truth. 

456
00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:23,560
So they obviously did some 
research. 

457
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:26,680
It's all the extra. 
I mean, it's, it's difficult. 

458
00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:31,200
I understand that, you know, 
when you're creating a film, the

459
00:25:31,200 --> 00:25:34,000
idea is to sell as many tickets 
as possible and try and make as 

460
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:38,400
much profit as possible, right? 
So if the sex needs to be 

461
00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:42,640
heightened or the drama needs to
be heightened, I get all of 

462
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:45,120
that. 
But what's infuriating is when 

463
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:50,560
all of the inaccuracies and 
going back to Black Swan again, 

464
00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:53,600
when they announced, oh, you 
know, Black Swan is coming out, 

465
00:25:53,640 --> 00:25:55,560
there was a there was a lot of 
buzz around it. 

466
00:25:55,560 --> 00:25:59,600
And in some ways I was very 
interested and excited to see it

467
00:25:59,600 --> 00:26:03,720
because I thought how lovely to 
have a film based, you know, 

468
00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:07,240
within the story of Swan Lake 
and, you know, in a dance 

469
00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:10,680
company, you know. 
Also Natalie Portman Stan, I do 

470
00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:11,720
like her. 
Me too. 

471
00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:14,720
Yeah, me too. 
Lovely leading character. 

472
00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:17,960
You know, this came out in 2010.
So, you know, I thought we've 

473
00:26:17,960 --> 00:26:22,280
probably moved beyond kind of 
tacky, cliche dance films and 

474
00:26:22,320 --> 00:26:24,120
there's been a little bit of an 
evolution. 

475
00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:28,400
But immediately in the beginning
of the film, I was, I was 

476
00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:31,760
already angry when I don't know 
how familiar you are with the 

477
00:26:31,760 --> 00:26:35,160
film, but the company are doing 
company class and I think 

478
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:37,920
they're auditioning. 
I think the scenario is they're 

479
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:41,000
doing company class, they're 
auditioning for upcoming casting

480
00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:43,200
of Swan Lake. 
So they're all kind of doing 

481
00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:47,320
their best full company and the 
director, so they're still at 

482
00:26:47,320 --> 00:26:50,760
the bar, right? 
The director walks into the 

483
00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:53,400
studio. 
They're still doing the 

484
00:26:53,400 --> 00:26:57,000
exercises, but he's then 
launches into this massive 

485
00:26:57,000 --> 00:27:00,960
speech about casting and the 
importance and just it would 

486
00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:02,600
never happen. 
Well, no. 

487
00:27:02,600 --> 00:27:04,640
These people are in the company.
They know what how a company 

488
00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:06,840
works. 
But also they're doing company 

489
00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:10,160
class, Granted it's for an 
audition or for or forecasting, 

490
00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:12,400
but they're doing a company 
class. 

491
00:27:12,640 --> 00:27:16,960
Like, why would the director 
waltz into the studio, start to 

492
00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:20,920
circle, you know, the dances and
start giving this very dramatic 

493
00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:23,520
speech? 
That annoyed me immediately 

494
00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:25,080
because I was like, well, that 
would never happen. 

495
00:27:25,360 --> 00:27:26,880
I can't imagine it's ever 
happened. 

496
00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:29,600
But if it has, I mean, that's so
egotistical of the director. 

497
00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:32,040
That's so warped. 
If that has happened, it's so 

498
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:34,080
unlikely. 
The only thing that could happen

499
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:36,680
is that the director could maybe
give a speech before class 

500
00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:39,000
started or when people are 
stretching in between. 

501
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:42,200
Barman Center could say, just so
you know, so and so is watching 

502
00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:44,240
this class to cast for his next 
ballet. 

503
00:27:44,840 --> 00:27:48,760
Absolutely never talking 
through, you know, the pianist 

504
00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:52,840
and the dancers doing exercises 
already that sets the tone of 

505
00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:55,160
the film. 
And so I was annoyed at kind of 

506
00:27:55,360 --> 00:27:57,440
just how that would never 
happen. 

507
00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:02,200
And then before we move on from 
Black Swan, because there are 

508
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:05,600
moments that are interesting and
there are moments accurate. 

509
00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:11,040
I did love seeing, you know, the
exquisite costumes and hearing 

510
00:28:11,040 --> 00:28:15,400
the music slightly reworked for 
film and, you know, glimpses of 

511
00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:18,600
the studio and whatnot. 
But they were very proud. 

512
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:21,160
The creative team were very 
proud of Natalie Portman, you 

513
00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:24,800
know, spending an intensive year
training in classical ballet. 

514
00:28:24,840 --> 00:28:28,200
Wonderful for her, the 
commitment and the discipline 

515
00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:30,960
that you need. 
But 12 months is not going to 

516
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:32,680
cut it. 
And they used a body double 

517
00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:34,360
anyway. 
But the moments where she's 

518
00:28:34,360 --> 00:28:37,480
dancing, she did very, very 
well. 

519
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:40,080
But as a professional dancer, if
you go back and look at those 

520
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:44,040
scenes, I mean, they're edited, 
you know, it really, it's just 

521
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:47,520
unnecessary. 
There are so many wonderful 

522
00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:51,480
dancers that can act. 
And I get the draw of a big star

523
00:28:51,480 --> 00:28:53,200
celebrity name. 
But if you're going to do a 

524
00:28:53,200 --> 00:28:58,880
dance themed film, particularly 
a classical ballet themed film, 

525
00:28:59,680 --> 00:29:02,840
surely there must be an 
exquisite actor or actor. 

526
00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:08,120
But I think that's also why I 
think I'm not a center stage big

527
00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:09,680
super fan. 
It sounds like I am. 

528
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:11,080
Talking. 
Here we go. 

529
00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:18,920
But the thing why I think center
stage worked was because I have 

530
00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:19,920
no idea. 
I'm sorry. 

531
00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:24,840
I'm sorry if you're listening 
guys, but the lead blonde girl 

532
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:29,760
is a real ballet dancer. 
The the boyfriend. 

533
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:32,680
The hot brown haired guy means 
nothing. 

534
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:37,520
He is a. 
Real ballet dancer Ethan Stifel 

535
00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:42,720
supposedly is a real ballet. 
I'm going to love my dancer. 

536
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:45,440
Exquisite. 
He's a real. 

537
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:48,120
Ballet dancer like so they are 
capable of. 

538
00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:52,520
Casting Yeah of casting this. 
Movie and actually having proper

539
00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:57,240
ballet dancers in the leads. 
They actually it was only the 

540
00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:01,680
the side role in what they 
called the supporting roles that

541
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:05,240
actually weren't ballet dancers.
Zoe. 

542
00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:07,240
Avatar Zoe. 
What's her name? 

543
00:30:08,280 --> 00:30:10,120
Saldana. 
Saldana. 

544
00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:12,920
She was in there because it was 
the time that she did like 

545
00:30:12,920 --> 00:30:17,120
Crossroads with Britney Spears 
and then did a centre stage era.

546
00:30:17,840 --> 00:30:20,360
She's the one who. 
Before she went down the sci-fi 

547
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:22,520
route, she was doing those kind 
of films. 

548
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:26,680
No, because she did that. 
The role of the girl who was she

549
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:28,360
had some great one liners in 
that film. 

550
00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:32,360
Isn't it better if we all do a 
triple-A nice clean double? 

551
00:30:32,760 --> 00:30:36,560
I'd like Shut it Zoe talking 
about Zoe's one liners. 

552
00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:40,200
That leads me on to another 
thing that I saw Neve Campbell 

553
00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:44,520
did a film called The Company. 
Yes, I do. 

554
00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:47,720
Remember hearing of this. 
I've never seen it but yes 

555
00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:49,360
you're right, I remember 
watching it. 

556
00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:51,320
Once ages ago and not think it 
was very good. 

557
00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:55,480
Anyway, I googled it before this
episode to see some clips of the

558
00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:58,800
dance sequences and the first 
thing that came up was this 

559
00:30:59,360 --> 00:31:01,880
scene that was in a rehearsal 
room. 

560
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:05,040
And basically the choreographer 
is there working with these two 

561
00:31:05,040 --> 00:31:07,920
guys doing this kind of 
contemporary piece with the guys

562
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,440
in skirts. 
Very Martha Graham lamentation. 

563
00:31:11,800 --> 00:31:14,760
And then basically said, yes, 
just grab the skirt, take the 

564
00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:19,640
skirt in a whatever way. 
And then straight away the other

565
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:21,200
guy goes, that's not what you 
said yesterday. 

566
00:31:21,200 --> 00:31:23,600
Yesterday you wanted to do this 
and yesterday you wanted us to 

567
00:31:23,600 --> 00:31:25,840
take the skirt like this and 
starts kicking off straight, 

568
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:27,200
right. 
Exactly that facial pulling 

569
00:31:27,200 --> 00:31:29,240
right now. 
That's that's exactly what I was

570
00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:33,360
thinking when that happened. 
I was like, OK, firstly, I don't

571
00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:36,240
think that's very realistic that
a dancer would just snap back at

572
00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:40,000
the choreographer unprovoked 
straight away, I mean. 

573
00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:43,360
Well, they've all done it at one
point. 

574
00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:45,480
Not correct actually I would 
say. 

575
00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:49,320
No, I haven't, but I've seen it 
happen. 

576
00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:52,600
But when I was watching this, I 
was like, this is giving. 

577
00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:57,160
It's giving male gay dancers a 
very bad Rep. 

578
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:01,520
It just came across as basically
a bitchy queen kicking off. 

579
00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:02,800
Yeah, playing. 
Up. 

580
00:32:02,840 --> 00:32:04,400
Yeah, playing up it was a bit 
like. 

581
00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:07,560
OK, that's not. 
We do have respect in these 

582
00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:09,880
rooms. 
And again, it was one of those 

583
00:32:09,880 --> 00:32:11,720
things where I was like, yeah, 
you've done this for film, but 

584
00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:14,080
it's not realistic. 
I don't. 

585
00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:16,800
Yes, people have kicked off in 
rehearsal rooms and stuff, but 

586
00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:19,120
like, this was an unprovoked 
thing and it was just. 

587
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:21,320
I don't know, it just really 
riled me up already just 

588
00:32:21,320 --> 00:32:24,120
watching it, thinking it's not 
realistic. 

589
00:32:24,160 --> 00:32:25,800
Yeah, unprovoked. 
I mean I. 

590
00:32:25,800 --> 00:32:27,960
Will say that. 
Nowadays, the younger generation

591
00:32:27,960 --> 00:32:30,040
seem to have lost a little bit 
of respect. 

592
00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:34,640
And there is a quicker reaction,
Yeah, I mean it's a fine. 

593
00:32:34,640 --> 00:32:36,960
Line, isn't it? 
I think what we're talking about

594
00:32:36,960 --> 00:32:40,680
is, is, you know, the manners 
and the etiquette has perhaps 

595
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:43,920
been a little bit lost. 
And, you know, generally 

596
00:32:43,920 --> 00:32:49,520
speaking, perhaps younger 
dancers feel maybe more 

597
00:32:49,520 --> 00:32:52,120
entitled. 
And I mean, this is a massive 

598
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:55,520
general generalization. 
And of course it, it will change

599
00:32:55,520 --> 00:32:57,960
from school to school to to 
country to whatnot. 

600
00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:02,280
But I think you're right, the 
etiquette has been lost in some 

601
00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:04,360
ways. 
And we've discussed this before,

602
00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:06,600
yes. 
Where young dancers? 

603
00:33:06,600 --> 00:33:13,320
Do feel more open to say how 
they feel and that's not wrong 

604
00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:15,800
to be that way. 
But I think it's all in the 

605
00:33:15,800 --> 00:33:19,440
delivery. 
And again, for me, it's all 

606
00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:24,160
about rather than deference, 
it's more about respect. 

607
00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:28,400
Show the respect to the show, 
give yourself some self respect 

608
00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:30,560
and show respect to your 
colleagues and to the creative 

609
00:33:30,560 --> 00:33:33,160
management. 
You can always choose to deliver

610
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:39,840
something in in in a either less
aggressive or combative way. 

611
00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:41,880
Why? 
I said I added like 3 little 

612
00:33:41,880 --> 00:33:44,000
bells into that word, but you 
know what? 

613
00:33:46,000 --> 00:33:47,840
I mean, I mean, I, I completely 
agree because there was 

614
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:52,000
something that happened 
literally the other day that 

615
00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:57,440
something was being set and a 
dancer replied with also we're 

616
00:33:57,440 --> 00:33:59,080
changing this again for the 4th 
time. 

617
00:33:59,200 --> 00:34:01,520
Oh my God. 
And Lich was like. 

618
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:04,560
And what if it is being changed 
again? 

619
00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:06,880
It's a redundant. 
Response though, because it's 

620
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:09,080
just to provoke the room, isn't 
it? 

621
00:34:09,080 --> 00:34:10,639
Or, you know exactly it's like 
what? 

622
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:15,719
The only thing you've achieved 
with that comment is riled up 

623
00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:19,920
the choreographer made the whole
room go yeah. 

624
00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:23,400
It's being changed. 
Because for whatever reason, a 

625
00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:26,639
reason that you don't know, it's
been changed because from out 

626
00:34:26,639 --> 00:34:30,239
front it looks bad, or it's been
changed because some other 

627
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:32,360
people didn't get the memo and 
they're still doing it on the 

628
00:34:32,360 --> 00:34:35,719
other leg, or it's changed 
because to go into the next 

629
00:34:35,719 --> 00:34:38,880
sequence it works better. 
Like whatever reason it has been

630
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:41,800
changed and there is a reason. 
Yeah, let's move on. 

631
00:34:41,800 --> 00:34:44,440
Let's not sit here and discuss 
it because you're deciding to 

632
00:34:44,440 --> 00:34:47,440
kind of kick up a fuss. 
And how peculiar. 

633
00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:50,480
Well, so I go. 
Back on what I said that scene 

634
00:34:50,480 --> 00:34:52,800
when the Neve Campbell movie was
based in reality. 

635
00:34:57,480 --> 00:35:04,200
Today's theme of the podcast is 
a roundabout way in answering We

636
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:08,320
will get there in the end, so. 
What have we learned? 

637
00:35:08,320 --> 00:35:11,480
We've learned that center stage 
actually is the only one that 

638
00:35:11,480 --> 00:35:14,040
did it right. 
I will say center stage, though,

639
00:35:14,200 --> 00:35:17,960
the whole motorbike on stage, I 
can't, I can't. 

640
00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:20,120
I can't. 
And then her sleeping with the 

641
00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:22,040
choreographer. 
And then. 

642
00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:24,440
Being the lead in his. 
Ballet. 

643
00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:27,320
And then like he goes to kiss 
her afterwards, after the show, 

644
00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:30,240
and she's like, I love you as a 
choreographer and as a dancer, 

645
00:35:30,240 --> 00:35:32,120
but as a boyfriend you kind of 
suck. 

646
00:35:32,200 --> 00:35:34,800
I'm going with this guy like, Oh
my God, I can't. 

647
00:35:37,600 --> 00:35:42,040
I think much like the movie 
Showgirls, it's they become, 

648
00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:46,000
they become iconic because 
they're terrible films really. 

649
00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:51,560
That's why they're so good. 
And I think, you know, it's 

650
00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:54,760
reached that level of fandom 
because it's so terrible. 

651
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:56,840
You can actually watch it. 
I mean, I haven't watched it in 

652
00:35:56,840 --> 00:35:59,400
a very, very long time. 
But of course those scenes and 

653
00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:02,800
the, the red point shoes pop up 
and that, you know, the, the hip

654
00:36:02,800 --> 00:36:07,400
hops and the I mean, I have to. 
Say one thing that I do like 

655
00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:11,080
about that movie as well is that
I remember I'm saying I'm 

656
00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:13,280
talking about this movie like I 
see it every day of my life. 

657
00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:15,480
I literally have not seen it 
this many times, but like I 

658
00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:18,920
think it was just ink burnt into
my brain was at the end when 

659
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:25,120
she's offered, she goes in for a
meeting with is Abti think and 

660
00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:28,160
she says stop. 
Before you tell me whether I've 

661
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:31,640
got the job or not, I just want 
to tell you that I've been 

662
00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:36,360
offered principal at this other 
guy's company because if I was 

663
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:39,560
in your company, I would just be
in the quarter ballet waving a 

664
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:41,760
rose back and forth and I'm 
better than that. 

665
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:43,640
I don't know where's my best 
years in the quarter ballet. 

666
00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:47,120
I want to be in a smaller 
company and be a principal and 

667
00:36:47,120 --> 00:36:51,840
do solo as roles. 
That whole scene, as dramatic 

668
00:36:51,840 --> 00:36:56,800
and has maybe weirdly worded as 
that speech was, was kind of 

669
00:36:56,800 --> 00:36:59,600
cool. 
I kind of thought that 

670
00:37:00,120 --> 00:37:05,160
conversation is never brought 
up, that not everybody wants to 

671
00:37:05,160 --> 00:37:09,720
be in New York City Ballet abt 
Paris Opera, whatever. 

672
00:37:09,920 --> 00:37:14,080
Like I thought it was. 
It was nice to have some a 

673
00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:17,400
conversation of someone saying 
like, I love your company. 

674
00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:19,360
I think it's great. 
I'm not that dancer. 

675
00:37:19,360 --> 00:37:22,280
I'm a dancer who actually wants 
to be in a smaller company and 

676
00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:25,440
do this. 
I thought that was cool that 

677
00:37:25,440 --> 00:37:27,040
that was discussed. 
Yeah. 

678
00:37:27,040 --> 00:37:29,360
And I'm sure for. 
Some dancers watching that movie

679
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:33,920
in real time, it was it gave 
them a voice or or or an option 

680
00:37:33,920 --> 00:37:36,760
to think outside of the box and 
think actually, I wonder if 

681
00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:39,640
that's that's what I want. 
Is that what I want? 

682
00:37:39,880 --> 00:37:43,080
Let's explore that because we're
so conditioned, aren't we, to, 

683
00:37:43,080 --> 00:37:46,080
you know, go through vocational 
school, graduate, get into a big

684
00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:49,480
ballet company and then, you 
know, rah rah rah. 

685
00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:53,600
But actually having options or 
hearing options is, is, is a 

686
00:37:53,600 --> 00:37:56,080
positive thing. 
And also because it is a. 

687
00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:59,680
Hollywood movie and it's, you 
know, quotation marks, normal 

688
00:37:59,680 --> 00:38:02,760
people watching. 
I I kind of like the fact that, 

689
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:05,560
you know, normal people are 
hearing this because the amount 

690
00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:09,600
of times when I've said that I 
live in Denmark and I'm a ballet

691
00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:13,000
dancer, I have to hear, oh, 
you're in the royal Danish. 

692
00:38:13,760 --> 00:38:15,720
Oh, no, I'm not. 
Oh, then what do you do? 

693
00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:21,000
There is more in a country than 
just the Royal Ballet in 

694
00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:24,200
England, the Royal Danish in 
Denmark, that you know what I 

695
00:38:24,200 --> 00:38:25,120
mean? 
Like it kind of. 

696
00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:30,320
I like, I like hearing that from
that film as well, that to try 

697
00:38:30,320 --> 00:38:33,400
and teach people that there is 
more than just that massive 

698
00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:35,920
ballet company, yes. 
That happens. 

699
00:38:36,640 --> 00:38:39,000
That happens a lot. 
Yeah, that happens a lot. 

700
00:38:39,000 --> 00:38:42,360
I think even last week someone 
asked, oh, what do you do? 

701
00:38:42,360 --> 00:38:45,240
And I said, oh, I'm AI said, 
well, I was a classical dancer. 

702
00:38:45,240 --> 00:38:47,840
I now teach classical band, 
right. 

703
00:38:47,880 --> 00:38:51,840
Oh, and the first, the first 
question they asked was, Oh, are

704
00:38:51,880 --> 00:38:53,600
you a, were you a principal 
dancer? 

705
00:38:54,440 --> 00:38:57,440
And I, I kind of caught me off 
guard and I was like, and I was 

706
00:38:57,440 --> 00:39:01,960
like, no, but you know, I was a 
soloist for, for certain things.

707
00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:05,160
And I found myself like having 
to explain, like value myself. 

708
00:39:05,160 --> 00:39:09,840
And then I just thought it's 
just it's they were lovely to 

709
00:39:09,880 --> 00:39:12,440
ask a question. 
They probably felt informed 

710
00:39:12,440 --> 00:39:15,320
because they knew what a 
principal dancer was, but it was

711
00:39:16,080 --> 00:39:20,480
it was the wrong question. 
It's, it's also difficult, I 

712
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:24,560
suppose, when you meet up with 
maybe not so much friends, but 

713
00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:27,000
maybe former colleagues and you 
happen to bump into each other 

714
00:39:27,000 --> 00:39:29,600
in town and you're like, oh, hi,
how are you doing? 

715
00:39:29,600 --> 00:39:32,800
And you know, oh, what are you, 
what are you in at the moment? 

716
00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:35,840
Now, if that person isn't in 
anything, it's very, very 

717
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:40,080
disheartening to have to say, 
Oh, you know, I'm whatever, 

718
00:39:40,080 --> 00:39:44,120
whatever they're doing. 
But it's what, the way you ask 

719
00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:48,240
someone how they are, I know we,
we're, we're kind of verging off

720
00:39:48,240 --> 00:39:50,400
into a slightly different 
conversation, but just based on 

721
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:52,240
the back of what you just said 
about, you know, oh, royal 

722
00:39:52,240 --> 00:39:54,960
Danish, etcetera. 
Just be mindful, I suppose, of 

723
00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:59,840
of how you interact with people 
within the same industry because

724
00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:04,760
that person who's not working at
the moment may be feeling very 

725
00:40:04,760 --> 00:40:07,960
disheartened completely. 
They might have just gone to six

726
00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:09,480
auditions and not got any of 
them. 

727
00:40:09,480 --> 00:40:12,800
And yeah, yeah, it's just so. 
Interesting how people who are 

728
00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:17,400
not perhaps in the industry or 
are in the industry can can make

729
00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:20,920
you feel a certain way just by 
asking to them probably a pretty

730
00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:23,320
generalized question, you know, 
so it's it's it's interesting 

731
00:40:23,320 --> 00:40:25,840
and also because you would. 
Never do it to someone working. 

732
00:40:25,840 --> 00:40:28,160
I don't know. 
In banking you never go up. 

733
00:40:28,160 --> 00:40:29,960
To someone. 
You know also what you're doing.

734
00:40:30,000 --> 00:40:33,360
I work for HSBC also. 
You work in that massive tower 

735
00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:35,600
in Canary Wharf and you're an 
investment banker. 

736
00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:39,960
So no, I'm a bank teller in 
Southwark, in HSSBC. 

737
00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:41,520
Like you wouldn't. 
You wouldn't. 

738
00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:43,280
Yeah, isn't it? 
Guess. 

739
00:40:44,120 --> 00:40:46,240
That they were at the top of 
their ladder or something. 

740
00:40:46,360 --> 00:40:50,160
It's very odd that whole oh, so 
you were you a principal dancer 

741
00:40:50,160 --> 00:40:53,560
with like straight away 
guessing, asking the question of

742
00:40:53,880 --> 00:40:58,240
oh, are you someone's saying to 
you, basically, if you said, oh,

743
00:40:58,240 --> 00:41:01,880
I'm I'm a classical dancer and 
someone's saying, oh, are you a 

744
00:41:01,880 --> 00:41:07,200
principal with the Royal Ballet?
It's a very specific the highest

745
00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:11,480
job in the land to ask and you 
happen to have met this person 

746
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:18,760
in Greg's in West Brompton. 
I don't know buying a. 

747
00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:23,120
Buying a Cornish pasty from 
Greg's it is. 

748
00:41:23,120 --> 00:41:26,720
Very odd that someone goes 
straight to straight to that it 

749
00:41:26,720 --> 00:41:28,520
is anyway. 
Yeah, it. 

750
00:41:28,520 --> 00:41:32,920
Happened well the and also. 
Like, that's goes back to, well,

751
00:41:33,280 --> 00:41:37,840
dance in the media is presented 
incorrectly and doesn't have 

752
00:41:38,680 --> 00:41:40,120
representation the way it 
should. 

753
00:41:40,120 --> 00:41:42,400
It doesn't show what our 
industry is really like. 

754
00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:45,560
And I suppose maybe, you know, 
doctors say the same about ER 

755
00:41:45,560 --> 00:41:47,760
and casualty. 
Like yeah, I always wonder. 

756
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:50,560
How accurate those like they 
must have people in saying this 

757
00:41:50,560 --> 00:41:54,680
is how you but I'm sure there 
are so many inaccuracies and and

758
00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:58,120
people in the medical profession
are like we wouldn't do that. 

759
00:41:58,120 --> 00:42:00,360
We wouldn't say that. 
We certainly wouldn't, you know,

760
00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:03,360
perform surgery in that, you 
know, it must happen in a 

761
00:42:03,360 --> 00:42:04,920
crossover in multiple 
industries. 

762
00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:11,840
But yeah, I mean, the dance 
world is, is is not shown in its

763
00:42:11,840 --> 00:42:14,800
true form. 
Although saying that more 

764
00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:20,800
recently there have been two 
ballet based TV series that I 

765
00:42:20,800 --> 00:42:24,160
have happened to watch one with 
one is called Flesh and Bone. 

766
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:27,760
And I mean, the title alone is 
just, I mean, ridiculous. 

767
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:32,840
But anyway, now I had a look and
that was launched in 2015, but I

768
00:42:32,840 --> 00:42:36,000
actually watched it much later 
because I remember watching it 

769
00:42:36,000 --> 00:42:39,200
on Netflix during COVID when 
Alan and I were living in 

770
00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:40,800
Mumbai. 
So I kind of got through a 

771
00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:42,280
little bit of COVID watching 
this series. 

772
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:46,360
And I have to say again, it's 
the struggles of a dancer in a, 

773
00:42:46,480 --> 00:42:49,640
in a ballet company and the 
relationship with the director 

774
00:42:49,640 --> 00:42:53,320
and this, this sexuality is 
heightened and you've got overly

775
00:42:53,320 --> 00:42:58,120
camp dying. 
But I did enjoy elements of that

776
00:42:58,120 --> 00:43:00,360
series because the dancing was 
good. 

777
00:43:00,360 --> 00:43:05,160
Like they you, I think the main 
character, I think she was in, I

778
00:43:05,160 --> 00:43:09,200
think she's American, but she 
was in a ballet company in 

779
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:10,880
Dresden. 
So she was like a fully 

780
00:43:11,560 --> 00:43:15,160
confessional ballet dancer. 
And I thought that the, the 

781
00:43:15,160 --> 00:43:17,960
technique and the standard, the 
level of the dancers they use 

782
00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:21,160
for the TV series was great. 
But again, you know, the, the, 

783
00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:24,360
the dramatisation, you know, 
these storylines and themes are,

784
00:43:24,520 --> 00:43:27,720
you know, over the top. 
But the dancing, I think check 

785
00:43:27,720 --> 00:43:29,560
it out. 
I think you'd enjoy it. 

786
00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:32,360
For me it is. 
Also, especially like, if it's 

787
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:35,200
going to be that over the top, 
like sorry to bring it up again 

788
00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:38,400
center stage, at least the 
dancers can't do something. 

789
00:43:38,600 --> 00:43:41,680
Yes, yes. 
Yes, yes, whereas the other the 

790
00:43:41,680 --> 00:43:46,080
a more recent TV series which 
certainly in the UK is still on 

791
00:43:46,080 --> 00:43:49,560
because I checked prior to this 
recording is Pretty Little 

792
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:52,880
things that came out in 20. 
Oh, I've made it that one. 

793
00:43:53,200 --> 00:43:57,080
And again, you know, out of 
intrigue. 

794
00:43:57,080 --> 00:44:01,120
I watched it and it was 
infuriating in many ways. 

795
00:44:01,120 --> 00:44:05,080
But again, the standard, the 
level of dancing was good. 

796
00:44:05,280 --> 00:44:08,720
You know, and they really, they 
have used real dancers working 

797
00:44:08,720 --> 00:44:11,240
in the industry. 
I mean, the levels, when it's 

798
00:44:11,240 --> 00:44:14,000
slightly inconsistent, you know,
you can tell they've chosen 

799
00:44:14,360 --> 00:44:20,320
actors or actresses who can act 
but also dance, where in some 

800
00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:23,440
cases they've chosen some 
excellent dancers that also are 

801
00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:26,080
great at acting. 
You know, so as a professional 

802
00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:31,120
dancer, I can see the difference
between a great actor who 

803
00:44:31,120 --> 00:44:34,600
perhaps isn't the best dancer 
that can get away with it versus

804
00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:36,880
a fantastic dance. 
The peaks and valleys of. 

805
00:44:38,320 --> 00:44:42,480
Ability, yeah, but it's. 
But but again, you know, but the

806
00:44:42,480 --> 00:44:45,720
same thing between, you know, 
sentence sentence sensitive 

807
00:44:48,960 --> 00:44:52,960
flesh and bone, Black Swan, they
all follow those kind of over 

808
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:56,920
dramatized themes, which I think
infuriates, you know, those who 

809
00:44:56,960 --> 00:45:00,560
have been educated within 
classical ballet or or dance in 

810
00:45:00,560 --> 00:45:03,000
general. 
But again, I think that's more 

811
00:45:03,000 --> 00:45:06,640
about selling, making a profit 
on the movie, But maybe that 

812
00:45:06,640 --> 00:45:09,640
won't ever change. 
You know, maybe we'll otherwise,

813
00:45:09,680 --> 00:45:13,360
perhaps it's it's deemed as a 
documentary rather than a film. 

814
00:45:13,360 --> 00:45:14,680
I don't know if it's too 
accurate. 

815
00:45:14,680 --> 00:45:16,720
I don't know. 
But, and and I'm sure there's an

816
00:45:16,720 --> 00:45:21,640
audience for it, but the result 
is, you know, the audience take 

817
00:45:21,640 --> 00:45:24,400
it as gospel mostly. 
And they they think we we live 

818
00:45:24,400 --> 00:45:26,640
like that within that dance 
company. 

819
00:45:26,640 --> 00:45:29,640
I just find it interesting. 
Because in an, in an era where 

820
00:45:29,640 --> 00:45:34,400
there is so many reality shows 
and documentaries and people 

821
00:45:34,400 --> 00:45:38,760
wanting to know what things are 
really like, industries are 

822
00:45:38,760 --> 00:45:40,960
really like. 
Whenever it is dance, it is 

823
00:45:40,960 --> 00:45:45,720
always dramaticized and always 
over the top and always I, I 

824
00:45:45,720 --> 00:45:48,080
would find it very interesting. 
I mean, even myself, I would 

825
00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:51,760
find it very interesting to 
watch a documentary or I watch a

826
00:45:52,240 --> 00:45:58,120
a more realistic view about a 
ballet school, a theatre school,

827
00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:01,360
behind the scenes of a western 
show kind of thing. 

828
00:46:01,360 --> 00:46:03,880
I I would find. 
But maybe that's just me, I 

829
00:46:03,880 --> 00:46:05,800
don't know. 
Now I think there's a market. 

830
00:46:05,800 --> 00:46:08,440
For it, whether you're a dancer 
or not, I mean, English National

831
00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:10,760
Ballet had, was it the agony and
the ecstasy? 

832
00:46:10,760 --> 00:46:12,240
Was it like a three-part 
document? 

833
00:46:13,160 --> 00:46:14,200
Oh, yeah. 
And, you know, I've heard 

834
00:46:14,200 --> 00:46:16,920
stories from, you know, dancers 
in the company at the time where

835
00:46:16,920 --> 00:46:19,720
things were edited out of 
context, you know, just to 

836
00:46:19,760 --> 00:46:22,800
tighten the drama. 
So even that was never a true 

837
00:46:22,800 --> 00:46:25,840
representation of of what what 
was really going on. 

838
00:46:25,840 --> 00:46:29,200
But yeah, because actually the 
most, some of the most 

839
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:31,800
interesting things are what's 
happening behind the scenes and 

840
00:46:31,800 --> 00:46:34,400
not on the stage, you know? 
Oh, 100% it. 

841
00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:37,480
Would be really interesting. 
To see, you know, little 

842
00:46:37,480 --> 00:46:40,360
highlights of conversations in 
the corridors and what happens 

843
00:46:40,400 --> 00:46:43,360
in the dressing room and how act
as the, you know, how dancers 

844
00:46:43,360 --> 00:46:46,560
are different from being on 
stage to how they interact and 

845
00:46:46,560 --> 00:46:49,960
behave with each other, you 
know, off stage, etcetera. 

846
00:46:49,960 --> 00:46:53,160
But you know, I suppose it's 
still quite a niche market. 

847
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:55,760
Even if there is a market, it's 
still quite niche. 

848
00:46:55,760 --> 00:46:58,720
So I just think lots of. 
People would be interested, I 

849
00:46:58,720 --> 00:47:02,600
don't know, to see, you know, 
that couple at the back in the 

850
00:47:02,600 --> 00:47:05,680
market scene of Romeo and 
Juliet, when they're stood there

851
00:47:05,680 --> 00:47:08,560
reacting to the sword fight or 
whatever, they're also talking 

852
00:47:08,560 --> 00:47:10,840
to each other, being like, 
should we go to KFC tonight? 

853
00:47:10,840 --> 00:47:13,000
Yeah, let's go to KFC. 
Oh, my God, Act, act, act. 

854
00:47:13,720 --> 00:47:16,680
Because all of that kind of, 
it's like, oh, did I turn off my

855
00:47:16,680 --> 00:47:17,880
hair straighteners before I 
left? 

856
00:47:19,760 --> 00:47:22,200
That's what's happening on. 
Stage If you wonder what dancers

857
00:47:22,200 --> 00:47:25,760
are talking about when they're 
in the back of a market scene or

858
00:47:26,200 --> 00:47:29,640
whatever, or even in a dance 
when you're doing some I don't 

859
00:47:29,640 --> 00:47:32,080
know, you're partnering your 
girl in some slow promenade, 

860
00:47:32,520 --> 00:47:35,680
usually saying Can you believe 
what so and so did last night 

861
00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:39,720
Yeah, all those little. 
Moments of, of very private, 

862
00:47:39,720 --> 00:47:43,280
intimate moments that kind of 
carries the dancer through what 

863
00:47:43,280 --> 00:47:45,960
they need to get through. 
Because I think once you're well

864
00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:49,560
rehearsed and, and the movement 
is in your body, those moments 

865
00:47:49,600 --> 00:47:52,760
definitely do happen. 
And they are very, very discreet

866
00:47:52,760 --> 00:47:55,920
because I think any well 
trained, I mean no one could 

867
00:47:55,920 --> 00:47:57,400
tell. 
No, no one can tell. 

868
00:47:57,400 --> 00:48:01,560
And I think it is quite normal 
to have those moments. 

869
00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:05,640
It doesn't take away from what 
you're giving to the audience. 

870
00:48:05,840 --> 00:48:08,880
You know, we're we're great at 
multitasking and being focused. 

871
00:48:09,240 --> 00:48:12,040
You know, we can execute what we
need to execute. 

872
00:48:12,320 --> 00:48:16,440
And on on occasion we might have
a non dance related conversation

873
00:48:16,440 --> 00:48:19,440
whilst dancing on stage. 
I think that's perfectly normal.

874
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:22,320
I think any dancer that says 
they've never done that is is 

875
00:48:22,320 --> 00:48:24,720
lying lying through. 
Their teeth? 

876
00:48:25,200 --> 00:48:27,360
Yeah, I think so. 
So even there's. 

877
00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:30,200
So many moments. 
I mean, Tom Forster was talking 

878
00:48:30,200 --> 00:48:32,880
about it with me the other week 
that, you know, there were so 

879
00:48:32,880 --> 00:48:35,680
many moments as a quarter ballet
member that you just stood 

880
00:48:35,680 --> 00:48:38,160
there. 
So of course, when you're stood 

881
00:48:38,160 --> 00:48:42,320
there in your market scene or in
your whatever it is, pretending 

882
00:48:42,320 --> 00:48:45,640
to buy an apple from a market 
stall in the background 

883
00:48:45,640 --> 00:48:50,280
somewhere, you were having a 
full on conversation with Adela 

884
00:48:50,280 --> 00:48:57,240
and Cindy Jordan. 
Kiara and Nadine are having a 

885
00:48:57,240 --> 00:48:58,880
full on conversation. 
Yeah. 

886
00:49:00,200 --> 00:49:02,760
Yeah, it definitely happens. 
And actually I think an 

887
00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:05,400
audience, you know, ATV audience
would find that really 

888
00:49:05,400 --> 00:49:07,960
interesting, 100%, you know 
more. 

889
00:49:07,960 --> 00:49:10,080
Than some. 
Stage scenario where the 

890
00:49:10,080 --> 00:49:13,000
directors giving a speech in the
middle of Ron de Jean, you know,

891
00:49:13,000 --> 00:49:15,520
it's just ridiculous, but also 
it's always. 

892
00:49:15,520 --> 00:49:20,400
About sex, and I'm sorry, I 
mean, yes, I know in every 

893
00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:23,800
single industry there is 
somebody, some person who wants 

894
00:49:23,800 --> 00:49:26,800
to sleep their way to the top. 
Like it's not a a dance related 

895
00:49:26,800 --> 00:49:29,080
thing. 
It's a thing that has happened 

896
00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:35,120
in industry and the work world 
in every aspect of every single 

897
00:49:35,120 --> 00:49:37,080
business, whatever you're 
talking about. 

898
00:49:37,280 --> 00:49:41,520
But these dance movies and dance
TV series really like to focus 

899
00:49:41,520 --> 00:49:45,520
on in on a female dancer 
sleeping with the director. 

900
00:49:46,120 --> 00:49:49,040
Oh, absolutely. 
And you'll there the key themes,

901
00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:53,880
you know, ambition, rivalry, 
deceit, eating disorders, sex 

902
00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:57,800
that I mean, I'm sure if you 
made a list of all the dance 

903
00:49:57,800 --> 00:50:01,680
films, all of those themes would
be running through each each 

904
00:50:01,680 --> 00:50:05,520
movie or TV series at some point
100%. 

905
00:50:05,600 --> 00:50:08,040
And you never hear, you know, 
the amount of people who are 

906
00:50:08,040 --> 00:50:11,440
just working in the chord 
ballet, love their life, are 

907
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:15,640
going out to, I don't know, 
Rupert Street Bar afterwards and

908
00:50:15,720 --> 00:50:17,720
that's it. 
Yeah, I mean, but that doesn't 

909
00:50:17,720 --> 00:50:23,840
make a movie, I'm sure, but. 
We'd watch it exactly. 

910
00:50:23,840 --> 00:50:25,120
It'd be more. 
Interesting to see what the 

911
00:50:25,120 --> 00:50:27,720
dancer did at Rupert Street Bar.
But that's the interesting part 

912
00:50:27,720 --> 00:50:29,760
of it. 
Why is there not a movie showing

913
00:50:29,760 --> 00:50:33,360
the dancers getting drunk off 
their face at Rupert St. trying 

914
00:50:33,360 --> 00:50:35,280
to get through the show the next
day? 

915
00:50:35,680 --> 00:50:38,400
There's your reality. 
Yeah, Harsh. 

916
00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:39,920
Reality. 
The double. 

917
00:50:39,920 --> 00:50:43,400
Show on Boxing Day, that's the 
reality or a new. 

918
00:50:43,400 --> 00:50:47,400
Year's Day special Awful. 
Nobody needs to be performing on

919
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:49,640
New Year's Day. 
Also, no one needs to be. 

920
00:50:49,640 --> 00:50:52,520
Going to the theatre to watch on
New Year's Day? 

921
00:50:52,720 --> 00:50:54,880
Yeah, I agree. 
Like seriously. 

922
00:50:54,920 --> 00:50:58,160
Who out as an adult myself now 
40. 

923
00:50:58,160 --> 00:51:00,800
Hello. 
I don't want to go to the 

924
00:51:00,800 --> 00:51:02,800
theatre on New Year's Day as an 
audience member. 

925
00:51:03,080 --> 00:51:04,480
Like no. 
Why? 

926
00:51:05,280 --> 00:51:08,560
Cut that New Year's Day theatre.
But also I have to say that's. 

927
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:12,240
One thing in Denmark that I love
New Year's Day is like is is a 

928
00:51:12,240 --> 00:51:14,800
bank holiday, right? 
So there is no work on New 

929
00:51:14,800 --> 00:51:16,800
Year's Day. 
Everybody can be hungover. 

930
00:51:17,120 --> 00:51:25,720
I'm sure Walt earned millions, 
but so there is never a show on 

931
00:51:25,720 --> 00:51:27,240
New Year's Day. 
I love it. 

932
00:51:27,720 --> 00:51:28,600
Yeah, that's the way it should 
be. 

933
00:51:28,600 --> 00:51:30,280
Isn't it? 
I mean, if you're seeing the new

934
00:51:30,280 --> 00:51:33,400
year in, you're up bare minimum,
you're still up at midnight, 

935
00:51:33,400 --> 00:51:35,160
right? 
So nobody wants to then and 

936
00:51:35,160 --> 00:51:37,600
you're drinking champagne. 
Nobody wants to get up and 

937
00:51:37,600 --> 00:51:39,480
perform, and nobody wants to 
get. 

938
00:51:39,480 --> 00:51:42,160
Up and go watch a show. 
The last thing I want to do with

939
00:51:42,160 --> 00:51:46,240
a hangover is sit in a dusty old
theatre and watch a show. 

940
00:51:46,320 --> 00:51:49,960
No, I want to be on my sofa 
eating prosciutto ham. 

941
00:51:50,560 --> 00:51:52,440
Yeah. 
With a full fat coke. 

942
00:51:53,560 --> 00:51:56,200
Watching Jane. 
McDonald highlights on YouTube 

943
00:51:57,800 --> 00:52:01,400
watching centre. 
Stage full circle if you'd. 

944
00:52:01,400 --> 00:52:05,880
Like to sign our petition to to 
cull New Year's Day Live 

945
00:52:06,000 --> 00:52:09,200
theatre? 
Please follow the link and if 

946
00:52:09,200 --> 00:52:11,400
you would like to. 
Join our fan club of Centre 

947
00:52:11,400 --> 00:52:14,760
Stage please. 
Merchandise will be. 

948
00:52:14,760 --> 00:52:19,720
Available soon. 
All right, babes. 

949
00:52:19,800 --> 00:52:23,360
Well, thank you for listening 
everybody to another episode of 

950
00:52:23,360 --> 00:52:25,760
Drinks at the Bar. 
Yes, thank you for listening. 

951
00:52:25,760 --> 00:52:28,640
Hope you've enjoyed your drink 
and please don't forget to share

952
00:52:28,640 --> 00:52:31,840
our little podcast with your 
friends, colleagues and Pilates 

953
00:52:31,840 --> 00:52:33,320
instructor. 
Thank you so much. 

954
00:52:36,440 --> 00:52:38,080
All right, sweetheart, I love 
you lots. 

955
00:52:38,080 --> 00:52:40,680
Always great to talk to you. 
Love you too. 

956
00:52:40,680 --> 00:52:43,280
Big kiss. 
Enjoy the rest of your day off. 

957
00:52:43,560 --> 00:52:44,760
You too. 
Love you lots, babes. 

958
00:52:45,560 --> 00:52:45,840
Bye bye.