1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:03,960 Hello everyone, and welcome back to Needy No More, the podcast 2 00:00:03,960 --> 00:00:06,680 dedicated to healing the anxious attachment style. 3 00:00:06,680 --> 00:00:09,520 I'm your host, anxious attachment style coach and 4 00:00:09,520 --> 00:00:12,440 author Chris Ratcliffe. I've helped thousands of people 5 00:00:12,440 --> 00:00:16,040 across 6 continents to end the cycle of anxious attachment 6 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:19,840 through my books, workshops, digital downloads, and coaching 7 00:00:19,840 --> 00:00:21,640 program. I'm excited to carry on that 8 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:25,560 mission here on the podcast, sharing tools and techniques, 9 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:29,320 principles and practices for you to explore on your journey to 10 00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:36,360 growing more secure. Today is a very special day on 11 00:00:36,440 --> 00:00:40,320 the show. I have a guest here who is 12 00:00:40,320 --> 00:00:43,800 somewhat hard to introduce because we have such an 13 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:47,040 interesting and complex relationship that's taken a lot 14 00:00:47,040 --> 00:00:51,560 of different forms. Her name is Christina and 15 00:00:51,640 --> 00:00:57,360 Christina and I met several years ago, maybe 2022. 16 00:00:57,720 --> 00:01:00,360 You can correct me on this. Christina I I'm not sure. 17 00:01:00,480 --> 00:01:04,120 I I think late 2021. Wow. 18 00:01:04,120 --> 00:01:09,720 OK, OK, so we met a few years ago when she reached out to me 19 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:13,960 for coaching. From there, after she finished 20 00:01:13,960 --> 00:01:18,000 the coaching program, I hired her on my team to help me 21 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:22,600 connect with other clients and to enroll people in the program 22 00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:25,320 and she even did some coaching for me as well. 23 00:01:25,320 --> 00:01:30,520 Christina is also a great success story for what coaching 24 00:01:30,520 --> 00:01:35,080 can do for your life. And she is now married to her 25 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:40,160 partner, Joseph Joey. And we'll talk about all of the 26 00:01:40,160 --> 00:01:42,960 above today. But Christina is now a really 27 00:01:42,960 --> 00:01:45,800 close friend of mine and we talk all the time. 28 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:47,680 And I'm really happy to have you on the show. 29 00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:50,880 Christina, thanks for coming on. Of course, thank you for having 30 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:53,720 me here. It's a pleasure and honor to 31 00:01:54,280 --> 00:01:58,080 speak with you, of course, in this forum, but also connecting 32 00:01:58,080 --> 00:02:02,560 with your listeners who I know are just waiting to hear more 33 00:02:02,560 --> 00:02:04,880 about our journey together. Why don't we start at the 34 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:07,120 beginning? It's the most natural place to 35 00:02:07,120 --> 00:02:11,880 start, I think. Tell us about where you were at 36 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:15,920 in your life, what was going on, how you were feeling when you 37 00:02:15,920 --> 00:02:20,360 reached out to me to set up. Just an intro conversation. 38 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:23,120 Yeah. I was in a really dark place, 39 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:26,200 probably one of the darkest in my life, and I think my 40 00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:29,520 environment at the time definitely reflected how I felt 41 00:02:29,520 --> 00:02:34,240 on the inside. I mean, I remember I was going 42 00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:38,080 through a breakup with a partner that I had three years. 43 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:40,080 We lived together, we had a dog together. 44 00:02:40,080 --> 00:02:42,920 It was very serious. I thought it was going to end in 45 00:02:42,920 --> 00:02:45,960 marriage, which of course now in hindsight, he wasn't the right 46 00:02:45,960 --> 00:02:49,360 partner for me. But Fast forward, I'm in my 47 00:02:49,360 --> 00:02:52,920 apartment where I'm living completely alone for the first 48 00:02:52,920 --> 00:02:54,600 time. I always lived with roommates or 49 00:02:54,600 --> 00:02:59,520 other people, never completely on my own and being an anxious 50 00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:03,880 attacher that is probably one of the hardest and scariest things 51 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:08,080 when we are consistently thrive driving off connection and 52 00:03:08,080 --> 00:03:11,280 wanting connection. So I ended up moving in alone. 53 00:03:11,440 --> 00:03:14,400 I had a mattress on the ground and like a bin of clothes. 54 00:03:14,400 --> 00:03:18,240 It was really nothing and I was wearing the same hoodie for 55 00:03:18,240 --> 00:03:20,920 three days in a row. I was not taking care of myself. 56 00:03:20,920 --> 00:03:24,760 I was really depressed and just scrolling TikTok as one does and 57 00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:29,440 I came across Chris and at this time content like Chris's was 58 00:03:29,440 --> 00:03:32,400 not really in my algorithm. It was probably the first of its 59 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:37,840 kind when he was speaking about anxious attachment styles and 60 00:03:37,960 --> 00:03:41,400 how having people leave you is almost a self fulfilling 61 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:45,240 prophecy He was speaking about. And I remember watching his 62 00:03:45,240 --> 00:03:49,520 video and going, wait, there's other people in this world that 63 00:03:49,520 --> 00:03:53,840 think these things Because a lot of the things that he said that 64 00:03:53,840 --> 00:03:57,120 you said in your content, I went on your page and looked at more. 65 00:03:57,560 --> 00:04:01,840 These are feelings and thoughts that I had in my head for years 66 00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:05,760 that I felt too ashamed to admit out loud to my friends or 67 00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:08,960 anybody telling them how desperate I felt for connection 68 00:04:08,960 --> 00:04:12,040 and the links I was going to go to to make a relationship work. 69 00:04:12,160 --> 00:04:15,360 Some things I still have never said out loud of the things that 70 00:04:15,360 --> 00:04:17,480 I have done to make relationships work. 71 00:04:17,480 --> 00:04:21,760 And I, Chris, you were really the only person that I've ever 72 00:04:21,959 --> 00:04:26,920 known at that time that really I felt saw that piece of me that I 73 00:04:26,920 --> 00:04:30,320 felt ashamed of. So naturally, I booked a call 74 00:04:30,320 --> 00:04:32,840 with you. I really didn't know what it 75 00:04:32,840 --> 00:04:35,520 meant. I wasn't super familiar with, 76 00:04:36,240 --> 00:04:39,680 you know, coaching and this type of avenue. 77 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:42,000 I didn't really understand what the call was or what it was for, 78 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:45,080 but all I knew is I needed to talk to you and whatever that 79 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:47,560 equated to you. I was willing to try to find a 80 00:04:47,560 --> 00:04:50,720 way to make work and I had my first call with you. 81 00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:54,760 I remember having thoughts of, wow, this person really 82 00:04:54,760 --> 00:05:00,280 understands me and really cares in a way that no therapist did. 83 00:05:00,280 --> 00:05:03,360 I ever feel so seen by a therapist before. 84 00:05:03,360 --> 00:05:06,840 And I knew I just had. I had to work with you and I had 85 00:05:06,840 --> 00:05:09,720 to make a change. I couldn't live the way I was 86 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:11,920 living anymore. And yeah, of course, we went on 87 00:05:11,920 --> 00:05:14,840 that second call and it was pretty much a done deal for me. 88 00:05:14,840 --> 00:05:19,520 I didn't really care about anything of how to make it 89 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:22,240 happen. I remember spending my last 90 00:05:22,240 --> 00:05:26,600 dollars to make it happen because the moving in alone was 91 00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:29,080 incredibly expensive. There were a lot of things 92 00:05:29,080 --> 00:05:32,200 happening, but I just knew I couldn't live this way anymore 93 00:05:32,680 --> 00:05:34,840 and I had to find a way to make it work. 94 00:05:35,400 --> 00:05:39,080 And I did. And then from there my my life 95 00:05:39,520 --> 00:05:41,000 really changed. It did. 96 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:43,480 It did. And we'll definitely get to some 97 00:05:43,480 --> 00:05:46,840 of those changes because you've really come full circle. 98 00:05:46,840 --> 00:05:52,280 But I want you to talk also about what your experience was 99 00:05:52,280 --> 00:05:55,600 like in the program. You did group coaching, which 100 00:05:55,600 --> 00:06:01,360 I'm not currently offering, but is very similar to in terms of, 101 00:06:01,680 --> 00:06:05,080 you know, conceptually and exercise wise what's in the 102 00:06:05,080 --> 00:06:06,760 one-on-one version of the program. 103 00:06:07,320 --> 00:06:11,320 What did you get out of it? Like what did you learn along 104 00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:14,600 the road, so to speak? I learned a lot of things. 105 00:06:14,600 --> 00:06:17,840 I mean, I still speak with a couple of the people that were 106 00:06:17,840 --> 00:06:20,720 in the program with me. They were all lovely people at 107 00:06:20,720 --> 00:06:24,400 different points in their life experiencing different journeys, 108 00:06:24,400 --> 00:06:26,680 and that made me feel so much less alone. 109 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:30,240 It was my favorite time of the week to have these sessions 110 00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:34,280 because I felt like I was with people who understood me. 111 00:06:34,280 --> 00:06:37,080 That was a big piece. I was looking for camaraderie. 112 00:06:37,080 --> 00:06:41,560 I was looking to not feel alone. I learned a lot about myself, 113 00:06:41,560 --> 00:06:45,280 and I know everybody talks about, oh, that must be from 114 00:06:45,280 --> 00:06:47,520 your childhood or oh, that must be childhood trauma. 115 00:06:47,520 --> 00:06:49,680 And that's something that a lot of people say these days, and 116 00:06:49,680 --> 00:06:53,320 I've heard that before, but I never really thought about the 117 00:06:53,320 --> 00:06:56,960 extent of how much it affected me until I did your program. 118 00:06:56,960 --> 00:06:59,400 There were a lot of different exercises where I had to talk 119 00:06:59,400 --> 00:07:02,840 about my role models. I'm thinking about who in my 120 00:07:02,840 --> 00:07:06,600 life was kind of mirroring the relationship or marriage that I 121 00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:08,800 was looking for. What was involved in those 122 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:11,280 relationships? Taking care of myself was not 123 00:07:11,280 --> 00:07:14,560 really a thing. I was eating like a cube of 124 00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:17,400 cheese to not pass out. I mean, I was not eating full 125 00:07:17,400 --> 00:07:20,640 meals. I was on a very off sleep 126 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:23,880 schedule. I was self medicating with 127 00:07:23,880 --> 00:07:26,880 marijuana edibles almost every night because I didn't want to 128 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:29,040 feel my feelings. I didn't really know how to 129 00:07:29,040 --> 00:07:32,640 regulate my nervous system. I was doing everything I could 130 00:07:32,640 --> 00:07:37,200 to avoid the feeling so I can get through the day, and it was 131 00:07:37,200 --> 00:07:39,680 the first time that I really started thinking of a routine 132 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:42,120 for myself. So I started going on walks 133 00:07:42,120 --> 00:07:45,960 every day, I started going to the gym a few times a week, and 134 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:51,200 I started eating 2 meals a day. At least I was not treating my 135 00:07:51,200 --> 00:07:54,440 body, my mind like a temple as somebody who was ready to even 136 00:07:54,440 --> 00:07:57,800 be in a healthy relationship. I was attracting exactly the way 137 00:07:57,800 --> 00:08:01,000 I was treating myself. And that was a big piece of what 138 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:04,360 I learned. How am I possibly going to be in 139 00:08:04,400 --> 00:08:07,720 a healthy relationship with a secure partner when I am almost 140 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:10,240 relying on them to take care of me? 141 00:08:10,280 --> 00:08:12,640 Because when I'm by myself, that's the default. 142 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:16,240 I think self-care was a really important piece that was huge 143 00:08:16,240 --> 00:08:20,160 for me in becoming healthier for not only myself but for the 144 00:08:20,360 --> 00:08:22,200 nature relationship I was really looking for. 145 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:26,240 Those small incremental things add up over time. 146 00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:29,360 I've always said that that's always been my approach to this 147 00:08:29,360 --> 00:08:34,080 work, the small stuff, because a lot of people aim for big 148 00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:38,159 breakthroughs and that is well-intentioned, but it's 149 00:08:38,159 --> 00:08:42,280 actually your habits and your routines that get you there or 150 00:08:42,280 --> 00:08:45,720 not. And so hearing you talk about 151 00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:50,240 going from not eating so well, not sleeping so well, to getting 152 00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:53,560 those foundations in place for yourself so you could build on 153 00:08:53,560 --> 00:08:55,640 top of them. It might not be an immediate 154 00:08:55,640 --> 00:08:59,040 connection or something that someone thinks about when 155 00:08:59,040 --> 00:09:01,880 they're healing, they're anxious attachment or healing from 156 00:09:02,160 --> 00:09:05,320 trauma. The consistency part of this is 157 00:09:05,320 --> 00:09:08,800 what a lot of people overlook because the small stuff 158 00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:13,840 accumulates via the consistency to create the breakthrough true 159 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:16,760 that they are seeking. Obviously there are going to be 160 00:09:16,760 --> 00:09:19,720 many people listening to this and watching who are not 161 00:09:19,720 --> 00:09:23,400 familiar with coaching who have never even reached out to anyone 162 00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:27,960 to potentially help them outside of a therapy environment. 163 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:32,840 In your experience, both as the client and as someone working 164 00:09:32,840 --> 00:09:37,520 with my clients, what do you think people get hung up on when 165 00:09:37,520 --> 00:09:40,440 it comes to taking a leap of faith to do this work? 166 00:09:40,440 --> 00:09:43,960 What holds them back? How can they work through some 167 00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:46,160 of that to get the help that they might need? 168 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:49,520 There's a few things that consistently came up when I had 169 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:53,720 conversation, conversations with folks who maybe felt fear or not 170 00:09:53,720 --> 00:09:57,000 ready. And a lot of times things would 171 00:09:57,000 --> 00:09:59,800 come up. Finances, time, there's no 172 00:09:59,800 --> 00:10:02,960 opportune time to heal, right? We're not all just sitting here 173 00:10:02,960 --> 00:10:05,400 with all this time. Often you have to implement it 174 00:10:05,400 --> 00:10:07,760 into your life and make it a priority. 175 00:10:07,800 --> 00:10:11,960 And when I would dig more into the real reason, it was the lack 176 00:10:11,960 --> 00:10:14,200 of self belief that they could follow through. 177 00:10:14,240 --> 00:10:17,640 And that's something that I can really understand because I had 178 00:10:17,640 --> 00:10:20,640 the same beliefs. Now, I think something important 179 00:10:20,640 --> 00:10:23,840 to think about when it comes to people considering this kind of 180 00:10:23,840 --> 00:10:27,840 work is you're really the only person who can decide if you 181 00:10:27,840 --> 00:10:30,360 want to keep living the way you live or not. 182 00:10:31,800 --> 00:10:36,560 And you could keep doing what you're doing, but likely you 183 00:10:36,560 --> 00:10:39,800 wouldn't have been speaking to myself or Chris if you were OK 184 00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:42,320 with that. So I think a lot of times it 185 00:10:42,320 --> 00:10:44,760 took a little bit of encouragement and holding 186 00:10:44,760 --> 00:10:47,120 someone's hand to get through the finish line because it's 187 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:49,720 really scary. And a lot of times as an anxious 188 00:10:49,720 --> 00:10:52,080 attacher, we don't trust your own judgement. 189 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:53,400 We don't trust your own thoughts. 190 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:55,480 We're always second guessing and making a decision. 191 00:10:55,560 --> 00:10:57,080 Decision can be really difficult. 192 00:10:57,400 --> 00:10:59,880 So I think at the end of the day, there's always going to be 193 00:10:59,880 --> 00:11:03,720 a fear for different reasons, whether it's what if I won't 194 00:11:03,720 --> 00:11:07,000 implement the work? What if I have a bad sense of 195 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:08,960 judgement? Once again, those are all 196 00:11:08,960 --> 00:11:11,760 legitimate thoughts. They all make sense. 197 00:11:11,760 --> 00:11:14,200 But at the end of the day, it kind of comes back to the same 198 00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:16,320 question. If you've tried therapy, you've 199 00:11:16,320 --> 00:11:19,840 tried calling your friends when you're upset, you have tried 200 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:21,960 journaling, but maybe you haven't done it consistently 201 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:23,560 enough. There's clearly something 202 00:11:23,560 --> 00:11:27,440 lacking in your support that is making it so you can't follow 203 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:29,240 through. It's not always you. 204 00:11:29,360 --> 00:11:32,600 Sometimes it's just you're doing things super sporadically to try 205 00:11:32,600 --> 00:11:35,320 to get temporary relief when really that's not the problem. 206 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:37,920 If you just journal for one or two days, you're not going to 207 00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:40,520 just wake up and be securely attached. 208 00:11:40,520 --> 00:11:44,320 You have to build small habits over time. 209 00:11:44,360 --> 00:11:47,280 And when you work with someone like Chris, the gentle reminders 210 00:11:47,280 --> 00:11:50,720 of you may not see the progress that you're making, but it's 211 00:11:50,720 --> 00:11:54,560 happening and you need to trust that it's happening and you need 212 00:11:54,560 --> 00:11:57,960 to keep doing the work. Because then you blink and 213 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:01,200 you're in your first healthy relationship with somebody that 214 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:04,800 is actually valuing and respecting you, and you wonder 215 00:12:04,800 --> 00:12:08,040 how you got there. Well, it's because you actually 216 00:12:08,040 --> 00:12:10,960 legitimately committed to be consistent. 217 00:12:10,960 --> 00:12:13,720 Even if it wasn't perfect, it's still different than what you 218 00:12:13,720 --> 00:12:16,360 did before. My goodness, there's so much in 219 00:12:16,360 --> 00:12:20,040 what you just shared. I just also want to point out 220 00:12:20,040 --> 00:12:22,280 the what ifs that you were saying. 221 00:12:22,280 --> 00:12:27,000 That is a classic sign of being in a space of doubt and worry 222 00:12:27,000 --> 00:12:28,960 and anxiety. So whenever I hear a what it 223 00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:33,280 will, what if this doesn't work? And what if that is anxiety 224 00:12:33,280 --> 00:12:35,840 presenting itself? And for someone struggling with 225 00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:39,560 anxious attachment, those are natural things to wonder. 226 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:42,800 But I think it's important to flip that on its head. 227 00:12:42,800 --> 00:12:46,480 What if you learn the skills you're hoping to learn? 228 00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:51,720 What if this environment of accountability and practicality 229 00:12:52,160 --> 00:12:56,720 is what has been lacking? What if you do know all of this? 230 00:12:56,720 --> 00:12:59,720 So it's not an information problem, but it's a 231 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:03,800 transformation problem. You need someone to help hold 232 00:13:03,800 --> 00:13:08,200 your feet to the fire so that you actually show up day in and 233 00:13:08,200 --> 00:13:10,000 day out. And that's part of why the 234 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:12,240 investment level is what it is, too. 235 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:16,400 You have real skin in the game. It is a bigger investment than 236 00:13:16,400 --> 00:13:19,600 just paying session by session with a therapist, or maybe not 237 00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:22,680 paying at all if you're not coming out of pocket for that 238 00:13:22,680 --> 00:13:25,240 expense. So this is something that 239 00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:27,640 completely flips things on its head. 240 00:13:27,640 --> 00:13:30,920 And I know for a lot of anxious attachers, there's shame in the 241 00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:34,840 room a lot of times that makes us think we're not good enough 242 00:13:34,840 --> 00:13:39,240 to invest in ourselves. And quite frankly, we always 243 00:13:39,240 --> 00:13:43,560 prioritize everybody else over ourselves, always in our 244 00:13:43,560 --> 00:13:47,080 relationships. So this is sometimes hard to get 245 00:13:47,080 --> 00:13:50,000 past for people like, am I worth that? 246 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:55,520 Is this actually going to help? But you get out what you put in, 247 00:13:55,520 --> 00:13:58,720 as I remind people all the time, you know, if you're concerned 248 00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:02,240 about that, that is actually something you have control over. 249 00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:07,120 Do the exercises, do the daily nervous system practice, reach 250 00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:11,760 out to me for messaging support. And if you show up for your 251 00:14:11,760 --> 00:14:15,040 sessions, in addition to all of those things, you are going to 252 00:14:15,040 --> 00:14:17,920 experience some degree of transformation. 253 00:14:18,520 --> 00:14:21,240 And I almost feel like another piece that people really 254 00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:26,360 struggle with is I always tell my friends, you have Foss fear 255 00:14:26,360 --> 00:14:30,320 of success. So it a lot of times being an 256 00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:32,800 anxious attacher. I know for me it was my 257 00:14:32,800 --> 00:14:37,680 personality for a really long time, my habits, my trauma 258 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:40,360 responses. It was literally just who I was 259 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:46,080 and I was terrified of not knowing who I am anymore and 260 00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:49,600 having to rebuild from that, from a place of being healthy. 261 00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:52,400 What if I'm not funny anymore with myself deprecating jokes? 262 00:14:52,400 --> 00:14:55,960 What if people don't like me anymore because I'm starting to 263 00:14:55,960 --> 00:14:58,200 set boundaries? It's easier this way. 264 00:14:58,200 --> 00:15:00,360 These are all thoughts that constantly went through my head 265 00:15:00,360 --> 00:15:03,720 of I don't know if I really am ready to change. 266 00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:07,400 Is it really that bad? And I mean, the answer for me, 267 00:15:07,400 --> 00:15:10,200 it was like, yeah, it is. But yeah, I just kind of wanted 268 00:15:10,200 --> 00:15:12,800 to point that out because that's kind of an unspoken thing that I 269 00:15:12,800 --> 00:15:15,080 thought about a lot. A lot of people, they really 270 00:15:15,080 --> 00:15:17,960 lean into their anxious attachment or their mental 271 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:19,520 illnesses. I mean, the things that they're 272 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:24,360 struggling with as being their personality and it. 273 00:15:24,360 --> 00:15:28,800 Does start to become an identity overtime that we then also 274 00:15:28,800 --> 00:15:32,040 become attached to. And that attachment part of it 275 00:15:32,040 --> 00:15:35,880 is important to name because it speaks to the experience, 276 00:15:35,880 --> 00:15:39,720 whether it be with a romantic partner or with ourselves, of 277 00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:42,800 even if it's not enjoyable, it is familiar. 278 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:46,840 The nervous system seeks it out, it recreates it in the hopes of 279 00:15:46,840 --> 00:15:49,440 resolving it. And yet without different 280 00:15:49,480 --> 00:15:54,280 ingredients, without something changing, the outcome only 281 00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:57,640 repeats itself. And I actually recently had 282 00:15:57,640 --> 00:16:01,640 someone reach out to me for coaching after three or four 283 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:05,360 years since our initial consultation and she enrolled in 284 00:16:05,360 --> 00:16:09,240 the program and is having a lot of realizations. 285 00:16:09,760 --> 00:16:13,880 One of those realizations is I could have done this three or 286 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:18,960 four years ago and been in an even better place by now, but 287 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:22,760 she wasn't ready, and that's OK. Everyone has to do their own 288 00:16:22,760 --> 00:16:27,200 work at their own time or not. That's also a choice, but I like 289 00:16:27,200 --> 00:16:30,720 to point that out just because you should listen to the timing 290 00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:34,720 of your life and if you're feeling called to expand your 291 00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:38,320 support system, then there is something compelling there. 292 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:41,720 It doesn't mean you have to work with me necessarily, but it does 293 00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:45,840 mean that the support system is lacking something. 294 00:16:46,440 --> 00:16:51,040 And if you revert back to that, that lack is still probably 295 00:16:51,040 --> 00:16:53,680 going to be there. If you don't have a road map or 296 00:16:54,240 --> 00:16:57,200 anything like that, now I want to transition to talking about 297 00:16:57,200 --> 00:17:01,120 your success specifically. You're in such a different place 298 00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:07,200 than you were previously. It hasn't been a road without 299 00:17:07,200 --> 00:17:11,319 its own challenges or bumps, let's say. 300 00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:14,880 Recall when you were putting yourself back out there and 301 00:17:14,880 --> 00:17:18,280 dating. You know you had some encounters 302 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:24,119 with folks that were not ideal. So talk to us about your dating 303 00:17:24,119 --> 00:17:27,200 experiences and putting yourself back out there and how you met 304 00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:32,480 Joey and how you knew that he was worth continuing to see and 305 00:17:32,480 --> 00:17:35,280 invest in because there was distance there too. 306 00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:38,880 There was, and I'm going to be completely honest because there 307 00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:42,280 was a lot of realizations through my healing to becoming 308 00:17:42,280 --> 00:17:46,720 more securely attached and that included me messing up several 309 00:17:46,720 --> 00:17:49,480 times. But The thing is, I got back on 310 00:17:49,480 --> 00:17:52,760 track faster. Realizations happen faster and 311 00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:55,880 situations that could have ended into a relationship like I would 312 00:17:55,880 --> 00:17:59,120 before I chose to end it and move forward. 313 00:17:59,120 --> 00:18:02,040 So although I made mistakes, it still ended up in a different 314 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:05,800 outcome, which is great. But naturally when my ex and I 315 00:18:05,800 --> 00:18:09,000 broke up, my first thought was OK, well, I have to find another 316 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:12,120 boyfriend. Embarrassingly enough, I always 317 00:18:12,120 --> 00:18:15,200 joked around with my friends. I've had a Valentine every year 318 00:18:15,200 --> 00:18:18,520 since I was 11. And it's, it's, it's crazy 319 00:18:18,520 --> 00:18:23,280 because I look back at some of the assignments I did when I was 320 00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:26,360 a kid and it asked, what do you want to be when you grow up? 321 00:18:27,040 --> 00:18:31,280 And people were saying a doctor, a writer, an astronaut. 322 00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:34,960 I looked back at one of them and it was so sad. 323 00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:38,680 It said to be loved. I think about that all the time. 324 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:43,120 And that's how I LED my life. And that pattern, even when I 325 00:18:43,120 --> 00:18:45,880 started my program initially with you, I still had that 326 00:18:45,880 --> 00:18:47,880 thought of how am I going to find my next support system? 327 00:18:47,880 --> 00:18:49,520 How am I going to find my next support system? 328 00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:52,360 Who is it going to be? Who's easy, easily accessible? 329 00:18:52,360 --> 00:18:54,080 Who do I think I can get to? Like me? 330 00:18:54,440 --> 00:18:58,080 These are all real thoughts that I had in my head and I want to 331 00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:02,240 say that the first date that I had after exiting my long term 332 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:05,720 relationship was a few weeks after it ended when I moved into 333 00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:08,520 my new space because I was desperate for relief. 334 00:19:08,520 --> 00:19:12,080 And I remember going out and having a great time with this 335 00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:13,760 person. They were somebody that I knew 336 00:19:13,760 --> 00:19:15,840 that they randomly messaged me on Facebook. 337 00:19:15,840 --> 00:19:18,880 I didn't reach out to them. So of course, in my mind I'm 338 00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:20,760 thinking, well, I didn't reach out to them. 339 00:19:20,800 --> 00:19:24,360 I didn't do anything weird. They reached out to me, so why 340 00:19:24,360 --> 00:19:27,320 not? This person wasn't ready to have 341 00:19:27,320 --> 00:19:30,520 a relationship. Truthfully I wasn't either, but 342 00:19:31,360 --> 00:19:34,960 I desperately just wanted someone to cling on to. 343 00:19:34,960 --> 00:19:37,240 And we went out dancing and we got tacos. 344 00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:42,000 We had a great, great conversation and I remember the 345 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:46,640 next morning he didn't text me or call me and I asked myself 346 00:19:46,640 --> 00:19:48,520 why? Why wouldn't he message me? 347 00:19:48,520 --> 00:19:51,720 Why? But that was a great night. 348 00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:54,480 A few days go by, I think by day four, I couldn't take it 349 00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:56,800 anymore. And I called him up and I said, 350 00:19:56,800 --> 00:19:59,520 hey, I I thought we had a great time. 351 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:01,880 I just wanted to check in to see if we're on the same page 352 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:03,680 because I haven't heard from you. 353 00:20:03,680 --> 00:20:06,280 I left the ball in your court and I'm just wanting to see if 354 00:20:06,280 --> 00:20:09,520 you have any intention of. Wanting to move forward or if 355 00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:11,160 you're just not feeling like this is for you. 356 00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:12,640 And that's something I tend to do. 357 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:15,080 Before, I would just suffer in silence. 358 00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:18,560 So that was a big piece for me, being able to pick up the phone 359 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:21,480 and do it from a place of empowerment as opposed to 360 00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:23,600 desperation. Because at that point I was 361 00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:26,800 thinking, well of course I want connection, but I'm actually not 362 00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:29,480 desperate for it. I want to hear what he is 363 00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:32,000 looking for and see if we're even in alignment because I'm 364 00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:35,120 feeling like we're not. He just said, you know what, 365 00:20:35,120 --> 00:20:37,000 you, you're a really strong person. 366 00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:38,760 And I, I actually really like you. 367 00:20:38,760 --> 00:20:41,040 But I'm driving for Uber right now. 368 00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:43,920 I'm between jobs. I see how successful you are. 369 00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:47,800 I don't feel comfortable moving forward because I don't feel 370 00:20:47,800 --> 00:20:50,240 confident enough of myself to be able to have a partner like you 371 00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:51,960 yet. So whether that that was true or 372 00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:54,000 not, it gave me clarity to move forward. 373 00:20:54,120 --> 00:20:57,840 And you listen to your own need for clarity by reaching out. 374 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:02,000 And I think that self honoring piece is important to name here. 375 00:21:02,360 --> 00:21:06,320 Yeah. So after some of these initial 376 00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:10,320 experiences, how long did it take for you until you met Joey? 377 00:21:10,440 --> 00:21:14,160 Yeah, I mean, I, I was dating for probably about a year. 378 00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:18,200 I went on like, you know, quite a few dates and I had a great 379 00:21:18,200 --> 00:21:19,840 time. I'm very social. 380 00:21:20,360 --> 00:21:24,280 I could probably find a way to connect with a paper bag. 381 00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:30,160 So for me, even if it wasn't a romantic connection, I still had 382 00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:32,920 a great time. And there were several instances 383 00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:35,360 where somebody wanted a relationship with me when I 384 00:21:35,360 --> 00:21:38,240 didn't want it back. And that was crazy for me 385 00:21:38,240 --> 00:21:41,000 because I always felt like I was the one chasing. 386 00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:44,560 It was almost a sense of empowerment that I'm not used 387 00:21:44,560 --> 00:21:49,200 to, but I didn't want it to be hurtful to other people. 388 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:53,800 And The thing is, I I found during this time that I didn't 389 00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:56,520 have to choose one or the other. I could still have emotional 390 00:21:56,520 --> 00:22:00,240 connection and have a casual relationship and still enjoy 391 00:22:00,240 --> 00:22:03,560 that person's presence, but know that they were not a long term 392 00:22:03,560 --> 00:22:04,960 fit for me. What? 393 00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:06,880 That was weird. Gray area. 394 00:22:06,880 --> 00:22:09,280 Hello. Yes, it was really interesting 395 00:22:09,280 --> 00:22:13,040 for me and I found it really difficult having those 396 00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:15,360 conversations with people that wanted that relationship with 397 00:22:15,360 --> 00:22:17,880 me. But I enjoyed their presence but 398 00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:19,400 knew they weren't a long term fit. 399 00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:24,400 And I felt for the first time that I was in the shoes of how 400 00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:26,840 other people must have felt with me in the past. 401 00:22:27,120 --> 00:22:31,280 I didn't really understand the fact that somebody could say to 402 00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:34,800 me, hey, I I really like you and I enjoy your presence, but I 403 00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:38,360 just don't see a future. No comprende this. 404 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:42,080 I had no idea how that could be possible. 405 00:22:42,080 --> 00:22:43,600 What do you mean? You like me and you don't see a 406 00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:45,200 future? That makes no sense. 407 00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:48,000 Well, I experienced it for the first time and it does make 408 00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:49,640 sense. It was just something I didn't 409 00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:53,360 experience before. Only I only was really dating 410 00:22:53,360 --> 00:22:58,400 one person at a time and right before I met Joey, I was seeing 411 00:22:58,400 --> 00:23:01,760 someone for a few months and I kind of dipped back into my 412 00:23:01,840 --> 00:23:05,760 anxious attachment tendencies of people pleasing particularly. 413 00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:09,360 I didn't feel like I wanted to date this person. 414 00:23:09,360 --> 00:23:12,880 They were incredibly persistent for months and it didn't scare 415 00:23:12,880 --> 00:23:14,240 me. So I thought to myself, well, 416 00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:17,520 maybe this is a potential of being a secure partner and I'm 417 00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:20,760 not feeling that fire inside because usually that's what I 418 00:23:20,760 --> 00:23:23,440 feel. I don't feel grossed out by him 419 00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:26,880 or anything, but I'm not really into it the way that he is. 420 00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:30,280 And I remember him asking me two to three times and the third 421 00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:34,320 time I just told myself, I'm going to say yes, I'm just going 422 00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:36,320 to say yes and I'm just going to go all in and see what happens. 423 00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:38,800 This was like a three month stint, but this gentleman named, 424 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:41,840 let's call him Jorge. I, I convinced myself I was 425 00:23:41,840 --> 00:23:44,760 really in it because I wanted things to be different for me 426 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:47,160 and I was questioning my own judgment. 427 00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:49,800 He told me he was in love with me and all these things and it 428 00:23:49,800 --> 00:23:52,240 wasn't there for me. And I ended it after a few 429 00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:54,720 months. And I just was like, after this 430 00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:57,600 experience, I am changed. I cannot do this again. 431 00:23:57,840 --> 00:24:00,640 Umm, I have to stick to how I really feel. 432 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:04,080 I ended up taking a small break from my online business to I go 433 00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:07,240 back into corporate and that's where I met Joey, my husband. 434 00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:09,600 And this is when things were fizzling out with that 435 00:24:09,600 --> 00:24:12,040 gentleman. I was dating for a few months 436 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:14,600 and Joey and I did not exchange phone numbers. 437 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:18,160 He knew that I was kind of seeing someone. 438 00:24:18,200 --> 00:24:20,000 I remember thinking, oh, he's really nice. 439 00:24:20,000 --> 00:24:22,120 He was constantly asking me, how can I help you? 440 00:24:22,120 --> 00:24:23,960 Or is everything making sense to you? 441 00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:27,040 Do you want to hop on Zoom and eat lunch together and I can 442 00:24:27,040 --> 00:24:28,320 walk you through some of the systems. 443 00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:30,960 He was just very friendly and very helpful. 444 00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:34,040 And I remember thinking that I thought he was really cute, but 445 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:39,240 I didn't do anything about it. It was the first job that I was 446 00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:42,000 ever fired from in my life. And I went back to running my 447 00:24:42,000 --> 00:24:45,160 business and I got a message on LinkedIn from Joey saying, Hey, 448 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:48,040 I'm really surprised that you were Lucko. 449 00:24:48,160 --> 00:24:50,320 You were the best performer on the team. 450 00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:52,960 I really looked up to all the things that you did and that you 451 00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:54,560 brought from doing in your own business. 452 00:24:54,560 --> 00:24:57,200 I I think that leadership is just kind of threatened by that 453 00:24:57,200 --> 00:24:59,920 and ended up letting you go. And if you want to still 454 00:24:59,920 --> 00:25:02,360 connect, here's my phone number, but no pressure. 455 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:06,520 And I was like, interesting. OK, we we texted a little bit 456 00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:10,040 and both of our grandparents were actually about to pass at 457 00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:12,720 the exact same time and we were both very close to this 458 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:16,080 particular grandparent. So we were talking, but we were 459 00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:19,560 both kind of going through the ends of the life of an important 460 00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:23,440 piece of our family system. It was a hard time, but we 461 00:25:23,440 --> 00:25:26,640 helped each other through it and we ended up Facetiming and we 462 00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:29,160 are Facetiming every day for over a month. 463 00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:31,800 We did intentional dates where we would play that. 464 00:25:31,800 --> 00:25:34,520 It's like a little red box. Are we really strangers? 465 00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:38,760 Is that what the Yes, we played that and we would have wine on 466 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,760 FaceTime and we we had intentional ways of getting to 467 00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:44,160 know each other as well. It wasn't just talking. 468 00:25:44,520 --> 00:25:48,000 We had similarities in regards of what we were looking for, he 469 00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:50,360 said. My intention is to find my wife 470 00:25:50,360 --> 00:25:55,640 at this time in my life, which I've never heard a man say that 471 00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:57,160 to me before. What do you mean? 472 00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:00,680 Everyone's like, I just want to catch a vibe and see how it 473 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:02,680 goes. So I, I said my intention is 474 00:26:02,680 --> 00:26:06,240 finding my life partner. I that's what I'm looking for. 475 00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:08,440 So thanks for being straightforward with that to 476 00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:09,880 make sure that we're in alignment. 477 00:26:09,880 --> 00:26:12,800 And it was refreshing that I wasn't the one who had to push 478 00:26:12,960 --> 00:26:16,840 to understand where he was at. He's a fellow anxious attacher. 479 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:19,400 I could kind of tell by the way that we connected. 480 00:26:19,400 --> 00:26:22,480 So we both were in pretty consistent communication, but 481 00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:25,440 we're giving the other person space to live our lives. 482 00:26:25,440 --> 00:26:27,960 We just really hit it off. I felt very comfortable with 483 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,640 him. I felt very safe. 484 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:34,240 And we got to know each other very well pretty early on, 485 00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:36,560 mostly because we were long distance, right? 486 00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:40,040 So what would equal dating in person? 487 00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:43,080 We surpassed that pretty quickly because all we had was 488 00:26:43,080 --> 00:26:45,320 conversation. I went to Atlanta because I was 489 00:26:45,320 --> 00:26:48,520 going to see one of my clients anyways, and we decided that we 490 00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:51,400 both wanted to spend the weekend together in an Airbnb. 491 00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:55,200 And we would decide what our comfortability was in regards of 492 00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:59,240 sleeping next to each other. We had an option for us to sleep 493 00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:01,440 separately. If there wasn't a connection in 494 00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:04,360 real life, we would be friends. So we were both on the same 495 00:27:04,360 --> 00:27:06,480 page. At the very least, we know that 496 00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:10,200 we like each other platonically, so if this doesn't end up being 497 00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:13,400 something we're open to the other person sharing, hey, this 498 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:15,920 doesn't feel right or I'm not feeling that connection, but 499 00:27:16,120 --> 00:27:18,280 let's finish out the weekend as friends and still be on good 500 00:27:18,280 --> 00:27:19,920 terms. So that made me feel 501 00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:21,560 comfortable. And of course, sharing my 502 00:27:21,560 --> 00:27:25,960 location with my girlfriends. So sure, you know, it went 503 00:27:25,960 --> 00:27:29,480 really well and he did things no one's ever done for me before. 504 00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:32,800 He had a whole note of my favorite snacks, my favorite 505 00:27:32,800 --> 00:27:35,040 activities. He was keeping track during our 506 00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:37,560 conversations, but he wasn't showing it to me. 507 00:27:37,760 --> 00:27:41,440 I saw it by accident when he was looking at it in the corner by 508 00:27:41,440 --> 00:27:43,640 himself. And he had all of my favorite 509 00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:46,240 snacks lined up for me. He brought me flowers when he 510 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:49,040 picked me up from the airport. He opened my doors for me. 511 00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:51,920 He bought us candles for when we had breakfast together. 512 00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:55,760 Just very intentional and very kind and not performative. 513 00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:58,200 I could just tell it was who he was, us as a person. 514 00:27:58,360 --> 00:28:01,320 And yeah, we had, we had an amazing time together and then 515 00:28:01,320 --> 00:28:04,600 he came to visit me in Chicago. We talked about what we wanted 516 00:28:04,600 --> 00:28:08,240 to do to move forward. I didn't really want to move to 517 00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:10,840 Atlanta and we both didn't want to keep doing long distance. 518 00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:14,880 I think it was just hard on us mentally and anxiety wise. 519 00:28:14,880 --> 00:28:17,240 It was just difficult being apart from each other. 520 00:28:17,240 --> 00:28:20,280 So we were trying to decide what we wanted to do, and he made the 521 00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:23,120 decision that he wanted to move to Chicago. 522 00:28:23,120 --> 00:28:26,440 And it was an interesting time because I was trying to do 523 00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:28,520 things differently than I've ever done because I've moved 524 00:28:28,520 --> 00:28:31,760 very quickly in relationships in the past out of scarcity and 525 00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:34,480 fear that they would leave. And I remember us eating 526 00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:37,160 together at a restaurant. And this is the third month that 527 00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:39,520 we were dating and knowing each other pretty much. 528 00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:43,560 We decided to sign a lease together in Chicago because I 529 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:46,320 was moving from my one bedroom and I was going to move alone. 530 00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:49,760 But we just made the decision and I told him about my anxious 531 00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:52,400 attachment journey and how I was concerned that I was moving too 532 00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:55,120 fast. We ended up having an agreement 533 00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:58,240 that if things didn't work out, he had an aunt and uncle that 534 00:28:58,240 --> 00:29:01,480 lived about 30 minutes away. I was able to afford the lease 535 00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:05,080 on my own and that I would keep the apartment and he would go 536 00:29:05,080 --> 00:29:06,920 live with his aunt and uncle until he could go back to 537 00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:10,200 Atlanta. So we did have a in depth 538 00:29:10,200 --> 00:29:13,600 conversation of how things would go and, and then it ended up 539 00:29:13,600 --> 00:29:16,000 working out really well. I wouldn't necessarily recommend 540 00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:20,200 it, but I really wanted to spend time with him and I wanted him 541 00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:24,200 to feel supported making that kind of move across the country. 542 00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:27,560 I felt that asking him to live completely on his own in a place 543 00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,880 that he did not know at all was unfair. 544 00:29:29,880 --> 00:29:33,360 I felt that I wanted to be there to support him because I 545 00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:37,560 wouldn't have asked him or even invited him to move to Chicago 546 00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:38,960 if I didn't see a future with him. 547 00:29:39,880 --> 00:29:43,320 So it was decision that I had to make based on what I knew and 548 00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:45,720 felt at the time of what I felt was best. 549 00:29:45,720 --> 00:29:48,720 And it wasn't coming from a place of fear of losing him. 550 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:51,560 It was coming from a place of I can see a feature with this 551 00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:55,360 person and I want them to feel supported and loved while making 552 00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,120 a move this big. I know I would probably want 553 00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:01,440 that same support. So this is the decision that we 554 00:30:01,440 --> 00:30:03,920 are making as a couple that feels best to us. 555 00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:07,720 People thought we were nuts for a few months and then his family 556 00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:11,520 met me and my family met him and once they saw us together and 557 00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:14,800 they, you know, they met me and him. 558 00:30:14,800 --> 00:30:18,600 His family went OK I get it OK. And my mom said OK I get it. 559 00:30:18,600 --> 00:30:20,960 Once everyone saw us together it was very clear. 560 00:30:20,960 --> 00:30:25,080 OK, this makes sense. This isn't some weird random 561 00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:27,800 playing house situation for a couple months and they're going 562 00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:30,880 to come back broken hearted, which could have happened, but 563 00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:34,080 you can kind of tell the difference when someone's just 564 00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:36,120 kind of moving too fast. They don't know each other at 565 00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:37,440 all. It's not intentional. 566 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:40,560 It was a very grounded feeling decision. 567 00:30:40,560 --> 00:30:43,280 So that was really healing for me to go. 568 00:30:43,720 --> 00:30:48,920 Made this in a place of security and feeling grounded and having 569 00:30:48,920 --> 00:30:51,640 a plan if things didn't work out and feeling safe enough to make 570 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:55,960 that plan with with my partner. And then Fast forward a year and 571 00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:59,200 a half, he proposed and then we were. 572 00:30:59,240 --> 00:31:01,520 We got married in December of 2024. 573 00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:05,240 You guys are the cutest. There's so much there that I 574 00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:08,040 want to name. And the first is the 575 00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:13,200 consideration of one another at every point as you're 576 00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:17,040 describing, whether it's the Airbnb or moving in together or 577 00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:19,760 even the idea of the move. Yeah. 578 00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:25,000 There's a real consideration of what's best, not just 579 00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:29,480 individually but together as a team and respecting one 580 00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:33,480 another's point of view, perspective, experiences, 581 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:37,120 comfort levels. There's also so much 582 00:31:37,360 --> 00:31:42,720 thoughtfulness and intentionality there that is 583 00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:47,640 important to name for folks who are potentially dating to have a 584 00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:51,720 lifelong partnership because each of you were able to name 585 00:31:51,720 --> 00:31:54,640 that that's what you desired. That's what this was 586 00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:57,920 potentially, hopefully working its way towards. 587 00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:01,880 If that intention hadn't have been set, then maybe the move 588 00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:04,280 doesn't make sense. Moving in together doesn't make 589 00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:06,960 sense. I mean, you even named that. 590 00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:10,920 You know, you saw a future with this person and you want him 591 00:32:10,920 --> 00:32:12,360 nearby. I mean, that's the whole point 592 00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:14,720 of ending the long distance, right? 593 00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:18,200 So I hear you about the judgement from the outside in 594 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:21,720 and people thinking you might be crazy or out of your mind or 595 00:32:21,720 --> 00:32:25,200 it's happening too quickly for their comfort level. 596 00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:29,320 But there's so much communication and consideration 597 00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:32,880 that happened between the two of you to get you there. 598 00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:35,880 And I think a lot of that intentionality, a lot of that 599 00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:39,840 consideration is why you are where you are today. 600 00:32:40,240 --> 00:32:44,040 There is such a comfort and care and safety that both of you 601 00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:48,680 brought to each other. That doesn't mean that it was 602 00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:50,560 perfect. It doesn't mean that it was 603 00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:53,920 without conflict or disagreement, which is important 604 00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:57,640 to name because many people just assume then that because you're 605 00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:00,440 so considerate and thoughtful and intentional that it means 606 00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:04,520 you don't argue or disagree, which is not true. 607 00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:07,000 Not true. I talked about this just a 608 00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:11,080 couple of episodes ago on what a secure relationship actually 609 00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:14,360 looks like. It's how you repair that matters 610 00:33:14,360 --> 00:33:18,800 and how you come back together that matters, and also how you 611 00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:22,440 show up for the conflict and disagreement that matters. 612 00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:25,680 And any patterns there. But I just wanted to name those 613 00:33:25,680 --> 00:33:28,360 things because I know a lot of people watching and listening 614 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:31,440 are like, how do I get there? I can't find the person. 615 00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:35,400 I'm not matching with someone or meeting people that want that 616 00:33:35,400 --> 00:33:38,280 kind of depth and intentionality. 617 00:33:38,800 --> 00:33:42,200 I also want to name that you had other prospects. 618 00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:46,560 I did have other prospects. You had other people that really 619 00:33:46,560 --> 00:33:51,000 wanted to go the distance with you and you listened to 620 00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:53,720 yourself. Because in the coaching program 621 00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:58,160 for people who don't know, you do a lot of work to identify 622 00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:01,240 your needs, your values, your love languages and really paint 623 00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:05,000 a very clear picture for yourself of who am I? 624 00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:10,239 What do I actually need? What are my must haves in a 625 00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:14,320 partner and partnership? And with that clarity that you 626 00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:18,960 brought to your dating life even if you didn't make the perfect 627 00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:21,120 decisions. I'm using air quotes for people 628 00:34:21,120 --> 00:34:22,440 who are listening instead of watching. 629 00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:26,400 But even if you didn't make the perfect decisions or honor how 630 00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:31,560 you were feeling earlier rather than later, you eventually got 631 00:34:31,560 --> 00:34:36,159 there and you listened to the clarity that you developed for 632 00:34:36,159 --> 00:34:39,040 yourself, that self-awareness that you cultivated in the 633 00:34:39,040 --> 00:34:42,080 coaching program. And because of that, when Joey 634 00:34:42,080 --> 00:34:47,040 showed up, you were very quickly, I think, able to see 635 00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:51,560 this person is different. This feels more natural, more 636 00:34:51,560 --> 00:34:54,560 organic. You're not having to coach or 637 00:34:54,560 --> 00:34:58,720 pursue or chase this person. You're not having to tell them, 638 00:34:58,720 --> 00:35:03,360 well, this is what I prefer. He's already naturally leaned in 639 00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:06,840 because of his own anxious attachment tendencies. 640 00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:09,640 And that's another thing I want to name for people too. 641 00:35:10,000 --> 00:35:14,840 An anxious, anxious partnership can be beautiful. 642 00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:20,560 It can be really healthy and fruitful and deep and meaningful 643 00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:23,600 and very fulfilling. And that doesn't mean that 644 00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:26,360 you're both 100% secure or insecure. 645 00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:29,160 That's not a thing. I've talked about that a lot on 646 00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:31,920 the show. You know that there's a degree 647 00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:35,160 of security and insecurity that's present in all of us. 648 00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:38,480 Yes. But there was enough security 649 00:35:38,480 --> 00:35:43,520 there, enough fuel in the tank, enough leaned in Ness from both 650 00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:48,560 of you that gave you what you needed to continue. 100% I 651 00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:51,560 couldn't agree more of what you said because something that 652 00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:55,000 comes to mind to me of the difference between Joey and I 653 00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:59,000 moving together a few months in. I think back to when my ex 654 00:35:59,000 --> 00:36:01,040 partner before Joe and I were together. 655 00:36:01,360 --> 00:36:04,920 I was very manipulative out of fear of being left. 656 00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:07,080 And that was something that I learned through therapy, through 657 00:36:07,080 --> 00:36:11,280 coaching with you, the part that I played and he was not ready to 658 00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:14,320 move in together at all. I remember feeling the stress 659 00:36:14,320 --> 00:36:17,400 from that situation and the misalignment and my fear 660 00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:20,520 exasperated from knowing that I really wanted it. 661 00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:23,400 But it wasn't even from a place of, oh, I really want it because 662 00:36:23,480 --> 00:36:24,880 because I want to be with this person. 663 00:36:24,880 --> 00:36:27,760 I just didn't want to be alone. But there was definitely 664 00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:30,600 misalignment in that relationship that I I saw later. 665 00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:34,560 And I was so willing to push him in a direction he wasn't ready 666 00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:36,640 to go in. And that was a huge piece of why 667 00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:40,720 the relationship ended because of my fear being so big, being 668 00:36:40,720 --> 00:36:45,160 left and being alone. I was willing to do anything to 669 00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:48,000 get him on the same page as me when maybe he'd say the words 670 00:36:48,000 --> 00:36:49,880 that he was, but in his heart he wasn't. 671 00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:53,120 There was a really big difference in how I showed up in 672 00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:56,640 the relationship I have with my husband than when I did before I 673 00:36:56,640 --> 00:36:59,160 started your program. I mean, it's I'm two different 674 00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:01,080 people. Do you consider yourself secure 675 00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:02,320 now? It's a great question. 676 00:37:02,320 --> 00:37:07,160 Much more secure, I would say. Who I chose as a partner really 677 00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:10,760 makes it easy for me to be secure in my marriage because he 678 00:37:10,760 --> 00:37:13,680 doesn't trigger the anxious parts of myself. 679 00:37:13,680 --> 00:37:16,720 I do still struggle with anxious attachment professionally and 680 00:37:16,720 --> 00:37:19,880 with friendships sometimes, but I would say that I'd handle 681 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:22,840 things a lot better. The symptoms of, you know, 682 00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:26,880 shaking, being afraid, not being able to eat due to abandonment 683 00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:31,240 or some type of conflict. Instead of it lasting an entire 684 00:37:31,240 --> 00:37:35,480 day, it will last 30 minutes. Maybe it's just so much lighter 685 00:37:35,480 --> 00:37:37,040 than it was before. Makes sense. 686 00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:41,120 A full day to 30 minutes is a huge improvement. 687 00:37:41,520 --> 00:37:44,360 Oh yeah, I mean, listen, my productivity has gone up. 688 00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:47,720 I'm sure. Yeah, Well, you're not so 689 00:37:47,720 --> 00:37:49,640 depleted. I mean, many of us stay in 690 00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:53,000 survival mode, and it is exhausting being anxiously 691 00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:54,920 attached. Yeah, all the time. 692 00:37:55,200 --> 00:37:56,360 It is. That kind of level of 693 00:37:56,360 --> 00:37:59,600 dysregulation will deplete you significantly. 694 00:38:00,320 --> 00:38:01,920 I do think it is important to name. 695 00:38:01,920 --> 00:38:04,440 It's OK to still struggle with some of this. 696 00:38:04,440 --> 00:38:08,200 A lot of these types of patterns tend to stem back to our 697 00:38:08,200 --> 00:38:11,360 earliest relationships. And I know we didn't get to it 698 00:38:11,440 --> 00:38:14,080 today, but there was some trauma there. 699 00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:18,160 I've talked openly about my own trauma on the show, so it's 700 00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:21,280 important not to judge ourselves for that, especially if you're 701 00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:23,720 watching or listening. Depending on where you are on 702 00:38:23,720 --> 00:38:27,440 your journey, it is OK to still struggle. 703 00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:31,600 Again, incremental improvement, small adjustments that 704 00:38:31,600 --> 00:38:37,360 accumulate over time to vastly improve how you manage on a 705 00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:41,960 day-to-day level and from moment to moment. 706 00:38:42,440 --> 00:38:44,760 You're not derailed by this anymore. 707 00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:48,200 You're able to function. You have a very fulfilling life 708 00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,560 and I've seen this quote circulate a lot but I want to 709 00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:54,360 name it here. It says that you can tell 710 00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:59,000 someones level of self love by the partner they choose. 711 00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:06,280 And you talking about your marriage now to Joey and the 712 00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:10,920 relationship that you have and how calm he makes you, how 713 00:39:10,920 --> 00:39:14,720 peaceful it is on the whole. Again, not every single second, 714 00:39:14,720 --> 00:39:18,120 but that he no longer triggers those parts of you. 715 00:39:18,120 --> 00:39:20,360 I think that's a part of the consideration and thoughtfulness 716 00:39:20,360 --> 00:39:22,640 too. He knows you at a very deep 717 00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:29,520 level and is considerate to not do that and not go there and I 718 00:39:29,520 --> 00:39:33,680 think that indicates a very deep level of self love for you. 719 00:39:33,840 --> 00:39:37,440 Who I ended up ultimately choosing for myself is not the 720 00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:40,320 same person that I would have chosen for myself even a few 721 00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:42,800 years ago. And you would see the extreme 722 00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:44,920 difference. And I there's an extreme 723 00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:47,400 difference with how I felt about myself and how I feel about 724 00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:49,320 myself now. So yeah, that I would say that's 725 00:39:49,320 --> 00:39:53,000 completely true. What would you say to the 726 00:39:53,000 --> 00:39:58,080 Christina who was in that one bedroom apartment with the 727 00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:01,160 mattress on the floor? What do you have to say to her 728 00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:03,000 now? What do you think she needs to 729 00:40:03,000 --> 00:40:06,040 hear from you or what? What would feel empowering to 730 00:40:06,040 --> 00:40:09,200 say to her knowing where you are now and where that road would 731 00:40:09,200 --> 00:40:12,120 eventually lead? I would tell her keep holding 732 00:40:12,120 --> 00:40:14,480 on. You're going to get to where 733 00:40:14,480 --> 00:40:18,120 you're looking to go. Even more so, keep showing up 734 00:40:18,120 --> 00:40:21,640 every single day. Things are going to get better. 735 00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:24,160 You're a good person. You don't have to keep living 736 00:40:24,160 --> 00:40:27,520 this way and you won't. But you have to keep trying 737 00:40:27,520 --> 00:40:29,120 every single day. And I know that you will. 738 00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:32,200 And I love you. You're worthy of all the love 739 00:40:32,200 --> 00:40:34,320 that you've been looking for. That's what I would say. 740 00:40:34,440 --> 00:40:36,440 Beautifully put. What do you have to say to 741 00:40:36,440 --> 00:40:42,640 anyone out there who hasn't healed their anxious attachment 742 00:40:42,720 --> 00:40:44,240 yet? What's your advice to them? 743 00:40:44,240 --> 00:40:47,520 There's just so much life to live on the other side. 744 00:40:47,520 --> 00:40:51,480 I mean, when I think of how I felt when I was in the thick of 745 00:40:51,480 --> 00:40:54,640 it, I felt like I was in this tiny little box and I was 746 00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:59,640 looking at the everyone on the outside moving and smiling and 747 00:40:59,640 --> 00:41:02,000 I'm in this little box that I just couldn't get out of. 748 00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:06,240 And for people listening, if you feel like you're in that box and 749 00:41:06,240 --> 00:41:10,000 you feel that there's no way out, if you are in a 750 00:41:10,000 --> 00:41:14,880 relationship that isn't serving you, if you are trying to find a 751 00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:18,600 partner but you feel like it's hard to find the right person 752 00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:22,920 for you, all I can say is that your life will become infinitely 753 00:41:22,920 --> 00:41:25,520 better if you make the choice to heal. 754 00:41:25,520 --> 00:41:28,840 Keep the good things, but the things that are not serving you, 755 00:41:29,400 --> 00:41:32,440 they're they're putting you back in your life. 756 00:41:32,520 --> 00:41:35,440 You every day that you decide not to heal from anxious 757 00:41:35,440 --> 00:41:38,440 attachment, it's one less day that you're really living. 758 00:41:38,760 --> 00:41:41,880 And sometimes it's hard to see what's possible on the other 759 00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:44,120 side because you don't think it's possible for you. 760 00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:47,200 It's, it's a mountain to climb, but you don't have to do it 761 00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:50,280 alone. There's people out there who who 762 00:41:50,280 --> 00:41:53,520 can absolutely help you. And if you're willing to try 763 00:41:53,520 --> 00:41:57,480 your best every day, even if some days 10%, some days 100%, 764 00:41:58,000 --> 00:41:59,760 you're still moving that needle forward. 765 00:41:59,840 --> 00:42:02,880 You will absolutely begin to live the life that you've always 766 00:42:02,880 --> 00:42:06,880 dreamed of, if not better. But there's no better day but 767 00:42:06,880 --> 00:42:10,400 today to get started on this journey so you can start living 768 00:42:10,400 --> 00:42:12,400 a fulfilling life. Because if you keep living the 769 00:42:12,400 --> 00:42:14,840 way that you are now, 10 years are going to pass you by and 770 00:42:14,840 --> 00:42:17,280 you're going to wonder why you didn't change anything. 771 00:42:18,080 --> 00:42:19,440 And that's really no way to live. 772 00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:23,480 Yeah, you can't make more time. As I always remind people, not 773 00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:26,720 even Jeff Bezos or Elon Musk can buy it. 774 00:42:26,720 --> 00:42:29,680 All the money in the world can't buy it, correct? 775 00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:33,280 So if you need the support, seek that out. 776 00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:35,840 Even if it's not me, Find a different coach. 777 00:42:35,840 --> 00:42:39,360 Find a therapist who really sees you and challenges you and holds 778 00:42:39,360 --> 00:42:41,880 you accountable. Find a healing modality that 779 00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:44,840 resonates with you. Take a look at your social 780 00:42:44,840 --> 00:42:47,480 circle and how they impact your nervous system. 781 00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:51,360 Try to surround yourself with people who you feel you can be 782 00:42:51,360 --> 00:42:55,800 your genuine self with, who appreciate you, who celebrate 783 00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:57,760 you. All very important things that 784 00:42:57,760 --> 00:43:00,280 I've talked about on the show before as well. 785 00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:06,880 Christina, as we wind toward the end of today's episode, how can 786 00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:09,880 people find you? You can find me on Instagram. 787 00:43:09,880 --> 00:43:14,680 Christina connects. Always happy to talk to a fellow 788 00:43:14,840 --> 00:43:17,760 fan of Chris's or somebody who's struggling with anxious 789 00:43:17,760 --> 00:43:21,000 attachment if you want to hear about my experience working with 790 00:43:21,000 --> 00:43:22,880 Chris. Anything else about my story? 791 00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:26,200 More than happy to talk to you or just connect as a fellow 792 00:43:26,200 --> 00:43:27,560 human. So that's Christina. 793 00:43:27,560 --> 00:43:35,200 Christina connects, CONNECTS. And yeah, I'll see you on the 794 00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:39,400 other side. Christina connects and for those 795 00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:43,000 who are interested in the coaching program, head to 796 00:43:43,000 --> 00:43:47,440 cracklift.com/coaching. CRACKL. 797 00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:53,200 Iffe.com/coaching Christina, thank you so much for coming on 798 00:43:53,200 --> 00:43:55,400 the show. It's so wonderful to see your 799 00:43:55,400 --> 00:43:58,560 face again and hear your voice. I know this combo is going to 800 00:43:58,560 --> 00:44:00,640 resonate with a lot a lot of folks. 801 00:44:01,440 --> 00:44:01,920 Thank you.