Stories from Super Touring. It was one of the most
anticipated debuts of the year as Andy Rams and Paul Radysich
finally brought the brand new Ford Mondeo to the BTCC grid at
Pembrey in South Wales in 1993. Welcome to the latest episode of
Stories From Super Touring. I'm Levi Riley and as ever to
take a look back at this eventful race meeting as stories
from Super Touring regular Andrew Charman and the regular
team of Adam Jones and Alan Clark.
Gentlemen, how are we all this evening?
Very good. Thank you.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Good to be back as always.
Looking forward to. A race track that's very close
to my home, so. And it's in my adopted country,
absolutely. Yes, and a track that probably a
lot of lot of listeners probably may have never even heard of
because there's there's not a lot of big races held there, is
there? No, nothing much now.
It's mainly a testing venue. I think the the, the rulings now
are so tight down there that they they get very little down
there at all. Andrew, I think we'll start with
you this week. What first comes to your mind
when you think back to this race meeting?
Actually something comes straight to mind and it's it's
quite personal and it's got nothing to do with Ford Mondeos.
My wife, Rosemary, she was, and she still is, as much of A
motorsport petrol head as me. I'd actually officially met her
at Brands Hatch in 1987 when she was going through the racing
score with her lead instructor being one, Ben Edwards, our
first son James, who today he writes about touring cars among
other things. So he's continuing the family
dynasty. He'd been born in April 1991 and
I'm pretty sure this meeting at Pembrey was the first when we
considered him old enough to be left with his grandparents while
we had a weekend in Wales. This was my first season working
properly in the BTCC and I was still transitioning because I'd
been a motorsport photographer up to them.
So I was transitioning to writer, and in those days it
wasn't that hard to get trackside access alongside me
for Rosemary. So we were at the end of the pit
lane and in a prime position to witness what I know we're going
to discuss further later, which was one of the greatest BTCC
starts of all time by smoking Joe Finkelhock.
It was like he had launch control, like like on the
Chinese electric super saloon that I drove only last week.
He simply left from the 3rd row, drove past everybody and was in
front by the 1st corner. It was amazing.
Fantastic And and Adam coming to you next, what jumps into your
mind when you think about this race.
Yeah looking looking back I think that the biggest one for
me, we're probably seeing the privateer of the Curia cost car
of David Leslie on pole position alongside Cleland obviously in
the works you know dominant team car driver combination.
So I think seeing him on pole position was a good, was a good
thing. And then you know watching some
of this footage back he's then you're listening to Andy Rouse
moaning about everyone that sort of said hello to him on the way
past in, in one way. And also again, just what what's
been, what's been said there with smoking Joe, having a rocky
start and having a bit of an easy time if it really just
staying out of trouble because that's what was just one of
those races, wasn't it was just absolute carnage at times, yeah.
Yeah, absolutely. And and finally coming to you,
Al, what are your memories of this last race in your homeland
of Wales? Well, that's it.
The fact that it was a BTCC race in Wales, I mean there's only
been two in the last well in my lifetime and and that was 92 and
93 at Pembury. My going going back to my my
original thoughts of when I think of this race, it's, it's,
it's quite childish, I'm afraid, but it's.
Andy Ross calling Keith Odor Keith Odor.
Did he do that on purpose as a bit of a Dick?
Do you? Think I'm not sure he's just one
of surname he doesn't know how to pronounce.
It just stuck with me, always stuck with me.
It's like Keith Odor. It's really childish, but he
always really stuck with me and just his hilarious looking back,
his rant. You know, I want to go motor
racing, not stop car racing. Thank you.
Something that's always really stuck with me.
But then also just being really sad for for David Leslie because
he was, as we will go into I'm sure, absolutely dominant this
weekend and and came away with nothing.
But yeah, those are my first couple of memories.
Anyway, that's 11, slightly more childish than the other.
As well as ever, we have asked our faithful listeners for what
they thought about this race meeting on our social media
channels and Andrew Collier says he remembers it.
For the first time. We heard that famous V6 sing and
and what a noise that would come to be in the championship there
on, well, Steve Pryor. He says he remembers the Mondeo
debut not quite going to plan and Harvey setting light to his
breaks in the pits. He also mentioned that it's a
shame that Pembre dropped off the calendar because it's a
really great circuit and I'm sure we'll get more into a
discussion about Pembre as a circuit throughout the episode.
Pete Skinner, He remembers just seeing that Mondeo out for the
first time and that, as we've already just touched on a couple
of times, Andy Rouse not exactly being the happiest of men after
that race with his with his Rams.
Tim Davies remembers as, as Andrew's already mentioned,
Winkelhock sort of flying star off the line, and that was also
mentioned by Andy Gray and Mark Shaw.
Greg Denton says that the heat was his main memory of that
race, saying that he he's never been sunburned in Wales before,
but that day normally win wind. Wind burnt on him.
Yeah. Matt Walker.
He says he remembers Tim Harvey's fire as well, and also
Harry Nuttall having a fine drive in the other Akiria Kos
Cavalier Ian Cannell. His main memory of the event is
Andy Rouse mispronouncing Kefau Dor's name same as Alex as ODA,
in his legendary rant about how many drivers hit him off that
day. Ian Cannell and I are are
childish buddies, yes. And that rant from Andy Rouse is
also remembered by Michael Hedstrom, Chris Morgan, Luke
Roberts, Kevin Wolfenden and John Cawley.
The build up to this race meeting was dominated by the
long-awaited debut of the Ford Mondeo, which would be driven by
Andy Rouse and Paul Radysich. Ralph Sport had started building
the Mondeos in December of 1992. With Rouse taking his time to
develop the cars fully before making their debut in the
series, Ford had finally confirmed the persistent rumours
in January 1993, confirming that they would be taking part in the
1993 championship with Andy Rouse preparing the cars for him
and Radisich. The car was then unveiled in
February at Andy Rouse's workshop in Coventry.
At the time of the unveiling it was a rear wheel drive car with
AV6 engine developed by Rouse. In March, the car would see the
track for the first time with the Mondeo running at
Snetterton, Bran Satch and the official TOCA test at
Silverstone. At these tests, the car was
roughly 2 1/2 seconds a lap off the pace.
It was at this time that the decision was made to miss the
start of the season. An official spokesman for Ford
said that more time was needed and that we want it to be right.
Andrew, can you understand that decision by Ford to delay the
debut of the new car? I can, and if I remember this
correctly, because it was a long time ago and I'm old now, there
was quite a lot to it. Ford is one of the big names of
BTCC history was using the series like most manufacturers
were at this time, to promote its own new road car because the
Mondeo was replacing the Sierra and it actually went on.
The road car actually went on sale in March 93.
Which was the same time as it was supposed to be debuting in
the in in the BTCC. So clearly being way off the
pace early on wouldn't have helped the sales pitch very
much, but it was actually quite a complex situation.
The engines, which were actually Mazda units extricated from the
Ford Probe, that's what they were based on.
They were supposed to be done by Cosworth, but Cosworth was
basically was also too busy at the start of the season, so
Rouse had to do his own programme at the start.
And plans for the road Mondeo included a four wheel drive
version and because there was a four wheel drive version, that
meant that Rouse could choose whether his car was front wheel
drive or rear wheel drive. And being a traditional old
racer, he of course went for a rear wheel drive because the
engines were ready just ahead of Pembre and of course they were
clearly quicker. But Ford has also been so
overwhelmed by sales of the road front wheel drive Rd. car that
they couldn't make enough, and so they put the all-wheel drive
version back. And that technically rendered
Rousey's race machines illegal in rear wheel drive form, so he
had to very quickly produce front wheel drive versions,
which made his qualifying on the 2nd row at Pembrey all the more
impressive. In April, the Mondeo took part
in the official TOCA test at Donnington Park before the
European Grand Prix was to be held there.
This time the car was 5 seconds off the pace and the cars were
again withdrawn from the race weekend.
Out. This must have been quite a
frustrating time for Allison Ford by this point.
Frustrating to a level, Yes. Sort of a bit like the kid at
Christmas, isn't it, when when you've got a new toy you want to
play with it and when you've got a new racing car you want to go
out and race it. So I can understand that there
are certain parts of of Andy Rouse and and Ford that would be
frustrated at these setbacks and thinking come on, yeah, we just
want to start racing our car, but.
As the Ford spokesman said there earlier, they wanted to do it
right. And so I guess these decisions
to keep putting off the the debut of the car would mean that
they would be doing it right. Because if they didn't do it
right, as Andrew said, they'd be at the back of the grid and that
really wouldn't impress people. You know, they're looking to
sell this new car that that replaced the Sierra.
And nobody's going to buy and nobody's going to look at the
car at the back of the grid and think, oh, that's a car I fancy.
I fancy buying. So no, I I can.
Yes, it would be frustrating. But I can also see that they
would be looking long term and thinking, no, this is the right
sensible call and and we just need to be patient.
So yeah. In May Rouse desert the car
again. This time the car was in the
front wheel drive configuration. Ford then confirmed that two
more Mondeos were due to be built, this time much lighter
and designed around the front wheel drive configuration.
Then finally before the meeting at Pembre, the new cars were
tested and were competitive. They were front wheel drive and
had Cosworth's face to engine installed rather than the Rouse
engines. Adam the quite a lot of
different configurations to be tested and tried in in the lead
up to racing for the first time in that model.
How would that have affected things for both the team and
drivers? I think, yeah, I mean they did
the right thing in terms of doing all the testing they
could. And most importantly, they're
going to the official test so that they're not going and doing
a private test elsewhere on their own in Spain or wherever
to get maximum. They needed to do it against
current established cars that are proven because that's the
only way you're going to know if you're on the pace or not, as a
as a brand new team, as a brand new car, that's what you needed
to do. So luckily they had that
exposure to be able to do that and then pull the car out of
races as and when if they're needed to.
But they've obviously done enough development within that
and testing and everything. All the information they would
have gathered over these tests is knowing what they needed.
So the car was clearly overweight because it's now come
with a lighter car. They realized that front wheel
drive is the way forward. You've got well established
front wheel drive cars here that again already established.
So yeah, they've done, they've done everything they're needed
to do and that just took their time to do it.
But they probably didn't have, they probably needed to have
started this program a lot earlier than they did.
But then it all, suddenly it's just ran over to that, to the,
you know, the year going into when the season beginning
really. But like everyone said, really
they couldn't just go into this and just, you know, maybe
qualify at the back and then a race or two goes by you, then
hopefully midfield and then you can't do that.
This is a manufacturer as big as Ford that he's there to sell
cars. This was win on a Sunday, sell
on a Monday. That was the attitude with all
of these manufacturers. So they had to get it right and
I think they went about it the right way.
If you look at those, the other big team that made the debut in
93, manufacturer wise, it's Renault.
And take away those two wet wins at Donnington with the with the
Michelin tyres and Renault season was very poor and I guess
Ford wouldn't want a similar season like that.
Absolutely. They've got so many others to
learn from, haven't they? To not make those mistakes?
You know they they this car was let's not forget this car was
replacing the the dominant Sierra Cosworth that was adored
by so many people and. They couldn't get it wrong that
they couldn't have this as a as a massive flop, would they?
Because that's all the publicity that I've got out of it was just
a massive, you know, the costs of what they were doing, you
know, coming into it and just been a massive flop.
I mean that, you know, that'd have been a PR nightmare,
wouldn't it? I think Renault were really
using 93 literally as a tow in the water exercise.
They obviously always planned to go to the Laguna and the
nineteens were a stopgap. Yeah, So it was, I mean they'd
they'd have been well aware that the 19 was being phased out so.
You know, there was no long term plan for the 19 to race long
term in the BTCC. So yeah, it's, it's, I suppose
it's a bit like the Volvo. Yeah.
You know, if you're going to learn an experiment, why not do
do it with something with a little bit less pressure, you
know? Well, I start on Volvo.
We can go off in a whole different direction.
Absolutely. People there still swear that
the estate would have been there in 95 if the arrow hadn't come
in. Yeah, no, yeah.
There's a few people who say that.
I'm not sure what to believe on that.
I. Don't think anyone is.
There are so many. We don't know What to Believe is
on touring cars. The competitive showing in the
test convinced Ralston Ford that this was the right time to debut
the car. Prior to the race, Andy Rouse
gave BBC Sport an interview for Grandstand.
Let's listen to that now. It's taken quite a while to to
design and develop the car into a competitive race car.
It's such a high standard that's that you need to meet now to be
competitive in the British Touring Car Championship.
But it does take the time, you know to to develop a car to that
level. And we started in December to to
build the Ford Mondeo and we've now developed a very competitive
car that's sitting 4th on the grid.
We had a car running by the first race, although it wasn't
at that stage fully competitive. It's taking quite a while then
to develop the engine, the the Ford V6 engine to a competitive
level and we've also evaluated front and rear wheel drive and
the car today is a front wheel drive car.
And so that that's really brought us to where we are now.
There's a lot of work going on behind the scenes.
The boys have all worked very, very hard and they're pleased to
be here today as a race track. For months, fans have been
waiting patiently for the debut of the Mondeo.
Andrew, can you understand the level of height that surrounded
this car's debut? I absolutely can.
A BTCC without Ford was not really right, was it?
Back in the 1960s it had been F1 champion Jim Clark in the Lotus
Cortinas, and then there were also the massive Galaxies and
the Mustangs, the yank tanks. Then of course in the 70s you
had the Allaman escorts, which were evocative cars in their own
right. And of course the final years
before the two litre formula, which as we know, became Super
Torian. They were dominated by the
awesome RS5 hundreds. I mean the Sierra.
The Sierra RS500 was a car that anyone like me who actually saw
them in action has a heck of a lot of memories of.
But if you ignore Rob Gravic's track star sapphire of 91, and
to be honest, that's something that's frankly very easy to do.
There'd been no proper Ford input since Super Touring began.
The return was much awaited by a whole lot of fans, particularly
as in an era of what detractors and the BTCC called Retma bill
racing. The Mondeo was likely to be one
of the most familiar Rep mabiles on EU KS roads.
On Europe's roads, it was Ford's First World Car.
It was supposed to be sold in the same way all over the globe.
Building up to the meeting, David Leslie was quickest in the
pre race test session at Pembre. This was coming off the back of
pole position at the previous round at Brands Hatch.
David was fresh from racing at Le Mond in a Jaguar alongside
Win Percy and Armand Harner, but was ready to get back to the
BTCC action at Pembre. He said the BMWs will be the
cast to beat at Pembrey because it because it is a tight track,
There are two hairpins and the BMW traction will be key here.
I think we will be chasing them all weekend again.
Just like last year Alex, the BMWs taken the top four
positions at Pembrey in 1992, so as David Wright to think that
the BMWs would be the car to beat once again.
Yes, it's a fair assumption. Part of me thinks that David's
trying to to to play down his chances at Pembre, but he'd got
pole position at the previous race at Brands Hatch as well.
So the the the Acuria Cos RML Cavalier was competitive.
But looking at the characteristics of a track like
Pembre again as as we as someone as one of us said earlier this.
Possibly some people here listening who might never have
seen Pembre or never even heard of it, but Pembre is a very,
very tight little track. It's almost, it's like a car
track on steroids almost, you know it's it's it's very tight,
very twisty and they're very, very tight hairpins including
the first corner and the traction of the rear wheel drive
car there would be ideal. So yeah, the the characteristics
of the track do certainly suits the BMW.
So it's not unfair to assume that that they would be at the
sharp end. So yeah, it's a fair assumption
from David, but I do also think there's a little bit of hiding
his his full potential in the Cavalier because I tell you what
by the by the time the mid season hit.
That Acuria cost Cavalier was was was fearsome.
It was a it was a car to beat. For the second time in two
races, pole position was taken by David Leslie.
In the semiworks, Acuria cost Vauxhall only 110th, ahead of
the factory Vauxhall Cavalier of John Cleland.
Leslie was relatively unimpressed with his qualifying
laps, telling Auto Sport my hot lap, it didn't feel too good at
all. It was all over the road, but
then quick laps didn't usually feel too good.
Cleland too was relatively unimpressed with his laps,
saying after the session mine was a really scrappy lap.
In fact, they both were. They felt really lousy, too
loose at the back. Andrew We've heard from John
Clotman before on stories from Super Touring, the factory
Vauxhall team which was run by Dave Cook Grayson Services.
They were getting a little concerned about the RML cars of
Akiria cost getting more competitive around this time.
With their recent showings in the championship and this second
pole position in a row, can you understand why that would be?
Yeah, very much so. The evidence was clear on the
track and not just the fact that.
David Leslie, in the supposed privateer Cavalier, was lining
up ahead of the works Cavalier of Cleland.
This was to be the second meeting succession when David
should have won because he'd been tipped out of the lead by
Winkelhorke at the at the previous meeting at Brown's
Hatch. But it was also the reputation
of RML team boss Ray Malik, who was racing under the Ecuria Cost
banner, and his reputation had been soaring for some time.
He'd already made big impressions in world sports car
racing, including such minor events as the More 24 Hours, for
example, and and he'd come into the BTCC.
They'd started off with X Dave Cook Cavaliers the previous
season, and then over the winter they'd built up their own
completely from a clean sheet of paper.
Which were rapidly coming to be regarded as better than the
works cars, and Dave Cookstein was right to be worried as a few
months later they'd be out of the contract as the contract
went to RML. Incidentally, the Acuria Cost
name went right back to the 1950s and it was revived in the
80s by a Scotsman called Hugh McKay.
Who I first encountered in Thunder salons in 1988, they
were running a Class B car which won the championship, and that's
a bitterly cold finale at Donnington in October that year.
They took the championship and they invited Rosemary and I into
their transporter for oxtail soup laced with a tot of
whiskey, which basically summed up the TV for us, and it
certainly warmed us up. Meanwhile, the dominant BMWs
were down in 6th and 9th place, but the surprise of the session
was Andy Rouse sticking his brand new Mondeo on the 2nd row
of the grid in fourth place. Adam.
That's quite the impressive debut for the Mondeo in the
hands of Rouse there, isn't it? Yeah.
Completely, I think you know, as we've already discussed in terms
of the amount of testing that they've already done against the
other, the other cars, I mean 5 seconds off the pace, 2 1/2
seconds off the pace and then to finally sort of you know.
Get stuck in a race weekend and and can qualify well and I think
it's massive, massive relief of pressure for him.
You know, running the cars as well as driving the cars and you
know with the engine side of it at this point for him anyway.
But I just think, yeah, just massive relief of pressure.
But then we also know that, you know, he's such a fast driver
and lapping on his own was one thing, but then come race day it
turned out to be something very different for him.
But. Yeah, I think just big, big
relief of pressure considering what they've gone through and
all the development they've had to do over the, you know, the
months prior to this. Julian Bailey, meanwhile, was
adamant he should have been on pole position in his Toyota
Carina. He qualified 3rd on the grid but
set his time in the afternoon session rather than the morning
session where all the faster times were set after the
qualifying session, he told the press.
The general consensus is that the track was slower in the
afternoon than it was in the morning.
By about 3/10, someone should have really been on pole, Alex.
Is that a statement you can agree with there from Julian?
I mean, lots of racing drivers will come up with reasons why
they should have been on pole or they should have done this.
They should have done that. Sorry, Adam.
Yeah, James Kay. This like James James Kay.
He could have won it. Yes, that's true.
Yeah. Yeah.
I think that was even more of a reach though than this one.
We need some sort of like, like league here, don't we?
In terms of, you know, how far away were they really?
Yes, we. Do we are talking about Julian
Bailey here as well? Yes.
The encounters I had with Julian Bailey were hysterical.
When we did Fantasy Touring Car and Super Touring Magazine, he
was the one driver that. Went through various ways,
ringing up to find out what what his price and seeding was.
I think there was a story that he.
Was it? He had a.
Shower in Ronnie Bigsy's flat or something.
At one time there were so many stories around Julian May, they
really have not heard that one. Yeah.
I'll have to look it up. We, we put it in Super Touring
and I will have to look it up. Oh yeah, yeah, please.
Yeah. I'll have a dig through my
magazines for that one. Can you stick to the rising
magazines, Alex? Yeah, but yeah, so, well, with
all those stories. And yeah, absolutely, you should
have been on pole position. There we go.
You've been convinced. But no I mean it could have,
would have should have. You know it's it was good
qualifying and that Toyota was a Funny Car in 93.
It it it it sort of performed well at certain circuits and
then in other circuits it looked really awful.
It was a a strange car and and and him and will seem to go
quite well at Pembrey. So this is one of the tracks
that the Toyota liked. So qualifying 3rd, 3/10 off or
3/10 slower than the the morning session, well who knows, but it
was good. Qualifying for Julian
regardless, but not sure about the pole position.
I don't think Leslie was was for catching to be honest.
No, he was on it that weekend, that was for sure, yeah.
The Dunlop runners were doing well in the Pembre heat, with
Tiff Nadal and Harry Nuttall impressing by starting 7th and
8th respectively. It's all the tires, Tiff joked
after qualifying. But he felt that Nissan's new
engines, fresh from Japan, also increased the competitiveness of
the Premera. The angriest drivers after
qualifying were Ian Cantwell and Alex Portland, who both failed
to qualify as Pembrey's license was limited to a 26 car grid.
Cantwell was very frustrated after being only six hundredths
off a second off qualifying for the race, producing a great lap.
At the end of the afternoon. Portman was suffering with bump
steer issues, but they were not diagnosed until it was too late
and Portman was out of the weekend.
Before the start of the race there was considerable concern
from the drivers about any potential incidents at the
notorious hatchets, her pin at turn one.
It was a scorching hot day in Wales which, whilst great for
the huge Pembrey crowd, meant very high levels of tyre wear on
Pembrey's abrasive track surface.
Andrew, can you understand why there was a certain amount of
concern about the first corner for the race down at Hatchet's
Hairpin? Well, to describe Pembrey, you
accelerate off the start for a few 100 yards and then you dive
into a really sharp more than 90° right-hander.
Something like the BTCC has Carnage written all over it and
I was quite surprised they all actually got away with it.
They were all lucky that the inevitable leaning didn't result
in someone being fired off in the wrong direction.
That corner is panel beater's dream.
Yeah it's a it's a funny corner to funny style of corner to have
as a as a first corner. It's extremely tight.
Penguin is not the not the widest of tracks anyway.
Yeah, but. Look at the other circuits that
have got a cycle on a SPA. Yeah, right.
True. Yeah, there's plenty of other
circuits. You know, the Far East as well
as the what's the one with? You got the first tight
right-hander straight into a left.
Where? Same circuit where Grosjean
crashed? Yeah, well, Macau's locking on
another level. But look at the circuit where
Grosjean had his shunt. Oh, Shakira.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. That goes straight into a tight
right hand. There's no that's true it.
Is what it is, but you're still with the same for everybody.
At the start, Winkle Hot got an absolute flyer and jumped from
6th on the grid to lead into the hairpin.
Watch look at Winkle Hockey, the white BMW past Rousson Hoy.
He's past Calendar Bailey, he's level with Leslie and he's taken
the lead from 6th on the grid into the first quarter.
And that is sensational. David Leslie thought he had made
a great start from pole position, telling Autosport I
got a good start, in fact my best of the season.
Then at the hairpin I just couldn't believe it.
This BMW just went straight past.
Adam, can you recall anyone making a better start in this
area of the BTCC or or maybe in the BTCC full stop?
Yeah, I mean BMWs generally always had a had a reputation
for making cracking starts and that's one thing that you know,
I mean standing starts all the time.
You know, even the era that I raced in the in the touring
cars, you know you'd all if you had a BMW within two rows behind
you. You knew by the 1st corner you'd
be lucky if you're still in front of them.
So you always knew you're going to lose a certain amount of
spots prior to getting to the first corner anyway, just
because the branches that they had.
But then they had disadvantages in terms of, you know,
understeer and cold, colder ties for the first few laps and not
always as good in the wet. And so he it was a swings and
roundabouts really. But I know obviously that era he
probably was the best start you're ever likely to see.
But then you know. When you but then look at look
at Frank Baylor in a certain silver Audi A4 four wheel drive.
I know it's 4 wheel drive, but in terms of starts, it was quite
regular for him to make them type of starts, yes.
Which again, again, was just unfair for everyone else because
they had, you know, 2 less wheels doing the drive, did you
know, gaining traction and then putting power through them.
But yeah, it was a cracking start and I just think from
Wincock's point of view, got the start you needed.
Took full advantage of the BMWs. Positive characteristics and
kept his nose clean and just allowed it all the carnies to
ensue behind him. I don't know if it's the the
angle of the camera that there was record in the race but when
when I went to watch back this race when I knew that we were
going to be looking into it, it looked like Winkelhor just came
from just so far back. And as I say, I don't know if
it's a trick of the camera where it just the the angle it was
filmed that made that made the grid look sort of more spread
out than it actually was. Yeah.
But it just looked like he'd come back from a different post
code to lead into that first corner and and as Andrew said
it's not it's not the huge it's not the longest rundown to turn
one there either. So, you know, it's maybe it was
a trick of the of the lens, but it was an incredible start.
Whilst the expected chaos didn't materialize at the first corner,
it was still somewhat of a messy start.
There was all sorts of contact. It was pretty messy and
aggressive, Will Hoy said After the race.
Finkel Hunt LED away from Leslie Cleland, Rouse, Bailey Hoy,
Nadal Nussle and Sopa Rouse and Baby Clash coming out of the
hairpin, with Rouse coming off best.
Despite the frenzied start, everyone made it past the first
lap. Al, is that just the typical
first lap in the BTCC? Yeah, I mean, as Andrew said
just now that Hatchet's hip in is a is a panel bashers dream.
So it was relatively tame to be honest with you.
It was it was was not as bad as I expected it to be.
So yeah, it was a pretty typical BTCC start.
It was a bit of leaning, it was a bit of shoving, bit of
pushing, but no real major problems.
Nobody was fired off, nobody was damaged beyond repair, nobody
was had to retire from the race at the side, you know.
Yeah, fairly typical BTCC start in 1993 to be honest.
Despite Finkelhat's lead into the first corner, by halfway
around the lap Leslie was already back ahead.
Winklehog had a slide out of the right-hander leading into
Brooklands, letting David get alongside before taking the lead
on the exit. Winklehog leads.
Leslie is second at attacking and the blue Vauxhall's going
through. On the inside.
David Leslie leads. By the end of the first lap,
Leslie was already over a second ahead of the BMW of Inkelhog,
whilst Rouse continued to impress by taking third from
Cleland. There were more antics at the
hairpin at the start of lap two when Kifo Door made contact with
SOPA Andrew. The hairpin became the place for
plenty of contact and disagreements during this race.
I think we've kind of touched on it already with it being a panel
beater's dream, but is that always going to be the case for
such a layout? Yeah, absolutely.
It's really the obvious passing place on the circuit.
And once you dive into the corner, you're going so slowly
at the apex and it's almost safer to hang in there and
bounce off each other because you're probably going to get
away with it. As I said, pound notes and panel
beaters. At the end of lap two, Renault's
Tim Harvey pulled into the pits to retire with his brakes on
fire. He had made contact with team
mate Alan Menu on track. Alan got very sideways at
Spitfire, Harvey explained after the race.
I backed off but still managed to hit him.
That got him into a tank slapper, came back across me and
we made contact again which sent us both onto the grass.
Well, unfortunately I was following Alan and he got
sideways and we both went off on the grass and I think it's
taking a load of grass into the radiator and boiled the engine
over. That's all but very
disappointing. But it was all all, all push and
shove on the first couple of laps.
There was nowhere to go. Teammate Menu was less
impressed. He continued on for a few more
laps, but the cars handling just got worse and worse before he
called it a day. Adam, that's a pretty bad day
for Renault there. Was that just a case of bad luck
for Harvey? A menu, do you think?
Yeah, I think so. He.
We've discussed previously that the the car wasn't as
competitive as they wanted it to be generally.
And I think he was just one of those weekends that you just
wanted to forget. And I think just to make it
worse, the fact that I made contact with each other.
So, you know, crashing with your teammates, never, you know he's
never going to get out. Ideal is it?
It's not. It's not ideal, but it was
obviously none of it was deliberate and it just it was
just sort of, you know, just put their weekend to bed really
wasn't it Was just, it just. Completely summed up the whole
disastrous weekend. Tim had nowhere to go.
I mean Alan had. Alan had lost the back end of it
ever so slightly, of course, backed off to try and catch it
and and Tim was there, It was, you know, it could have been any
car but it just happened to be that it was his teammate and.
That's it. There's just certain situations
where you just cannot do anything.
Yeah, just really unfortunate. Quite, quite funny actually.
This Tim and Alan were talking at at Super Touring Power in in
July this year and Tim said that he'd found he was he was digging
through files or something or whatever, and he'd found a
letter that had been sent to him from his.
I don't know whether it was the team boss or from higher up in
the higher ups at Renault. And it was about this incident
and it was basically about how how disappointing it was that
the two Renault cars made made contact with each other and
effectively took each other out of the race and and under no
circumstances should it happen again And and Tim and Alan
weren't sure which incident it it linked to and apparently Alan
had a letter sent to him as well exactly the same and and it it
worked out there was this incident.
So quite a funny memory to look back on that They both had stern
letters sent to them, which is a different.
It's a different world now, isn't it?
Really. Yeah, you got a.
Real warning from your employer. Yeah, you know, but yeah, it's
quite a quite a funny memory from from those two at at Brands
Hatch this year. Leslie continued to pull away at
the front After four laps. He had a lead of over 2 seconds
in the first few laps. I simply couldn't stay with
Leslie, Finkelhock said after the race.
Was it fair to say that the Akuria cost car had now become
one of the quickest cars in the entire field?
Yes. I mean the fact that Leslie was
on pole position here. He was on pole position at the
previous race at Brands Hatch and as Andrew said, was leading
until he was tipped into a spin by by smoking Joe.
Yeah the the the Akuria cost car was one of the quickest cars in
the field and Leslie throughout the second-half of the city.
When they got the car going, it really, really shone and it was
it was a lot of bad luck actually that David.
There were three or four races throughout the second-half of 93
where David a bit like this one was in a position to win or had
a chance to victory and something happened.
Either something broke or he was hit off or there was always
something but the car clearly had pace and and as as Andrew
said not long ago it was no surprise that RML were then
awarded the works contract for for 94 because they were really
showing Vauxhall up and and you know outperforming the works
cars with your own self built car which is what the the the
RML cars were. There was no manufacturer
involvement it it's a bit embarrassing for Vauxhall
really. So yeah, it was definitely one
of the cars at the front of the grid in the in the second-half
of the season. Being settled down for a few
laps until lap 10 when Cleland dived inside Rouse at Hatches
hairpin with the Scotsman making contact with Rouse.
This allowed Hoy to run alongside his former Toyota
teammate and he too made contact with Rouse as he went past into
fourth position. The Mondeo with Rouse started
smoking as the contact had pushed the bodywork onto the
tire. One lap later, Bailey, Nuttall
and Sopa also got passed, the Mondeo clearly damaged from the
earlier contract. Andrew That's a pretty rough
couple of laps there for Rouse, wasn't it?
Yes it it was in all the time that I worked in the BTCC.
Every driver I've interviewed has always been hard done by,
never too slow to tell us journos that everyone's out to
get them and none of it is remotely likely to be their
fault. Andy was as good a Moaner as any
of them, but especially watching back this race for tonight, I
really think he had a point. On this occasion.
It was almost as if everyone wanted a slice of Mondeo, yeah.
And you can't even say it was a case of the the seasons, you
know, established racers wanting to put the newbies in their
place. Because let's face it, and he
had more BTCC races under his belt and most of the rest of the
field put together. But also, I think it's one of
them you can't. You know, if you're a bit too,
it's hard to describe it, but it's similar in when like even
going back to cars in days if you're not getting amongst it
and you're not the one. You know, thrown at the inside
when there's an opportunity. I'm not saying like T-bone
somebody, but just having a go you can't.
Like you've got to if you if you if you back off just 10%, you're
going to get punished and you're going to get bullied off.
It's it's like bullying someone off a football when you when you
get there, if you're a little bit rougher than them or you're
going in there with a bit of a shoulder barge and you're going
to, you're going to win the ball back because they're just,
they're just attacking the situation.
They're attacking the game. And I think you can sometimes be
a sitting duck if you're a little bit too calm about the
situation where you just think it's going to be a nice this is,
this is BTCC here. Andy was one of the fastest
drivers you're ever going to see in the touring cars.
The most wins, but that wasn't his style.
Yeah, No, that's right. That completely wasn't his
style. But sometimes you've just,
you've got to, you've got to join him and he just, he just
allowed himself to get bullied out of the way, really by pretty
much everybody on the grid. Yeah, I was just about to say
something similar in the sense that I was too young to see Andy
Rouse race the RS5, hundreds, the Capris.
But one thing that you can't say about the man is that he was
quick. He was a very quick racer
drummer and I'm wondering if towards the end of his career,
so 9394 was the racing moving away from his style of racing.
Completely. And I think we've said, yeah,
this, yeah, Andy in a previous podcast, but yeah, like.
On his own pole lap leading races on his own, fastest man on
there. But going into this era it all
became a little bit, you know, panel bashing.
We were bashing it all. It was allowed, but not to the
extremes. But you go back to the Irish 500
days, that wasn't really, you know, it was rare that there was
a lot of contact like that. So he's coming into a new era
where you you've got to, you know, to beat them, you've got
to join them. And you've got to.
Change your way of doing it. It's someone, I can't remember
who it was, but someone said to me before as well that Andy, as
well as being the designer and the engineer, was the driver and
it wasn't. It wasn't his style to see cars
that he had designed and engineered get damaged by
getting involved in that style of racing.
So I can't remember who get who told me who told me that.
But yeah, it it it definitely was moving away from from Andy's
style. Towards the end of his career.
He'd he'd have had a more personal, complete, personal
input into what was going on. Like you've just said, you
imagine being a big view on the other in another team.
Or if you're Harvey or your menu or your Clenland and or even
smoking Joe, you know, you have a few panel bashes you get stuck
in, you know, get the job done, team are going to fix it Monday.
It's absolutely fine, yeah. Andy's thinking of Monday.
I've been. I've been the one that's having
to sort of get it fixed. I've got to get that fixed on
Monday, yeah, yeah. Yeah, so do you know what I
mean? He's the one that's seen his
cars in a completely different light as a racing driver, you
going in there and just seeing the team do what they do.
But he's he's on both sides of the fence here.
On lap 14, disaster struck for David Leslie.
As he crossed the start finish line, his voxel slowed down and
he pulled off at the hairpin. A dejected Leslie was robbed of
the chance of his first ever BTCC victory by a broken
frostle. Cable up.
Goes Leslie's board. 17 laps to go and he's got a good lead.
That's it. That's the Aguria cost Vauxhall
and up goes Leslie's hand. He's slowing down.
The leader is in trouble and Leslie's touring off.
He's slowing right down onto the grass.
What? What bitter, bitter luck.
That's the second race in succession.
What have I got to do to win a BTCC race?
Leslie asked after the race. The car was perfect.
The tyres were great too. Adam, that's some pretty cruel
luck for Leslie there, isn't it? Yeah, I mean, oh God, if that
was going to happen, I'd rather be last.
I'd rather be halfway down the field.
I'd rather be somewhere other than where he was.
Because he was, yeah, real bad luck.
Really bad. Like I said, he'd been in pole
position at Brands before. Got pole position there.
Put one over the works. Vauxhalls.
I think the win was his, personally.
I think he was. He was dominant that weekend.
Even the Smoking Joe said that he couldn't keep up with him.
He'd got it nailed. He was in the right car, right
team, right setup, everything was just working for him and and
to have something so similar if the engine had blown itself to
smithereens, you think OK well that is really bad luck but a
throttle cable? Yeah, you know, it's something
so small as well. Exactly.
The mechanics would have been kicking themselves whatever the
reason was for it breaking. And you know, it's just yeah, of
all the things but to be so close, but.
You know, he had a he had a great future ahead of him after
that anyway, and he put himself in good stead and proved a
point, I think doing what he'd done those, you know, put it on
pole previously and and that weekend as well.
So you know, he put himself firmly on the map.
Rouse again was on the receiving end of contact as Kefi door
dived inside the Ford at the hairpin.
At the end of the lap, Rouse pulled into the pits.
The amount of contact his Mondeira received had damaged
the suspension of the car. He made it back out for a couple
of laps before coming back into the pits to retire for good.
Once out of the car, Rouse would then give a memorable interview
to the BBC cameras. Let's have a listen to it now.
Oh, basically. I got one into by John Cladden,
Wilhoit Bailey ODA and one or two others you can mention.
Oh man, it's just plenty pathetic.
I want to go motor racing, not stop car racing.
Thank you. How Andy Rouse was clearly very
angry there after the race. It has to be.
Yeah, it was, wasn't he? Was it justified, in your
opinion? Yes, I think it was.
In fairness, it's, you know, you think, think how Andy must have
felt. He's spent the first half of
this season testing, building these cars then, you know.
Finding out, OK, we're not going to race here and we're going to
give a bit more development time and then OK, we're not going to
race here. And finally these cars were
competitive. They had good engines in them.
The the the chassis that he'd built were the lightweight
Mondeo chassis, not the original ones that they he was, he was
testing and then the whole field wants to beat him up basically,
you know, and you could see every time.
The first big hit was Cleland and I have to say, as much as
I'm a big fan, as I said before of John Cleland, it was, I
thought it was quite a poor move from Cleland because he gave a
proper punt and and then that the car slewed sideways.
And then Will Holly came and give him a little tickle across
the across the wing mirror as well and you could see the car
was the I don't think there's a straight panel on the right hand
side of that Monday. It's And then then the course,
the the the the bodywork started fouling the tire which would not
help. And then who else came along.
Then there's so many Bailey and then of course Keith Odor.
Who Keith Odor gave him a gave him a little hit as well.
And yeah, so it it, it seemed that the whole field had had it
in for Andy and they thought, right he's coming back now, is
he And. Let's let's get after him.
But yeah I did. I did feel very sorry for him
because that car, as as Adam said earlier, it was a brilliant
performance to put it forth on the grid and and to end it by
half the field hitting your car and the suspense suspension
failing from that it's it must have been really, really
disappointing especially you know he hadn't raced A touring
car race for six months so. That's the thing I think, of all
the meetings to go into. You're going to.
He can come to Penn very tight into his state, like this is
touring cars the way the others were driving.
He's no different to any of the race.
He's just gone into there. Yeah, almost like forgetting
what it's like and forgetting the fact that you've got to dish
it out. People are giving it to me.
I've got to give it back, otherwise I am going to get
bullied here and that's that's how I saw the race with him.
I think the one of the interesting things about this
whole race actually is the fact that while Rouse was making all
these headlines of all sorts of different ways, the 2nd Mondeo
Radisic basically did nothing at all.
And within a very few short weeks it would be Radisich
effectively leading the team and becoming, you know, a real fawn
in the side of BMW and then at the end of the season taking the
touring cold World Cup. That's true.
Well, reversal. Yes, yeah, that's that's quite
true. Never thought of that actually,
that, yeah, towards the end of the season it was Radisich.
It was dominating. The.
The front of the grid. And you know he finished third
in the standings at the end of the season after only after
missing the first seven races. So exactly.
That's an incredibly impressive performance.
Yeah. Harry Nuttall was having his
strongest showing yet in the BTCC where he was dicing with
championship leader Steve Super. Super eventually got the better
of him on lap 19, but Nuttall continued to hound the BMW
driver. Andrew was this Nuttall
strongest showing in his BTCC career?
Yes it was. And he had a very short BTCC
career. It was only the one season, I
must admit. When I was preparing for tonight
I thought to myself, whatever happened to Harry Nuttall?
Because when you work in motorsport, we're very good at
completely losing track of people the moment they drop out
of the little spear that we operate in.
So if you're in touring cars, driver comes in, you interview
him for a year and you write about him for a year, he goes
off and do something else, and then you completely forget about
him, you know, on with the next one.
So I'm afraid I had to resort to Google to find out that Sir
Harry Nuttall, because he's now a Baronet, he inherited the
family title in 2007, was last recorded as being on
sponsorship, a Vice role for none other than the Mercedes
Formula One team. Apparently he's done that role
for several years for several other teams, including Braun GP
in that tumultuous year. I don't know, if you watched the
excellent documentary that's just launched on Sky with Keanu
Reeves, that really is worth a watch.
Very well done, yeah? So interviewing Harry in 1993, I
remember he was quite colourful. He really was the image of the
the young gentleman racer having fun at weekends, but apparently
his sponsorship getting abilities were quite strong too.
He was mainly responsible for the blue colour scheme with the
big white cross on the top, and he was also responsible for
securing sponsorship for the team from Penthouse magazine,
which as I remember, brought with it some very interesting
grid girls. Yes, because didn't he?
I can't remember. I I read a a review of this
race. I can't remember whether it was
auto sport or elsewhere, but it was there was a quote from him
and he's saying, yes, Mr. Make sure you write down Mr.
Penthouse got sixth or something like that.
So he seemed that was Harry. He seemed a very eccentric
character. Yes, say the least, but I mean
if you if you've really his Wikipedia profile, it's
extremely colorful in a whole load of works, yes.
There's there's stuff on there that I was quite, yeah.
It's quite eye opening, isn't it?
Yeah, I mean, obviously, you know, Wikipedia is always
completely true, as we know. Talking of very good
documentaries about Formula One teams.
The obviously the Braun one you've mentioned is supposed to
be very, very good. But I don't know if anyone has
seen the the Andrea Moda documentary this.
Yes. Oh no, it's.
I shall have to send you a link. It's wonderful.
It's brilliant. There's it's a three-part 45
minutes. I think they are each part.
Documentary of Andrea Moda in Formula One in 92.
It's I remember Andrea Modi. It was a disaster from *.
Yes, but it seems to they've even had Nigel Mansell on there
talking about it. So it's quite it's it's quite a
quite an eye opening documentary.
We shouldn't, we shouldn't diversify from obviously the one
true motorsport that he's touring cars for too long, but
absolutely that's Formula One. The Williams documentary is, I
think, one of the best, which really shows up a quite a
dysfunctional family at the head of a web sport.
Oh, OK. Oh, I'll have to, yeah.
Well worth a watch. Might surprise you.
Especially the son who seemed to be very bitter that the daughter
got the race team and he got the Heritage operation.
Yes, yeah. Yeah, I've heard that.
Yeah. Yeah.
Well worth a watch. SOPA and Nuttall were soon on
Cleland's tail for 3rd and on lap 25 they made contact at
Brooklands and SOPA was free with Nuttall following Adam.
There seemed to be quite a lot of contact during this race
meeting, maybe even for a BTCC event as well.
I think it is. I mean for sure it was, I mean
we always expected, you know, you always still do expect a bit
of contact with with BTCC racing generally, but.
That we've already touched on before.
This was just like a big car track.
You know, you've got a hairpin as the first corner, so
everyone's going steaming into this sort of almost first gear
hair, you know, 90, right? And then it's just a series of
twisty bends. So it it was just, yeah, if you
used to choose one race to go and watch as a fan, that would
probably be the one because you just know by the nature of the
circuit and the nature of the, you know, the the racing
generally. It's just that combination.
We know what's going to happen this weekend and it's a bit of a
survival of the fittest really in terms of the cars and and and
keeping keeping your nose clean. Just exactly what I think Leslie
was going to do out in the lead. But Smoking Joe ended up doing
that by just staying out for another start battling behind
your usual scenario, and it's sort of one of your easiest wins
you're ever going to have. He just, yeah, kept his nose
clean and and stayed on the on the black stuff.
On lap 29, Nussell had another go at super.
He was right behind him out of Brooklyn's and on the back
straight. He was gathering himself for
another assault at Honda Curve. But the next thing we saw was
that he was off the track. Oh, what happened there?
For now. As as we've already said, he's
having a very strong meeting and taking making the most out of
the. The increased competitiveness of
the the Akuria cost car and he was challenging SOPA for 3rd
which was, and I mean this in the I don't mean this in a
disrespectful way. It was uncharted territory for
for Sir Harry and the next thing he knows the fire extinguisher
in his car goes off in the footwell and as he glances down
to have a look at it and see what's happened.
He just runs himself off track and runs and sadly dropped
himself from from 4th challenging for 3rd down to 6th.
So yeah, it was a real shame because this was, as Andrew
said, by far Harry's strongest meeting in in his short BTCC
career. So yeah, Mr. Penthouse, I'm
afraid. Yeah, dropped a few positions
because of his fire extinguisher.
I have been told by many erasing drier over the years that the
fire extinguishers suddenly going off in your car without
warning is not a very nice experience.
I can imagine. It's quite scary.
Yeah, I've got is that. Has it ever happened to you?
Yeah, I think had it GT racing circuit abroad.
I can't remember which one he was, but.
It's it's the shock as you're not expecting it.
You. Know these these.
Things are designed. You press the you know, you
press the button inside. If you you know the car is on
fire and you're having to bail out and buy Marshalls post
ideally, but you know that's what it's there for.
If the Marshalls then obviously have their access to press the
button just below the windscreen, it's but it's a
pretty mess. It makes as well.
I know it's a mechanic's nightmare.
It's designed to obviously do what it's there to do, but.
When it does go off, when you're not expecting it to go off, it
scares the living crap out of you because you're just thinking
like, is it smoke? Is it?
I'm on fire. Like what?
What's going on? And then until you realise, oh
actually like I'm getting soaking wet here, like someone's
just turned the shower on inside the the car, but it's the
visibility then, because then you struggle.
You either carry on, but if it if it's gone all over the
windscreen, everything, then then obviously you've got to
stop. But yeah, it just makes.
A mess like you wouldn't believe.
And the amount of mechanics or people that aren't mechanics
that have say for instance, you know, pushing the car to help
you get out on the transporter or pushing it away from, you
know, around the workshop that and you tell them don't go in,
don't go anywhere near that red button.
And the amount of times where people have accidentally pressed
it and then you're like, Oh no. Yeah.
Oh, no. But yeah, it's it's awful.
I'm guessing it's no different to sort of imagining driving
down the motorway. And suddenly something that like
that going off in in your car, you know only in a.
Bottle of Pop. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.
You know, it it that would be a passive way.
Yeah. That would frighten you and you
know or. Yeah, but like putting a lot,
Putting a Minto in a bottle of Coke.
Whilst doing 150 miles an hour. The M25 in rush hour, Yeah,
yeah, just try that lads, and then you'll get some sort of
idea of what it's like. Despite the set back, Nuttall
was awarded A Corbo Driver of the Day for his efforts.
Adam, do you think that was the right decision?
To be honest, yeah, I mean you know we've seen Smoking Joe win
plenty of races and he didn't do it other than obviously the star
and what have you. But it's this was his only
season in BTCC and as Alex has already mentioned, you know he
qualified 8. He ended up finishing 6th, if
you'd have said to him prior to that weekend.
You fancy a 6th place you know, snapped your hand off and and
shook on it right there. You know it's so the but then he
also he'll be kicking himself. The fact that he was, he was
fighting Steve sober for 3rd place like you know this was
unreal for him. So I think for for him with a
lack of experience that he did have within that championship
and and you know the competition he was up against and yeah, fair
play. Yeah, for me, the only other
candidate could have been his team mate, David Leslie.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think if you've got to award
it based on finishing the race, yeah, obviously not all I get
it. But I think in terms of just the
actual effort generally over the weekend pole position fastest in
practice and and and leading the race knowing what the pretty
much what the outcome was going to be you probably would give it
to Leslie yeah but as yeah for the finishers and yeah there's
there's no other as as Adam just said he was you know Steve super
was the championship leader going into this race meeting and
and there was not all challenging challenging him for
a place on the podium So yeah it's it's very much.
A gangster, works team, established team, established
driver. I think, yeah.
I think he would have been unreal for him, really, you
know. Good.
A good day for him, yeah. Eugene O'Brien was the final
casualty of the day, his Peugeot engine expiring on the final
lap. At the front, Winklehock took
the win and with it the championship lead from his team
mate Steve Soper. Once Leslie dropped out, smoking
Joe Cruise to victory. The start was very important, he
said after race. After that I could choose my own
lines and try to conserve my tires.
His team mate Soper was less happy, despite coming from 10th
on the grid to finish third. Now BMW will think that they
don't need to do any more development work, he told
Autosport. It's getting harder and harder
out there, Andrew, with the development rates on the grid
getting faster with Steve Wright to be a little bit concerned
about falling behind the curve. In Steve's case, no.
His point was, well, his point was well made.
But I think this was another case of drivers doing what they
always do when they're given the means, in this case ATV
microphone that's keeping the pressure on, in this case, their
team. The BMWs were now being run by
Schnitzer, which was already a world renowned team.
From their efforts in such series as the DTM.
They'd come to the BTCC from the DTM and over the first half of
the season I the team was run by two brothers, Dieter and
Charlie, and over the first half of the season I got to know
Charlie quite well. And quickly found him not only
to be one of the nicest men in motorsport, but also both he and
his brother absolutely dedicated to their task.
I can't imagine for a moment that he would he ever have got
complacent and stopped looking for the next game, so I don't
think Steve had anything to worry about.
In that case, Charlie Lamb seemed like one of the most
genuine nice chaps of motorsport.
He was. He's the real Gen.
Yeah, he, you know, no matter how busy he was, he always had
plenty of time for the likes of me who, let's face it, us
journalists are always irritating, always turned up at
just the wrong moment when you, you know, always need a quote
just at the wrong moment. But he always gave me loads of
time and he he explained the stuff I didn't understand
because I was still very much wet behind the ears at that
point. Yeah, one of the nicest mending
motorsport by an absolute star in terms of preparing the cars.
And let's face it, when you look at BM, WS history in the BTCC,
most of the success had something to do with Schnitzer,
Yes, because that one year that Schnitzer went away in 95.
Look at the drop in performance. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I went.
To visit them in but Bavaria it was a very funny little team but
and then obviously they came back in 96 and and and well,
yeah, yeah, yeah. Paul Radysich came home in 8th
place. The new Mondeo achieving its
first points finish in the first ever race.
Alex, was there reasons to be positive for the future for the
Mondeo after that race? Oh absolutely.
It's you know if if if you're qualifying 4th in your first
race then the car is obviously got serious potential.
And you know as we've already mentioned Radicic certainly at
the once he got into the groove he took the first win for the
Mondeo at a Brands Hatch later on in the season and went on to
win the World Cup and did it again in 94.
So yes, there there was definitely reasons for Ford to
to look look positive on the future, but interestingly, I
don't think they'd have expected the first championship for the
BTCC and for Mondeo in the BTCC to be all the way in 2000.
Yeah, everyone seemed to think that the Mondeo was a super
successful car throughout its lifetime in the championship,
but there were some real doldrums in in 96 and 97 where
the car was just awful. 93 They were too late for the reasons
we've said. 94 they should have won it.
But then along came Aero and then in 95 and 96 they got into
panic mode and started going and finding other people to build
their cars and it all went very wrong.
I think it was it was out of the 95 of the 96 car, which was some
was it shoe bubble, it was supposedly revolutionary or the
engine canted over at some funny angle and it did not work at
all. And Forges dug themselves a
deeper and deeper hole, and then into 97 with the mark 2.
Mondi didn't. When Reynard involved and there
were so many different people doing different parts of the
car, it just didn't work. Yeah, and they only started
working when they went back to a proper team.
We knew what they were doing in touring cars because these teams
at fault, because we can race in other motorsport and we know
everything about other motorsport, We'll be able to
walk the BTCC. Were soon found to be wanting,
yes, yeah, definitely, I think. If Arrow hadn't arrived in 94, I
think they would have had a bit of momentum.
They would, yeah, but no radix would.
Have been championed in 94 without the arrow alphas.
Just when they literally found their feet and thought, right,
we've cracked this, all of a sudden the rules change.
So yeah, that must have been a bit of a blow for them.
This was one of the hottest races of the 1993 season, with
the tight, twisty track at Pembrey providing some great
racing up and down the field. Despite the entertaining races
held at Pembrey in 1992 and 1993, the championship never
returned to the circuit to race and the BTCC hasn't stepped foot
in Wales since. Andrew.
Is it a shame that Pembrey never featured in the Championship
moving forward? And can you understand why it
was dropped from the calendar heading into the mid 90s?
I think it is a shame though I have to admit this weekend was
the date the last time I went to Pembrey.
It was an interesting circuit but it was also an odd one
whenever we did go there and it wasn't very often, I was in
Surrey at the time. I've been in Wales now for 16
years but even the 16 years I've been here I still haven't gone
back to Pembrey. But every time we did go there,
we always used to look for the single lone protester against
motorsport that was stationed right by the gate as you drove
in and ignored by everybody. It was that sort of odd place.
You know, I think it's it fell foul on the BTC CS growth.
You know, the championship was demanding not only better and
more facilities at the circuits, but also around them.
They wanted big catchment area, plenty of hotels for example
and. I think for the same reason I
would love to see the BTCC at the much younger Welsh circuit
at the other end of the country on Anglesey.
The photographers would have a field day for championship.
Went there because when you see it on TV it reminds you of
Phillip Island down under Australia.
It would be a seaside vacation and it looks really lovely.
But for the same reasons as Pembre, it's in the middle of
nowhere. There's not a load of hotels.
It would be an absolute. Ball late to get to.
I think it's unlikely the BTCC will go there anytime soon.
I mean in terms of facilities, in many ways both tracks are not
that far removed from Knockhill, but of course Knockhill is just
up the road from Edinburgh. So yeah, so sadly, no, I I wish
Wales did have a BTCC round. We had that absolute.
Ridiculous carry on with the so-called Circuit of Wales
project a few years ago and I think if we got that then the
championship might have gone there.
But no, I don't think we'll see the BTCC in Wales anytime soon,
unfortunately. And I think to give Pembree it's
due, it's always been, you know, the career I've had or even pre
pre me even going into cars here when I was still karting, it was
always a successful. Well accomplished.
Sort of #1 on the on the the list for teams to go testing.
Yeah, yeah you know it's testing testing testing F3 teams,
Formula four teams, touring car teams.
I think might have been out some some F1, yes.
Going on at the times, you know it was the tests that like you
know, you spoke to any team that was doing testing.
I was spending a week at Pembro, We're going to Pembro, we're
going to Pembre, going to Pembre.
And because he just had because it was in the middle of nowhere.
And I think back then, noise and things weren't a particular
issue. They could allow that to happen.
So it's very, you know, it was, it was the place for everybody
went testing in the 90s. Testing was huge at Pembury and
the amount of times, that's what.
It was known for really in my eyes, it was never really on the
agenda as a race circuit to to compete in a race.
It was always the Ted. That's where everybody went
testing all the big teams, all the huge, biggest teams.
When they're testing constantly, yeah, so, So for me it's it's an
hour away for me and. And Alex is miles away from
everyone, isn't he? And the amount of times that we
used to go there and to watch the testing, because you'd have,
you'd have Damon Hill pounding round in the Williams, you'd
have Nigel Mansell in the Williams, you know, you watch
back. There was a documentary I
watched on Sky Sports with Alan Prost and there was a an they
they talked about an incident where Alan and Ayton had fallen
out at Pembrey whilst testing. And you just think that's mad,
you know it. And Senna and Alan Prost falling
out around the back of the garages in Pembrey, that's what.
I'm saying that's how big it was as a test shark he got.
It was a huge. Senna Hill, Williams like and
and all the death three teams. Formula Four teams, like
everybody, went there it was. It was like there was no second
choice for anyone. That was just the go to.
That's where we do our development pre season.
Couple of other notable testing programs that I saw there would
have been Mansell did a lot of tests in there in the Mondeo
before his 98th season in the forward and also Andy Prio.
I saw him test a Laguna Super Tour there after after winning
the Renault Spyder Cup in 99. That was the prize, wasn't it?
And that was the prize. And and incidentally
subsequently realized that that was the last ever operation, the
last ever run for Williams Touring Car Engineering because
they obviously they ran down at the end of 99 with Renault
pulling out of the series and their very last testing actual,
their very last track action was that test for Prio.
Yeah. And that was at Pembrey.
So yeah, it's it's as you say, it's seen, it's seen some big
people testing there over the years, but very rarely for
racing. And what you said with Nigel
going there to do, because it was the only place you could
literally probably just go there exclusively pay to have the
circuit, probably the rates are nowhere near what it would be
cost to get to Silverstone etcetera, because you're not
paying for all the facilities and everything that surrounds
it. It's somewhere where you could
just go get everything in the truck and just go and spend a
week there. You know, as without having to
to to replicate that you'd need to go to Spain, France, Italy,
you know, to do all that. So that was the place where you
could go. You couldn't just book a
Silverstone for a week. You couldn't just go and book,
you know, brands for a week, you know.
But there you could. It was easy enough to do and
that's why everyone did it, because I think it was a bit of
a quite a relaxed. Sort of private place to go
without spy. Nice.
So much as well, that privacy? Yeah, exactly.
It was ideal because people had to go so far the way to get
there that nobody bothered. Yeah.
No, he wasn't. You wouldn't know if someone had
been spent a week there because he wasn't publicized, but if.
If Nigel, you know, said if my Ford had rented Silverstone for
a week, bloody hell, you don't know.
I mean, yes, exactly. You know about it being in
Pembury, especially with you being as close as you were to
that. But you know, if you'd have
spent a week at at Silverstone, it had been a, you know everyone
what you would have on every national pipe, wouldn't it?
Yeah, yeah. I'd never raced there, but when
I, after I'd done, had my two years in France, when I won the
Elf campus, running a campus championship in 99 at Le Mans.
Well, based at Le Mans that we raced around off to the circuit
of France and then I stayed on to do F3 with them, won that
championship in 2000. I then did a test.
I think it was in 2001. I did a test with, do you
remember? You might remember, but remember
Jamie Spence based at 3:00. Races in the Green Puma Racing
Formula Three team. He was a new team that had been
created. So I I went in 2001, I went and
did it. I was there for a couple of days
doing a test with them in the same car.
So I was, as I was as quick as Jamie Spence was at that time.
So my first time in A or second time in a Class A car, because
halfway through my my season in in France, I actually did the
Zandvoort Masters in a Class A car in the same team that I was
with. So that was my first time in a
Class A car and then I did did a test in there with with
Pumasburg. This was the story of the Ford
Mondeo's debut in the BTCC. I'm not sure how many people
knew just how big an impact the model would have on the BTCC.
Be assured, we are definitely going to be covering more Mondeo
stories in the future on stories from Super Touring, and there
are plenty that we can go through as well.
It's now time for our new four Series 3 feature where producer
Dan asks us all the question and we can see if we were paying
attention. Don't forget to play along at
home too. Now last time out Alex scored a
point for guessing Peugeot correctly, so it is currently 21
to the regulars Producer Dan, have you got your question
ready? I have got my question ready, So
it was quite an interesting weekend in the Tokyo Challenge
for Privateers. You mentioned that two of the
main contenders actually didn't even qualify for the event, but.
The winner, who was the winner in the Toka Challenge for
privateers Ian Cantwell? No, he didn't qualify.
He. Didn't qualify.
You weren't paying attention, right?
Was it one of the part line? Corinas who was in that team?
I got the wrong Ian. There's three Ian's.
I got the wrong one. It's.
It's not Ian. I'm not.
I'm not going to help any of you guys out.
It's. I know it can Oh, and I don't
know it. Yeah, I I.
Can I? Let's see.
Let's see if anyone else can get it before you.
Jump in so if if it's an Ian because I was thinking James K
or oh he was in the other part Lane Bobby Verdon row.
But don't. No, I can't remember, sorry.
Oh no, I've got it. Ian Khan.
Is it in Khan? Yeah.
Is it in Khan? It was Ian Khan, yes.
Getty Ian Khan, right. His first win of the of the
season in the Toka Challenge, he got third place at Silverstone
and 2nd place at Donnington, but Pembre was his first win.
He also then went on to win at Silverstone next time out.
Brands Hatch and Silverstone later on in the year, and at the
end of the year he was only two points off Matt Neil.
So it's a pretty tight championship in 1993, if your
name was Ian. Ian Ian Ashley was third and Ian
Cantwell was seventh. Third World, but he he stopped
turning up after the mid season. Silverstone round obviously
didn't get Ashley. There's a main card.
Yeah, I was trying to remember Ian Ashley because I was
thinking Ian Carl. I knew one of them was third and
I thought that as Ian Carl like he was the other.
He was in. Ian Ashley was third in that
race in the Challenge, so I didn't realize.
No, Ian Ashley, in the late 70s, rolled a Formula One card to
destruction in the Canadian Grand Prix.
Yes, this is. I was just about to say I didn't
realise until very recently that Ian Ashley was actually an XF1
driver. He was, Yeah, He was.
What? What?
What team was it? It was like one of the Was it a
hiskiff? According to the Internet,
Because the Internet knows everything.
He he raced a a token racing and a Brabham in 1974, raced a
Williams, the FWA three in 1975, but did not start the German
Grand Prix. He raced to BRM for one race in
1976 at the start of the season in Brazil, and then in 1977 he
raced to Hesketh at the well. He he sort of raced to Hesketh
because for three of the five appearances he made he didn't
even qualify. He got 17th at the USA Grand
Prix. And at the Canadian Grand Prix
in 1977, he didn't even start the race.
So actually in his Formula One career he only finished three
races, one of which was a non classified.
Because he was so far behind, he got 114th place and 117th place.
And he has a connection with a touring car driver or something.
He did has a connection with a touring car driver at
Snetterton. Quite recently.
There was a start line as which one?
It was one of the. The Chevrolets, the PMW
Chevrolets all right, rolled itself off the grid and
demolished television tower. When Ian Ashley had its huge
crash at the Canadian Grand Prix, he went straight into a
television tower. Oh, OK.
There you go. Totally useless facts.
There you go. And if anyone was wondering who
was third in the Turkey times for privateers, it was Luton's
finest David Bingley. David Peakley, Yes, he was
always interesting to interview. Ian Khan actually shared I did
some GT racing with him in a Porsche.
Oh really? So yeah, yeah, I did.
And I will. I have a sign.
You know the signs you get above the peak garriages.
I've got a sign somewhere. Think it's in the man cave that
I'll or. After this he's released.
I will post that as proof. Yes, please do.
Yeah. So back back to the winner of
the quiz. Like what?
Do I get a prize or do I get a mug?
Do I get a 1990s mug? Is that what happens here or?
That I'd like to thank Andrew Sharman for joining us once
again to look back at this race and we hope to see you again on
Stories from Super Touring. Well, you know where to find me.
I mean, I'm absolutely loving doing these, even though it's
forcing me to exercise bits of my grey matter that haven't been
disturbed for very many years. Yeah, absolutely.
You want me back? I'll be there.
Yeah. We love having you on, Andrew.
And our thanks as ever go to you guys for listening to the show.
And if you enjoyed today's episode, please make sure to
give us a review A5 star rating and subscribe to the podcast
feed on your podcast app of choice.
And a few of you have got in touch after last week's episode
with Mick Linford to say just how much they enjoyed it.
So thank you very much for those comments.
Aaron Ewing told us that he loved the episode of Mick,
whilst James Hipwell said it was a proper down to earth and
honest chat, which it absolutely was.
Was was very eye open for all of us.
I think I can sell more of all us there, wasn't it?
I think it was, I think even even for me, being involved in
touring cars at a later stage and what that was to know
probably more than what the average person would know in
terms of internal stuff. It was even a shock to me to
know just how the air just lacked backwards and the amount
of times that he probably would have wanted to throw the towel
in. Yeah, I I really, really felt
for for Mick when he was telling us just how.
You know how tough it was and it was.
It was really enlightening actually, and it makes you
realise just. What a good job he did do.
Yeah. No support.
Yeah you know and and to be up against and as I said last week
I didn't mean it in a in a disrespectful way but you know
he was his Peugeot team were up against Williams TWR Pro Drive
you know these massive companies that.
That were, you know, very, very well versed in preparing racing
cars. One of the.
Most strongest times of touring car racing was it in terms of
the teaming, the teams that were involved?
Yes. And until very late they were
still doing it in the back of the back of the car plant, you
know it's it's, it's impressive. And Paul Waterhouse, he also got
in touch. So it was a very interesting
episode and said what a great interview.
So thanks very much for that Paul and everyone else that got
in touch with their comments on the episode.
We always enjoy hearing just how much you're loving the podcast.
That's that was really lovely to see.
Yeah. Thank you everyone.
Don't forget you can now support the podcast by buying some of
our own merchandise. Range from mugs to T-shirts.
All are available at 1990s btcc.com/shop and all profit
goes towards keeping the blog and the podcast running.
You can also send us a con about today's episode, the podcast in
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future episode by sending it to POD at 1990s btcc.com.
In the meantime, we'll see you next week.