1 00:00:00,400 --> 00:00:18,080 Stories from Super Touring. Hello and welcome to this week's 2 00:00:18,080 --> 00:00:20,560 episode of Stories from Super Touring. 3 00:00:21,120 --> 00:00:25,000 And in this week's episode, I've got a very special guest joining 4 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:28,200 me. He's a motorsport legend and 5 00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:31,240 he's the 1994 British Touring Car champion. 6 00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:35,720 And we're going to talk about his 1994 title success with AR 7 00:00:35,720 --> 00:00:37,080 in the BTCC. Today. 8 00:00:37,440 --> 00:00:39,840 It's none other than Gabrielli. Tarquini. 9 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:43,360 Gabrielli, Welcome back to STORIES from Super Touring. 10 00:00:43,360 --> 00:00:45,960 How are you doing? Very well, very well. 11 00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:49,000 Nice to meet you again. Yes, it's good to see you again. 12 00:00:49,680 --> 00:00:54,440 Just as a as a start, we look at 1994 and obviously it was your 13 00:00:54,440 --> 00:00:56,680 touring car, your British touring car debut. 14 00:00:58,520 --> 00:01:02,080 Is it a view you've looked back on fondly within York within 15 00:01:02,080 --> 00:01:04,800 such a varied and huge motorsport career that you've 16 00:01:04,800 --> 00:01:07,040 had? Is it one of the years where you 17 00:01:07,040 --> 00:01:09,280 look back on with a lot of fondness? 18 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:14,360 Yes sure, it was my first title because I mean I start racing 19 00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:18,600 into in Super Touring since long time. 20 00:01:18,880 --> 00:01:26,680 Also before 94 I start with AR with the 75 Turbo and after with 21 00:01:26,680 --> 00:01:32,280 the BMW and after back to AR. But I never won a title, 22 00:01:32,280 --> 00:01:36,760 especially because when I was involved in Super Touring I was 23 00:01:36,760 --> 00:01:39,360 at the same time involving in Formula One. 24 00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:49,480 So normally I never did the full season and especially for this 25 00:01:49,480 --> 00:01:55,680 reason I never won a title. 94 was my first title and one of 26 00:01:55,680 --> 00:02:00,360 the best memory in my career because, I mean, it was a 27 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:06,720 special season with an Italian team, with an Italian car in 28 00:02:06,720 --> 00:02:10,240 England. Yeah, it was really special for 29 00:02:10,240 --> 00:02:12,000 me. You, you say that you'd spent 30 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:16,440 the previous, you'd spent some previous time with AR in Super 31 00:02:16,440 --> 00:02:20,360 Touring. It was their BTCC debut in 94. 32 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:23,200 As you said, coming over into England and racing in the 33 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:26,720 British series. Was it your choice to come over 34 00:02:26,720 --> 00:02:29,200 and race in in the British Touring Car Championship or was 35 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:32,880 it more of a case of Alfa Romeo said right, We want to race in, 36 00:02:32,880 --> 00:02:36,320 in, in the BTCC and you're, you're going to be Rory racing 37 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:39,240 with us. No, it was in Alfa Romeo. 38 00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:46,000 Choose because choice because Giorgio Pianta, the the boss of 39 00:02:46,000 --> 00:02:51,360 Alfa Romeo at this time after a season spending the Italian 40 00:02:51,360 --> 00:02:59,080 Super Turismo the 93 where we we we was really the rookie with 41 00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:02,880 the front wheel traction was the first the first 155 front wheel 42 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:11,040 traction car driven by me and Morbidelli and Tamara Vidali in 43 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:13,880 in Italy. But in the beginning the car 44 00:03:13,880 --> 00:03:18,520 wasn't really competitive. During the season I I won some 45 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:23,920 some rounds, but the competitiveness was more and 46 00:03:23,920 --> 00:03:26,040 more. And in the end of the season we 47 00:03:26,040 --> 00:03:32,680 was we was there and saw the big boss decide the first choice was 48 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:37,440 to enter in the French championship, French Super 49 00:03:37,440 --> 00:03:40,880 Touring championship. And after he changed idea, 50 00:03:41,760 --> 00:03:47,200 because probably considering that the fight 155 was a 51 00:03:47,200 --> 00:03:54,200 competitive enough, he choose the the BTCC and we start the 52 00:03:54,200 --> 00:03:57,040 campaign of the BTCC during the winter. 53 00:03:57,800 --> 00:04:01,160 Nothing to do with your your your ability to watch a bit more 54 00:04:01,160 --> 00:04:02,680 Chelsea then whilst you're over here. 55 00:04:05,280 --> 00:04:11,600 Now is less Italian than 94. I mean, it was an Italian, 56 00:04:12,480 --> 00:04:15,360 almost an Italian team. This year, yeah, yeah. 57 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:20,320 So you came over and and obviously major debut in in the 58 00:04:20,320 --> 00:04:25,600 BTCC in that season 94. Now there was a lot of talk 59 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:30,840 about what additions your car had with with regards to the the 60 00:04:30,840 --> 00:04:34,520 front and rear splitters. How much did you know about that 61 00:04:34,520 --> 00:04:39,240 at the time and how aware of you were the how aware were you at 62 00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:43,280 the time of these developments that that Alpha course were were 63 00:04:43,280 --> 00:04:47,880 were making on the car? I was aware of everything 64 00:04:47,880 --> 00:04:53,680 because I mean, we start the campaign in the winter, we start 65 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:57,720 testing the tyres in Nogaro in the winter time. 66 00:04:58,400 --> 00:05:04,520 And at this time I was really the the man of developing and 67 00:05:04,520 --> 00:05:08,760 racing. So I start talking with Sergio 68 00:05:08,760 --> 00:05:12,640 Limoni, it was the big boss of Alpha Technical Alfa Romeo at 69 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:19,520 this, this time the engineer and I mean, I, he was very busy with 70 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:23,680 DTM at this time because he was also the engineer of the 71 00:05:23,880 --> 00:05:31,840 fantastic 155 DTM car. And in Nogaro we start planning 72 00:05:31,840 --> 00:05:36,960 and programming what was the, the developing, what's the way 73 00:05:36,960 --> 00:05:40,000 to go for improving the performance of the car. 74 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:47,440 And during the the winter time on we discover something on the 75 00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:50,520 differential because at this time the differential was the 76 00:05:50,520 --> 00:06:00,680 key of a front with traction and we invent something mixed in our 77 00:06:00,680 --> 00:06:04,840 Raleigh and mechanic differential coming from the 78 00:06:04,840 --> 00:06:08,400 Lancia Delta Raleigh car. OK. 79 00:06:08,800 --> 00:06:10,400 Differential. OK, Yeah. 80 00:06:10,960 --> 00:06:14,840 And we start testing on the winter and we discover a big, 81 00:06:14,840 --> 00:06:19,280 big improvement in lap time and also entire wear. 82 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:23,080 And after he, he want to go deeply and deeply on the 83 00:06:23,080 --> 00:06:30,400 developing the car and we introduce these rear wing and 84 00:06:30,400 --> 00:06:35,320 the the front split. That was a special homologation. 85 00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:42,160 And I test two or three times in the private test because they 86 00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:46,360 want to keep secret to this, because the end of homologation 87 00:06:46,360 --> 00:06:53,760 was the end of March 94. And it was a big rush to prepare 88 00:06:53,760 --> 00:07:00,200 two 2500 car. So special edition, Silverstone 89 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:05,680 special edition was everything was made for the BTCC campaign 90 00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:08,960 and we prepare the, I mean the English campaign. 91 00:07:10,000 --> 00:07:13,880 Yeah, and I like that twist of that, that sort of little joke 92 00:07:13,880 --> 00:07:16,360 that was called the Silverstone as well, just for the reason 93 00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:17,080 though. Brilliant. 94 00:07:18,000 --> 00:07:22,360 Did you expect it to 'cause as much of A uproar as it did? 95 00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:31,720 But real no in the beginning no, because I mean I really know how 96 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:35,880 how big was the difference in term of performance and the rear 97 00:07:35,880 --> 00:07:38,280 wing was almost 0. OK. 98 00:07:39,560 --> 00:07:47,600 It was the road car rear wing coming from the A33 that was not 99 00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:56,120 the performance wing. It was just to metal to increase 100 00:07:56,120 --> 00:08:00,960 the the right of the wing. But to be honest the the real 101 00:08:00,960 --> 00:08:05,800 gain was was almost 0. The front splitter was bigger 102 00:08:05,880 --> 00:08:15,240 because it was very clever limone to use these higher duck 103 00:08:15,240 --> 00:08:19,880 for the the the the disc and brake the front brakes to use 104 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:24,720 just a small wing. And these make a small 105 00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:28,880 difference in in term of the front grip and lap time 106 00:08:28,880 --> 00:08:33,720 performance. But I mean the surprise was 107 00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:39,919 bigger because we decide never test these two solution on the 108 00:08:40,440 --> 00:08:42,480 all the tests we made in England. 109 00:08:42,480 --> 00:08:47,720 So we we spend a lot of time during the winter to test in the 110 00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:51,240 English track because I did the no track. 111 00:08:51,280 --> 00:08:58,840 I know Silverstone brands, probably a brand such and 112 00:08:58,840 --> 00:09:01,320 Donington. The rest was completely new for 113 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:06,040 me and also for the team. So we tried to test as much as 114 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:11,920 possible the, the the English track and we never, we never put 115 00:09:11,920 --> 00:09:14,560 the car like the Silverstone cars. 116 00:09:15,280 --> 00:09:20,160 And, and we decide also in tracks on on the first race to 117 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:26,880 do the the free practise one or, and two with the with the normal 118 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:30,240 car. And we, we put just the the, the 119 00:09:30,240 --> 00:09:33,320 wing, the rear wing, the front splitter for qualifying. 120 00:09:33,440 --> 00:09:40,320 Yeah, this was probably not very clever because this happened 121 00:09:40,320 --> 00:09:44,640 because the first race interaction was on the first 122 00:09:44,640 --> 00:09:47,240 weekend of April, the 4th of April. 123 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:56,000 And the we let's goes through the end of rend of all mortgage 124 00:09:56,000 --> 00:09:59,200 period. So in the end of March and the 125 00:09:59,200 --> 00:10:03,160 qualifying was on, I don't remember exactly the 2nd of 126 00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:06,080 April. And we put all together the rear 127 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:12,600 wing and the front blitzer. And this was, I think part of 128 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:19,920 the big mess we create in the in the BTCC 94 because nobody was 129 00:10:19,920 --> 00:10:26,040 expected this configuration. Everybody start complain, 130 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:28,120 especially because the car was very good. 131 00:10:28,120 --> 00:10:32,080 I mean, I score pole position. I won the first race because 132 00:10:32,320 --> 00:10:37,040 interaction was a single race and the performance was was very 133 00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:40,000 good. And I mean the, the surprise 134 00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:44,720 don't make do you make the, the, the, the light atmosphere around 135 00:10:44,720 --> 00:10:47,440 us. Yeah, there were a few in 136 00:10:47,440 --> 00:10:50,840 particular Ford and Andy Rose was were were were not best 137 00:10:50,840 --> 00:10:53,520 pleased. In fact, I found it funny that 138 00:10:53,520 --> 00:10:57,040 he he did a few developments for his Ford and and dubbed it the 139 00:10:57,040 --> 00:11:03,440 Monza in response. But but yeah, it it, it, it was 140 00:11:03,440 --> 00:11:05,720 interesting. How much of an impact did you 141 00:11:05,720 --> 00:11:11,880 expect to to go into the BTCC and you know, get pole position, 142 00:11:11,880 --> 00:11:16,360 win the race at a, you know, at a fairly, you know, no race is 143 00:11:16,360 --> 00:11:21,640 easy as such, but you know, at a fairly easy performance then. 144 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:27,480 To be honest, because especially during the winter test, there 145 00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:33,480 was there was a lot of car testing at the same, at the same 146 00:11:33,480 --> 00:11:36,760 day at the same track. And the performance was 147 00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:40,360 especially because I didn't know the track sometimes not very 148 00:11:40,360 --> 00:11:42,200 good. I mean, the pace was there. 149 00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:46,880 Sometimes I was on the top three, on top five, but never, I 150 00:11:46,880 --> 00:11:51,520 mean on, on top and regularly on on top on pace. 151 00:11:52,160 --> 00:11:59,080 And I remember exactly a test in Alton Park and Giorgio Pianta 152 00:11:59,080 --> 00:12:04,680 joined this this test and watching the the the the greet 153 00:12:04,880 --> 00:12:08,040 and also the manufacturer involved, because at this time 154 00:12:08,040 --> 00:12:12,880 there was 10/10 team with 10 different manufacturers. 155 00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:17,880 And they say, yeah, this Giorgio Pianta told me this is very, 156 00:12:17,880 --> 00:12:20,520 very difficult. And I don't think that you can 157 00:12:21,120 --> 00:12:24,640 win this, this championship. And we make a bet. 158 00:12:24,640 --> 00:12:28,280 He make a bet and say, OK, what, what do you want? 159 00:12:28,280 --> 00:12:31,880 If you win the, the, the, the, the title and say, OK, you can 160 00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:33,920 give me the car at the end of the season. 161 00:12:34,800 --> 00:12:40,800 And that's was the bet with him because he was sure that we we 162 00:12:40,800 --> 00:12:44,120 never achieved the title. And in the end I achieved the 163 00:12:44,120 --> 00:12:48,480 title and the the car was on my garage for long, long time. 164 00:12:48,480 --> 00:12:51,160 I was going to say, yeah, I know you have done to that car for a 165 00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:55,280 long time, but so he must have been sweating a little bit. 166 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:58,360 Once you went and won not only at Thruxton, but you did the 167 00:12:58,360 --> 00:13:01,560 double at Brands and then you won at Snetterton as well. 168 00:13:02,520 --> 00:13:06,480 Yeah, that's, that's don't help the relationship with other team 169 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:13,480 because no, I mean, we didn't try to manage the advantage. 170 00:13:13,480 --> 00:13:20,040 But to be honest with you and probably I don't know if the 171 00:13:20,040 --> 00:13:27,320 English fan and support knowing this, but the real big advantage 172 00:13:27,320 --> 00:13:31,840 was the differential and everybody was looking at the 173 00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:35,440 rear wing and the front split. But at this time the 174 00:13:35,440 --> 00:13:38,480 differential make the big, big difference. 175 00:13:39,320 --> 00:13:43,880 But the approach was not very clever because because we can 176 00:13:43,880 --> 00:13:50,480 idle it to beat the, the, the performance and try to survive 177 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:56,320 for the half season. And in the hand, nobody told me 178 00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:59,120 to to to manage the the performance. 179 00:13:59,680 --> 00:14:04,760 We want straight out full throttle and to win as much as 180 00:14:04,760 --> 00:14:07,560 possible. So, and to be honest, it was 181 00:14:09,360 --> 00:14:14,920 really too much because I won five consecutive rounds and the 182 00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:19,680 6th, the 6th race I had an accident in in the first and 183 00:14:19,680 --> 00:14:24,560 second in the second lap when I was not leading but I was in the 184 00:14:24,560 --> 00:14:30,800 top five or six. These make make a big a big 185 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:33,720 difference. I mean because after I mean 186 00:14:33,800 --> 00:14:37,680 Alton Park problem appear and there was a big. 187 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:43,560 Fight yeah, I mean, we talk of those first five race win, race 188 00:14:43,560 --> 00:14:48,480 wins that you won consecutively. One of those was at Snetterton 189 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:51,240 and it was a good battle on track. 190 00:14:51,240 --> 00:14:54,160 But it was a weird weekend because it was the Bank Holiday 191 00:14:54,160 --> 00:15:00,280 Monday, the day after the the atrocities that happened at at 192 00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:04,440 Imola with obviously the deaths of not only in Senna, but Roland 193 00:15:04,440 --> 00:15:09,360 Ratzenberger, big accident to to Rubens Barrichello as well. 194 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:13,000 I mean, these these were some of these people you raced alongside 195 00:15:13,000 --> 00:15:15,000 in Formula One. It must have been a weird 196 00:15:15,000 --> 00:15:19,160 weekend for you. Yeah, it was a sort of nightmare 197 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:20,320 weekend. Yeah. 198 00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:28,040 And fortunately, we, we was on TV because this time we was able 199 00:15:28,120 --> 00:15:33,440 to, to, to, to watch the Italian TV through the satellite. 200 00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:39,600 And I remember very well what, what we, we everybody saw on, on 201 00:15:39,600 --> 00:15:43,440 this race weekend in Nemo. Like it was my own track. 202 00:15:43,440 --> 00:15:50,000 I was racing there many times. I mean, I raised with Senna 203 00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:54,240 because Senna was born in 60. I was 60, born in 60. 204 00:15:54,240 --> 00:15:59,560 I mean, from 62 I personally spend a lot of time with, I've 205 00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:03,560 done not only Formula One, but also in, in karting. 206 00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:07,120 So it was, it was a nightmare, a nightmare. 207 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:13,280 And I remember very, very well that we'd race with the, with 208 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:17,440 the, with the black in, in, in the car and with the name of 209 00:16:18,120 --> 00:16:24,640 Roland and Ayrton on, on top of the, the bonnet. 210 00:16:24,640 --> 00:16:31,320 And yeah, it's, it's, I mean, it's something that I never 211 00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:34,960 forgot in my life. Yeah, and that weekend as well 212 00:16:34,960 --> 00:16:39,000 was the first time that your teammate Jean Pierre of Simoni 213 00:16:39,320 --> 00:16:41,360 LED a race. He led him. 214 00:16:41,360 --> 00:16:43,680 And poor Adesitra had a bit of a battle at the start. 215 00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:46,880 What was Jam Piero like as a team mate? 216 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:49,000 Was he was he a good help? Was he he? 217 00:16:49,480 --> 00:16:52,800 We've had, I've had chats with Jam Piero in the past. 218 00:16:52,800 --> 00:16:55,280 He's a lovely fellow, good team mate. 219 00:16:55,960 --> 00:17:00,240 Yeah, a very good team mate. I mean, in the beginning of the 220 00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:04,800 season, there was not driver number one or driver #2 we start 221 00:17:04,839 --> 00:17:10,319 from equal. But after the first 3-4 races, 222 00:17:10,319 --> 00:17:15,760 it was clear that, I mean, it was, it was there just to, to, 223 00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:18,119 to help me during the, the season. 224 00:17:18,640 --> 00:17:24,440 It was a fast, a fast driver. But in the beginning, especially 225 00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:30,160 because he he didn't have he didn't has a lot of experience 226 00:17:30,160 --> 00:17:33,920 in touring car. It was one of the first season 227 00:17:33,920 --> 00:17:40,600 in touring car because he he he he came from A1 seat car and it 228 00:17:40,600 --> 00:17:44,840 was a really a big problem for him, especially to manage the 229 00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:49,120 tyre wear. Also the on traffic. 230 00:17:49,120 --> 00:17:55,520 I mean, the fight was his big probably minus was in in in 231 00:17:55,520 --> 00:18:00,640 fight in the battle. It was sometimes to too strong 232 00:18:00,640 --> 00:18:04,640 and some sometimes to to to weaken the in in this fight. 233 00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:09,920 And I remember a lot of crashes in the middle of the in the 234 00:18:09,920 --> 00:18:15,600 middle of the battle. So, and after he he was, he was 235 00:18:15,600 --> 00:18:21,040 helping me to be honest, I I didn't need a lot of help 236 00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:26,800 because the championship went to the to the my direction and Alfa 237 00:18:26,800 --> 00:18:31,280 Romeo direction. But when I need his help, he was 238 00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:34,760 always smiling and help me a lot. 239 00:18:34,920 --> 00:18:36,920 Yeah, and. Then, as you say, the 240 00:18:37,080 --> 00:18:38,640 championship moved on to Silverstone. 241 00:18:38,640 --> 00:18:41,840 You won the first race but it was your first retirement. 242 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:46,680 There was an instant I think Alan was pushed by Paul or vice 243 00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:51,280 versa and turned you around and poor old Keith O'door. 244 00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:54,320 Yeah. And had nowhere to go and slap. 245 00:18:54,320 --> 00:18:56,680 It was quite a big accident actually it was quite a nasty 246 00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:58,760 shunt. Yeah, I was stopped in the 247 00:18:58,760 --> 00:19:04,400 middle of the of the way on the on the line and he hit me quite 248 00:19:04,400 --> 00:19:06,600 hard. But he was a car in front of him 249 00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:09,960 move last minutes and he went he went to me. 250 00:19:10,560 --> 00:19:14,640 And yeah, it was the first zero of the season. 251 00:19:14,640 --> 00:19:22,040 And at this time the advantage in term of points was not, I 252 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:26,360 mean huge, especially because Paul Raddis it just got a lot of 253 00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:30,600 points as well. So it was very, very, very fast 254 00:19:30,600 --> 00:19:34,240 in the in the beginning, except the first rate was it was 255 00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:36,960 stopped. I don't remember he had an 256 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:42,520 accident, but after he he won Silverstone, he he scored two 257 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:47,520 podium in Zettatone Silverstone. So he he was close to me. 258 00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:54,160 And despite the five the five consecutive win, I didn't get a 259 00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:57,560 a gap in in in the in the championship driver. 260 00:19:57,880 --> 00:20:02,560 No, and that. Would Gap would get even smaller 261 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:06,920 when you got to Alton Park because there's the iconic scene 262 00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:13,080 of all the fans pouring into the track as your trucks are are 263 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:16,160 exiting? I mean, is Alton Park is where 264 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:17,840 it came to a real head, didn't it? 265 00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:21,040 This whole battle between yourselves and mainly Ford, but 266 00:20:21,040 --> 00:20:23,480 Vauxhall were a little bit unhappy as well. 267 00:20:23,480 --> 00:20:27,680 And at this point, did you think maybe you wouldn't be back in 268 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:28,640 Britain? And that was it. 269 00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:34,760 Yeah, I was really, really disappointing because they will 270 00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:39,040 start the fight. I mean, we need to to go to the 271 00:20:39,040 --> 00:20:47,000 tribunal, sporting tribunal. And we had a call with Giorgio 272 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:50,800 Pianta this time just in, in the beginning of the the week. 273 00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:53,880 Everybody was there. I mean, the car was ready to go, 274 00:20:54,240 --> 00:20:57,840 the track was there and I was ready to go. 275 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:05,600 And when Pianta call and say you must come back to Italy, we stop 276 00:21:05,600 --> 00:21:08,240 racing. And he was really serious 277 00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:13,680 because at this time we, he decides to stop the BTCC 278 00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:18,280 campaign. And at this time I need to come 279 00:21:18,280 --> 00:21:22,520 back to race in Italy or in France, but no more in, in the, 280 00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:26,280 in the BTCC. And it was really serious and I, 281 00:21:26,280 --> 00:21:32,360 I know him very well since two or three years before and 282 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:41,200 everybody was sure 100% that the last race was in, in 283 00:21:41,280 --> 00:21:46,120 Silverstone. So, and it was a very shame, 284 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:51,480 especially for the tifosi because but at this time there 285 00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:56,160 was also starting a campaign of supporting the Alfa Romeo. 286 00:21:56,560 --> 00:22:02,320 A lot of Italian came to visit BTCC because of, I mean, an 287 00:22:02,320 --> 00:22:07,560 Italian fight for for the first time for the, the title with an 288 00:22:07,560 --> 00:22:14,760 Italian car, an Italian team. So we start to see some red area 289 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:20,800 on the grandstand and, and I, I mean, people was crying, Italian 290 00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:24,160 people was, was crying watching our track. 291 00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:26,960 Yeah, yeah. Exit to the the the the the 292 00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:31,680 Alton Park circuit. So it was not a really good 293 00:22:31,680 --> 00:22:33,520 memory, no. No. 294 00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:37,240 And at this point it had been decided that your best results 295 00:22:37,240 --> 00:22:41,160 from I think it was Snetterton and and Silverstone were to be 296 00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:44,120 taken. Yeah, at this point or Radisich 297 00:22:44,120 --> 00:22:46,160 was actually in the lead of the championship. 298 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:51,440 So yeah, at what point did they decide, OK, we'll come back and 299 00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:54,840 and did you have to do any begging or anything or was 300 00:22:54,840 --> 00:22:58,320 there, you know? No, I mean, I was out of the, 301 00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:03,760 the playing. I mean, I can play with just 302 00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:07,960 the, the, the big boss, Giorgio Gan, Tainini Russo, the sporting 303 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:12,840 director. They they was, they was 304 00:23:12,840 --> 00:23:16,520 fighting, they need to change the lawyer. 305 00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:21,880 They come to the court again and they asked to have the point 306 00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:26,120 back and to to make an agreement, a sort of agreement 307 00:23:26,120 --> 00:23:32,920 with the with the TOCA just to give the position back with the 308 00:23:32,920 --> 00:23:39,200 real wing. And we can maintain 100%, not 309 00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:42,760 100%, but something like a 90% of the front splitter. 310 00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:48,080 Yeah. No, the agreement was was this 311 00:23:48,080 --> 00:23:54,720 and they decide to to come back. Yeah, yeah, it's it was the 312 00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:57,320 rear, the rear, the the rear wing, the space had to come 313 00:23:57,320 --> 00:23:59,320 down. So it was, it was a lot lower 314 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:02,960 and then yeah, the front spitter was in the retracted position, 315 00:24:03,280 --> 00:24:05,840 yeah. Did that have much of an impact 316 00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:08,400 on the performance of the car? You talk about it me being 317 00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:11,600 mainly the the diff at this point so. 318 00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:13,880 Yeah, but the the rear wing was zero. 319 00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:15,960 Yeah. I mean, to be honest, it was a 320 00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:20,600 cosmetical difference, but not in term of a performance. 321 00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:27,480 The front splitter help a little bit, OK, the the downforce was 322 00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:35,280 reducing by these new rules, but I mean, the car was not as 323 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:38,640 competitive as before, but he's still very good. 324 00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:43,960 And in some track. We, we was, we was we start to, 325 00:24:44,120 --> 00:24:49,880 we restart winning again because from Bransas that was, I mean, 326 00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:54,360 probably my favourite track and also the 155 our track. 327 00:24:54,800 --> 00:24:58,040 We we won again though. Yes, because you the the, the 328 00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:00,800 you returned for Donington, which was a, a John Cleland 329 00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:04,600 double, Yeah, which which he thought he was very happy with 330 00:25:04,600 --> 00:25:06,720 at the time and, and thought there we go. 331 00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:09,240 That's the alphas dealt with. But then like you say, you came 332 00:25:09,240 --> 00:25:14,680 back very strongly at, at Brands Hatch where you and you and Jan 333 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:17,720 Piero both finished first and second both races. 334 00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:22,640 So it's sort of it shows that it wasn't just the area, I guess 335 00:25:22,640 --> 00:25:25,520 that the car as you said was a was a good car anyway. 336 00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:29,960 To be honest, yes, it was a good car, especially for the from the 337 00:25:30,120 --> 00:25:33,560 differential. I mean, the main difference was 338 00:25:33,560 --> 00:25:35,680 the the the the differential, yeah. 339 00:25:36,320 --> 00:25:40,640 Yeah, and then the coming into the the Grand Prix support 340 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:44,320 meeting, it was when the homologation rules changed and 341 00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:49,080 and people teams were allowed to add certain bits to their car 342 00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:52,960 and BMW and Renault did and it seemed to transform the BMW, 343 00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:56,680 although they did have a weight, they did a bit of relief on the 344 00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:59,760 weight penalty as well for the rear wheel drive You and you and 345 00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:02,280 Jerkim had a great battle at Silverstone. 346 00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:04,000 I I remember watching that one very fondly. 347 00:26:04,360 --> 00:26:07,720 Was it more exciting at that point that you had someone to 348 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:09,200 have a bit of a tussle with on track? 349 00:26:09,440 --> 00:26:15,360 Yes, especially some battle with Joachim, because I mean from 350 00:26:15,360 --> 00:26:21,000 Joakim. I met Joakim years before in in 351 00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:25,440 Formula One. He was teammate in AGS, not for 352 00:26:25,440 --> 00:26:32,840 a long time, but, and he was, I mean not very fast on Formula 353 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:42,040 One, but very fast in Turinka. And I had some very tough fight, 354 00:26:42,040 --> 00:26:49,840 but always very clean. I mean never pushed by Joaquim 355 00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:53,640 or never. Strange things it was, it was 356 00:26:54,120 --> 00:26:57,840 really nice to fight with him. Really, really nice to fight 357 00:26:57,840 --> 00:26:59,720 with him. Yeah, yeah, no, he Joe, Joe. 358 00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:01,440 Joe was smoking Joe with a super. 359 00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:02,880 Yeah, Smoking Joe. Yeah, we. 360 00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:08,520 Love smoking, Joe, but you then. So you, you, you finished second 361 00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:11,000 to Joe actually at the, at the British Grand Prix support 362 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:14,880 meeting, which had that big crash at the start. 363 00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:19,360 And talking of big crashes, we get to Knock Hill. 364 00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:24,360 Yeah, which I'm sure I'm pretty sure you wouldn't have. 365 00:27:24,480 --> 00:27:26,960 You mentioned earlier at the start of the show that you had 366 00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:30,400 only experienced brands Donnington and and Silverstone. 367 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:33,360 What on earth were you thinking the first time you got to Knock 368 00:27:33,360 --> 00:27:34,920 Hill? Because that's like a roller 369 00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,960 coaster, isn't it? Yeah, I mean, I remember very 370 00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:41,320 well we didn't test on the winter especially because 371 00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:45,160 probably there was no there very, very cold. 372 00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:52,880 And we decide to to, to go to, to Knock Hill very early in in 373 00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:55,200 the week. And at this time there was free 374 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:59,360 practise starting from I don't remember Monday or Thursday, but 375 00:27:59,600 --> 00:28:02,840 or Wednesday. But we we spend two or three 376 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:08,000 days testing over there. And I mean, despite the car was 377 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:12,040 very competitive, we wasn't very competitive in Nokia. 378 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:17,080 I mean, probably it was me because first time you need to 379 00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:22,560 pay the don't know the, the really the way to go and how, 380 00:28:22,600 --> 00:28:26,200 how to approach these different truck. 381 00:28:26,200 --> 00:28:29,560 I mean, you'll spend much more time on the grass and over the 382 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:34,520 curb resident on the asphalt. And for me, it was really, 383 00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:38,000 really difficult. It was one of the my worst 384 00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:40,040 qualify qualifying in the season. 385 00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:46,800 And it was the the very first time that the president of Fiat 386 00:28:46,800 --> 00:28:49,800 Cantarella joined to see our weekend. 387 00:28:50,960 --> 00:28:55,520 It was the worst one. And I remember he, he was 388 00:28:55,520 --> 00:29:01,440 watching me on the, the, the third quarter where I, I roll, 389 00:29:02,240 --> 00:29:07,120 roll after in the first race. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 390 00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:11,120 I mean, the, it's, it's iconic. It's iconic. 391 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:12,960 And yeah, it, it, it's one of the. 392 00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:16,320 And I think it's helped by Murray Walker's unique 393 00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:20,320 commentary of it all. I remember exactly from the the 394 00:29:20,320 --> 00:29:23,400 word of Mario, it's Star Queenie, it's star Queen that's 395 00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:26,080 his. I mean even if I I go to the 396 00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:32,720 social now I can find some video coming from the 94 no kill 397 00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:34,880 racing track so. It was. 398 00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:39,840 The really iconic, Yeah, it's. It was Tim Harvey that sort of 399 00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:41,160 nudged you after that, wasn't it? 400 00:29:41,160 --> 00:29:45,520 And it was, it was a really bizarre accident because it 401 00:29:45,520 --> 00:29:48,400 wasn't at a high speed or anything, but you just kept 402 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:49,800 going. And she just kept that. 403 00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:51,840 He just wouldn't stop. It was. 404 00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:58,160 It was really, really strange because it was like you told, I 405 00:29:58,160 --> 00:30:02,280 mean the speed was around 70 or 80 kilometres per hour. 406 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:06,000 It was a second gear corner, very, very slow. 407 00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:12,600 But I was jumping on the curbs and Harvey hit me on the side 408 00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:17,520 and these effect make like a washing machine and I never 409 00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:20,880 stopped. I was rolling I was inside as 410 00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:27,480 surprised how long I I roll around because for me it make no 411 00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:31,560 sense to roll so long with these very low speed. 412 00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:35,560 But yeah, it's, it's a really unusual accident, but the amount 413 00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:37,520 of damage it did to the car as well, it was. 414 00:30:37,640 --> 00:30:40,840 Completely destroyed, yeah. So what did the what did the 415 00:30:40,840 --> 00:30:46,440 Fiat president say All. That he was very, very happy 416 00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:51,160 because, I mean, we was leading the championship and despite the 417 00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:56,520 performance of Nokil, he said this is fantastic for marketing 418 00:30:56,520 --> 00:31:02,480 because I mean, he was clever to know that he's an acid, iconic 419 00:31:02,480 --> 00:31:05,720 accident. They'd make probably more effect 420 00:31:05,720 --> 00:31:08,800 than to win the race. Yeah, yeah, that's true. 421 00:31:08,800 --> 00:31:12,080 Yeah. And one thing I've got to ask is 422 00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:15,880 did Tim ever apologise? Yeah, I was. 423 00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:22,320 I mean, I was hungry with him and the first, but probably he 424 00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:27,480 was surprised as well because he didn't expect the car rolling in 425 00:31:27,480 --> 00:31:28,480 front. Of him, yeah. 426 00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:31,200 Yeah. Go fast and so long so. 427 00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:33,440 Well, they, they still give him a bit of stick about it now 428 00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:36,520 because I, I, they, they did the coverage of the, the current 429 00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:38,240 towing cars from Nokia last year. 430 00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:42,600 And, and I know that Paul O'Neill gave him a bit of you've 431 00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:44,080 rolled a few cars around here sort. 432 00:31:44,160 --> 00:31:47,320 Of you know. So it's still fondly remembered. 433 00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:51,480 But yeah, I mean that that is one of as, as we've said, the 434 00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:53,360 the one of the most iconic accidents. 435 00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:56,880 But you did get back to Orton Park to actually race there this 436 00:31:56,880 --> 00:31:59,920 time and, and, and got a third place. 437 00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:03,360 Then we got to the Brands Hatch and got another pair of seconds. 438 00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:08,160 At this point it was a case of when, rather than if, you were 439 00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:13,520 going to win the championship. Yeah, this time the BMW was 440 00:32:13,680 --> 00:32:16,440 really, really fast. It was almost uncatchable. 441 00:32:17,040 --> 00:32:21,360 And for the the, the weight and for the performance, I mean, it 442 00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:25,640 was very difficult to fight with the with the smoking jaw, but 443 00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:28,080 fortunately I can score podium and points. 444 00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:33,120 So I keep maintain my gap, increasing my gap. 445 00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:41,040 And yeah, before, before Silverstone, everybody knows 446 00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:44,040 that the probably Silverstone was the key of the title. 447 00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:48,800 With some points there, I can, I can close the, the, the, the 448 00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:53,480 fight for the title. And another, I mean, anecdote 449 00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:57,960 before Silverstone that I was completely sick the week of 450 00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:02,320 before Silverstone, I was completely sick and with high 451 00:33:02,320 --> 00:33:09,400 fever and I, I was not sure to, to, to join Silverstone for the 452 00:33:09,400 --> 00:33:14,960 race. And at this time, Alfa Romeo 453 00:33:14,960 --> 00:33:20,000 send send me a doctor at home just to, to, to try to, to 454 00:33:20,000 --> 00:33:23,240 recover me well and, and soon and fast. 455 00:33:23,840 --> 00:33:28,600 And fortunately I can recover a little bit on, I don't remember 456 00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:33,800 it was Wednesday and Giorgio Pianda sent me the private jet 457 00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:38,440 to collect me at home and send me to, to Silverstone. 458 00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:45,240 So it was the the the the the only one I I can I can approach 459 00:33:45,360 --> 00:33:47,640 a track with a private jet. Nice. 460 00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:50,600 Yeah, very nice. Was there any chance of you 461 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:54,120 missing it at any point, or would you have just gone on with 462 00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:57,760 it anyway? No, it was not completely and 463 00:33:57,760 --> 00:34:00,720 fully recovered, but the fever gone. 464 00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:05,720 I mean, I don't remember, but completely before the, the, the 465 00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:10,880 qualifying I was a little bit sick on on free practise, but 466 00:34:10,880 --> 00:34:15,040 after in in qualifying I was, was was good. 467 00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:19,440 Yeah. And that is where you did clinch 468 00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:23,280 the title, Yeah. Including the first race, yeah. 469 00:34:23,280 --> 00:34:28,120 Including that brilliant lock up and the, the, the, the tyre 470 00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:30,679 speech that you did on the, on the, on the start finish line. 471 00:34:30,679 --> 00:34:34,840 I mean, at that point that must have been, I mean, it was a, it 472 00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:37,800 was a tough year with so many ups and downs for you. 473 00:34:39,000 --> 00:34:41,880 You know, at one point you thought early on that you 474 00:34:41,880 --> 00:34:43,280 weren't even going to complete the season. 475 00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:48,120 So it must have been a big relief to to finally get it done 476 00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:53,679 and completed. Yeah, because I mean the IT was 477 00:34:54,239 --> 00:34:56,600 like I told you before, it was my first title. 478 00:34:56,679 --> 00:34:59,240 Yeah. I never fight for the title in 479 00:34:59,240 --> 00:35:03,680 my life. And at this time, Alfa Romeo was 480 00:35:03,680 --> 00:35:08,520 under pressure because in 93 they won the DTM with Larini, 481 00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:14,360 but in 94 there was not a very good campaign and they lost very 482 00:35:14,360 --> 00:35:18,440 early the championship. And they put all these pressure 483 00:35:18,440 --> 00:35:24,560 into me because at this time Alfa Romeo was a big team, 484 00:35:25,080 --> 00:35:30,280 spending a lot of money to fight with the with the others. 485 00:35:30,280 --> 00:35:36,120 Probably it was the biggest team in term of money spending in in 486 00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:40,200 touring car. And I can feel this pressure and 487 00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:45,120 especially because I was under fever here, completely sick 488 00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:50,000 private jet come in into my house to bring me and to send me 489 00:35:50,000 --> 00:35:52,640 to Silverstone. I was really, really. 490 00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:55,600 I can feel my the pressure on my shoulder. 491 00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:59,520 Yeah. And for me, the first race, I 492 00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:03,360 want to close on the first race and I can win the first race 493 00:36:03,360 --> 00:36:08,760 because my car in Silverstone was very good and I can try to 494 00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:13,440 attack team on, on, on, on the the last few laps. 495 00:36:13,920 --> 00:36:18,760 But when they told me by radio that second position was enough 496 00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:23,680 to to win the title, I decide, OK, I can stay. 497 00:36:23,920 --> 00:36:26,240 I can stay 2nd and win the title. 498 00:36:26,240 --> 00:36:28,560 That is much more important than risky. 499 00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:31,760 And scored zero and opened the the title again. 500 00:36:32,680 --> 00:36:35,720 And so for me it was after the Chequers flag. 501 00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:38,040 I was really, really, really happy. 502 00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:40,360 Yeah, I can imagine. I could imagine it. 503 00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:43,200 And then you went on and won the second race as well there. 504 00:36:44,120 --> 00:36:48,520 Yeah, because I told Tonini Russo because Pianta was not 505 00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:54,400 with us in in the Silverstone. And I say now I won the title 506 00:36:54,400 --> 00:36:59,040 but I want to win the second race and I will try as hard as 507 00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:02,360 possible to win. It was a big fight again and I 508 00:37:02,360 --> 00:37:07,320 can I can score another win. And he may be, if I'm not wrong, 509 00:37:07,320 --> 00:37:13,240 gate win in in the BTCC that it was at this time something 510 00:37:13,280 --> 00:37:15,920 really special. Yeah, yeah, that's right. 511 00:37:15,920 --> 00:37:17,800 Yeah. You mentioned Nini Russo there. 512 00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:20,760 I mean, he, he seemed like, he seemed like quite a character. 513 00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:28,040 Was what was he like? It was a a very nice man. 514 00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:31,760 My relationship was very good for long time within. 515 00:37:31,760 --> 00:37:37,920 He's living in Portugal and I call him every time, especially 516 00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:46,560 in Christmas time because he's, he's one of my favourite sport 517 00:37:46,560 --> 00:37:51,680 director I had in my my career. Now I am sport sporting 518 00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:53,840 director. So I know what's the job. 519 00:37:54,280 --> 00:37:58,960 But he was one of the, the best on his, his role and was very, 520 00:38:01,000 --> 00:38:07,040 very good in, in all the kind of things and all approach to the 521 00:38:07,160 --> 00:38:11,680 motorsport. I mean, he, I can earn something 522 00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:16,520 from, from his job. And yeah, I was very, very happy 523 00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:19,440 to to have Nini with me at this time, Yeah. 524 00:38:20,000 --> 00:38:22,440 And then obviously that was a penultimate meeting. 525 00:38:22,440 --> 00:38:25,080 So the finale was at at Donington. 526 00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:27,160 Job done as far as you were concerned. 527 00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:32,800 A rare off in the in the first race, you ended up in the gravel 528 00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:35,800 trap, but it meant that you were at the back of the grid for the 529 00:38:35,800 --> 00:38:37,720 for the final race of the season. 530 00:38:38,280 --> 00:38:42,520 And it produced one of the most incredible drive through the 531 00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:46,080 field and almost in a second. Role. 532 00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:49,600 Yeah, that must. Have been fun. 533 00:38:50,760 --> 00:39:01,600 Yeah, because I decided to let Jean Piero win and I was there 534 00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:07,080 just to to help him win. And unfortunately, in the first 535 00:39:07,080 --> 00:39:10,080 race, I make a mistake and they cost me the race. 536 00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:16,640 And in the second, the gem Piero finally got a win that I was 537 00:39:16,640 --> 00:39:24,200 very, very happy for him. And I had these two wheel side 538 00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:28,120 way for, I don't know, 200 metre or something like this. 539 00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:35,240 That the another iconic video from these this season and these 540 00:39:35,520 --> 00:39:39,280 there is an explanation. I mean, now I can, I can told 541 00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:46,560 you because this differential I had to a button in the steering, 542 00:39:46,640 --> 00:39:50,280 in the steering wheel, I can completely close the 543 00:39:50,280 --> 00:39:54,000 differential. And normally we use on jumping 544 00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:57,800 on the kerbs just to avoid the wheelspin, because at this time 545 00:39:57,800 --> 00:40:04,240 the mechanical differential was not like now that you can stop 546 00:40:04,240 --> 00:40:09,440 the the speeding very fast and so when I jump. 547 00:40:10,840 --> 00:40:15,600 Over the curbs, IEI push the bottom a little bit earlier than 548 00:40:15,600 --> 00:40:20,920 before and the effect that you have two two wheel, 2 wheel 549 00:40:20,920 --> 00:40:25,320 torque that help me to to go on the side. 550 00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:30,720 And fortunately I reduce the the the the the the spinning. 551 00:40:30,720 --> 00:40:35,600 I start spinning with the wheel and I can open the the steering 552 00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:39,320 wheel to to the left a little bit to do to the left to help 553 00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:43,880 the the car land, land in the ground again. 554 00:40:44,240 --> 00:40:49,880 But unfortunately the oil radiator collapse when I land 555 00:40:49,880 --> 00:40:54,960 because it was quite hard and there was an oil leak and I I 556 00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:55,920 need to stop. I need to. 557 00:40:57,480 --> 00:41:02,160 Yes, because that you did that right in front of me and I 558 00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:03,760 thought, Oh no, he's going over again. 559 00:41:03,800 --> 00:41:07,360 But yeah, yeah. Because it was a really nice 560 00:41:07,360 --> 00:41:11,040 comeback. And I mean, in my head, I don't 561 00:41:11,040 --> 00:41:15,000 remember if I was 4th or 5th, but there was the possibility 562 00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:16,840 to, to, to finish into the podium. 563 00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:21,080 So I was fully attacked because I, I had never to lose and 564 00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:23,480 something to gain. I mean, the championship was 565 00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:26,320 over. Jean Piero was leading by radio. 566 00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:29,960 They they told me that Jean Piero was leading and I was in 567 00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:35,200 fully attack version and unfortunately I didn't. 568 00:41:35,200 --> 00:41:36,120 I didn't. Finish. 569 00:41:36,320 --> 00:41:40,240 No, it's, it was, it was quite funny actually, because on the 570 00:41:40,240 --> 00:41:44,760 coverage, if you look back, you kept overtaking everyone into 571 00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:47,480 the, the, the, the Goddard chicane, going out onto the 572 00:41:47,480 --> 00:41:52,600 Grand Prix loop and your pit crew kept getting it wrong on 573 00:41:52,600 --> 00:41:55,600 the pit boards. You'd pass somebody and they'd 574 00:41:55,600 --> 00:41:57,640 be like right P6 and you weren't your P5. 575 00:41:57,640 --> 00:42:00,560 And then the next lap, really. Yeah, I remember. 576 00:42:01,600 --> 00:42:06,320 But but yeah, as you say, Jam Piero won his his only touring 577 00:42:06,320 --> 00:42:06,760 car. Yeah. 578 00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:10,520 And that obviously that must have been great for the for the 579 00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:14,520 for the team as well to see Jam Piero yeah, take his first win. 580 00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:18,400 Yeah, especially because, I mean, he deserved to win a race. 581 00:42:18,400 --> 00:42:22,120 He was sometimes in the condition to win. 582 00:42:22,120 --> 00:42:27,120 I remember in Brands he let me pass once and sometimes in the 583 00:42:27,120 --> 00:42:32,520 battle he give he give me my his position. 584 00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:36,920 So he was, I mean, especially after the the first five races, 585 00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:43,400 it was obliged to work, to work with me, a dirty work because 586 00:42:43,400 --> 00:42:49,520 sometimes the people don't say this, but I I really want Jean 587 00:42:49,520 --> 00:42:52,880 Piero let let win a race. Yeah. 588 00:42:53,040 --> 00:42:55,360 At least, yeah. Yeah, it, it's funny because 589 00:42:55,720 --> 00:42:59,480 I've, I've, I've messaged back and forth with, with Jean Piero 590 00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:05,040 before and he'd actually never seen his own win because he said 591 00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:07,320 I flew straight back to Italy once the race finished. 592 00:43:07,320 --> 00:43:09,920 So we never saw the, the races on television. 593 00:43:09,920 --> 00:43:13,920 So I sent him the, the, the videos and, and he was so 594 00:43:13,920 --> 00:43:15,320 thrilled about it. He said it's one of his 595 00:43:15,320 --> 00:43:16,880 favourite memories in Motorsports. 596 00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:20,840 So that's quite cool. But so, yeah, you, you won the 597 00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:26,640 the your first championship and then left the BTCC certainly at 598 00:43:26,640 --> 00:43:30,840 the start of 1995. Was that again, was that your 599 00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:32,760 choice? Or was that alpha saying, right, 600 00:43:32,760 --> 00:43:33,960 we want you to go and do this now? 601 00:43:34,680 --> 00:43:39,120 No, it was alpha choice. I mean at this time Giorgio 602 00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:43,080 Pianto decide everything on his mind. 603 00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:50,960 Probably he want to win at home because I mean, since the last 604 00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:58,320 win was 92 on the with AR for Alfa Romeo, the Italian Super 605 00:43:58,320 --> 00:44:02,440 touring with a different category, but they never won in 606 00:44:02,440 --> 00:44:06,920 the in the class D2 like it was called this category Super 607 00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:13,720 Touring and and we come back to to Italy, but unfortunately the 608 00:44:13,720 --> 00:44:19,240 car wasn't really competitive like in 94, especially because 609 00:44:20,120 --> 00:44:24,080 everybody was able to to copy our differential because not 610 00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:31,360 everybody, but it was yuland that make on on sale on market 611 00:44:31,720 --> 00:44:36,200 our differential because they discover completely how it was 612 00:44:36,200 --> 00:44:42,400 working and probably it was a little bit better than our 613 00:44:42,400 --> 00:44:48,960 differential in 94 and 95. For this reason we we lost the 614 00:44:48,960 --> 00:44:54,520 competitiveness and this time there was the OD 4 wheel drive, 615 00:44:54,520 --> 00:44:57,600 especially in Italy was almost uncatchable. 616 00:44:58,160 --> 00:45:03,320 So we spend the first part of the the season fighting with 617 00:45:03,320 --> 00:45:07,240 them, but we're not not a lot of result. 618 00:45:07,640 --> 00:45:14,600 And after because the the BTCC campaign with war weekend Simoni 619 00:45:14,600 --> 00:45:19,000 wasn't really good. Alfa Romeo sent me back for some 620 00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:25,080 races in BTCC. But I mean the result was not as 621 00:45:25,160 --> 00:45:27,600 as as good as expected. Yeah, yeah. 622 00:45:28,000 --> 00:45:31,360 And at what point did you get on the phone to piano and say, 623 00:45:31,360 --> 00:45:33,640 where's my 155? I want it now. 624 00:45:33,960 --> 00:45:38,400 No, it was. It was a nice man and in the end 625 00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:47,200 of 94, he took my car, completely rebuilt, and he sent 626 00:45:47,200 --> 00:45:48,960 to my home. It was a new car. 627 00:45:49,360 --> 00:45:51,560 It was my car, but completely new. 628 00:45:51,720 --> 00:46:00,280 Yeah, and stay in my garage until 2021 because I never use 629 00:46:01,240 --> 00:46:05,960 it and I sold on 2021. Yeah. 630 00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:08,920 Did you ever take it out afterwards or was it just a 631 00:46:08,960 --> 00:46:10,800 static sitting in your garage for? 632 00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:15,840 That no obvious, I mean car of like, like this car you must run 633 00:46:17,320 --> 00:46:20,520 I mean every two or three years. So yeah, yeah, because my my 634 00:46:20,520 --> 00:46:26,200 family run a go Kart track. So I use this go Kart track just 635 00:46:26,240 --> 00:46:31,640 to to do a roll out with my 155. Nice, nice, nice. 636 00:46:31,800 --> 00:46:36,080 SO yeah, we, you've obviously we've mentioned that one, 1994, 637 00:46:36,080 --> 00:46:40,920 your first title. Do you, you seem to think of it 638 00:46:40,920 --> 00:46:44,760 as a really high point in your very illustrious career. 639 00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:47,080 We look we look back at what you've won throughout your 640 00:46:47,080 --> 00:46:50,080 career in a World Touring car championships, numerous other 641 00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:54,360 touring car championships. But 1994 really does resonate 642 00:46:54,360 --> 00:46:57,320 with you still to this day. Something really special. 643 00:46:57,920 --> 00:47:02,440 For me is at the same level of the World Touring Car 644 00:47:02,440 --> 00:47:05,200 Championship, probably even more. 645 00:47:06,680 --> 00:47:08,840 I mean, not, not probably the last one. 646 00:47:08,840 --> 00:47:14,200 That is my best memory of my career because that was very 647 00:47:14,240 --> 00:47:23,040 old, because I was, I mean, I won on 2018 and I, I was 50, 648 00:47:23,040 --> 00:47:27,040 almost 57. So I remember, and this is 649 00:47:27,040 --> 00:47:31,320 probably the best of my career, the best achievement of my 650 00:47:31,320 --> 00:47:36,280 career, but in very close to to this, it's the BTCC. 651 00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:39,440 Yeah, 94. Talking of the best of your 652 00:47:39,440 --> 00:47:42,560 career, if there was one race that you could say that was the 653 00:47:42,560 --> 00:47:45,840 race of my life in any category whatever, what would it be? 654 00:47:46,040 --> 00:47:54,960 For me it was the my all my only Formula One point in Mexico 89. 655 00:47:54,960 --> 00:48:00,520 So that's the race of my life. I remember, I will remember 656 00:48:00,520 --> 00:48:06,200 forever and still on my in my best memory because I mean I 657 00:48:06,200 --> 00:48:12,600 spend 6 season in Formula One but without a very performance 658 00:48:12,600 --> 00:48:19,360 car performing car and with AGS scoring a point, it was 659 00:48:19,360 --> 00:48:21,480 something very very hard to achieve. 660 00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:26,560 Yeah, no, I can imagine. But no, I mean, Gabrielli, just 661 00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:31,440 want to say thank you again for agreeing to join us this today 662 00:48:31,440 --> 00:48:34,680 to talk about your 1994 title success. 663 00:48:34,840 --> 00:48:38,000 When you look back at 94, is there one thing in particular 664 00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:41,200 that sticks out for you in the memory, or is it just the whole 665 00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:47,280 year in general? No, I, I really appreciate how 666 00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:52,360 much fun we got, especially in the end of the season. 667 00:48:52,920 --> 00:48:59,120 I mean, I watch the the, the number of fun increasing race by 668 00:48:59,120 --> 00:49:00,200 race. Yeah. 669 00:49:00,280 --> 00:49:06,000 And in the hand it was almost 15 or 20% of the people watching 670 00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:08,480 the BTCC. And that surprised me. 671 00:49:08,520 --> 00:49:14,800 OK, 50% was Italian or Alf Italian, Alf British, but I 672 00:49:14,800 --> 00:49:20,200 still, I mean a very good memory and a motivation for me. 673 00:49:20,200 --> 00:49:22,960 I mean, remember the the 94? Yeah. 674 00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:26,840 No, perfect. Well, thanks again for agreeing 675 00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:30,520 to, to join us to talk about the, your specials here in 1994. 676 00:49:30,840 --> 00:49:32,520 Gabrielli, just yeah, thanks very much. 677 00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:36,000 And, and from, from all our listeners, we just like to say 678 00:49:36,000 --> 00:49:38,480 thank you for all the memories you've given us over the years 679 00:49:38,480 --> 00:49:42,680 in, in the British touring cars and beyond, because you are one 680 00:49:42,680 --> 00:49:46,280 of the, you are one of the iconic drivers of the, of, of 681 00:49:46,280 --> 00:49:47,440 the sport. So thank you. 682 00:49:48,120 --> 00:49:55,040 Thank you to you and I want to say Arrivederci to the BTCC fan 683 00:49:55,040 --> 00:50:00,640 because I mean I want to be back probably with the the old 684 00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:05,960 touring car cars, I don't know, but once I I will be back. 685 00:50:06,880 --> 00:50:10,920 Well, I'm sure touring car fans around Britain will be delighted 686 00:50:10,920 --> 00:50:14,360 to hear that, Gabrielli. So my thanks again go to 687 00:50:14,360 --> 00:50:18,280 Gabrielli for joining us on today's episode of Stories from 688 00:50:18,280 --> 00:50:22,600 Super Touring, looking back at his incredible 1994 title 689 00:50:22,600 --> 00:50:27,320 success with AR. A huge thank you to you guys as 690 00:50:27,320 --> 00:50:29,640 well for listening to today's episode. 691 00:50:29,960 --> 00:50:33,160 If you enjoyed it, please take a moment to leave us a review, 692 00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:37,480 drop a five star rating and subscribe to the podcast on your 693 00:50:37,480 --> 00:50:41,840 favourite podcast app. It really does help us grow and 694 00:50:41,880 --> 00:50:45,560 bring you more of these stories. You can also get in touch with 695 00:50:45,560 --> 00:50:49,080 us with your thoughts on today's episode or the podcast in 696 00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:53,160 general, maybe even a suggestion for future shows by emailing us 697 00:50:53,160 --> 00:50:59,680 at pod 1990s btcc.com. But until then, we'll see you 698 00:50:59,840 --> 00:51:01,160 next week. Goodbye.