1 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:12,560 Hello and welcome to another episode of the AIGA Design 2 00:00:12,560 --> 00:00:14,960 Podcast. My name is Lee Sean Huang, Co 3 00:00:14,960 --> 00:00:19,000 Executive Director of Learning and Programs here at AIGA, the 4 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:21,400 professional association for design. 5 00:00:22,040 --> 00:00:25,160 Eyes on Design is the new overarching theme for our 6 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:28,960 programming this year in 2026, which will include this podcast, 7 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:32,560 our design conference coming up in November as well as 8 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:35,920 accretives and residents program that will launch shortly. 9 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:40,080 This season we are building on the legacy of AI GS acclaimed 10 00:00:40,080 --> 00:00:44,720 ION Design magazine, which ran from 2015 to 2022, and we're 11 00:00:44,720 --> 00:00:46,560 looking at design through different eyes, different 12 00:00:46,560 --> 00:00:49,200 perspectives and points of view. Hello everyone. 13 00:00:49,200 --> 00:00:52,640 I'm Julia Donatello, Design Competitions and Event Manager 14 00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:56,360 at AIG. I wanted to turn to our guests 15 00:00:56,920 --> 00:00:59,680 this episode. We have Andy Carson, who is the 16 00:00:59,680 --> 00:01:02,680 Marketing and Business Support Manager at Arctic Paper and Rob 17 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:06,600 Slow, Managing Director at Arctic Paper UK. 18 00:01:06,800 --> 00:01:11,480 So to kick us off, can you guys tell us about Arctic Paper, its 19 00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:14,120 portfolio, the kinds of products that you work with? 20 00:01:14,120 --> 00:01:16,320 And yeah, let us know more about your company. 21 00:01:17,320 --> 00:01:18,400 I'm Andy. This is Rob. 22 00:01:19,080 --> 00:01:22,960 Yeah, there you go. For folks who are watching this 23 00:01:22,960 --> 00:01:26,360 on YouTube, if you're listening to the audio version of the 24 00:01:26,360 --> 00:01:28,960 podcast, I guess you'll get to know their voices as we go. 25 00:01:30,440 --> 00:01:32,760 That's great. But no, just first of all, 26 00:01:32,760 --> 00:01:35,520 thanks for having us join your, your podcast. 27 00:01:35,520 --> 00:01:38,240 It's it's great, really good experience. 28 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:43,640 Arctic paper is AEU based paper group. 29 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:50,080 We have 3 paper mills, we've got 2IN Sweden and one in Poland. 30 00:01:50,560 --> 00:01:54,760 And we're actually quite a unique group because we're not 31 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:58,000 just specifying one type of paper or making one type of 32 00:01:58,000 --> 00:02:00,880 paper. We work with coated and uncoated 33 00:02:00,920 --> 00:02:06,520 in commodity and also book production and high end design. 34 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:10,440 So from one group, we're offering the whole marketplace 35 00:02:11,039 --> 00:02:13,920 product offering. When we're looking at where do 36 00:02:13,920 --> 00:02:18,680 we sell our products, we have 13 different offices throughout 37 00:02:18,680 --> 00:02:24,760 Europe, but also we see more and more people working remotely all 38 00:02:24,760 --> 00:02:27,240 around the world since since COVID times. 39 00:02:27,920 --> 00:02:30,920 And so we actually have an overseas team looking for 40 00:02:30,920 --> 00:02:33,400 looking at business outside of Europe. 41 00:02:34,000 --> 00:02:38,280 And one of those key areas for us is the US market. 42 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:43,000 We've seen more and more requests and demand for monk and 43 00:02:43,000 --> 00:02:48,360 design. So since 2022, we've actually 44 00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:53,800 had a special project looking at the US market to give support to 45 00:02:53,800 --> 00:02:59,120 the brand and just to give like knowledge and awareness of into 46 00:02:59,120 --> 00:03:03,160 the US market, which has been really a great success so, so 47 00:03:03,160 --> 00:03:07,400 far. And also we've got a great team 48 00:03:07,640 --> 00:03:11,040 based in Mungadahl. We call it the dummy shop, and 49 00:03:11,040 --> 00:03:15,520 they look after all the sample requests and all the the live 50 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:18,040 dummies. So although they're based in 51 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:22,160 Sweden, they've got very, very long arms and they reach all 52 00:03:22,160 --> 00:03:25,600 around the world with their samples and their dummies. 53 00:03:25,800 --> 00:03:29,800 So yeah, just a quick overview who we are and what we're up to. 54 00:03:30,560 --> 00:03:33,720 Yeah, you guys first came on to our radar because we saw that 55 00:03:33,880 --> 00:03:37,800 several winners of last year's 50 books, 50 covers competition 56 00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:41,720 had listed Arctic paper, Munkin as the paper stock that they 57 00:03:41,720 --> 00:03:44,080 were using for their books. And it's like, oh, wow, we see 58 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:46,800 something going on here. We want more designers to know 59 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:50,640 about the paper. But just a clarifying question. 60 00:03:50,640 --> 00:03:52,800 So there's Arctic Paper, which is the name of the company and 61 00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:56,800 then also Munkin design brand. Can you just clarify a little 62 00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:59,280 bit what that the sub brand relationship is there? 63 00:03:59,760 --> 00:04:02,280 Yeah. So Arctic Paper is the group 64 00:04:03,480 --> 00:04:05,400 making up made-up of the three meals. 65 00:04:05,760 --> 00:04:10,200 And then we have Munkadal, which is on the just north of 66 00:04:10,200 --> 00:04:14,520 Gothenburg in Sweden and that makes our Munken brands, which 67 00:04:14,520 --> 00:04:19,320 is Munken Design and Munken Book Premium and Print. 68 00:04:19,839 --> 00:04:22,680 And then on the north of Stockholm, the other side of 69 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:27,480 Sweden, we have Gritspo who makes coated products. 70 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:31,600 So that'd be known as the GG range and Arctic volume. 71 00:04:32,200 --> 00:04:36,880 And then just on the the border of Poland and Germany, we have a 72 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:42,800 Polish mill called Costrin and that makes our inkjet papers and 73 00:04:42,840 --> 00:04:46,840 our standard white offset free sheet paper. 74 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:49,440 Yeah. So you're truly a European 75 00:04:49,440 --> 00:04:52,000 company in that sense? Absolutely, Yeah. 76 00:04:52,120 --> 00:04:55,760 So and and say that, that that's our, that's our original base. 77 00:04:56,080 --> 00:05:00,600 But we've we've seen the market move so much further outside of 78 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:02,160 Europe, but still based in Europe. 79 00:05:03,240 --> 00:05:05,000 Yeah, we we have to move with those times. 80 00:05:05,680 --> 00:05:09,160 And so I know that you guys aren't on the design side of 81 00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:12,200 things directly, but you work with a lot of book designers and 82 00:05:12,520 --> 00:05:14,040 things like that. But just to get a little bit 83 00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:16,880 more about your own backgrounds and your careers, could you 84 00:05:17,120 --> 00:05:19,400 maybe introduce yourselves briefly and then we'll come back 85 00:05:19,400 --> 00:05:24,120 to the brand and the paper? My journey starts by mistake 86 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:28,160 really. I was at school and I was 87 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:33,200 looking for a part time job after school or at weekends and 88 00:05:33,320 --> 00:05:37,800 I knocked on the door of a local paper merchant to see if I could 89 00:05:37,800 --> 00:05:41,680 wash their their vehicles and their vans just for a bit of 90 00:05:41,680 --> 00:05:46,400 spare cash. It LED from there on to working 91 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:50,080 in the sample department, working into accounts, working 92 00:05:50,080 --> 00:05:55,840 on inside sales and it really opened my eyes up to paper. 93 00:05:56,760 --> 00:05:59,760 Before that it was saying you drew on, coloured on, printed on 94 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:02,600 in photocopiers. So it really sort of opened my 95 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:06,040 eyes. And from there I worked for a 96 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:08,840 number of other paper merchants in the UK. 97 00:06:08,840 --> 00:06:15,400 And around about 2000 I decided maybe I've had enough and I need 98 00:06:15,400 --> 00:06:19,720 to look outside the industry. And then I got a phone call from 99 00:06:19,720 --> 00:06:23,200 an old boss who had just joined Arctic Paper. 100 00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:27,600 And he said, Rob, I've got a four year project. 101 00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:30,560 We're looking to change the market, change how we sell to 102 00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:33,040 the market. We'd really like you on board. 103 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:37,160 And I said, yeah, yeah. OK, look, four years Max. 104 00:06:37,320 --> 00:06:39,360 I, I'm really, really looking for a change. 105 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:43,560 So here we are. So that was 2002. 106 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:47,640 Here we are in 2026, and I'm still here. 107 00:06:47,640 --> 00:06:50,480 Turned into 24 years. Yeah, absolutely. 108 00:06:50,480 --> 00:06:54,400 So I think, I think it just shows that having a great, great 109 00:06:54,400 --> 00:06:58,960 company and great products to sell, time absolutely flies. 110 00:06:59,200 --> 00:07:02,760 So yeah, it's it's sort of flowing past. 111 00:07:02,760 --> 00:07:05,560 But yeah, that's how I got into paper and I'm still in paper and 112 00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:07,120 I love it, absolutely love it so. 113 00:07:07,280 --> 00:07:10,600 So my background is a it's a little bit more, I don't know if 114 00:07:10,600 --> 00:07:12,360 it's better or worse or what have you. 115 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:18,920 But anyway, after leaving, well the run up to leaving college, I 116 00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:22,040 really wanted to travel but do it in a, in a constructive way. 117 00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:27,520 And I applied to as a charity. This is more how I got into 118 00:07:27,520 --> 00:07:30,000 sales that then led on to, to paper. 119 00:07:30,400 --> 00:07:33,840 Yeah, I went on selection weekend for, for Operation Rally 120 00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:38,080 and I got chosen to go to Africa for, for three months. 121 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:42,120 But part of that expedition before I went out to raise £3000 122 00:07:43,120 --> 00:07:46,520 to do that, I'd wrote to different companies close to by 123 00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:50,600 where I live and there was a there's a polythene producer who 124 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:55,320 I had to present myself to. And they said we like the sound 125 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:57,160 of this. But rather than give you money, 126 00:07:57,160 --> 00:08:03,800 we what we'll do is print around about 12,000 black refuse sacks 127 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:07,440 with British Fish Queen sponsors Andrew Curzon on Operation 128 00:08:07,440 --> 00:08:12,600 Rally, to which I then had to go out and sell door to door it. 129 00:08:12,600 --> 00:08:19,600 This was back in 199293. There was no Idi, couldn't go to 130 00:08:19,600 --> 00:08:21,000 the door with an ID card or anything. 131 00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:25,800 It was all presenting myself to a stranger, selling the product, 132 00:08:25,800 --> 00:08:29,080 selling why I was trying to raise the money and within no 133 00:08:29,080 --> 00:08:31,360 time at all that I raised the £3000. 134 00:08:31,360 --> 00:08:33,919 But I got real real buzz from it. 135 00:08:33,919 --> 00:08:36,159 Real. I love talking to people, I love 136 00:08:36,159 --> 00:08:39,080 the connection that if you sell the product well enough they 137 00:08:39,080 --> 00:08:41,640 would instead of giving you the set amount they would give you 138 00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:44,200 more. So this is all all good. 139 00:08:44,200 --> 00:08:48,120 So what when I came back from my year of travelling, knew I 140 00:08:48,120 --> 00:08:51,960 wanted to go into to sales. So from there I worked for a 141 00:08:51,960 --> 00:08:57,360 company called Gilba UK and I started lower down and I worked 142 00:08:57,360 --> 00:09:02,120 myself up to corporate account manager of ICI and Enron, big 143 00:09:02,120 --> 00:09:05,840 corporate companies. And I used to look after their 144 00:09:06,560 --> 00:09:10,000 all their stationary, all office furniture, all the computer 145 00:09:10,000 --> 00:09:13,280 consumables, but that also included printed literature, 146 00:09:13,280 --> 00:09:17,600 their corporate concept work. So then I became involved in 147 00:09:17,600 --> 00:09:20,080 paper printing, that sort of thing. 148 00:09:20,440 --> 00:09:24,240 And it was at that time Rob and his colleague came into Gilbert, 149 00:09:24,840 --> 00:09:29,680 presented the paper, the how things can change through 150 00:09:29,680 --> 00:09:32,880 different specs of paper, grammages, everything like that, 151 00:09:33,600 --> 00:09:34,960 which I found really interesting. 152 00:09:34,960 --> 00:09:38,920 I worked with Rob from an external side when I was spec in 153 00:09:38,920 --> 00:09:40,720 products for the accounts, which I looked after. 154 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:46,160 And then yeah, over the years kind of kicks, yeah, we, we kind 155 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:48,760 of clicked, kept in contact with each other, although working for 156 00:09:48,760 --> 00:09:52,920 separate companies. And then 2006, I think it was 157 00:09:52,920 --> 00:09:55,680 and Rob said we've got an opportunity in the North East of 158 00:09:55,680 --> 00:09:58,760 England. He would like to, to, to, to 159 00:09:58,760 --> 00:10:01,480 choose you for that, that role. So yeah. 160 00:10:01,480 --> 00:10:04,440 And then then went from there and again, similar to Rob that 161 00:10:04,880 --> 00:10:08,560 since 2006 to 2026, yeah, still here. 162 00:10:08,560 --> 00:10:12,480 So it's it's a great attribute to Arctic Paper and it's a 163 00:10:12,480 --> 00:10:16,160 company that always is forward thinking of of new products, new 164 00:10:16,160 --> 00:10:17,920 product development improvements. 165 00:10:18,320 --> 00:10:21,000 So yeah, real good. Real good. 166 00:10:21,680 --> 00:10:23,040 It's gone past, isn't it, 20 years? 167 00:10:23,600 --> 00:10:28,040 Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Wow I love how non linear 168 00:10:28,040 --> 00:10:31,080 somehow non linear careers you've had. 169 00:10:31,080 --> 00:10:34,920 Both of you in different. Ways, Yeah, yeah, definitely. 170 00:10:35,200 --> 00:10:37,680 It's it's been good fun along the way as well. 171 00:10:42,200 --> 00:10:45,720 As we move forward, we learned that Arctic Paper has 172 00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:49,760 collaborated with European design schools for more than 20 173 00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:52,080 years now. So students from Germany, 174 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:54,440 Norway, Sweden, Poland and the UK. 175 00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:59,600 We wanted to hear a little bit of how the selection process of 176 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:03,920 these schools and these students work and how was it for you to 177 00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:06,400 work with them throughout all this, this time. 178 00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:10,120 Just to touch on on the The Monk and Agenda, this is this is a a 179 00:11:10,560 --> 00:11:13,320 campaign that we as a company take really seriously. 180 00:11:13,560 --> 00:11:17,720 Collaborating with young creatives is extremely important 181 00:11:17,720 --> 00:11:21,760 to us to give us like new fresh perspectives of the design 182 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:24,920 generation which is coming through as a campaign itself. 183 00:11:24,920 --> 00:11:29,640 We print round about 14,000 copies of The Monk and Agenda of 184 00:11:29,640 --> 00:11:33,040 that year and that's every year that we we produce that. 185 00:11:33,040 --> 00:11:36,440 So it's something that we take really, really seriously because 186 00:11:36,440 --> 00:11:40,920 of this connection and and that what we do each year within each 187 00:11:40,920 --> 00:11:45,440 country we've got sales teams as Rob said, 13 offices throughout 188 00:11:45,440 --> 00:11:47,880 Europe. We've got sales teams within 189 00:11:47,880 --> 00:11:52,680 each country and they've got connections with our colleges, 190 00:11:52,680 --> 00:11:56,800 design universities already that as well as existing business 191 00:11:56,800 --> 00:12:02,080 that we we do look after. And we do focus on the next 192 00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:07,240 generation coming through the actual finalized choice because 193 00:12:07,680 --> 00:12:11,160 it's the choices through our marketing department that rather 194 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:13,800 than put everything through Norway, Scandinavia, that side 195 00:12:13,800 --> 00:12:16,200 of things we try. There's such demand from each 196 00:12:16,200 --> 00:12:18,800 country that can we do it because it's such a well known 197 00:12:19,000 --> 00:12:21,960 project and campaign. So we get requests from each 198 00:12:21,960 --> 00:12:26,520 country and from that our marketing team said right, OK, 199 00:12:26,520 --> 00:12:29,480 this year we'll put it through through Sweden, we'll put it 200 00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:32,960 through the UK. And from there the person 201 00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:36,280 responsible in each sales office then picks up the dialogue with 202 00:12:36,280 --> 00:12:39,080 the art college, with the design university. 203 00:12:39,760 --> 00:12:45,160 We then go in to present Arctic Papers company, our product 204 00:12:45,160 --> 00:12:49,600 portfolio and then the concept of the monk, an agenda itself, 205 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:53,880 the papers that are involved. What if if they wanted to use 206 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:56,000 any printing effects on that paper? 207 00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:58,920 You know that, that you know what they can, what the 208 00:12:58,920 --> 00:13:02,560 capabilities are, if you like the dimensions, the binding 209 00:13:02,560 --> 00:13:05,560 that's involved. And then basically it's it's 210 00:13:05,560 --> 00:13:08,480 down to the, the, the design students. 211 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:13,080 They've got a blank canvas and they can just use, use their 212 00:13:13,560 --> 00:13:17,920 creative imagination of how they perceive next year's agenda to 213 00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:21,800 be. And we just let them run run 214 00:13:21,800 --> 00:13:23,720 with that. Because this partnership has 215 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:27,800 been going on for I think around 20 years, I'm sure you've you've 216 00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:30,920 seen a lot of changes on how design is perceived and 217 00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:34,560 practiced throughout these years and throughout all different 218 00:13:34,560 --> 00:13:37,160 countries. I'm curious to hear from you, 219 00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:40,520 what do you think the current generation of designers? 220 00:13:40,520 --> 00:13:44,400 What is the big shift in the change that you've seen that 221 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:48,600 stand out to you? I've I've seen within, within 222 00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:53,200 the last two to three years that from from taking the monkey 223 00:13:53,200 --> 00:13:59,200 agenda as as a as a static tool of the agenda as a traditional 224 00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:04,960 split into days, months, weeks. In that in that kind of generic 225 00:14:05,080 --> 00:14:08,160 layout of an agenda, which which happened previous. 226 00:14:08,440 --> 00:14:10,960 But in the last two to three years, the layout is a lot more 227 00:14:10,960 --> 00:14:13,960 flexible. It's almost the gender is more 228 00:14:13,960 --> 00:14:17,560 than an agenda that can be used for note taking. 229 00:14:17,560 --> 00:14:23,920 I mean, for example, the last one, the 2025 copy was Calendar 230 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:27,520 as You Like It, which was designed by students from Hale 231 00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:32,880 at the university in Germany. And they, they use the concept 232 00:14:32,880 --> 00:14:36,920 of you're free to the way it was laid out there could circle 233 00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:40,160 dates, days within each, each week, each month. 234 00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:46,600 And one week, one month could take 10 pages, whereas during a 235 00:14:46,600 --> 00:14:49,000 quieter month it could take 2 to 3 pages. 236 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:53,800 So, and that, that would leave enough space to like notice 237 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:58,400 during meetings, sketches, ideas, scribbles, but then 238 00:14:58,400 --> 00:15:02,400 there'd be no wasted pages throughout the agenda because it 239 00:15:02,400 --> 00:15:05,680 would eventually, you know, fill, fill, fill up. 240 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:09,360 So, so that's, that's the kind of main switch that it's, it's 241 00:15:09,360 --> 00:15:13,240 more than an agenda now. It's more fluid, more flexible, 242 00:15:13,800 --> 00:15:15,160 which is which is great to say. Yeah. 243 00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:16,240 I. Think also, you know, 244 00:15:17,160 --> 00:15:21,080 everybody's using their phones or, or their, or their iPads or 245 00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:25,240 whatever. So it's not necessarily for a, a 246 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:30,160 diary or for your making your, your, your meeting appointments. 247 00:15:30,440 --> 00:15:33,960 It's more of a, a working tool. And we've certainly seen that 248 00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:36,880 come through the last two or three years of, yeah, people 249 00:15:37,120 --> 00:15:40,880 just still using paper, but not necessarily just the writing 250 00:15:40,880 --> 00:15:44,200 down meeting with Arctic at 2:00. 251 00:15:44,200 --> 00:15:48,000 It's it's a working tool. And yeah, certainly that's what 252 00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:48,560 I was saying. Yeah. 253 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:49,520 Yeah. So you lost cuts. 254 00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:51,960 Absolutely. And I think just another thing 255 00:15:51,960 --> 00:15:56,280 that it's always quite interesting to see the ideas 256 00:15:56,280 --> 00:15:58,200 that come from country to country. 257 00:15:59,280 --> 00:16:05,240 How can a newer new idea, you know, come about and in it was 258 00:16:05,560 --> 00:16:09,560 20/20/21. the IT was in London. Yeah. 259 00:16:09,640 --> 00:16:13,720 So I worked with the University of Chelsea College of Arts 260 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:15,320 there. It was 2021. 261 00:16:15,320 --> 00:16:18,400 So we were in the midst of COVID, in the midst of lockdown. 262 00:16:18,880 --> 00:16:22,160 And so it was all difficult. Everything was done by digital 263 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:25,880 meetings. And anyway, the, the theme that, 264 00:16:25,880 --> 00:16:30,520 which they came up with was the power of colour and colour 265 00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:34,720 breathing and checking in with people's, you know, kind of 266 00:16:34,720 --> 00:16:38,600 well-being during that period. And it was just really 267 00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:41,680 interesting of this, this technique that psychologists use 268 00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:44,840 of this breathing technique. And it was checking in at the 269 00:16:44,840 --> 00:16:48,680 end of each week, each month. And it was, it was, yeah, it 270 00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:51,400 was, it was great. And I mean, certainly from the 271 00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:54,480 monk inside, it was a great illustration as well because it 272 00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:58,560 was a pair of colour that it was a great illustration of how monk 273 00:16:58,560 --> 00:17:03,160 and design can perform with, with all colours, how it 274 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:06,640 performs prints on paper. So it works, you know, both, 275 00:17:06,640 --> 00:17:09,119 both sides as well. And then, then there's then 276 00:17:09,119 --> 00:17:13,240 there's been fun elements making the agenda quite playerful, 277 00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:16,880 quite interactive. There's gridded systems that 278 00:17:16,880 --> 00:17:19,440 works with typography. So there's all different 279 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:24,480 elements, which it's brilliant to see how different countries 280 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:28,840 you know, work with, with a with a blank medium of paper. 281 00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:32,600 Yeah, I love that. My next question was actually 282 00:17:32,600 --> 00:17:37,440 speaking about like living in a digital screen first era and how 283 00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:40,120 what is the biggest misconception of the young 284 00:17:40,120 --> 00:17:44,800 designers about print today? So you mentioned that they were 285 00:17:44,800 --> 00:17:47,480 able to work well, especially like during the pandemic that 286 00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:51,320 they had to adapt on the project that they were working with. 287 00:17:51,560 --> 00:17:55,160 But is there anything that you feel that Monk and Agenda 288 00:17:55,360 --> 00:17:58,520 challenged them to rethink the medium, the paper medium? 289 00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:03,760 Yeah, I mean, I, I, I think like the misconception with with the 290 00:18:03,760 --> 00:18:08,480 younger creatives coming through is that print is quite static, 291 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:14,360 it's secondary and it's got limited engagement because 292 00:18:14,360 --> 00:18:18,440 obviously the world in which we live, everything is instant, 293 00:18:18,440 --> 00:18:21,840 instant messaging, everything is done on the screen. 294 00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:27,440 But I think the monk and monk and agenda, it's, it's like 295 00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:31,560 we're not, we're not trying to compete against digital media 296 00:18:31,560 --> 00:18:34,840 with it's a different, different kind of solution to the 297 00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:39,840 communication with, with, with the, with the agenda itself. 298 00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:44,920 And I think by involving the younger generation in in the 299 00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:51,240 layout of the the agenda, the print on paper, it's kind of 300 00:18:51,440 --> 00:18:55,120 interaction with using different weights, the tactile side of 301 00:18:55,120 --> 00:18:58,680 things, how how a pen which you're writing on the agenda, 302 00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:02,640 how the pen interacts with the paper, how it falls, how it how 303 00:19:02,680 --> 00:19:05,360 it lays, lays, you know, when you're opening the page up. 304 00:19:05,560 --> 00:19:09,880 So there's a lot of those things which agenda just kind of gives 305 00:19:09,880 --> 00:19:13,440 astute like those things that perhaps we take a second nature 306 00:19:13,440 --> 00:19:15,400 there. It brings to the forefront of 307 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:18,160 those those minds. And I think it's, yeah, it's 308 00:19:18,160 --> 00:19:21,200 something that digital side perhaps you know, is limited 309 00:19:21,200 --> 00:19:26,040 obviously that we offer students through this, this campaign. 310 00:19:26,320 --> 00:19:28,720 That's great. I think that's a great 311 00:19:28,720 --> 00:19:33,160 opportunity for them to to explore how, you know, the 312 00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:37,840 physical materials still, how they're still very important. 313 00:19:38,760 --> 00:19:43,600 And Speaking of that, as Lucia mentioned, we have AIJ has a 314 00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:48,360 legacy design competition called 50 books, 50 covers that is now 315 00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:52,480 more than 100 years old. And we know that some of the 316 00:19:52,480 --> 00:19:56,880 winners every year, they use Monk and papers and we wanted to 317 00:19:56,880 --> 00:20:00,240 hear from you like we know that they choose the the the paper 318 00:20:00,240 --> 00:20:04,400 because of its quality and the versatility that offers. 319 00:20:05,760 --> 00:20:10,560 What do you think is specially valuable for designers to you to 320 00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:15,200 use Monkham papers? And also, what do you think is 321 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:21,240 the role that the paper plays in creating a meaningful experience 322 00:20:21,240 --> 00:20:23,800 for today's designers but also readers? 323 00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:27,120 Well, first of all, it's great that some of your winners have 324 00:20:27,120 --> 00:20:31,520 used Munkan in the past. So thank you to everybody who's 325 00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:33,080 done that. That's, that's great. 326 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:40,440 I think we've flat, flat screen, you know, we live with it 24 327 00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:43,960 hours a day, near enough for personal and for work. 328 00:20:45,360 --> 00:20:50,000 But I think there there is a a point where there's an 329 00:20:50,000 --> 00:20:55,880 importance for a physical book, physical brochure which you can 330 00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:57,880 hold in your hands. You can smell. 331 00:20:58,120 --> 00:21:00,280 You can touch, you can feel the natural product. 332 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:06,160 It's a little bit like when ebook first come out, they said 333 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:10,000 it's the end of the physical book, bit like the paperless 334 00:21:10,000 --> 00:21:12,840 office. And that's not necessarily the 335 00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:16,400 case. People's lives are so busy, they 336 00:21:16,520 --> 00:21:20,520 we all need a little bit of downtime and to take that into a 337 00:21:20,520 --> 00:21:25,280 book, stepping away from the screens, it's, it's really 338 00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:28,520 important, but I think it's to have a quality book. 339 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:34,440 People want to experience the imagery, the text literally 340 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:38,200 jumping off the page rather than just reading it from a screen. 341 00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:44,760 And that's really where for us, Monk and design comes in because 342 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:47,040 it's a, it's a natural feeling product. 343 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:52,000 It's an uncoated product, but it's designed for for colour 344 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:55,960 printing. So really the the imagery 345 00:21:55,960 --> 00:22:01,400 literally jumps off the page and you can keep it forever. 346 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:05,000 You can put it on your bookshelf or pass it to a friend. 347 00:22:05,280 --> 00:22:09,800 So yeah, I think that's really the importance of a physical 348 00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:13,080 product, which just gives you a break from the screen as well. 349 00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:15,480 Sorry, just to add on on Rob's point there. 350 00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:18,080 I mean, Rob's, you know, kind of talking about the book side of 351 00:22:18,080 --> 00:22:22,720 things from, from the like your creative or the company 352 00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:28,040 background is, you know that the Internet is, is a great tool for 353 00:22:28,080 --> 00:22:34,200 for getting messages out there. But on the on the web, you know, 354 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:37,520 you can look at a company, you can look at the information 355 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:40,400 which you need, but within a click, within a second, you can 356 00:22:40,400 --> 00:22:44,240 click onto another company and another company and another. 357 00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:48,160 It almost becomes, you know, becomes a, becomes a commodity. 358 00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:53,440 Whereas something you know, a great paper, a great print on 359 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:57,280 paper means so much more. You know, a beautiful piece of 360 00:22:57,280 --> 00:23:01,240 printed literature that is something that's like the brand 361 00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:02,920 in hand. You can, you can, you can see 362 00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:04,240 it, you can feel it, you can touch it. 363 00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:06,840 You get the feeling, you get the, the reaction back. 364 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:14,280 I think companies and and pieces like this, those are the ones 365 00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:18,160 that people remember, those you want to keep you, you won't 366 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:22,120 forget them. But I think, yeah, digital side 367 00:23:22,120 --> 00:23:28,080 works well, but then the printed side also is needed to to create 368 00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:34,800 that that reaction. So we've been talking about the 369 00:23:34,800 --> 00:23:38,280 relationship between your paper and with designers, design 370 00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:40,160 education, as well as with readers. 371 00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:43,400 I wanted to pivot a bit and talk about the relationship between 372 00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:46,440 paper and the environment, with nature. 373 00:23:46,600 --> 00:23:49,320 This is important now more than ever perhaps. 374 00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:54,640 But can you tell us about Mookin and Arctic papers, commitment to 375 00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:56,880 sustainability and your relationship with all that? 376 00:23:57,400 --> 00:24:01,440 We are, we are very lucky. We get to visit our meals quite 377 00:24:01,440 --> 00:24:05,400 regularly and they are all in beautiful, beautiful locations, 378 00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:10,680 normally by rivers or lakes or everything in forestry. 379 00:24:10,960 --> 00:24:14,440 It's absolutely beautiful. So, so the environment has 380 00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:19,360 always been at the forefront of Arctic paper, not only because 381 00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:23,520 we're ticking boxes because of what the, the governments are 382 00:24:23,520 --> 00:24:26,000 pushing upon us or what people's perception is. 383 00:24:26,360 --> 00:24:30,720 It's about looking after our own environment and our, and our own 384 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:34,120 local areas. So it's a bit of a, a win win 385 00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:38,680 really. So we, we have many, many 386 00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:45,120 accreditations, one being cradle to cradle, which reaches across 387 00:24:45,400 --> 00:24:50,560 many industries from housing, house building to paper 388 00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:53,720 production. And it's so important to show at 389 00:24:53,840 --> 00:25:00,280 every stage the finished product is taking the environment into 390 00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:04,520 consideration. So it's the whole process, not 391 00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:08,640 just the end use. But that's just one part of our 392 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:11,960 journey. Monkadal, for example, was one 393 00:25:11,960 --> 00:25:17,960 of the first meals to offer FSC for a, for a paper choice. 394 00:25:18,400 --> 00:25:25,760 And I, I really see currently that CO2 is the, is the buzz at 395 00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:27,600 the moment. Everyone's concerned about the 396 00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:32,520 CO2 emissions. And with that in mind, Moncadol 397 00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:38,480 has just reinvested into a whole new boiler system where we will 398 00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:42,720 be burning wooden pellets to power our machines. 399 00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:47,800 And alongside that, we've got our other meal in Sweden, which 400 00:25:47,800 --> 00:25:52,400 is a heavy investment into a whole new manufacturing plant, 401 00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:57,080 taking wood dust from the sawmills, turning it into a wood 402 00:25:57,080 --> 00:26:02,160 pellet to power the machines. So it's a real there again, it's 403 00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:07,880 that whole cycle of from a, from a sawmill waste, we're taking it 404 00:26:07,880 --> 00:26:11,840 into energy to power the machine to make the paper etcetera, 405 00:26:11,840 --> 00:26:13,960 etcetera. As you're really using like 406 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:18,520 every part of the tree. Yeah, Yeah, it is. 407 00:26:18,800 --> 00:26:22,360 It really is closing that closing that loop and I think 408 00:26:22,680 --> 00:26:27,040 the next part and it's really important for AI believe for a 409 00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:28,760 paper production is. Not just to. 410 00:26:28,760 --> 00:26:33,520 Look at what we're doing today or what is, is, is is expected 411 00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:35,600 of us. It's what's coming next. 412 00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:37,520 You know, keep looking, looking forward. 413 00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:44,160 And I personally see water consumption is going to be the 414 00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:46,400 next buzz. How much water? 415 00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:50,320 And water is so heavily used within paper production. 416 00:26:51,360 --> 00:26:53,440 It really matters. Obviously, we're all taking it 417 00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:56,280 from the rivers. We're using it, cleaning it, 418 00:26:56,480 --> 00:26:59,040 putting it back to the river. But if you can use less and less 419 00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:02,040 of it to produce the paper, that's got to be good. 420 00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:06,120 For the environment and. Again, Monkadal has has been a 421 00:27:06,120 --> 00:27:11,440 stand out in this area where the average is about 10. 422 00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:16,120 Ten Yeah, 10. 1010 to 11 cubic litres of water per tonne of 423 00:27:16,120 --> 00:27:20,320 paper. Monkadal uses 3 to 4. 424 00:27:20,880 --> 00:27:23,880 So again, we're, we're looking, we're, we're not just on the 425 00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:26,840 curve, we're looking above the curve and looking at what's 426 00:27:26,840 --> 00:27:29,800 next. So it's, it's vitally important 427 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:31,680 to us, the environment. I think. 428 00:27:31,680 --> 00:27:33,720 I think as well. Sorry, just from like my point 429 00:27:33,720 --> 00:27:37,960 as well, when I take and users and customers out to the mill, 430 00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:42,200 what comes across as certainly the feedback from from the 431 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:48,360 customers is that the, the, the knowledge of within Monkadal 432 00:27:48,360 --> 00:27:51,080 paper mill, it's it's not something that you punch in 433 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:53,840 numbers and get you put in, pull up one end and get paper out the 434 00:27:53,840 --> 00:27:55,800 other end. It's generations of knowledge 435 00:27:56,200 --> 00:27:59,000 that being passed through to family generations that work 436 00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:01,840 there. So therefore that the Mukadal 437 00:28:02,360 --> 00:28:06,840 small town, which is positioned close to the mill there goes to 438 00:28:06,840 --> 00:28:09,880 great lengths to look after the environment surrounding the 439 00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:11,160 mill. So they make sure the water's 440 00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,240 clean going out into the fjord, etcetera. 441 00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:17,880 Not, not, not just for like accreditations that side of 442 00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:21,800 things, but more for that. That is where they live, the 443 00:28:21,800 --> 00:28:25,280 fjord where the, the, the, the town is situated next day. 444 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:30,840 They want to make sure everything is, is at the best 445 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,840 possible level so that weekends they can take their families 446 00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:36,360 swimming. And if you're go sailing, go 447 00:28:36,360 --> 00:28:38,400 fishing, those kind of activities. 448 00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:42,240 And that's that comes across time and time and again from 449 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:44,440 taking customers out. Perhaps we. 450 00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,880 Take a little bit for granted now, but it's certainly the 451 00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:52,280 vision that people see when coming across to to Munkadar. 452 00:28:52,800 --> 00:28:56,760 Well, yeah, you could really feel like that commitment to to 453 00:28:57,400 --> 00:29:00,320 sustainability if you're like, literally, you know, swimming in 454 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:01,600 the lake, right? Yeah. 455 00:29:01,600 --> 00:29:04,440 Yeah, absolutely. Swedish people are so, yeah, 456 00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,120 this is what we do. This is, this is our life. 457 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:10,320 This is. Yeah, why would you want to swim 458 00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:11,600 in a Yeah, dirty. Night. 459 00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:14,360 Yeah, it's like literally your backyard in that sense, right? 460 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:17,560 And so like, you're going to want to protect it and make sure 461 00:29:17,560 --> 00:29:20,640 that it is sustainable. Absolutely, yeah. 462 00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:28,600 Earlier, we discussed about how design often involves 463 00:29:28,600 --> 00:29:31,760 negotiating between the digital version and the physical 464 00:29:31,760 --> 00:29:36,320 constraints. Uncoded papers offer a unique 465 00:29:36,320 --> 00:29:41,120 tactile so the physicality and its beauty, but it also 466 00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:43,360 represents presents some challenges. 467 00:29:43,600 --> 00:29:46,400 So what do you think are the most common challenges that 468 00:29:46,400 --> 00:29:50,920 designers face when they have to translate the the digital files 469 00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:55,720 to uncoded papers? And how do you think Monkan 470 00:29:56,040 --> 00:30:00,320 papers help bridge the gap to ensure that the final printed 471 00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:06,280 result in the in the physical book is what the designers 472 00:30:06,280 --> 00:30:08,200 actually expected from the beginning I. 473 00:30:08,440 --> 00:30:11,880 Think that's where we as a as a paper company try and try and 474 00:30:12,120 --> 00:30:16,400 bridge the gap between design, printer and end user. 475 00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:19,840 So we try and bridge that gap of expectation and what's needed. 476 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:26,800 I think the common challenge from from the designer side is 477 00:30:26,800 --> 00:30:29,200 obviously there. The design side is, is on the 478 00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:34,040 screen, it's in RGB, which has got a wide gamut of, of colours. 479 00:30:34,400 --> 00:30:42,240 And for that then to be printed on uncoated paper in CMYK, which 480 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:45,760 is a more limited gamut of, of, of colours there. 481 00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:51,400 So to ensure that like the images hold true and they're not 482 00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:54,680 darkened or flattened. This is where we, we link in 483 00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:58,080 with the, the printer to use their knowledge and experience 484 00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:04,200 to use their software to then translate what they see on the 485 00:31:04,200 --> 00:31:07,640 screen onto uncoded paper to the best level possible. 486 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:12,400 So, so we, we try and link in all those, you know, aspects of 487 00:31:12,400 --> 00:31:16,880 knowledge to pull in to bring the best performance from the 488 00:31:16,880 --> 00:31:21,520 paper as from Arctic paper side, we, we've got specific ICC 489 00:31:21,520 --> 00:31:26,560 profiles, so profiling for printing on our monk and design 490 00:31:26,560 --> 00:31:32,680 grades, which give, you know, the correct colours to achieve, 491 00:31:32,720 --> 00:31:34,840 you know, the stable printed material. 492 00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:37,520 So we offer that as a from our side as well. 493 00:31:38,480 --> 00:31:42,560 But yeah, it's a combination of all different segments to ensure 494 00:31:42,560 --> 00:31:45,680 the best print result. And I'll say the Munkin design 495 00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:51,080 is is developed for for colour printing where a lot of uncut is 496 00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:55,160 single colour. So this way it you literally 497 00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:58,960 hold the ink dot the size as in what it should be. 498 00:31:58,960 --> 00:32:01,320 So you get a true colour and a true image. 499 00:32:01,680 --> 00:32:05,640 So it makes it really sharp sharp image which then 500 00:32:05,640 --> 00:32:07,440 translates to what you should see on the screen. 501 00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:11,160 It's so complex that I'm learning so much about paper 502 00:32:11,520 --> 00:32:15,640 paper production. We also learned that in 2020 503 00:32:15,680 --> 00:32:20,080 Arctic paper really released Monk and sons are free to use 504 00:32:20,080 --> 00:32:27,800 typeface and then in 2022 Monk and creator a web-based tool for 505 00:32:27,800 --> 00:32:30,200 animated type of typography experiment. 506 00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:35,000 So it's, I'm curious because it's not every day that we see a 507 00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:38,520 paper company building software products. 508 00:32:39,040 --> 00:32:43,120 So how do you think about these digital tools that the company 509 00:32:43,120 --> 00:32:46,720 created in the past years and that do you consider that they 510 00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:50,520 are like a Trojan horse to bring designers back to print? 511 00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:53,880 Or is it more like an acknowledgement that the future 512 00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:58,920 is of design per SE is certainly certainly somehow hybrid, 513 00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:02,280 Hybrid. I believe that that both digital 514 00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:05,520 and analogue can can can work together. 515 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:12,080 That's, you know, exactly the, the Monk and Sands font in 2020 516 00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:16,120 and then Monk and creator in 2022 when we tried to kind of 517 00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:19,120 embrace that through, through our, our campaigns. 518 00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:21,440 I mean, just to give you some, you know, some background on it, 519 00:33:21,440 --> 00:33:26,920 the Monk and Sands font in 2020. That was part of our monk and 520 00:33:27,200 --> 00:33:34,680 rebranding and it was kind of an acknowledgement to the to the 521 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:39,800 Triotex font, which was introduced our design by Cage 522 00:33:39,800 --> 00:33:44,920 Gustafson in Sweden and that that the font itself was used in 523 00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:47,800 Swedish Rd. signs. It's quite a distinct font that 524 00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:51,280 you see in Sweden. So it was almost like a nod, the 525 00:33:51,280 --> 00:33:56,560 monkey Santo and nod to Cage Gustafson and and the Traitex 526 00:33:56,560 --> 00:34:02,720 Traitex form the 48 forty, 488 page book to run alongside the 527 00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:08,360 the rebrand launch, which incorporated the possibilities 528 00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:14,400 of how to use the Monken sans phones, the background of the 529 00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:18,040 mill, it's environment, the people that work there, and also 530 00:34:18,440 --> 00:34:23,639 the actual piece, physical piece as a book to mark the rebrand of 531 00:34:23,719 --> 00:34:26,560 of Monken. Then in 2022, we launched the 532 00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:32,600 Monken Creator, which was another step forward in kind of 533 00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:36,639 working with digital media. And we worked with, you know, 534 00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:39,800 and a designer called Patrick Huber. 535 00:34:40,679 --> 00:34:44,880 And it had both the digital and analogue elements. 536 00:34:45,159 --> 00:34:50,679 And what that entailed was to work as an experimental platform 537 00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:56,159 with creative coding with Jennifer Design and allowed 538 00:34:56,159 --> 00:35:02,360 creators via a free web-based app to playfully experiment with 539 00:35:02,360 --> 00:35:07,000 the sans font itself, such as rotation, letter space, spacing, 540 00:35:07,200 --> 00:35:11,200 background, insertion, size, position, all those, all those 541 00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:13,520 connotations. And then secondly, to run 542 00:35:13,520 --> 00:35:16,560 alongside that, we produced a large printed piece. 543 00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:21,160 So we had digital and analog working hand in hand, hand in 544 00:35:21,160 --> 00:35:26,320 hand together. I think also it shows that we 545 00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:30,080 can't be scared of digital. It's here, it's what everyone's 546 00:35:30,080 --> 00:35:33,160 working with every single day. And we have to, we have to 547 00:35:33,160 --> 00:35:38,600 embrace it and just make sure that people are using both 548 00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:40,840 because there there is certainly a need for both. 549 00:35:42,240 --> 00:35:44,920 So if you shy away from it and you're scared of it, you're 550 00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:49,320 going to be left behind. And that's one thing Arctic 551 00:35:49,320 --> 00:35:54,360 isn't scared of is facing our our challenges and embrace it. 552 00:35:54,360 --> 00:35:57,200 Let's use it. The creators are using it every 553 00:35:57,200 --> 00:35:59,800 single day. So why not have a have a tool 554 00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:04,920 for them to use to promote paper and print and type font. 555 00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:08,000 So it's it all comes together, we're all in it together. 556 00:36:08,560 --> 00:36:11,400 Yeah, I love that. I think it makes sense to think 557 00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:15,640 about the the world needing both mediums. 558 00:36:15,640 --> 00:36:18,680 So yeah, making sure that we know how to navigate and work 559 00:36:18,680 --> 00:36:23,960 with both mediums is essential. On that note, I wanted to also 560 00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:29,760 as as we close this this block of questions, I wanted to check 561 00:36:29,760 --> 00:36:32,520 in terms of when we're speaking about the future of design. 562 00:36:32,520 --> 00:36:38,320 Do you think, do you believe high end book, paper physical 563 00:36:38,320 --> 00:36:42,360 books are going to become somehow a luxury item, so a 564 00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:49,440 niche similar to what the venue records are now or? 565 00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:53,080 Yeah, yeah, I that's, that's, that's a, that's a good point 566 00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:58,040 because I actually dusted off my vinyl records at Christmas. 567 00:36:58,520 --> 00:37:01,440 So they've been in, they've been in the cupboard since the 90s. 568 00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:04,640 So that, that, that, that was quite interesting. 569 00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:08,520 So yeah, that is quite a niche market, especially my music. 570 00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:12,480 So that was I'd. Say that my, my son, he's 20 and 571 00:37:12,480 --> 00:37:16,960 he's, he's got a record player now and he's take my old vinyl 572 00:37:17,440 --> 00:37:21,040 Oasis records, old classics. Now it's back. 573 00:37:21,240 --> 00:37:22,880 Yeah, it's back for sure. Yeah. 574 00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:27,280 So, yeah, with that in mind, I I, I really feel that the high 575 00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:32,120 end book or the high end book club does have that luxury niche 576 00:37:32,520 --> 00:37:36,000 following. We're actually seeing more and 577 00:37:36,000 --> 00:37:39,720 more publishers producing books to follow that trend. 578 00:37:40,080 --> 00:37:45,520 So making it a real masterpiece of like the binding, the covers, 579 00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:49,400 the text, really putting a lot of expense behind it to make it 580 00:37:49,400 --> 00:37:53,360 that luxury feel. And I think we've with any of 581 00:37:53,360 --> 00:37:59,120 these design projects, it's about storytelling and the human 582 00:37:59,120 --> 00:38:02,120 interaction. And that physical book supports 583 00:38:02,120 --> 00:38:05,320 both of those. So I really think that that is 584 00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:10,560 becoming the the niche and I think also with a book and the 585 00:38:10,560 --> 00:38:13,360 reason why it's becoming luxury pieces. 586 00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:16,480 But in the old days, we used to share books and we used to pass 587 00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:19,000 them on and pass them down the generations. 588 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:22,400 And we've sort of lost that a little bit. 589 00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:29,480 But by having that real quality feel, that real impact piece, 590 00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:33,000 it's, it's nice to share that book again, which I think is 591 00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:35,440 amazing. You know, I'm a paper nerd and a 592 00:38:35,440 --> 00:38:38,880 book nerd, but it is so nice to be able to share, share a 593 00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:43,440 quality book and pass it on. I think with Arctic Paper, it's 594 00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:48,520 it's always been our in our strategy to to promote best 595 00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:52,960 product, best high print results and caring for the environment. 596 00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:57,560 And this change in the book market has really sort of 597 00:38:57,960 --> 00:39:03,120 supported our vision. So yeah, everybody get on to 598 00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:06,080 buying quality books and passing it on to your friends and 599 00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:07,440 families. Wonderful and. 600 00:39:08,000 --> 00:39:09,080 And obviously your records, yeah. 601 00:39:15,640 --> 00:39:18,280 So throughout our conversation, we have been talking about 602 00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:22,120 different technologies for the sustainability of paper 603 00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:25,120 production, book design and and all of that. 604 00:39:25,120 --> 00:39:30,000 But we like to end our episodes with a future facing disposition 605 00:39:30,000 --> 00:39:32,800 and look. So two more questions to wrap 606 00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:36,720 up. 1 is AI, it's a hot topic. I don't know how you all are 607 00:39:36,720 --> 00:39:40,520 thinking about this in the context of your business of 608 00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:42,760 paper and and books Is this Yeah. 609 00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:45,040 Do you have any thoughts on AI and your business? 610 00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:51,080 Again, I can see AI compliments in digital media and the way 611 00:39:51,080 --> 00:39:53,960 that moves ahead. I think we're entering into, you 612 00:39:54,560 --> 00:39:57,440 know, it's an important period at the minute for the younger 613 00:39:57,440 --> 00:40:01,880 designers, younger creatives, education is extremely important 614 00:40:02,080 --> 00:40:06,960 at this period because in a world where everything is done 615 00:40:06,960 --> 00:40:11,280 by through screen etcetera, I think some of the the knowledge, 616 00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:15,440 the experience of transitioning that from the. 617 00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:18,520 Screen to. Print, if the education isn't 618 00:40:18,520 --> 00:40:23,960 there, then a lot of those skills will be lost of what can 619 00:40:23,960 --> 00:40:26,600 be achieved through through, through paper. 620 00:40:27,280 --> 00:40:30,560 As regards the print, print itself, yeah, obviously even in 621 00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:36,280 the last 20-30 years the volumes have have have dropped somewhat. 622 00:40:37,040 --> 00:40:40,880 But I think as regards print working in combination with 623 00:40:40,880 --> 00:40:44,600 digital, with AI, that there'll always be that need, there'll 624 00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:49,800 always be that that need for beautiful print, printed paper, 625 00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:52,600 it's truly important. Yeah, the basics on the 626 00:40:52,600 --> 00:40:54,760 timeless, right? There's a quote We we. 627 00:40:54,760 --> 00:40:59,000 With monk and creator, we, we worked with Patrick Uber, the 628 00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:02,000 creative on the monk and creator. 629 00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:04,840 And he does. I've got, I've just got a quote 630 00:41:04,920 --> 00:41:07,760 from Patrick that I think sums it up beautifully. 631 00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:10,560 If it's OK if I just share that with you guys. 632 00:41:11,160 --> 00:41:14,640 Driven by the question of how the mixture of data, human 633 00:41:14,640 --> 00:41:18,040 interaction, algorithms, artificial intelligence and 634 00:41:18,040 --> 00:41:21,680 storytelling can fundamentally transform the impact of 635 00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:25,960 communication design, I believe that paper can be the answer to 636 00:41:25,960 --> 00:41:28,840 this tension. In a world dominated by 637 00:41:28,840 --> 00:41:32,680 algorithms, an endless stream of content, and the pressure of 638 00:41:32,680 --> 00:41:36,360 immediate reaction, paper introduces a pause. 639 00:41:36,720 --> 00:41:39,720 It doesn't compete for attention through noise or speed. 640 00:41:40,160 --> 00:41:44,720 It offers focus, quiet, and a time for understanding. 641 00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:47,240 I think that's beautifully thought, much better than I 642 00:41:47,240 --> 00:41:49,160 could have thought. But I think that's a beautiful 643 00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:54,120 quote of summing up how how you know things things are moving. 644 00:41:54,760 --> 00:41:58,800 Yeah, that's a wonderful way to land this conversation. 645 00:41:58,800 --> 00:42:01,720 Just one final quick question for both of you guys about just 646 00:42:01,720 --> 00:42:04,280 the the near future of this year, 2026. 647 00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:07,880 Is there anything you're looking forward to, recent developments 648 00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:10,840 or things coming up either in the world of design or print or 649 00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:13,360 creativity in general, that you want to share with our audience? 650 00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:18,440 I think what we've seen over the last couple of years, I want to 651 00:42:18,440 --> 00:42:23,280 see more and more of is the new and upcoming creatives working 652 00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:26,560 with or embracing digital and physical print. 653 00:42:27,680 --> 00:42:31,680 That's absolutely what I want to see in the future and for this 654 00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:38,240 year and of course working with you guys, 2026. 655 00:42:38,240 --> 00:42:41,720 So it's going to be a good year. Looking forward. 656 00:42:42,720 --> 00:42:45,200 Absolutely, Yeah, I just echo what what Rob said. 657 00:42:45,200 --> 00:42:48,600 I think it's, I think the period that we're going through is, is 658 00:42:48,600 --> 00:42:53,720 exciting challenges, but there's excitement there of how how the 659 00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:59,320 industry evolves, adapts. Yeah, I think, yeah, good time 660 00:42:59,320 --> 00:43:00,880 to head. Well, Andy and Rob, thank you 661 00:43:00,880 --> 00:43:04,160 for sharing your time with us today and your insights about 662 00:43:04,160 --> 00:43:07,120 Arctic Paper and Munkin. We look forward to the 663 00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:09,360 collaborating with you all this year as well. 664 00:43:09,360 --> 00:43:12,160 And to our viewers and listeners, thank you for tuning 665 00:43:12,160 --> 00:43:15,600 in to another episode of the AIG Design Podcast. 666 00:43:16,000 --> 00:43:19,480 Hope you'll leave us a review or rating wherever you get podcasts 667 00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:22,560 or give us a like on YouTube. All right, see you next time. 668 00:43:22,720 --> 00:43:23,080 Bye.