1
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Very enlightened parents who 
were determined to breakdown 

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gender stereotypes gave their 
daughter trucks for her 4th 

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birthday and she was absolutely 
thrilled with the present and 

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took them off to her bedroom and
the parents came in and they put

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the trucks in bed and pulled the
covers up so that only the 

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headlights were showing. 
Same behaviors have been 

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deserved. 
Watching chimpanzees in the 

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wild. 
The juvenile female chimpanzee 

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is cradling the stick and 
pretending it's a baby. 

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Where's the juvenile male 
chimpanzee is whacking his 

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friend with the stiffest? 
The argument that the the 

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differences are socially 
constructed certainly can't be 

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00:00:33,480 --> 00:00:40,240
cool story. 
Hey guys, welcome back to the 

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00:00:40,240 --> 00:00:42,520
Lila Rose podcast. 
Today we have a special treat. 

15
00:00:42,520 --> 00:00:45,040
We're going to be having Doctor 
Leonard Sachs in studio. 

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00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:47,400
We actually talked with him 
before on the show about Boys 

17
00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:49,960
Adrift. 
Why is the modern world so tough

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00:00:49,960 --> 00:00:51,680
for boys? 
Why are they struggling so much?

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00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:55,440
Today with Doctor Sachs, who was
a family doctor, an MD and APHD 

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00:00:55,440 --> 00:00:58,840
in psychology, we are also going
to talk about why gender 

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00:00:58,840 --> 00:01:00,840
matters. 
He wrote about a book called Why

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Gender Matters back in 2005. 
It matters more than ever today,

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talking about the differences 
between boys and girls. 

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We're going to talk about the 
research behind why gender 

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matters and why boys and girls 
are, yes, news flash, different,

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as well as why it has gotten so 
chaotic today with the trans 

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ideology, so many young girls, 
over 35% of them identifying as 

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non straight, as queer or non 
binary or as lesbian. 

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What's driving that? 
And we're also going to talk 

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00:01:29,520 --> 00:01:32,320
about the importance on the 
power of intergenerational 

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formation and development and 
how we've lost that as a 

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society. 
I also have some hypotheses that

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I throw at Doctor Sacks and get 
his response. 

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Enjoy the episode and don't 
forget to subscribe to the show 

35
00:01:43,680 --> 00:01:46,720
if you aren't already. 
Support us on locals and Patreon

36
00:01:46,720 --> 00:01:48,280
so that we can keep the show 
growing. 

37
00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:50,680
And don't forget to subscribe to
the show if you aren't already 

38
00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:53,960
on podcast or on YouTube. 
And ring that notification bell 

39
00:01:53,960 --> 00:01:55,920
so that you never miss a new 
episode. 

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00:01:56,680 --> 00:01:58,880
Doctor Leonard Sachs, welcome 
back to the podcast. 

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00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:01,920
Thanks for inviting me. 
You were a very popular episode 

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00:02:01,920 --> 00:02:05,120
with you before talking about 
boys and their struggles in 

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modern in the modern world, but 
you've written a lot of other 

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00:02:07,720 --> 00:02:09,320
really important books. 
So I'm excited that we get 

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00:02:09,320 --> 00:02:11,760
another try at this. 
And thanks for coming in studio.

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00:02:12,320 --> 00:02:13,960
You're welcome. 
How was the travel in? 

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00:02:15,000 --> 00:02:17,800
Tiring. 
OK, well hopefully this will be 

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00:02:17,800 --> 00:02:20,960
a lively discussion that will 
keep us awake. 

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00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:23,760
All right, so for those that 
don't know you, maybe they 

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00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:25,960
haven't heard the last episode, 
are not familiar with your work 

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00:02:25,960 --> 00:02:27,840
yet, give us a little bit of 
your background as a 

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00:02:27,840 --> 00:02:32,280
psychologist. 
Well, I am first and foremost a 

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00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:34,320
family doctor. 
I'm a medical doctor. 

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00:02:34,320 --> 00:02:38,680
I earned my MD as well as my 
doctorate in psychology at the 

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00:02:38,680 --> 00:02:43,760
University of Pennsylvania. 
I am board certified in family 

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medicine and I am a practicing 
family doctor. 

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00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:48,760
I've been a family doctor for 
over 30 years. 

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00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:54,600
I have signed off on over 
120,000 patient visits over 30 

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years time. 
I'm also a PhD psychologist, 

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00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:00,600
which is little unusual for a 
family doctor. 

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00:03:01,480 --> 00:03:06,920
And that has given me, I think, 
a unique perspective in some of 

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the challenges that kids are 
facing, that families are 

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facing. 
So you've written several books 

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00:03:13,440 --> 00:03:17,000
and we've talked about one that 
focuses on the plight of boys, 

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00:03:17,360 --> 00:03:19,920
but there's a couple more that I
think are so timely and 

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00:03:19,920 --> 00:03:21,320
important. 
One of them is The Collapse of 

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00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:24,040
Parenting, the New York Times 
bestseller, and the other one is

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Why Gender Matters. 
You wrote Why Gender Matters. 

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You first wrote the 1st edition,
came out 2005. 

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OK, What inspired you in 2005 to
write a book called Why Gender 

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00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:37,320
Matters? 
Clearly we understand why it 

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00:03:37,320 --> 00:03:39,920
matters today, why we should be 
talking about why it matters. 

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00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:44,760
But what inspired that in 2005? 
So when I I attended public 

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schools in Ohio K through 12, 
and I vividly recall our high 

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00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:52,880
school honors assembly when I 
was a junior in 1976. 

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The the Honors Assembly, all the
kids who been recognized for 

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00:04:01,120 --> 00:04:03,560
outstanding achievement were up 
on the stage, and it was all 

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boys. 
The editor of the school 

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00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:08,320
newspaper, Andy Borowitz, was a 
boy. 

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00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:10,600
Andy has gone on to have an 
amazing career. 

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00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:13,640
He writes a column for the New 
York New Yorker magazine called 

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The Borowitz Report. 
He's a celebrity. 

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00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:20,160
He wrote Fresh Prince of Bel Air
for Hollywood. 

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00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:24,640
The editor of the poetry journal
was a boy. 

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00:04:24,640 --> 00:04:27,400
The editor of the yearbook was a
boy. 

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The there was all boys up on 
stage and there were people back

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00:04:32,080 --> 00:04:35,520
then, like notably Myra and 
David Sadker, 2 American 

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00:04:35,520 --> 00:04:39,880
researchers who were writing 
books called Failing at 

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00:04:39,880 --> 00:04:43,160
fairness, How Schools 
Shortchange Girls published in 

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00:04:43,160 --> 00:04:47,600
1994 based on their research in 
the 70s and 80s showing how all 

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the valedictorians are boys, all
the high achievers are boys. 

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Schools are failing girls. 
That's the world I grew up in. 

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That's how old I am. 
So then I graduated from Penn 

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with my doctorate in psychology 
and my medical degree. 

95
00:05:04,880 --> 00:05:06,880
I did a three-year residency and
family medicine. 

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00:05:06,880 --> 00:05:10,280
And then I started my own 
practice in Montgomery County, 

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00:05:10,280 --> 00:05:14,840
Maryland, just outside 
Washington, DC in 1990. 

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00:05:14,840 --> 00:05:19,240
And moving through the 1990s, I 
was like, boy, this, this place 

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00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:24,040
is really strange because when I
attended school in Ohio, the 

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high achievers were boys and, 
and now I'm seeing something 

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very different. 
I'm seeing families where the 

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00:05:30,920 --> 00:05:33,600
high achievers are girls and the
boys are goofballs who don't 

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00:05:33,600 --> 00:05:36,840
care and are not motivated. 
And my first thought is, what's 

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00:05:36,840 --> 00:05:38,560
wrong with Montgomery County, 
Maryland? 

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00:05:39,480 --> 00:05:44,600
But then in the late 90s, I 
began to reach out to colleagues

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00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:48,680
across the United States and 
back home in Ohio and other. 

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00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:51,920
And this is not confined to 
Montgomery County, Maryland. 

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This is a national phenomenon. 
What's going on? 

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What changed over a 
comparatively short period of 

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time for the mid 70s to the mid 
90s that flipped the script so 

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that suddenly girls were 
outperforming their brothers? 

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00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:11,320
Incidentally, it became very 
clear as I began to research 

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this. 
The gender gap was widening, 

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with boys falling farther and 
farther behind, not because 

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girls were doing better, but 
because boys are doing worse. 

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And so I began to look into 
this. 

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And that led to an article I 
wrote for the American 

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00:06:31,160 --> 00:06:36,480
Psychological Association 23 
years ago called Reclaiming 

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00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:39,280
Kindergarten, Making 
Kindergarten Less Harmful to 

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Boys, where I talked about how 
early education changed, how 

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kindergarten used to be about 
duck, duck, goose and singing in

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00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:50,840
rounds and going on field trips.
And by the year 2000, it was all

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00:06:50,840 --> 00:06:55,040
about literacy and numeracy and 
how that was immensely harmful 

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to boys. 
Because we now know that the 

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00:06:59,960 --> 00:07:03,000
language areas of the brain of 
the five year old boy look 

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00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:05,640
pretty much like the language 
areas of a three-year old girl. 

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00:07:05,640 --> 00:07:08,080
It's not developmentally 
appropriate to ask a 5 year old 

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00:07:08,080 --> 00:07:11,400
boy to sit still, be quiet, and 
learn about diphthongs for 40 

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minutes. 
I want to stop you right there 

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00:07:12,640 --> 00:07:16,280
because that's so fascinating 
and most people don't know that,

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especially in our world that's 
increasingly erasing gender and 

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the sex differences. 
So little boy's brain at 5 in 

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terms of its. 
The language area. 

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00:07:26,040 --> 00:07:28,000
It's language. 
Area areas of the brain develop 

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in a different sequence in boys 
compared with girls and. 

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Girls develop earlier is what 
you're saying and. 

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00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:35,760
That's. 
In some areas when it comes to 

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their language. 
Yeah, language. 

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The girls are way ahead of the 
boys. 

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And so I wrote this article, a 
scholarly paper, peer reviewed 

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scholarly paper for the American
Psychological Association, just 

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00:07:50,080 --> 00:07:54,640
really to get it off my chest. 
And to my surprise, it was 

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picked up by the national media 
of Richard Rothstein, who was 

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00:07:58,560 --> 00:08:01,600
the education columnist of the 
New York Times, wrote about it 

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00:08:01,600 --> 00:08:05,800
in his in the New York Times. 
And I was on television in in 

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00:08:05,800 --> 00:08:07,720
Canada. 
It was the front page of the 

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00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:10,280
National Post, which is Canadian
National newspaper. 

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And so I actually began to be 
invited to visit schools and I 

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00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:20,720
had visited a number of schools 
in in researching this question.

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00:08:20,720 --> 00:08:24,960
And and then I started speaking 
in more schools and was really 

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00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:29,920
struck by how the lack of 
awareness of gender differences 

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harms both girls and boys. 
And so that led me to write Why 

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00:08:35,760 --> 00:08:37,960
Gender Matters. 
A special thank you to our 

154
00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:40,840
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169
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Goodranchers.com So since then, 
a lot has changed. 

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00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:24,360
Mostly I would say not so much 
in the status of the fact that 

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00:09:24,360 --> 00:09:27,760
they're different biologically 
boys and girls, but in politics 

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00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:29,720
and culture and how we see boys 
and girls. 

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Let's breakdown. 
I'd love to hear you breakdown 

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for us. 
What are the differences between

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boys and girls? 
This is how it sounds like very,

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very well. 
I have a 7 hour workshop on that

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for teachers where we go through
all the differences and and how 

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those differences, what 
implications those differences 

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have for best practice in the 
classroom. 

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But OK, we'll take a stab at 
three top. 

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Three top differences. 
Developmentally. 

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Behaviorally. 
We'll try one and we'll see how 

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00:10:01,600 --> 00:10:08,120
we do with that. 
So I cite 12 studies in which 

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researchers have given young 
children of choice of playing 

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with a doll or a truck, 
basically a girl toy or a boy 

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toy. 
As I said, we have 12 different 

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studies that have done basically
this. 

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They're all the studies are a 
little bit different in how they

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did this and what toys they 
offered. 

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00:10:26,400 --> 00:10:30,360
But we have many, many different
studies over over many years, 

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00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:34,480
some recent, some going back 50 
years, in which researchers have

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00:10:34,480 --> 00:10:38,400
given little kids 3456 years of 
age a choice of playing with a 

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00:10:38,400 --> 00:10:40,760
doll or a truck. 
What do you find? 

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00:10:40,760 --> 00:10:44,280
You find that girls are somewhat
more likely to play with dolls 

195
00:10:44,280 --> 00:10:47,200
than they are with trucks. 
Boys are much more likely to 

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00:10:47,200 --> 00:10:49,000
play with trucks than they are 
with dolls. 

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00:10:49,000 --> 00:10:53,000
Now, this is not a new finding. 
40 years ago, I took a graduate 

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00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:55,920
seminar in developmental 
psychology with the late Justin 

199
00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:59,880
Aaron Fried at Penn. 
And we had a few of these 

200
00:10:59,880 --> 00:11:02,160
studies way back then. 
And Professor Aaron Fried asked,

201
00:11:02,160 --> 00:11:06,600
why is this? 
Why do 4 year old girls slightly

202
00:11:06,600 --> 00:11:08,400
prefer to play with dolls rather
than trucks? 

203
00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:10,920
And four year old boys greatly 
prefer to play with trucks 

204
00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:15,360
rather than with dolls. 
Professor Aaron Fried said it's 

205
00:11:15,360 --> 00:11:17,360
because of the social 
construction of gender. 

206
00:11:17,360 --> 00:11:22,000
We teach kids how to do gender. 
And by the time kids are 3-4 

207
00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:24,480
years old, girls have learned 
that they're supposed to play 

208
00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:26,480
with dolls rather than trucks. 
And so they do. 

209
00:11:26,480 --> 00:11:28,680
But the girls do spend some time
playing with trucks. 

210
00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:33,520
But Professor Aaron Fried said 
we send a much stronger message 

211
00:11:33,520 --> 00:11:36,200
to boys that boys absolutely 
we're supposed to play with 

212
00:11:36,200 --> 00:11:38,920
trucks and absolutely not for 
the Barbie doll. 

213
00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:41,800
And when I'm doing the 
presentation, we show the graph 

214
00:11:41,800 --> 00:11:45,520
and the boy picks up the the 
Barbie doll and drops it like a 

215
00:11:45,520 --> 00:11:47,760
hot potato. 
There's very little variation 

216
00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:50,640
among the boys. 
Very, very few boys spend any 

217
00:11:50,640 --> 00:11:52,680
time playing with Barbie dolls. 
Or. 

218
00:11:52,720 --> 00:11:56,680
They use it like 3 or the well, 
but in the studies that I'm 

219
00:11:56,680 --> 00:11:58,920
citing, they just don't play 
with it. 

220
00:11:58,920 --> 00:12:04,280
Yeah, I didn't question that 
notion of the social 

221
00:12:04,280 --> 00:12:06,760
construction of gender, and I 
don't know anyone who did back 

222
00:12:06,760 --> 00:12:10,080
in the 1980s. 
Back then, everyone agreed that 

223
00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:12,880
sex differences in the play 
preferences of young children 

224
00:12:12,880 --> 00:12:14,720
was due to the social 
construction of gender. 

225
00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:17,960
Why didn't anyone question that?
I'm just it it seems like it. 

226
00:12:18,120 --> 00:12:20,240
Seemed perfectly plausible. 
It just seemed plausible. 

227
00:12:20,680 --> 00:12:23,520
Jerry and Alexander, who was 
then at Yale, was the first to 

228
00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:28,760
to come up with the idea of 
giving the same idea to juvenile

229
00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:31,600
monkeys. 
Give juvenile monkeys a choice 

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of playing with dowell or truck,
and her findings have 

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00:12:35,360 --> 00:12:39,520
subsequently been replicated by 
Kim Wallen and colleagues at the

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00:12:39,520 --> 00:12:42,000
Yerkes Primary Research Center 
studying a different species of 

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00:12:42,000 --> 00:12:45,280
monkey, and as well as by 
Richard Ragam and colleagues 

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00:12:45,280 --> 00:12:47,160
observing chimpanzees in the 
wild. 

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00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:52,600
The female monkey slightly 
prefers to play with Dowell's 

236
00:12:52,600 --> 00:12:55,200
rather than the trucks. 
The male monkey greatly prefers 

237
00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:57,520
to play with trucks rather than 
dolls. 

238
00:12:58,200 --> 00:13:01,560
Now you could try to you could 
try to invoke you could try to 

239
00:13:01,560 --> 00:13:03,320
invoke the social construction 
of gender. 

240
00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:05,440
To explain that finding, you'd 
have to assert that the monkey 

241
00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:08,120
and authority is saying 
something like, now, son, don't 

242
00:13:08,120 --> 00:13:09,840
let me catch you playing with no
Dal. 

243
00:13:10,200 --> 00:13:12,640
But this does not happen. 
The monkey and authority is 

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00:13:12,640 --> 00:13:16,520
making paying no attention to 
the choices made by the juvenile

245
00:13:16,520 --> 00:13:18,440
and makes no difference. 
If you conduct a study in 

246
00:13:18,440 --> 00:13:22,040
isolation or or in the colony, 
you cannot plausibly invoke the 

247
00:13:22,040 --> 00:13:25,800
social construction of gender to
explain the fact that juvenile 

248
00:13:25,800 --> 00:13:29,040
monkeys, greatly juvenile male 
monkeys, greatly prefer to play 

249
00:13:29,040 --> 00:13:32,120
with a dull grey chalk than 
rather than a colorful doll. 

250
00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:37,600
And this finding has to be 
hardwired because it's observed 

251
00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:40,000
in four different primates, 
human, chimpanzee and two 

252
00:13:40,000 --> 00:13:43,920
species of monkey. 
Jerry and Alexander was the 

253
00:13:43,920 --> 00:13:47,000
first to document that finding 
in a non human primate and also 

254
00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:49,720
the first to propose a plausible
explanation. 

255
00:13:50,480 --> 00:13:53,560
And it's her explanation that 
many teachers have found useful 

256
00:13:53,560 --> 00:13:56,280
in creating gender aware 
instructional strategy. 

257
00:13:56,280 --> 00:13:59,760
So I do go into it in some 
detail in my book Why Gender 

258
00:13:59,760 --> 00:14:01,360
Matters. 
I have an appendix on this 

259
00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:04,040
topic. 
It turns out well. 

260
00:14:04,560 --> 00:14:07,000
Neuroscientists have known for 
40 years that there are two 

261
00:14:07,000 --> 00:14:09,840
visual systems in the brains of 
all higher primates, human, 

262
00:14:09,840 --> 00:14:13,000
chimpanzee and monkey. 
One visual system is looking for

263
00:14:13,000 --> 00:14:16,800
color, detail and texture. 
The other visual system is 

264
00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:20,240
looking for speed, change in 
direction, collision. 

265
00:14:21,320 --> 00:14:23,680
The what system and the where 
system is the way they're 

266
00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:26,440
sometimes referred to or the 
parvo cellular or the Magna 

267
00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:30,720
cellular or dorsal and ventral 
referring to their The fact that

268
00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:35,520
these are anatomically separate 
streams of information in the 

269
00:14:35,520 --> 00:14:38,200
human brain and in the brains of
monkeys and chimpanzees. 

270
00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:44,440
Jaron Alexander was the first to
argue 20 years ago that the the 

271
00:14:44,440 --> 00:14:47,240
P system, the system looking for
color, detail and texture, 

272
00:14:47,240 --> 00:14:50,840
predominates in females, and the
M system, the system looking for

273
00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:54,240
speed, collision, change in 
direction, greatly predominates 

274
00:14:54,240 --> 00:14:56,880
in primate males. 
You know, when she made that 

275
00:14:56,880 --> 00:15:00,920
argument 20 years ago, it was a 
conjecture, it was hypothesis. 

276
00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:03,560
But over the last 20 years, 
we've gotten a great deal of 

277
00:15:03,560 --> 00:15:06,480
research that provides strong 
support for her hypothesis. 

278
00:15:06,480 --> 00:15:09,560
For example, Katrina Almonds and
her colleagues in Germany taking

279
00:15:09,560 --> 00:15:14,240
slices through Hoc 5, that area 
5 of human occipital cortex 

280
00:15:15,520 --> 00:15:18,160
that's looking for speed, 
collision, change in direction. 

281
00:15:18,160 --> 00:15:21,280
Find you can take a slice 
through the human brain and Hoc 

282
00:15:21,560 --> 00:15:25,840
5 hold that slide up to the 
light, and say without error 

283
00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:28,760
whether that piece of brain came
from a man or a woman. 

284
00:15:28,760 --> 00:15:30,920
There is no overlap between the 
sexes. 

285
00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:34,480
The organization of the brain is
radically different at Hoc 5, 

286
00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:37,040
even after adjusting for any 
size differences. 

287
00:15:37,240 --> 00:15:40,560
So, so just to pause here for a 
moment, this is separate from 

288
00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:43,840
your, the structure, the fact 
that men are physically 

289
00:15:43,840 --> 00:15:46,440
stronger. 
It's a separate from, you know, 

290
00:15:46,600 --> 00:15:50,120
hormone changes in the body, 
estrogen versus testosterone. 

291
00:15:50,120 --> 00:15:53,160
You have more testosterone also 
leads from strength, maybe more 

292
00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:55,320
agility. 
This is just about brain 

293
00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:57,840
development. 
This is about the organization 

294
00:15:57,840 --> 00:16:01,200
of the brain. 
Yes, the visual system in the 

295
00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:05,880
brain. 
And Jaron Alexander has read my 

296
00:16:05,880 --> 00:16:09,400
discussion of her work, and 
she's given it her approval. 

297
00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:15,600
Why do girls slightly prefer to 
play with dolls rather than 

298
00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:16,880
trucks? 
Because girls have more 

299
00:16:16,880 --> 00:16:20,360
resources in that part, in that 
visual system that's looking for

300
00:16:20,360 --> 00:16:23,200
color, detail, and texture. 
So they're more interested in 

301
00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:25,600
things that have an interesting 
color, detail and texture. 

302
00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:29,920
Boys, Jerry and Alexander 
asserts, have more resources in 

303
00:16:29,920 --> 00:16:32,920
the magnicellular visual system,
the system that's looking for 

304
00:16:32,920 --> 00:16:34,920
speed, collision, change in 
direction. 

305
00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:38,440
Why do juvenile males, whether 
human, chimpanzee or monkey, 

306
00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:42,120
greatly prefer to play with a 
dull Gray truck rather than a 

307
00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:44,960
Barbie doll? 
Because it's got wheels. 

308
00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:48,360
It goes kaboom. 
Now at this point many people 

309
00:16:48,360 --> 00:16:51,760
are thinking, OK, I can see how 
this might be interesting if I 

310
00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:54,360
were on neuroscientist 
interested in sex differences in

311
00:16:54,360 --> 00:16:57,280
the visual system. 
But how does this help me to be 

312
00:16:57,280 --> 00:16:58,960
a better parent or better 
teacher? 

313
00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:02,120
Well then I said 5 studies in 
which researchers gave young 

314
00:17:02,120 --> 00:17:07,480
children a blank piece of paper 
and a box of crayons and said to

315
00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:10,319
each child, draw whatever you 
want. 

316
00:17:11,200 --> 00:17:14,760
What do kids draw when you give 
them a blank piece of paper and 

317
00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:18,319
a box of crayons? 
I have a study from the United 

318
00:17:18,319 --> 00:17:21,200
States, from England, from South
Africa, from Japan and from 

319
00:17:21,200 --> 00:17:23,119
Thailand. 
The girls everywhere draw 

320
00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:27,280
people, pets, flowers and trees.
Typically 2-3 or four arranged 

321
00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:29,240
on holes on the ground. 
Again, in the presentation I'm 

322
00:17:29,240 --> 00:17:31,680
showing the pictures that little
girls What age are. 

323
00:17:31,720 --> 00:17:36,640
We talking. 
Here Doctor 5678 and the girls 

324
00:17:36,640 --> 00:17:39,080
use 10 or more crayons for the 
predominance of red, orange, 

325
00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:41,600
yellow, green, mage and brown. 
The people are people, 

326
00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:44,600
recognizably people with eyes, 
hair and clothes. 

327
00:17:46,120 --> 00:17:48,600
What do boys draw on this 
parameter? 

328
00:17:48,600 --> 00:17:52,160
Boys form a bimodal distribution
of variance which is highly 

329
00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:54,880
kurtotic and skewed, which is a 
fancy way of saying the boys 

330
00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:58,000
form 2 clumps. 
In each of these five studies, 

331
00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:03,040
about 8% of boys, about one in 
12 boys draw pretty much what 

332
00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:05,600
the girls draw. 
They draw people, pets, and 

333
00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:08,200
trees. 
Turns out that boys who draw 

334
00:18:08,200 --> 00:18:10,840
people, pets and trees have a 
lot in common with other boys 

335
00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:13,200
who draw people, pets and trees.
They're at least three times 

336
00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:16,720
more likely than other boys to 
have allergies, asthma, or 

337
00:18:16,720 --> 00:18:20,040
eczema sufficiently severe to 
warrant ongoing consultation 

338
00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:22,360
with a physician. 
They may be athletic, but 

339
00:18:22,360 --> 00:18:24,320
they're not playing football or 
ice hockey. 

340
00:18:24,680 --> 00:18:27,880
They're playing tennis, track or
golf because they don't like to 

341
00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:29,680
hit and they don't like to be 
hit. 

342
00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:32,200
Is this the nerd 
stereotypically? 

343
00:18:32,360 --> 00:18:36,520
Indeed, and they are much more 
likely beginning in middle 

344
00:18:36,520 --> 00:18:39,680
school to become victims of 
bullying, because the favorite 

345
00:18:39,680 --> 00:18:42,200
game among middle school boys is
One boy comes up to their boy 

346
00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:45,280
and says, hey, how about I hit 
you as hard as I can and you hit

347
00:18:45,280 --> 00:18:48,360
me as hard as you can? 
This boy says, but I don't want 

348
00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:50,880
to hit you and I don't want you 
to hit me. 

349
00:18:51,160 --> 00:18:54,720
He runs off and boom, marks 
himself as a victim of bullying.

350
00:18:55,520 --> 00:19:01,200
What about the more than 90% of 
boys In each of these five 

351
00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:04,600
studies I just mentioned, more 
than 90% of boys do not draw 

352
00:19:04,600 --> 00:19:07,280
people, pets and trees. 
In each of these five studies, 

353
00:19:07,280 --> 00:19:10,120
more than 90% of boys are trying
to Draw Something radically 

354
00:19:10,120 --> 00:19:14,240
different, a scene of action at 
a moment of change, like a 

355
00:19:14,240 --> 00:19:17,440
monster eating an alien, a 
rocket smashing into a planet. 

356
00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:20,600
Human figures, if present, are 
often stick figures. 

357
00:19:20,600 --> 00:19:23,200
And I'm when I do the 
presentation, I'm showing you 

358
00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:27,480
these pictures of boys have 
drawn stick figures lacking 

359
00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:31,080
eyes, mouth, hair and clothes. 
The boys use 6 or fewer crayons 

360
00:19:31,080 --> 00:19:33,400
over the Browns of black, grey, 
silver and blue. 

361
00:19:34,440 --> 00:19:36,920
And again, Jerry and Alexander 
has read my chapter and she 

362
00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:42,960
agrees that most girls are 
drawing pictures that engage the

363
00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:45,720
parvo cellular visual system 
that have color, detail and 

364
00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:48,240
texture. 
The great majority of boys, more

365
00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:50,720
than 90% are trying to draw 
pictures that engage the 

366
00:19:50,720 --> 00:19:55,000
magnacellular visual system that
implies speed, collision, change

367
00:19:55,000 --> 00:19:57,360
in direction. 
That's true. 

368
00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:03,000
That implies hypothesis, namely 
that if more teachers understood

369
00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:07,600
these differences, we could 
break down gender stereotypes. 

370
00:20:07,600 --> 00:20:10,720
We could have 8 year old boys 
who love to draw just as much as

371
00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:13,680
girls do. 
And, and then I, when I'm doing 

372
00:20:13,680 --> 00:20:17,200
the presentation, I show the 
pictures that the kids draw. 

373
00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:23,320
And, and I asked the attendees 
to imagine that you're a teacher

374
00:20:23,320 --> 00:20:26,160
and you've got second graders 
and you ask them to draw 

375
00:20:26,160 --> 00:20:28,320
whatever they want. 
And here this girl has drawn. 

376
00:20:28,760 --> 00:20:31,240
Her and her little sister and 
her little Kitty and her 

377
00:20:31,240 --> 00:20:34,600
sister's friend and the teacher 
saying, oh, lovely, I love 

378
00:20:35,080 --> 00:20:37,680
wonderful, all the color and 
detail, texture. 

379
00:20:37,960 --> 00:20:40,640
Then she comes to this boy who's
just drawn a bunch of squiggles 

380
00:20:40,640 --> 00:20:42,280
and she says, what are you 
trying to draw here? 

381
00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:45,200
And he explains he's trying to 
draw a car crash at the moment 

382
00:20:45,200 --> 00:20:46,720
of impact. 
This car has been crushed 

383
00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:49,360
between these two. 
And the teacher says, you know, 

384
00:20:49,360 --> 00:20:51,600
Jason, a car crash that's really
violent. 

385
00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:53,360
People are going to get killed 
or paralyzed. 

386
00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:55,400
Look at Emily's picture. 
It's so nice. 

387
00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:57,640
No one's getting killed. 
You know, why do you have to 

388
00:20:57,640 --> 00:21:01,600
Draw Something so violent? 
And the unattended message that 

389
00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:05,320
boy is getting is the drawing is
for girls. 

390
00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:09,320
So I was visiting a second grade
classroom, and the teacher said,

391
00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:10,840
free time, you can do whatever 
you want. 

392
00:21:11,040 --> 00:21:13,080
And some of the girls were 
sitting and coloring, and one of

393
00:21:13,080 --> 00:21:15,520
the boys was running around the 
room making a buzzing noise. 

394
00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:17,000
And I got in his way and I 
stopped him. 

395
00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:20,120
I said how come you don't want 
to sit and draw? 

396
00:21:20,400 --> 00:21:23,360
And he said without hesitation 
he said drawings for girls. 

397
00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:27,240
And I'm sure the teacher never 
said drawing is for girls, but 

398
00:21:27,240 --> 00:21:29,320
you might as well have. 
Because by praising and 

399
00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:32,440
understanding pictures with 
color detail, textured faces, 

400
00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:36,000
but not really getting the point
of a picture that is all about 

401
00:21:36,000 --> 00:21:40,560
action, she is unintentionally 
sending the message the drawing 

402
00:21:40,560 --> 00:21:43,200
is for girls. 
The lack of awareness of gender 

403
00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:46,800
differences has the unintended 
consequence of reinforcing 

404
00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:50,920
gender stereotypes, because this
teacher, like most teachers, has

405
00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:55,120
received no formal instruction 
in sex differences in the kinds 

406
00:21:55,120 --> 00:21:57,320
of pictures that girls and boys 
want to draw. 

407
00:21:57,840 --> 00:22:01,120
She got one more boy who's 
decided the drawing is for 

408
00:22:01,120 --> 00:22:03,160
girls. 
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That's Seven weeks, coffee.com. 
So in that scenario, you just, 

423
00:22:43,120 --> 00:22:45,240
you just shared, you know, the 
got the boys running around, 

424
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:48,320
zooming around the classroom. 
You know, I've got 2 little very

425
00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:51,080
young boys and they're zooming 
up until the moment of bedtime 

426
00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:54,240
and they're just wrestling, 
fighting, jumping in the beds. 

427
00:22:54,240 --> 00:22:56,920
I mean, they've got so much 
energy constantly, constantly. 

428
00:22:57,480 --> 00:23:00,040
And you know, I always look at 
other friends who have girls and

429
00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:03,080
the girl has usually less 
energy, the little girl. 

430
00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:04,920
Is this a brain development 
thing? 

431
00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:07,520
Is this a biological system 
thing separate from the brain? 

432
00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:08,360
What? 
What is that? 

433
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:11,200
I would dispute you on the 
facts. 

434
00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:15,200
My daughter was and remains 
huge. 

435
00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:20,840
She was energetic and you have 
girls who are very energetic 

436
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:25,840
and, and my daughter absolutely 
at age 5 would be jumping off 

437
00:23:25,840 --> 00:23:30,320
the top of the couch, jumping 
off a 10 foot ledge onto the 

438
00:23:30,920 --> 00:23:34,600
floor below actually. 
And when I do that part of the 

439
00:23:34,600 --> 00:23:39,280
presentation, I show a picture 
of her admiring the cast, which 

440
00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:42,760
I applied when she jumped off 
the top of a nine foot jungle 

441
00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:46,080
jib and fell on her outstretched
hand and broke her wrist. 

442
00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:51,840
I casted her wrist so I I don't 
accept your claim on the facts 

443
00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:54,960
that boys are energetic and 
girls are less. 

444
00:23:54,960 --> 00:23:57,160
Perhaps I. 
Miss Maybe I'm mislabelling it. 

445
00:23:57,160 --> 00:24:01,240
What it is it fair to say that 
very young boys versus young 

446
00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:05,640
girls are more interested in 
wrestling and, you know, a 

447
00:24:06,120 --> 00:24:08,280
physical? 
Let me physical finish my 

448
00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:11,400
comment about drawing because 
that boy was running around the 

449
00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:15,760
room making buzzing noises and 
not drawing because the teacher 

450
00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:18,120
had no idea how to encourage him
drawing. 

451
00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:22,360
Margaret Paula Olafstadter 
overseas 17 schools across 

452
00:24:22,360 --> 00:24:26,000
Iceland K through 8 schools and 
she and her teachers know all 

453
00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:29,440
about sex differences in the 
visual system and how those 

454
00:24:29,440 --> 00:24:31,920
differences influence best 
practice in the classroom. 

455
00:24:32,240 --> 00:24:36,640
She sent 44 of her teachers from
Iceland to Chicago, IL to attend

456
00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:38,840
a 2 day workshop I hosted on 
this topic. 

457
00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:42,480
She then then sends sixty of her
teachers from Iceland to 

458
00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:46,280
Orlando, FL to attend a 280 
workshop I hosted on this topic 

459
00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:49,640
and then in my invitation she 
came to Houston to speak and 

460
00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:52,080
share her experience. 
She did a breakout session which

461
00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:58,480
I attended, and she told us that
in each of her 17 schools today,

462
00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:04,440
since the teachers have had this
training today when the teacher 

463
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:07,000
says free time, you can do 
whatever you want. 

464
00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:10,560
The boy's favorite activity is 
drawing. 

465
00:25:11,200 --> 00:25:13,400
Boys love to draw. 
Girls love to draw. 

466
00:25:13,400 --> 00:25:16,600
I don't believe there's any 
innate difference between girls 

467
00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:23,080
and boys and how much they would
like to sit and draw, but 

468
00:25:23,080 --> 00:25:26,040
there's a big difference in what
they want to draw and if you 

469
00:25:26,040 --> 00:25:29,720
don't understand that, you end 
up with what We have a country 

470
00:25:29,720 --> 00:25:32,080
where second grade boys think 
drawing is for girls. 

471
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:35,880
When you go to the College Board
website and you look to see who 

472
00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:37,720
took. 
Among high school kids who took 

473
00:25:37,720 --> 00:25:40,720
the Advanced Placement exam in 
art history last year, girls 

474
00:25:40,720 --> 00:25:43,840
outnumbered boys by more than 
three to 1, which is ironic in 

475
00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:46,720
view of the fact that most of 
the artists they're studying are

476
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:49,480
men. 
The lack of awareness of gender 

477
00:25:49,480 --> 00:25:52,880
differences has the unedited 
consequence of reinforcing 

478
00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:55,160
gender stereotypes. 
If teachers don't have this 

479
00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:57,720
training, you end up with boys 
running around the room making 

480
00:25:57,720 --> 00:26:00,560
buzzing noise while the girls 
are coloring. 

481
00:26:01,240 --> 00:26:04,960
And again, Margaret Paula 
Alstotter is a great believer in

482
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:08,480
what she calls dare training. 
Getting girls to run around, 

483
00:26:08,480 --> 00:26:12,800
jump off things, walk on stones 
and their bare feet. 

484
00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:18,120
Because girls love to do that. 
If you encourage them, if you 

485
00:26:18,120 --> 00:26:20,720
understand gender differences, 
you can breakdown gender 

486
00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:25,800
stereotyes and the girls will be
running U and down on on the 

487
00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:28,560
beach and the boys will be 
sitting and drawing. 

488
00:26:29,160 --> 00:26:32,000
So, so you think that it is a 
gender stereotype and not a 

489
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:36,520
truth about gender that, you 
know, small boys versus small 

490
00:26:36,520 --> 00:26:40,480
girls are more interested in 
things like wrestling and. 

491
00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:45,400
Well, wrestling per SE, there is
some evidence to support your 

492
00:26:45,400 --> 00:26:47,160
claim. 
OK, when you're talking 

493
00:26:47,280 --> 00:26:51,760
specifically about simulated 
combat is going to appeal to 

494
00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:53,520
boys, but. 
Or. 

495
00:26:54,080 --> 00:26:59,760
Yeah, using using toys as guns 
or energetic girls can be very 

496
00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:03,880
energetic and should be and. 
It was a bad word. 

497
00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:06,440
But they channel the energy in 
different ways. 

498
00:27:06,840 --> 00:27:10,040
That makes sense. 
So when you see a small child, 

499
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:12,840
let's move from drawing to 
wrestling. 

500
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:16,080
Or you know, using a toy as a 
gun as opposed to what maybe the

501
00:27:16,080 --> 00:27:18,800
toy might be for. 
I see. 

502
00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:22,200
My impression has been that is 
usually more prevalent amongst 

503
00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:24,000
males. 
Why is that? 

504
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:27,720
So indeed, and why gender 
matters, I share a story from my

505
00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:32,360
own practice when very 
enlightened parents who were 

506
00:27:32,360 --> 00:27:39,160
determined to breakdown gender 
stereotypes gave their daughter 

507
00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:43,920
trucks for her for her 4th 
birthday and and she was 

508
00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:47,200
absolutely thrilled with the 
present and took them off to her

509
00:27:47,200 --> 00:27:50,120
bedroom. 
And the parents came in a few 

510
00:27:50,120 --> 00:27:53,760
minutes later and the daughter 
said they're sleeping. 

511
00:27:54,200 --> 00:27:56,800
She put the trucks in bed and 
pulled the covers up so that 

512
00:27:56,800 --> 00:27:58,160
only the headlights were 
showing. 

513
00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:00,800
And the. 
These enlightened parents 

514
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:07,200
likewise gave their son a doll 
which he used as a weapon and as

515
00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:10,840
a projectile, but did not use 
the doll as it was intended to 

516
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:15,880
be used. 
And again, these the same 

517
00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:20,480
behaviors have been preserved by
Richard Wrangham watching 

518
00:28:20,480 --> 00:28:25,400
chimpanzees in the wild. 
The juvenile female chimpanzee 

519
00:28:25,400 --> 00:28:28,720
is cradling the stick and 
pretending it's a baby, whereas 

520
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:32,080
the juvenile male chimpanzee is 
whacking his friend with a 

521
00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:34,960
stick. 
So the argument that these 

522
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:40,400
differences are are socially 
constructed, while it may have 

523
00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:43,960
some truth, it certainly can't 
be the whole story because we 

524
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:48,840
observe this same pattern of 
behavior in chimpanzees and in 

525
00:28:48,880 --> 00:28:52,520
juvenile monkeys. 
These same sex differences 

526
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:56,400
observed in other species that 
do not construct gender in the 

527
00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:59,720
way that humans do. 
So for the boy then that's using

528
00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:03,280
the toy as a projectile or as a 
weapon versus the girl who might

529
00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:05,880
take a toy that is designed to 
look like a weapon, but you 

530
00:29:05,880 --> 00:29:07,840
know, maybe nurture it in some 
way. 

531
00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:11,160
What does that speak to in their
in the sex differences 

532
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:13,200
biologically? 
Where's the biological evidence 

533
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:16,360
for why that's happening? 
Those different responses? 

534
00:29:20,560 --> 00:29:23,040
Well, I think we can say with 
confidence that it is 

535
00:29:23,040 --> 00:29:28,560
genetically programmed because 
it is conservative across 

536
00:29:28,560 --> 00:29:30,120
species. 
It is not a function of 

537
00:29:30,120 --> 00:29:35,800
testosterone. 
Juvenile males and females prior

538
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:37,920
to the onset of puberty don't 
make testosterone. 

539
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:41,400
If you draw blood from a four 
year old, there are no sex 

540
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:44,440
differences in testosterone 
levels comparing 4 year old boys

541
00:29:44,440 --> 00:29:50,600
with four year old girls. 
And so these differences clearly

542
00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:56,160
are to a considerable degree 
hardwired. 

543
00:29:56,600 --> 00:30:01,840
And again, I cited an 
astonishing study of more of 

544
00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:05,880
researchers looked at more than 
1000 samples of human brain 

545
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:12,480
tissue from dead people at every
age of life, including prenatal.

546
00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:15,000
So mother is in a car crash, she
dies. 

547
00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:18,040
The baby she's carrying dies. 
You take the baby out of the 

548
00:30:18,040 --> 00:30:21,680
wound, you cut open the brain 
and you test the brain tissue. 

549
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:25,640
That's how the study is done. 
And you and and the brains of 

550
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:29,080
dead children and adolescents 
and young adults and middle-aged

551
00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:31,160
adults. 
In the elderly, you look to see 

552
00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:36,760
what genes are active in brain 
tissue when this person has 

553
00:30:36,760 --> 00:30:39,280
died. 
You find very little sex 

554
00:30:39,280 --> 00:30:43,040
differences in adults in 
patterns of gene transcription, 

555
00:30:44,160 --> 00:30:49,440
but huge profound sex 
differences in the baby prior to

556
00:30:49,440 --> 00:30:54,320
birth. 
The biggest differences in gene 

557
00:30:54,640 --> 00:30:57,840
transcription in the human brain
is prior to birth. 

558
00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:06,280
We are born male or female. 
Genesis 127 in the image of God.

559
00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:10,000
He created in male and female. 
He created them. 

560
00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:14,240
We are indeed born male or 
female with some very rare 

561
00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:16,080
exceptions. 
There is a phenomenon called 

562
00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:21,280
intersex where So for example, 
an XXXY chimera, an individual 

563
00:31:21,280 --> 00:31:27,040
who's a mixture of XX cells and 
XY cells, classically a 5050 

564
00:31:27,080 --> 00:31:32,480
chimera, that individual's going
to have may have a ovary on one 

565
00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:38,040
side, testicle on the other 
side, their blood equal mix of 

566
00:31:38,040 --> 00:31:41,520
male and female hormones. 
So true intersex individuals, 

567
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:46,200
these are exceedingly rare. 
Fewer than two in 10,000 humans 

568
00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:49,240
are intersex. 
Now the Biden administration, 

569
00:31:49,240 --> 00:31:55,240
United Nations, the New York 
Times, and many other sources 

570
00:31:55,240 --> 00:31:58,520
will claim that no, no, no 
intersex is as common as red 

571
00:31:58,520 --> 00:32:00,920
hair. 
The 2 and 100 humans are 

572
00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:02,640
intersex. 
That's false. 

573
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:08,080
And if your listeners are 
interested, I would refer them 

574
00:32:08,080 --> 00:32:11,200
to my paper titled How Common is
Intersex? 

575
00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:14,520
Where I show that the correct 
number is fewer than two and 

576
00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:18,600
10,000 and that the claim made 
by Anne Fausto Sterling at Brown

577
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:23,440
University that it's 2 and 100 
is is wildly false and is based 

578
00:32:23,440 --> 00:32:29,280
on on, on lies. 
It's hard to use any other word 

579
00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:33,960
because she's including 
disorders like late onset 

580
00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:37,160
congenital adrenal hyperplasia, 
where you have men who look like

581
00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:40,640
men and can father children and 
women who look like women and 

582
00:32:40,640 --> 00:32:45,560
can bear children who have this 
condition that causes acne. 

583
00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:48,960
And she claims it's intersex 
because they're not perfectly 

584
00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:52,240
male or female. 
Any departure from the 

585
00:32:52,280 --> 00:32:56,240
Aristotelian perfection in her 
definition makes you intersex, 

586
00:32:56,240 --> 00:32:59,920
which is simply psychotic. 
It's detached from reality. 

587
00:32:59,920 --> 00:33:04,320
If someone looks like a man, has
XY chromosomes, is male and can 

588
00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:08,760
father a child, to say that no, 
no, no, he's not male because he

589
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:12,920
has bad acne, that's it's, well,
it is. 

590
00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:15,720
It's a lie in pursuit of an 
agenda. 

591
00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:19,960
And Fausto Sterling wanted to 
assert that male and female are 

592
00:33:19,960 --> 00:33:25,640
not binary, that there's this 
big population of people who are

593
00:33:25,680 --> 00:33:29,720
both male and female. 
And so she's lying in pursuit of

594
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:37,000
that political agenda. 
So and the United Nations and 

595
00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:39,880
the Biden administration, The 
New York Times follow that line 

596
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:46,840
for political reasons. 
But in truth, fewer than two and

597
00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:51,400
10,000 humans are intersex. 
It is a very rare anomaly, 

598
00:33:51,600 --> 00:33:55,120
roughly on the same order of 
magnitude as conjoined twins, 

599
00:33:55,120 --> 00:33:56,760
what we used to call Siamese 
twins. 

600
00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:00,920
We don't create a theory of 
personality based on Siamese 

601
00:34:00,920 --> 00:34:04,160
twins. 
We recognize that 2 heads 

602
00:34:04,160 --> 00:34:06,760
sharing one body is a very rare 
anomaly. 

603
00:34:06,760 --> 00:34:11,719
It is not the ground for 
thinking about how personality 

604
00:34:11,719 --> 00:34:15,480
develops because indeed Siamese 
twins 2 heads sharing one body. 

605
00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:22,120
That's a very unusual situation.
Likewise intersex very rare 

606
00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:25,440
phenomenon. 
Those unfortunate individuals 

607
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:29,840
certainly are deserving of care,
should not be subjected to 

608
00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:35,920
surgery and as infants. 
But that's not grounds for 

609
00:34:35,920 --> 00:34:43,440
saying that the binary they this
division of the human race into 

610
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:46,880
male and female is somehow 
called into question, any more 

611
00:34:46,880 --> 00:34:49,960
than we would say that the 
division between day and night 

612
00:34:50,520 --> 00:34:54,280
is meaningless because there is 
such a thing as dusk and dawn 

613
00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:56,960
and twilight. 
The existence of twilight 

614
00:34:56,960 --> 00:35:01,280
doesn't render meaningless the 
division between day and night. 

615
00:35:01,720 --> 00:35:04,840
The existence of intersex does 
not render meaningless the 

616
00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:06,800
division between male and 
female. 

617
00:35:07,360 --> 00:35:09,520
So well said. 
Babies deserve the best and 

618
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:14,000
that's why I love everylife.com.
everylife.com is the pro-life 

619
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:17,520
diaper and wipes company that is
serving moms and babies in need 

620
00:35:17,720 --> 00:35:20,560
and have created best in class 
products for your little one. 

621
00:35:20,800 --> 00:35:22,960
When you order from 
everylife.com, you're not only 

622
00:35:22,960 --> 00:35:25,600
going to get a great diaper that
is just as good or better than 

623
00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:27,960
what you get on the shelves at 
the store, but you are 

624
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:30,680
supporting a company and 
partnering with a company that 

625
00:35:30,680 --> 00:35:33,720
fuels the pro-life movement. 
In fact, just recently Everylife

626
00:35:33,720 --> 00:35:38,600
donated 1700 boxes of diapers 
with my organization live action

627
00:35:38,600 --> 00:35:41,920
directly to moms in need to help
them with their babies. 

628
00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:43,840
I love this company. 
I love the heart behind this 

629
00:35:43,840 --> 00:35:45,320
company and you're going to love
the products. 

630
00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:48,160
It's every life. 
COM and use the code Lila check 

631
00:35:48,160 --> 00:35:51,800
out for 10% off your order. 
There's some recent studies out 

632
00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:57,000
that are seen very troubling, 
you know, 1/4 to 1/3 of gen's 

633
00:35:57,000 --> 00:36:01,000
ears or millennials depending on
the study identify as LGBTQ, you

634
00:36:01,200 --> 00:36:05,920
know, whatever other numbers or 
plus or whatever and many of 

635
00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:09,840
them in that pocket. 
It's not just lesbian or gay 

636
00:36:09,840 --> 00:36:12,400
anymore, it's a lot of trans non
binary. 

637
00:36:12,640 --> 00:36:14,800
Well, it is. 
There's certainly a growing 

638
00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:18,920
number of trans but so for the 
Youth Risk Behavior Survey, the 

639
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:23,640
most recent iteration, this is 
more than 12,000 adolescents 

640
00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:26,160
interviewed nationwide. 
In a demographically 

641
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:34,800
representative sample, 38% of 
girls said teenage girls said 

642
00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:37,720
they are not straight. 
So they're lesbian, gay, 

643
00:36:37,720 --> 00:36:43,040
bisexual, questioning and a few 
are trans, but most of them are 

644
00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:46,400
saying they're not straight. 
Now, having talked with these 

645
00:36:46,400 --> 00:36:51,760
girls, I can tell you that many 
of them are running away from 

646
00:36:51,760 --> 00:36:54,640
something rather than running 
towards something. 

647
00:36:54,720 --> 00:36:59,840
They are repulsed by the idea of
being a straight girl, and for 

648
00:36:59,840 --> 00:37:05,000
good reason. 
Because contemporary American 

649
00:37:05,000 --> 00:37:09,320
popular culture, by which I mean
the culture of WAP, of Cardi B, 

650
00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:13,840
of Megan the Stallion, of Bruno 
Mars and Drake, is a culture 

651
00:37:13,840 --> 00:37:17,320
that teaches girls that it's a 
girl's job to get on her knees 

652
00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:20,680
and give oral sex to boys at 15 
years of age. 

653
00:37:21,880 --> 00:37:25,800
And many girls are really turned
off by that. 

654
00:37:25,800 --> 00:37:28,840
And I can tell you about 16 year
old boys demanding anal 

655
00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:32,640
intercourse from their 15 year 
old girlfriend because this 

656
00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:36,480
boy's been living on pornography
for the last three years and he 

657
00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:39,600
says, yeah, women love it. 
No, they don't. 

658
00:37:39,600 --> 00:37:41,440
No one has explained to that, 
boys. 

659
00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:49,520
Those are actresses being paid 
to pretend that they enjoy it. 

660
00:37:51,760 --> 00:37:56,400
News flash, most girls don't 
enjoy anal intercourse. 

661
00:37:56,400 --> 00:37:59,920
Or as one teenage girl said to 
her boyfriend when he proposed 

662
00:37:59,920 --> 00:38:02,600
anal intercourse, she said, 
yeah, how about if we try 

663
00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:04,320
shoving something hard up your 
behind? 

664
00:38:04,320 --> 00:38:08,360
See how you like it. 
But again, many parents are 

665
00:38:08,360 --> 00:38:10,120
clueless. 
They don't realize that their 

666
00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:13,360
son has a smartphone. 
At 13 years of age, he has 

667
00:38:13,360 --> 00:38:17,040
unlimited access to pornography.
He doesn't need a credit card. 

668
00:38:17,880 --> 00:38:21,640
He just needs to say that he's 
18 and he can access anything. 

669
00:38:22,240 --> 00:38:28,280
And this is a real problem. 
And we have, look, almost every 

670
00:38:28,280 --> 00:38:33,560
culture of which we have any 
knowledge has taken male, female

671
00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:39,200
relations seriously and has 
limited and governed and guided 

672
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:44,080
how girls and boys get together.
We no longer do that, and the 

673
00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:49,000
result is a culture of boys who 
have learned about sex from porn

674
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:53,920
videos at 16 years of age, 
expecting the girl to get on her

675
00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:55,920
knees and give oral sex to the 
boys. 

676
00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:58,240
And the girls are getting tired 
of it. 

677
00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:02,640
And that, in my judgement as a 
family doctor, is the primary 

678
00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:06,160
factor driving this explosion in
the proportion of young girls 

679
00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:10,000
who say I'm not straight or as 
one, A young woman said to me, 

680
00:39:10,000 --> 00:39:13,440
She said I don't care if I never
see another penis as long as I 

681
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:14,840
live. 
I'm sick of it. 

682
00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:22,640
I'm sick of it. 
We have lost any clue as to how 

683
00:39:22,640 --> 00:39:28,240
to teach boys to be gentlemen, 
how to teach girls and boys to 

684
00:39:28,240 --> 00:39:30,720
engage in romance rather than 
hooking up. 

685
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:36,200
Hooking up is the opposite of 
romance, and the result is a 

686
00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:40,880
growing proportion, 38% of girls
who say I'm not sure what I am, 

687
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:45,200
but I'm not a straight girl 
because I don't want to do it. 

688
00:39:46,120 --> 00:39:48,600
Do you see that? 
I'm not sure what I am, but I'm 

689
00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:51,720
not a straight girl. 
A journey of I don't know that 

690
00:39:51,840 --> 00:39:55,080
it becomes pathologized to the 
point where she all of a sudden 

691
00:39:55,160 --> 00:39:59,520
so hates being a woman, having a
woman's body that she considers 

692
00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:03,120
or she thinks she may be trans. 
And then I mean I I just see 

693
00:40:03,160 --> 00:40:04,920
the. 
Anecdotes so if you if. 

694
00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:07,880
You're just hating their. 
Body, Google my name and WAP. 

695
00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:09,840
Are we allowed to say what WAP 
stands for? 

696
00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:12,600
I mean, I think the audience is.
Familiar with this? 

697
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:16,560
WAP was a hugely popular video 
starring Cardi B and Megan Thee 

698
00:40:16,560 --> 00:40:19,600
Stallion, as as well as a cameo 
by Kylie Jenner. 

699
00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:28,640
It stands for Wet Ass Pussy, 
where these two women sing that 

700
00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:34,520
they want to be tied up, they 
want to choke on a man's penis. 

701
00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:40,840
And this video not only was #1 
most popular video in the United

702
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:44,160
States broke all kinds of 
records for downloads, 

703
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:49,240
93,000,000 downloads in one 
week, but was also praised in 

704
00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:54,920
the New York Times, in the Wall 
Street Journal as empowering 

705
00:40:54,920 --> 00:40:58,040
women. 
And this is so great that women 

706
00:40:58,040 --> 00:40:59,680
are now telling us what they 
want. 

707
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:03,120
Well, what's a girl supposed to 
think when she sees that the 

708
00:41:03,120 --> 00:41:07,640
most popular video in the 
country is a girl is 2 young 

709
00:41:07,640 --> 00:41:10,640
women saying how they want to 
choke on a man's cock. 

710
00:41:10,640 --> 00:41:15,000
They want to be tied up 
handcuffs. 

711
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:20,480
It's basically. 
Girls, some girls are saying 

712
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:24,040
yuck, that is not me. 
But hey, the New York Times, 

713
00:41:24,040 --> 00:41:27,000
Teen Vogue, and the Wall Street 
Journal all say this is great. 

714
00:41:27,440 --> 00:41:29,560
Well, you know what? 
Maybe I'm not a girl then, 

715
00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:33,080
because this is not me. 
Maybe I'm something else. 

716
00:41:33,080 --> 00:41:37,280
Maybe I'm a boy because 
certainly the idea of being tied

717
00:41:37,280 --> 00:41:40,600
up and choking on a man's cock 
doesn't appeal to me. 

718
00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:43,280
But according to the New York 
Times, The Wall Street Journal 

719
00:41:43,280 --> 00:41:48,440
on Teen Vogue, it should. 
So, you know, forget that. 

720
00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:52,920
Have you seen a connection 
between a rejection of basically

721
00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:56,400
the sexual objectification 
pornification that girls are 

722
00:41:56,400 --> 00:42:00,200
experiencing? 
In addition, add on the fact 

723
00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:02,720
that after puberty and just 
generally speaking, you have 

724
00:42:02,720 --> 00:42:05,920
body image issues where girls 
don't like their bodies 

725
00:42:05,920 --> 00:42:08,600
generally speaking anyways, or 
they're overweight, or they 

726
00:42:08,600 --> 00:42:11,640
struggle with just body 
acceptance. 

727
00:42:11,880 --> 00:42:15,160
And so you have this lethal 
combo of the sexualization piece

728
00:42:15,160 --> 00:42:17,320
where they're rejecting that 
they don't want to be seen that 

729
00:42:17,320 --> 00:42:18,760
way. 
And then they also are 

730
00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:21,880
uncomfortable in their bodies. 
And so does that create a? 

731
00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:24,960
Could that create a perfect 
storm for saying, well, I'm just

732
00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:26,440
going to. 
I don't know. 

733
00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:29,320
You're sounding. 
You're sounding awfully, 2007. 

734
00:42:29,640 --> 00:42:30,440
Oh, really? 
Yeah. 

735
00:42:30,680 --> 00:42:33,560
Because what? 
Happened in 2000 and. 

736
00:42:33,560 --> 00:42:37,400
Seven, well, 15 years ago, 16 
years ago, 20 years ago, you 

737
00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:42,160
could make a plausible case that
hey, magazines, there used to be

738
00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:45,560
magazines back then like Teen 
Vogue and Cosmo Girl that 

739
00:42:45,560 --> 00:42:50,120
depicted these slender models. 
And you would go to the 

740
00:42:50,120 --> 00:42:55,360
department store, go to Target 
and you'd see big posters of 

741
00:42:55,360 --> 00:42:59,840
slender models. 
That's very 2007. 

742
00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:03,680
You go to Target now and you see
a lot of fat women as the 

743
00:43:03,680 --> 00:43:07,920
models. 
And that is by design and body 

744
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:12,280
body positivity. 
I think that's what I'm probing 

745
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:13,880
out here because I agree with 
you. 

746
00:43:13,880 --> 00:43:15,600
It's not like be fat. 
You're going to be, you're going

747
00:43:15,600 --> 00:43:17,280
to be happy and great. 
But do you think they're 

748
00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:21,280
actually happy and great? 
It varies. 

749
00:43:21,320 --> 00:43:26,560
Everyone is different. 
I have met slender girls who are

750
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:29,120
miserable and I've met fat girls
who are happy. 

751
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:39,800
So I am not persuaded by your 
implied claim that girls who are

752
00:43:39,800 --> 00:43:45,680
not slender today uniformly 
torture themselves. 

753
00:43:45,680 --> 00:43:47,560
There are certainly some who do 
without it to be. 

754
00:43:47,680 --> 00:43:50,120
Clear, it's not just girls that 
are not slender, it's generally 

755
00:43:50,120 --> 00:43:53,200
girls that struggle with, you 
know, eating disorders is sort 

756
00:43:53,200 --> 00:43:56,880
of a, you know, you, you'd say 
you have an eating disorder, but

757
00:43:56,880 --> 00:43:58,880
they struggle with body image 
and they could be very skinny, 

758
00:43:58,880 --> 00:44:02,440
they could be very fat, but they
are not happy with their bodies.

759
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:05,360
Yeah. 
But I, I don't think that's new.

760
00:44:05,560 --> 00:44:07,200
I think that I don't think 
that's new. 

761
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:10,120
I think that's certainly been 
with us for at least. 

762
00:44:10,120 --> 00:44:12,720
The last I, I guess what I'm 
saying, when I was a girl, you 

763
00:44:12,720 --> 00:44:15,520
know, and struggling, you know, 
I struggled with body image 

764
00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:17,280
issues. 
I had a, an eating, you know, 

765
00:44:17,440 --> 00:44:20,000
disordered eating at one point. 
A lot of other girls in you had 

766
00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:23,000
that today's average girl. 
We still have tons of eating 

767
00:44:23,000 --> 00:44:25,240
disorders today. 
But now you have this additional

768
00:44:25,240 --> 00:44:28,280
option if you're struggling with
your body and with food of 

769
00:44:28,400 --> 00:44:33,880
exploring being trans as a way 
to deal with your not, not body 

770
00:44:33,880 --> 00:44:35,960
dysmorphia, but your actual 
body. 

771
00:44:36,120 --> 00:44:39,280
You know, you know, your your 
anorexia or your bulimia. 

772
00:44:39,640 --> 00:44:41,360
Yeah. 
So your question we're grappling

773
00:44:41,360 --> 00:44:44,640
with is why this explosion and 
the number of young women who 

774
00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:47,520
say they're men, the number of 
teenage girls who say they're 

775
00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:52,400
boys? 
And yeah, I, I, I think that you

776
00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:59,400
have proposed a reasonable 
hypothesis, namely that one of 

777
00:44:59,400 --> 00:45:04,040
many factors driving this is 
that this is now an option for 

778
00:45:04,040 --> 00:45:09,120
that girl who's unhappy with her
body, that, hey, if I was a boy,

779
00:45:09,160 --> 00:45:11,640
it wouldn't, it wouldn't matter.
We did. 

780
00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:17,040
We have something pretty ancient
in our civilization that says 

781
00:45:17,040 --> 00:45:21,000
that how you look is really 
important if you're a girl and 

782
00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:24,080
not important if you're a boy, 
or much, much, much less 

783
00:45:24,080 --> 00:45:26,520
important. 
And that is not at all new. 

784
00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:30,920
So when I talk to students or 
teachers about this topic, I 

785
00:45:30,920 --> 00:45:32,560
often cite The Lord of the 
Rings. 

786
00:45:33,240 --> 00:45:38,040
So the Lord of the Rings has 
only a few female characters. 

787
00:45:38,040 --> 00:45:41,520
The books, not the movies. 
The The books have only a few 

788
00:45:41,520 --> 00:45:45,560
female characters who have 
names, and they're all described

789
00:45:45,560 --> 00:45:50,120
as staggeringly beautiful. 
Ewan is amazingly beautiful. 

790
00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:54,400
Arwen's amazing, amazingly 
beauty beautiful. 

791
00:45:54,400 --> 00:45:57,440
The Lady of Le Florian is 
amazingly beautiful. 

792
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:03,640
There are other women, but they 
are unmentioned. 

793
00:46:03,640 --> 00:46:06,520
The only women who are mentioned
are amazing, beautiful. 

794
00:46:06,520 --> 00:46:10,160
Well, the heroes of the story, 
Frodo and Sam, aren't 

795
00:46:10,240 --> 00:46:11,800
attractive. 
They're not big. 

796
00:46:11,800 --> 00:46:15,880
They're not strong. 
Frodo, Sam, Pippin, Mary. 

797
00:46:17,440 --> 00:46:21,080
Males aren't anything at all 
special to look at. 

798
00:46:22,880 --> 00:46:27,280
One of the unintended messages 
of The Lord of the Rings is that

799
00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:30,720
if you're a man, it doesn't 
matter what you look like, but 

800
00:46:30,720 --> 00:46:34,000
if you're a woman, it's 
essential that you be beautiful.

801
00:46:34,000 --> 00:46:36,640
If you're not beautiful, you're 
nobody. 

802
00:46:36,640 --> 00:46:40,000
Literally. 
There is no named character. 

803
00:46:40,000 --> 00:46:42,600
You don't. 
Even make a you don't even get a

804
00:46:42,600 --> 00:46:47,920
name, so that's nothing new. 
OK, Tolkien wrote those books in

805
00:46:47,920 --> 00:46:56,200
the 1940s, so we have a long 
history in Western civilization 

806
00:46:56,440 --> 00:47:02,720
of prioritizing looks for girls 
and for boys. 

807
00:47:03,240 --> 00:47:07,600
It's who you are for girls, it's
how you look. 

808
00:47:07,800 --> 00:47:10,240
There's nothing new about that, 
unfortunately. 

809
00:47:10,240 --> 00:47:12,800
Where does that come from? 
Oh my goodness, that's that's 

810
00:47:12,800 --> 00:47:15,800
very ancient. 
Now I am not an anthropologist, 

811
00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:21,320
but I have consulted with real 
anthropologist who have found 

812
00:47:21,320 --> 00:47:26,280
something similar in other 
cultures, Not necessarily in all

813
00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:28,640
other cultures, but in many 
other cultures. 

814
00:47:28,640 --> 00:47:33,880
So certainly there's something 
about our species that 

815
00:47:33,880 --> 00:47:40,320
prioritizes looks for girls and 
women and achievement for boys 

816
00:47:40,320 --> 00:47:44,120
and men. 
So for boys and men it's 

817
00:47:44,120 --> 00:47:49,200
important to do and for girls 
and women it's more important to

818
00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:52,800
look good. 
And that is immensely toxic for 

819
00:47:52,800 --> 00:47:58,560
girls and women and we. 
But that, that is not new is my 

820
00:47:58,560 --> 00:48:00,000
point. 
That is, there's nothing new 

821
00:48:00,000 --> 00:48:02,600
about that. 
You have suggested that maybe 

822
00:48:02,600 --> 00:48:07,880
that's part of what's driving 
girls to be trans. 

823
00:48:07,880 --> 00:48:10,840
And I've pushed back a bit 
because the trans thing is very 

824
00:48:10,840 --> 00:48:13,800
new. 
It's really new. 20 years ago 

825
00:48:13,800 --> 00:48:17,080
when I wrote the 1st edition of 
Why Gender Matters, there's like

826
00:48:17,080 --> 00:48:22,360
2 sentences on transgender. 30 
years ago, just 30 years ago, 

827
00:48:22,360 --> 00:48:24,920
the American Psychiatric 
Association estimated the 

828
00:48:24,920 --> 00:48:28,520
prevalence of transgender. 
They said it's so rare it's hard

829
00:48:28,520 --> 00:48:33,560
to say, but we think it's one in
30,000 men and fewer than one in

830
00:48:33,560 --> 00:48:36,880
100,000 women. 
That was the American 

831
00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:40,440
Psychiatric Association exactly 
30 years ago, 1994. 

832
00:48:41,320 --> 00:48:47,440
And now we've got, you know, 
easily 4% of teenage girls in 

833
00:48:47,440 --> 00:48:48,920
this country saying they're 
trans. 

834
00:48:51,160 --> 00:48:55,600
Well, I. 19% of teenage girls. 
4% of teenage girls say they're 

835
00:48:55,600 --> 00:48:59,200
trans, 38% of teenage girls say 
they're not straight. 

836
00:49:01,560 --> 00:49:11,040
So going from basically zero to 
4% in, in 20 years, it's hard 

837
00:49:11,040 --> 00:49:14,400
for me to to say, Oh yeah, 
that's, that's because of the 

838
00:49:14,400 --> 00:49:17,560
toxic effects of body 
positivity, because we've had a 

839
00:49:17,560 --> 00:49:19,760
toxic culture with regard to 
body positivity. 

840
00:49:19,760 --> 00:49:23,480
What would be the toxic effects 
of body idol worship? 

841
00:49:23,480 --> 00:49:25,400
I mean, when it comes to 
appearance, well. 

842
00:49:25,600 --> 00:49:29,120
And I think there's some there 
are other factors driving this 

843
00:49:29,120 --> 00:49:32,560
explosion in, in the trans 
identification for. 

844
00:49:32,560 --> 00:49:33,920
Girls, what would you say those 
are? 

845
00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:38,000
All right, so how much time do 
how much time? 

846
00:49:38,040 --> 00:49:39,480
Do Yeah, we'll go. 
We'll go. 

847
00:49:39,520 --> 00:49:45,720
At least we'll go 10 more. 
All right, so the 1st edition of

848
00:49:45,720 --> 00:49:48,160
my book, Why Gender Matters, had
almost nothing on trans. 

849
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:51,720
The second edition has 12 
chapters, the last four of which

850
00:49:51,720 --> 00:49:54,480
are lesbian, gay, bisexual, 
transgender, and intersex. 

851
00:49:55,560 --> 00:50:00,160
And I dive deeply into this 
question of why? 

852
00:50:00,880 --> 00:50:03,480
Why this explosion and the 
proportion of kids who say 

853
00:50:03,480 --> 00:50:08,640
they're trans? 
Almost every culture of which we

854
00:50:08,640 --> 00:50:12,080
have substantial knowledge has 
taught girls to be women, has 

855
00:50:12,080 --> 00:50:14,280
taught boys to be men. 
What does that mean? 

856
00:50:14,600 --> 00:50:16,920
Well, it actually means 
something different in each 

857
00:50:16,920 --> 00:50:21,520
culture. 
And in the Japan of the Tokugawa

858
00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:25,160
Shogun 816 O3, it meant 
something very different than it

859
00:50:25,320 --> 00:50:30,000
means for us today are. 
There core through lines though 

860
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:33,000
for for all. 
Well, one example I give is the 

861
00:50:33,000 --> 00:50:37,120
meticulous preparation and 
serving of tea in 16 O 3 in 

862
00:50:37,120 --> 00:50:39,720
Japan was exclusively the 
province of men. 

863
00:50:39,800 --> 00:50:44,600
Women were not even permitted to
attend tea ceremony and and 

864
00:50:44,600 --> 00:50:50,120
making it look good and doing it
just right was taught by men two

865
00:50:50,120 --> 00:50:54,080
boys. 
Now in our culture in 21st 

866
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:57,080
century America, meticulous care
and the preparation of serving 

867
00:50:57,080 --> 00:51:00,960
in tea we would tend to think is
more of a feminine trait than a 

868
00:51:00,960 --> 00:51:04,040
masculine trait. 
How cultures construct 

869
00:51:04,040 --> 00:51:08,960
masculinity and femininity does 
vary quite a bit from one 

870
00:51:08,960 --> 00:51:12,680
culture to another, with a few 
exceptions. 

871
00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:18,880
So training in the skills 
required to kill other humans is

872
00:51:18,880 --> 00:51:23,480
exclusively male in essentially 
every culture of which we have 

873
00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:25,840
any knowledge. 
There are only mythological 

874
00:51:25,840 --> 00:51:30,760
exceptions like the Amazons. 
So training humans to kill other

875
00:51:30,760 --> 00:51:33,080
humans is almost exclusively 
male. 

876
00:51:33,520 --> 00:51:37,160
But almost every other domain 
you look at, whether it's 

877
00:51:37,160 --> 00:51:41,840
cooking or clothing, you can 
find a culture where men 

878
00:51:41,920 --> 00:51:46,240
dominate and where those are 
masculine occupations. 

879
00:51:47,520 --> 00:51:50,720
But to don't to interrupt here, 
but I want to interrupt here 

880
00:51:50,720 --> 00:51:55,640
because childbearing is an 
exclusively female domain. 

881
00:51:55,640 --> 00:51:58,840
Obviously men can be very 
involved with children and they 

882
00:51:58,840 --> 00:52:01,680
should be, I believe. 
But childbearing is exclusively 

883
00:52:01,680 --> 00:52:03,800
female. 
So you say them what's across, 

884
00:52:03,840 --> 00:52:06,680
you know, across cultures, 
across time for men, it's being 

885
00:52:06,680 --> 00:52:08,720
trained to kill for women. 
Can you? 

886
00:52:08,720 --> 00:52:10,920
Is it fair to say being trained 
to basic? 

887
00:52:10,920 --> 00:52:13,320
Training on the question we're 
trying to figure out is what's 

888
00:52:13,320 --> 00:52:18,080
driving the explosion of trans 
and one of the one of several 

889
00:52:18,080 --> 00:52:19,640
answers. 
It's not just one answer, but 

890
00:52:19,640 --> 00:52:23,680
one of several answers I give in
those final four chapters of Why

891
00:52:23,680 --> 00:52:28,800
Gender Matters is We no longer 
teach girls to be women and boys

892
00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:30,560
to be men. 
And so I'm asking what does it 

893
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:33,160
mean through? 
It means you have a community of

894
00:52:33,160 --> 00:52:36,400
men for for boys and a community
of women for girls. 

895
00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:40,720
So Robert Putnam at Harvard 
spent decades leading an army of

896
00:52:40,720 --> 00:52:43,920
graduate students across the 
United States, documenting that 

897
00:52:43,920 --> 00:52:48,000
50 years ago you had a community
of women for girls. 

898
00:52:48,000 --> 00:52:49,280
Well, how, how does he document 
that? 

899
00:52:49,280 --> 00:52:53,200
Well, he goes to Lake Forest, IL
and, and bowling. 

900
00:52:53,200 --> 00:52:55,760
Bowling used to be a lot more 
popular in the United States. 

901
00:52:55,760 --> 00:52:58,000
But more importantly, from 
Doctor Putnam's perspective, 

902
00:53:00,400 --> 00:53:03,120
most of the bowling 50 years ago
was in bowling leagues. 

903
00:53:03,120 --> 00:53:04,680
And Tuesday night might be the 
women's night. 

904
00:53:04,680 --> 00:53:06,160
And Thursday night was the men's
night. 

905
00:53:06,160 --> 00:53:08,480
And he and his students dig up. 
All right, who was in the 

906
00:53:08,480 --> 00:53:12,520
bowling league in Lake Forest, 
IL in 1970? 

907
00:53:13,200 --> 00:53:15,920
Well, let's see. 
On this team there was a 53 year

908
00:53:15,920 --> 00:53:19,160
old woman, a 37 year old woman, 
a 26 year old woman, a 17 year 

909
00:53:19,160 --> 00:53:20,440
old girl, and a 12 year old 
girl. 

910
00:53:21,200 --> 00:53:23,200
People in the United States 
still go bowling, but they go 

911
00:53:23,200 --> 00:53:25,640
bowling alone. 
To borrow the title of Doctor 

912
00:53:25,640 --> 00:53:28,720
Putnam's best known book, 
meaning not literally alone, but

913
00:53:28,720 --> 00:53:31,520
instead of this 17 year old girl
going bowling with a community 

914
00:53:31,520 --> 00:53:35,480
of women, she going bowling with
a bunch of 17 year olds, girls 

915
00:53:35,480 --> 00:53:38,040
and boys mixed together. 
Which as far as Doctor Putnam is

916
00:53:38,040 --> 00:53:41,600
concerned, is bowling alone. 
When Doctor Putnam uses the term

917
00:53:41,600 --> 00:53:45,400
community, he means bonds across
generations, and the bonds 

918
00:53:45,400 --> 00:53:47,440
across generations have been 
broken. 

919
00:53:47,760 --> 00:53:50,160
We used to have a community of 
women for girls. 

920
00:53:50,280 --> 00:53:52,400
We used to have a community of 
men for boys. 

921
00:53:52,560 --> 00:53:57,000
We don't anymore. 
We set kids adrift in the 

922
00:53:57,000 --> 00:54:00,720
culture of Instagram and TikTok 
to figure out for themselves 

923
00:54:01,440 --> 00:54:04,000
what they're supposed to be. 
And the result is they are 

924
00:54:04,000 --> 00:54:09,000
confused. 
And that confusion, I assert, is

925
00:54:09,000 --> 00:54:14,640
one of several factors driving 
this explosion in girls who say 

926
00:54:14,640 --> 00:54:16,920
they're boys and boys who say 
they're girls. 

927
00:54:17,160 --> 00:54:19,480
It's so fascinating. 
What is so powerful about 

928
00:54:19,480 --> 00:54:25,320
intergenerational community? 
Oh my gosh, that is core to the 

929
00:54:25,320 --> 00:54:32,720
human experience. 
So look, what is childhood for? 

930
00:54:33,080 --> 00:54:37,320
Literally what is childhood for?
A four year old horse is a 

931
00:54:37,320 --> 00:54:41,160
mature adult. 
The Kentucky Derby has raced 

932
00:54:41,160 --> 00:54:44,160
with three-year olds. 
A four year old human is barely 

933
00:54:44,160 --> 00:54:48,200
begun humans or children or 
adolescents for more years than 

934
00:54:48,200 --> 00:54:51,400
most animals live. 
It can't just be about 

935
00:54:51,400 --> 00:54:54,560
biological maturation because a 
four year old horse is a mature 

936
00:54:54,560 --> 00:54:56,560
adult and it's a bigger animal 
than a human. 

937
00:54:56,560 --> 00:55:02,240
So why? 
Why humans are developing 

938
00:55:02,240 --> 00:55:05,160
Children are adolescents for 
more years than most animals 

939
00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:06,560
live. 
Why? 

940
00:55:06,760 --> 00:55:08,720
We don't have to guess. 
We have scholars like Doctor 

941
00:55:08,720 --> 00:55:12,360
Melvin Counter at Emory who 
wrote this 800 page monograph 

942
00:55:12,360 --> 00:55:15,120
published by Oxford University 
Press titled The Evolution of 

943
00:55:15,120 --> 00:55:18,400
Childhood, comparing development
at our species with development 

944
00:55:18,400 --> 00:55:20,160
and other species, especially 
other primates. 

945
00:55:20,600 --> 00:55:25,280
And the answers the scholars 
give is that human development 

946
00:55:25,280 --> 00:55:30,000
takes as long as it does because
it takes many years for the 

947
00:55:30,000 --> 00:55:33,480
grown-ups to teach the grown up 
culture to the children. 

948
00:55:33,880 --> 00:55:37,080
That's what makes us unique as a
species. 

949
00:55:37,360 --> 00:55:39,680
That's what's programmed in our 
DNA. 

950
00:55:40,240 --> 00:55:42,600
So on the next page of my book, 
The Collapse of Parenting, where

951
00:55:42,600 --> 00:55:45,920
I present this research, I say a
column by Jennifer Finney 

952
00:55:45,920 --> 00:55:49,640
Boylan, a long time columnist 
for the New York Times, and she 

953
00:55:49,640 --> 00:55:50,920
wrote about enlightened 
parenting. 

954
00:55:50,920 --> 00:55:53,200
And in her column she says that 
enlightened parenting means 

955
00:55:53,200 --> 00:55:56,120
setting your child free to 
discover for themselves their 

956
00:55:56,120 --> 00:55:58,960
own right and wrong. 
And if in so doing your child 

957
00:55:58,960 --> 00:56:01,120
becomes a stranger to you, then 
so be it. 

958
00:56:01,440 --> 00:56:04,160
Quote UN quote. 
That might sound enlightened to 

959
00:56:04,160 --> 00:56:07,040
some, but it's not enlightened. 
If you set your child free to 

960
00:56:07,040 --> 00:56:09,880
discover that for themselves, 
their own right and wrong, and 

961
00:56:09,880 --> 00:56:12,800
then they have a device with 
Internet access, what they will 

962
00:56:12,800 --> 00:56:17,240
discover is Cardi B, WAP, Megan 
Thee Stallion, Drake, mainstream

963
00:56:17,240 --> 00:56:20,920
pornography, and confusion about
gender. 

964
00:56:22,600 --> 00:56:26,080
That New York Times advice to 
set your child free to discover 

965
00:56:26,080 --> 00:56:29,600
their for themselves, their own 
right and wrong is not only an 

966
00:56:29,600 --> 00:56:33,360
abdication of parental 
responsibility, it is profoundly

967
00:56:33,400 --> 00:56:35,840
unhuman. 
It's not what we are programmed 

968
00:56:35,840 --> 00:56:37,520
to do. 
It's not what's in our DNA. 

969
00:56:37,520 --> 00:56:40,960
It's not why human development 
takes as long as it does. 

970
00:56:41,200 --> 00:56:44,760
Human development takes as long 
as it does because we're 

971
00:56:44,760 --> 00:56:47,600
supposed to have strong bonds 
across generations for the 

972
00:56:47,600 --> 00:56:51,600
grown-ups to teach the kids. 
And almost every enduring 

973
00:56:51,600 --> 00:56:56,040
culture, every enduring culture,
every culture that lasts has 

974
00:56:56,040 --> 00:56:59,360
those bonds. 
And I say that having consulted 

975
00:56:59,360 --> 00:57:05,760
with the comparative 
anthropologist in my, which I 

976
00:57:05,760 --> 00:57:09,080
did for my book, Boys Adrift, 
and they will tell you that 

977
00:57:09,280 --> 00:57:12,320
every culture that lasts is 
characterized by strong bonds 

978
00:57:12,320 --> 00:57:15,440
across generations. 
A community of men for boys, a 

979
00:57:15,480 --> 00:57:18,680
community of women for girls. 
We used to do that. 

980
00:57:19,520 --> 00:57:24,840
As recently as 50 years ago, we 
had the sewing circles again. 

981
00:57:25,160 --> 00:57:28,200
Doctor Putnam and his colleagues
document OK the sewing circle in

982
00:57:28,240 --> 00:57:31,120
Shaker Eyes, Ohio, organized not
by kin relation but by 

983
00:57:31,120 --> 00:57:33,640
geographic proximity, which is a
fancy way of saying that the 

984
00:57:33,640 --> 00:57:36,400
girls and women in that sewing 
circle weren't related to each 

985
00:57:36,400 --> 00:57:38,760
other, they just happened to 
live on the same block. 

986
00:57:39,120 --> 00:57:43,400
There were innumerable 
mechanisms as recently as 50 

987
00:57:43,400 --> 00:57:47,840
years ago in the United States 
to have bonds across 

988
00:57:47,880 --> 00:57:50,280
generations, women with girls, 
men with boys. 

989
00:57:50,280 --> 00:57:54,920
Doctor Putnam's got pictures of 
guys working under the hood of a

990
00:57:54,920 --> 00:57:59,040
of a car 50 years ago, and he 
and his students figure out who 

991
00:57:59,040 --> 00:58:01,040
are the men and boys in those 
photograph. 

992
00:58:01,160 --> 00:58:03,240
Whether we're older men, younger
men and boys. 

993
00:58:03,760 --> 00:58:06,240
You go out today and drive 
around on Saturday afternoon, 

994
00:58:06,440 --> 00:58:09,760
you just might see 2 old geezers
working to the hood of their 65 

995
00:58:09,760 --> 00:58:11,840
Corvette. 
But the boys are not with them. 

996
00:58:12,160 --> 00:58:17,160
The bonds across generations 
have been broken as a result. 

997
00:58:17,160 --> 00:58:21,320
We have a lot of confused boys, 
a lot of confused girls who have

998
00:58:21,320 --> 00:58:25,320
no idea what it means to be a 
man because we no longer have a 

999
00:58:25,320 --> 00:58:28,440
community of men for boys, a 
community of women for girls. 

1000
00:58:28,680 --> 00:58:30,280
When I speak to churches, I 
talk. 

1001
00:58:30,280 --> 00:58:33,000
I share what I have learned 
visiting churches across this 

1002
00:58:33,000 --> 00:58:36,440
country. 
A few churches still get it that

1003
00:58:37,040 --> 00:58:39,240
so. 
So I I show a flyer from a 

1004
00:58:39,240 --> 00:58:43,320
church youth group, come to the 
pizza party and hang out and 

1005
00:58:43,320 --> 00:58:45,920
have fun. 
That's not what kids need. 

1006
00:58:47,720 --> 00:58:50,400
What a girl needs to become a 
woman of faith is different from

1007
00:58:50,400 --> 00:58:52,360
what a boy needs to become a man
of faith. 

1008
00:58:53,560 --> 00:58:57,280
Boys need a community of men. 
Girls need a community of women.

1009
00:58:57,840 --> 00:59:01,480
Now, I am not a fan of the 
Mormon religion, which I regard 

1010
00:59:01,480 --> 00:59:07,200
as very bizarre, but they get 
this every Sunday in the Mormon 

1011
00:59:07,200 --> 00:59:09,720
church. 
The girls go with the women, the

1012
00:59:09,720 --> 00:59:13,040
boys go with the men, and the 
Mormon church is thriving. 

1013
00:59:13,240 --> 00:59:16,160
And I think a big reason it's 
thriving is because they get 

1014
00:59:16,160 --> 00:59:18,560
this. 
Most churches in the United 

1015
00:59:18,560 --> 00:59:21,360
States, Catholic and Protestant,
do not get this. 

1016
00:59:21,720 --> 00:59:25,160
And as a result, many of those 
congregations are dwindling. 

1017
00:59:25,800 --> 00:59:28,480
There's a lot of fear, I think 
from, you know, whether it's 

1018
00:59:28,480 --> 00:59:29,760
Gen. 
X to the Gen. 

1019
00:59:29,760 --> 00:59:33,560
Z or, or it's the boomer to the 
millennial of, you know, not of 

1020
00:59:33,560 --> 00:59:37,560
misunderstandings or wounds from
how the person was raised. 

1021
00:59:37,560 --> 00:59:40,000
And now they're not at peace 
with their parents. 

1022
00:59:40,480 --> 00:59:43,040
So there's just a lot of 
division amongst the generations

1023
00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:46,280
that I think isn't beyond just 
there's not good social. 

1024
00:59:46,360 --> 00:59:49,480
Well, it's hard wired and girls 
need a community of women and 

1025
00:59:49,480 --> 00:59:51,880
boys need a community of men. 
And I always welcome the 

1026
00:59:51,920 --> 00:59:55,440
opportunity to speak to churches
because they are uniquely well 

1027
00:59:55,440 --> 01:00:00,320
situated to create those 
communities. 

1028
01:00:00,320 --> 01:00:03,640
And I share examples of how 
other churches have done it and 

1029
01:00:03,640 --> 01:00:06,680
are doing it. 
So what I'm, what I'm, what I'm 

1030
01:00:06,680 --> 01:00:11,760
going here with is there is 
perhaps fueling some of the 

1031
01:00:11,760 --> 01:00:13,960
disintegration of the 
generations. 

1032
01:00:14,280 --> 01:00:18,360
There's this generational divide
where people look down on their 

1033
01:00:18,360 --> 01:00:20,120
parents. 
You know, I think it's become 

1034
01:00:20,120 --> 01:00:23,400
more in vogue for people to not 
want to talk to my parents 

1035
01:00:23,400 --> 01:00:26,640
because of the way they hurt me 
or because of our differences. 

1036
01:00:26,960 --> 01:00:29,640
And people are more drawn to 
their peer group. 

1037
01:00:29,680 --> 01:00:31,880
Is this something that you're 
seeing as well? 

1038
01:00:31,880 --> 01:00:32,560
Well. 
Sure. 

1039
01:00:32,560 --> 01:00:38,080
And that's, that's of course a 
main phenomenon driving my book 

1040
01:00:38,080 --> 01:00:43,760
The Collapse of Parenting, which
is not just documenting the the 

1041
01:00:43,760 --> 01:00:46,640
collapse of parenting, but the 
main point of the book is to 

1042
01:00:46,640 --> 01:00:51,200
give parents some concrete 
pointers to prioritize the 

1043
01:00:51,200 --> 01:00:55,000
family, to recreate those strong
bonds across generations. 

1044
01:00:55,000 --> 01:00:58,120
Do you think that the school 
structure today, the 8 sometimes

1045
01:00:58,120 --> 01:01:01,320
hours you're with a peer group, 
you're not with your family, 

1046
01:01:01,640 --> 01:01:03,520
Then you go hang out and do 
sports with your peer group. 

1047
01:01:03,520 --> 01:01:05,120
Then on the weekends you're 
hanging with your peer group. 

1048
01:01:05,360 --> 01:01:08,800
There's just less physical time 
kids are spending with extended 

1049
01:01:08,800 --> 01:01:12,000
family with. 
No, I don't buy that the the 

1050
01:01:12,200 --> 01:01:15,280
structure of the school day is 
not radically different today 

1051
01:01:15,280 --> 01:01:19,560
than it was 40 years ago. 
But parenting has collapsed over

1052
01:01:19,560 --> 01:01:22,840
the last 40 years, so I do not 
blame it on the organization of 

1053
01:01:22,840 --> 01:01:26,280
the school day. 
I blame it on American popular 

1054
01:01:26,280 --> 01:01:27,840
culture. 
More if I have to blame it on 

1055
01:01:27,840 --> 01:01:30,040
anything. 
But 100 years ago, the school 

1056
01:01:30,040 --> 01:01:31,640
room was a mixed age group, 
right? 

1057
01:01:33,120 --> 01:01:37,160
100 yeah, if you go back more 
than 100 years ago when very few

1058
01:01:37,160 --> 01:01:39,880
Americans, the majority of 
Americans did not go to high 

1059
01:01:39,880 --> 01:01:44,280
school. 
But, but I don't think that's a 

1060
01:01:44,280 --> 01:01:47,880
useful lesson for us. 
The the structure of the school 

1061
01:01:47,880 --> 01:01:50,920
day, again, has not changed 
radically in the last 40 years, 

1062
01:01:51,320 --> 01:01:55,600
but there has been a collapse of
parenting over the last 20 years

1063
01:01:55,600 --> 01:01:57,360
actually. 
And that's the focus of my book 

1064
01:01:57,840 --> 01:01:59,880
Collapse of Parenting. 
So, so much more we could talk 

1065
01:01:59,880 --> 01:02:01,560
about. 
I have one more question and 

1066
01:02:01,560 --> 01:02:04,640
might lead to a little secondary
question, but I've so much of 

1067
01:02:04,640 --> 01:02:06,880
what you're saying begs this 
question for me and it's kind of

1068
01:02:06,880 --> 01:02:10,440
what we were discussing earlier.
What are the differences between

1069
01:02:10,440 --> 01:02:14,080
men and women culturally that 
that have cultural 

1070
01:02:14,080 --> 01:02:15,920
ramifications? 
So what I mean by that is you 

1071
01:02:15,920 --> 01:02:18,440
said, you know, in this Japanese
culture, the men were the ones 

1072
01:02:18,440 --> 01:02:20,280
serving the tea. 
And you see all these different 

1073
01:02:20,280 --> 01:02:22,560
activities that might be 
stereotypically male or female, 

1074
01:02:22,760 --> 01:02:25,160
but they will flip based on the 
culture or the time. 

1075
01:02:25,240 --> 01:02:26,880
They'll change. 
I don't know that I'm not 

1076
01:02:26,880 --> 01:02:28,560
comfortable with the word. 
Maybe they won't flip. 

1077
01:02:28,560 --> 01:02:30,760
They change. 
Every culture constructs 

1078
01:02:30,760 --> 01:02:32,920
masculinity and femininity 
differently. 

1079
01:02:32,960 --> 01:02:36,480
But you named one thing that is 
set across cultures and times 

1080
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:39,520
for men, which is to kill, to be
trained, to protect. 

1081
01:02:39,600 --> 01:02:41,560
Really. 
Let's say in killing other 

1082
01:02:41,560 --> 01:02:46,800
humans is predominantly male in 
every culture of which we have 

1083
01:02:46,800 --> 01:02:49,080
substantial knowledge. 
That's not mythological. 

1084
01:02:49,320 --> 01:02:53,160
And what would be that activity 
or the activities that are 

1085
01:02:53,160 --> 01:02:54,680
across time and cultures for 
women? 

1086
01:02:56,000 --> 01:02:58,600
Bearing and nurturing very young
children. 

1087
01:02:59,520 --> 01:03:02,320
So I, when I think about the 
gender differences and there's a

1088
01:03:02,320 --> 01:03:06,560
lot of, you know, arguments and 
Tradcon, left Wing, Red Pill, 

1089
01:03:06,560 --> 01:03:08,920
all of these different ideas 
about what it means to be a man,

1090
01:03:08,920 --> 01:03:12,440
what it means to be a woman. 
Is it fair to boil it down? 

1091
01:03:12,720 --> 01:03:14,920
And you look at the trappings 
and of what culture kind of 

1092
01:03:15,000 --> 01:03:17,120
builds up around being a man or 
woman? 

1093
01:03:17,400 --> 01:03:20,480
You boil it down though, Women 
can bear children, very young 

1094
01:03:20,480 --> 01:03:24,000
children men can't, and then 
then can protect the whole 

1095
01:03:24,000 --> 01:03:25,800
project of the woman bearing a 
child. 

1096
01:03:25,800 --> 01:03:28,320
What do you think of that? 
No, I'm not comfortable with it.

1097
01:03:28,680 --> 01:03:32,440
So again, one of the points I 
make in why not why gender 

1098
01:03:32,440 --> 01:03:38,080
matters is that 50 years ago, 
the early gender theorists, I 

1099
01:03:38,080 --> 01:03:41,320
believe that gender was on a 
continuum. 

1100
01:03:41,320 --> 01:03:44,680
You could be very masculine, you
could be very feminine. 

1101
01:03:44,680 --> 01:03:47,400
It was a single one-dimensional 
continuum. 

1102
01:03:47,400 --> 01:03:50,240
And if you were more masculine 
than you were necessarily less 

1103
01:03:50,240 --> 01:03:52,320
feminine. 
That turns out simply not to be 

1104
01:03:52,320 --> 01:03:55,480
accurate. 
Gender is 2 dimensional. 

1105
01:03:55,720 --> 01:03:59,480
You can be masculine or not. 
You can be feminine or not. 

1106
01:03:59,640 --> 01:04:01,720
You can be both, which is 
androgynous. 

1107
01:04:01,800 --> 01:04:04,160
You can be neither, which is 
undifferentiated. 

1108
01:04:04,680 --> 01:04:08,560
So gender is A2 dimensional 
space and part of becoming a an 

1109
01:04:09,680 --> 01:04:13,400
adult who's comfortable in your 
own skin is figuring out where 

1110
01:04:13,400 --> 01:04:15,440
you belong on that 
two-dimensional space. 

1111
01:04:15,800 --> 01:04:19,720
So for example, I've been 
married for 34 years. 

1112
01:04:21,320 --> 01:04:24,040
In my marriage, I do all the 
grocery shopping because my wife

1113
01:04:24,040 --> 01:04:27,160
hates to shop for groceries. 
She hates to make supper. 

1114
01:04:27,160 --> 01:04:32,320
She loves it when I make supper.
Or we neither of us make supper 

1115
01:04:32,320 --> 01:04:34,120
and we make some other 
arrangement. 

1116
01:04:35,080 --> 01:04:37,520
She doesn't like to cook, she 
doesn't like to shop. 

1117
01:04:37,880 --> 01:04:41,720
She mows the lawn, she fixes the
lawn tractor, which I would have

1118
01:04:41,720 --> 01:04:47,240
no idea how to do. 
But I'm a straight man. 

1119
01:04:47,240 --> 01:04:50,720
She's a straight woman. 
We're comfortable as men and 

1120
01:04:50,720 --> 01:04:52,320
women. 
We may be a little gender 

1121
01:04:52,360 --> 01:04:55,840
atypical in that I love to shop 
for groceries. 

1122
01:04:55,840 --> 01:04:58,320
I love ballet. 
She doesn't really care for 

1123
01:04:58,320 --> 01:05:04,720
ballet and she'd rather mow the 
lawn, and that's fine to be. 

1124
01:05:04,720 --> 01:05:07,520
Clear, Mike, what I was saying 
earlier is actually agreeing 

1125
01:05:07,520 --> 01:05:10,760
with what you just said, that we
overemphasize these 

1126
01:05:10,760 --> 01:05:14,400
traditionally feminine versus 
masculine activities when we get

1127
01:05:14,400 --> 01:05:18,400
away from the core that matters,
which is that the through line 

1128
01:05:18,400 --> 01:05:21,960
for men is this protect thing, 
this I, you know, train for war 

1129
01:05:21,960 --> 01:05:23,160
thing. 
And the through line for women 

1130
01:05:23,160 --> 01:05:24,480
is they can only bear the 
children. 

1131
01:05:24,600 --> 01:05:27,440
Those are really the fundamental
differences that matter if we're

1132
01:05:27,440 --> 01:05:31,360
going to talk about gender. 
Well, I think one place that 

1133
01:05:31,360 --> 01:05:35,920
we're failing is failing to 
teach girls and boys that then 

1134
01:05:36,800 --> 01:05:40,080
the division of the human race 
into male and female is real. 

1135
01:05:40,080 --> 01:05:43,760
It's not a social construct. 
But it's real to what end? 

1136
01:05:43,760 --> 01:05:45,200
It's real to the procreative 
end. 

1137
01:05:46,560 --> 01:05:50,600
It's real again tomorrow night 
at Jay Sarah, I'm going to go 

1138
01:05:50,600 --> 01:05:52,640
over these differences with the 
parents. 

1139
01:05:52,640 --> 01:05:54,520
It's it's real in the sense 
that. 

1140
01:05:54,520 --> 01:05:59,960
You can book Doctor Saks on his.
Website see differently, they 

1141
01:05:59,960 --> 01:06:05,040
hear differently. 
They differ profoundly in how 

1142
01:06:05,280 --> 01:06:09,160
they detect odors. 
For many odors, a girl, a woman 

1143
01:06:09,160 --> 01:06:13,280
has a sense of smell that's 
100,000 times more sensible than

1144
01:06:13,280 --> 01:06:17,000
a sensitive than a boy or man. 
So a man and woman walk into a 

1145
01:06:17,000 --> 01:06:20,760
room and the woman says, Oh my 
gosh, it stinks, I'm going to 

1146
01:06:20,760 --> 01:06:22,920
throw up. 
And the man says I don't smell 

1147
01:06:22,920 --> 01:06:25,200
anything. 
And they don't understand each 

1148
01:06:25,200 --> 01:06:27,240
other because the woman's like, 
what do you mean you don't smell

1149
01:06:27,240 --> 01:06:28,880
anything? 
And he says I don't smell 

1150
01:06:28,880 --> 01:06:33,600
anything because no one has 
explained to them that gender 

1151
01:06:33,600 --> 01:06:35,640
matters. 
These these differences are 

1152
01:06:35,640 --> 01:06:37,880
real. 
I'll try one more time to see if

1153
01:06:37,880 --> 01:06:41,800
I, if we may align here at all, 
where with my current working 

1154
01:06:41,800 --> 01:06:45,200
theory, which is that the, all 
of these differences that we're 

1155
01:06:45,200 --> 01:06:48,840
talking about, that we've talked
about today, let's say many of 

1156
01:06:48,840 --> 01:06:50,760
them, you know, I'm not going to
say every single one, but many 

1157
01:06:50,760 --> 01:06:54,200
of them are connected back to 
when you go way back to the 

1158
01:06:54,200 --> 01:06:57,480
biological difference between a 
man and a woman, that men father

1159
01:06:57,480 --> 01:06:59,680
and women mother. 
And the, the way that those 

1160
01:06:59,680 --> 01:07:01,960
things happen fundamentally are 
different. 

1161
01:07:02,240 --> 01:07:04,760
And so many of these other 
traits are connected back to 

1162
01:07:04,760 --> 01:07:07,280
empowering the mother to mother 
well and the father to father 

1163
01:07:07,280 --> 01:07:14,000
well, fair or not fair. 
Evolutionary biologists are 

1164
01:07:14,000 --> 01:07:19,160
struggling to understand why 
these differences make sense. 

1165
01:07:19,160 --> 01:07:24,880
Why would it confer evolutionary
advantage for the man to smell 

1166
01:07:25,080 --> 01:07:29,320
less? 
Well, there is no consensus 

1167
01:07:29,320 --> 01:07:33,880
right now among the scholars as 
to why these differences have 

1168
01:07:33,880 --> 01:07:36,920
evolved. 
And in the absence of that 

1169
01:07:36,920 --> 01:07:40,320
consensus, I cannot endorse your
conjecture. 

1170
01:07:40,320 --> 01:07:45,320
It's it's a conjecture, but it's
not it when I speak to parents, 

1171
01:07:45,560 --> 01:07:51,960
it's evidence based parenting. 
And look, we may not be able to 

1172
01:07:51,960 --> 01:07:54,560
say with certainty why these 
differences are there, but I 

1173
01:07:54,600 --> 01:07:58,520
think it's very important for 
parents to know about the 

1174
01:07:58,520 --> 01:08:02,040
differences because the woman is
saying to your son, how can you 

1175
01:08:02,040 --> 01:08:03,640
stand it in your bedroom? 
It stinks. 

1176
01:08:03,640 --> 01:08:06,120
And the son says, I'll smell a 
little bit. 

1177
01:08:06,280 --> 01:08:09,400
And and mom thinks her son is 
being defined and disrespectful.

1178
01:08:09,400 --> 01:08:12,200
He's not, of course. 
He really doesn't smell anything

1179
01:08:12,320 --> 01:08:14,360
mom needs. 
Going back to the original 

1180
01:08:14,360 --> 01:08:17,760
example, the girl wants to play 
with a doll, The girl put her 

1181
01:08:17,760 --> 01:08:22,279
trucks into a bed to sleep. 
And the boy wants to, you know, 

1182
01:08:22,279 --> 01:08:25,359
he's tactile, he's movement. 
He, he, he's, he's conflict. 

1183
01:08:25,359 --> 01:08:27,880
He wants to move things and 
shake things up, right? 

1184
01:08:28,760 --> 01:08:30,640
Isn't it fair? 
You don't need an evolutionary 

1185
01:08:30,640 --> 01:08:34,160
biologist to tell you that The 
girl's instinct to want to 

1186
01:08:34,160 --> 01:08:37,680
nurture the doll and to notice 
the details of the doll and to 

1187
01:08:37,680 --> 01:08:41,359
nurture the truck and the boy's 
instinct to, you know, prepare 

1188
01:08:41,359 --> 01:08:43,960
himself basically for the 
conflict of all these activities

1189
01:08:43,960 --> 01:08:46,680
that he can design with them. 
Is connected. 

1190
01:08:46,680 --> 01:08:49,920
Can connect back very, very 
directly over time to the girl's

1191
01:08:49,920 --> 01:08:53,359
ability to mother and need to 
mother a tiny, tiny little 

1192
01:08:53,359 --> 01:08:57,520
infant, and the boys perhaps a 
relationship to want to protect 

1193
01:08:57,520 --> 01:09:00,000
or create structures to support 
that activity that's so 

1194
01:09:00,000 --> 01:09:02,000
fundamental to the future of the
human race. 

1195
01:09:02,560 --> 01:09:03,760
OK. 
Is it fair? 

1196
01:09:03,960 --> 01:09:06,680
It's fair. 
OK, well, we'll have to revisit 

1197
01:09:06,680 --> 01:09:09,960
this, but thank you, Doctor 
Saxon for for joining the 

1198
01:09:09,960 --> 01:09:11,000
podcast. 
It's awesome. 

1199
01:09:11,359 --> 01:09:14,279
Thank you. 
Thanks for listening to this 

1200
01:09:14,279 --> 01:09:16,000
episode of the Lila Rose 
Podcast. 

1201
01:09:16,240 --> 01:09:18,760
Check out Doctor Leonard Sachs's
work and his book at the link in

1202
01:09:18,760 --> 01:09:20,439
the bio. 
I hope you enjoyed it. 

1203
01:09:20,439 --> 01:09:22,640
And as always, don't forget. 
You can e-mail me or you can 

1204
01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:24,439
message us. 
We love hearing from you guys on

1205
01:09:24,439 --> 01:09:27,319
the show. 
My e-mail is lila@gtbmedia.com. 

1206
01:09:27,399 --> 01:09:29,560
And don't forget to subscribe 
wherever you listen to your 

1207
01:09:29,560 --> 01:09:32,359
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1208
01:09:32,359 --> 01:09:34,439
subscribed and ring that 
notification bell. 

1209
01:09:34,600 --> 01:09:35,520
We'll see you next time.