Hi everyone. I'm Sandra provenza and I'm the
host of the doctrine Earth podcast and I am so happy you
decided to join me on today's episode.
This podcast is a platform for nurses to share their Journey as
they made their way in the diverse field of nursing as
either entrepreneurs and Academia private practice or
even corporate world. I think we should celebrate just
how diverse the field of nursing is through mentoring one.
Another with the stories of our careers, nothing is too much.
Ending because each journey is unique.
This podcast will address exactly how to make the most of
your career and maybe inspire you to make a change.
If you're looking for something different, I am motivated to see
you live your best nursing life and that looks different for
everyone. Let's get started with today's
guests. Today I have the privilege of
chatting with IV a family nurse practitioner from Greenville,
North Carolina. She graduated with her BSN from
East Carolina University in 2001 and worked in various areas of
nursing, for five years before, acquiring her master's degree in
2007, she is currently enrolled in the postmasters dnp program
at ECU as a nurse practitioner. Ivy has worked for 13 years at
the CHS Pediatrics. First in Greenville, North
Carolina. She has a desire to deliver.
Excellent, patient care to help her patients, achieve Optimal
Health, as a family unit, she has obtained.
Her certificate of advanced education in obesity medicine
with Oma. She sits on their National
pediatric committee. And for the last eight years,
she's been an international board.
Certified lactation consultant IV, enjoys, her long-term
relationship with her boyfriend, Mark, as well as hiking and for,
Geography. Hi Ivy.
Thank you for coming onto the doctor nurse podcast.
Today. Thank you so much for having me.
We're going to first start with what's your current role or job
title? Explain what you do for a living
there. I'm a family nurse practitioner.
I've been at the Pediatric Office, I work at for.
This is your 13, actually starting here, 14 soon.
And I'm also a board. Certified lactation consultant
at that practice. So I actually get to see babies
for a lactation issue. He's like, tations support in
addition to seeing regular, well visits or visits, do you just
deal with moms having issues with lactation latching?
Or are you seeing anything that walks in the door?
Pediatric wise, so I can see anything that is what that kind
of comes in. So I have 18 year old patients.
I see, I have you know, newborns in addition to the lactation
Services which is a little bit of a Juggle sometimes because
when moms need help on Tell people, they don't need help.
You know Monday through Friday 8 to 5.
A lot of times they need help on the evenings or in the evenings
or on the weekends. And so some of that I have to be
a little flexible at times and I've gone in and seeing patients
on the weekend. You know if I saw them on Friday
or another provider, saw them and realized they had issues to
sort of accommodate that, but I do have scheduled times for
lactation and we try to utilize those first but I also have been
able to use Telehealth or I was one of the first providers at
our practice to really start using Telehealth and and we've
been able to increase that. And so when the pandemic hit, a
lot of prices were switching to Telehealth options.
We were already ahead of the game because I had, well, you
don't want that. And so you're giving care for
like Tatian or just anything that walks in the door with
Telehealth. So for Telehealth, I do focus a
little more on the lactation part now, but I still will see a
lot of my My attention deficit or behavioral concerns through
Telehealth. I see some rashes different
different little sicknesses like that.
You know I feel comfortable doing through Telehealth as
well. So you're on The Cutting Edge of
the Telehealth Journey that the rest of the country is now on,
which is pretty cool. What do you think is great about
it though? For a mom who has a baby at
home. That's having a breast feeding
issue, the thought of having to kind of and sometimes there are
certain issues we have to see in clinic, but sometimes I can talk
with them. Rue things.
And it's a secure site that we use, they're not having to come
into the office. They're able to be right at
home. I can see there are set up as
far as how they have their pillows plays, what options do
they have for positioning? So it gives me a little more
insight and it's a little more comfortable.
I think sometimes for them versus having to get out and try
to get to the office with a newborn.
I think it's the convenience a lot of people truly love the
convenient. I had a mom actually, right
before we jumped on, who was sending a message that Through
our portal saying, hey, I need to schedule a Telehealth for
this tomorrow. Can you can you get that
scheduled for me? A lot of our parents are really
falling in love with certain aspects of it being through
Telehealth. I remember when I was a new mom,
you're right having to juggle the baby bag.
On top of that, I bring enough toys and oh my gosh, I have the
baby putting him in the car seat.
Is he perfectly in the car seat? There's so much anxiety when
you're trying to take a newborn that it would be.
So nice to just be able to open your computer.
And have somebody there to help you.
That's really cool. That's a neat service.
You guys are offering. So, how did you choose what
you're doing right now? What was your specific journey
to this position and this job? So, when my mom, well, I was 13
at the time. My mom and I were involved in a
very serious car accident and it was driver side impact.
She was hit, they estimated. We were basically at a stoplight
and just started to advance and she was hit in the door.
They estimated going 75 to 85. Miles around, and she was
airlifted from our local facility to a level one.
Trauma center and a trauma surgeon saved her life.
And so, I was 13 at the time, and I actually thought I was
going to be a trauma surgeon. And when I started looking at
that, I realized I wanted a little more interaction with
patient. I started praying about it and I
really felt led to go to nursing school and so I said, okay God,
if I get accepted Nursing school that I'm going to trust that
swear. I meant to be and I was
accepted. And I started at East Carolina
University, Go Pirate, in Greenville, North Carolina.
And so, I did my bachelor's in nursing and then I became a
nurse on the cardiac Intermediate Unit, which I
loved. And I still I'm passionate about
cardiac nursing but at the time I started feeling led to
consider the nurse practitioner program at the time I was on
that unit. I work night.
They basically were not going to be able to offer me a Add a
position and I knew I could not go back to school or work and
night, so it's just not going to be feasible for me.
So, a friend said, have you ever thought about newborn Nursery?
We love it down here, you love kids.
And I babysat all through college and and I do have a
passion for children and I said, okay, I've never thought about
newborn Nursery but I'm going to apply and see and in the end of
my interview, the unit manager said, Well normally we have a
long list of candidates but everybody, we called had already
found another job or just wasn't interested.
Come into the nursery, she's like, when can you start?
And so, I transferred to the newborn nursery and I remember,
I started taking some of my basic classes.
I was really nervous about applying to the nurse
practitioner program and several of the ladies prayed with me, I
said again, God at this is your plan then it's going to the door
is going to open and it did. And so I started the journey for
the nurse practitioner program and I've completed that and in
the middle of that the position of Assistant.
That was working with dr. Holbrook, who is the owner of
the practice? At the time?
One of the owners was going to retire and they approached me
and said, would you like a position and I really had not
fully considered Pediatrics. So I did a rotation with their
office and I fell in love with her office.
I guess the rest is sort of History.
So what made you? Because I heard you say, I
decided to go be a nurse practitioner like, what was that
turning point for you? What made you decide?
I'm interested in this role. I think for being a new album.
To advance my education. I knew I wanted to be a little
more involved in making the decisions for my patient.
I value bedside nursing. I think it's an excellent.
It's actually roll on, we need more bedside.
Nurses. And we know that we're in a
shortage actually right now, but I think it's going to probably
get worse with the pandemic and we're seeing nursing burnout.
And so I do value those. No, those nurses that I valued
that role and I learned a lot in that that time.
But I knew I wanted a little more involvement.
With my patient. One of the things I didn't like
is we take care of in the hospital and we send them home
and we don't have those connections and I guess I sort
of have the mindset of the Little Country Doctor, I grew up
in a very rural part of North Carolina and eventually, God,
may leave me back there, but he hasn't yet.
I want to know, I want to go to the kids ballgame.
I want to be the provider who watches them grow up, and I've
had already some patients who were older when I started at the
practice time at who are now coming back with their babies.
And so I'm getting to see sort of those Rations and, and really
fell apart of their family at times.
And I think that's one of the things that makes us different
as a nurse practitioners. I think we have that connection
piece, sometimes that I think sometimes is potentially missing
and other Healthcare roles, and I love that I have had kids that
have asked me to go to their Christmas programs.
And I try to find a way to go to their Christmas programs.
And, you know, obviously, I can't go for every kid and I
can't go every year, but those are things that I think are
important to kids. That's one of the things that I
also liked about nursing was the ability that I felt like we had
to connect to patients in a way that just felt really real and
tangible compared to what I saw in Physicians where they just
kind of walk in. They give a diagnosis.
They got what the plan and they just walk out.
I felt the same way that like nurse practitioners tended, to
be more, the role of just listening.
And I think that goes back to our nursing training and one of,
you know, the nursing empathy that we're To just put yourself
in people's shoes and it just exudes itself when you're a
nurse practitioner because you don't know how to be any other
way but that way so it's like I've just I've got a little more
knowledge. I've got a little more
understanding but I'm still a nurse and I say that it's funny.
You say it that way but you know I said that to one of my
physician colleagues one day and her response was but you're a
provider now and I'm like but you have to understand, I will
always be A nurse and and that is our mindset and it is very,
very different, you know, I think.
We and if you look at some of the studies you know I'm back in
school now and so I'm juggling a lot of different learning needs
and for myself and growing in that area.
But we tend to definitely have that patient Focus, which can be
bad sometimes because we can, you know, take it to a little
extreme. I think some people do but so
it's about But we focus more on our there and all their needs
met. Does this Mom, if you, if you're
going to send in this prescription, can she afford
that? Are you going to tell her to
take this, you know, put this baby on formula and she can't
afford a forty seven dollar can of formula because it's a
special brand. Have you really considered that
I think are nursing Rowley as bedside?
Nurses were able to sort of work through that.
That and our training in general.
I think what you're talking about is the forest through the
trees, like holistically. I felt like my training was
constantly reminding me. Holistic Viewpoint, don't just
look at the individual issue. Look at the full person.
I agree with you 100% on that. So IV give me an example of one
of your biggest challenges and one of your biggest successes in
your career, to where you are now.
Stuff because I could think of a lot of challenges do.
I think for me right now, a challenge that I have and it's
not just it's not just in my practice.
I want to be very clear about that.
But the lactation roll, sometimes I think it's very hard
for pediatricians are providers in the Pediatric world to sort
of bring like, Tatian Consultants to the table and I
think that they They struggle sometimes with that, I think
it's easy for them to say, especially if they are female
and they breastfed, I think it's very easy for them to say, oh I
breastfed a baby and I know this is how it's supposed to go, and
sometimes I feel sort of caught in the middle because now I've
got a mom who's calling me and they're saying this isn't going
well, but yet I have a provider who saying, well, it's going
great. And I think you're doing fine
and I have no concerns. And so I think that's probably
my biggest Biggest struggle right now is how to find that
happy medium ballot and of course my patients are always
going to come first and I think some people don't necessarily
they see that. Maybe it's negative that I'm
going to be a little more patient advocate.
And so I don't know if that's an ego thing or what the situation
is with that. I still struggle with finding
out exactly what causes that. I was going to ask you what you
think is the reason for the discrepancy between what you're
getting from the patient and what the, you know, the provider
is saying because I remember when I was a nurse IV and I
would walk into the room or the patient would tell me.
Like my pain is a 10/10 and so I would go like okay let me get
the doctor and then I'd walk with the doctor and the patient
would be just like I'm fine. And I'm like, you did not just
tell me like two seconds ago when I was in here.
That there was a Current story and now you're changing it.
Do you think it's something like that?
Or do you think it's that doctors aren't hearing their
patients or other providers aren't truly listening to their
patients? Because I do also seen that from
the, from the side of the patient where I've gone to see a
provider. And I'm describing something, or
I'm trying to explain something, and they're almost like
railroading me. I don't know if that's the right
word but to their just like completely ignoring what I'm
saying and I'm like, you're not You're sending me and I know I'm
speaking in a way, that's very clear.
So, I do think, I think sometimes it can be, we're not
sitting down and listening with the patient.
I've had a couple patients who had breast feeding issues from
the get-go and now I'm just sort of finding out behind the eight
ball so to speak that they were having all these issues and I
think part of it is, we just didn't sit down with the mom and
say, let's talk about what's really going on.
I think that guy that can play You play a huge role.
And I think, for some women even now, this is the first, they're
the first generation in their family, to breastfeed, you know,
we've got a long history of women who were told not to
breastfeed for various reasons and we could have a whole
separate conversation on that. And so we have some women who
they don't have a mom, who breastfed.
They may not even have a friend to who breastfed for greater
than a few weeks. Or, you know, if they're talking
about I wanted to do, and I like the term extended breastfeeding,
but that's what we call it because I think babies should be
able to choose sort of when they, when they're ready to
wean. Self weaning, not dictated by
all they turn a year, boom. Let's stop them from
breastfeeding. And, you know, some of your big
organizations, still really say, a year to a year, and I think
some of that is have to have some goals and so that can be
considered a goal for moms because we want them to
breastfeed. Longer.
But I also think that for some people in their mind, always
supposed to be a year. And if we get past that your
point, you're doing something odd, you know, or it's not
beneficial to the baby in the mom and I'm like, that is not
true. So ivy can I say something
really fast? I surely am breastfeeding a 20
month old baby? I love it.
I so love that you were like
totally like pushing this because I get so much Black from
co-workers because I still have to pump occasionally at work,
not all the time but sometimes at work I have to pump and
people are like you're still doing that and I am so
emboldened. I'm like yep.
And then I remember Allah. So, I took my little bags of
milk and I put it in the refrigerator, no.
But like, it was just so funny, and I love that you're
supporting this because I feel in my heart, I'm supposed to do
this, and I feel it in my soul that Benji's and my son's name
is Benjamin still needs milk and he hasn't wean himself off.
And so I'm like whenever he's ready, you know, and by the
grace of God which is complete, it is completely from the Lord
that I still have leche. I just decided Added whenever
he's ready. He'll make a clear and then
we'll make the move. But I don't feel I and I am
telling you. I've gotten so much slack about
it, so it is such. I would love it.
So much to have a provider like just, you know, encourage me.
I've been if we lived in other countries, it would be totally
accepted as the norm. And, and I think that that's
sort of, we have to change the mindset of the culture here that
it is a okay, and I think it starts with the providers.
And I think it starts with this is much encouragement.
You know, we have a lactation support group that I lead and,
and, you know, those moms are so great and we do it once a month,
Zoom right now meeting and they're able to kind of support
each other. Because again, some of those
moms in that group or that I see, they don't have anybody to
really be their cheerleader. And I true, the role that You
have to play one of the roles as a lactation consultant is.
You have to play that and I think for some providers that's
really really hard for them to grasp.
So what do you mean you're talking to this Mom at 7:30 at
night? Well, okay, she had an issue and
that can't wait, can't really wait.
Sometimes and, you know, I've been on vacation and did a
Telehealth from the mountains because the mom had issues and
was in tears. And that mom's gone on to
breastfeed. I think we're at, we have to at
least At Alma said a year now because of the timing of the
trip and so had she not had that encouragement would she have
continued? I don't know the answer to that
but by mine sort of thinks she may not have.
Or if she'd had the mom there who said, well, I gave you
formula just, you know, you need rest.
Give you, you know, because Mom's are moms want to be
protective of us. And so that's sort of their
protectiveness mechanism. I've had an interesting
conversation with my mom as well, where she would kind of go
like, okay, are you getting enough nutrition?
And because they're worried about About your their baby,
right? And so they want to make sure
that you're taking care of yourself and that's important
for breastfeeding, moms to have encouragement tips on how to
keep going, because it is something that, you know, I
remember reading a statistic, we're like one in ten.
Women are breastfeeding working moms or breastfeeding six
months. I think it was.
And I remember thinking one in ten moms or breastfeeding at six
months that are Working and it's because the system is not built
to keep those moms encouraged and to keep them working and
also being able to provide you know milk for their children and
so you're so rundown. But I'm so thankful that my job
that I currently have is encouraging of moms and just
gives you the space and so they're like we need to set your
schedule up so that you can go and do this and all that kind of
advocacy and change. So the system is what I think
this country needs to do. Because if we do think that our
children are the most important things, and breast milk is an
incredible resource for them. Then why wouldn't we set up the
system to make more mom's successful at this?
It's not for everyone. And so, if this is something
that if you're not able to do, or it's hard for you, or you're
not having, you're not enjoying this and you want to stop or
whatever, the reason is, you know, of course, we're not
pushing right now, anything on people.
But it's it's of the It's of my mindset that man, if we could
just have more mom's encouraged than, I think that we would have
a higher compliance. For example, I have a friend
who's a PA who legitimately told me she had to stop breastfeeding
because her son's breastfeeding time was cutting into her
patient load and how much she would get paid per patient.
And so, she looked at how much formula would cost versus seeing
the patients that she could see and She said that she was going
to be making more money to see the patient then to continue
breastfeeding. And I was like, why is this
system designed this way? Yeah, this moment to continue
breastfeeding if it wasn't for her job and it was just a cyst
disheartening, the other going to be outside this, you know, we
have a country that, you know, I'm big on pediatric obesity, I
sit on the oh, Mac, pediatric committee and which is a
national board. And you know, that's that's a
passion I have. Well, it's very Ink to
breastfeeding. We know that those babies tend
to have lower issues with obesity later on in life and it
helps so many benefits to Mom, too.
But we need to look at our society and I think, if that's
the one thing, the pandemic has taught us.
We have a problem with people who have it.
Be City in are overweight. Let's say it the right way.
Yeah, we have a problem, they need help.
And so I think it's very easy to say, get out there and exercise,
get out there and choose a healthy diet.
And that doesn't address all the issues that is important
important component. But we need to go back to the
drawing board and say, what are the things we can do.
And one of the things we need to do is we need to promote
breastfeeding, we're helping in that issue and start with that.
And I tell give a lecture and I say, when does obesity
management start in the Pediatric population?
And a lot of people say, oh, well when they're too, or I have
different answers that I've been given, but I always say it
starts when moms Pregnant because we need to address with
her how important it is for her to breastfeed for her health and
also for her baby's Health. Wow, you start to realize that
this starts even before you come out of your mom's womb that this
programming is going on inside your cells.
I don't disagree with you. I think that you are 100%
correct. And I think it does require a
shift and I think we have to create systems that allow women
to be able to comply with really something that is so important
to the beginning of your life, to the end.
Like it begins to shape the trajectory of where you go.
So we talked a little bit about your biggest challenge.
What about one of your biggest successes?
I think for May 7th, my biggest successes have actually been
through my patients. I have some patience.
You know, I've mentioned the Obesity that I really have a
strong passion for that. I have a few patients right now
that really struggled and we are really on the right track and
they're making such good healthy choices and I can sort of feel
like I'm a part of their success and so to me knowing that
they're going to be healthier, I consider that a successful
moment as a provider, I think going through the certification
for my lactation and at the time I didn't have as much support as
I have more support now but that was a challenge and I think wow
I was Actually pretty successful to make it and to pass boards on
the first time. And so, I think there's been
little successes along the way I witnessed her ass.
I have had one giant success, although some people might say
different, but and you said you're currently going to school
right now. There are I made the decision
after a lot of almost a pressure but they did.
I was teaching for ECU and also I teach some for you and C as
well just classes here and there but I have Didn't I have nurse
practitioner students? I have for years, I'm very
passionate about having students.
It's very difficult for a nurse practitioner program to find
placement for a Pete for Pediatric.
And I actually have three ECU nurses Nurse Practitioner
students right now in one semester, so it's been a
challenging, but a good semester there.
There are three great students are going to be awesome
additions to the the profession and I'm excited for them, but I
made the decision. Vision that I should consider
going by for my doctorate because when I came through the
ECU program was a master's level, and there's a couple
reasons for that one. Is if my students are going to
be held at that level, I should be at that level.
And the second reason, is it opens the door if I ever decide
I want to teach more there, certain positions in, you know,
universities that I wouldn't be qualified with just a master's
ivy. I think that is amazing.
I have my doctorate and the name of this podcast is the doctor
nurse podcast, because I feel so passionately that as nurses, we
should reach the highest level of Education that we possibly
can. And I love to hear when nurses
are like, I'm not done, I'm going to keep going back and I'm
going to keep learning because I believe that that we set
ourselves apart it's necessary. But it is something that I think
shows other, you know, students like you're saying or other
providers that I don't. I take my nursing career very
seriously and I have pushed myself to get, get everything I
can from this educational process that I have a career in.
And so I admire that so much that makes my heart so happy to
hear because it was the same part and And that drove me to
get my doctorate as well. Well, thank you for that any
mentors. Do you have anybody helping you
along the way there are, I will say this.
I've always loved. You see you.
And I knew, you know at this is my third degree from them and
some people say oh you should go to a different school and I just
knew that I needed to go after going through the mattress
program there and how well I was trained and how passionate they
are. I knew that was where I want to
go for my doctorate and my Parents unfortunately had covid
in November and EC you had actually, as part of trying to
figure out how do we do school with the pandemic, had students
start early and end the semester by Thanksgiving.
And my parents got sick, the Sunday after Thanksgiving.
And so I've always said that that was a blessing that, you
know, if they had to get sick, I mean it was all, it's still bad.
My mom's doing A lot of health problems from it but God just
sort of made sure that that was protected.
But with that said, so many of the professor's.
As soon as they found out immediately, what can we do?
What do you need, how can we help you?
You know, your semesters done, don't.
But if you need something next semester or even even in between
and so, you know dr. Tillman is my advisor, but I
consider her a good friend. Dr. Michelle Skipper, she's the
head of the The program. I mean, she's been great.
And then dr. Hodges, she's a friend.
And we actually went through the master's program together and
she's had her doctorate for a while, but she was really
encouraged me to go back and they've all just really
supported me. And, you know, even even through
this semester just sort of checked in, are you okay?
I was very hesitant to take two classes.
This semester just with everything going on with my
parents and I'm not going to lie there some days.
I'm like, I don't know how I'm keeping all these glass balls
up. The Lord does and I'm going to
trust him but they encouraged me.
They said I think that you know, they said I really think you're
going to be fine but if you get into trouble you talk to us and
we will let you take an incomplete or we'll figure out
whatever we need to do at that point.
And so I as of right now, no, not everything's turned in, I
have to Ace and those classes and I just, I give it, I think
it's just really their encouragement that I can do
this, you know, balancing things, it's hard.
There's some tights that. You know, it's a long night, and
I'm working through lunch on a paper and, you know, but I see
that light at the end of the tunnel, I can't get it out.
I'm very glad that I went ahead and did that because it would
have delayed it. I think you actually would have
ended up delaying my graduation a little bit really, really
proud of you. Thank you.
Last question. What advice do you have for any
nurses that are just starting off in their careers?
I think two things that I really think we don't address enough
with with new nurses and that's whether you're a new Brand new
nurse, or if you're down a new role as a nurse practitioner,
you need to make sure you have self care and you need to accept
that it is. Okay, to take care of you.
I think it's really easy to get burnout.
I think during the pandemic we've seen that at much, higher
levels for many reasons, but I also think that nurses tend to
be the ones who take care of themselves.
Laughs, the reality is we have to put ourselves first and I'm
still learning this. So there's plenty of times that
I don't put IV first. So, I mean, I'm preaching to the
choir here on this, but you definitely have to learn self
care. I think that self care is vital,
that convey being 10 minutes of a walk or, you know, one of the
things I've learned to do is no matter how crazy my day is at
the office that I can have days where I work.
I mean, I'm booked through lunch sometimes when you've been there
for a while, if you have a lot of patience and it's a little
bit harder. I don't say no very easily, but
what I'm learning is it's okay to take 10 minutes to go to
stretch and stand outside and just take a deep breath.
It's Okay, to take a few minutes and, and meditate, I love yoga.
I keep a yoga mat in my office. Sometimes it's nothing more than
a few minutes of yoga, or I have about 10 minutes to play.
And so, I think that's one of the number.
One thing I would say is self-care, but I also would say,
make sure you take care of your family too.
Because I think it's very easy to, but your family below.
Other people sometimes, especially if you're an advanced
practice role, I think I see that a little more.
With that because the one thing about being a nurse at the
hospital if you're a bedside nurse, you clock out and for the
most part, you don't tell always take it home.
You may take emotions home, you may take some of that home.
One of the things I have on my door, as I come in from the
garage, is your home now? It's okay to breathe and I have
that up there and I literally sometimes just look at it and
say, okay, I'm home now. Everything is at the office.
Yes, I'm breastfeeding, questions may come up, yes, some
other things may come up but Home and I can so I think
putting your family up there and yourself.
Alrighty. So the last part of this podcast
is just rapid. Fire questions, subdue, three
questions of quick, rapid-fire questions and then we'll wrap it
up. What is your most used Emoji?
I'll heart. And what book are you currently
reading day? I am currently reading the new
book and I can't remember the title of.
It's just come out. Oh my gosh, I can't remember.
I just got it yesterday and I just started it.
It's it's a family that does the, the Christmas Jammies.
Have you seen them? No.
Okay, they're so hilarious. But anyway, they actually live
in North Carolina, which is where I'm from, and they wrote a
just fin. Its fin has the guy's name, oh,
I have to, I have to send it to you, but it's a great book.
Well, I really read a little bit awesome.
Okay. And then if you could win an
Olympic medal for any sport, real or fake, what would it be?
So I am not athletic. I would probably say if I could
be great at any sport that I would love to be great at
skiing. I've always wanted to be a great
skier, but I am not talented. And so I've broken both my feet
and other accidents. That's why not there?
I'm not sure. I need to get on skis.
Well, that's a wrap. Thank you so much for coming
onto the podcast today and chatting with me.
It's been an absolute Joy. You are so amazing and I'm so
just your, I'm your fan with getting your doctorate degree.
Well, done. Keep going.
We can do hard things. He's so much.
Yeah, thanks for coming on, and we'll catch you next time.
Sounds great. Well, we're at the end of our
time together. I hope you enjoyed the chat.
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