Hi there. My name is dr.
Presenta, and I'm the host of the doctor nurse podcast.
I'm an advanced nurse practitioner and I want to be
your guide into the world of nursing professions.
This podcast is a platform for nurses to share their Journeys
as they made their way in the diverse field of nursing as
either entrepreneurs, Academia private, practice or even the
corporate world. I think we should celebrate just
how diverse the field of nursing is through mentoring one.
Another, with the stories of our career.
Our Journeys, nothing is too mundane because each journey is
unique. This podcast will showcase
career options to encourage nurses to view their degrees
with a business mindset. After all we work in the
healthcare business and ultimately I hope I might
inspire you to make a change. If you're looking for something
different, I am motivated to see you live, your best, nursing
life and that looks different for everyone.
Thanks for joining me on today's podcast.
And let's get started with today's guests.
Hi Hanna, welcome onto the doctor nurse podcast.
I'm so happy to have you on today.
Hannah is the owner CEO of the Blue Ridge.
Medical legal Consulting, business that she is the legal
nurse for and she also works as an out piece of surgery.
Nurse. She's in both worlds right now
which is something that me at the doctor podcast from really
really likes nurses that are pursuing also not just hospital
jobs but also finding their niches in other areas.
And she's Contracting with another legal nurse consulting,
firm to find cases. It's apply the Hannah and choice
being outdoors reading and he's gotten recently addicted to
baking from the pandemic. Aisha's, been watching the
British cooking show the greatest cooking show, they can
show Great British baking show. She got addicted to making.
So yeah, that's Hannah. She's gonna explain to us guys,
her journey to Legal Nurse Consulting.
What took her there and share? How and What she's doing right
now with her career? Welcome Hannah.
I'm so happy to have you on today.
Thanks for having me. I appreciate it.
Yeah. So Hannah, let's Dive Right In.
What is your current role? Your job title or explained it a
little bit, but really explain what you do for a living.
So what I did for a living right now, I work in an outpatient
Endoscopy Center, so I do that for days a week, for eight hour
shifts and then the rest of my time is spent on my business.
Basically, I am an independent legal nurse Consultants.
Are acting right now. But yeah that's basically what I
do. We work at the Endoscopy Center.
You said you work how many hours of 32 hours a week right now. 39
about 8 to 15 hours, a ditional, or spent on my business, that's
a pretty good mix in argue. Just helping with people going
to sleep, waking up, making sure they're ready for a procedures.
Or are you involved in what aspect of the endoscopy?
Are you involved in? So, the nurses basically run the
center, it's one Organization, three different centers.
So we do the pre-op side, we also are the nurse in the
procedure room and we do the post office.
And so we can also do the surgical tech role if needed.
So we kind of do everything and just kind of show up and do
whatever we need to got. Ya and then tell us about your
side, hustle your business, what you got going on there, which is
pretty cool. So yeah, start it.
So I wanted to be a legal nurse consultant basically, since I
was a new grad, I just thought it was is really cool.
I loved how the nurses got to work with the attorneys and be
an influential role in a bunch of, you know, really important
medical cases. When I had been a nurse for
about two years, I emailed a legal nurse consultant,
Pennsylvania and asked her advice on what I should do.
And she basically told me I needed a lot more experience,
could because legal nurse Consultants drawn, a lot of
their own nursing experience. That's like, what's your
marketing? Your marketing yourself.
Basically to the attorneys. Got it.
So I A formed my career so that I would get the experience.
I wanted to, I spent the next seven years in the trauma
center. In Baltimore, Maryland, I worked
in three different units that are kind of built up, everything
I needed to work in the a lot of the medical malpractice cases
and then to well year and a half ago.
Now, at the beginning of the pandemic April 4th 2020, I
registered my LLC and then the pandemic it so that kind of set
everything back but I officially started work.
On my legal Consulting, business and December 2020, and having
kind of slowly building it up from there.
Cool. Now, whenever you decided or you
found interest in the career and she told you, you didn't have
enough experience. So, use that.
Okay. I'm going to go into the areas
where I think it will give me the experience I need.
How did you know that? Like, how did you know that
trauma would be where you need to go for that?
Because I kept seeing Billboards and ads for all the lawyers who
you like if you were in a car accident, call us.
So I was like, hey, that's looks like a good Area.
That's really smart and I just found it fascinating.
Yeah. And so, how long did you work in
trauma before you went into legal nurse Consulting?
How many years, 7 years, 7 years as a nurse there.
And then I realized I couldn't really do this for my entire
life anymore. So I thought it was time to
start, you know, looking into legal Consulting.
I remember in your journey you had said that you went from
trauma to ICU or were you in the ICU trauma.
So yes to both the The are atoms Cali Center.
In Baltimore is the only Standalone Shock Trauma Center
in the entire world so it's basically its own hospital.
So I started out on like an intermedia care unit and then I
went to two of their icy use. Go kind of did the whole gamut.
We'll probably kind of segue into the next question.
So how did you get there? What was your specific Journey
from the time that you decided? I'm going to be a nurse to.
Alright, I'm now opening my own practice walk us through the
beginning of part of your It's probably where I'd like to
start. So I should probably preface
this by saying that I got into nursing because I thought it was
cool. When I was 15, people have these
stories of how they want to help people want out, which is great.
And I do, you know, enjoy helping people but I literally
thought it was cool when I was a teenager.
So that's how I got into it. So I started working at Hopkins
in organ transplant for my first new grad job.
Yeah. Totally like her, very specific.
Random unit. And I burned out there.
I've burned out at three of my four jobs.
He's so burned out there didn't really recognize it at the time,
but I moved that's when I moved to the trauma center.
You know, something I've always been interested in and just talk
to the legal nurse consultants in this kind of trying to plan
my career. So I moved there.
The first job I had, there was amazing.
I loved it. I moved out of it because it
wasn't an ICU and I wanted. I see your experience.
So I went to a an ECMO trauma unit and ECMO is the lung bypass
that's extra Corporal membranous oxygen is a It's basically like
the lung and heart bypass and I burned out there too and I left
there after a year because I just could, wow, I couldn't
handle it anymore and it's then I moved to a neuro trauma ICU
which I loved like, I loved all my coworkers.
I liked the patient's. My managers were amazing but I
had it up burning out there too and I realized it at the
beginning of the pandemic and that's when I started looking
into getting into Luke who solely because I was like, okay,
Now's the Time maybe bed size, just not for me anymore.
I've got the experience I want. So it's time to come to do
everyone and myself a favor and move on.
Yeah, so whenever you first be decided to become a nurse or
heard you said you were 15 years old?
Did you go and get your associates degree?
Did you then get your bachelor's degree?
I went to Howard Community College, which is an associate's
degree College in Columbia, Maryland.
And I did that, because my dad said he'd pay for one degree,
and I was like, all right, so, I better get this degree.
So I went there got my associates degree started
working as a nurse lived at home until age, 25.
When I bought my house and it's, I looked at home, I was able to
save, you know, a lot of money. So I was able to buy my house
and pay for my bachelor's degree, which I did online at
Ohio, and I wanted to graduate without any student debt.
So that's what I did. And it worked out pretty well.
I feel like if I have a friend who's from Ohio State and every
place we were go, he would keep going.
Oh wait, Ayo and I was so sweet. I was so like stupid because he
was just saying that I was like, what are you doing?
Why are you doing that to people?
And you know, he was like it spells Ohio fuck.
Oh, my mom always laughs at me because I have an Ohio State
sweatshirt, but since I went online, I didn't like get the
full experience, so I'll be wearing it, like around a DC or
whatever, and people, yellow a chat me, it'll just go straight
up on my head. I just don't ask her and she
yells at, for me, she loves to be over time.
Yeah. No, because I what I watch that
interaction. I was like oh, that's kind of
cool. Like I wish we had something
like that. Yeah, yeah.
So okay, so you go get your bachelor's degree, your dad
offers to pay for your Associates which is hilarious.
Make sure you get your Bachelors but you're at home.
You buy a house which is awesome.
And then you spend the next seven years as you walked us
through in the trauma, either in the ICU setting or in the
intermediate step down type settings.
Yeah, and then burning through and burning out of these
critical care jobs. Where you're working as an ICU
nurse leads you to this legal nurse Consulting.
So I'm sure a lot of our nurses are interested because you see
these flyers, they come to your mailbox like be a legal nurse
consultant. I've gotten them because I was
interested in it and I kind of didn't really understand like
what they did. So could you walk us through
really? What a legal nurse consultant,
how she's involved in the the legal atmosphere?
Yes, a legal nurse Consultants. Basically interpret where the
medical resources for attorneys. So just like being an ICU nurse
like a legal consultant, you can do a ton of different things.
So there are at the legal nurse Consultants, who are expert
Witnesses in their field. There are the ones who do just
workman's compensation. They're the ones who do the
medical exams with the Physicians.
What I do right now is the medical record review and report
writing the attorneys will basically send me men.
Uncle records. However, many files, they got
the most I've had, I think was, like, 15,000 pages of medical
records that you then have to comb through and write a report
on. And it's usually at first a
merit review. So we read through the records,
we determine if there was negligence malpractice anything
like that. We make a recommendation to the
attorney based on our findings, and then they either take the
case or they drop the case, and if they decide to take the case,
then usually they'll send the records back to us.
On with any additional ones that they found and we write what's
called a chronology report. So that's basically listing out
and table form, every single medical record listing out all
of the inaccuracies, all the discrepancies, all the missing
records that are mentioned in the medical records that we have
and then we send that report back to them and then they take
it from there. Interesting.
You're kind of the go-between to determine if the case is is
worth taking. If you look at a case and you
go, it's pretty Ironclad like everybody did what they were
supposed to do. Then I'm attorney will go.
Okay, yeah, okay, well then I won't take this case, but if
you're like, no, this is a mess. This is bad.
I don't know what your terminology is like, this is a
tort or, but if you're like, this seems to be evidence of
negligence. But yeah, that and then that
what's, what? Prompts them to go.
Okay, great. Well, then we'll go ahead and
take this and will pursue it for legal recourse.
Yes, which is pretty neat. And so what are the other areas
that your career can go into? Is there other things that you
see yourself going into with this legal nurse consulting?
Or is this really where you want to stay?
No, I actually would like to do forensics.
I've always been interested in forensics and more of like, the
criminal cases. So I actually took to forensic
classes in college because I was so interested in it and I still
have the textbooks for though. So my dream would be be to
become a forensics legal, nurse consultant expert and kind of
work in that area. Okay.
Is this like CSI type stuff or like Special Victims?
Unit A little bit? Yeah, so it would be more more
of the like, the criminal cases, the murders.
The strangulations, the dead bodies found was this fell play?
Was it natural death? That sort of situation.
So, legal nurse Consultants? Nurses, they work on these
cases. Yep.
Yeah. We do interest.
We can look Pictures. Look at a body and especially
with a trauma background. Like I have we can tell them
kind of what caused it. Things like that.
Interesting. Yeah.
So what are some of the things that you had to do to get your
legal nurse Consulting, certification.
So there are several ways to do it.
You really don't need a certification to become a legal
nurse Consultants. I wanted it because I know that
attorneys. Look at a certification more
than experience just in my personal experience.
So it's easier to say like hey I have this certification then hey
look at all my years of experience, let me show you how
that can help you. So I went through, it's called
Ellen ceased at with RN Market, okay?
Yes, they actually it was a really good program.
It was 120 credit hours of Education, they have provided a
massive comprehensive education on what legal nurse Consultants
do. They gave me a whole marketing
package. They gave me my website.
It was a really, really good training and then they gave me.
It's called the It's legal nurse consultant certification, which
is their own, they have their own organization, their own
certification. So, that's what I got.
Did you have to take a test in order to graduate from this
program? Yes.
Yeah, there were multiple quizzes throughout the program,
and then a test at the End plus to practice cases, start to
finish that. They graded and gave me feedback
on. Wow, is very is very involved
and very, very good. I'm very glad I did it.
How long did it take you to complete the certification about
two months? I did it pretty fast.
Fast. They give you, I believe six
months to a year to complete it but I, you know, this was in
February 2020, so I didn't know the world was going to shut
down. I was like, that's a big, let's
get this rolling soon as fast. Good for you.
The legal nurse Consulting. Certification was it's super
expensive just for my own like edification.
I'm just wondering. It was about six thousand
dollars. Whoa.
That is not cheap. No, it's not cheap.
But they do have a guarantee that if you don't get a first
case, you get all of it back. So what?
Yeah basically one Percent guarantee that you'll get at
least your first case. Wow so yeah, that's good to know
and I was like, whoa - well you know, worst thing is I get a
case. Do they help you get a case or
do you have to pursue it? Like in this group that you're a
part of whenever you work with this Consulting Group, do they
find the cases for you? Do they show up at your door?
Like how does it happen? They give you all the marketing
resources that you need and then they basically tell you how to
do it and then you have to Market to people in your area
and figure out kind of how It works for you.
How do you fight get people? Like you don't, you're not
ambulance-chasing right now. I have I have my website.
I have business cards, they actually really advocate for
packets. They say that attorneys.
Never open the regular the regular size envelopes.
They opened the big envelopes first, but they tell you to put
all your marketing materials in one of those big 9 by 12.
Envelopes mail, it to the attorneys, followed up with a
phone call. And the attorneys will probably
open your package first when they get them out, interesting,
you Market to the attorneys and then they send you business, S,
you just go just within your local area or do you send
packets to like everybody I've just been the local are at right
now but with the subcontracting I'm doing, I'm working mainly
with the attorneys. Well the attorney cases I don't
work with the attorneys particularly when I got
Contracting but from Georgia Florida and California for my
marketing purposes. It's mainly just the Maryland DC
area. Don't you?
And then the group that you're a part of they send out to farther
places? Yes, they do the marketing for
me basically. And you do the cases for them
and then for your like, your own work, use in cases, you send
your name out to people around you and then they send you
business as well. Yeah, you kind of have like two
sources of input for business. You're double-dipping in the
area around, you getting known locally which is really smart,
because those are the people that they're kind of in your
Niche, they know. Yeah, you're in your area, but
this is all women-owned businesses are big now.
So this is smart super smart Hannah.
Wow. Okay, cool.
Since Owning your own business and kind of pursuing that what
have you found as you've gone about kind of working in both
worlds is working in the hospital, kind of fuel, your
desire for entrepreneurship or is it vice versa?
Has your entrepreneurship, made you appreciate your role in the
hospital? A little bit of both.
I really enjoy making my own schedule working when I want to
having weekends and holidays off, I do miss the Hustle and
bustle of the I see you. I feel like I thrive in that
environment, so kind of both kind of both a little bit.
Uh, yeah. Okay, yeah.
Also, do you think that over time you would like to be more
in an entrepreneurial role in step back from the hospital?
Or do you always want to be an okay?
That's kind of you're in goal. Yeah, I specifically got this
outpatient job because I can slowly scale back on that.
While I build up my business to kind of transition out, very
smart, very smart well throughout your journey and
you've Blend it really well. Kind of your process to how you
got to where you are today. Could you give us one of the big
success that you had in your career, a high that you look
back and you go? That was that was a really neat
moment as a nurse or even in your legal nurse Consulting
career. Well, recently, I got a case in
my legal nurse Consulting career.
It was a pretty involved case. I don't know exactly how much I
could say, but basically the patients had died.
Unfortunately, from after a Surgery and I look to the
medical records. I did all my research, things
like that, the family wanted to sue because they thought that
the nursing home that they had sent him to had done something
wrong, because he basically was in the hospital went to nursing
home for one night, they found him unresponsive in the morning,
went back to the hospital and he eventually died so that they
they thought the nursing home. Yeah, it was really sad.
They thought the nursing hope did something wrong so they were
trying to see them but it turns out that it was actually just a
really terrible rare. Complication, which I
discovered, we sent that back to attorney that the attorney
decided not to take the case, which is really.
It was a very, very sad outcome for the family and the patient,
but I, I did appreciate that. We could get to the root cause
of the problem and provide them with an answer.
Even if that meant, not suing and not getting any monetary
compensation for the, yeah, I feel like, what you just
provided was closure, right? Yep.
Yeah, whenever you are a pair of mother or Father, that's your
parent. You do kind of want to know.
Okay. Well, did somebody just like,
not check on my dad and, you know, like and it's just like,
no he had a really rare complication from surgery and
that's the risk that you take with those surgeries.
When those people Sue they just want closure, they want someone
to pay someone to tell them what happened.
So yeah, it was good that we were able to provide them.
Interesting. That's really cool.
And then tell me about one of the biggest challenges in your
career. Mean, you've talked about
burnout Multiple jobs. I see you jobs and given the
atmosphere of covid and everyone's just and I kind of
struggle a little bit because I do feel nurses, we are super
resilient so there's a part of me that's wanting to make sure I
keep encouraging. I don't want us to be
discouraged and I don't want to add too kind of a - nurses were
treated bad. Where, you know?
Yeah, you know, fight the man. I kinda don't want to do that
but I do want to say, what is something that as you've gone
through your career and I got it might be the burnout and might
be other things that you felt. Like was a challenge that you
had to overcome because I think that's what nurses are really
good at as we don't good at overcoming challenges.
So tell me a little bit about maybe one of your experiences
that you could think back on your career.
Yeah. We are really good at overcoming
challenges and the funny thing about burnout is that nobody
wants to burn out. I learned that I loved my job.
I loved the ICU job. I loved all my co-workers.
My managers were amazing. It wasn't them.
It was just I just burned out and I tried not to, you know, I
stuck with it. I Then switch to night shift, to
see if that would make things easier, which it did, not those
was the wrong choice for me. But yeah, it's burnouts really
hard and I think that it's becoming more and more prevalent
today. So, I think if we, as a nursing
Community, just talk about it more and help each other through
it. Like, I went and saw a therapist
at work, who helped a lot by just removing that stigma of.
Yeah, for now, because nobody wants to do it, it just happens.
So I think if we can all support each, Each other and talk about
it. More just talking about, it will
help know what did burn out look like for you.
So for me, I was extremely tired all the time, no matter how much
I slept, I couldn't catch up. I woke up tired.
I went to bed tired. I would have liked a little
burst of energy in the afternoon.
I also gained a lot of weight which wasn't yet, but I didn't
really recognize it until I was like, wow, this is the problem
now. And along with that I couldn't
lose it. I was actively trying to His
way, it could not lose weight just because of all the stress,
my body was telling me, I'd had enough basically, I had another
nurse on my podcast and she described burn out and it sounds
like in both situations. It was the same.
It was almost like a neglecting of self.
Yep. In both situations and ended up
leading to her getting diagnosed with an autoimmune disorder.
And she talks about all yeah podcast.
And so that's what I have already antibodies know that was
ever hacked issue that we have in fact issue was I think
thyroid and she was describing Give it to me and my heart
broke. Because I remember telling you
before the we gone to the podcast was just, I was so
burned out from work that I would come home and study
because I knew that was my ticket out of here.
Yeah. Like this is my ticket out of
this mess that I don't enjoy. And so did did the legal nurse
Consulting? Kind of ignite the fire towards
nursing again for you. And I was like, corny way but it
wasn't like the wind beneath your wings as you were like
going to work. And it is now When I was still
working in the hospital, I would kind of did the same thing with
my legal Consulting as you did with studying, like, I would
come home work and I because I knew like, that's what I had to
do to get out of here, but now, it is like now I'm really
interested in nursing again, I love learning things, I always
have. So, I love little things.
I come across in cases, that it didn't know before research them
all up. So it's, it has ignited, it a
little bit more. That's really cool.
And I think that's good for people to hear because I think,
they think, Well, it's going to be harder to get out and it'll
be harder to learn something new.
And what you might find is that might be the thing that makes
you fall back in love with, what you originally, all went into
nursing for which was to help people.
It's a really cool medicine. I think it's just something that
I never realized. Again, I thought was starting a
podcast. It was going to be this super
draining thing, but it's been something that's brought a lot
of joy and something that's like it's yes, it's new, it's
different, it's maybe sometimes kind of Are learning new things,
but it actually is opening doors to things that I would not have
realized I would have enjoyed more than what I was doing.
Yeah. I just kind of have to find your
Niche, right? So any mentors along your
journey, anybody along the way that really helped you, or gave
you some advice that you felt like was really beneficial you'd
like to share with my listeners. Yeah, actually, some of our
leadership at the trauma center has been amazing.
Karen mcculloh is the nurse educator for my unit over there.
And she was the president of the American Association for For
critical care. Nurses Back In I want to say
26:18 2017 and she's been really great just because she's so
excited about all the new things.
She's really supportive of nurses.
So I love learning from her and she kind of kept sparking my
love of learning and I've been trying to find some legal nurse
consultant venters. I just joined one of the online
chapters from the American Association of Legal Nurse
Consultants because I need some connections, there is some
enters in that field. Yeah.
Yeah, you always always be mentors where we go.
I hope you find one. I hope.
Hi Universe Center one buddy. Really cool.
We're gonna manage. I like it.
Right here on the podcast there. Yeah.
And all right. Very cool.
So, what advice do you have for new nurse starting off?
She just got her associate. She just got her bachelor's.
She's got a diploma in hand. She just passed her and Clacks.
And she's like, now, what do I do?
What is something? You wish you would have known
sooner? What do you wish?
Somebody would have told you you're never stuck.
You're never stuck in one. A job.
You never have to do anything. Nothing is the wrong choice,
whatever is the right choice for you, is the right choice, no
matter what, anybody else around you is telling you, good.
I like that. I like that.
And what if there's a woman who's considering legal nurse
Consulting and she's like, I don't know.
I mean, do I have what it takes, what's some advice you have for
one of those women or men. Let's go for it.
You never know, unless you try and everything.
You need to know about legal Consulting.
You learn along the way. So, yeah.
So, a lot of Education. Well, anything else you'd like
to share with our listeners? What if somebody wants to check
out your website, where do they find you Blue Ridge mlc.com, and
I'm also on Instagram at Common Sense, RN, okay, and what do you
have on your Instagram? Just like little fast, little
nursing advice. Yeah.
Factoids little nursing advice things.
I posted something today. With bright about brain
injuries. The different lobes of the brain
and what it will look like. If a particular lobe is injured,
this is so subtle effects like that because it's really neat
that you knew the trajectory of your nursing career like early
on that you wanted to do this and you've tailored it around
this. I did not do that in my career
whatsoever. So it's really neat to hear that
you had this in goal and you've always kept that in the well, I
kind of did it one way but never with something where I could be
an entrepreneur in, I never did that.
And that's something here that I think is really cool.
That I really want my listeners to hone in on is that while you
were working and doing your Drudge work, you had your eye on
entrepreneurship. How do I make my own thing?
How do I get my own thing? And I find that really
admirable. That's the smart way to approach
your nursing career. Yeah, I really do.
All right, so, for the last part of that it of the podcast, I do
a rapid fire questions. Okay.
And yeah, these are just fly by the seat of your pants,
quickfire, ready? All right, let's go tell me.
If you could teach one subject in school, what would it be
brain? Trauma.
Brain. Brain trauma.
Yeah, that's interesting. Next one.
What is your favorite beverage water?
Is that weird? Super cool.
I like Scotch will do that. I like okay.
I don't really like the Ila malt Petey's.
Got ya. I'm a plant.
I like water. Okay.
Alright. And maybe your parent or someone
that loves you wants to buy you a birthday cake?
What would they put on the birthday cake?
Probably be chocolate with either coconut or peanut butter.
Maybe both so awesome and that's it.
Thank you so much for coming onto the doctor nurse podcast,
sitting and chatting with me. I had such a good time and it
was so sweet about your career. Thank you Jerry.
We are at the end of our time together.
I really enjoyed the chat, please be sure to subscribe to
the show so you don't miss an episode and leave us a review.
If you like the show, I would love to get 5 stars.
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So please follow us there for any updates on new New podcasts
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You could always message me at the doctor nurse podcast at
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you're interested in hearing about.
And as always, thanks for listening, I want to thank my
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Kevin prior for your support of this podcast.
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My link is in the show notes. I just a reminder, the
information in this podcast is for occasional purposes only and
the information should not be used in substitute for
Professional Care by medical provider.
The information. This podcast is not represent
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